PTS Update 18 - Feedback Thread for Jewelry Crafting

ghastley

idahogeekette wrote: »

3) Not important to game, just a thought that is stuck in my head, but "Pewter" named nodes are sort of silly since pewter is an Alloy........ Does also make me wonder why Copper isn't usable...... maybe mix with Tin, silver, gold, etc. ? I know, I know, its just a game......but one of the draws I love with ESO is how its more realistically grounded than many games with very logical and realistic gear, props, and costuming.

Think of it like Ebony - same name, different substance. Copper, I think, is already in use (style mat?)

Aral_Ebordna

I used a template character to make jewelry in all traits for another character. I used the research time reduce scrolls in various combinations to get research of all traits completed. The scrolls worked fine.

I was able to find nodes in zones to obtain raw materials. They are infrequent. I am concerned how easy they will be to find when it goes live unless the frequency of nodes is increased.

I found the survey location easily. I prefer the descriptive text which was specific enough in my case to find the location quickly.

I did certification in Alinor. It was easy to find and complete certification. I found dust and pulverized materials.

I used one of the supplied writs on a template character. One I had the trait research completed, there were no issues in completing and turning the writ in.

charlmgn

Ahnastashia wrote: »

An immediate pain point is that there are not nearly enough seam nodes. There are going to be a zillion crafters all trying to get raw materials so they can level jewelry crafting from scratch and at least at this point, it looks like you're going to starve us for raw resources. Also, am I mistaken that a portion of regular ore nodes were just turned into seam nodes? So, if that is true, it's going to make it so there are less ore nodes as well. Crafters have waited a long time for jewelry crafting and we are going to need a huge amount of raw resources to work with. We should be tripping over nodes at this point (at least initially). Please significantly up the nodes and if you just turned some of the old ore nodes into new seam nodes.. please don't do that. Seam nodes should be in addition to regular ore nodes and should be all over the place just like other raw material nodes are.

I agree that the number of nodes needs to be increased. I would also like the ability to select the level of materials I find (among the levels I am able to use) so I can pick up mid-level materials on my max characters. This hasn't worked right since they scaled all zones.

As far as making separate jewelcrafting and blacksmithing nodes, they could more easily fix it by having the same nodes drop both materials at the same time. That's mixing professions though, so I'm not sure they want to do that. They did include shared nodes when they implemented poisons, but they were still used in Alchemy. It did have the net result of reducing the number of potion materials that dropped though.

charlmgn

I have found a lot of Jewelry Boxes to loot, and almost all of them have contained trait and style stones for non-jewelry items, which makes no sense. One (so far) has had a piece of jewelry I could decon. I understand you want to not throw out an overabundance of JC materials to begin with, but obtaining non-JC items in JC containers can't be the answer.

Desimator

I realise that jewellery upgrading is a system they wanted to remain niche no normal trial to gold jewellery in a few hours but the system that has a drop rate of fragment equivalent to the current drop rate for tempers when refining raw mats would require on average refining 10,000 raw mats to upgrade 1 purple jewellery piece to gold that is crazy.

Romestamo

Agree with all those saying there need to be more resource nodes. I kept a very unscientific count last Friday and Saturday and while adventuring overland found 28 iron nodes but only 7 pewter - and I'd spent a point to light up the pewter. On Sunday it was far worse, 17 iron and only 2 pewter. So I was not able to progress the test character more than a couple of ranks in jewelry before it got deleted.

If it's too much of a hassle, people just won't do it.

POps75p

Sordidfairytale wrote: »

I'm stunned that the attunable stations cost 250 vouchers. I wasn't a fan that woodworking cost the same as cloth and blacksmith either, but this is robbery.

Reasonably 100 writ vouchers would be sufficient?

so each of the add on for crafting jewl will be 250 each, even if you already own the current station.

idahogeekette

I pulled out a high level character and ran around the old world some. He has maxed trades. I Found ONE node--- it was Platinum. I was able to mine it. This character did not have a single point in jewelrycrafting.

After an evening of running around, thieving, killing monsters, and making harvest runs around the landscape, I found no more jewelry seams! Just that one Platinum. No Pewter.

Nor did I find any jewelry, jewelry mats, or jewelry books to get that first level.

idahogeekette

charlmgn wrote: »

I have found a lot of Jewelry Boxes to loot, and almost all of them have contained trait and style stones for non-jewelry items, which makes no sense. One (so far) has had a piece of jewelry I could decon. I understand you want to not throw out an overabundance of JC materials to begin with, but obtaining non-JC items in JC containers can't be the answer.

