This...

ShedsHisTail · March 2016

Deadfinger6 wrote: »

Awh...God, I can only watch 2mins of this....when did everyone become Whiney Neo-developers with a need to slate any thing that they percieve isn't the way the game should be.

Right? I watched like 3 minutes and all I could think was... "Is he going to whine the whole time?"

Xendyn · March 2016

gamerguy757 wrote: »

@andypappb16_ESO I clicked on it and it turned yellow. It either turns yellow or clear. I keep getting notifications.
@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_CoriJ How can I stop notifications for specific threads?

All you can do is go into your Notifications and uncheck the box for "receive notifications for discussions I've participated in"

I think that'll do it.
Maybe.

babylon · March 2016

gamerguy757 wrote: »

@andypappb16_ESO I clicked on it and it turned yellow. It either turns yellow or clear. I keep getting notifications.
@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_CoriJ How can I stop notifications for specific threads?

You can't - you have to turn that tickbox off for ALL threads people post in. Or change it so you just get a popup box rather than an email notification. Again this will affect all threads, no way to control individual threads except by making it so you get emails only on threads you FOLLOW (puts a star on the thread), and regular threads like this where you simply made a comment just turn off email notifications.

You need to "edit your profile" to get to these settings (then change for "notifications").

@gamerguy757

__________________________

DaveMoeDee · March 2016

LiquidSchwartz wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

I like how people throw around the term "casual" like its an insult. Pretty sure you are supposed to PLAY games casually and not make it your life's work. For many of us casuals we have lots of real life obligations. We might not play as much as these supposed hardcore people but our money spends the same. By definition casuals are the majority of people paying for and playing this game.

I wear it as a term of pride.

It's not an insult but more like yin and yang
Casuals are not what mmos are made for they take tons of hours and dedication but the way they are putting this game into motion isn't like an mmo that caters to having a thriving endgame for hardcore players and casuals alike but just catering to casuals leaving that hardcore segment in the toilet and giving more and more to casuals who will just quit when the content is finished or leave until the next dlc
That's not how you make a game last or make money

MMOs are made to make money. They don't have to be made for hardcore or casual players. They just need a profitable business model.

The value in 'hardcore' is that they will stick around doing the same thing over and over again, potentially keeping your game active and potentially throwing a lot of money at your game depending on how the game monetizes that. That doesn't mean that an MMO needs to cater to 'endgame' or to the 'hardcore' people who love endgame. It depends upon their business model.

There are also different kinds of 'hardcore' players. There are people who spend all day in Cyrodiil. There are people who complete group dungeons on all their characters. There are people who play economy simulator.

If ZOS thinks ESO can be profitable by being DLC sales based, they might cater to people who focus on narrative and lore. What is quite naive about the 'casual' label is that actually listening to dialog and reading books in game takes a major time investment. These people could spend as much time in-game as the 'hardcore' player. A casual like me will also spend time in Cyrodiil or IC if I feel like handing with one of my guilds (or if I want to unlock a skill). I spend those same 'tons of hours' in game, but I'm not sure that I would fit the 'hardcore' definition some put forth.

Sometime success is not about following the formula everyone else follows. Sometimes it is about finding your own niche.

Lysette · March 2016

WalkingLegacy wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

EsoRecon wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

Moglijuana wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

WalkingLegacy wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

I think Fengrush has no idea about how casuals play and for how long they stay in a game. He said like 3 months and then they are leaving the game - why would they possibly do that?- They have seen like nothing from this game in 3 months, because they do neither rush through the content nor would they spend a lot of time playing - if they get to play 20 hours per month that is already a lot and if they get up to 40 they hit a boundary, where their spouses will start to seriously get mad at them.

For casuals the game content will not run out anytime soon - they simply are not gamers who would consume a game like it would be melting ice cream. They do not burn through the content like being on speed and they do not run around like squirrels from quest to quest - they try to enjoy their time in Tamriel, without stress or the insane idea, that endgame would be what the game would be about - it is not - that what hardcore gamers see as a necessary evil - the PvE content - that is their game. And that Pvp content is not much more than a necessary evil, because they will most likely never get to it anyway.

This game can perfectly live on for many years to come, paid solely by casual players - they might not play a lot, they will as well not be a burden on the servers, but they are willing to keep up a subscription for years to come - because that is what they want - enjoyable entertainment to get back to, whenever they have a couple of hours. They do not seek a challenge, but entertainment, something to get away from reality for a bit - so they stay subscribed, because this is the cheapest seen long term. And that is exactky what ZOS wants as well - reliable income for years to come - so it is a win-win situation - just not for hardcore players.

You have it so backwards sometimes.

Lysette wrote: »

Mojmir wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

I think Fengrush has no idea about how casuals play and for how long they stay in a game. He said like 3 months and then they are leaving the game - why would they possibly do that?- They have seen like nothing from this game in 3 months, because they do neither rush through the content nor would they spend a lot of time playing - if they get to play 20 hours per month that is already a lot and if they get up to 40 they hit a boundary, where their spouses will start to seriously get mad at them.

For casuals the game content will not run out anytime soon - they simply are not gamers who would consume a game like it would be melting ice cream. They do not burn through the content like being on speed and they do not run around like squirrels from quest to quest - they try to enjoy their time in Tamriel, without stress or the insane idea, that endgame would be what the game would be about - it is not - that what hardcore gamers see as a necessary evil - the PvE content - that is their game. And that Pvp content is not much more than a necessary evil, because they will most likely never get to it anyway.

