Cheating and Exploits

Buffler

Ihonu wrote: »

Buffler wrote: »

Ihonu wrote: »

Yesterday, I was in Cyrodil with a rl-friend. We joined a raid and attacked a Castle. More than 20 People. Blue emperor came out of the Castle ALONE and faced the whole raid. OVER 20 PEOPLE went all out assault on him and his hitpoint bar didn't move. HE KILLED THE WHOLE RAID ALONE. I HATE IT, i'm going to quit the game if they continue to do nothing.

Lol he was emp! They get 100% resource bonuses.

I know that, but 100% resources doesn't make you invulnerable and you can't win 20 to 1 just because of that.

Yes you can! Especially as a DK. The ulti regen as a dk emp is insane. Seen it done many times.

Elsonso

Buffler wrote: »

Ihonu wrote: »

Buffler wrote: »

Ihonu wrote: »

Yesterday, I was in Cyrodil with a rl-friend. We joined a raid and attacked a Castle. More than 20 People. Blue emperor came out of the Castle ALONE and faced the whole raid. OVER 20 PEOPLE went all out assault on him and his hitpoint bar didn't move. HE KILLED THE WHOLE RAID ALONE. I HATE IT, i'm going to quit the game if they continue to do nothing.

Lol he was emp! They get 100% resource bonuses.

I know that, but 100% resources doesn't make you invulnerable and you can't win 20 to 1 just because of that.

Yes you can! Especially as a DK. The ulti regen as a dk emp is insane. Seen it done many times.

So DK Emperors can have a health stat regen that exeeds the total damage output of 20 people.

InvitationNotFound

SirAndy wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

You seem to think that you saying "Others can see it" is sufficient as proof. That might be enough for the typical ESO goons to buy into, but I won't unless you prove that others can see it. Such as you one shotting players with 42 million stamina, where we can clearly see your damage output to other players.
Now everyone will respond and say "Ohh wahh, why do you want him to prove that and get in trouble, hurr he totally didn't already modify his game anyway".
And the cycle repeats.

So everyone else in this thread is now a "goon"? You really are something else.

Hypothetically speaking, lets say there actually was video someone else recorded of me showing my health go from the base amount to some higher amount and finally to 42 million and suppose i showed you several screenshots from that video with the other players identity blacked out, would that be enough to change your mind?

@SirAndy
I actually would be interested in that feel free to send me a private message

@ TheOtherGuyI'mNotGoingToTagHereAsItWouldntMakeSenseToReaptThisOverAndOverAgain
Yes, more evidence would be great (and i'm aware that CE works at least to a certain degree) but what you're currently doing here doesn't make any sense at all. Try to get at least some basic concepts and terms right.

OdinForge

InvitationNotFound wrote: »

SirAndy wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

You seem to think that you saying "Others can see it" is sufficient as proof. That might be enough for the typical ESO goons to buy into, but I won't unless you prove that others can see it. Such as you one shotting players with 42 million stamina, where we can clearly see your damage output to other players.
Now everyone will respond and say "Ohh wahh, why do you want him to prove that and get in trouble, hurr he totally didn't already modify his game anyway".
And the cycle repeats.

So everyone else in this thread is now a "goon"? You really are something else.

Hypothetically speaking, lets say there actually was video someone else recorded of me showing my health go from the base amount to some higher amount and finally to 42 million and suppose i showed you several screenshots from that video with the other players identity blacked out, would that be enough to change your mind?

@SirAndy
I actually would be interested in that feel free to send me a private message

@ TheOtherGuyI'mNotGoingToTagHereAsItWouldntMakeSenseToReaptThisOverAndOverAgain
Yes, more evidence would be great (and i'm aware that CE works at least to a certain degree) but what you're currently doing here doesn't make any sense at all. Try to get at least some basic concepts and terms right.

You don't have to tag me, but I'll quote you as I'm maintaining an eye on this thread.

The only thing here that doesn't make sense, is why SirAndy refuses to use his "debugger" (which somehow isn't the same thing as CE, despite doing the exact same thing as CE) again to backup his original claim that you can indeed fight with players whilst having insanely high modified stats and not getting caught by the flag system.

He simply posted a picture of his character display, I've only merely pointed out that in the past you could change the displays on your character sheet, but that other players wouldn't register those attributes. Instead of providing the proper evidence to the contrary he got defensive and his minions basically wanted me to accept his word for it, because he makes addons or something. He's intent on relying on screenshots of his HP, which is unreliable. Either get of a video of someone attacking your HP to where we can see you not dying because of a high HP pool and not doing anything to keep yourself alive. Or show us a video of your damage against a player with insanely high resources.

