PTS Update 18 - Feedback Thread for Jewelry Crafting

Edaphon

Elsterchen wrote: »

Edaphon wrote: »

Wayshuba wrote: »

Vandellia wrote: »

Extremely Unhappy with the implementation of trait research. I might be able to understand only being able to research a single ring trait and a single necklace trait at a time but as it currently stands 1 trait only is flat out ugly. if you can not afford to spend deep /hard cash to "speed up" research times it, it will take a completely unreasonable and insane amount of time to get everything learned id estimate somewhere around 5 to 6 months for a intense crafter and far more for the typical player which is simply unaccceptable.

With ESO+ membership and maxed out passives to reduce research time it will take 212 days or 7 months.

No, it won't.
It will take 140 days, same as woodworking.

Instead of reposting this pic that clearly shows data from a char with maxed research time modifier, please look at the real numbers i.e.: starting at level 1 with no option to put a skill point into advancing research time.

You may only add ONE skill point there after a few levels, a second skill point may be added a few levels later. ... After researching the correct level-up rates you may add the numbers.

Please keep in mind: the 21 is a monday (no golden vendor till saturday), existing jewellery is not deconstructable (which btw. is also true for jewellery in containers you may have stored up). I am pretty sure there will be one maybe 3 or even 10 people that will get help from guildmates/friends and get all new jewellery found on day one ... however I fear even for them its going to be a tough call to max out jewellery crafting on said day one. hence, there is no reason to assume the time analyzing traits starts with all skills maxed out already.

I'm not reposting that picture, I made it specifically for this post.

You can put points into the research passive at level 8, 18, 28 and 45. That's what? Two days of farming dolmens in Alik'r?
Anyone who hasn't maxed the skill line by the end of week 1 isn't really trying but let's be generous and say it takes 10 days.

You're now looking at a total time of 150 days for casual farmers. Yeah, that changes everything...

And you can cut that time in half by using scrolls from the master writ vendor.

Tasear

Wasn't able to find a combination with stamina race playing Magicka character. Everything turned out lesser values.

MyNameIsElias

soooo......has anybody figured out a fast way to lvl jewelry crafting yet?

Elsterchen

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

soooo......has anybody figured out a fast way to lvl jewelry crafting yet?

as @Edaphon nicely pointed out you may take your 10% chance (RNG hates me so mine is definately closer to "not-worth-the-trouble") to pick up jewellery at dolmens with 1 dolmen ~ every 5 Minutes you may grind your senses to oblivion. If you scratch peeing, eating and sleeping for ~ 10 days straight, you might have enough to be close to level 50. Attention: do not forget to drink! Drinking is mandatory for living.

The whales may pick up golden jewellery at the golden vendor on Friday/Saturday ... and should be done after spending a hefty amount of gold (rumor has it its ~ 80 golden Rings...).

Casual peasants will try the usual ... quest, chests, dailies, PVP, PVE, stealing as well as murdering and fight over the rather expensive jewellery at guild vendors ... those that loose will have to do with the very and extremely expensive jewellery at guild vendors.

my guess.

Edaphon

Elsterchen wrote: »

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

soooo......has anybody figured out a fast way to lvl jewelry crafting yet?

as @Edaphon nicely pointed out you may take your 10% chance (RNG hates me so mine is definately closer to "not-worth-the-trouble") to pick up jewellery at dolmens with 1 dolmen ~ every 5 Minutes you may grind your senses to oblivion. If you scratch peeing, eating and sleeping for ~ 10 days straight, you might have enough to be close to level 50. Attention: do not forget to drink! Drinking is mandatory for living.

The whales may pick up golden jewellery at the golden vendor on Friday/Saturday ... and should be done after spending a hefty amount of gold (rumor has it its ~ 80 golden Rings...).

Casual peasants will try the usual ... quest, chests, dailies, PVP, PVE, stealing as well as murdering and fight over the rather expensive jewellery at guild vendors ... those that loose will have to do with the very and extremely expensive jewellery at guild vendors.

my guess.

1) Dolmens don't have a 10% chance to drop jewelry, it's 100%

2) Buying jewelry from the golden vendor to level up the skill line is just plain stupid. Inspiration gain from gold jewelry is worse than purple

3) A whale isn't someone with lots of ingame gold, it's someone who spends a lot of real money on a game

4) It's not 80 golden rings to get the skill line to 50, it's a minimum of 80 golden rings to get enough upgrade mats for a gold item. You need 333 purple items to max the skill line and a lot more if you're using gold (see point 2) )


No offense @Elsterchen but you're just poorly informed about JC and should refrain from commenting on it because right now you're just spreading misinformation.
Maybe actually test some stuff on PTS first and then comment on it?

Darauk

Feedback and observations for the game devs...