This game can perfectly live on for many years to come, paid solely by casual players - they might not play a lot, they will as well not be a burden on the servers, but they are willing to keep up a subscription for years to come - because that is what they want - enjoyable entertainment to get back to, whenever they have a couple of hours. They do not seek a challenge, but entertainment, something to get away from reality for a bit - so they stay subscribed, because this is the cheapest seen long term. And that is exactky what ZOS wants as well - reliable income for years to come - so it is a win-win situation - just not for hardcore players.

so basically in a nut shell: hardcore players,pvp fanatics,and streamers picked the wrong game to invest in. not arguing just interpreting.

Of course they did - like Mr. Firor said lately, this is not the typical MMO but more of an expansive online Elder Scrolls RPG. And that is what it is going to be, you expect the wrong thing, if you think it will ever be something else.

He has said so many things, and constantly changes their agenda when they realize they can't accomplish anything. This is no different then stating their "MMO" is different than traditional MMOs. How so Matt/Lysette? Different because you're designing a single player experience but charging cash shop items that mimic an MMO?

Different as in "having no end game" - you guys are just not getting it - there is no end game and never will be - you might get an arena - another hamster cage for you to run in for a little while longer - but in fact ESO is a role playing game, an online version of an Elder Scrolls RPG - in that it is not a typical MMO. That ESO still has this hamster cage in Cyrrodil is just because it is still making some extra cash - if it will do that no longer, it might cease to be a PvP zone, who can say that now - you guys say, you will eventually leave, and think that is a threat - it is not, they might wait for you to actually do it. They cannot kick you out because you have paid for the game and are customers, but you are not the desired kind of customer, that's for certain. The whole game development is showing this.

The problem is, the Dev team hints at going in a certain direction (usually to appeal to both PvE & PvP) but then they go in a completely different direction without any discussion with the players that play their game...

Did it ever come to your mind, that ZOS has the data - they can actually see, where most players are and what they are doing most of the time - if it would be pvp, then they would cater for this more - but as it seems, it is not pvp, despite that this kind of people cry the loudest in the forum - in actual numbers they just seem to be insignificant, not worth the hassle. They are still providing some income, so you pvp guys will get some bread crumbs from time to time, but that's it. Otherwise it is an online role playing game based on the PvE and role play crowd - because, you might not believe it, they are the majority and they will stick with the game and not bail out for the next big hype, like you guys will do - bail and invade the next thing like a swarm of locusts, make people there miserable with your poison until it will be time for the locusts to bail and swarm to the next hype - and you think, you guys are preferred customers?- Now, get real.

They are trying to make the game better -_- And I am willing to bet that there was once more people playing pvp than pve, but ZOS every update does something that pushes PVP players away.

Sigh - you guys really do not get what Elder Scrolls is all about - do you? - it was never meant to be what you think it would be. Never, simply because this would p*ss off the fan base of TES. It was never meant to be a PvP-centric game, never, but Elder Scrolls with friends. Basically that what they now clearly state - an expansive online Elder Scrolls RPG - that is what it is.

Why do you continue to make this up? Elder Scrolls is beyond being labeled as a PvE or PvP game.

It is a story and that story can be told in either PvP or PvE.

Lysette wrote: »

EsoRecon wrote: »

I just now realized that the majority of people left are skyrim players. Well I have something for you. This isn't that type of game. Now don't get me wrong I absolutely loved skyrim, but ESO isn't skyrim. So there should be good pvp and things to do at end game. It shouldn't just be an RP quester game. It's an MMO!

Mr. Firor is not of your opinion - and he is in the lead - so guess what will happen and who is right.

Now you speak for Matt Firor? Have you not noticed how he has back tracked on a lot of his promises to the game? Do you think he back tracked because they don't know how to fix their own game?

You know Matt Firor background is DAoC. A RvRvR MMORPG.

Regardless what his background might be, he got what TES is about - and that ESO should not be a pvp-centric game but an online version of the Elder Scrolls RPG - that he stated this clearly lately, made me very happy - because there is hope, that PvP will disappear at some point in time with all their demands, which are so contrary to what RPG game play is like. PvP want shapeless "balanced" game play, where all is basically the same and have the same abilities with different names - that is not what role play is like. A role player takes on a character as it is, he is not re-rolling just because the game play is changing, because he feels an attachment to his/her character, is developing the role of his/her character, accepts strengths and weaknesses and goes for the fun of playing the role, instead to be a number crunching min/max player. Role play seeks diversity, not uniformity like pvp. These 2 play styles do not go well together - they are too different.

Edit. and I am not making this up - this is what Mr. Firor said lately in an interview:

After PC launch, and especially leading up to console launch mid-last year, we have done a great job setting customer expectations about what ESO is, and now that it has become so popular, I don’t think we run into anyone thinking the game is Skyrim 2. Our bigger challenge has been to educate players that we are not a traditional 2004-style MMO and much more an expansive online Elder Scrolls RPG.

RedRoomGaming · March 2016

172 notifications, this is going to be a long damn read.

I_killed_Vivec · March 2016

LiquidSchwartz wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

I like how people throw around the term "casual" like its an insult. Pretty sure you are supposed to PLAY games casually and not make it your life's work. For many of us casuals we have lots of real life obligations. We might not play as much as these supposed hardcore people but our money spends the same. By definition casuals are the majority of people paying for and playing this game.

I wear it as a term of pride.

It's not an insult but more like yin and yang
Casuals are not what mmos are made for they take tons of hours and dedication but the way they are putting this game into motion isn't like an mmo that caters to having a thriving endgame for hardcore players and casuals alike but just catering to casuals leaving that hardcore segment in the toilet and giving more and more to casuals who will just quit when the content is finished or leave until the next dlc
That's not how you make a game last or make money

Really?