You're free to get angry at me for requesting a complete analysis, instead of just a picture and his word. Thank god the ESO community isn't responsible for investigation work, you guys would believe bigfoot was real if I simply provided a picture and said I make addons for him.

Ihonu

OdinForge wrote: »

InvitationNotFound wrote: »

SirAndy wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

You seem to think that you saying "Others can see it" is sufficient as proof. That might be enough for the typical ESO goons to buy into, but I won't unless you prove that others can see it. Such as you one shotting players with 42 million stamina, where we can clearly see your damage output to other players.
Now everyone will respond and say "Ohh wahh, why do you want him to prove that and get in trouble, hurr he totally didn't already modify his game anyway".
And the cycle repeats.

So everyone else in this thread is now a "goon"? You really are something else.

Hypothetically speaking, lets say there actually was video someone else recorded of me showing my health go from the base amount to some higher amount and finally to 42 million and suppose i showed you several screenshots from that video with the other players identity blacked out, would that be enough to change your mind?

@SirAndy
I actually would be interested in that feel free to send me a private message

@ TheOtherGuyI'mNotGoingToTagHereAsItWouldntMakeSenseToReaptThisOverAndOverAgain
Yes, more evidence would be great (and i'm aware that CE works at least to a certain degree) but what you're currently doing here doesn't make any sense at all. Try to get at least some basic concepts and terms right.

You don't have to tag me, but I'll quote you as I'm maintaining an eye on this thread.

The only thing here that doesn't make sense, is why SirAndy refuses to use his "debugger" (which somehow isn't the same thing as CE, despite doing the exact same thing as CE) again to backup his original claim that you can indeed fight with players whilst having insanely high modified stats and not getting caught by the flag system.

He simply posted a picture of his character display, I've only merely pointed out that in the past you could change the displays on your character sheet, but that other players wouldn't register those attributes. Instead of providing the proper evidence to the contrary he got defensive and his minions basically wanted me to accept his word for it, because he makes addons or something. He's intent on relying on screenshots of his HP, which is unreliable. Either get of a video of someone attacking your HP to where we can see you not dying because of a high HP pool and not doing anything to keep yourself alive. Or show us a video of your damage against a player with insanely high resources.

You're free to get angry at me for requesting a complete analysis, instead of just a picture and his word. Thank god the ESO community isn't responsible for investigation work, you guys would believe bigfoot was real if I simply provided a picture and said I make addons for him.

Do you pvp at all? There's a lot of guys with insane hp-regen who never die running around there. So what else do you need as proof? Just get to cyrodill and pvp for an hour and you run into three guys minimum that can soak the damage of a whole raid!

OdinForge

Ihonu wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

InvitationNotFound wrote: »

SirAndy wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

You seem to think that you saying "Others can see it" is sufficient as proof. That might be enough for the typical ESO goons to buy into, but I won't unless you prove that others can see it. Such as you one shotting players with 42 million stamina, where we can clearly see your damage output to other players.
Now everyone will respond and say "Ohh wahh, why do you want him to prove that and get in trouble, hurr he totally didn't already modify his game anyway".
And the cycle repeats.

So everyone else in this thread is now a "goon"? You really are something else.

Hypothetically speaking, lets say there actually was video someone else recorded of me showing my health go from the base amount to some higher amount and finally to 42 million and suppose i showed you several screenshots from that video with the other players identity blacked out, would that be enough to change your mind?

@SirAndy
I actually would be interested in that feel free to send me a private message

@ TheOtherGuyI'mNotGoingToTagHereAsItWouldntMakeSenseToReaptThisOverAndOverAgain
Yes, more evidence would be great (and i'm aware that CE works at least to a certain degree) but what you're currently doing here doesn't make any sense at all. Try to get at least some basic concepts and terms right.

You don't have to tag me, but I'll quote you as I'm maintaining an eye on this thread.

The only thing here that doesn't make sense, is why SirAndy refuses to use his "debugger" (which somehow isn't the same thing as CE, despite doing the exact same thing as CE) again to backup his original claim that you can indeed fight with players whilst having insanely high modified stats and not getting caught by the flag system.

He simply posted a picture of his character display, I've only merely pointed out that in the past you could change the displays on your character sheet, but that other players wouldn't register those attributes. Instead of providing the proper evidence to the contrary he got defensive and his minions basically wanted me to accept his word for it, because he makes addons or something. He's intent on relying on screenshots of his HP, which is unreliable. Either get of a video of someone attacking your HP to where we can see you not dying because of a high HP pool and not doing anything to keep yourself alive. Or show us a video of your damage against a player with insanely high resources.

