Official Feedback Thread for Sorcerers

GRYM.LOCKE

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom

We want notes today !!!! PleaaaaAaaaAaaaAAasSssssEEEEEEEEE

ZOS_JessicaFolsom

SwaminoNowlino wrote: »

Don't want to steal or distract from this thread. But could you put a LOCKED forum post out on the general discussion thread or the combat and mechanics thread or somewhere that states you are going to be doing this (which doesn't need to devolve into arguing or people yelling at you in that thread). Also could you provide an example of what you all are specifically looking for in terms of feedback and what you and the team are looking for/considering? (Not a "NERF THIS, your stupid, NERF THAT, They are OP so I need to be OP as well" type thing, but well reasoned, fact based stuff)

This is a tremendous and much welcomed opportunity and I would like to avoid people squandering it or trolling.

Or maybe just create an "Official Overall Class Feedback Thread - Sorcs/Templars/DKs/etc" that states what you have said here and what the team is looking for in terms of constructive feedback, and then heavily moderate those threads so that only constructive posts are housed there?

Ideally I'd like to see stuff debated in general threads and then carried over to the official thread as a repository of feedback and response.

I only say this because not everyone reads the sorc thread and knows that you all are doing some great outreach work, and I want people to know about it and make the most of this opportunity. Thanks and keep up the great work!

There are some great ideas here - maybe something for the Combat & Character Mechanics forum area, as you suggested. We do want to start having regular Q&As here on the forums, between our community and Dev team. As you can see with this one we're working on, it takes a few days to do one of these from start to finish.

We're taking with Eric and his team about what kind of feedback they're looking for, just as you mentioned. We are working on improving communication, getting more of a two-way dialogue going. It may take a little bit to initially get going, but we'll get there.

Valrien

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

SwaminoNowlino wrote: »

Don't want to steal or distract from this thread. But could you put a LOCKED forum post out on the general discussion thread or the combat and mechanics thread or somewhere that states you are going to be doing this (which doesn't need to devolve into arguing or people yelling at you in that thread). Also could you provide an example of what you all are specifically looking for in terms of feedback and what you and the team are looking for/considering? (Not a "NERF THIS, your stupid, NERF THAT, They are OP so I need to be OP as well" type thing, but well reasoned, fact based stuff)

This is a tremendous and much welcomed opportunity and I would like to avoid people squandering it or trolling.

Or maybe just create an "Official Overall Class Feedback Thread - Sorcs/Templars/DKs/etc" that states what you have said here and what the team is looking for in terms of constructive feedback, and then heavily moderate those threads so that only constructive posts are housed there?

Ideally I'd like to see stuff debated in general threads and then carried over to the official thread as a repository of feedback and response.

I only say this because not everyone reads the sorc thread and knows that you all are doing some great outreach work, and I want people to know about it and make the most of this opportunity. Thanks and keep up the great work!

There are some great ideas here - maybe something for the Combat & Character Mechanics forum area, as you suggested. We do want to start having regular Q&As here on the forums, between our community and Dev team. As you can see with this one we're working on, it takes a few days to do one of these from start to finish.

We're taking with Eric and his team about what kind of feedback they're looking for, just as you mentioned. We are working on improving communication, getting more of a two-way dialogue going. It may take a little bit to initially get going, but we'll get there.

You are an angel, Jessica. This is exactly what we want

PainfulFAFA

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

SwaminoNowlino wrote: »

Don't want to steal or distract from this thread. But could you put a LOCKED forum post out on the general discussion thread or the combat and mechanics thread or somewhere that states you are going to be doing this (which doesn't need to devolve into arguing or people yelling at you in that thread). Also could you provide an example of what you all are specifically looking for in terms of feedback and what you and the team are looking for/considering? (Not a "NERF THIS, your stupid, NERF THAT, They are OP so I need to be OP as well" type thing, but well reasoned, fact based stuff)

This is a tremendous and much welcomed opportunity and I would like to avoid people squandering it or trolling.

Or maybe just create an "Official Overall Class Feedback Thread - Sorcs/Templars/DKs/etc" that states what you have said here and what the team is looking for in terms of constructive feedback, and then heavily moderate those threads so that only constructive posts are housed there?

Ideally I'd like to see stuff debated in general threads and then carried over to the official thread as a repository of feedback and response.

I only say this because not everyone reads the sorc thread and knows that you all are doing some great outreach work, and I want people to know about it and make the most of this opportunity. Thanks and keep up the great work!

There are some great ideas here - maybe something for the Combat & Character Mechanics forum area, as you suggested. We do want to start having regular Q&As here on the forums, between our community and Dev team. As you can see with this one we're working on, it takes a few days to do one of these from start to finish.

We're taking with Eric and his team about what kind of feedback they're looking for, just as you mentioned. We are working on improving communication, getting more of a two-way dialogue going. It may take a little bit to initially get going, but we'll get there.

Wrobel and the gang needs to know that Crystal Blast HAS to be revamped.

That is all.

Faulgor

Derra wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

holosoul wrote: »

For example, if you ran DW lets say you gain 10% damage (an over-estimation)
but then you can't apply a debuff that reduces your enemy's stamina regeneration and magicka regeneration by 60%

Do you really think that is better?

So you can't apply said poison with your resto staff then swap over to DW bar?

Yes you can but shhhh... you are interrupting the rage.

However, remember the OP poisons they are raging over will for YOUR examole they will bring up the only 20% proc cjance but for their examples it seems oft forgotten.

Also keep in mind the dual enchant you have on main. Bar are trippled.

@STEVIL can you clarify your last sentence for me?

Also, I saw all the poisons and yes a lot of them look attractive but I don't think it's the end of the world. I think with certain builds and setups you can probably get by with normal enchants.

In DB the vslue of all enchantments went up by3x to 4x.
Poisons disable enchants.

So poison on your staff bar and no poison on your dw bar means that bar has enchants there are bigger.

But they also increased the CD on enchants which basically makes those dmg increases void if you take more than 1 procc to kill your target.

Really not sure why this is repeated all the time, it's just not true. Cooldown for enchants is still 4 seconds.

Not sure how viable they will be in PvP, but in PvE they are amazing. Had a lot of fun with prismatic enchants in IC sewers.