I hopped on the PTS a number of times in the past several days, and spent a good four hours after the Monday patch to see what changed. I did notice a decent improvement in JC mat seams. In my four hours of frolicking around seeing the sights and killing the mobs, I ran into a good dozen seams. I ran into probably 25-35 ore nodes, close to 50 cloth, and probably 35 or 40 wood nodes during the same time.

(By comparison, I saw only 1 node the first time I played on PTS, outside of the three you have to harvest to get certified.)

I didn't level JC to see the spread between a character at max level (platinum) and JC at level 1 (pewter). I ran into about 75% pewter seams and 25% platinum seams. This was all on SI where I would assume a majority of the play testers were on. It is possible SI was heavily farmed, so I will try to visit the mainland later this week to see if rates are better.

I then compared mat faming on live. I spent ~2 hours tonight on the live server (very casually) farming ore, wood, and cloth. In ~2 hours, I ran into 30-40 ore nodes on Live in Rivenspire, without even really looking. I saw about the same ore split between Blacksmith level 1 (~75% of nodes being iron ore) and a character at L50, CP495 (~25% of nodes being rubedite). For completeness, I ran into about 25-30 wood notes, 30-35 cloth nodes, and over 40 rune nodes during this same time. I ran into so many alchemy nodes that I lost count. Easily over 50 in the ~2 hours.

My initial feedback likely remains. There still aren't enough JC nodes. And it still seems as though JC nodes were replacing ore nodes, which isn't a good approach.

Original but Still Valid Feedback: Add more JC nodes but make them net additions to the world, not replacements for a percentage of ore nodes.

Now I have a new item of feedback now that I've been trying to level JC. The skill line really needs to be reworked to mirror the other crafting skills. Far too many mats are required to craft and, especially, to upgrade. I can appreciate the intent of the design goal to make JC comparable to getting Legendary items from dungeons and trials (i.e., hard), but the current design for JC crafting is "too hard" and makes JC unattractive for a crafter like myself. It's also very complex compared to the other crafting skills.

New Feedback #1: Change the upgrade mat requirement in particular. Probably change the trait mat requirements. JC needs to be much more similar to Blacksmithing, Clothier, and Woodworking. Maybe make the upgrade and trait mat drop rates from refining raw materials into materials lower than the other skills, but don't implement the 10x "refine" grind.

New Feedback #2: Add a JC hireling passive trait.

New Feedback #3: Allow researching both ring and necklace at the same time (for one of the upgraded research time reduction traits, similar to Blacksmithing, Clothier, and Woodworking).

Respectfully,

Darauk

Oliviander

Darauk wrote: »

Feedback and observations for the game devs...

Now I have a new item of feedback now that I've been trying to level JC. The skill line really needs to be reworked to mirror the other crafting skills.

Darauk

I wasn't on the test server but read all the comments on JC as I am eager to level it with all my chars.
Nearly everybody who critizises the way JC works, says something like bringing JC in line with the other
Crafting skills. But I really miss the argument, why that should be so.
Any help ?

Epicasballs

Since Morrowind was released I have played this game off and on often not playing for months. Morrowind really killed the fun of combat and I stopped giving ZOS money because I no longer enjoyed playing ESO as combat is boring now. I heard JC was coming with Summerest and I made the mistake of pre-ordering it because the theory crafter in me was stoked as hell.

Never pre-order anything.

You hooked me back in... then I learned the details of the system I was excited about and you lost me again. I feel cheated.

@ZOS_GinaBruno

Y'all devs ought to be ashamed. Let people have fun. It's a game. Make ESO fun again. There's no reason to make JC so grindy. Shame.

Darauk

Oliviander wrote: »

I wasn't on the test server but read all the comments on JC as I am eager to level it with all my chars.
Nearly everybody who critizises the way JC works, says something like bringing JC in line with the other
Crafting skills. But I really miss the argument, why that should be so.
Any help ?

With the three main crafting skills, you get upgrade mats by refining raw materials. Refine some ore and you have a small chance to get a temper.

JC doesn't do that. Refine some dust you have a small chance to get … some upgrade dust. Which, itself, needs to be refined. All of the upgrade mats and trait mats behave like Malachite Shards. You need 10x upgrade dust to make 1x upgrade mat. And you need 8x gold upgrade mats to upgrade to legendary (if you have max traits). So that means farming 80x upgrade dust to get your 8x upgrade mats. Per jewelry item (240x dust to get 24x mats to upgrade 2x ring and 1x necklace).

To put it into loose context, imagine the Tempering Alloy equivalent. You would need 10x Tempering "Nuggets" to refine into just 1x Tempering Alloy. And you know how often a Tempering Alloy currently drops from refining ores...

Editorial
I can't recall the exact terms, so I'm just using some approximate terms and amounts. Please don't yell me for inaccuracies.