You're free to get angry at me for requesting a complete analysis, instead of just a picture and his word. Thank god the ESO community isn't responsible for investigation work, you guys would believe bigfoot was real if I simply provided a picture and said I make addons for him.

Do you pvp at all? There's a lot of guys with insane hp-regen who never die running around there. So what else do you need as proof? Just get to cyrodill and pvp for an hour and you run into three guys minimum that can soak the damage of a whole raid!

Do you pvp at all?

Yes.

There's a lot of guys with insane hp-regen who never die running around there. So what else do you need as proof? Just get to cyrodill and pvp for an hour and you run into three guys minimum that can soak the damage of a whole raid!

The game mechanics allow for you to make a strong tank build, that can out-sustain and out-heal pug group damage. One good player troll tanking a raid of bad players does not qualify as "evidence of cheating".

There is a difference between someone making a strong tank build, to troll a raid of bad players. And someone running around with 42 million HP and just standing in a field unable to die because of a massive HP pool.

Your post is the exact type of forumscience ESO is known for xD

Ihonu

OdinForge wrote: »

Ihonu wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

InvitationNotFound wrote: »

SirAndy wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

You seem to think that you saying "Others can see it" is sufficient as proof. That might be enough for the typical ESO goons to buy into, but I won't unless you prove that others can see it. Such as you one shotting players with 42 million stamina, where we can clearly see your damage output to other players.
Now everyone will respond and say "Ohh wahh, why do you want him to prove that and get in trouble, hurr he totally didn't already modify his game anyway".
And the cycle repeats.

So everyone else in this thread is now a "goon"? You really are something else.

Hypothetically speaking, lets say there actually was video someone else recorded of me showing my health go from the base amount to some higher amount and finally to 42 million and suppose i showed you several screenshots from that video with the other players identity blacked out, would that be enough to change your mind?

@SirAndy
I actually would be interested in that feel free to send me a private message

@ TheOtherGuyI'mNotGoingToTagHereAsItWouldntMakeSenseToReaptThisOverAndOverAgain
Yes, more evidence would be great (and i'm aware that CE works at least to a certain degree) but what you're currently doing here doesn't make any sense at all. Try to get at least some basic concepts and terms right.

You don't have to tag me, but I'll quote you as I'm maintaining an eye on this thread.

The only thing here that doesn't make sense, is why SirAndy refuses to use his "debugger" (which somehow isn't the same thing as CE, despite doing the exact same thing as CE) again to backup his original claim that you can indeed fight with players whilst having insanely high modified stats and not getting caught by the flag system.

He simply posted a picture of his character display, I've only merely pointed out that in the past you could change the displays on your character sheet, but that other players wouldn't register those attributes. Instead of providing the proper evidence to the contrary he got defensive and his minions basically wanted me to accept his word for it, because he makes addons or something. He's intent on relying on screenshots of his HP, which is unreliable. Either get of a video of someone attacking your HP to where we can see you not dying because of a high HP pool and not doing anything to keep yourself alive. Or show us a video of your damage against a player with insanely high resources.

You're free to get angry at me for requesting a complete analysis, instead of just a picture and his word. Thank god the ESO community isn't responsible for investigation work, you guys would believe bigfoot was real if I simply provided a picture and said I make addons for him.

Do you pvp at all? There's a lot of guys with insane hp-regen who never die running around there. So what else do you need as proof? Just get to cyrodill and pvp for an hour and you run into three guys minimum that can soak the damage of a whole raid!

Do you pvp at all?

Yes.

There's a lot of guys with insane hp-regen who never die running around there. So what else do you need as proof? Just get to cyrodill and pvp for an hour and you run into three guys minimum that can soak the damage of a whole raid!

The game mechanics allow for you to make a strong tank build, that can out-sustain and out-heal pug group damage. One good player troll tanking a raid of bad players does not qualify as "evidence of cheating".

There is a difference between someone making a strong tank build, to troll a raid of bad players. And someone running around with 42 million HP and just standing in a field unable to die because of a massive HP pool.

Your post is the exact type of forumscience ESO is known for xD

I and my rl friend both have stormproof... It wasn't exactly a low cp newb raid. Pretty sure everyone drove at least 20k dps in the raid. One player can not tank an entire raid of experienced players. 20 people with 20k dps is 400k dps that's not tankable by one Player, even as dk with emperor, and if you have a completly tanky build you dont have enough damage to kill the entire raid.
And if you have never experienced something like that you dont pvp.

