PTS Update 18 - Feedback Thread for Jewelry Crafting

Linaleah

Colecovision wrote: »

General Feedback:

I spent the summer of '95 working for this old German dude as a jewelers apprentice. We used old methods, made our own alloys from coins and the whole bit. We also did sculpture in pitch using a ball hammer and chasing tools. Please tell whoever designed the bench that I love it. The picks, the files, the curve on the bench, all of it. It's something I hadn't thought about in a while and seeing the bench was a blast.

oh the look of the bench is brilliant. that is probably one thing I personaly have zero issues with. weeell teeny tiny issue with a missing bench pin and a scrap catching drawer, but I'm just being super nitpicky here

that it costs more than 3 times as much as benches for other crafts? not so much. why is it that all the other stations are 35 vouchers, but JC station is 125 for the basic version?

schattenkind

Werent the other crafting stations around 100 vouchers at the beginning too? My memory might be bad but some bell is ringing reading the "125".

Linaleah

schattenkind wrote: »

Werent the other crafting stations around 100 vouchers at the beginning too? My memory might be bad but some bell is ringing reading the "125".

attunables. not regular. regular stations were, as far as i remember - always 35.

VicRedguard

Casdha wrote: »

I'm guessing that you are gonna wait until folks get bored with jewelry to have daily writs for them, or are they gonna be in a different place than the other writs?

Also,only a piece of a trait stone every few seams that has be to refined like the base material 10 to 1, are they not gonna pop out by refining the base materials like they do for the rest of the craft materials?

Is it gonna be like other crafts in that is easier to learn with deconing higher level materials or is meant for max level crafters only?

Read The Natch Potes. Everything is there, and you are wrong on most accounts.

CoyoteNZ

My 2c worth may not count as I’m a console player so not on the PTS but...

I’m a crafter at heart, I want it to be a part of the game like PvP, PvE, farming and trading is.

I feel a little disappointed with the current system as the best way for example to become a master blacksmith is to go dungeon grinding on your cp160+ toon and then do lots of deconstruction.

The parts I love are the daily craft writs, and how you have to research the traits. This actually means doing something other than just playing the same game and becoming a master crafter by the result of it.

I don’t want to be able to make better (or worst) stuff than you can get by PvP, or Vet Dunegons, I just want equivalent but different.

Make crafting an aspect of the game, not just a easy to do when you get good at other aspects.

Heck, if it was me I’d increase the inspiration from writs, but make that the only way to increase crafting.

ADarklore

I'm curious... with all the people on PTS out farming the new nodes, is it possible that there are just too many active players farming and that's why people aren't finding them or finding so few?

If not, then ZOS needs to step up and add many more nodes... or... increase the respawn rate at least for the first few months after Summerset is released as most players are going to be trying to level this line with their crafter- probably even before doing the Summerset storyline.

Edaphon

ADarklore wrote: »

I'm curious... with all the people on PTS out farming the new nodes, is it possible that there are just too many active players farming and that's why people aren't finding them or finding so few?

Nope, most zones are completely empty.

JasonSilverSpring

The lack of base materials is a huge issue. I spent an hour farming just to get the mats for a tier 1 daily writ. It should be easier to do daily writs as that should be key to learning the skill line.

Also oddly it was frustrating to get top tier materials half the time because I needed pewter to do my stupid writ. I guess after the extreme time it will take to max jewelry crafting I should have hoarded a modest amount of mats.

lostcloud

There is an issue to a degree with the nodes that do spawn, it seems to be a 50/50 split with the material you are able to craft with and platinum. While this will give you a large quantity of platinum once you reach 50 in JC it does restrict the already low quantity of the current material you need.
The nodes and be somewhat hard to see in some environments even with keen eye.

Linaleah

ADarklore wrote: »

I'm curious... with all the people on PTS out farming the new nodes, is it possible that there are just too many active players farming and that's why people aren't finding them or finding so few?

If not, then ZOS needs to step up and add many more nodes... or... increase the respawn rate at least for the first few months after Summerset is released as most players are going to be trying to level this line with their crafter- probably even before doing the Summerset storyline.

the fact that that we tend to be the only person per zone while farming is part of the issue. even with no competition there are just too few JC nodes. all the other nodes are abundant. now imagine this situation, but with competition from other players. materials are scarce even without it. with competition its going to be worse then already terrible droprates.