NBrookus

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

There are some great ideas here - maybe something for the Combat & Character Mechanics forum area, as you suggested. We do want to start having regular Q&As here on the forums, between our community and Dev team. As you can see with this one we're working on, it takes a few days to do one of these from start to finish.

We're taking with Eric and his team about what kind of feedback they're looking for, just as you mentioned. We are working on improving communication, getting more of a two-way dialogue going. It may take a little bit to initially get going, but we'll get there.

Awesome! You guys have the metrics and raw data, but the regular players know how it all works out day to day. It'll be a good combination.

Makkir

Derra wrote: »

But they also increased the CD on enchants which basically makes those dmg increases void if you take more than 1 procc to kill your target.

Also for a sorc it wouldn't make sense since how would he ever get his DW enchants to proc....?

Yolokin_Swagonborn

Makkir wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

But they also increased the CD on enchants which basically makes those dmg increases void if you take more than 1 procc to kill your target.

Also for a sorc it wouldn't make sense since how would he ever get his DW enchants to proc....?

DW magicka sorc is what doesn't make sense. I understand why it's done but still. Pehaps instead of asking how sorcs are supposed to activate their enchants while duel wielding, we should ask why sorcs still have to DW to get more spell damage.

cpuScientist

STEVIL wrote: »

cpuScientist wrote: »

Yet after all that I ask again nay I plead. Switch Bound aegis magicka with pet health passive. Make it that by just having a pet on your bar or don't i could care less. Just let us have an active pet over a static tri slot skill that does 1 thing. (The same bound aegis is had by NB with a passive, GET IT we have to give up 3 slots for something NB'S get PASSIVELY.)

Just switch it so we can have pets have a real spot on our DPS rotation. If you hate pets and they wander off too much. Set them to passive. Hold y and right click. They will always be on you and go where you go. If you.stand in red they will if you get out so will they. Also give console players control of pets. It's absurd that they don't have that, pets are truly horrible without control. (Also tip for Sorcs switch the Y button with the C button for pet control make it 1000% EASIER.

So once again, switch the magicka bound aegis with the health pet passive. This will help tanks and DPS alike.

My view of pets is that pets are killable buffs.

In order to be very competitive for slots they need to be AS TOUGH TO KILL as THEY ARE WORTH KILLING.

If the pet buffs health it is hard to see where mathematically its worth attacking them vs ignoring them and hitting thecaster.

So, making part of pets buff "magica" which boosts the caster damage, shields, heal and sustain does not sound bad.

Also thing you nneed more support oriented key-click for pets since their attack AI will make attack boosts for pets matginal at best.

If each pet morph had one significant and differemt group support key-click in addition to a per active pet magica boost, some of the problem on many fronts would be addressed, imo.

The thing with the lets, is there abilities really are useful, except tormentor that thing is terrible. Just the absolute worst.

The AOE pet is helpful in both PvP and in AoE situations. It may not hit super hard but it does decent damage about half an impulse. The heal clanfear, offers up a nice heal and takes some hits to go down. Both versions of this pet are handy.

The twilight heal is very good, except the twilight itself is simply much too flimsy. That 5k boost in Cyrodil needs to be baseline increase, in PvE aswell. The tormentor once again is thrash, it is not a noticeable increase, and only working for half health is silly. It really should be a single target in the same vein as the AOE pet, a 2 second delayed attack that roots on each hit or also stuns on last. The root would be so it can slow down whatever is coming for it. Or Stun on last to keep it in line with the AOE pet. But trust me the tormentor is pure unfiltered thrash.

And finally please consider scaling up and changing the trait of necropotence. Sturdy is not useful, would be better served with divines and infused. But this set along with the switching of magicka aegis and health passive, would go a long way to making pet sorcs viable.

Yolokin_Swagonborn

Glad to know we are back to discussing sorc and no longer attacking eachother. Did some PTS testing (mainly for the stamina changes) and here are the results:


IMPLOSION PASSIVE
Implosion doesn't seem to hit as hard as the tooltip says it does. We also still need a response from Eric as to why this ability scales on max health.
Unless spiders have a ton more armor than I think they have. If so that's about 30% mitigation. One tanky spider.

CRIT SURGE
Crit surge passively healing for 3KHPS non-crit (less without tons of CP into blessed and rapid mending) and costing about half of your magicka bar is really a poor tradeoff. I was using it to fight multiple enemies in PvE and between the high cost of crit surge and the high cost of hurricane, (which you have to keep up to effectively use crit surge) i was both stamina and magicka starved.

In PvP, it will only heal for 1.5KHPS (non-crit) assuming you can keep constant pressure on an enemy. A tall order. Used to be able to just get one good hit for a large heal. Hardly worth slotting anymore. I tried to keep an open mind about this change but I am convinced the change as a nerf and a step in the wrong direction. Maybe one morph can do the flat heal with DOTs, the other could do the % heal with direct damage, and both morphs could give major spell/weapon damage. That's one way to fix it. The other is to have two % heal effects when cast (a dot heal and a direct damage heal) and only put a cooldown on the dot heal. Bottom line it still needs work.


DARK EXCHANGE
Nice that the heal strength was increased. Its usable for grinding in PvE but still not usable for any serious endgame content. You will take at least 8K in damage in one second of Vet Maelstrom Arena while you are a sitting duck waiting for the channel to end. In PvP, with so many interrupts available, its a guaranteed death sentence. At the very least they could make the skill uninteruptable like what they did for wrecking blow. Then there might be a way to use it in PvP but it would still be terrible. 1 second for 4k of (reduced) healing in a burst meta is the formula for a dead sorc. Making it instant cast but 1 second delay before the heals kick in could work. That way you couldn't spam it to stay alive (like templars can with BoL for twice the heal) but if you were quick and weaved a dodgeroll after instant casting it you would get your heal in a second.



BOUND ARMAMENTS
I keep wanting to slot this on my redguard Sorc for the extra stamina (and to activate the daedric protection passive) but because I have to run so many (non-class) weapon skills, heals, and utility just to survive, the two bar cost prevents me. Then I don't get Daedric Protection passive (20% stamina regen) because I only have TWO options as a stam sorc to slot Daedric Summoning. Who wants to run atronarc ultimate on your main bar when its NOT EVEN A PHYSICAL ULT? Because sorcs don't have physical ults because reasons. So there are some amazing combos with dawnbreaker now that its physical damage and has a knockdown but it needs to be on your main bar or one weapon swap glitch ruins your opportunity to use it.