OdinForge

Ihonu wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

Ihonu wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

InvitationNotFound wrote: »

SirAndy wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

You seem to think that you saying "Others can see it" is sufficient as proof. That might be enough for the typical ESO goons to buy into, but I won't unless you prove that others can see it. Such as you one shotting players with 42 million stamina, where we can clearly see your damage output to other players.
Now everyone will respond and say "Ohh wahh, why do you want him to prove that and get in trouble, hurr he totally didn't already modify his game anyway".
And the cycle repeats.

So everyone else in this thread is now a "goon"? You really are something else.

Hypothetically speaking, lets say there actually was video someone else recorded of me showing my health go from the base amount to some higher amount and finally to 42 million and suppose i showed you several screenshots from that video with the other players identity blacked out, would that be enough to change your mind?

@SirAndy
I actually would be interested in that feel free to send me a private message

@ TheOtherGuyI'mNotGoingToTagHereAsItWouldntMakeSenseToReaptThisOverAndOverAgain
Yes, more evidence would be great (and i'm aware that CE works at least to a certain degree) but what you're currently doing here doesn't make any sense at all. Try to get at least some basic concepts and terms right.

You don't have to tag me, but I'll quote you as I'm maintaining an eye on this thread.

The only thing here that doesn't make sense, is why SirAndy refuses to use his "debugger" (which somehow isn't the same thing as CE, despite doing the exact same thing as CE) again to backup his original claim that you can indeed fight with players whilst having insanely high modified stats and not getting caught by the flag system.

He simply posted a picture of his character display, I've only merely pointed out that in the past you could change the displays on your character sheet, but that other players wouldn't register those attributes. Instead of providing the proper evidence to the contrary he got defensive and his minions basically wanted me to accept his word for it, because he makes addons or something. He's intent on relying on screenshots of his HP, which is unreliable. Either get of a video of someone attacking your HP to where we can see you not dying because of a high HP pool and not doing anything to keep yourself alive. Or show us a video of your damage against a player with insanely high resources.

You're free to get angry at me for requesting a complete analysis, instead of just a picture and his word. Thank god the ESO community isn't responsible for investigation work, you guys would believe bigfoot was real if I simply provided a picture and said I make addons for him.

Do you pvp at all? There's a lot of guys with insane hp-regen who never die running around there. So what else do you need as proof? Just get to cyrodill and pvp for an hour and you run into three guys minimum that can soak the damage of a whole raid!

Do you pvp at all?

Yes.

There's a lot of guys with insane hp-regen who never die running around there. So what else do you need as proof? Just get to cyrodill and pvp for an hour and you run into three guys minimum that can soak the damage of a whole raid!

The game mechanics allow for you to make a strong tank build, that can out-sustain and out-heal pug group damage. One good player troll tanking a raid of bad players does not qualify as "evidence of cheating".

There is a difference between someone making a strong tank build, to troll a raid of bad players. And someone running around with 42 million HP and just standing in a field unable to die because of a massive HP pool.

Your post is the exact type of forumscience ESO is known for xD

I and my rl friend both have stormproof... It wasn't exactly a low cp newb raid. Pretty sure everyone drove at least 20k dps in the raid. One player can not tank an entire raid of experienced players. 20 people with 20k dps is 400k dps that's not tankable by one Player, even as dk with emperor, and if you have a completly tanky build you dont have enough damage to kill the entire raid.
And if you have never experienced something like that you dont pvp.

Okey

Wolfkeks

^ awesome, how about you guys agree to disagree?

OdinForge

Wolfkeks wrote: »

^ awesome, how about you guys agree to disagree?

I wouldn't misinterpret my response to that poor guy as some type of "agree to disagree" reply. There is no legitimate discussion to be had with someone who's argument to why his group isn't a noob pug group getting wrecked by a tank, leverages on the idea that two of them have the title stormproof.

xD

Dominion_Mirages

Voltranox

The debate about how to prove cheating is still rampant has its merits and I'd like to see more information, since ZOS has not been helping in this regard. There are a few examples in this thread of players using their knowledge of game theory/mechanics to do just that.

The fact is though, that any experienced pvp player can tell you that the game is full of evidence of cheating (and this applies to pve and its rewards too) and bots in pve. Zazeer and others blew the lid on it with their displays of flying and raining ultimates about a year ago, and the problem has not gone away.

I have 14 characters of every class (except Warden because I boycotted Morrowind) and have been playing for years now. I am still learning the finer points of the game, but I have gotten much better at spotting suspicious behavior, from macros with no cool-down, to unlimited regen, to speed-hacks, to god-mode (often present all at once - of course). On a side note, I got hit with 7 ballista hits per second yesterday...by a guy on foot.