A lot of "casuals" have more loyalty to this game than some of the "hardcore" players - particularly those, even in this thread, who are threatening to leave.

As I said above, I'm sure ZoS have a much better idea of who is really paying the bills - I suspect it isn't the hardcode PvPer who sits in Cyrodiil and doesn't need to sub, but rather the greater numbers of ponderous casual players slowly working their way through DLC, buying costumes and pets.

GazettE · March 2016

Well after all, the only thing i couldnt agree more is the bug issues. Whats the point of testing the new patch in PTS but when it goes live there is a lot of different bugs going on. I mean how could this happen? Whats the point of PTS?

Mojmir · March 2016

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

LiquidSchwartz wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

I like how people throw around the term "casual" like its an insult. Pretty sure you are supposed to PLAY games casually and not make it your life's work. For many of us casuals we have lots of real life obligations. We might not play as much as these supposed hardcore people but our money spends the same. By definition casuals are the majority of people paying for and playing this game.

I wear it as a term of pride.

It's not an insult but more like yin and yang
Casuals are not what mmos are made for they take tons of hours and dedication but the way they are putting this game into motion isn't like an mmo that caters to having a thriving endgame for hardcore players and casuals alike but just catering to casuals leaving that hardcore segment in the toilet and giving more and more to casuals who will just quit when the content is finished or leave until the next dlc
That's not how you make a game last or make money

Really?

A lot of "casuals" have more loyalty to this game than some of the "hardcore" players - particularly those, even in this thread, who are threatening to leave.

As I said above, I'm sure ZoS have a much better idea of who is really paying the bills - I suspect it isn't the hardcode PvPer who sits in Cyrodiil and doesn't need to sub, but rather the greater numbers of ponderous casual players slowly working their way through DLC, buying costumes and pets.

im sure the casuals are playing the game right now too, and not on the forums fighting.

Lysette · March 2016

Mojmir wrote: »

Bottom line, they weren't listeni

Deadfinger6 wrote: »

Awh...God, I can only watch 2mins of this....when did everyone become Whiney Neo-developers with a need to slate any thing that they percieve isn't the way the game should be.

hes not saying anything that hasn't been said before, making a video doesn't make the point any stronger. bottom line: things will continue they way they've been going.

Lysette wrote: »

.

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

EsoRecon wrote: »

Can someone explain to me why PVE players get so mad when we PVP players want something good to happen in PVP? I mean it doesn't affect you, so why get so worked up about it.

Look into how many of the complainers phrase their complaints. If they are complaining about so-called "casual", you have your answer.

Also, we need to keep our voices heard because we don't start many complaint threads. It is important to be heard so that ZOS knows that a large number of people like where the game is going and thought TG was a great addition (though with mixed opinions on topless NPCs and purple/pink critters.)

Indeed and we are critical as well, but in a constructive way - like with the overdone thief troves - well it was not working like intended, so they fixed it - some of you call this a nerf, but that is what constructive criticism is like - you make your points and state how you think it could be made better - that's all what it is about - the Devs will then decide, if they agree and they might fix it or if they have another idea about it and let it how it is - in the end it is their game, we can help to shape it a little and point out flaws, but in the end they decide, ESO is not a democracy, where you could vote - the only way you can vote is with your money - just go and buy ZOS from Zenimax, then the game will go 100% in your way - otherwise you will have to play what you get - or leave.

this so called nerf actually made things worse for everyone else, the prices for the dropped sets just went up. I didn't want the troves changed, either way I profited. it isn't just about what you ask for with ZOS, its about the repercussions. this is one thing fengrush didn't mention in his video, but definitely ties in.

Well I did want them changed, because they felt just wrong - and how it turned out it was a bug and they fixed it. I do not judge the game after what is good for me or not, but what I think is good for the game and the game play overall. I did not even use this exploit - and knowing about a bug and taking advantage of it is an exploit. It just felt wrong, when I can stay in a 30m circle and open one of the 2 troves there every 30 seconds - this was just horrible - and of course it turned out to be a bug.

rotaugen454 · March 2016

Morbash wrote: »

Kahl_dur wrote: »

Morbash wrote: »

Kahl_dur wrote: »

Sorry, I'm confused. Was that supposed to be a review of Thieve's Guild? Seemed more like the foul-mouthed rantings of a disgruntled streamer to me.

Sorry, I'm confused. Was your post supposed to add something of value to the discussion? If you can't handle coarse language, then please take your prudish bait post elsewhere. Feel free to come back and contribute to the discussion when you're wearing your big boy pants.

LOL. It's called sarcasm. And yes, his "Thieve's Guild review" was nothing more than a profanity-laced tirade that lacked both coherence and constructive criticism.

Sure, his review did consist of a fair share of profanity. I'll give you that. However, just because profanities were used, that doesn't mean the video lacked coherency or constructive criticism. The criticism Fengrush offers is colorfully constructive, and he makes many valid points.

Have you tried filtering the language and listening to the points made in the video? I'm going to assume "no" considering we've yet to move past "Gasp! That man said some bad, bad words. He's a very baaaad man; therefore, his opinions on ESO do not matter."

I can personally pick out plenty of sound arguments that Fengrush makes, and Fengrush's inclusion of profanities does not impact my ability to do so. See...watch this...

