What have you done to weaving?

Grimlok_S

BohnT2 wrote: »

Since the patch dropped you can no longer cancel light attacks, it's completely off and feels ridicouly broken.
Please fix this as fast as possible

Yes, finally! All animations are cheat and should be cancel.
Light attacks forever!!

xAarionx

I can get 0,83 LA/sec in a 164 avarenge ping.
and I realise that i CAN actually get better
I have friends who can actually hit 0,95 avarenge with 200+ latency

So Blaming Ping on your low LA/sec ratio is completly nonsensicall

It's not even lack of hability, it's the laziness of spend half an hour practincing on a dummy,....
Seriously, it's a muscle memory hability, anyone will get with practice...
(And before saying, I'm almost a casual... I played a Little more during th pandemic, But when I got called back to work I don't have much time play. And I say you just have to spent a few minutes of gameplay practicing to get at least decent of weaving)

Gilvoth

Stinkyremy wrote: »

BohnT2 wrote: »

it's completely off and feels ridicouly broken.

DFon't you mean they finally fixed it!???
Light attack animation cancelling ect is an unintende bug of the engine that they ran with and then even adde3d it to the mechanics of the game.
It is a bug in itself.

yes, your correct, and it is now fixed.
i for one vote that it stays, its much better this way, and its a Great step in the right direction.

VoidCommander

colossalvoids wrote: »

Seems like not a result of their changes but probably a form of lag or unintended bug that went through as on pts it's impossible to distinguish actually bugs from lag at times.

I do agree that it seems to be lag related.

Gilvoth

Grimlok_S wrote: »

BohnT2 wrote: »

Since the patch dropped you can no longer cancel light attacks, it's completely off and feels ridicouly broken.
Please fix this as fast as possible

Yes, finally! All animations are cheat and should be cancel.
Light attacks forever!!

well said, it needs to stay this way.
all we can do is hope that it stays and they build more onto it to keep it for the other problems we have in this situation to better the pvp mechanics in eso.

Cloudless

Gilvoth wrote: »

Stinkyremy wrote: »

BohnT2 wrote: »

it's completely off and feels ridicouly broken.

DFon't you mean they finally fixed it!???
Light attack animation cancelling ect is an unintende bug of the engine that they ran with and then even adde3d it to the mechanics of the game.
It is a bug in itself.

yes, your correct, and it is now fixed.
i for one vote that it stays, its much better this way, and its a Great step in the right direction.

I can't believe you're seriously calling a bug that causes skills to not fire at all, or fire twice in a row, or not proc, or desync... a "fix".
Have you even tried playing lately? Because I can assure you the issue most people are reporting isn't about light attacks not being canceled anymore, it's about skills not working properly.

idk

stevusbeefus wrote: »

Tannus15 wrote: »

VilniusNastavnik wrote: »

Please do not fix this. I stopped playing at Murkmire as it became impossible to compete in end game content as every man [Snip] demanded 100K DPS which is borderline impossible for us Oceanic players who sit on 200-300 ping. Weaving was the straw that broke the camels back for me. I have been looking to return but with the mechanics still catering to low ping players..

[Edited for inappropriate content]

I'm in Melbourne.



Stop blaming your latency. My guild is full of oceanic players with griffon heart, immortal redeemer, TTT, vet DLC trifectas.

[Removed quote]

The reality is in every MMORPG there is a big difference in attitude towards improving one's gameplay between the raiders that clear the most challenging level of raids with the greatest of ease vs the next tier of player and there is really nothing wrong with any group.

@Atropos (who probably has notifications turned off since he has not played ESO in years) wisely said he limited the number of players in his founding guild because there is a big difference between the top 25 players and the next 25 players and again with the next 25. His guild has goals and they set the standards based on those goals. Every well-led guild has its own standards to help the guild meet their goals.

emilyhyoyeon

honestly I'm just worried about the fact that it still says ''investigating'' next to the weaving bug in the pinned bug thread instead of fix being tested or working on a fix or whatever

ZOS_Volpe

Greetings,

We've removed several inappropriate and baiting comments. This is a friendly reminder that comments need to adhere to our Community Rules. Please note that derailing a thread with off-topic or baiting comments will result in the thread being closed.