ZOS may have taken some steps to alleviate the most extreme displays of cheating, but it is still a massive daily problem. My enjoyment of the game is being negatively affected, and I am paying $180 (WTF!!!) per year for the subscription. For that kind of ridiculous subscription cost, I think ZOS's customers deserve a solution or at the very least, some communication.

For the company to allow it to continue, and let their customers cop the results, while also remaining silent, is the worst business decision possible. It strains the relationship and patience of the very people that their income depends upon.

Ihonu

OdinForge wrote: »

Wolfkeks wrote: »

^ awesome, how about you guys agree to disagree?

I wouldn't misinterpret my response to that poor guy as some type of "agree to disagree" reply. There is no legitimate discussion to be had with someone who's argument to why his group isn't a noob pug group getting wrecked by a tank, leverages on the idea that two of them have the title stormproof.

xD

So you pvp regularly and you have never ever seen a cheater... Seriously? I mean really??? You are not kidding? This is not ironic? You are serious, right?
Or did some "friend" get a short time ban for cheating and now all bans are unfair, and there are no cheaters in no game ever?

rfennell_ESO

There is little point trying to debate certain people.

The reality of things is that people have been cheating all this time and turning a profit off the game with their monetized streams and youtube. There are some honest ones, but the reality is there aren't many.

The idle hands of ZOS have sat back and allowed it to occur, have actually promoted proven exploiters on esolive. Like really... promoted and featured exploiters of their own game.

You would have to ask where is the disconnect between reality and fantasy is when the devs themselves aren't aware of exploiters to a degree so staggering that they promote and feature them. It's really so bad it's nearly inexcusable.

Here is reality: it's likely that most of the pvp streamers are exploiters. It's also likely that every world first and ranked group was also using cheat engine. Every "famous" players in game, with very few exceptions, gained that fame exploiting the game. That's reality, and they have also responded with derision and lies to every accusation of what's freaking true.

The worst decision was protecting them on these forums. That's basically paying someone to cut your throat for you and then having a police force that enforces a policy of claiming there is no throat slitting going on and punishing the witnesses of it for daring to say it is going on and who are the perpetrators of it.

INHUMANENATION

This thread is awesome!!!

Just wanted to say TY to the ESO staff for standing their ground. The overwhelming majority of players I've encountered do not enjoy drama. I would even go so far as to say some of us have enough drama irl that we choose to play ESO to escape that drama. So TY for respecting the privacy policy as well as continuing to tolerate open RESPECTFUL discussion. If I've ever been reported it would be for social stuff to the people thinking im some exploiter. While I admit I have done some things over the totality of my ESO experience that might warrant a 3 day ban (ambushing into keeps that amazingly beautiful time everyone else was able to) I've truly tried to play the game as intended. It's a beautiful game, I don't need to be the best. Im just happy to play.

Katinas

Katinas wrote: »

Server: PC EU.
Location: Grahtwood, Haven, coastline near Volunidai's Manor.
Time: Now, since forever.
A train of bots are running around in circles killing mudcrabs and crocodiles.
This has been happening for many months. Sent bug reports several times.
Please go and purge them.

A week since reporting the farm bots nothing has been done. I still see same names in same place doign same stuff that they were doing last time.
This spot has had farmers for MONTHS now.
Video for entertainment purposes:
https://streamable.com/z9whk

Cpt_Teemo

Katinas wrote: »

Katinas wrote: »

Server: PC EU.
Location: Grahtwood, Haven, coastline near Volunidai's Manor.
Time: Now, since forever.
A train of bots are running around in circles killing mudcrabs and crocodiles.
This has been happening for many months. Sent bug reports several times.
Please go and purge them.

A week since reporting the farm bots nothing has been done. I still see same names in same place doign same stuff that they were doing last time.
This spot has had farmers for MONTHS now.
Video for entertainment purposes:
https://streamable.com/z9whk

Doesn't really look like bots since they just stay in one place at a time mostly I thought killing fast respawns, looks more like someone using macros off there main character, which is still breaking ToS.

Elsonso

Katinas wrote: »

Katinas wrote: »

Server: PC EU.
Location: Grahtwood, Haven, coastline near Volunidai's Manor.
Time: Now, since forever.
A train of bots are running around in circles killing mudcrabs and crocodiles.
This has been happening for many months. Sent bug reports several times.
Please go and purge them.

A week since reporting the farm bots nothing has been done. I still see same names in same place doign same stuff that they were doing last time.
This spot has had farmers for MONTHS now.
Video for entertainment purposes:
https://streamable.com/z9whk

Two comments...