I agree. I expected Jewlery Boxes to have better loot than a lockpick or piece of bone.

Rhyono

Could Jewelry skills stop using Woodworking images? That'd be great.

eso_nya

Had a look at the Master Writs from forgotten mail last night.
Its a major letdown.
Legendary item nets ~110 vouchers, epic item ~7.

Compared to the other crafts, its inbetween legendary and legendary + nirnhoned in terms of reward which is theoretically okayish, but as the legendary jeweleries need 10 times more upgrade mats, crafting those items is (atleast) 10 times more expensive.

A legendary, bloodthirsty ring of a 9 trait set, will take 80 of the golddusts (id assume those should be around ~800k gold on the guildtrader, u can also refine ~8000 raw mats to get them or run 80 vtrials in hm, or buy and decon 80 of cyro vendors rings....) [I do believe the droprates for the gold dusts equal current droprates for "complete" gold tempers. Please DO proof me wrong on that.]
U'll need to do new pvp dailies for a while to get a ring to research and enough spares to decon to get a traitstone.
Than u need to research all 9 traits to be able to make a 9 traiter in the first place.
For a bit more than 100 vouchers.

I see 3 things i could do with those master wirts so far:
- type DESTROY (tho they aint actually worth the time to do so)
- dump in a random guildbank
- collect 6 and than send a mail to someone i hate

If u leave it as is, please consider increasing the amount of vouchers u get by x10, for 1k vouchers on a single writ, i might consider actually doing them, the value of used mats would still be higher than the value of the vouchers gained, but getting 1k vouchers e.g. for enchanting is a lot more hassle, thus it be at least a timesaver.

Or, please rework the whole refining dust system and have complete items drop. I think noone ever mentioned that before, but some systems of the game do feel a tiny bit grindy at times.

joaaocaampos

Here are my suggestions for improvement.

joaaocaampos wrote: »

Harmony

• Increases the power of activated Synergy effects and reduces Synergy's cooldown.

Swift

• Increases your non-mounted movement speed and reduces the duration of all snare effects on you.

I had suggested adding the Training or Prosperous effects to Swift, but that would lose the Trait fantasy. So above is a valid suggestion!

Protective

1. Increases Physical and Spell Resistance, and Critical Resistance.
2. Increases Physical and Spell Resistance, and increases the amount of damage you can block.

majulook

idahogeekette wrote: »

1) Curious why not every crafting location has had a jewelry station added. Some of the old-world areas do not have one (Bleakrock, for example)

I found JC stations in Enchanter stores in some of the city's, maybe that's were the one is in Bleakrock.

JHartEllis

Jewelry crafting will be popular and open up much more build diversity, especially with the new traits and in conjunction with the 2H weapon double set bonus change. However, I'm dreadful of the upcoming crafted jewelry market based on the distinction between the Crown-based research and the voucher-based research.

A major feature of the Crown Research Scrolls is that they have no cooldown:


Compared to the scrolls from the writ voucher Achievement Mediator, which do have a cooldown:


With maximum Lapidary Research and ESO+, the total time to research all 9 traits is 70 days, so it would take ~35 days using a Research Scroll, Jewelry Crafting, 1 Day every day to finish research for either necklaces or rings.

For popular 6-trait sets like Hunding's Rage and Julianos, those that purchase Crown Instant Jewelry Crafting Research are going to have a market monopoly for the first week of Summerset. For 9-trait sets, this Crown-exclusive monopoly is over a month! Those that pay for the Crown research are going to be the only ones able to create these sets, and this really flips the current Crown model upside down: Crown purchases for research or horse riding lessons have been used to CATCH UP with other players and not to LEAP AHEAD of the player base.

This also compromises the integrity of the trading system by creating an unlevel playing field. Jewelry crafting is going to be a huge market out the gate, and only those that pay many tens of thousands of Crowns will have access to benefit from the frenzy.

There would be several ways to avoid this troubling market scenario:

1) Add Instant Jewelry Crafting Research Scrolls (and the wording and effect from Instant All Research) only AFTER Summerset has been live for some time. A full 35-day wait would completely eliminate the effect, though even a week or two would severely mitigate the issue.

2) Add Grand and Major equivalent research scrolls to the writ voucher Achievement Mediator, even if at very high prices. This would shorten the total 35-day window down to about 10 days.

3) Remove the 20-hour cooldown from the Research Scroll, Jewelry Crafting, 1 Day. This would completely alleviate the issue, though the Writ Voucher cost should probably be significantly increased in this case.