As a stamina sorc, you have two things working against you that culminates in one HUGE debilitating issue.

• You have to run too many non-class skills just to do damage and heal effectively because of inefficient class damage and heals
• Then you have no room for the lackluster class skills (read: Daedric Summoning) you have to slot to unlock your own class passives (Daedric Protection) effectively.

This juggling act makes you ineffective as a stam build.


Link to "Give Bound Armaments the Magelight Treatment" Post

RebornV3x

nearly 50 pages wow

bloodenragedb14_ESO

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

But they also increased the CD on enchants which basically makes those dmg increases void if you take more than 1 procc to kill your target.

Also for a sorc it wouldn't make sense since how would he ever get his DW enchants to proc....?

DW magicka sorc is what doesn't make sense. I understand why it's done but still. Pehaps instead of asking how sorcs are supposed to activate their enchants while duel wielding, we should ask why sorcs still have to DW to get more spell damage.

a sorcerer with two daggers makes sense actually, Do you know what a Athame is? its a ritualistic dagger used in spellcraft. i am a wiccan so i use them occasionally, though mine is more a shortsword, its still a valid implement.

a Sorcerer or mage that uses a dagger is not that uncommon, for those that use blood magic in many fantasy worlds, its preferable to a staff as you have to get at your, or anothers, blood somehow.

and, as far as i can remember, DnD allows wizards the use of clubs, daggers, and crossbows of all things

so Mages of all types exist, ((most still use magic as a resource, despite whatever discipline they are, but if i say that everyone and their damn mother starts jumping down my damn throat)) And they are never restricted to just one type of weapon. I personally want a Scythe, but im more necro minded anyway

Taonnor

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

But they also increased the CD on enchants which basically makes those dmg increases void if you take more than 1 procc to kill your target.

Also for a sorc it wouldn't make sense since how would he ever get his DW enchants to proc....?

DW magicka sorc is what doesn't make sense. I understand why it's done but still. Pehaps instead of asking how sorcs are supposed to activate their enchants while duel wielding, we should ask why sorcs still have to DW to get more spell damage.

a sorcerer with two daggers makes sense actually, Do you know what a Athame is? its a ritualistic dagger used in spellcraft. i am a wiccan so i use them occasionally, though mine is more a shortsword, its still a valid implement.

a Sorcerer or mage that uses a dagger is not that uncommon, for those that use blood magic in many fantasy worlds, its preferable to a staff as you have to get at your, or anothers, blood somehow.

and, as far as i can remember, DnD allows wizards the use of clubs, daggers, and crossbows of all things

so Mages of all types exist, ((most still use magic as a resource, despite whatever discipline they are, but if i say that everyone and their damn mother starts jumping down my damn throat)) And they are never restricted to just one type of weapon. I personally want a Scythe, but im more necro minded anyway

Thats correct, but what i am not understand is:

@ZOS_GinaBruno : Why i am must use 2 one hand sworts to gain the highest spell damage for my sorcerer skills? Why i cannot have a special passive sorcerer ability that buffs my "magic staff weapon/ spell damage"? I mean i am a sorcerer why i have no affinity to magic weapons like... magic staffs?

Yolokin_Swagonborn

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

But they also increased the CD on enchants which basically makes those dmg increases void if you take more than 1 procc to kill your target.

Also for a sorc it wouldn't make sense since how would he ever get his DW enchants to proc....?

DW magicka sorc is what doesn't make sense. I understand why it's done but still. Pehaps instead of asking how sorcs are supposed to activate their enchants while duel wielding, we should ask why sorcs still have to DW to get more spell damage.

a sorcerer with two daggers makes sense actually, Do you know what a Athame is? its a ritualistic dagger used in spellcraft. i am a wiccan so i use them occasionally, though mine is more a shortsword, its still a valid implement.

a Sorcerer or mage that uses a dagger is not that uncommon, for those that use blood magic in many fantasy worlds, its preferable to a staff as you have to get at your, or anothers, blood somehow.

and, as far as i can remember, DnD allows wizards the use of clubs, daggers, and crossbows of all things

so Mages of all types exist, ((most still use magic as a resource, despite whatever discipline they are, but if i say that everyone and their damn mother starts jumping down my damn throat)) And they are never restricted to just one type of weapon. I personally want a Scythe, but im more necro minded anyway

As someone that keeps pushing for stam sorcs, trust me I know. You are missing my point. Since the removal of soft caps and the installment of the crapeon system, the game doesn't allow for hybrid builds that are effective in endgame situations. I'm not saying magicka sorcs should only use staffs, im saying they can't because of game mechanics. They only reason people slot two swords is because for some zany reason, that gives you more spell damage than a staff. That is it. The devs aren't wiccan, they just decided that swords should give more spell damage from some reason.

This leaves magicka sorcs in a bad place because neither magicka nor stamina sorcs have a class spammable. So they can slot force pulse at a spell damage and item utility loss or go duel wield like every other magica class is doing for endgame DPS but not have a spammable other than overload.

bloodenragedb14_ESO

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

But they also increased the CD on enchants which basically makes those dmg increases void if you take more than 1 procc to kill your target.

Also for a sorc it wouldn't make sense since how would he ever get his DW enchants to proc....?