First, in my experience, it takes at least a week for them to get around to banning bots in a specific location.

Second, screen shots and videos in daytime are easier to see than ones taken at night.

Sarjako

I came here looking for cheats and exploits and all I found was a bunch of kids attacking each other . Sighhhhhh.

Apherius

Katinas wrote: »

Katinas wrote: »

Server: PC EU.
Location: Grahtwood, Haven, coastline near Volunidai's Manor.
Time: Now, since forever.
A train of bots are running around in circles killing mudcrabs and crocodiles.
This has been happening for many months. Sent bug reports several times.
Please go and purge them.

A week since reporting the farm bots nothing has been done. I still see same names in same place doign same stuff that they were doing last time.
This spot has had farmers for MONTHS now.
Video for entertainment purposes:
https://streamable.com/z9whk

ALLthe name you linked in your video are still ingame , just repported them all today ( they are 17 ) ...

Elsonso

Apherius wrote: »

Katinas wrote: »

Katinas wrote: »

Server: PC EU.
Location: Grahtwood, Haven, coastline near Volunidai's Manor.
Time: Now, since forever.
A train of bots are running around in circles killing mudcrabs and crocodiles.
This has been happening for many months. Sent bug reports several times.
Please go and purge them.

A week since reporting the farm bots nothing has been done. I still see same names in same place doign same stuff that they were doing last time.
This spot has had farmers for MONTHS now.
Video for entertainment purposes:
https://streamable.com/z9whk

ALLthe name you linked in your video are still ingame , just repported them all today ( they are 17 ) ...

That will definitely help. According to them, the more reports there are, the faster they get around to looking at it.

Voltranox

Spent 3 hours in Kyne Cyrodiil today. Fought lots of enemy players from the two other factions.
As a refreshing change, NO outright suspicious performances observed. Good stuff.

StackonClown

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

There is little point trying to debate certain people.

The reality of things is that people have been cheating all this time and turning a profit off the game with their monetized streams and youtube. There are some honest ones, but the reality is there aren't many.

The idle hands of ZOS have sat back and allowed it to occur, have actually promoted proven exploiters on esolive. Like really... promoted and featured exploiters of their own game.

You would have to ask where is the disconnect between reality and fantasy is when the devs themselves aren't aware of exploiters to a degree so staggering that they promote and feature them. It's really so bad it's nearly inexcusable.

Here is reality: it's likely that most of the pvp streamers are exploiters. It's also likely that every world first and ranked group was also using cheat engine. Every "famous" players in game, with very few exceptions, gained that fame exploiting the game. That's reality, and they have also responded with derision and lies to every accusation of what's freaking true.

The worst decision was protecting them on these forums. That's basically paying someone to cut your throat for you and then having a police force that enforces a policy of claiming there is no throat slitting going on and punishing the witnesses of it for daring to say it is going on and who are the perpetrators of it.

Very well said.. like drugs in sport - you'd be surprised how many 'top players' are cheating the system - the entire russian athletics team got banned for cheating..

INHUMANENATION

Apherius wrote: »

Katinas wrote: »

Katinas wrote: »

Server: PC EU.
Location: Grahtwood, Haven, coastline near Volunidai's Manor.
Time: Now, since forever.
A train of bots are running around in circles killing mudcrabs and crocodiles.
This has been happening for many months. Sent bug reports several times.
Please go and purge them.

A week since reporting the farm bots nothing has been done. I still see same names in same place doign same stuff that they were doing last time.
This spot has had farmers for MONTHS now.
Video for entertainment purposes:
https://streamable.com/z9whk

ALLthe name you linked in your video are still ingame , just repported them all today ( they are 17 ) ...

Not to be awkward but isn't posting this stuff to forums against ToS? I was under the impression we were supposed to just report the issue. Not name/shame. Someone has already confirmed in this thread the reported them as a result of the post you made. Surely having redundant reports based off of a third parties claims cannot do anything but impede devs as they work thru duplicated reports.

Just a thought.

Voltranox

Yesterday in Kyne, I fought several battles with an enemy character that had an easy to remember name.
Average player, quite squishy, normal damage. He died fairly quickly, and often.

Today...same character.
Now, with 8 attackers throwing everything they've got at him, his health bar flickers at the 80% mark.
He hits with multiple skills per second like a machinegun.
All of his damage is high, up to 10k per hit.
He moves super fast.
God mode now eh?

Reported...but what's the point? Like throwing a penny into a big, dark sink-hole.

rfennell_ESO

StackonClown wrote: »

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

There is little point trying to debate certain people.

The reality of things is that people have been cheating all this time and turning a profit off the game with their monetized streams and youtube. There are some honest ones, but the reality is there aren't many.

