Time for some prime time PVP! (8PM EST, PC/NA/Vivec)

Ranger209 · December 2018

Joy_Division wrote: »

....EP got rolled the entire primetime. DC and its three bar population ....

This really needs to be emphasized. It's concerning, and becoming consistent. I am an NA PC Vivec player who is in every night during NA prime time 6-10 p.m. CST on DC. I generally queue in between 6 and 8 and have only encountered a queue once, and it was a queue of 1. All those things you mention do contribute heavily, along with the general lag, but so does faction swapping to a smaller degree. What are the queues for the other 2 factions like during that time frame? Are there any, or are all factions down on numbers consistently? I know when I get on AD and EP have the lock symbol, but don't know if they are truly locked or just 4 bar at that point.

DisgracefulMind · December 2018

zyk wrote: »

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DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Ackwalan wrote: »

Looks like a lot of people won't play unless their side is winning.

Opposite for me. I've barely been pvping because EP's side is so boring rn Q.Q

Oh, the irony. Your ball group help kill overnight NA PVP and now you're sad because it's boring.

I hope it was worth the lulz when you were trolling scrolls with only randoms to fight against.

Man you are salty, and I didn't even say anything for you to be salty. I wouldn't sit there and blame a PvP guild that's been alive no more than 3 months for all of the issues we've been seeing. And last campaign it was AD capping the map during the later time period, so please stop.

And if you knew anything about me, which you don't, I only play once or twice in a raid every week, if even that, and not very late. Running around with a scroll didn't kill PvP at night.

Reverb · December 2018

This is the least enjoyable ESO PvP "era" for me. There are plenty of threads that discuss the details of the current state, so I won't do it here. But fighting against the current state is not enjoyable in any way, and I have no interest in playing the way that would be necessary to counter the current state.

So I'm spending my time doing other things. Almost 5 years I have stuck with and remained passionate about the game, despite its flaws. But ESO PvP has finally delivered an experience I'm not even willing to log in for. I think many people feel the same way.

Haashhtaag · December 2018

Ranger209 wrote: »

show previous quotes

Joy_Division wrote: »

....EP got rolled the entire primetime. DC and its three bar population ....

This really needs to be emphasized. It's concerning, and becoming consistent. I am an NA PC Vivec player who is in every night during NA prime time 6-10 p.m. CST on DC. I generally queue in between 6 and 8 and have only encountered a queue once, and it was a queue of 1. All those things you mention do contribute heavily, along with the general lag, but so does faction swapping to a smaller degree. What are the queues for the other 2 factions like during that time frame? Are there any, or are all factions down on numbers consistently? I know when I get on AD and EP have the lock symbol, but don't know if they are truly locked or just 4 bar at that point.

I can confirm I get in instantly on AD and Dc during the eeek on the same time frame you’re on. But when I try I DC there is always a 30-60 person queue

Joy_Division · December 2018

Derra wrote: »

show previous quotes

Joy_Division wrote: »

But to the larger point. ESO PvP has always been dynamic, changing literally from hour to hour because of population and guild turnover or just from the natural flow of how the map plays. At 9:00 EP could have the entire North Red and trying to swarm Dc scrolls, but in just 30 minutes later be all the way back to just their three tri-keeps because of such over-extension. Snap shots are utterly misleading because the situation is going to be completely different in just a short while and Tuesday is going to be a very different story from Monday.

While somewhat true in general that eso map can be very volatile - i just wish this would actually translate into campaign results.

For vivec EU I can think of 3 campaign cycles AD did NOT win in the past 2 years. Something has to be done about mornincapping and imbalanced populations. Regardless of what faction it benefits.

We don't have a BigBoss here on NA. From what I hear, yeah, the EU isn't dynamic because of what he does. NA usually is. Even though EP probably has won about half the campaigns dating back to Launch and has taken more scrolls during non-primetimes than the other two factions, there have been many a night and many a campaigns in which Chalman has remained blue with 50 DC guarding it and EP has finished in last place.

@Ranger209 - What happened last night is not because people logged onto another faction because EP was taking a beating. Because the pop cap is much lower now than it was back in the day, organized guilds have a much stronger effect on how the map plays, particularly an experienced one. No Drac (EP's best guild) for EP and yes Omni (AD guild) is going to shift the balance a lot.

Kadoin · December 2018

Ackwalan wrote: »

Looks like a lot of people won't play unless their side is winning.

Blame ZOS for the crappy state PvP is in. I've honestly logged in less and when I do its always laggy, unresponsive and general piece of crap.