I'm just trying to make the point that the upgrade mat farming is explosively more involved than the other crafting skills. And since JC seam nodes seem to appear about 40-50% less than ore nodes, it's going to be a bit of a slog unless you pay gold to the guild traders to bulk up mats to ease the grind.
End Editorial

Edit: To be fair to ZOS, they did disclose all of this up front in a fairly recent post.

https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/26357

I read it. I understood it. I didn't appreciate it. Now I do. And I don't enjoy it.

JasonSilverSpring

Darauk wrote: »

Oliviander wrote: »

I wasn't on the test server but read all the comments on JC as I am eager to level it with all my chars.
Nearly everybody who critizises the way JC works, says something like bringing JC in line with the other
Crafting skills. But I really miss the argument, why that should be so.
Any help ?

With the three main crafting skills, you get upgrade mats by refining raw materials. Refine some ore and you have a small chance to get a temper.

JC doesn't do that. Refine some dust you have a small chance to get … some upgrade dust. Which, itself, needs to be refined. All of the upgrade mats and trait mats behave like Malachite Shards. You need 10x upgrade dust to make 1x upgrade mat. And you need 8x gold upgrade mats to upgrade to legendary (if you have max traits). So that means farming 80x upgrade dust to get your 8x upgrade mats. Per jewelry item (240x dust to get 24x mats to upgrade 2x ring and 1x necklace).

To put it into loose context, imagine the Tempering Alloy equivalent. You would need 10x Tempering "Nuggets" to refine into just 1x Tempering Alloy. And you know how often a Tempering Alloy currently drops from refining ores...

Editorial
I can't recall the exact terms, so I'm just using some approximate terms and amounts. Please don't yell me for inaccuracies.

I'm just trying to make the point that the upgrade mat farming is explosively more involved than the other crafting skills. And since JC seam nodes seem to appear about 40-50% less than ore nodes, it's going to be a bit of a slog unless you pay gold to the guild traders to bulk up mats to ease the grind.
End Editorial

Edit: To be fair to ZOS, they did disclose all of this up front in a fairly recent post.

https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/26357

I read it. I understood it. I didn't appreciate it. Now I do. And I don't enjoy it.

I really appreciate your detailed feedback. I agree with most of it.

As for ZOS telling us up front about the extra grind for traits and upgrade mats, that post was after pre-orders started. They should have shared that info then.

I don't have issue with them limiting to researching one item at a time since there are only two items. There is a lot less to research.

I do think upgrading to purple should be much easier. I can understand making gold hard since gold jewelry is very limited today.

commdt

Elsterchen wrote: »

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

soooo......has anybody figured out a fast way to lvl jewelry crafting yet?

as @Edaphon nicely pointed out you may take your 10% chance (RNG hates me so mine is definately closer to "not-worth-the-trouble") to pick up jewellery at dolmens with 1 dolmen ~ every 5 Minutes you may grind your senses to oblivion. If you scratch peeing, eating and sleeping for ~ 10 days straight, you might have enough to be close to level 50. Attention: do not forget to drink! Drinking is mandatory for living.

The whales may pick up golden jewellery at the golden vendor on Friday/Saturday ... and should be done after spending a hefty amount of gold (rumor has it its ~ 80 golden Rings...).

Casual peasants will try the usual ... quest, chests, dailies, PVP, PVE, stealing as well as murdering and fight over the rather expensive jewellery at guild vendors ... those that loose will have to do with the very and extremely expensive jewellery at guild vendors.

my guess.

actually it is ~1.5 mins per dolmen (was for me in Glenumbra during Halloween) and the chance is 100%.

Asardes

I'd rather play Stamina DK in vAS than grind dolmens on purpose to train my JC skill

Minghash

Turned in my fifth daily jewelry crafting writ (three silver rings) and, again, the inspiration promised did not add to the crafting level status counter. So no crafting level advancement from doing daily writs (for the thirt time now)

The Pewter writs did give 2000 points, the Copper and Silver writs so far have given no points.

Anybody else having this issue ?

Edaphon

Minghash wrote: »

Turned in my fifth daily jewelry crafting writ (three silver rings) and, again, the inspiration promised did not add to the crafting level status counter. So no crafting level advancement from doing daily writs (for the thirt time now)

The Pewter writs did give 2000 points, the Copper and Silver writs so far have given no points.

Anybody else having this issue ?

I've had platinum writs grant inspiration for both JC and enchanting, pewter writs are working as intended.

Maybe copper and silver only grant inspiration for enchanting? I'll test that later today.


Edit: Copper writs do indeed grant inspiration for enchanting.

Darauk

JasonSilverSpring wrote: »

As for ZOS telling us up front about the extra grind for traits and upgrade mats, that post was after pre-orders started. They should have shared that info then.

