[Class Reps] Meeting Notes - June 7

ZOS_GinaBruno

Below you'll find the topic points we discussed with the Class Reps during our meeting yesterday. The main goal was to have them to present the biggest pain points and concerns for each class, which we'll be digesting and taking into consideration for any future changes. This is not a list of everything that will be changing, and may not include every piece of feedback that was received. Again, they were asked only to focus on the biggest pain points from the community at large.

Dragonknights

• Coagulating Blood and passive problems. Coagulating Blood is a good heal, but it’s secondary effect of major fortitude is often redundant and doesn’t feel useful enough for the cost of the skill.
• Some DK passives feel underwhelming like Elder Dragon and World in Ruin.
• PvP players feel overly reliant on Sword & Board and Vampire archetypes. Would like a bit more mobility. Adding a short snare immunity (2 seconds) on Wings might make non-vampire option attractive.
• Stamina Dragonknights don’t feel like Dragonknights. They were really strong prior in PvE because heavy attacks were strong, now that technique isn’t as good. Also there’s a feeling the stamina DKs don’t get much out of the class as some passives like World in ruin offer little value to them. Molten Armaments offers what they want but is the “wrong” buff.
• Several concerns were brought up for Magicka DK:
  • Power Lash misses a lot
  • Burning Breath cone also misses target. Noxious breath (stam morph) good for PvP, not as much for PvE.
  • Sustain needs help
  • Not wanted for melee DPS
• Key abilities like Flame Lash, Burning Breath and Burning embers feel clunky to use (different ranges, cone not hitting hit boxes, et al)

Nightblades

• The Cloak-Detect play-counterplay is too extreme. Either cloak is *really* strong if a player can disappear with impunity or is *really* weak when the player can not disappear at all and their main skill feels useless. Need more of a middle ground.
• Obvious/bad morph choices that limit diversity. Debilitate, Power Extraction, and Manifestation of Terror for example. Also, some morphs have good ideas but need a bit more. Dark Cloak is a good heal, but minor protection buff is too short for example
• Incapacitating Strike. Seen as an overloaded and does too much. Reverting original mechanic of stunning when target has higher health was a popular opinion.
• Some Nightblades have indicated some non-cloak defense options would help when they do get marked or detect potted.
• Nightblades dominate as DPS, but underperform as tanks pigeonhole them and limit diversity
  • The “sap” tank playstyle, for instance, is no longer possible
• Some players would rather have Agony back than Malevolent Offering.

Sorcerers

• Mobile themed class doesn’t feel mobile. Bolt Escape “whiplash” effect, losing momentum especially up/down hills. Very susceptible to snares/roots. Class should be able to kite better
• Pets in PvP. Hard to control/die/have a mind of their own. Steals buffs from players. Paradox in a way, because in duels a “zookeeper” Sorcerer is a nightmare to fight (especially now they can cast them while CC immune). The more chaotic PvP gets, pets quickly lose their usefulness.
• The post Crystal Frag version has lost a lot of what was once a defining feature. Sorcerer now feel formulaic and boring, especially now that dual wield isn’t really a thing. Destro Reach sorcerers are cookie-cutter and require specific reward weapon, rune cage auto stun while meteor drops feels cheap and is certainly unsatisfying for the target.
• Stamina based sorcerers are unhappy they don’t feel much they get much out of the class as Hurricane is the only damage ability they used.
  • The idea of a stamina Air Atronach morph (ala Ra Kotu from Hel Ra) was mentioned by several people.
  • Also a number of sorcerer passives don’t help the Stamina sorcerer
• Sustain in PvE is a pain point. Dark Deal is hard to fit on a sorcerer bar for to remain competitive DPS
  • Wrobel questioned “Is lack of bar space because Sorcerer has too many good abilities?”
  • Yes and no. Sorcerer has good abilities, but must slot them to play well. For example, Sorcerer and Nightblade both have +8 % magicka boosts, sorcerer needs to slot a skill that does no damage, the Nightblade does not. Also Pets take up dead bar spots
• Masel’s chart has 46% of concern pet-oriented. Aside from boss fights that preclude pets (like Mage in AA), the Twilight tormentor morph was seen as particularly weak and the Clannfear too expensive for taking up two skills and dies to mechanics.