DW magicka sorc is what doesn't make sense. I understand why it's done but still. Pehaps instead of asking how sorcs are supposed to activate their enchants while duel wielding, we should ask why sorcs still have to DW to get more spell damage.

a sorcerer with two daggers makes sense actually, Do you know what a Athame is? its a ritualistic dagger used in spellcraft. i am a wiccan so i use them occasionally, though mine is more a shortsword, its still a valid implement.

a Sorcerer or mage that uses a dagger is not that uncommon, for those that use blood magic in many fantasy worlds, its preferable to a staff as you have to get at your, or anothers, blood somehow.

and, as far as i can remember, DnD allows wizards the use of clubs, daggers, and crossbows of all things

so Mages of all types exist, ((most still use magic as a resource, despite whatever discipline they are, but if i say that everyone and their damn mother starts jumping down my damn throat)) And they are never restricted to just one type of weapon. I personally want a Scythe, but im more necro minded anyway

As someone that keeps pushing for stam sorcs, trust me I know. You are missing my point. Since the removal of soft caps and the installment of the crapeon system, the game doesn't allow for hybrid builds that are effective in endgame situations. I'm not saying magicka sorcs shouldnt use non-staffs, im saying they can't because of game mechanics. They only reason people slot two swords is because for some zany reason, that gives you more spell damage than a staff. That is it. The devs aren't wiccan, they just decided that swords should give more spell damage from some reason. Which leaves magicka sorcs in a bad place because neither magicka nor stamina sorcs have a class spammable. So they can slot force pulse at a spell damage and item utility loss or go duel wield like every other magica class is doing for endgame DPS but not have a spammable other than overload.

lets not mention overload, it pulls from a non-replenishable ((so long as its active)) resource, so calling it a spammable is incorrect in my opinion.

and im not argueing that point, the removal of soft caps was unwarranted, it removed any 'fun' i could have had at building different types of builds, its something i wish to see re-implemented someday, the sooner the better.

We, both stam and mag, need a spammable, competitive dps, skill at our disposal

NativeJoe

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

But they also increased the CD on enchants which basically makes those dmg increases void if you take more than 1 procc to kill your target.

Also for a sorc it wouldn't make sense since how would he ever get his DW enchants to proc....?

DW magicka sorc is what doesn't make sense. I understand why it's done but still. Pehaps instead of asking how sorcs are supposed to activate their enchants while duel wielding, we should ask why sorcs still have to DW to get more spell damage.

a sorcerer with two daggers makes sense actually, Do you know what a Athame is? its a ritualistic dagger used in spellcraft. i am a wiccan so i use them occasionally, though mine is more a shortsword, its still a valid implement.

a Sorcerer or mage that uses a dagger is not that uncommon, for those that use blood magic in many fantasy worlds, its preferable to a staff as you have to get at your, or anothers, blood somehow.

and, as far as i can remember, DnD allows wizards the use of clubs, daggers, and crossbows of all things

so Mages of all types exist, ((most still use magic as a resource, despite whatever discipline they are, but if i say that everyone and their damn mother starts jumping down my damn throat)) And they are never restricted to just one type of weapon. I personally want a Scythe, but im more necro minded anyway

No problem with your point of view from me. Kinda on the odd sides of spirituality as well. Anyway... Yes...But if we where to have that system in place it would need to do something different for every class imo. or at the very least a modifier. GW2 did it, each weapon is different and plays different on every character. And I don't think it'd be to hard to implement the system here if some thought was put into it. IE a Sorc conjures some form of medium range magickal slash attack from a sword, a warrior using a staff will do something like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DxucIZYyFrc

but these are things that cannot be implemented anytime soon even tho they make sense. They're just not going to do this sort of work. They can't balance the skills as it is...and adding new ones is something they Avoid at all costs. (if you haven't noticed)

honestly tho I would like to take the entire development team. dispatch them to several other games to play for a solid amount of time where they actually get to and participate in end game activities. then have them come back renewed and give us some new stuff. I'm sick of force pulse and crystal frags...and hate being shoe-horned into sub par builds because they are the only effective builds. why can't we have pets with CP? pets that have passive bonuses since they're a toggle and having them literally clogs up ur bar so much that your hands are tied. Get rid of this shield change and figure something else out that is fair...

bloodenragedb14_ESO

NativeJoe wrote: »

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

But they also increased the CD on enchants which basically makes those dmg increases void if you take more than 1 procc to kill your target.

Also for a sorc it wouldn't make sense since how would he ever get his DW enchants to proc....?

DW magicka sorc is what doesn't make sense. I understand why it's done but still. Pehaps instead of asking how sorcs are supposed to activate their enchants while duel wielding, we should ask why sorcs still have to DW to get more spell damage.

a sorcerer with two daggers makes sense actually, Do you know what a Athame is? its a ritualistic dagger used in spellcraft. i am a wiccan so i use them occasionally, though mine is more a shortsword, its still a valid implement.

a Sorcerer or mage that uses a dagger is not that uncommon, for those that use blood magic in many fantasy worlds, its preferable to a staff as you have to get at your, or anothers, blood somehow.

and, as far as i can remember, DnD allows wizards the use of clubs, daggers, and crossbows of all things

so Mages of all types exist, ((most still use magic as a resource, despite whatever discipline they are, but if i say that everyone and their damn mother starts jumping down my damn throat)) And they are never restricted to just one type of weapon. I personally want a Scythe, but im more necro minded anyway

No problem with your point of view from me. Kinda on the odd sides of spirituality as well. Anyway... Yes...But if we where to have that system in place it would need to do something different for every class imo. or at the very least a modifier. GW2 did it, each weapon is different and plays different on every character. And I don't think it'd be to hard to implement the system here if some thought was put into it. IE a Sorc conjures some form of medium range magickal slash attack from a sword, a warrior using a staff will do something like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DxucIZYyFrc

but these are things that cannot be implemented anytime soon even tho they make sense. They're just not going to do this sort of work. They can't balance the skills as it is...and adding new ones is something they Avoid at all costs. (if you haven't noticed)

that would be the best way to do it, maybe once they hire more talent, i loved how that worked in GW2, especially the necro, gods i love necromancy classes in games

Flaminir

So.... I'm guessing that if the Dev's want to make any tweaks to the Sorc class moving forward that it won't be a full scale overhaul to every skill line as many people here would like... that there would just be the time for a few changes (Not in DB obviously, but moving forward)....

SO.... if you could make just THREE changes what would they be???

Try and make them realistic, cover as many builds as possible, and also added bonus points if they are likely to be easy for the dev's to build into existing systems/mechanics rather than a total redesign of a skill.