P.S. when i was farming, i specifically picked up all the ore nodes along with whatever JC seams I found. since they apparently share spawns, I wanted to force more of them to spawn. they STILL spawned rarely

Castielle

I feel like the Jewelry Crafting system is too grindy for something that you have to pay cash for. I could understand if it was free to everyone, but it's not. As is right now, you have to deconstruct about 100 purple jewelry in order to get enough mats to upgrade 1 ring or necklace with 100% success to purple. That's on top of the Green and Blue ones as well. That seems extremely unreasonable.

In addition, Jewelry nodes are too rare and you're lucky if you find any at all when you go out to look for them. They also share nodes with ore, which is a bad idea. When I played Lord of the Rings Online, Tin used to be a rare spawn of Copper. This was the first material you needed to level up, but it was so rare that no one could level up Blacksmithing in that game and Tin became the most valuable metal, even though it was the lowest tier. Eventually after about a year Turbine drastically increased the spawn rate and that problem went away. Please cut to the chase and do that before live release...

Cas

ausmack2014

New to the PTS yesterday and naturally being a lover of crafting, I went looking for JC mats. In the entire time I was on, I found only one.

The zones I looked through were not incredibly busy - nowhere near how normally busy are on the live server - and I have to say that this needs to be attended to prior to launch.

You have a brand new profession. EVERYONE is going to want to try it out. So you are going to have a heap of very frustrated people unless you significantly increase the spawn rates and locations of the required materials.

Perhaps you could consider increasing the numbers and locations for the initial rush period and then putting it back down to normal after a period of time. But as it is, the rates are just way too low.

TequilaFire

I feel a little better as I found an area where the seams are a little more plentiful and farmed close to 100 platinum dust.
No where near anything to do with Summerset though. I am afraid to mention it as it might get nerfed. lol

Esha76

My impressions of Jewel crafting. I'm afraid it's not much.

Which sets are you looking forward to crafting once this system goes live?

Hunding’s/Julianos… I have to do an assessment of my characters with the 2-h weapon changes, so I’m no9t sure which sets I will make for which characters first at this time.

TL/DR: I don’t know yet.

Were you able to successfully research the new traits? Could you easily find the source?

Haven’t researched anything yet, but it’s clear how to do so.

Which was your favorite trait, and why?

Depends which character I am playing. Right now, I have only played my Stam NB on the PTS. I don’t PvP, so upon initial glance, I will probably just stick with Robust for her.

Did you understand how to obtain the raw materials for Jewelry Crafting?

Yes. Though the nodes are exceptionally rare in Summerset. Haven't been to the mainland.

Were you able to find the Survey Report locations?

Haven’t obtain any yet.

Were you able to get certified?

Yes

Were you able to successfully attune a Crafting Station to a Jewelry Crafting Station?

I don’t buy housing crafting stations.

Did you craft any new furnishings with Jewelry Crafting?

Have not obtained any Jewelry furnishing schematics.

Did you try Transmutation with Jewelry Crafting?

Not yet, but it is one of the first things I plan to do with my healer’s jewels when it goes live.

Did you get any Writs in Jewelry Crafting?

Yes. They seem fine to me. Though I was not able to complete them every day due to scarcity of pewter nodes in Summerset at this time. I just don’t have the resources to complete the writs.

Do you have any other general feedback?

I am not a fan of 10 pieces need to be refined to make one temper improvement.


Not enough jewelry crafting mat nodes in Summerset. As I have not come across many, as in only 3 in the days I have tested, I have been unable to really test out this new crafting feature.

radiostar

It's funny because you have to buy SS to get to use Jewels crafting, but to collect the metals you have to leave the island. Is that WAI, Z?

Also, 14 ranks to get to Engraver 2? Really? Am I forgetting from early access, or is that way out of whack?

I posted a pic that for psijic recipes you need Engraver level 5 for the gold one. Please do not reduce jewels drops from what's on live right now when SS drops. We will need every bit of jewels we can find, plus a better amount of raw metals.

KudnaBeefhooked

The way I see it, ZOS have done 2 things to gimp jewelcrafting.

Firstly, they have minimised the number of nodes one would reasonable expect (as compared to wood/ore/cloth) and they have also done this at the expense of ore nodes (simply slotting in seams where some ore nodes use to spawn.

Secondly, they have prevented players from deconning their jewellery that already existed in the game prior to the Summerset launch.