Templars

• Offensive skills are too awkward/impractical/just not very good. Solar Barrage cast time ruins flows of nice DPS rotation. Radiant Destruction execute is a DPS loss. Sweeps channel is long, doesn’t make some DPS rotations, hard to hit targets in PVP.
• Poor stamina management. Makes tanking hard. Makes a long DPS rotation against bosses unsustainable.
  • Repentance needs actual corpses and an enemy not to repent them first. Causes arguments with allies in Teamspeak who gets to use the skill.
• Rune Focus and more generally the “House.” Having to cast and recast an armor buff that doesn’t actually do anything exciting every 8 seconds is frustrating. “House” is too hard to manage because mechanics in PvP and PvE compel movement and healing nerfs make “stand your ground” unmanageable.
• Radial Sweep ultimate. Both morphs. Just not very good. Range is too short, damage is too low, often misses, other non-class ultimates are better/more versatile.
• Only class without a pro-active/preventative defense (no more blinding flashes, no reflect, no non-health scaling shields, etc.) has led to PvP archetype nobody like: the “Healbot” who holds block with sword and shield and hits Breath of Life
• Templar CC is seen as lacking and no AoE root make tanking hard and slow class feel slower
  • Shards not CCing still a sore spot
  • Eclipse CCs enemies without CCing them; ability can sometimes feel worthless vs experienced players
• There is a feeling that a lot of Templar passives are situational, restrictive, or weak.

Wardens

• The Bear. People like it. People are frustrated with how the Warden (good) DPS is so tied to it that when the Bear dies/can’t be controlled/takes up an AoE ultimate option, they feel let down by it. Bear getting CCed a lot was brought up several times.
  • Console players say it’s hard to control because they have to use heavy attacks
• No class-unique form of CC. Players don’t just want a generic stun ala Destro staff, but something awesome that comes from playing a Warden
• As a DPS, Wardens don’t really offer something unique or interesting to a group. So, if their DPS isn’t top notch, there isn’t really a reason to have them in that role.
• The desire to be an Ice-themed DPS was something that got a lot of mention.
• Players feel that the class has so many buff skills that come at the detriment of good combat options (such as an Ice DoT).
  • Coupled with damage skills that don’t offer Wardens tactical options make playing the class stale and hard in PvP (For example Dive [both morphs] just does damage and Growing Swarm morph seen as weak).
• Warden players feel as though some obvious needs have been neglected (non-Bear Magicka DPS, the lack of class CC).

Tanks

• Dragonknights are great tanks, but some tank players feel “forced” to play them rather than say a Warden tank because the Engulfing Flames buff is deemed necessary
  • Wrobel Question: “Why can’t a DK DPS provide this?
  • They can, but magicka DPS is seen as undesirable because this means taking a spot away from a stamina NB, which offers so much more.
  • It’s not an easy problem to solve as we would *like* classes to offer unique things to groups. This issue is when only the DK tanks offers something awesome and none of the other 4 classes offer some alternative awesome thing.
• The Hardened Armor morph is undesirable as the little shield is gone almost immediately after activation.
• Tanks want to aid the group, but the current mechanics of group buffs 1) limit to only 6 players and 2) continue to only hit the same 6 players upon further activations (it’s the old purge bug)
  • My PvP group tested this just last night. A DK igneous weapon only ever hits 6 people in our group and it’s always the same 6 players. Upon this realization, our DK immediately unslotted Igneous Weapons.
• Hit Boxes/lack or reliable means of targeting. Hit boxes are big, this is nice for DPS, but makes it really hard for tanks to taunt/target dangerous adds. The Asylum Sanctorium Saint Llothis for example hides behind a huge Dragon and even if it’s tab-targeted, he’s hard to taunt and interrupt.
• Lack of Gear Diversity. The Ebon / Alkosh combination is still seen as better than anything offered since.
• Templar and Nightblades stamina management

Healers

• Often don’t feel needed. Tank + 3 DPS is seen as more efficient and higher scoring.
• A lot of new Healer toys/mechanics just offer heals, but healers also want to buff their group. For example, the new Cinderstrom Dragonknight morph offers a nice heal, but the skill is really expensive, the area is really small, and doesn’t offer anything to allies except heals that might not even be needed.
• DPS dominates gameplay and when players have enough of it to skip mechanics, healers do not feel part of the team. Relegated to side-kicks
• Healers would like some class identity. People trust templars because they bring something recognizable to raid. What does a sorcerer bring?
• The Force Siphon (both morphs) is seen as “wrong” because everything it provides can be acquired elsewhere more efficiently
  • The double resto staff healer for example is viewed with suspicion
• PvP line of sight checks are too punishing. Small boxes and branches act as impenetrable walls.