That, my friend, is an excellent point. I preordered SI pretty much same day of announcement, and that was in no small part due to JC.

When considering your comment, I'm even less pleased about the system design.

How short my memory...

Qbiken

Well, I need to get the achievement for destroying Dark Anchors anyway, might as well hit "2 birds with one stone"....

Nebthet78

I see they upgraded the amount of seams that spawn.. this is good.

I can deal with the 10x to get ounces.... however, the 10x on the traits needs to be lowered to something like 5x needed.

Then, I would suggest that there be NO 10x requirment for grains. They are rare enough from decon and refinement that these should be given out at plating, or else you need to upgrade the number we get from decon.

I don't mind a little grind, but after two days of doing nothing but grinding this stuff out... yeah... waaaaaaaay too much of a grind on live.

Darauk

Nebthet78 wrote: »

I see they upgraded the amount of seams that spawn.. this is good.

I can deal with the 10x to get ounces.... however, the 10x on the traits needs to be lowered to something like 5x needed.

Then, I would suggest that there be NO 10x requirment for grains. They are rare enough from decon and refinement that these should be given out at plating, or else you need to upgrade the number we get from decon.

I don't mind a little grind, but after two days of doing nothing but grinding this stuff out... yeah... waaaaaaaay too much of a grind on live.

I've been grinding for five days on Live at this point.

• Seam spawns are improved, but still pale in comparison to ore.
• The 10x to get ounces is fine, as that's in line with the other crafting skills.
• I completely agree with you: the 10x raw for trait materials and plating materials is heinous. It will take forever to get enough mats to craft and/or upgrade jewelry to Legendary for my main and all of my alts.

drake88131

Darauk wrote: »

Nebthet78 wrote: »

I see they upgraded the amount of seams that spawn.. this is good.

I can deal with the 10x to get ounces.... however, the 10x on the traits needs to be lowered to something like 5x needed.

Then, I would suggest that there be NO 10x requirment for grains. They are rare enough from decon and refinement that these should be given out at plating, or else you need to upgrade the number we get from decon.

I don't mind a little grind, but after two days of doing nothing but grinding this stuff out... yeah... waaaaaaaay too much of a grind on live.

I've been grinding for five days on Live at this point.

• Seam spawns are improved, but still pale in comparison to ore.
• The 10x to get ounces is fine, as that's in line with the other crafting skills.
• I completely agree with you: the 10x raw for trait materials and plating materials is heinous. It will take forever to get enough mats to craft and/or upgrade jewelry to Legendary for my main and all of my alts.

Try pvp? I'm guessing this is a push to get people to play pvp for transmute stones? If so it's going to work for me!!!!

Darauk

drake88131 wrote: »

Try pvp? I'm guessing this is a push to get people to play pvp for transmute stones? If so it's going to work for me!!!!

I hope that's not the draw... I suck at PVP.

Now with that Summerset is on live, I really (really) don't like the 10x dust requirement for traits or plating materials.

I've managed to research all traits (most bought from traders, used research scrolls with crown gems to speed everything up) and reach Level 50 in week (grind Alik'r dolmens for hours and hours and hours to get jewelry to deconstruct). Despite deconstructing more than enough green, blue, and purple jewelry to more than get to Level 50, I still have *two* whopping purple plating mats.

Yeouch.

Kaxxi

only jewels i get have healthy, arcane and 1 more. how do we get other traits?

JasonSilverSpring

Kaxxi wrote: »

only jewels i get have healthy, arcane and 1 more. how do we get other traits?

@Kaxxi, there are specific ways to find the other traits. Read this guide fir the specifics:

https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/26357?Check-out-Jewelry-Crafting-With-this-Preview-&-Guide

You can also look at guild stores, but prices can be high currently.

Kaxxi

JasonSilverSpring wrote: »

Kaxxi wrote: »

only jewels i get have healthy, arcane and 1 more. how do we get other traits?

@Kaxxi, there are specific ways to find the other traits. Read this guide fir the specifics:

https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/26357?Check-out-Jewelry-Crafting-With-this-Preview-&-Guide

You can also look at guild stores, but prices can be high currently.

ohhh thank you very much

Pyr0xyrecuprotite

Cross posting to link to other threads where this has been reported. Apparently it was reported in the PTS thread at least as far back as May 19 (pre-release), and multiple times since May 30 (once people have moved beyond doing Pewter writs).

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/5147155/#Comment_5147155 - PTS thread
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/416173/jewelry-writ-inspiration-not-working (May 30)
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/416171/jewelry-inspiration (May 30)
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/416476/jewelry-crafting-daily-writs-grant-wrong-no-inspiration (May 31)
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/416590/jewelry-crafting-writs-doesnt-give-inspiration-bug-or-intended (June 1)