Some key points from Fengrush's Thieves Guild review:

1. Balance has shifted in the favor of Magicka based builds since TG released. This is mainly due to changes with CP, Proximity Detonation, and the addition of sets such as Vicious Death. Not only that, but stamina builds did not receive any noteworthy changes to their skill sets. For example, with the exception of stamina DKs and their dragon leap, stamina builds do not have ultimates that scale off of physical damage.

2. ZOS did not scale old content and gear to max level. This makes the old content and gear obsolete. Why not make old content and gear scale to max level? It'll add variety alongside new content such as Thieves Guild.

3. Performance in Cyrodiil is still extremely lackluster. Why? Because AOE caps cause ball groups. People form ball groups because they know it's safe. There's an inherent advantage to stacking numbers on top of each other. AOE caps basically serve as an artificial shield. The more numbers you have, the less damage you take. And currently, the only way to effectively combat ball groups is to bring in a ball group of your own. When these ball groups clash for hours on end and constantly spam AOEs, this becomes the root of the lag and performance issues we experience in Cyrodiil each and everyday.

See? Not that hard to pick out some of the points Fengrush made in his video despite his crude way of communicating. And even though he uses profane speech, his arguments are still plausible and comprehensible.

People are WAAAY too caught up in how the message was delivered rather than the actual message itself.

I agree it goes too much towards Magicka (even if my main is a Magicka sorc, I have Stam builds too). Basically, you wrote three points that took him about a half hour of yelling to get across. It's not the message, it is the medium. I also think they should scale the gear, but if Vet ranks go away in 3 months, it is a temporary thing. As for PvP, it cuts down on grouping to remove AoE caps, but doesn't that just make the uber players go 1v10 to make impressive videos? For me, I was hoping for huge PvP battles, and was in a few, but it is hit or miss how many are in battles at any particular time. I think removing AoE caps would take out some problems and replace them with others, it's just a matter of deciding which is the best alternative. I'm personally fine either way, but that's because I don't do a ton of PvP.

ShedsHisTail · March 2016

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

LiquidSchwartz wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

I like how people throw around the term "casual" like its an insult. Pretty sure you are supposed to PLAY games casually and not make it your life's work. For many of us casuals we have lots of real life obligations. We might not play as much as these supposed hardcore people but our money spends the same. By definition casuals are the majority of people paying for and playing this game.

I wear it as a term of pride.

It's not an insult but more like yin and yang
Casuals are not what mmos are made for they take tons of hours and dedication but the way they are putting this game into motion isn't like an mmo that caters to having a thriving endgame for hardcore players and casuals alike but just catering to casuals leaving that hardcore segment in the toilet and giving more and more to casuals who will just quit when the content is finished or leave until the next dlc
That's not how you make a game last or make money

Really?

A lot of "casuals" have more loyalty to this game than some of the "hardcore" players - particularly those, even in this thread, who are threatening to leave.

As I said above, I'm sure ZoS have a much better idea of who is really paying the bills - I suspect it isn't the hardcode PvPer who sits in Cyrodiil and doesn't need to sub, but rather the greater numbers of ponderous casual players slowly working their way through DLC, buying costumes and pets.

Agreed.
The casual player who spends months playing through the newest DLC, staying subbed and buying the novelty items, is going to contribute far more to the games profitability and longevity than the un-subbed hardcore player who blows through the new content in a weekend, then gets bored and finds a new game until the next DLC hits.

Lysette · March 2016

Molag_Crow wrote: »

I've been on a break from ESO for a few weeks, waiting for Thieves Guild, and I'm not entirely excited but there's that.

All the people who're disagreeing with Fengrush/most of his valid points, must be delusional! Sure, you may be pretty happy doing whatever you're currently doing in ESO, but sooner or later you'll come to the realization that most of us have already come to, and then maybe Fengrush's words will repeat in your head.

if I ever will hit "end game", then it will be just that to me - end of the game - i will move on to something else. I do not expect something to be after "end of the game" - I do not believe in an afterlife and I do not believe into game content after the end of the game either. So who is delusional now?

Lysette · March 2016

LiquidSchwartz wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

I like how people throw around the term "casual" like its an insult. Pretty sure you are supposed to PLAY games casually and not make it your life's work. For many of us casuals we have lots of real life obligations. We might not play as much as these supposed hardcore people but our money spends the same. By definition casuals are the majority of people paying for and playing this game.

I wear it as a term of pride.

It's not an insult but more like yin and yang
Casuals are not what mmos are made for they take tons of hours and dedication but the way they are putting this game into motion isn't like an mmo that caters to having a thriving endgame for hardcore players and casuals alike but just catering to casuals leaving that hardcore segment in the toilet and giving more and more to casuals who will just quit when the content is finished or leave until the next dlc
That's not how you make a game last or make money

They do not leave until the next DLC - you have a wrong impression for how long it takes a casual player to get even through one zone in this game. Some of you guys have done thief guild quest line within its first week - burnt through the content - that is not the way casuals play - for them this DLC will last for much longer than it takes for the next to come out. And they will stay subscribed during all that time, while not being a burden on the servers and as well not always whining and complaining about everything.

You guys do not give ZOS any praise at all - but look at this game, it is mostly beautiful and entertaining - if you don't enjoy it, well, then go play something else - to us casuals this game ranges from really good to just awesome, looks from beautiful to breath-taking and plays smoothly without any lag - we have a totally different experience than hardcore pvp player.