Thank you for your understanding.

danno8

Thanks to this bug I can now disguise a full channel of Sweeps and it will land as one giant burst on my opponents. Just have to use Degeneration before hand.

stevusbeefus

danno8 wrote: »

Thanks to this bug I can now disguise a full channel of Sweeps and it will land as one giant burst on my opponents. Just have to use Degeneration before hand.

it just works

Kingslayer513

ArchMikem wrote: »

Vlad9425 wrote: »

Nyladreas wrote: »

Vlad9425 wrote: »

asuitandtyb14_ESO wrote: »

Nice! I might actually play the game now if this is intended.

Have fun playing on your own

Pretty damn sure there have always been more posts and requests to "nerf" animation cancelling over the years, than there were to support it.

So... not really.

Pretty damn sure bad players want everything that kills them nerfed or removed so we shouldn’t be catering to these people.

Calling people who don't like exploiting unintended mechanics, "bad".

Kingslayer513 wrote: »

Scion_of_Yggdrasil wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Scion_of_Yggdrasil wrote: »

ZarkingFrued wrote: »

Lol at the amount of players here who think Light attack weaving being bugged is somehow going to help them be better at the game. ZOS listening to these people has utterly destroyed a good game in the course of about 2 years.

Listening to the insecure, toxic player base has been destroying this game for years.

Yes, that applies to the anti-animation cancellers who have been playing a game with systems they despised for 6+ years now and insist that what has been officially recognized as a game feature - regardless of when - is a bug.

Quit spreading propaganda to support your narrative. They "accepted" it because they gave up trying to fix it. It was unintentional. Always has been. Always will be.

I love when people who don't have a technical background push these exaggerated fictions. Light attacks are on a separate cooldown than abilities. That's it. This isn't some insurmountable debug task that ZOS can't puzzle out. It's a design choice. It would be trivial to put light attacks on the same 1s global cooldown as all the other abilities, which would remove light attack weaving. ZOS doesn't want to do that. Light attack weaving is intentional. End of story.

That is literally false. You're taking a narrative that supports the believers of one side of the debate and calling it fact. (That "end of story" bit at the end there is also telling). If you've been here for the game's lifetime then you should know and accept that Animation Canceling is, seriously, a bona fide, by definition, mechanic exploit. Simply being able to cancel an animation itself is unintended. Or else, why even create an Animation if the game lets you skip it? "Weaving" is just the community's label for exploiting a combat bug that ZOS refuses to fix. Whether the reason is they can't, which now seems not true as this "issue" wouldn't be a thing, or they just don't want to anymore, mostly because of the uproar that is this thread from players that love fast paced combat.

Regardless, those of us saying that Animation Canceling is an exploit aren't lying. By definition it's a legitimate bug. It's just an officially sanctioned bug now. Even if it's allowed we won't forget or rewrite what it really is.

This post is so full of logical fallacies, I don't even know where to begin.

I've been playing since early 2015, and in that time I've seen ZOS make a myriad of changes and updates directly and explicitly in support of animation canceling and light attack weaving. And at the risk of being accused of condescension, I think that clearly you've never been a part of software development before because of you were you'd know that this happens all the time, a first pass at software will contain previously unintended features/nuances that are actually quite nice, end up being embraced by the dev team and expanded upon henceforth. No one in their right mind would continue till the end of time claiming that something embraced in full, developed, and expanded upon is nonetheless an unintended exploit of the software. That's just not how it works. You might say it was originally unintended and subsequently incorporated, sure. None of this necessitates sticking your head in the sand and calling it an exploit after years of development to support this feature.

And BTW, instant cast execution of abilities is a design choice and the reason why you can ani cancel those abilities. The server receives your instruction upon activation, meanwhile the client (your game) renders an animation based on the current data it has. An alternative design choice might be to make all abilities cast time with durations matching the animation length to eliminate animation canceling (you can still cancel, but won't receive the effect). ZOS knows all this, and thankfully has decided not to go that route for the sake of enjoyable combat.

xAarionx

I'll say it
I'm not playing right now becouse of this (and the speed bug and the werewolf bug)

the combat seems completly Off, I can't get the combos that I used prior to this propperlly, andwhen I do they just, don't connect right, it's really, I don't know the right word for that, it's not annoying, ity's just strange... Like some OCD side of mine don't like the wway the skills are not connecting so smothly with each other. Gives me the shivers....
it really hit's me de wrong way the time between a LA and a cristal Shard cast on sorc for exemple.