If not that, its just getting jumped by a group of players wearing earthgore, because they don't have enough of an advantage with numbers. And when that isn't happening, then its your faction running around with earthgore in a group and attacking doors. And when that is not happening, face NBs that can stealth right in your face at point blank range because ZOS somehow thinks that is balanced and its fair, despite nerfing every other defensive mechanic in the game AND healing

Balance in this patch is worse than the previous one, and I think I can let ZOS know how I feel about their changes by simply logging into the game LESS. If not that, get my rank 3 reward level and stop logging or going PvE.

As for not logging in unless a side is winning, guess what? MAYBE, just MAYBE if the game was actually good enough to be enjoyed without winning, guess what? People would actually play. Since that's not the case, why should it surprise anyone that people stop caring?

Minno · December 2018

Joy_Division wrote: »

It's dead because people don't want to deal with the in-combat bug, being immobile due to ZOS changes, questionable changes to classes, their friends left the game, they're still holding out hope that Fallout 76 will be worthy of a Triple A release -aside from the lag.

It seems whenever EP wins campaign or does well, then all the DC and AD come on to these forums as they have for the past four years and complain about what they perceived is foul play. It's been this way ever since EP was dubbed the "unemployed faction" going all the way back to 2014. But everything was perfectly acceptable and just great when EP was finishing in last place for, what was it, 3-4 months before? Where was this empathy all those months when AD Aussie-Asian crew painted the map Yellow?

People love taking convenient snapshots to show how those players on the other faction are meanies and bad-sports. Did you happen to log on tonight, that is 12/4, one day after this post? EP got rolled the entire primetime. DC and its three bar population took Arrius and the EP hordes were pretty much cooped up in Farragut, unable to make any progress. They got so demoralized, it was EP that dropped to 3 bars while AD still had pop-locked. In short, they got their ass kicked - and you're asking them to show empathy? Fat chance.

But to the larger point. ESO PvP has always been dynamic, changing literally from hour to hour because of population and guild turnover or just from the natural flow of how the map plays. At 9:00 EP could have the entire North Red and trying to swarm Dc scrolls, but in just 30 minutes later be all the way back to just their three tri-keeps because of such over-extension. Snap shots are utterly misleading because the situation is going to be completely different in just a short while and Tuesday is going to be a very different story from Monday.

I am going to take credit for the "unemployed" trash talk! Best forum pvp I have ever done lol.

Ranger209 · December 2018

Joy_Division wrote: »

show previous quotes

Derra wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

But to the larger point. ESO PvP has always been dynamic, changing literally from hour to hour because of population and guild turnover or just from the natural flow of how the map plays. At 9:00 EP could have the entire North Red and trying to swarm Dc scrolls, but in just 30 minutes later be all the way back to just their three tri-keeps because of such over-extension. Snap shots are utterly misleading because the situation is going to be completely different in just a short while and Tuesday is going to be a very different story from Monday.

While somewhat true in general that eso map can be very volatile - i just wish this would actually translate into campaign results.

For vivec EU I can think of 3 campaign cycles AD did NOT win in the past 2 years. Something has to be done about mornincapping and imbalanced populations. Regardless of what faction it benefits.

We don't have a BigBoss here on NA. From what I hear, yeah, the EU isn't dynamic because of what he does. NA usually is. Even though EP probably has won about half the campaigns dating back to Launch and has taken more scrolls during non-primetimes than the other two factions, there have been many a night and many a campaigns in which Chalman has remained blue with 50 DC guarding it and EP has finished in last place.

@Ranger209 - What happened last night is not because people logged onto another faction because EP was taking a beating. Because the pop cap is much lower now than it was back in the day, organized guilds have a much stronger effect on how the map plays, particularly an experienced one. No Drac (EP's best guild) for EP and yes Omni (AD guild) is going to shift the balance a lot.

I'm not looking at emphasizing the 3 bar prime time DC population last night as looking at that as a consistent thing that has been happening over the last month or more. I see it as a bad tell of the state of the game. The overarching issues have led to a depleted player base. The ability to swap factions allows people to hop at any time that they think their faction is beyond winning.

The meaning of the score, the 3 banner war, and anything greater than ones own personal pvp experience falls apart with faction swapping. All of that stuff becomes irrelevant, and for people who enjoy that aspect of Cyrodiil it becomes disheartening and even frustrating at times to be a part of. I don't know I hope Vivec survives on its own and that they don't have to combine servers. It is the last server with any population of note, and that is now becoming less noteworthy. When one of the factions can't poplock during prime time consistently over a long period of time I get the feeling things are going the wrong direction.

GlorphNoldorin · December 2018

Ackwalan wrote: »

Looks like a lot of people won't play unless their side is winning.

A lot of people wont play because the lag, once bad, becomes ridiculous when a certain group runs. Apart from the fact that it is no fun at all to fight said group and pvp has had writing on the wall for a a long time.