Moglijuana · March 2016

Sigh. Idk how this thread turned into a casual vs. hardcore discussion. The ENTIRE point of the video was to highlight the immense amount of transparency in ZOS's communication with their community. It affects EVERYONE. Not JUST Pvp, not JUST PvE. Everyone. All they need to do is be a bit more vocal in the direction they are planning on going and that ALONE would give people a better idea on what to look forward to, or to move on.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · March 2016

LiquidSchwartz wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

I like how people throw around the term "casual" like its an insult. Pretty sure you are supposed to PLAY games casually and not make it your life's work. For many of us casuals we have lots of real life obligations. We might not play as much as these supposed hardcore people but our money spends the same. By definition casuals are the majority of people paying for and playing this game.

I wear it as a term of pride.

It's not an insult but more like yin and yang
Casuals are not what mmos are made for they take tons of hours and dedication but the way they are putting this game into motion isn't like an mmo that caters to having a thriving endgame for hardcore players and casuals alike but just catering to casuals leaving that hardcore segment in the toilet and giving more and more to casuals who will just quit when the content is finished or leave until the next dlc
That's not how you make a game last or make money

You dont understand is the problem. This game has been from day one a casual type MMO. It doesnt take 100s of hours of dedication. Im barely done with Orsinium and TG came out. I still havent ran the previous trials and now we have a new one already. Not to mention on entire new area to explore. Ill probably end up barely finishing it when the next one comes out. A LOT of ESO players are exactly like me. I play with a lot of my real life friends. So you saying the game isnt made for us seems like it is made exactly for us.

Hardcore people burn through 3 months of development in three days and then complain they have nothing to do for months.

Uriel_Nocturne · March 2016

I would like that half hour of my life back, please...

Ashtaris · March 2016

me_ming wrote: »

Honestly? It's really hard to disagree with Feng Rush on this one. As much as, I don't agree with some of his opinions, this video is just too real and on point. The PTS version of TG is waaaaay better than the live one. I didn't mind it at first, but later on I feel cheated. Because I (or anyone else) didn't deserve to play a beta version of the game. The amount of bugs in TG is just intolerable. It's silly. And there really is no excuse for them to be releasing a DLC that is NOT ready. I understand that games will always have bugs upon release, but it shouldn't feel like you're playing a beta version-- a version that feels like you're still testing it.

I feel many of you have not considered that software testing is a game of "What if's". If player A does such and such to this interactive at this particular time in the solar cycle, then something breaks. And to compound the problem, what broke for player A may only occur if the server load is past a certain point. So you can see, many times the bugs will only come to the surface when it's in a "Live" environment, not with the handful of people who are doing testing on the PTS.

Having said that, I will say that there are many occassions when ZOS does get valid bug reports but does nothing to correct the problems. After awhile, those annoyances build up until you get to a breaking point, which obviously happened to FENGRUSH

rfennell_ESO · March 2016

Ashtaris wrote: »

me_ming wrote: »

Honestly? It's really hard to disagree with Feng Rush on this one. As much as, I don't agree with some of his opinions, this video is just too real and on point. The PTS version of TG is waaaaay better than the live one. I didn't mind it at first, but later on I feel cheated. Because I (or anyone else) didn't deserve to play a beta version of the game. The amount of bugs in TG is just intolerable. It's silly. And there really is no excuse for them to be releasing a DLC that is NOT ready. I understand that games will always have bugs upon release, but it shouldn't feel like you're playing a beta version-- a version that feels like you're still testing it.

I feel many of you have not considered that software testing is a game of "What if's". If player A does such and such to this interactive at this particular time in the solar cycle, then something breaks. And to compound the problem, what broke for player A may only occur if the server load is past a certain point. So you can see, many times the bugs will only come to the surface when it's in a "Live" environment, not with the handful of people who are doing testing on the PTS.

Having said that, I will say that there are many occassions when ZOS does get valid bug reports but does nothing to correct the problems. After awhile, those annoyances build up until you get to a breaking point, which obviously happened to FENGRUSH

Of course the problem is a lot of the "get ahead" types that are on pts are there to get advance knowledge of things and won't report any bugs they can abuse.

Tankqull · March 2016

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Ashtaris wrote: »

me_ming wrote: »

Honestly? It's really hard to disagree with Feng Rush on this one. As much as, I don't agree with some of his opinions, this video is just too real and on point. The PTS version of TG is waaaaay better than the live one. I didn't mind it at first, but later on I feel cheated. Because I (or anyone else) didn't deserve to play a beta version of the game. The amount of bugs in TG is just intolerable. It's silly. And there really is no excuse for them to be releasing a DLC that is NOT ready. I understand that games will always have bugs upon release, but it shouldn't feel like you're playing a beta version-- a version that feels like you're still testing it.

I feel many of you have not considered that software testing is a game of "What if's". If player A does such and such to this interactive at this particular time in the solar cycle, then something breaks. And to compound the problem, what broke for player A may only occur if the server load is past a certain point. So you can see, many times the bugs will only come to the surface when it's in a "Live" environment, not with the handful of people who are doing testing on the PTS.

Having said that, I will say that there are many occassions when ZOS does get valid bug reports but does nothing to correct the problems. After awhile, those annoyances build up until you get to a breaking point, which obviously happened to FENGRUSH

Of course the problem is a lot of the "get ahead" types that are on pts are there to get advance knowledge of things and won't report any bugs they can abuse.

i´ve reportet 4 glaring obviously bugged things none was addressed before going live...
so much to your conspiracy theories of a majority not reporting bugs to gain advantages...

D0ntevenL1ft · March 2016

Get back to the first page you thread

Dahkoht · March 2016

JD2013 wrote: »

He makes a couple of points. I'm willing to grant you that. But it's completely lost in his own sense of self importance and childish ranting.