Here's mine:

1. Bound Armor - Move the max stam/magicka increases into our passives (To replace the health boost for a pet being active... make it for having a skill from anywhere in the tree being slotted.. health boost for pets being slotted is counter intuitive, if pets are out you will take less damage so why need more health?). Then change the skill to being a bound weapon... maybe a sword/bow for a stam morph, and a summoned daedric orb for magicka. These can act like DoT's dealing out damage for 10 seconds. Once summoned these bound weapons don't dispel until time is up so you can slot on either bar & have fewer toggles.
2. Curse - One morph as a target based DOT which also causes the target to deal less damage... the other morph as Velocious curse is now... so you can either go for burst (PvP) or a sustained DOT for a PVE dps buff.
3. Overload - Change to a cheap ultimate cost, single cast lightning strike. Deals decent damage & most importantly provides a group utility buff of some kind.... maybe some kind of effect on players in the immediate area.... or some form of debuff on the mobs like taking 8% more damage from all sources for 8 seconds, something like that (But not simple regen major/minor buffs which people already have up.... something more unique)

Obviously there are other simple fixes I wouldn't include in the 3 changes... like reverting surge changes & just capping the heal at 6k, & making dark exchange an instant cast.

The idea behind my main 3 changes is to give useful choices.... one less toggle, useful DoT's to both stam / magicka builds while still keeping the theme of summoning, choices between burst/sustained dps, & group utility by replacing the cancerous cheese that is overload with something that people would want in a group environment.

NoMaassPliz

Flaminir wrote: »

So.... I'm guessing that if the Dev's want to make any tweaks to the Sorc class moving forward that it won't be a full scale overhaul to every skill line as many people here would like... that there would just be the time for a few changes (Not in DB obviously, but moving forward)....

SO.... if you could make just THREE changes what would they be???

Try and make them realistic, cover as many builds as possible, and also added bonus points if they are likely to be easy for the dev's to build into existing systems/mechanics rather than a total redesign of a skill.

Here's mine:

1. Bound Armor - Move the max stam/magicka increases into our passives (To replace the health boost for a pet being active... make it for having a skill from anywhere in the tree being slotted.. health boost for pets being slotted is counter intuitive, if pets are out you will take less damage so why need more health?). Then change the skill to being a bound weapon... maybe a sword/bow for a stam morph, and a summoned daedric orb for magicka. These can act like DoT's dealing out damage for 10 seconds. Once summoned these bound weapons don't dispel until time is up so you can slot on either bar & have fewer toggles.
2. Curse - One morph as a target based DOT which also causes the target to deal less damage... the other morph as Velocious curse is now... so you can either go for burst (PvP) or a sustained DOT for a PVE dps buff.
3. Overload - Change to a cheap ultimate cost, single cast lightning strike. Deals decent damage & most importantly provides a group utility buff of some kind.... maybe some kind of effect on players in the immediate area.... or some form of debuff on the mobs like taking 8% more damage from all sources for 8 seconds, something like that (But not simple regen major/minor buffs which people already have up.... something more unique)

Obviously there are other simple fixes I wouldn't include in the 3 changes... like reverting surge changes & just capping the heal at 6k, & making dark exchange an instant cast.

The idea behind my main 3 changes is to give useful choices.... one less toggle, useful DoT's to both stam / magicka builds while still keeping the theme of summoning, choices between burst/sustained dps, & group utility by replacing the cancerous cheese that is overload with something that people would want in a group environment.

These are all great, but I would settle for:

1) either a 10 second hardened ward, or a longer shield that is critable.
2) reversion of surge, or at least a buff to where it is now.

The rest is nice, but I think fixing these at least makes the class competitive in pvp / VMA in DB. Group utility is a whole other issue that will require some broader fixes as you have indicated. My sorc will get his weekly runs in for leaderboard rewards, but until group utility is improved he'll be picking flowers.

Natas013

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

NativeJoe wrote: »

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

But they also increased the CD on enchants which basically makes those dmg increases void if you take more than 1 procc to kill your target.

Also for a sorc it wouldn't make sense since how would he ever get his DW enchants to proc....?

DW magicka sorc is what doesn't make sense. I understand why it's done but still. Pehaps instead of asking how sorcs are supposed to activate their enchants while duel wielding, we should ask why sorcs still have to DW to get more spell damage.

a sorcerer with two daggers makes sense actually, Do you know what a Athame is? its a ritualistic dagger used in spellcraft. i am a wiccan so i use them occasionally, though mine is more a shortsword, its still a valid implement.

a Sorcerer or mage that uses a dagger is not that uncommon, for those that use blood magic in many fantasy worlds, its preferable to a staff as you have to get at your, or anothers, blood somehow.

and, as far as i can remember, DnD allows wizards the use of clubs, daggers, and crossbows of all things

so Mages of all types exist, ((most still use magic as a resource, despite whatever discipline they are, but if i say that everyone and their damn mother starts jumping down my damn throat)) And they are never restricted to just one type of weapon. I personally want a Scythe, but im more necro minded anyway

No problem with your point of view from me. Kinda on the odd sides of spirituality as well. Anyway... Yes...But if we where to have that system in place it would need to do something different for every class imo. or at the very least a modifier. GW2 did it, each weapon is different and plays different on every character. And I don't think it'd be to hard to implement the system here if some thought was put into it. IE a Sorc conjures some form of medium range magickal slash attack from a sword, a warrior using a staff will do something like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DxucIZYyFrc

but these are things that cannot be implemented anytime soon even tho they make sense. They're just not going to do this sort of work. They can't balance the skills as it is...and adding new ones is something they Avoid at all costs. (if you haven't noticed)

that would be the best way to do it, maybe once they hire more talent, i loved how that worked in GW2, especially the necro, gods i love necromancy classes in games

Having different weapon skill lines for every class sounds good on one hand, but overly complicated on the other. It's defiantly not something we could expect anytime soon if it were a direction they decided to go. This would in effect make every weapon an extension of every class, and likely require all skills to have a stam and mag morph. This is a very elligent solution to the problem, but seems it would be a balancing nightmare.

I still feel introducing two new weapon lines an easier solution, if not a better one.

First off, though I'm not sure how this could be balanced with sprinting and dodge roll, blocking with a magic based weapon should use magicka. Holding block should be a steady drain on your resource that's relative to level and current cp and can be mitigated by regen. This cost should take into account max achievable regen per level and never be less then a steady drain of 1% on mag/stam. Further resource loss from blocking damage should be relative to the strength of the attack blocked. Of course this in of itself may be a diffucult mechanic to implement but I feel this change would be good and needed for balancing new weapons and a change to which resource is used for blocking dependent on weapon used.