Also, Combat weaving and Rotation are the only things that make eso combat more dynamic and not just a coninuous spam of skills one after another.

I wouldn't say it's just bad, it's, I don't know, everything feels off place

Oreyn_Bearclaw

danno8 wrote: »

Thanks to this bug I can now disguise a full channel of Sweeps and it will land as one giant burst on my opponents. Just have to use Degeneration before hand.

@danno8

Do we have a current list of skills causing this? As far as I can tell, Daedric Prey is doing the same thing as degen. Once you cast, you freeze for second, than sort of rubber band forward. It makes parsing next to impossible as it totally throws of your rotation, but I also see the potential for abuse as you stated.

Also, I can't imagine how anybody thinks that combat feels better this patch. It boggles the mind. Weaving my not have been intended at the beginning, but its been fully endorsed and anyone with an ounce of skill realizes how much better it makes combat. It is why ESO combat is superior to virtually any other MMO. People just need to stop the nonsense already.. You know what else wasnt intended? Penicillin, but that turned out to be pretty great as well.

I am not playing until this is fixed, and if not fixed soon, I am protesting my sub that I just repurchased.

Jolsyf

Gilvoth wrote: »

Stinkyremy wrote: »

BohnT2 wrote: »

it's completely off and feels ridicouly broken.

DFon't you mean they finally fixed it!???
Light attack animation cancelling ect is an unintende bug of the engine that they ran with and then even adde3d it to the mechanics of the game.
It is a bug in itself.

yes, your correct, and it is now fixed.
i for one vote that it stays, its much better this way, and its a Great step in the right direction.

I take it you have never used the skill elemental weapon, you literally can't use this skill without weaving light atacks, it does just refunds your magicka without doing a damn thing... There a few others like wrecking blow (40% boost to the next light atack) and the nightblade bow to name a few, how would you use those skills without doing skill + light atack + skill + light atack? I'm simply failing to understand how hard it is to do a light atack follow up with a skill.

Btw do you use a bow on your backbar? Let's say you cast endless hail, you cast it and let the animation of your character lowering his arms to standard position before swapping to your main bar? I'm gonna place a huge bet that the answer is no, because its a long animation than can be "canceled" because the skill was fired but the character still have some animation to play. The way everyone does is cast endless and imedietly swaps.

This is the easiest example I can think of, this isn't some MMO that you have to press 1 buttom (wait animation) press second buttom (wait for animation) like WoW but more of a combo system where you can light atack + follow up skill and maybe even bash if you are skilled. That's the name of the game, it takes skill, just like a fighting game, and just like a fighting game, theres ppl to complain that it is too hard and they should just make auto combos (like in Fighters Z).

danno8

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

danno8 wrote: »

Thanks to this bug I can now disguise a full channel of Sweeps and it will land as one giant burst on my opponents. Just have to use Degeneration before hand.

@danno8

Do we have a current list of skills causing this? As far as I can tell, Daedric Prey is doing the same thing as degen. Once you cast, you freeze for second, than sort of rubber band forward. It makes parsing next to impossible as it totally throws of your rotation, but I also see the potential for abuse as you stated.

Also, I can't imagine how anybody thinks that combat feels better this patch. It boggles the mind. Weaving my not have been intended at the beginning, but its been fully endorsed and anyone with an ounce of skill realizes how much better it makes combat. It is why ESO combat is superior to virtually any other MMO. People just need to stop the nonsense already.. You know what else wasnt intended? Penicillin, but that turned out to be pretty great as well.

I am not playing until this is fixed, and if not fixed soon, I am protesting my sub that I just repurchased.

As far as I know just the two skills you mention. There is a bug report for Daedric Prey in the bug section, and I added to that thread about Degeneration.