While I can understand why Zos have taken the approach to number 2, the first point makes no sense at all. When Summerset launches on live, there will be swarms of players trying to sweep up as many seams as possible. Lowering the number of spawn points will only lead to much anger and greifing. While ZOS wants to make as much money as possible from Summerset, which is reasonable (they are a business after all and not a charity), I would have thought the name of the game is to keep players happy so they keep playing.

Just my 2 cents.

DarcyMardin

Castielle wrote: »

I feel like the Jewelry Crafting system is too grindy for something that you have to pay cash for. I could understand if it was free to everyone, but it's not. As is right now, you have to deconstruct about 100 purple jewelry in order to get enough mats to upgrade 1 ring or necklace with 100% success to purple. That's on top of the Green and Blue ones as well. That seems extremely unreasonable.

In addition, Jewelry nodes are too rare and you're lucky if you find any at all when you go out to look for them. They also share nodes with ore, which is a bad idea. When I played Lord of the Rings Online, Tin used to be a rare spawn of Copper. This was the first material you needed to level up, but it was so rare that no one could level up Blacksmithing in that game and Tin became the most valuable metal, even though it was the lowest tier. Eventually after about a year Turbine drastically increased the spawn rate and that problem went away. Please cut to the chase and do that before live release...

Cas

Oh yes, I remember that from LOTRO! And then later when we had leveled into our 40s, remember how people used to camp Misty Mountain silver? And fight over the nodes. Or call out the names of node-snatchers in global chat to try to shame them. It could get quite nasty at times, although LOTRO was usually a pretty civil community.

Please ZOS, let’s not set things up for that kind of anger and resentment. Increase the seam spawn, please. I have explored for many hours now on the PTS, searching for seams, and have found very few. And certainly not enough to do the daily writs.

commdt

Well now, look at it another way. We all feared that jewelry crafting would make high end content not rewarding, as everyone would be able to craft golden rings themselves. But ZOS did a good job here making high end content more rewarding which is nice. Now the main source of ring materials would be from doing vet dungeons (purple) vet trials (golden) or earning high BG and Cyro scores (purple and golden) which will make participating in these activities more attractive.
If you dont do high end content you still can make golden war machine rings for your crafter which will never get any use of them (never understood the point...), though it will take some time
The implementation is perfect, and here you are whining

SergeantJinx

Alhatariel wrote: »

I am shocked that the juwelry stations cost 250 vouchers! Ill have to buy 38 stations for in our guildhall and that X 250 vouchers is really much.

My last count they are 41? and your not including the new ones coming out i think that's another 4.

Linaleah

commdt wrote: »

Well now, look at it another way. We all feared that jewelry crafting would make high end content not rewarding, as everyone would be able to craft golden rings themselves. But ZOS did a good job here making high end content more rewarding which is nice. Now the main source of ring materials would be from doing vet dungeons (purple) vet trials (golden) or earning high BG and Cyro scores (purple and golden) which will make participating in these activities more attractive.
If you dont do high end content you still can make golden war machine rings for your crafter which will never get any use of them (never understood the point...), though it will take some time
The implementation is perfect, and here you are whining

sigh.

you are forgetting something. housing. you know, that thing for which you can NOT get materials from deconstructing stuff.

aside from the fact that implementation is far from perfect and is incredibly grindy regardless... furnishing mats can ONLY be farmed via out in a world nodes.

that and its far FAR easier and faster to farm jewelry for deconstruction via chest runs/dolmen grinds.

last but not least. guess what? people who don't like end game activities right now? will NOT suddenly like them after jewelry crafting will become available. becasue the reason they don't like them is NOT the loot, its the activity itself.

JasonSilverSpring

commdt wrote: »

Well now, look at it another way. We all feared that jewelry crafting would make high end content not rewarding, as everyone would be able to craft golden rings themselves. But ZOS did a good job here making high end content more rewarding which is nice. Now the main source of ring materials would be from doing vet dungeons (purple) vet trials (golden) or earning high BG and Cyro scores (purple and golden) which will make participating in these activities more attractive.
If you dont do high end content you still can make golden war machine rings for your crafter which will never get any use of them (never understood the point...), though it will take some time
The implementation is perfect, and here you are whining

I can somewhat get behind putting access to gold upgrade materials behind such content. But, acquiring the basic mats to craft and lower upgrade mats should not be so difficult.