You do know said group has openly stated that those from other factions should join them before they judge? And a lot from DC have clearly either switched or left

Those with faction loyalty, can only put up with so much for so long given how the game performs

tonemd · December 2018

Joy_Division wrote: »

EP got rolled the entire primetime. DC and its three bar population took Arrius and the EP hordes were pretty much cooped up in Farragut, unable to make any progress.

Wasn't EP just "cooped up" in the keep where DC's scroll was? EP's been doing that for weeks now.

Iskras · December 2018

zyk wrote: »

show previous quotes

Iskras wrote: »

zyk wrote: »

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Ackwalan wrote: »

Looks like a lot of people won't play unless their side is winning.

Opposite for me. I've barely been pvping because EP's side is so boring rn Q.Q

Oh, the irony. Your ball group help kill overnight NA PVP and now you're sad because it's boring.

I hope it was worth the lulz when you were trolling scrolls with only randoms to fight against.

When this happens, i just left the game. Umplayable... LAG terrible, bugs... nothing seems work anymore.

It wasn't so much lag when they play, but poor sportsmanship.

In any online game, if one side is trouncing the others, the other players will find a different server to play on. ESO campaigns are all public servers played, mostly, by random casuals.

Groups of all sizes composed of competitive players don't show enough empathy when there aren't other groups like them to fight, but especially ball groups.

No, your casual competition won't 'git gud' or ball up. They are casual for reasons that go beyond the game. They'll just find something else to do.

Can be both or some reasons. Not only one, of corse.

zyk · December 2018

Joy_Division wrote: »

It's dead because people don't want to deal with the in-combat bug, being immobile due to ZOS changes, questionable changes to classes, their friends left the game, they're still holding out hope that Fallout 76 will be worthy of a Triple A release -aside from the lag.

Which is exactly why we shouldn't pee in the well by capping scrolls and emp immediately before prime time -- which has become a regular occurrence. Prime time lag is bad enough without exacerbating it with emp deposes and scroll recoveries.

EP is leading the campaign by thousands of points and are practically guaranteed to win this cycle. It's completely unnecessary to run up the score by emping a guy for the 20th time and capping scrolls. It makes the game that much more miserable during prime time hours.

I say the same things to my own faction. AD capped all opposition scrolls overnight which basically killed PVP during that period. AD can't catch up to EP, so it was pointless to do so. There were no good fights at all.

I don't actually really care who wins campaigns. I care about good fights which happen most often when there's combat parity between factions and the score is close.

Joy_Division · December 2018

Ranger209 wrote: »

show previous quotes

Joy_Division wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

But to the larger point. ESO PvP has always been dynamic, changing literally from hour to hour because of population and guild turnover or just from the natural flow of how the map plays. At 9:00 EP could have the entire North Red and trying to swarm Dc scrolls, but in just 30 minutes later be all the way back to just their three tri-keeps because of such over-extension. Snap shots are utterly misleading because the situation is going to be completely different in just a short while and Tuesday is going to be a very different story from Monday.

While somewhat true in general that eso map can be very volatile - i just wish this would actually translate into campaign results.

For vivec EU I can think of 3 campaign cycles AD did NOT win in the past 2 years. Something has to be done about mornincapping and imbalanced populations. Regardless of what faction it benefits.

We don't have a BigBoss here on NA. From what I hear, yeah, the EU isn't dynamic because of what he does. NA usually is. Even though EP probably has won about half the campaigns dating back to Launch and has taken more scrolls during non-primetimes than the other two factions, there have been many a night and many a campaigns in which Chalman has remained blue with 50 DC guarding it and EP has finished in last place.

@Ranger209 - What happened last night is not because people logged onto another faction because EP was taking a beating. Because the pop cap is much lower now than it was back in the day, organized guilds have a much stronger effect on how the map plays, particularly an experienced one. No Drac (EP's best guild) for EP and yes Omni (AD guild) is going to shift the balance a lot.

I'm not looking at emphasizing the 3 bar prime time DC population last night as looking at that as a consistent thing that has been happening over the last month or more. I see it as a bad tell of the state of the game. The overarching issues have led to a depleted player base. The ability to swap factions allows people to hop at any time that they think their faction is beyond winning.

The meaning of the score, the 3 banner war, and anything greater than ones own personal pvp experience falls apart with faction swapping. All of that stuff becomes irrelevant, and for people who enjoy that aspect of Cyrodiil it becomes disheartening and even frustrating at times to be a part of. I don't know I hope Vivec survives on its own and that they don't have to combine servers. It is the last server with any population of note, and that is now becoming less noteworthy. When one of the factions can't poplock during prime time consistently over a long period of time I get the feeling things are going the wrong direction.

And however wonderful the 3 banner war concept may be, it would be irrelevant because the game's poor performance and accompanying bugs plus balance changes frustrate people and prompt them to leave. That is why the game's PvP population does not grow despite the large influx of new players ZOS gets from update to update.