FangOfTheTwoMoons

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vlad9425 wrote: »

Nyladreas wrote: »

Vlad9425 wrote: »

asuitandtyb14_ESO wrote: »

Nice! I might actually play the game now if this is intended.

Have fun playing on your own

Pretty damn sure there have always been more posts and requests to "nerf" animation cancelling over the years, than there were to support it.

So... not really.

Pretty damn sure bad players want everything that kills them nerfed or removed so we shouldn’t be catering to these people.

Animation Canceling is a Bug, an exploit and if you rely an exploit to get kills then do you even have any actual skills?

By that logic you should be able to weave perfectly. Since ya know, its takes no skill.

I doubt you can though. If you could, you wouldn't have even commented saying what you said.

HEIIMS

How can you complain about a game where you have 6 keybinds for skills, 6 Kevin, let that sink in, in other games you have more keybinds for consumables alone. The most complex rotation in ESO would be what you'd do at lvl 20 in other mmos. So many pugs crying about "exploiters" or animation cancelling just because they're incapable or too insecure to replicate it, you just don't understand core mechanics of ESO combat if you think these absolutely borked animations we have right now are killing animation cancelling. Right now you can hide 5 ability casts behind 3 animations. In a places like Cyrodiil that might become even more of a problem since that place is already full of various types of desyncs. One thing you're right about tho, people who farm you at keeps and resources are "carried" by animation cancelling, a valuable skill they developed, which you chose to ignore. And that is not going anywhere, even if zos decides to completely remove it you'll still get farmed by the same faster/smarter players, so I'm really not sure what are you trying to prove. Thing is, the game is a hell hole right now, with things not working as they should, maybe that'll get fixed on Monday, maybe we'll have an even bigger mess. At least for once they aknowledged the problem right away instead of 2 patches later.

Vayln_Ninetails

Invisible22 wrote: »

I can see a 1-2 sec light attack delay whenever i cast degeneration.If i keep my rotation the same without casting degeneration at all it feels just a tiny bit clunkier...for me at least it only happens whenever i cast degen.

To me cancelling animations with light attacks is very clunky.

Glad they patched this """feature""" and good riddance!

derpy_cat1234

I think this thread is evidence enough why the floor will forever be stationary while the ceiling will always go up regardless of the changes. Everyone out here telling their life stories or googling the definition of "exploit" like we are playing the grammar police... I wish every single one of these people included what exactly la weaving is stopping them from currently achieving cause im really curious. Like what,are you not killing overland mobs fast enough? Is the 20% dps increase from weaving really what's stopping you from getting godslayer? Do you even want/need godslayer? I am willing to bet, me and my guild can clear all trial hms without weaving except maybe narvii portal hm so what exactly is the issue here? Is it a matter of principle? Like you saw one guy 5 years ago kinda agree with you so now you discard all evidence that don't support your world view and just keep repeating the same thing?

Its already confirmed that this change is unintended. Move on. If you hate a core(at this point) gameplay mechanic so much just go play something else or just continue playing like you already are and accept the MASSIVE,GAMEBREAKING,ABSURD dps loss of about 20-25%

JinMori

What i can see is basically that animations overlap, they didn't remove animation cancelling or weaving at all fortunately, and they never will so stop asking.

ZOS_GinaBruno

Hey everyone, just to follow up on this, we have a fix for this issue scheduled to go out with our next incremental patch, which is currently scheduled for November 16.

xAarionx

JinMori wrote: »

What i can see is basically that animations overlap, they didn't remove animation cancelling or weaving at all fortunately, and they never will so stop asking.

Thats enough to make me really annoyed when playing....

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey everyone, just to follow up on this, we have a fix for this issue scheduled to go out with our next incremental patch, which is currently scheduled for November 16.

Lol, my Birthday
Not that anyone cares.... u.u

Sylvermynx

Also my brother's and my sister in law's.... kind of a not great day in my book (because I can't stand either of them - you I don't know, so I'll give you the benefit of the doubt). I guess this thing isn't hotfixable, so while I'm actually not having any issues myself, it sucks that those who are having issues have to wait on stadia for the fix.

Azorean

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey everyone, just to follow up on this, we have a fix for this issue scheduled to go out with our next incremental patch, which is currently scheduled for November 16.