Non-class/role related issues

• Defile is very strong.
  • Defile is necessary but it’s very accessible and too easily applied and reapplied:
  • Wrobel Question: Can this be countered by Healing stars in Champion system?
  • It’s hard. Befoul scales a lot better. Befoul in Green tree means players can damage and defile at same time..
  • We talked that it was fine for a player to spec specifically for defile and being strong/effective, but it’s too easy to be an effective defiler without really trying.
  • Unhealthy consequence: players a re forced to build tanky and inexperienced player get deleted.
• More synergies. It was mentioned that there was no need to bring a magicka sorcerer into a competitive raid environment *except* the Conduit synergy. So, more synergies mean more reasons to use perceived non-meta classes. Nightblades, for instance, don’t offer a synergy. It’s not a big deal now because they are DPS meta, but a NB healer is out of luck. Also, before this patch DKs felt unwanted in PvP raids. Now, with the synergy change, DKs feel they make legit contributions with all the synergies they offer. It’s a win-win.
• Some synergies are too finicky. The Trapping Webs synergy from undaunted requires a range and angle that is so narrow it‘s too hard to activate it. Nova, an ultimate that players already feel is too expensive and overshadowed by Warhorn needs to have it’s synergy activated and players can’t do this without moving to the absolute center.
• Sload’s set. On its own and in isolation it’s not too bad. Coupled with things like a defile Set, a Zaan Proc, and a no CP environment it’s too much. Also, this set raises the overall toxicity in PvP because of its perception which I’d argue is a bigger concern than balance (seriously, I average 1 hate tell every 3-4 MONTHS. I got 4 in a single night just using this set).
• Content for anything between 4 and 12 players is desired by many, because 12 is hard to organize and 4 is too little for many groups of friends, would also bring new group compositions.
• Heavy armor still seen as more desirable for PvP, especially for stamina builds. The idea of moving the critical hit passive from the Champion tree to the Light and Medium armor skills was floated around.
• If you are a “stamina” player, there is little distinction between the classes as weapon abilities are predominate. Only the Nightblade feels like a fluid from a stamina perspective. We mused about how some lesser used abilities like the DK Obsidian Shard could be used to help create more of a unique stamina class identity.
• Mobility came up as pain points for three classes (sorcerers, DKs, Templars) and are seen as particularly punishing vs. magicka
  • This perhaps is less an issue with classes as the snare system needs reform
  • Wrobel question: “Does the new Psijic Skills help?”
  • They do, but it’s still a pain point for several reasons
    • Major expedition does not remove snares like Shuffle/Forward Momentum or Mist Form.
    • The Channeled Acceleration has a cast-time (bashable, you’re slower at the time you want most to be faster). The Race Against Time Morph duration is really short.
    • Mist Form is still a lot better because nothing can stop a player from going to point A to point B and gets 75% mitigation to boot.
• More Group oriented passives: They are something that gives what many players want, identity to their class and the feeling they are offering something useful to their group/team.

The following was not discussed during the meeting as we ran out of time, but notes were forwarded to the Dev Team afterwards:

Werewolves

• What werewolves DO NOT want
  • To become overpowered. They realize they teeter on the line.
  • To get the best dps or to become meta, or even to get directly competitive dps. They don’t want a werewolf in every group. Werewolves like feeling special and needing to exert greater effort to achieve the same or even just shy of the same results in PvE.
  • Large, sweeping reworks or changes to core mechanics.
  • For Hircine’s Bounty to scale off of stamina/weapon damage OR to cost stamina. To make it cost stamina would pressure their sustain too much. Stam sustain is already tough on werewolves. And to make it scale off of physical stats would eliminate the hybrid leaning of werewolf builds, turning werewolf build patterns into a mirror of the rest of the stamina meta and requiring damage nerfs to compensate the new builds. For example, Pelinal’s + Fury + 2 Kena (a common build and Caius’ current favorite) would become Fury + Seventh Legion + 2 Kena. Werewolves like their hybridy build patterns the way they are. Do you want to fight a werewolf with 1k more weapon damage than they already have?
• What werewolves DO want
  • Roar to cost magicka. It’s a utility spell.
  • To be a legitimate and playable choice that can somewhat compete with other builds for PvE dps. The werewolf community is split on whether they should be able to tank or not.
  • Quality of life fixes and bug fixes. They want to be updated to the current state of the game.
  • More uptime in werewolf form. Potentially a way to add time to their werewolf form actively, such as by dealing damage or casting werewolf abilities. This might enable werewolf dps in trials where tanks hold aggro, werewolf RP, and running for long distances between fights. When asked if werewolves being able to permawolf would necessarily be perceived as a bad thing, I didn’t really get pushback from werewolves or non-werewolf players alike. Many were unsure if they would like werewolves maintaining werewolf form outside of combat, though. Werewolves want to play as werewolves without necessarily having to worry about taking damage, pouncing on things, or looking for Devour synergies.
  • More support for pack or group play, such as synergies, cross healing, or unique buffs.
• Top quality of life concerns
  • Can’t res allies
  • Can’t use synergies
  • Can’t sneak
  • Devour synergy requires precise targeting and direct line of sight without other characters in the way, making it clunky and unwieldy to use in fights

Vampires

• Many have requested an option to toggle off vamp appearance
• People consider vampirism incomplete
  • Want more active abilities
  • Want more meaning to vamp stages
  • Want active and deliberate shifting between stages. Want more decision making
  • But people understand that this isn’t a high priority
• Unequal risk/reward between PvE and PvP
  • Dawnbreaker is the main ultimate for ⅗ stamina classes, and fire damage is everywhere. Destro ult + Vicious Death are the main kill tools for large scale play, siege and especially oils are in every keep fight, mDKs deal predominantly fire damage, and this patch has shifted magicka builds more to using fire staves than ever before.
  • PvPers are shifting away from using vamp, as they find it more punishing than beneficial. They don’t consider it “risky” at this point -- it just hurts to be a vamp because the damage types to which you incur weaknesses are so prevalent. The only archetypes which still widely use vamp are gankers, bombers, and immobile magicka things which need mist form to not be pinned down. Gankers and bombers do not really intend to take damage from players, and mDKs and magplars for example get rekt by snares. Magplars can’t realistically spam that purge like people can spam snares, and wings doesn’t have immunity, leaving mDKs pinned back in place as snares are quickly reapplied.

Masel

Dottzgaming

Really love the points brought up across the board. Great work guys, very well done.

NightbladeMechanics

^_^

Minno

It's been a long time since we had a thread like this with consistent and value points.

Good work and first edition of the rep program!!

NightbladeMechanics

Masel92 wrote: »

Reserved for pie charts.

Oh I can’t wait! Masel your data was very helpful and insightful.

Hmm now I want pie..

Bfish22090

solid list

greenmachine

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

[*] Sustain in PvE is a pain point. Dark Deal is hard to fit on a sorcerer bar for to remain competitive DPS

• Wrobel questioned “Is lack of bar space because Sorcerer has too many good abilities?”

I've got a bad feeling about this

Minno

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Masel92 wrote: »

Reserved for pie charts.

Oh I can’t wait! Masel your data was very helpful and insightful.

Hmm now I want pie..

I got you:

usmguy1234

Bravo to the people involved with this!

BohnT

Who made these Stamdk suggestions?
Like really noxious Breath is utter crap, the skill does crappy damage the dot is laughable, it's completely outclassed by shalks.
Also why is there no mention of a stam spammable that's like the number 1 issue that was mentioned in the DK post

code65536

Lack of Gear Diversity. The Ebon / Alkosh combination is still seen as better than anything offered since.

That's a good thing. Not having to regrind for gear for a new tanking meta every patch is such a relief. One of the great perks of tanking, TBH.

Koolio

Good stuff so far.

Btw MNB DW melee also got gutted

Manifestation of terror is amazing right now . Please for the love of tacos( Tried to write Talos but I’ll let that stay)

DO NOT CHANGE THIS MOVE

casparian

code65536 wrote: »

Lack of Gear Diversity. The Ebon / Alkosh combination is still seen as better than anything offered since.

That's a good thing. Not having to regrind for gear for a new tanking meta every patch is such a relief. One of the great perks of tanking, TBH.