Although all the changes I suggested for blocking wouldn't be necessary, my idea also requires a stam morph for every class skill for balancing purposes. This also make my idea one we couldn't expect on the next update or two.

The last part is the most complicated, and likely the hardest to balance. As it sits 2H balances with destro and bow balances with resto. That leaves 1HS and DW. Only two core items need to be added, wand and some sort of focus. Wand is pretty self explanatory and in no way lore breaking. I'd give wands and their skills at most half the range of destro. Focus on the other hand is where I'd need help from lore buffs to figure out what exactly this should be. My short list includes a doll, a crystal, a buckler, a spell book, and a totem (something relevant to the style it's made in). This would give us DW wands and wand and "focus".

Wands would work similar to destro, three elemental types and a forth damage type, magic. Off hand wand must be the same as the main hand or magic damage. With DW of the same you gain the added effects given to destro. With the off hand being magic you lose the added effect but gain spell power equal to DW weapons have with no passives. Put a passive in that increases elemental effect chances to proc where applicable, and if not the passive gives effects similar to DW. As to which should do what I'm not sure.

In the first option wands used in wand and "focus" would still deal its damage type in light/heavy attacks, but the skills would not be effected by this choice, only the visuals. This skill line would be akin to one hand and shield, focusing on damage mitigation and tanking mobs (look a use for inner beast).

Just my take. I know it'd be an incredible undertaking, but wouldn't it be awesome? Here's hoping we see something like this one day.

Minalan

NoMaassPliz wrote: »

Flaminir wrote: »

So.... I'm guessing that if the Dev's want to make any tweaks to the Sorc class moving forward that it won't be a full scale overhaul to every skill line as many people here would like... that there would just be the time for a few changes (Not in DB obviously, but moving forward)....

SO.... if you could make just THREE changes what would they be???

Try and make them realistic, cover as many builds as possible, and also added bonus points if they are likely to be easy for the dev's to build into existing systems/mechanics rather than a total redesign of a skill.

Here's mine:

1. Bound Armor - Move the max stam/magicka increases into our passives (To replace the health boost for a pet being active... make it for having a skill from anywhere in the tree being slotted.. health boost for pets being slotted is counter intuitive, if pets are out you will take less damage so why need more health?). Then change the skill to being a bound weapon... maybe a sword/bow for a stam morph, and a summoned daedric orb for magicka. These can act like DoT's dealing out damage for 10 seconds. Once summoned these bound weapons don't dispel until time is up so you can slot on either bar & have fewer toggles.
2. Curse - One morph as a target based DOT which also causes the target to deal less damage... the other morph as Velocious curse is now... so you can either go for burst (PvP) or a sustained DOT for a PVE dps buff.
3. Overload - Change to a cheap ultimate cost, single cast lightning strike. Deals decent damage & most importantly provides a group utility buff of some kind.... maybe some kind of effect on players in the immediate area.... or some form of debuff on the mobs like taking 8% more damage from all sources for 8 seconds, something like that (But not simple regen major/minor buffs which people already have up.... something more unique)

Obviously there are other simple fixes I wouldn't include in the 3 changes... like reverting surge changes & just capping the heal at 6k, & making dark exchange an instant cast.

The idea behind my main 3 changes is to give useful choices.... one less toggle, useful DoT's to both stam / magicka builds while still keeping the theme of summoning, choices between burst/sustained dps, & group utility by replacing the cancerous cheese that is overload with something that people would want in a group environment.

These are all great, but I would settle for:

1) either a 10 second hardened ward, or a longer shield that is critable.
2) reversion of surge, or at least a buff to where it is now.

The rest is nice, but I think fixing these at least makes the class competitive in pvp / VMA in DB. Group utility is a whole other issue that will require some broader fixes as you have indicated. My sorc will get his weekly runs in for leaderboard rewards, but until group utility is improved he'll be picking flowers.

Pretty much this right here. I know they mean empowered ward to be a PVE shield, and it works great as one - but it's too small in PVP. Hardened Ward is terrible for some of the PVE trials and daily pledges. The duration is too short, and it affects our already anemic DPS.

But I'm not going to pay to respec morphs every time I leave Cyrodiil. That's a bad design. Make hardened 10 seconds and empowered 12.

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom is @Wrobel getting kickbacks from Stendarr for his morph reset shrine? Having a separate PVP and PVE morph for shield is a bad idea.

NoMaassPliz

Minalan wrote: »

But I'm not going to pay to respec morphs every time I leave Cyrodiil. That's a bad design. Make hardened 10 seconds and empowered 12.

Couldn't agree more.

Flaminir

Minalan wrote: »

NoMaassPliz wrote: »

Flaminir wrote: »

So.... I'm guessing that if the Dev's want to make any tweaks to the Sorc class moving forward that it won't be a full scale overhaul to every skill line as many people here would like... that there would just be the time for a few changes (Not in DB obviously, but moving forward)....

SO.... if you could make just THREE changes what would they be???

Try and make them realistic, cover as many builds as possible, and also added bonus points if they are likely to be easy for the dev's to build into existing systems/mechanics rather than a total redesign of a skill.

Here's mine:

1. Bound Armor - Move the max stam/magicka increases into our passives (To replace the health boost for a pet being active... make it for having a skill from anywhere in the tree being slotted.. health boost for pets being slotted is counter intuitive, if pets are out you will take less damage so why need more health?). Then change the skill to being a bound weapon... maybe a sword/bow for a stam morph, and a summoned daedric orb for magicka. These can act like DoT's dealing out damage for 10 seconds. Once summoned these bound weapons don't dispel until time is up so you can slot on either bar & have fewer toggles.
2. Curse - One morph as a target based DOT which also causes the target to deal less damage... the other morph as Velocious curse is now... so you can either go for burst (PvP) or a sustained DOT for a PVE dps buff.
3. Overload - Change to a cheap ultimate cost, single cast lightning strike. Deals decent damage & most importantly provides a group utility buff of some kind.... maybe some kind of effect on players in the immediate area.... or some form of debuff on the mobs like taking 8% more damage from all sources for 8 seconds, something like that (But not simple regen major/minor buffs which people already have up.... something more unique)

Obviously there are other simple fixes I wouldn't include in the 3 changes... like reverting surge changes & just capping the heal at 6k, & making dark exchange an instant cast.