Stole this from another thread about this video , and it's worth repeating.

"Give a self-absorbed twenty-something a camera and YouTube and the video you just watched is the most likely outcome."

starkerealm · March 2016

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

LiquidSchwartz wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

I like how people throw around the term "casual" like its an insult. Pretty sure you are supposed to PLAY games casually and not make it your life's work. For many of us casuals we have lots of real life obligations. We might not play as much as these supposed hardcore people but our money spends the same. By definition casuals are the majority of people paying for and playing this game.

I wear it as a term of pride.

It's not an insult but more like yin and yang
Casuals are not what mmos are made for they take tons of hours and dedication but the way they are putting this game into motion isn't like an mmo that caters to having a thriving endgame for hardcore players and casuals alike but just catering to casuals leaving that hardcore segment in the toilet and giving more and more to casuals who will just quit when the content is finished or leave until the next dlc
That's not how you make a game last or make money

You dont understand is the problem. This game has been from day one a casual type MMO. It doesnt take 100s of hours of dedication. Im barely done with Orsinium and TG came out. I still havent ran the previous trials and now we have a new one already. Not to mention on entire new area to explore. Ill probably end up barely finishing it when the next one comes out. A LOT of ESO players are exactly like me. I play with a lot of my real life friends. So you saying the game isnt made for us seems like it is made exactly for us.

Hardcore people burn through 3 months of development in three days and then complain they have nothing to do for months.

And then insist that they speak for the majority of players.

I still remember that derp in another thread who insisted they just wanted to be "an average PvPer, like Sypher."

But, yeah, this is the story of MMOs in a nutshell. Players that insist they're speaking for everyone when they're in the extreme minority.

Feng is talking for less than 1% of ESO's population, and then demanding that his opinions are more important than the rest of us because he had a stamina sorc build featured.

Nolphi · March 2016

For those seeing a Salty Fengrush for the first time and judging: go do your homework and go watch all the We are ESO episodes and the ESO Lives in between them. Sure, the man has always been 'flavor full' but the current state of ranting is not coming out of the blue.

I think we can all agree on a few basic things:

- Most PVE content takes a long time to create and most players will only run it once. Unless you force them to grind it till their eyes bleed for the best gear in the game. While this may keep people playing for a while its also incredibly frustrating and when people start seeing this game as work they will quit at one point.
- PVP content dominates the streaming top charts and is the only way to create brand new experiences for your playerbase each time they sign in. I suck at PVP and even I have had my most exciting times in PVP. Real life people will always be more interesting to fight with or against.

The 'We are ESO' folks kept saying the same thing: the combat sysem in ESO is its primary assets and its such a shame its not getting used to its full potential. I fully understand what they mean with that and meaningful, different PVP settings would give endless engaging content in my opinion. Much more than a new quest zone or gear sets could ever give.

Arenas or on the spot duelling would:

- Give me a way to really learn PVP. Its rare for me to find or create a situation where I can have a simple undisturbed one on one fight without getting disturbed by other players. Getting ganked or attemptin a sneeky gank myself teaches me little as it creates wildly unfair fights. Running in huge groups with TS following the instructions of the leader teaches me nothing.
- Give ZOS the statistics they need to create balance. Only in isolated one on one battles can you truly see what works and doesnt work and which skills are being used and which arent. Its like any kind of scientific research: eliminate as many outside factors.

To ZOS: you guys are not bad people, you guys are crazy creative and ESO could be the best MMO experience. I run a large business myself and understand the need for revenue and the quarterly DLCs is your way of doing that. I think you guys have reached a stage though where the basic quality of your product and the direction it is taking
needs a review. Why dont you guys run a massive survey inside your game to get some clear and honest feedback from your entire playerbase? Ask them what they want. Give away 100 crowns for completing the survey. You cannot get representative feedback from the forums, streamers or small focus group discussions with a few guild leaders. You need the entire player base to give you their feedback and then you need to openly come out and share those results with us and how you plan to address it. This is customer engagement at its most basic level. Run a survey! It will also tell you how to make more money from the Crown Store. For the life of me I cannot understand why you guys are able to create awesome and creative zones like Wrothgar and its storyline but cant find the inspiration to come up with more interesting vanity items... different colored bears 4 months in a row?

Mojmir · March 2016

Nolphi wrote: »

For those seeing a Salty Fengrush for the first time and judging: go do your homework and go watch all the We are ESO episodes and the ESO Lives in between them. Sure, the man has always been 'flavor full' but the current state of ranting is not coming out of the blue.

I think we can all agree on a few basic things:

- Most PVE content takes a long time to create and most players will only run it once. Unless you force them to grind it till their eyes bleed for the best gear in the game. While this may keep people playing for a while its also incredibly frustrating and when people start seeing this game as work they will quit at one point.
- PVP content dominates the streaming top charts and is the only way to create brand new experiences for your playerbase each time they sign in. I suck at PVP and even I have had my most exciting times in PVP. Real life people will always be more interesting to fight with or against.

The 'We are ESO' folks kept saying the same thing: the combat sysem in ESO is its primary assets and its such a shame its not getting used to its full potential. I fully understand what they mean with that and meaningful, different PVP settings would give endless engaging content in my opinion. Much more than a new quest zone or gear sets could ever give.