Yes and no. Not having to regrind for gear is nice, but the other side of the coin is that you're pigeonholed into just a few possible setups.

OdinForge

greenmachine wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

[*] Sustain in PvE is a pain point. Dark Deal is hard to fit on a sorcerer bar for to remain competitive DPS

• Wrobel questioned “Is lack of bar space because Sorcerer has too many good abilities?”

I've got a bad feeling about this

Rohamad_Ali

Great list ! Thank you class Reps !

technohic

greenmachine wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

[*] Sustain in PvE is a pain point. Dark Deal is hard to fit on a sorcerer bar for to remain competitive DPS

• Wrobel questioned “Is lack of bar space because Sorcerer has too many good abilities?”

I've got a bad feeling about this

Lol it’s a fair question to one degree but the premise of it being possible to have “too many good abilities “. I’d hope to se every class ability to be good and therefore be more good abilities than bar slots.

code65536

code65536 wrote: »

Lack of Gear Diversity. The Ebon / Alkosh combination is still seen as better than anything offered since.

That's a good thing. Not having to regrind for gear for a new tanking meta every patch is such a relief. One of the great perks of tanking, TBH.

Furthermore, despite how good Ebon/Alkosh is, endgame tanks still need a wide variety of gear. My tanks' bags are more full of gear than the bags of my DPS characters. I have Ebon, Alkosh, Torug, Plague, and Dragon, and I need to be able to run them in any combination (e.g., if I run Torug/Alkosh, I need Torug body pieces, but if I run Ebon/Torug, I need Torug weapons, so I end up carrying both body pieces and weapons of Torug around).

Plus there are some less-used niche tanking sets like Livewire (for DSA) or Jorvuld's or SPC (which some groups have the tank use in Asylum).

Yes, for most single-tank content, Ebon/Alkosh is the go-to. But there is a wide diversity and variety of gear for a wide range of situations. Progressing in a new trial? Plague. Maintanking a 2-tank trial that your group is familiar with? You need Torug. Offtanking the Assembly General? Doesn't make sense to have a penetration set, so need something like Jorvuld or Dragon instead.

So there is a lot of gear diversity. Granted, it's all situational diversity. But that seems fine to me.

Derra

The comment about sorcerer barspace and use of darkdeal in pve has destroyed every last bit of hope i had that we´d see something good happening.

Honestly it´s baffling how the lead dev can be so disconnected from one of the classes he should be knowing inside out because that´s his job.

Not only is the thought of using darkdeal in pve absolutely unrealistic in it´s current state because it returns to few resources for one cast, has 1.2s casttime + 0.2s animation delay which disrupts rotation - no most importantly it costs stamina which you don´t have in pve builds and makes no sense to gear for to use a lackluster mechanic in the first place.
That he thinks sorc has too many good abilities is just the mindboggling cherry on top of the cake here. Doublebar magelight + aegis and or pets.
What a freaking sad joke.

I´m hugely disappointed.

Edit: Edited due to hexis clarifying what was said. My point about slotting darkdeal for pve sustain still stands. It´s a little disheartening to read that someone thinks this could even be a valid option at the current state of the game and the ability.

Blobsky

Some good points, some very good points, but also a few deeply concerning points...

1. Mobility came up as pain points for three classes inc Sorc - ?????

2. Some Nightblades have indicated some non-cloak defense options would help when they do get marked or detect potted. Tell me that is AFTER a nerf to cloak (from a guy with 2 grand overlord nightblades...)

3. Pet Buffs I'm not sure how many of these guys have played petsorc, but buffing this playstyle in any way is not a good idea. Once mastered it is extremely strong, people are just generally bad at it. The ONLY real pet issue is the clanfear is attrocious, and all platforms need command AND dismiss options (Both are needed to master the class)

4. No mention of bleeds - ???


Rest looks fine I guess, just don't go with the passive major breach suggestion on magsorc from discords please lord

Masel

BohnT wrote: »

Who made these Stamdk suggestions?
Like really noxious Breath is utter crap, the skill does crappy damage the dot is laughable, it's completely outclassed by shalks.
Also why is there no mention of a stam spammable that's like the number 1 issue that was mentioned in the DK post

It was there and mentioned, seems like it got lost in the notes.

testd4n1

greenmachine wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

[*] Sustain in PvE is a pain point. Dark Deal is hard to fit on a sorcerer bar for to remain competitive DPS

• Wrobel questioned “Is lack of bar space because Sorcerer has too many good abilities?”