The idea behind my main 3 changes is to give useful choices.... one less toggle, useful DoT's to both stam / magicka builds while still keeping the theme of summoning, choices between burst/sustained dps, & group utility by replacing the cancerous cheese that is overload with something that people would want in a group environment.

These are all great, but I would settle for:

1) either a 10 second hardened ward, or a longer shield that is critable.
2) reversion of surge, or at least a buff to where it is now.

The rest is nice, but I think fixing these at least makes the class competitive in pvp / VMA in DB. Group utility is a whole other issue that will require some broader fixes as you have indicated. My sorc will get his weekly runs in for leaderboard rewards, but until group utility is improved he'll be picking flowers.

Having a separate PVP and PVE morph for shield is a bad idea.

I Agree on that for the shield....

I have no problem with offensive skills being different... in fact I think its good & encourages build diversity... but when it comes to absolute core mechanics (Like staying alive) then I think that you should have skills that are viable for both.

cpuScientist

Natas013 wrote: »

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

NativeJoe wrote: »

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

But they also increased the CD on enchants which basically makes those dmg increases void if you take more than 1 procc to kill your target.

Also for a sorc it wouldn't make sense since how would he ever get his DW enchants to proc....?

DW magicka sorc is what doesn't make sense. I understand why it's done but still. Pehaps instead of asking how sorcs are supposed to activate their enchants while duel wielding, we should ask why sorcs still have to DW to get more spell damage.

a sorcerer with two daggers makes sense actually, Do you know what a Athame is? its a ritualistic dagger used in spellcraft. i am a wiccan so i use them occasionally, though mine is more a shortsword, its still a valid implement.

a Sorcerer or mage that uses a dagger is not that uncommon, for those that use blood magic in many fantasy worlds, its preferable to a staff as you have to get at your, or anothers, blood somehow.

and, as far as i can remember, DnD allows wizards the use of clubs, daggers, and crossbows of all things

so Mages of all types exist, ((most still use magic as a resource, despite whatever discipline they are, but if i say that everyone and their damn mother starts jumping down my damn throat)) And they are never restricted to just one type of weapon. I personally want a Scythe, but im more necro minded anyway

No problem with your point of view from me. Kinda on the odd sides of spirituality as well. Anyway... Yes...But if we where to have that system in place it would need to do something different for every class imo. or at the very least a modifier. GW2 did it, each weapon is different and plays different on every character. And I don't think it'd be to hard to implement the system here if some thought was put into it. IE a Sorc conjures some form of medium range magickal slash attack from a sword, a warrior using a staff will do something like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DxucIZYyFrc

but these are things that cannot be implemented anytime soon even tho they make sense. They're just not going to do this sort of work. They can't balance the skills as it is...and adding new ones is something they Avoid at all costs. (if you haven't noticed)

that would be the best way to do it, maybe once they hire more talent, i loved how that worked in GW2, especially the necro, gods i love necromancy classes in games

Having different weapon skill lines for every class sounds good on one hand, but overly complicated on the other. It's defiantly not something we could expect anytime soon if it were a direction they decided to go. This would in effect make every weapon an extension of every class, and likely require all skills to have a stam and mag morph. This is a very elligent solution to the problem, but seems it would be a balancing nightmare.

I still feel introducing two new weapon lines an easier solution, if not a better one.

First off, though I'm not sure how this could be balanced with sprinting and dodge roll, blocking with a magic based weapon should use magicka. Holding block should be a steady drain on your resource that's relative to level and current cp and can be mitigated by regen. This cost should take into account max achievable regen per level and never be less then a steady drain of 1% on mag/stam. Further resource loss from blocking damage should be relative to the strength of the attack blocked. Of course this in of itself may be a diffucult mechanic to implement but I feel this change would be good and needed for balancing new weapons and a change to which resource is used for blocking dependent on weapon used.

Although all the changes I suggested for blocking wouldn't be necessary, my idea also requires a stam morph for every class skill for balancing purposes. This also make my idea one we couldn't expect on the next update or two.

The last part is the most complicated, and likely the hardest to balance. As it sits 2H balances with destro and bow balances with resto. That leaves 1HS and DW. Only two core items need to be added, wand and some sort of focus. Wand is pretty self explanatory and in no way lore breaking. I'd give wands and their skills at most half the range of destro. Focus on the other hand is where I'd need help from lore buffs to figure out what exactly this should be. My short list includes a doll, a crystal, a buckler, a spell book, and a totem (something relevant to the style it's made in). This would give us DW wands and wand and "focus".

Wands would work similar to destro, three elemental types and a forth damage type, magic. Off hand wand must be the same as the main hand or magic damage. With DW of the same you gain the added effects given to destro. With the off hand being magic you lose the added effect but gain spell power equal to DW weapons have with no passives. Put a passive in that increases elemental effect chances to proc where applicable, and if not the passive gives effects similar to DW. As to which should do what I'm not sure.

In the first option wands used in wand and "focus" would still deal its damage type in light/heavy attacks, but the skills would not be effected by this choice, only the visuals. This skill line would be akin to one hand and shield, focusing on damage mitigation and tanking mobs (look a use for inner beast).

Just my take. I know it'd be an incredible undertaking, but wouldn't it be awesome? Here's hoping we see something like this one day.

I agree, it's a neat idea. But the game was not built like that. And it would be a major waste of time and resources. Just add weapons for diversity. I badly want SPEARS. Maybe Crossbows aswell. But SPEARS for melee and for magic. I guess wands but I have never seen a wand in Elder Scrolls. It just seems so weird and out of place IMO. But I mean what else could be used. Scrolls maybe lol....

GRYM.LOCKE

3 Things huh Hmmm I wouild go with

1: Split up PVP / PVE shields or Leave shields at 12 seconds (Both Morphs)

2: Add some stamina morphs to other skills

3: Change Pets

- Familar

Morph - 1: Clan fear
- Physical Damage
- Taunt Enemies 10 second Cool down
- Lot of Health
- Knock down skill

Morph - 2: (New form if possible) Volatile Spark
- 2: Aoe attack That is increased by Magika and Number of pets

Twilight

Morph 1
Frontal AOE Shreik that stuns 10 second Cool down
Zap - That bounce to nearby Targets

Morph 2
Aoe Heal
Magika regen 10%

ZOS_JessicaFolsom

Here you all go. We know it isn't everything you have questions about, but it's a start.