Ranger209 · December 2018

Joy_Division wrote: »

show previous quotes

Ranger209 wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

But to the larger point. ESO PvP has always been dynamic, changing literally from hour to hour because of population and guild turnover or just from the natural flow of how the map plays. At 9:00 EP could have the entire North Red and trying to swarm Dc scrolls, but in just 30 minutes later be all the way back to just their three tri-keeps because of such over-extension. Snap shots are utterly misleading because the situation is going to be completely different in just a short while and Tuesday is going to be a very different story from Monday.

While somewhat true in general that eso map can be very volatile - i just wish this would actually translate into campaign results.

For vivec EU I can think of 3 campaign cycles AD did NOT win in the past 2 years. Something has to be done about mornincapping and imbalanced populations. Regardless of what faction it benefits.

We don't have a BigBoss here on NA. From what I hear, yeah, the EU isn't dynamic because of what he does. NA usually is. Even though EP probably has won about half the campaigns dating back to Launch and has taken more scrolls during non-primetimes than the other two factions, there have been many a night and many a campaigns in which Chalman has remained blue with 50 DC guarding it and EP has finished in last place.

@Ranger209 - What happened last night is not because people logged onto another faction because EP was taking a beating. Because the pop cap is much lower now than it was back in the day, organized guilds have a much stronger effect on how the map plays, particularly an experienced one. No Drac (EP's best guild) for EP and yes Omni (AD guild) is going to shift the balance a lot.

I'm not looking at emphasizing the 3 bar prime time DC population last night as looking at that as a consistent thing that has been happening over the last month or more. I see it as a bad tell of the state of the game. The overarching issues have led to a depleted player base. The ability to swap factions allows people to hop at any time that they think their faction is beyond winning.

The meaning of the score, the 3 banner war, and anything greater than ones own personal pvp experience falls apart with faction swapping. All of that stuff becomes irrelevant, and for people who enjoy that aspect of Cyrodiil it becomes disheartening and even frustrating at times to be a part of. I don't know I hope Vivec survives on its own and that they don't have to combine servers. It is the last server with any population of note, and that is now becoming less noteworthy. When one of the factions can't poplock during prime time consistently over a long period of time I get the feeling things are going the wrong direction.

And however wonderful the 3 banner war concept may be, it would be irrelevant because the game's poor performance and accompanying bugs plus balance changes frustrate people and prompt them to leave. That is why the game's PvP population does not grow despite the large influx of new players ZOS gets from update to update.

Ok i'll cave and make an EP toon so I can win too and play with a locked faction that outnumbers its opponent rather than always being outnumbered. Maybe the crow will let me join his herd.

Joy_Division · December 2018

Ranger209 wrote: »

show previous quotes

Joy_Division wrote: »

Ranger209 wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

But to the larger point. ESO PvP has always been dynamic, changing literally from hour to hour because of population and guild turnover or just from the natural flow of how the map plays. At 9:00 EP could have the entire North Red and trying to swarm Dc scrolls, but in just 30 minutes later be all the way back to just their three tri-keeps because of such over-extension. Snap shots are utterly misleading because the situation is going to be completely different in just a short while and Tuesday is going to be a very different story from Monday.

While somewhat true in general that eso map can be very volatile - i just wish this would actually translate into campaign results.

For vivec EU I can think of 3 campaign cycles AD did NOT win in the past 2 years. Something has to be done about mornincapping and imbalanced populations. Regardless of what faction it benefits.

We don't have a BigBoss here on NA. From what I hear, yeah, the EU isn't dynamic because of what he does. NA usually is. Even though EP probably has won about half the campaigns dating back to Launch and has taken more scrolls during non-primetimes than the other two factions, there have been many a night and many a campaigns in which Chalman has remained blue with 50 DC guarding it and EP has finished in last place.

@Ranger209 - What happened last night is not because people logged onto another faction because EP was taking a beating. Because the pop cap is much lower now than it was back in the day, organized guilds have a much stronger effect on how the map plays, particularly an experienced one. No Drac (EP's best guild) for EP and yes Omni (AD guild) is going to shift the balance a lot.

I'm not looking at emphasizing the 3 bar prime time DC population last night as looking at that as a consistent thing that has been happening over the last month or more. I see it as a bad tell of the state of the game. The overarching issues have led to a depleted player base. The ability to swap factions allows people to hop at any time that they think their faction is beyond winning.

The meaning of the score, the 3 banner war, and anything greater than ones own personal pvp experience falls apart with faction swapping. All of that stuff becomes irrelevant, and for people who enjoy that aspect of Cyrodiil it becomes disheartening and even frustrating at times to be a part of. I don't know I hope Vivec survives on its own and that they don't have to combine servers. It is the last server with any population of note, and that is now becoming less noteworthy. When one of the factions can't poplock during prime time consistently over a long period of time I get the feeling things are going the wrong direction.