If someone wants to craft purple jewelry that drops fairly easily now, why does that have to be so difficult?

I am not a high end content player but I have mastered crafting and should be able to enjoy mastering jewelry crafting.

schattenkind

To the rarity of material nodes:
What I wrote in another (unofficial) thread before, the node count should adapt to online-player-count dynamically to give everyone the same chance to get materials. Looking at the number of players during a day, in the mornings are the less and in the evenings the most, so as it is now, the players who can play in the mornings will always outrun those who only can play in evenings (and weekends) by far. People who only can play evenings or weekends (due to work or other stuff) are in a huge disadvantage, which should not be, given the possibilities of code programming.

To accomplish that I'd go with about 0,7 ratio increasing node refresh, as not all players online are harvesting. To put this in an example, lets say 100 players are online, node spawn ratio is 1.0, then 1000 players online ratio would be 7.0. Well, I m not a math genius, but overall this would be the most fair and giving everyone the same chances to get materials not depending on when they can play or how many ppl are harvesting. Noone would need to camp nodes.

Concerning the node sharing with blacksmithing materials: Seems logical, since it is all metals. I dont know if wood:blacksmith:clothing nodes are spawning 1:1:1 in relation to each other but the situation right now is, from wood you can do staves/bows and shiels only, clothing light armor only (medium doesnt count), blacksmithing armor, weapons and now jewelery. The relation should be adapted to this needs.
But, looking at the raw and refined material rareness and prices, blacksmithing materials are the cheapest, followed by wood and clothing on top. That puts the availability and rareness of materials in totaly different relation, which would let assume, blacksmithing nodes are the most or at least that blacksmithing materials are not needed that much as the others. Therefore, puting jewelery crafting mats on top of that would make blacksmithing mats a bit more rare but also more valuable.
To express this in numbers from my MM data (and experience) just for cp160 mats: rubedit ingots are about 7gp, sanded ruby ashes 14-15gp and ancestor silk about 35 (not taking into count the event caused price raising). Making blacksmit mats more rare would push up the prices to a more even level. For wood mats the level wont raise since the item count available to craft is way lower, due to less possibilities (changing a heavy armor setup is taking way more blacksmith mats then changing a shield or staff/bow taking wood mats). The higher price for tempering alloy (about 5,2k/p atm) in relation to dreugh wax (4,8k/p) and rosin (4,2k) results from the upgrade necessity: for a heavy armor it is more important to go gold, than it is for light/medium, where also counts that medium armor is upgraded with clothing materials. Same, for weapons it is more important to go gold if youre a dd, and weapons you have 2 (or 4 in worst case), while armor is 7.
Long story short, I say it is ok for now but wood crafting needs more attention in the future.

commdt

Linaleah wrote: »

commdt wrote: »

Well now, look at it another way. We all feared that jewelry crafting would make high end content not rewarding, as everyone would be able to craft golden rings themselves. But ZOS did a good job here making high end content more rewarding which is nice. Now the main source of ring materials would be from doing vet dungeons (purple) vet trials (golden) or earning high BG and Cyro scores (purple and golden) which will make participating in these activities more attractive.
If you dont do high end content you still can make golden war machine rings for your crafter which will never get any use of them (never understood the point...), though it will take some time
The implementation is perfect, and here you are whining

sigh.

you are forgetting something. housing. you know, that thing for which you can NOT get materials from deconstructing stuff.

aside from the fact that implementation is far from perfect and is incredibly grindy regardless... furnishing mats can ONLY be farmed via out in a world nodes.

that and its far FAR easier and faster to farm jewelry for deconstruction via chest runs/dolmen grinds.

last but not least. guess what? people who don't like end game activities right now? will NOT suddenly like them after jewelry crafting will become available. becasue the reason they don't like them is NOT the loot, its the activity itself.

Well I get your point, housing jewelry crafting will be quite costly. Honestly I would like only one thing, for jewelry dailies to be at list a bit profitable (net above the cost in materials), else I will ignore them entirely

Edaphon

Got my first master writ today.



Basically the same amount of writ vouchers as we would get for a 3 trait set with a common motif/trait from one of the other crafting skills but it requires 10 times the amount of upgrade mats.

Definitely not worth doing in its current state. Either the rewards need to be better or upgrade mats need to be easier to get.