ZOS_Wrobel

The answers to your initial set of questions are located here:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/267979/dark-brotherhood-sorcerer-q-a#latest

DHale

Really, I did not see any buffs to sorcs except Stam sorc which were badly in need. Still have a ways to go. For all the pvp er rage, sorcs are one of the worst sustainable dps in the game no exceptions. I am sure your data reports confirm this especially in pve. With shields at 6 seconds I can buff (aka) up fire two or three abilities then need buff up again. As a stamina user this is when I am attacking those like playing sorcs. It is ridiculously easy to kill 95 plus percent if those sorcs. Playing my sorc is now just simply more work and less fun and that is no Bueno. I want to thank you though it encouraged me to level other toons. Btw you can keep track... Sorc population will drop and maybe that's a good thing. I for one will not be playing my sorc unless I am called upon to provide the once and great title of negate monkey now at it has been restored to half its former glory. My only feedback is trying small incremental changes rather than large sweeping changes with unintended consequences.

SorataArisugawa

So disappointing...

Natas013

cpuScientist wrote: »

Natas013 wrote: »

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

NativeJoe wrote: »

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

But they also increased the CD on enchants which basically makes those dmg increases void if you take more than 1 procc to kill your target.

Also for a sorc it wouldn't make sense since how would he ever get his DW enchants to proc....?

DW magicka sorc is what doesn't make sense. I understand why it's done but still. Pehaps instead of asking how sorcs are supposed to activate their enchants while duel wielding, we should ask why sorcs still have to DW to get more spell damage.

a sorcerer with two daggers makes sense actually, Do you know what a Athame is? its a ritualistic dagger used in spellcraft. i am a wiccan so i use them occasionally, though mine is more a shortsword, its still a valid implement.

a Sorcerer or mage that uses a dagger is not that uncommon, for those that use blood magic in many fantasy worlds, its preferable to a staff as you have to get at your, or anothers, blood somehow.

and, as far as i can remember, DnD allows wizards the use of clubs, daggers, and crossbows of all things

so Mages of all types exist, ((most still use magic as a resource, despite whatever discipline they are, but if i say that everyone and their damn mother starts jumping down my damn throat)) And they are never restricted to just one type of weapon. I personally want a Scythe, but im more necro minded anyway

No problem with your point of view from me. Kinda on the odd sides of spirituality as well. Anyway... Yes...But if we where to have that system in place it would need to do something different for every class imo. or at the very least a modifier. GW2 did it, each weapon is different and plays different on every character. And I don't think it'd be to hard to implement the system here if some thought was put into it. IE a Sorc conjures some form of medium range magickal slash attack from a sword, a warrior using a staff will do something like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DxucIZYyFrc

but these are things that cannot be implemented anytime soon even tho they make sense. They're just not going to do this sort of work. They can't balance the skills as it is...and adding new ones is something they Avoid at all costs. (if you haven't noticed)

that would be the best way to do it, maybe once they hire more talent, i loved how that worked in GW2, especially the necro, gods i love necromancy classes in games

Having different weapon skill lines for every class sounds good on one hand, but overly complicated on the other. It's defiantly not something we could expect anytime soon if it were a direction they decided to go. This would in effect make every weapon an extension of every class, and likely require all skills to have a stam and mag morph. This is a very elligent solution to the problem, but seems it would be a balancing nightmare.

I still feel introducing two new weapon lines an easier solution, if not a better one.

First off, though I'm not sure how this could be balanced with sprinting and dodge roll, blocking with a magic based weapon should use magicka. Holding block should be a steady drain on your resource that's relative to level and current cp and can be mitigated by regen. This cost should take into account max achievable regen per level and never be less then a steady drain of 1% on mag/stam. Further resource loss from blocking damage should be relative to the strength of the attack blocked. Of course this in of itself may be a diffucult mechanic to implement but I feel this change would be good and needed for balancing new weapons and a change to which resource is used for blocking dependent on weapon used.

Although all the changes I suggested for blocking wouldn't be necessary, my idea also requires a stam morph for every class skill for balancing purposes. This also make my idea one we couldn't expect on the next update or two.

The last part is the most complicated, and likely the hardest to balance. As it sits 2H balances with destro and bow balances with resto. That leaves 1HS and DW. Only two core items need to be added, wand and some sort of focus. Wand is pretty self explanatory and in no way lore breaking. I'd give wands and their skills at most half the range of destro. Focus on the other hand is where I'd need help from lore buffs to figure out what exactly this should be. My short list includes a doll, a crystal, a buckler, a spell book, and a totem (something relevant to the style it's made in). This would give us DW wands and wand and "focus".

Wands would work similar to destro, three elemental types and a forth damage type, magic. Off hand wand must be the same as the main hand or magic damage. With DW of the same you gain the added effects given to destro. With the off hand being magic you lose the added effect but gain spell power equal to DW weapons have with no passives. Put a passive in that increases elemental effect chances to proc where applicable, and if not the passive gives effects similar to DW. As to which should do what I'm not sure.

In the first option wands used in wand and "focus" would still deal its damage type in light/heavy attacks, but the skills would not be effected by this choice, only the visuals. This skill line would be akin to one hand and shield, focusing on damage mitigation and tanking mobs (look a use for inner beast).

Just my take. I know it'd be an incredible undertaking, but wouldn't it be awesome? Here's hoping we see something like this one day.

I agree, it's a neat idea. But the game was not built like that. And it would be a major waste of time and resources. Just add weapons for diversity. I badly want SPEARS. Maybe Crossbows aswell. But SPEARS for melee and for magic. I guess wands but I have never seen a wand in Elder Scrolls. It just seems so weird and out of place IMO. But I mean what else could be used. Scrolls maybe lol....

There's wands in ES lore, I think there was a wand in Morrowind, I know there was a wand in this very game that was in a quest on EP starter island (the one where three people were turned into skeevers). Just adding weapons, with or without skill lines, without balancing them would have one side or the other screaming foul. Problem is, they made this bed, and we get to lie in it. Can't add anything without changing up everything.

On a side note, if the focus were what was elemental, make the fourth type necromancy.