Arenas or on the spot duelling would:

- Give me a way to really learn PVP. Its rare for me to find or create a situation where I can have a simple undisturbed one on one fight without getting disturbed by other players. Getting ganked or attemptin a sneeky gank myself teaches me little as it creates wildly unfair fights. Running in huge groups with TS following the instructions of the leader teaches me nothing.
- Give ZOS the statistics they need to create balance. Only in isolated one on one battles can you truly see what works and doesnt work and which skills are being used and which arent. Its like any kind of scientific research: eliminate as many outside factors.

To ZOS: you guys are not bad people, you guys are crazy creative and ESO could be the best MMO experience. I run a large business myself and understand the need for revenue and the quarterly DLCs is your way of doing that. I think you guys have reached a stage though where the basic quality of your product and the direction it is taking
needs a review. Why dont you guys run a massive survey inside your game to get some clear and honest feedback from your entire playerbase? Ask them what they want. Give away 100 crowns for completing the survey. You cannot get representative feedback from the forums, streamers or small focus group discussions with a few guild leaders. You need the entire player base to give you their feedback and then you need to openly come out and share those results with us and how you plan to address it. This is customer engagement at its most basic level. Run a survey! It will also tell you how to make more money from the Crown Store. For the life of me I cannot understand why you guys are able to create awesome and creative zones like Wrothgar and its storyline but cant find the inspiration to come up with more interesting vanity items... different colored bears 4 months in a row?

who needs a fengrush video when you have this ^^^^

starkerealm · March 2016

Mojmir wrote: »

Nolphi wrote: »

For those seeing a Salty Fengrush for the first time and judging: go do your homework and go watch all the We are ESO episodes and the ESO Lives in between them. Sure, the man has always been 'flavor full' but the current state of ranting is not coming out of the blue.

I think we can all agree on a few basic things:

- Most PVE content takes a long time to create and most players will only run it once. Unless you force them to grind it till their eyes bleed for the best gear in the game. While this may keep people playing for a while its also incredibly frustrating and when people start seeing this game as work they will quit at one point.
- PVP content dominates the streaming top charts and is the only way to create brand new experiences for your playerbase each time they sign in. I suck at PVP and even I have had my most exciting times in PVP. Real life people will always be more interesting to fight with or against.

The 'We are ESO' folks kept saying the same thing: the combat sysem in ESO is its primary assets and its such a shame its not getting used to its full potential. I fully understand what they mean with that and meaningful, different PVP settings would give endless engaging content in my opinion. Much more than a new quest zone or gear sets could ever give.

Arenas or on the spot duelling would:

- Give me a way to really learn PVP. Its rare for me to find or create a situation where I can have a simple undisturbed one on one fight without getting disturbed by other players. Getting ganked or attemptin a sneeky gank myself teaches me little as it creates wildly unfair fights. Running in huge groups with TS following the instructions of the leader teaches me nothing.
- Give ZOS the statistics they need to create balance. Only in isolated one on one battles can you truly see what works and doesnt work and which skills are being used and which arent. Its like any kind of scientific research: eliminate as many outside factors.

To ZOS: you guys are not bad people, you guys are crazy creative and ESO could be the best MMO experience. I run a large business myself and understand the need for revenue and the quarterly DLCs is your way of doing that. I think you guys have reached a stage though where the basic quality of your product and the direction it is taking
needs a review. Why dont you guys run a massive survey inside your game to get some clear and honest feedback from your entire playerbase? Ask them what they want. Give away 100 crowns for completing the survey. You cannot get representative feedback from the forums, streamers or small focus group discussions with a few guild leaders. You need the entire player base to give you their feedback and then you need to openly come out and share those results with us and how you plan to address it. This is customer engagement at its most basic level. Run a survey! It will also tell you how to make more money from the Crown Store. For the life of me I cannot understand why you guys are able to create awesome and creative zones like Wrothgar and its storyline but cant find the inspiration to come up with more interesting vanity items... different colored bears 4 months in a row?

who needs a fengrush video when you have this ^^^^

Feng Rush. Since this doesn't contribute to his analytics.

WalkingLegacy · March 2016

Nolphi wrote: »

For those seeing a Salty Fengrush for the first time and judging: go do your homework and go watch all the We are ESO episodes and the ESO Lives in between them. Sure, the man has always been 'flavor full' but the current state of ranting is not coming out of the blue.

I think we can all agree on a few basic things:

- Most PVE content takes a long time to create and most players will only run it once. Unless you force them to grind it till their eyes bleed for the best gear in the game. While this may keep people playing for a while its also incredibly frustrating and when people start seeing this game as work they will quit at one point.
- PVP content dominates the streaming top charts and is the only way to create brand new experiences for your playerbase each time they sign in. I suck at PVP and even I have had my most exciting times in PVP. Real life people will always be more interesting to fight with or against.

The 'We are ESO' folks kept saying the same thing: the combat sysem in ESO is its primary assets and its such a shame its not getting used to its full potential. I fully understand what they mean with that and meaningful, different PVP settings would give endless engaging content in my opinion. Much more than a new quest zone or gear sets could ever give.

Arenas or on the spot duelling would:

- Give me a way to really learn PVP. Its rare for me to find or create a situation where I can have a simple undisturbed one on one fight without getting disturbed by other players. Getting ganked or attemptin a sneeky gank myself teaches me little as it creates wildly unfair fights. Running in huge groups with TS following the instructions of the leader teaches me nothing.
- Give ZOS the statistics they need to create balance. Only in isolated one on one battles can you truly see what works and doesnt work and which skills are being used and which arent. Its like any kind of scientific research: eliminate as many outside factors.