The idle hands of ZOS have sat back and allowed it to occur, have actually promoted proven exploiters on esolive. Like really... promoted and featured exploiters of their own game.

You would have to ask where is the disconnect between reality and fantasy is when the devs themselves aren't aware of exploiters to a degree so staggering that they promote and feature them. It's really so bad it's nearly inexcusable.

Here is reality: it's likely that most of the pvp streamers are exploiters. It's also likely that every world first and ranked group was also using cheat engine. Every "famous" players in game, with very few exceptions, gained that fame exploiting the game. That's reality, and they have also responded with derision and lies to every accusation of what's freaking true.

The worst decision was protecting them on these forums. That's basically paying someone to cut your throat for you and then having a police force that enforces a policy of claiming there is no throat slitting going on and punishing the witnesses of it for daring to say it is going on and who are the perpetrators of it.

Very well said.. like drugs in sport - you'd be surprised how many 'top players' are cheating the system - the entire russian athletics team got banned for cheating..

Actually, I wouldn't be surprised. I've been calling them out for ~3 years or so.

It's basically a risk versus reward scenario. Judging by the duration that some of these players stream (and you know they play on top of the streaming), any revenue they can gain is more than they are currently making.

It's a new era in gaming, where ordinary players can simply and easily stream their play. You really didn't see this happening only 3-4 years ago, but now... anyone with a modern video card can simply stream. When they do they quickly realize that the stream watchers of the world want to see domination and "skilled" play. Temptation wins over... The actual risk is low (or in some cases non-existent) or even worse... the risk is actually a reward as the company developing the game is oblivious to what's really going on that they "feature" known exploiters.

The viewers of the world and game are even worse with their total lack of objectivity and total sycophantism to certain streamers.

In truth, it's so bad that the next billing phase will see me end my eso sub that I've carried since day -5 (early access). I don't see a light at the end of the tunnel... All I see is ZOS ignoring the tunnel. @Alcast 's video regarding CE weekend with his little addition in the corner is how ZOS has dealt with serious issues (leslie Nielson video), worse is they just don't bother even acknowledging or addressing a very real problem.

If risk<reward then people going to cheat. That's the truth of the matter.

Voltranox

Yeah it's looking pretty bleak. I've been strongly considering walking too.
I've had some fun times with the game. Especially the social aspect.

I don't play PVE much (some trials and pledges). PVP is why I continued.
The game is totally compromised, and it impacts PVP directly.
It reduces my enjoyment of the competition. I've become jaded.

For $180 a year subscription, I'd expect more from the developer.
I've probably spent close to $500 on this game. Incredible. Never done that before.

Despite having grown attached to it over years, I'm starting to feel like a chump.
That's when it's time to wake up and walk away.

ProbablePaul

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Actually, I wouldn't be surprised. I've been calling them out for ~3 years or so.

It's basically a risk versus reward scenario. Judging by the duration that some of these players stream (and you know they play on top of the streaming), any revenue they can gain is more than they are currently making.

It's a new era in gaming, where ordinary players can simply and easily stream their play. You really didn't see this happening only 3-4 years ago, but now... anyone with a modern video card can simply stream. When they do they quickly realize that the stream watchers of the world want to see domination and "skilled" play. Temptation wins over... The actual risk is low (or in some cases non-existent) or even worse... the risk is actually a reward as the company developing the game is oblivious to what's really going on that they "feature" known exploiters.

The viewers of the world and game are even worse with their total lack of objectivity and total sycophantism to certain streamers.

In truth, it's so bad that the next billing phase will see me end my eso sub that I've carried since day -5 (early access). I don't see a light at the end of the tunnel... All I see is ZOS ignoring the tunnel. @Alcast 's video regarding CE weekend with his little addition in the corner is how ZOS has dealt with serious issues (leslie Nielson video), worse is they just don't bother even acknowledging or addressing a very real problem.

If risk<reward then people going to cheat. That's the truth of the matter.

What's unfortunate about everything you're claiming is that it can't be substantiated beyond your own speculation, neither by you nor ZOS(judging by their actions). It's not fair, either, for you to generalize with such intense opinions about information that you can't be certain of; e.g. streamers and pvp players consisting mostly of exploiters. I mean, if you can't prove that skillful players are using exploits, then the evidence you do have is that they are skilled players. Sometimes people are just that talented, unless you can prove otherwise. And no, your convictions for society at large do not substantiate anything. At best, you have a working hypothesis!