And however wonderful the 3 banner war concept may be, it would be irrelevant because the game's poor performance and accompanying bugs plus balance changes frustrate people and prompt them to leave. That is why the game's PvP population does not grow despite the large influx of new players ZOS gets from update to update.

Ok i'll cave and make an EP toon so I can win too and play with a locked faction that outnumbers its opponent rather than always being outnumbered. Maybe the crow will let me join his herd.

Go ahead and waste your time. You're still going to get 50 transmute stones. Still going to get 5 keep repair kits. Still going to get 5 rings, 4 of which will be decon trash. You're not going to prevent Chalman from being blue when DC decides to faction stack it. And when Crow stacks 3 raids, it's still only going to be 72 (rather than 73) because you are simply replacing another EP who will be stuck in q, rather than adding another EP solider onto the field of play. You swapping over won;t make any difference whatsoever to your rewards or how AvA will play out.

but the game's performance will still be terrible.

Ruckly · December 2018

PVP is dead. You know it when strategy is thrown out the window and the blob is the only thing anyone does. Pointless spam to no end. I'm going to guess that the marginal combat we have been seeing the last few months has increased the overall cognitive aptitude of the players and that is bad for whoever bets on mmos breeding mindless zombies. We got an entire quarter though

What!?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFS4zYWxzNA[/video]

zyk · December 2018

Ruckly wrote: »

PVP is dead. You know it when strategy is thrown out the window and the blob is the only thing anyone does. Pointless spam to no end. I'm going to guess that the marginal combat we have been seeing the last few months has increased the overall cognitive aptitude of the players and that is bad for whoever bets on mmos breeding mindless zombies. We got an entire quarter though

AvA feels like the rest of the grinds ESO players do now. Like writs, random dungeons, weekly trials, and AvA faction stack map captures for end of campaign rewards on all alts.

Elong · December 2018

zyk wrote: »

show previous quotes

Ruckly wrote: »

PVP is dead. You know it when strategy is thrown out the window and the blob is the only thing anyone does. Pointless spam to no end. I'm going to guess that the marginal combat we have been seeing the last few months has increased the overall cognitive aptitude of the players and that is bad for whoever bets on mmos breeding mindless zombies. We got an entire quarter though

AvA feels like the rest of the grinds ESO players do now. Like writs, random dungeons, weekly trials, and AvA faction stack map captures for end of campaign rewards on all alts.

I mean, if you've been playing for 4 years on the same map with little changes and constant reduction in the service and performance offered by ZOS, then yeah it sure does. I think some of us treat it seriously when we're logged in, but you can understand why people see it as a check list these days.

zyk · December 2018

Elong wrote: »

I mean, if you've been playing for 4 years on the same map with little changes and constant reduction in the service and performance offered by ZOS, then yeah it sure does. I think some of us treat it seriously when we're logged in, but you can understand why people see it as a check list these days.

I don't, really. When the game is reduced to tedium that is done for rewards, it's time to find something else to do.

It's one thing to swallow some tedium when developing a new character (lorebooks, shards, fg, undaunted), but the daily routine of tedious grinds is a classic trap MMO players fall into.

I don't want AvA to be reduced to something people do mainly for geodes. It's things like that which drive bad gameplay IMO.

technohic · December 2018

I'm not sure what's worse. The face the map looks like what's in the OP often lately with DC not really getting a sizable force until after 9 PM EST. Or the whining about it. I di it to but it really crushes morale when it's in zone chat along with telling others what they are attacking is stupid.

Ruckly · December 2018

It's over. People were conditioned to higher damage siege that had crits. Everything can be blobbed through now. You might get something out of a frost mage but I'd say that is all there is left. Ice comet/immobilize/stun/eye of the cold/block/dodge roll/chill. Only thing with a dynamic worth playing that no one ever bothered nerfing.

_Crow · December 2018

HaroniNDeorum · December 2018

Reverb wrote: »

This is the least enjoyable ESO PvP "era" for me. There are plenty of threads that discuss the details of the current state, so I won't do it here. But fighting against the current state is not enjoyable in any way, and I have no interest in playing the way that would be necessary to counter the current state.

So I'm spending my time doing other things. Almost 5 years I have stuck with and remained passionate about the game, despite its flaws. But ESO PvP has finally delivered an experience I'm not even willing to log in for. I think many people feel the same way.