To ZOS: you guys are not bad people, you guys are crazy creative and ESO could be the best MMO experience. I run a large business myself and understand the need for revenue and the quarterly DLCs is your way of doing that. I think you guys have reached a stage though where the basic quality of your product and the direction it is taking
needs a review. Why dont you guys run a massive survey inside your game to get some clear and honest feedback from your entire playerbase? Ask them what they want. Give away 100 crowns for completing the survey. You cannot get representative feedback from the forums, streamers or small focus group discussions with a few guild leaders. You need the entire player base to give you their feedback and then you need to openly come out and share those results with us and how you plan to address it. This is customer engagement at its most basic level. Run a survey! It will also tell you how to make more money from the Crown Store. For the life of me I cannot understand why you guys are able to create awesome and creative zones like Wrothgar and its storyline but cant find the inspiration to come up with more interesting vanity items... different colored bears 4 months in a row?

ZOS should hire this guy as project leader.

Nifty2g · March 2016

ahem

As someone who has been here since beta, i can understand where Fengrush is coming from, I didn't have much to do and I was very excited when this game first came out, there were a lot of issues around but it was incredibly fun and something good to do. The game had no real balance at all, still doesn't really lol

Once I hit veteran rank 1 for the first time, i took a break, there was simply nothing to do, no end game it was just questing, i took a break for about 3 months until Craglorn came out, and that's when I started getting into everything because raids were introduced and it brought players together they were a fun thing to do, hardmode, vdsa and sanctum all came out, there was a huge amount of influx of content all at the same time, it was great more and more players got into it. I'd have to say 1.5 was the best state this game was in, with balance issues here and there it was the most dynamic and fun.

Since then what have we got, 1 trial? a girl the other day said something pretty depressing, that she could have had 2 kids by the time ZOS released a new trial. That's pretty bad when you think about it, and the trials still haven't been increased, we still have low level trials, it's shocking really. We've been asking so much for scaled trials, because there is no content for the competitive players, we have a trial that is incredibly hard to beat and will be for quite some time until they increase the power crawl, so it's going to turn into 1 and done content, once the guilds start downing it, I highly doubt they will keep downing it - no interest.

It's like Maelstrom, we all thought that would have been amazing, I mean the first time clearing that content was so fun, now it's just boring as anything - apart from the last boss, well done on that ZOS, honestly. Most fun I have had is doing that boss them mechanics are very engaging. But everything else is just burn the bosses and then kill adds.

You have literally no idea the impact this has had on the PvE community if you take a look at then and now, you'd be disgusted by how many people have left, and keep leaving. Most of my friends have left this game and they don't plan on coming back, not because they hate it but because of the stubbornness from ZOS to release new content, and scale new content.

We keep getting these Roleplay updates, they are fun sure, but they are just money grabs there really isn't anything in this game right now to make long lasting players like myself stay, i hardly have anything to do. There is literally nothing to do in PvE, so I move to PvP and that is just incredibly unbalanced and laggymess, I have no idea how anyone plays in that, so it's not surprising to me that people leave.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_Finn I'm probably not on your good list, but I urge you guys to rethink your next DLC's, the RP stuff is fun for a few days, it doesn't keep players around, you really need to introduce DLC's that have a long last to them, I could have dropped all 3 of my purchases so far and not be at a loss at all. You should make DLC where players say to each other, you really need to get this, it's important for you to play this game in the long run.

I'm starting to get fairly fed up with the attitudes myself, I'm only really sticking around for the community and the people I have met, but every day 1 of them leaves and gives me less of a reason to stick around if nothing we say as a community is being heard on.

Please scale trials, VDSA was your most craziest and most fun dungeon/trial you have ever put out, you should scale it to keep players around, the grind for gear in there was also incredibly fun and gave people something to do.

I don't see why you can't add stuff like VDSA which honestly is the perfect direction to keep players around - a 2 man arena, 6 man arena, etc etc. Stuff like that keeps people playing for the fun and for the competition.

Parafrost · March 2016

I have come to the understanding that ESO has become as toxic, if not more toxic than League. There shouldn't even be a reason to "painfully" agree with anyone. You either agree or disagree and tell why you agree or disagree. Not state that it is painful for you to agree with what someone is saying. That shows denial. You want this game to succeed but are brushing off players because they are fruitful with their criticism and even hope the game will turn out better. This is not how anyone should act in a mmo, let alone any game. Toxicity has to go. You telling someone to just quit already isnt going to bring in players. You will all soon cry when you notice a lack of players, or even your own friends leave the game just because they see all of the things wrong with the game. This goes towards everyone in this chat. No matter how politely you tell someone to screw off, you are still telling them to screw off. I'm a big fan of elder scrolls games, and this game just makes me want to shove my head into a wall everytime i play it. The community in this game doesn't welcome new players, since if you are new you will most likely not even get a group, i've experienced this on ps4 where ppl started banning me from the party because im not vr16. There are some terrible vr16s in this game that can't outdps a vr1. In conclusion, the community needs to stop with the toxicity or else the game will plummet even further. Now that consoles have a pretty decent mmo AND a moba to play, theres not much reason to even play this game unless you are not a fan of shooters, like me.

Edit: i respect those that are atleast forthright with their disagreements and do so in a non toxic way. This is how debates on patches should be, not "oh you are a complainer, go away. no one wants you here anyways. just quit already."

waterfairy · March 2016

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Hardcore people burn through 3 months of development in three days and then complain they have nothing to do for months.

This sums it up in a nutshell. They race to the top then whine that there's nothing to do once they're there. If you slow down and simply play the game instead of just focusing on the end game then there you'll have a much better time and plenty of content along the way. If you race to the treasure then you'll miss the gold along the road.