But, don't get me wrong, I believe that there are cheaters out there. It's not that hard to do, and isn't all that specialized; freshman year of a computer science program gives you more than enough knowledge to implement some kind of device that will control a bot, or to execute/issue macros commands. I also agree that cheaters should be removed from that game, but feeling this way doesn't make catching them any easier. The hard part is proving that someone is cheating, given that most offenses occur outside of the game itself which ZOS has no legal influence over. Oftentimes people cheat by modifying hardware, like their controller, or keyboard and mouse. Sure, there are alternative methods to catching people cheating, directly. We could use statistics to make inferences about how specific player behavior deviates or varies too much from some other behavior that's been measured to be typical for a given population. But even then, all you have is data that indicates that a group of individuals share a similar style of play, which does not indicate cheating, it only accentuates the juiciness of your speculation, which leads to more research. And yes, even though that data might show that each of those players' actions are being executed in the exact same sequence, at the exact same rate, indefinitely. The problem still stands, how do you prove that they aren't playing the game themselves? Sure it might seem obvious when you observe them, but if you can't prove it, then you can't say you know. Unlike when people were repeatedly killing delve bosses for filled soul gems; that was in game, and the bad behavior was easily proved. Any accusations of cheating, without adequate proof, could be proven false, for which ZOS would have to answer for - who gets to be the fall guy for that? Who chose to falsely accuse a bunch of people? Beyond that, the cost of the equipment of collecting so much data might be more expensive than the money the company is losing from cheaters.

It seems to me that ZOS is going to dedicate their time to improving the game until they can identify a surefire solution to catching cheaters, and if it's not their decision to do that, then it might be the decision of the stakeholders who are paying them to make the game(who might only be concerned about the return on their investment).

Either way, it's unlikely that they have been, or are going to just ignore it, because they've taken action against cheaters in the past, e.g. all the changes that made cyrodiil so laggy. As well as the fact that there's no real incentive for them to allow cheating.

As for leaving the game, that's probably the best thing to do if you're unhappy. I left the game when morrowind released, and only recently came back to check things out, and no, it doesn't look like I will be sticking around for very long, haha. If there's one thing you're right about, it's that video gaming in general has taken a dump. Ever since it grew to be bigger than the movie industry it's been heading down this path.

rfennell_ESO

ProbablePaul wrote: »

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Actually, I wouldn't be surprised. I've been calling them out for ~3 years or so.

It's basically a risk versus reward scenario. Judging by the duration that some of these players stream (and you know they play on top of the streaming), any revenue they can gain is more than they are currently making.

It's a new era in gaming, where ordinary players can simply and easily stream their play. You really didn't see this happening only 3-4 years ago, but now... anyone with a modern video card can simply stream. When they do they quickly realize that the stream watchers of the world want to see domination and "skilled" play. Temptation wins over... The actual risk is low (or in some cases non-existent) or even worse... the risk is actually a reward as the company developing the game is oblivious to what's really going on that they "feature" known exploiters.

The viewers of the world and game are even worse with their total lack of objectivity and total sycophantism to certain streamers.

In truth, it's so bad that the next billing phase will see me end my eso sub that I've carried since day -5 (early access). I don't see a light at the end of the tunnel... All I see is ZOS ignoring the tunnel. @Alcast 's video regarding CE weekend with his little addition in the corner is how ZOS has dealt with serious issues (leslie Nielson video), worse is they just don't bother even acknowledging or addressing a very real problem.

If risk<reward then people going to cheat. That's the truth of the matter.

What's unfortunate about everything you're claiming is that it can't be substantiated beyond your own speculation, neither by you nor ZOS(judging by their actions). It's not fair, either, for you to generalize with such intense opinions about information that you can't be certain of; e.g. streamers and pvp players consisting mostly of exploiters. I mean, if you can't prove that skillful players are using exploits, then the evidence you do have is that they are skilled players. Sometimes people are just that talented, unless you can prove otherwise. And no, your convictions for society at large do not substantiate anything. At best, you have a working hypothesis!

It can be substantiated by one of the more "famous" streamers crashed to desktop revealing cheat engine running.

That might prove only that there is one cheater... but, thing is... it's now known. When you see players that operate the same exact way, you can take an educated guess that they are doing the exact same thing.

Talent don't make 0 regen builds have sustain. Only cheat engine seems to be able to do that.

Malamar1229

I also play on both platforms and there's a substantial difference in the "quality" or "skill" in players between both platforms. That is, if you can stay connected in Cyrodiil more than 10 minutes on the Xbox! I've said that multi times though.

I do think the lag contributing to what looks like 1 shots happens more on PC than XB. But the the Stam guys who seemingly dodge every attack are not as prevalent on the XB....