As a trading guild leader, I'm very much concerned about the potential for the sudden existence of a Crown-exclusive market, and it makes me worry about the game direction if it hits live as is, so I hope action is taken before then.

Mannox

JHartEllis wrote: »

Jewelry crafting will be popular and open up much more build diversity, especially with the new traits and in conjunction with the 2H weapon double set bonus change. However, I'm dreadful of the upcoming crafted jewelry market based on the distinction between the Crown-based research and the voucher-based research.

A major feature of the Crown Research Scrolls is that they have no cooldown:


Compared to the scrolls from the writ voucher Achievement Mediator, which do have a cooldown:


With maximum Lapidary Research and ESO+, the total time to research all 9 traits is 70 days, so it would take ~35 days using a Research Scroll, Jewelry Crafting, 1 Day every day to finish research for either necklaces or rings.

For popular 6-trait sets like Hunding's Rage and Julianos, those that purchase Crown Instant Jewelry Crafting Research are going to have a market monopoly for the first week of Summerset. For 9-trait sets, this Crown-exclusive monopoly is over a month! Those that pay for the Crown research are going to be the only ones able to create these sets, and this really flips the current Crown model upside down: Crown purchases for research or horse riding lessons have been used to CATCH UP with other players and not to LEAP AHEAD of the player base.

This also compromises the integrity of the trading system by creating an unlevel playing field. Jewelry crafting is going to be a huge market out the gate, and only those that pay many tens of thousands of Crowns will have access to benefit from the frenzy.

There would be several ways to avoid this troubling market scenario:

1) Add Instant Jewelry Crafting Research Scrolls (and the wording and effect from Instant All Research) only AFTER Summerset has been live for some time. A full 35-day wait would completely eliminate the effect, though even a week or two would severely mitigate the issue.

2) Add Grand and Major equivalent research scrolls to the writ voucher Achievement Mediator, even if at very high prices. This would shorten the total 35-day window down to about 10 days.

3) Remove the 20-hour cooldown from the Research Scroll, Jewelry Crafting, 1 Day. This would completely alleviate the issue, though the Writ Voucher cost should probably be significantly increased in this case.

As a trading guild leader, I'm very much concerned about the potential for the sudden existence of a Crown-exclusive market, and it makes me worry about the game direction if it hits live as is, so I hope action is taken before then.

Took the words out of my mouth. I highly doubt however that ZOS will change its current ploy for hot selling through the Crown Store. It is a clear pay to win in my opinion. Soul crushing for someone like me who wants none of this slimy business in my favorite hobby.

POps75p

could someone please tell me if you can use the Current Crafting Vouchers to Purchase and Attuned Jewelry Crafting station for the 250 vouchers, or do you need to have the Jewelry Crafting Master Writ one?

tks in advance

Rhyono

When I opposed buying research time, people vehemently supported their right to catch up to what took me months. I'm over CP750, $100 should be able to buy a character at my level, right? After all, they have a right to catch up to me. Now, they can buy their way past me in all future traits? That's fair.

Casdha

OK, one thing that is not simply stated in this thread that I can find.

Without all of the skill points taken to reduce the amount of mats needed to improve jewelry, to get 100% chance it starts out at
5 for green or 50 raw green mats
10 for blue or 100 raw blue mats
15 for purple or 150 raw purple mats
20 for gold or 200 raw gold mats

Don't guess I will even attempt improvements until this skill line is maxed out.

eso_nya

POps75p wrote: »

could someone please tell me if you can use the Current Crafting Vouchers to Purchase and Attuned Jewelry Crafting station for the 250 vouchers, or do you need to have the Jewelry Crafting Master Writ one?

tks in advance

@POps75p
U could always buy "new" voucher stuff with the vouchers u got before the things were introduced. The vouchers the jewelery writs promise dont look any different than the currently available.
So it _should_ be the same for attunables.
Will come back here and let u know if this changed for some reason, after pts got eu char copy.

POps75p

eso_nya wrote: »

POps75p wrote: »

could someone please tell me if you can use the Current Crafting Vouchers to Purchase and Attuned Jewelry Crafting station for the 250 vouchers, or do you need to have the Jewelry Crafting Master Writ one?

tks in advance

@POps75p
U could always buy "new" voucher stuff with the vouchers u got before the things were introduced. The vouchers the jewelery writs promise dont look any different than the currently available.
So it _should_ be the same for attunables.
Will come back here and let u know if this changed for some reason, after pts got eu char copy.

much appreciated for the effort. tks

eso_nya

On a template char w/ maxed "Jewelry Extraction"-passive, refining the 5 stacks of 200 dusts i got from material supply boxes gave:

12 green Terne Grains
6 blue Iridium Grains
11 purple Zircon Grains
4 golden Chromium Grains

15 Pulverized Antimony (Healthy)
24 Oulverized Cobalt (Arcane)
18 Pulverized Zinc (Robust)

173 Pewter Ounces
166 Copper Ounces
176 Silver Ounces
182 Electrum Ounces
172 Platinum Ounces

Deconning the 9 Willlpower/Endurance/Agility Necks and Rings got:

6 golden Chromium Grains

3 Pulverized Antimony
3 Pulverized Zinc
2 Pulverized Cobalt
8 Platinum Ounces

Even tho its a rather small sample size, i think it save to say:
- upgrade dusts drop at the same ratio than their counterparts from the other crafts, thus 10 times less
- refining only gives traitstones-parts for healthy, arcane and robust
- deconning only has a chance to give a grain of the upgrademat, an ounce (the full base material) or a pulverized traitstonepart back
- it didnt happen, but looks possible to get back nothing

Looks like my previous assumtion was actually to optimistic :P

eso_nya wrote: »

A legendary, bloodthirsty ring of a 9 trait set, will take 80 of the golddusts (id assume those should be around ~800k gold on the guildtrader, u can also refine ~8000 raw mats to get them or run 80 vtrials in hm, or buy and decon 80 of cyro vendors rings....)

The spambots and their farming minions will love that.

POps75p

So for example a magicka setup:
2610 Magicka – Player 1 wearing full gold jewelry
2520 Magicka – Player 2 wearing full purple jewelry

from one of the best eso sites avail, always one of the 1st to have the updated info

wtf would anyone upgrade purple to gold to get a 90 increase in the desired format. you have to be stupid to do it with crafting as it NOT close to being cost effective

https://alcasthq.com/eso-jewelry-crafting-summerset/

BrightOblivion

I confess, when I first saw Jewelry Crafting listed as one of Summerset's features, I was ecstatic, and almost pre-ordered Summerset on the spot. It's bugged me for quite some time that our character, as formidable as the rest of their resume was, could be so baffled by a simple loop of metal or a charm on a chain. But then I started looking more at how the process was actually going to work, how you're going to need ten times the amount of upgrade materials or trait items to create anything, and how rare the nodes seem to be, and that initial elation vanished faster than a water droplet in the desert.

Don't get me wrong. I don't disagree that we don't want to completely devalue things like veteran trials, but it seems like y'all have grabbed the pendulum and fastened it at the other extreme. Truly, is maintaining the value of crappy rings and necklaces I find in veteran content or buy off The Golden truly worth ten times as much as any piece of armor or weaponry? Consider the price the rarity of the upgrade materials and the fact that you'll need ten times as much to do anything, and compare it to the price of items off the Golden (the closest thing we have to a jewelry:gold comparison right now). Do they remotely match up? You have people talking about how just to upgrade an item from purple to gold, with all the upgrades for lowering the number of tempers needed, you'll need 800k gold. Compare that to the 500k needed to buy a dungeon set necklace in gold, no upgrades or additional materials needed, and you see a considerable discrepancy. If your goal was to limit the upgrade potential of jewelry, doubling or even multiplying the needed rates by 5 would have probably been enough. That's still 40 gold temper pieces at full upgrade, not even counting the materials needed to get up to purple. If a similar pricing for tempers held, you'd still be looking at about 400k to go from purple to gold, which is still nothing to sneeze at. I could even understand making it so that the amount ramped up, especially when going from purple to gold. After all, min-maxing comes with a price tag. But to make it so that we need ten times the normal amount- 20 green, 30 blue, 40 purple, and 80 gold- defies my comprehension especially after, to see what sort of numbers I was looking at, I refined all the jewelry dust I got on my PTS template, with all passives in place, and got 18 green, 14 blue, 6 purple, and a whopping 4 gold GRAINS. That's right. From 1k dust, 100 refinings, I got 4 gold dust. At a similar rate, after refining between six and seven thousand dust, I could make a piece of purple jewelry, and it would take TWENTY THOUSAND dust to refine it to gold. That's sixty thousand for all three pieces of jewelry.