True. On Panda Force we are still organizing our raids 3 times a week, sometimes just 2 because the game is in a terrible spot. Right now we are playing other games in small groups or searching for options. The lack of commitment from zos on their own game performance is sick

Elong · December 2018

zyk wrote: »

show previous quotes

Elong wrote: »

I mean, if you've been playing for 4 years on the same map with little changes and constant reduction in the service and performance offered by ZOS, then yeah it sure does. I think some of us treat it seriously when we're logged in, but you can understand why people see it as a check list these days.

I don't, really. When the game is reduced to tedium that is done for rewards, it's time to find something else to do.

It's one thing to swallow some tedium when developing a new character (lorebooks, shards, fg, undaunted), but the daily routine of tedious grinds is a classic trap MMO players fall into.

I don't want AvA to be reduced to something people do mainly for geodes. It's things like that which drive bad gameplay IMO.

Oh I totally agree.

Ruckly · December 2018

This tedium is true now in single player rpgs as well. Dragon age inquisition is an abomination. Fallout 4 you start to fell like you are picking up crap everywhere.

Fallout 76 might have been the fall. Bethesda might need a new approach. More tactical/strategic decision making and meaningful dialog. Something that involves(verb) the player into the game rather than the player simply being in the game doing stuff.

Ranger209 · December 2018

Joy_Division wrote: »

show previous quotes

Ranger209 wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Ranger209 wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

But to the larger point. ESO PvP has always been dynamic, changing literally from hour to hour because of population and guild turnover or just from the natural flow of how the map plays. At 9:00 EP could have the entire North Red and trying to swarm Dc scrolls, but in just 30 minutes later be all the way back to just their three tri-keeps because of such over-extension. Snap shots are utterly misleading because the situation is going to be completely different in just a short while and Tuesday is going to be a very different story from Monday.

While somewhat true in general that eso map can be very volatile - i just wish this would actually translate into campaign results.

For vivec EU I can think of 3 campaign cycles AD did NOT win in the past 2 years. Something has to be done about mornincapping and imbalanced populations. Regardless of what faction it benefits.

We don't have a BigBoss here on NA. From what I hear, yeah, the EU isn't dynamic because of what he does. NA usually is. Even though EP probably has won about half the campaigns dating back to Launch and has taken more scrolls during non-primetimes than the other two factions, there have been many a night and many a campaigns in which Chalman has remained blue with 50 DC guarding it and EP has finished in last place.

@Ranger209 - What happened last night is not because people logged onto another faction because EP was taking a beating. Because the pop cap is much lower now than it was back in the day, organized guilds have a much stronger effect on how the map plays, particularly an experienced one. No Drac (EP's best guild) for EP and yes Omni (AD guild) is going to shift the balance a lot.

I'm not looking at emphasizing the 3 bar prime time DC population last night as looking at that as a consistent thing that has been happening over the last month or more. I see it as a bad tell of the state of the game. The overarching issues have led to a depleted player base. The ability to swap factions allows people to hop at any time that they think their faction is beyond winning.

The meaning of the score, the 3 banner war, and anything greater than ones own personal pvp experience falls apart with faction swapping. All of that stuff becomes irrelevant, and for people who enjoy that aspect of Cyrodiil it becomes disheartening and even frustrating at times to be a part of. I don't know I hope Vivec survives on its own and that they don't have to combine servers. It is the last server with any population of note, and that is now becoming less noteworthy. When one of the factions can't poplock during prime time consistently over a long period of time I get the feeling things are going the wrong direction.

And however wonderful the 3 banner war concept may be, it would be irrelevant because the game's poor performance and accompanying bugs plus balance changes frustrate people and prompt them to leave. That is why the game's PvP population does not grow despite the large influx of new players ZOS gets from update to update.

Ok i'll cave and make an EP toon so I can win too and play with a locked faction that outnumbers its opponent rather than always being outnumbered. Maybe the crow will let me join his herd.

Go ahead and waste your time. You're still going to get 50 transmute stones. Still going to get 5 keep repair kits. Still going to get 5 rings, 4 of which will be decon trash. You're not going to prevent Chalman from being blue when DC decides to faction stack it. And when Crow stacks 3 raids, it's still only going to be 72 (rather than 73) because you are simply replacing another EP who will be stuck in q, rather than adding another EP solider onto the field of play. You swapping over won;t make any difference whatsoever to your rewards or how AvA will play out.

but the game's performance will still be terrible.

First off that response of mine was sarcastic and spiteful. I will never play anything other than DC. However, it encapsulates the general idea of many faction swappers. They don't want to fight outnumbered all the time so they gravitate toward the stronger perceived faction. Look at various time slots throughout the 24 hour cycle and you will see windows of underpopulated time frames dominated by AD, then EP, then DC. What do all of these time frames have in common? They are dominated by one faction during each of them. Too many people will take the easier path and jump to the dominant faction. The other thing you get during low pop hours is the bunch of AP *** that turns the map one color and then swaps factions and turns it back another color. Don't see this as often, but it happens irregularly enough. You are now starting to see this manifest during NA prime time.