I've got a bad feeling about this

In what aspect? I highly doubt they will add more slots as controllers are used to their full potential as is. Everything is mapped.

GatheredMyst

There's a lot of great things here. Awesome feedback.

Only thing i'd be careful with is stuff like this, tho:

"Dragonknights are great tanks, but some tank players feel “forced” to play them rather than say a Warden tank because the Engulfing Flames buff is deemed necessary"

That's player interpretation, not necessarily requirement. It's been an age-old thing in MMO's since I was playing EverQuest. Players will always structure the way that they deem being "optimal", even if it is possible to complete content with "sub-optimal" compositions. Wrobel alluded to this with his response.

Reason I bring that up? If balanced around that interpretation, it can sometimes do more harm than good.

But a lot of the stuff that is mentioned here is quite good.

Rickter

Bravo and well done. EVERYONE deserves a pat on the back for all contributing as a community to get this feedback directly into the hands of ZOS

GandTheImpaler

People are misunderstanding a fair question asked about bar space. When correctly used, questions allow answers to come that you did not possess before. They are also used when trying to clarify something said before. Nobody is perfect and I'd much rather have questions and the attempt to understand rather than silence. These are not transcripts of the entire conversation so let's hop off the hate train.

BohnT

Masel92 wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

Who made these Stamdk suggestions?
Like really noxious Breath is utter crap, the skill does crappy damage the dot is laughable, it's completely outclassed by shalks.
Also why is there no mention of a stam spammable that's like the number 1 issue that was mentioned in the DK post

It was there and mentioned, seems like it got lost in the notes.

but how did 'noxious breath is a good skill in pvp'' made it on the list? the skill is really really bad

casparian

ITT: people taking incomplete notes passed around through multiple sets of hands as complete, courtroom-accurate transcripts of the meeting.

Minyassa

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

[*] More uptime in werewolf form. Potentially a way to add time to their werewolf form actively, such as by dealing damage or casting werewolf abilities. This might enable werewolf dps in trials where tanks hold aggro, werewolf RP, and running for long distances between fights. When asked if werewolves being able to permawolf would necessarily be perceived as a bad thing, I didn’t really get pushback from werewolves or non-werewolf players alike. Many were unsure if they would like werewolves maintaining werewolf form outside of combat, though. Werewolves want to play as werewolves without necessarily having to worry about taking damage, pouncing on things, or looking for Devour synergies.

Yes please!! I, for one, am very sure that I would like werewolves maintaining werewolf form outside of combat. For werewolf RP that's a must. Since they can't do most emotes, even role-players would break form every so often to use those, but it would definitely "feel more werewolfy".

I would also love to see some moon-based passives. We have moon phases in the game, I think it would be neat if a passive got stronger with the full moon(s).

NBrookus

As someone who has played all 5 classes, heal tank and dps, vamp and werewolf... this summary is absolutely awesome. Thank you class reps, ZOS and everyone who contributed.

DeathStalker

casparian wrote: »

ITT: people taking incomplete notes passed around through multiple sets of hands as complete, courtroom-accurate transcripts of the meeting.

It's a shame these meetings can't be recorded and then uploaded to twitch later for all of us to watch.

GandTheImpaler

Blobsky wrote: »

Some good points, some very good points, but also a few deeply concerning points...

1. Mobility came up as pain points for three classes inc Sorc - ?????

2. Some Nightblades have indicated some non-cloak defense options would help when they do get marked or detect potted. Tell me that is AFTER a nerf to cloak (from a guy with 2 grand overlord nightblades...)

3. Pet Buffs I'm not sure how many of these guys have played petsorc, but buffing this playstyle in any way is not a good idea. Once mastered it is extremely strong, people are just generally bad at it. The ONLY real pet issue is the clanfear is attrocious, and all platforms need command AND dismiss options (Both are needed to master the class)

4. No mention of bleeds - ???


Rest looks fine I guess, just don't go with the passive major breach suggestion on magsorc from discords please lord

1. Snares and roots being so prevalent


2. We talked about having a middle ground. So changes rather than nerf or buff. Works either too well or too ***.


3. Pet changes*

4. We talked about them in the same time we talked about defiles seeing as why they are such an issue is due to the lack of healing you have when paired with defile.