Casdha

VicRedguard wrote: »

Casdha wrote: »

I'm guessing that you are gonna wait until folks get bored with jewelry to have daily writs for them, or are they gonna be in a different place than the other writs?

Also,only a piece of a trait stone every few seams that has be to refined like the base material 10 to 1, are they not gonna pop out by refining the base materials like they do for the rest of the craft materials?

Is it gonna be like other crafts in that is easier to learn with deconing higher level materials or is meant for max level crafters only?

Read The Natch Potes. Everything is there, and you are wrong on most accounts.

I did own up to this and make an addition. The fact that I made this post in the first place should be taken to mean that No, it is not obvious.

As far as patch notes go, it was my first time playing after getting home from work, I had about an hour before I went to bed so no I didn't read patch notes first.

edit: also the reason I made the comment about the stones from nodes is that I got 3 Pulverized Dawn-Prism (Used for the Triune trait) straight from a seam node.

Sweetpea704

I am really excited about jewelry crafting! I was able to get certified pretty quickly. I haven't gotten too far yet because I was trying to use my main crafter. I wanted to see what it is going to be like when it goes live. I wasn't able to get very far, sadly. First, I noticed that you don't have the ability to buy a jewelry station with crowns. Please add that. Also, you need to increase the drop rates for the jewelry mats. I mean by a lot. My play style is to basically pick up everything I see and in an hour I saw like two jewelry nodes. In the next hour, I saw zero nodes. Also, just make it where we can decon our old jewelry, if this is possible. You know, I realize that you cater to a crowd of people that only come back to play this game when new content comes out. Then they go back to other games. But, you might actually keep some of those players longer if the grinding wasn't so awful. My ADD was definitely kicking in. It is sad too, because the landscape is beautiful and the quests are really good. I would just lessen the grind-y parts a bit. They are a super buzz kill.

I will start a template toon and try again this weekend.

Pea

commdt

Edaphon wrote: »

Got my first master writ today.



Basically the same amount of writ vouchers as we would get for a 3 trait set with a common motif/trait from one of the other crafting skills but it requires 10 times the amount of upgrade mats.

Definitely not worth doing in its current state. Either the rewards need to be better or upgrade mats need to be easier to get.

There is enough nonsence in the game, but this one beats it big deal

Carbonised

Edaphon wrote: »

Got my first master writ today.



Basically the same amount of writ vouchers as we would get for a 3 trait set with a common motif/trait from one of the other crafting skills but it requires 10 times the amount of upgrade mats.

Definitely not worth doing in its current state. Either the rewards need to be better or upgrade mats need to be easier to get.

ZOS, this can absolutely NOT go into the game in it's current state.

I thought you had realised by now that the Perfect Roe writs are absolutely trash, and barely no one ever makes them due to how unrewarding they are. So what do you do, not only do you fail to fix the roe writs, you go ahead and add another type of useless, unrewarding writ instead?

Jewelrycrafters are already being screwed over once, by not having trait mats available to them, they get 1 out of all trait mats through daily crafting quests, and arguably the worst of the traits too. And now you screw them over again by rewarding purple traited jewelry with an obscenely low voucher amount like this?

Come on people, you already made jewelrycrafting more than 10 times the grind it should be, due to low node count and tempers split up in 10 parts. Did you fail to make the voucher reward 10 times higher as well?

The current voucher reward from jewelrycrafting writs is insultingly low, and will just make people trash the writs as soon as they get them. Fix Roe writs too, while you're at it.

phileunderx2

The nodes will increase with increased farming. I tried it out yesterday on a couple of my small loops and first time around mostly ore second time many more seams after about 30 mins or so I harvested about 75 seams. Now when this goes live it still is going to be crazy because everyone and their dog is going to be farming this stuff. I also predict many many bots.

TerraDewBerry

I really think the best way for the Dev who worked on this new craft to understand what the "fuss" is about is for them to go to the PTS and actually level to 50 the craft they created. From scratch, with just what you can harvest out in the wild, no boosts no DEV hacks/tricks. They need to do several of the master and grand master writs and need to make and upgrade jewelry to gold for at least a full set. I think if this happened, we would see a pretty quick change in what is going on.. or at least I would hope we would. Because then they would actually understand what they have done.. and why they need to fix it.

TLDR: the Dev who created the jewelry crafting line needs to personally experience what they are asking their players to experience.. just like the players will.