Your right none of that stuff matters, rewards for winning, and it can't as long as there is faction hopping, cause guess what? As soon as there are rewards that really do entice someone to win at all costs everyone will be jumping the moment the campaign has been determined. And if the rewards really do matter that will be about the halfway point of the campaign. Faction swapping and a competitive AvAvA environment can't co-exist. Faction swapping and a decent reward system can't co-exist.

No one is unaware that performance is the biggest bugaboo that hampers playing in cyrodiil by a long shot. ZOS apparently does not want to allocate the resources required to fix it. I won't say they can't fix it. I think anything can be fixed, programmatically, if you throw enough time and money at it. However, it seems the amount required is beyond their budget. Yeah they will try this or that maybe in a feeble attempt to help it along, but really it is a major, major undertaking to actually correct it, and they aren't into it. The dollars aren't there, and the manpower isn't there either.

That being said this is what we are left with, it is what it is. To ignore the negative impact that faction swapping has on a competitive AvAvA environment is just as foolish as ignoring the negative impact that poor performance has on it. Especially when the poor performance isn't going anywhere.

Knootewoot · December 2018

zyk wrote: »

It means that, once again, prime time begins with the conditions that create the worst lag which has to be endured through an uphill battle, so players are choosing to do something else instead.

This. ^

I wonder why i keep trying. I played for an hour or so, but the lag was so bad it was no use. So i decided to call it a day and play Battlefront2 instead.

I wanted to give Murkmire (despite the overall negative feedback from other players mainly because of Sorc-nerf) a chance, as any change to the game is a step closer to hopefully a more balanced game and a better PvP experience.

But how can i enjoy a better experience if the fun gets totally sucked out by lag even with small 10 vs 10 battles.

I can't. I sucks and i wish it worked. I love the PvP in this game, but although i am tolerant the end is nigh.

Irylia · December 2018

When vivec is your only option all day because shor and sotha are both 1 across
Vivec starts lagging late afternoon which is around the time most people get off work, same as most of my guild, so most days we miss out on no lag viv and then the q lines pick up in an hour or two making it nearly impossible to get in. If you do happen to get into the campaign you almost wish you hadn’t and the only responsive action your character can make without delay is roll dodge.

Then at 10 est sotha picks up but if you don’t have a group of atleast 6, with a healer, you are screwed. Since you only face faction stacks with earthgore while siege monkeys provide air support for the Zerg.

We refuse to play in lag and will just log off. The masses already have enough of a handicap, they don’t need our characters wearing drunk goggles “lag” as well.

Really wish players were inclined to enter shor and spread out. Make shor another 30 day with same campaign scoring between viv and shor, perhaps?
Drop the overall population size per campaign and all q lines once capped in viv are sent to shor?

No interest in pvdooring dead campaigns or playing with lag

technohic · December 2018

Irylia wrote: »

When vivec is your only option all day because shor and sotha are both 1 across
Vivec starts lagging late afternoon which is around the time most people get off work, same as most of my guild, so most days we miss out on no lag viv and then the q lines pick up in an hour or two making it nearly impossible to get in. If you do happen to get into the campaign you almost wish you hadn’t and the only responsive action your character can make without delay is roll dodge.

Then at 10 est sotha picks up but if you don’t have a group of atleast 6, with a healer, you are screwed. Since you only face faction stacks with earthgore while siege monkeys provide air support for the Zerg.

We refuse to play in lag and will just log off. The masses already have enough of a handicap, they don’t need our characters wearing drunk goggles “lag” as well.

Really wish players were inclined to enter shor and spread out. Make shor another 30 day with same campaign scoring between viv and shor, perhaps?
Drop the overall population size per campaign and all q lines once capped in viv are sent to shor?

No interest in pvdooring dead campaigns or playing with lag

About a year or so ago; Shor was decent for good fights. Then people realized they could stack up there when things weren't going their way in Vivec, and usually the faction that did it; steamrolled the map. It got to where at least in Vivec; you were more likely to have a zerg on your side to fight back. Shor had dried up since although I have seen some good action there the past couple weekends prime time and some fun small man post prime time this past Friday night/early Saturday morning

I'd like for some encouragement to spread things out between Vivec and Shor, but now I think DC does not have the numbers to show up for 2 healthy campaigns. Barely lock Vivec, and there's never a queue and then most the faction will sit there screwing around with Drac while the rest avoid or just wait for them to leave.