Thank you Stadia for this 2-week downtime!

2 weeks playing like this. You guys want to lose players because atm is impossible to do good trial runs or even push anything. I guess Craglorn is back on the list...

JinMori

xAarionx wrote: »

JinMori wrote: »

What i can see is basically that animations overlap, they didn't remove animation cancelling or weaving at all fortunately, and they never will so stop asking.

Thats enough to make me really annoyed when playing....

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey everyone, just to follow up on this, we have a fix for this issue scheduled to go out with our next incremental patch, which is currently scheduled for November 16.

Lol, my Birthday
Not that anyone cares.... u.u

Not denying that it's super annoying.

MurderMostFoul

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey everyone, just to follow up on this, we have a fix for this issue scheduled to go out with our next incremental patch, which is currently scheduled for November 16.

Can console get this fix with the 11/10 update? Or will we have to wait for several weeks?

@ZOS_GinaBruno

jristaub17_ESO

I don't see how a ping of 200-300ms should have anything to do with limiting someone's DPS. You cannot spit out skills full throttle anyway, because there is an intrinsic 1s "cooldown" for all of them anyway (i.e. if you attack with the same skill more frequently than every 1 second, you will only get the damage from them approximately every 1 second). You have to time your skills to be 1 second apart (or as close too, without being under) in order to get maximum damage.

Tossing out a light attack in between skills simply uses up the "empty space" between skills, since there is no cooldown on light attacks. This is how weaving works. It is not about being as fast as possible, or so fast that a 300ms ping might actually impact your DPS. It is about effectively utilizing the cooldown on every skill that exists, and tossing out an attack between skills to make sure you are doing damage when you cannot do damage with a skill.

THAT is where weaving comes from. Weaving isn't really about canceling animations. Canceling just sort of happens when you toss out those light attacks, to fill in the time until your next skill. Getting GOOD at that weave, so that you can keep your skills as close to 1 second apart, without actually activating skills more frequently than 1 second, and WEAVING those light attacks and skills together as tightly as you can in those 1 second intervals, is how you maximize your DPS.

So, 300ms? That is 1/3rd of a second, not even. That should not have any truly meaningful impact on what DPS you can achieve. Maximizing your DPS takes practice and skill with timing your skills and light attacks. It takes good dexterity in your fingers, skill with a controller or kb/mouse, as well. I am never quite able to maximize my DPS, because I just can't make my fingers work that well. I'm always around 1.2 seconds on my weave. Its better than always accidentally hitting skills more frequently than 1s, but not as good as if I could get closer to 1 second.

idk

Vayln_Ninetails wrote: »

Invisible22 wrote: »

I can see a 1-2 sec light attack delay whenever i cast degeneration.If i keep my rotation the same without casting degeneration at all it feels just a tiny bit clunkier...for me at least it only happens whenever i cast degen.

To me cancelling animations with light attacks is very clunky.

Glad they patched this """feature""" and good riddance!

@Vayln_Ninetails

Have you read the Known Issues Zos has linked at the top of every forum page? Zos already has a fix scheduled for the unintended change to basic attack weaving. They clearly stated that this problem created with this update was not intended.

JinMori

idk wrote: »

Vayln_Ninetails wrote: »

Invisible22 wrote: »

I can see a 1-2 sec light attack delay whenever i cast degeneration.If i keep my rotation the same without casting degeneration at all it feels just a tiny bit clunkier...for me at least it only happens whenever i cast degen.

To me cancelling animations with light attacks is very clunky.

Glad they patched this """feature""" and good riddance!

@Vayln_Ninetails

Have you read the Known Issues Zos has linked at the top of every forum page? Zos already has a fix scheduled for the unintended change to basic attack weaving. They clearly stated that this problem created with this update was not intended.

Let a man dream!

Anyway, this argument is getting ridiculous, there are forms of animation cancelling in basically any game, if you want combat to feel unresponsive, well we could try to patch out ac, i assure to all of these people, it's not gonna work out well.

Also, removing weaving would leave eso combat very barren, you do not have cds, or anything really in this game, you only have skills that are either instant or with a cast time, remove ac, and it's gonna be super boring.