Admittedly, that's frustration-inducing enough on its own. However, then one must take into account how difficult it is to find the jewelry seams, which the designer has seemingly implemented in one of the worst possible ways. As others have suggested, having multiple types of nodes share the same spawn point is not a good idea. It wasn't/isn't for alchemy reagents, and it isn't for jewelry seams/ ore nodes. Either someone goes along and winds up running in circles picking up a whole lot of stuff they don't want and fervently hoping for what they actually want to spawn in its place, or they ignore it and eventually all anyone is left with is unwanted castoffs. It's not something that makes for pleasant, enjoyable gameplay, to be sure. Add to that an apparent imbalance in the amount of seams (ore shows up far, far move often), and you have the beginnings of a very unpleasant grind, especially when everyone on the server is trying to find them to get their jewelry crafting leveled up. At the very least, the rate at which seams show up should be increased, though, to be honest, they should have been given their own nodes in the first place. Yes, it makes sense from a thematic standpoint that you would occasionally find jewel dust in rocks and ore veins. However, from a gameplay standpoint, especially involving something that is being advertised as a banner reason to buy Summerset, the way Battlegrounds was for Morrowind, it's an awful idea. When a new feature is announced, especially like this one, people want to experience it. They want to feel like they're progressing. They want to test and explore and figure out how it works. They don't want to run in the same circle for an hour and a half and realize that they've gotten ten seams and more than half of them were for materials they won't be able to use for a very long time.

Where these two points of irritation combine, you have master writs and their pittance of vouchers. Despite taking ten or more times the amount of effort, particularly when considering the amount of work that will go into getting the new trait materials, these writs reward the same amount of vouchers as any other craft. Which is to say, perhaps ten if you're lucky. However, as previously stated, rather than maybe needing to harvest a thousand of the raw material to have everything you need to upgrade the item to the purple that's needed for the writ, it takes four to six times that amount. For the same reward. Heaven forbid you get a master writ for a gold item. At this point, if you do get a jewelry master writ, all indications are that your best bet is to destroy it, a la Buoyant Armiger writs, because no one in their right mind is going to buy it, even if you decided to sell it. Once again, it doesn't make for good or entertaining gameplay.

All of this is to say that, despite wanting this feature for a long time and being initially excited when I heard it was coming, all I feel right now regarding its implementation is disheartened and disappointed. Worse yet, because y'all posted the guide regarding the feature, complete with numbers, before we even got a chance to look at the feature in the PTS or provide feedback in the thread that's for that purpose, I have absolutely zero hope of it getting better. (As an aside to @ZOS_GinaBruno , @ZOS_JessicaFolsom , or whoever wrote the article, while I can understand wanting to tout your new feature, giving too many numbers or specifics in an official article only makes testers wonder why they should even bother with feedback when it's not going to change anything.) "We've added jewelry crafting for people who buy Summerset! You can now create your own jewelry for crafted sets, and upgrade existing jewelry!" You know, once you've participated in a stupidly miserable grind for a few months. Maybe around the time of the next DLC release.

Thanks, but I think I'll pass. At least for now.

Casdha

Do this to all of them and it might not be as bad LoL

KudnaBeefhooked

One thing that I haven't seen posted anywhere is the difference between Pre-Summerset and post-Summerset jewellery. I know you can't decon pre-Summerset jewellery but when something is posted on a trader, how can you know that it will be deconn-able or not just by looking at it? If there isn't something to indicate this then loads of folks will get scammed.

schattenkind

Maybe just give the post-summerset jewels a green outline in the item description and/or tooltip. Or an orange for the pre-summerset. Something like that, easy to see, not searching for 3px icons somewhere in the corner.

But I agree on that important point, had this in mind but not being confronted with this issue on pts, it got lost...

Darlon

Pre Summerset jewelry will have an extra tooltip that says so

JasonSilverSpring

KudnaBeefhooked wrote: »

One thing that I haven't seen posted anywhere is the difference between Pre-Summerset and post-Summerset jewellery. I know you can't decon pre-Summerset jewellery but when something is posted on a trader, how can you know that it will be deconn-able or not just by looking at it? If there isn't something to indicate this then loads of folks will get scammed.

Pre Summerset jewelry will state that it cannot be deconstructed in the description.

POps75p

JasonSilverSpring wrote: »

KudnaBeefhooked wrote: »

One thing that I haven't seen posted anywhere is the difference between Pre-Summerset and post-Summerset jewellery. I know you can't decon pre-Summerset jewellery but when something is posted on a trader, how can you know that it will be deconn-able or not just by looking at it? If there isn't something to indicate this then loads of folks will get scammed.

Pre Summerset jewelry will state that it cannot be deconstructed in the description.

but are you able to change the trait on the old jewellery?

Casdha

One thing I think should be added is that if you improve an old piece of jewelry it should be where you can then deconstruct it. That is a lot of mats to use and not be able to get any of them back especially if it is bound.