Joy_Division · December 2018

Ranger209 wrote: »

show previous quotes

Joy_Division wrote: »

Ranger209 wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Ranger209 wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

But to the larger point. ESO PvP has always been dynamic, changing literally from hour to hour because of population and guild turnover or just from the natural flow of how the map plays. At 9:00 EP could have the entire North Red and trying to swarm Dc scrolls, but in just 30 minutes later be all the way back to just their three tri-keeps because of such over-extension. Snap shots are utterly misleading because the situation is going to be completely different in just a short while and Tuesday is going to be a very different story from Monday.

While somewhat true in general that eso map can be very volatile - i just wish this would actually translate into campaign results.

For vivec EU I can think of 3 campaign cycles AD did NOT win in the past 2 years. Something has to be done about mornincapping and imbalanced populations. Regardless of what faction it benefits.

We don't have a BigBoss here on NA. From what I hear, yeah, the EU isn't dynamic because of what he does. NA usually is. Even though EP probably has won about half the campaigns dating back to Launch and has taken more scrolls during non-primetimes than the other two factions, there have been many a night and many a campaigns in which Chalman has remained blue with 50 DC guarding it and EP has finished in last place.

@Ranger209 - What happened last night is not because people logged onto another faction because EP was taking a beating. Because the pop cap is much lower now than it was back in the day, organized guilds have a much stronger effect on how the map plays, particularly an experienced one. No Drac (EP's best guild) for EP and yes Omni (AD guild) is going to shift the balance a lot.

I'm not looking at emphasizing the 3 bar prime time DC population last night as looking at that as a consistent thing that has been happening over the last month or more. I see it as a bad tell of the state of the game. The overarching issues have led to a depleted player base. The ability to swap factions allows people to hop at any time that they think their faction is beyond winning.

The meaning of the score, the 3 banner war, and anything greater than ones own personal pvp experience falls apart with faction swapping. All of that stuff becomes irrelevant, and for people who enjoy that aspect of Cyrodiil it becomes disheartening and even frustrating at times to be a part of. I don't know I hope Vivec survives on its own and that they don't have to combine servers. It is the last server with any population of note, and that is now becoming less noteworthy. When one of the factions can't poplock during prime time consistently over a long period of time I get the feeling things are going the wrong direction.

And however wonderful the 3 banner war concept may be, it would be irrelevant because the game's poor performance and accompanying bugs plus balance changes frustrate people and prompt them to leave. That is why the game's PvP population does not grow despite the large influx of new players ZOS gets from update to update.

Ok i'll cave and make an EP toon so I can win too and play with a locked faction that outnumbers its opponent rather than always being outnumbered. Maybe the crow will let me join his herd.

Go ahead and waste your time. You're still going to get 50 transmute stones. Still going to get 5 keep repair kits. Still going to get 5 rings, 4 of which will be decon trash. You're not going to prevent Chalman from being blue when DC decides to faction stack it. And when Crow stacks 3 raids, it's still only going to be 72 (rather than 73) because you are simply replacing another EP who will be stuck in q, rather than adding another EP solider onto the field of play. You swapping over won;t make any difference whatsoever to your rewards or how AvA will play out.

but the game's performance will still be terrible.

First off that response of mine was sarcastic and spiteful. I will never play anything other than DC. However, it encapsulates the general idea of many faction swappers. They don't want to fight outnumbered all the time so they gravitate toward the stronger perceived faction. Look at various time slots throughout the 24 hour cycle and you will see windows of underpopulated time frames dominated by AD, then EP, then DC. What do all of these time frames have in common? They are dominated by one faction during each of them. Too many people will take the easier path and jump to the dominant faction. The other thing you get during low pop hours is the bunch of AP *** that turns the map one color and then swaps factions and turns it back another color. Don't see this as often, but it happens irregularly enough. You are now starting to see this manifest during NA prime time.

Your right none of that stuff matters, rewards for winning, and it can't as long as there is faction hopping, cause guess what? As soon as there are rewards that really do entice someone to win at all costs everyone will be jumping the moment the campaign has been determined. And if the rewards really do matter that will be about the halfway point of the campaign. Faction swapping and a competitive AvAvA environment can't co-exist. Faction swapping and a decent reward system can't co-exist.

No one is unaware that performance is the biggest bugaboo that hampers playing in cyrodiil by a long shot. ZOS apparently does not want to allocate the resources required to fix it. I won't say they can't fix it. I think anything can be fixed, programmatically, if you throw enough time and money at it. However, it seems the amount required is beyond their budget. Yeah they will try this or that maybe in a feeble attempt to help it along, but really it is a major, major undertaking to actually correct it, and they aren't into it. The dollars aren't there, and the manpower isn't there either.

That being said this is what we are left with, it is what it is. To ignore the negative impact that faction swapping has on a competitive AvAvA environment is just as foolish as ignoring the negative impact that poor performance has on it. Especially when the poor performance isn't going anywhere.