Update 44 is now available for testing on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/categories/pts
Maintenance for the week of September 30:
• PC/Mac: NA and EU megaservers for maintenance – September 30, 4:00AM EDT (8:00 UTC) - 8:00AM EDT (12:00 UTC)
• Xbox: NA and EU megaservers for patch maintenance – October 2, 6:00AM EDT (10:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EDT (16:00 UTC)
• PlayStation®: NA and EU megaservers for patch maintenance – October 2, 6:00AM EDT (10:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EDT (16:00 UTC)
• PC/Mac: NA and EU megaservers for maintenance – September 30, 4:00AM EDT (8:00 UTC) - 8:00AM EDT (12:00 UTC)
• Xbox: NA and EU megaservers for patch maintenance – October 2, 6:00AM EDT (10:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EDT (16:00 UTC)
• PlayStation®: NA and EU megaservers for patch maintenance – October 2, 6:00AM EDT (10:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EDT (16:00 UTC)
What happened to " we will track your exp earned " ????( Gina Bruno answered this 12/28/2014)
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global_gbb16_ESO✭✭✭global_gbb16_ESO wrote: »On an additional note, dev teams do not set their own agenda. Whatever they are working towards (i.e. wiping VR2 to VR14 in preparation for CP), it would have been set by management.
.. or some technical issue that has made them realise they can't audit what has been done so far and thus can't appropriate the correct amount of CP back tn people who have gained ranks past VR1. Which if true is ludicrous.
Like i said earlier, they've wasted many months of my work trying to build my characters past VR1 with no prior warning so to hell with ZOS. I'll spend my money elsewhere.
Your statement will only be true if when 1.7 comes to live and the veteran system is removed, ZoS gives no Champion Point compensation for the experience between Vr1 and vr14.
Thanks for your post, however I suspect you may have misread what I posted so please accept my apologies.
The reason I'm angry, I and lots of other good folk (including yourself no doubt) have spent months building up their main and alts way past VR1 and for what? To be told "we're changing the system and by the way anything levelled further than VR1 will count for nothing kthxbai".
The game itself lacks enough content to be fresh after 9 months and then they pull the above stunt.. no thanks.
6 -
Grao✭✭✭✭✭
✭global_gbb16_ESO wrote: »global_gbb16_ESO wrote: »On an additional note, dev teams do not set their own agenda. Whatever they are working towards (i.e. wiping VR2 to VR14 in preparation for CP), it would have been set by management.
.. or some technical issue that has made them realise they can't audit what has been done so far and thus can't appropriate the correct amount of CP back tn people who have gained ranks past VR1. Which if true is ludicrous.
Like i said earlier, they've wasted many months of my work trying to build my characters past VR1 with no prior warning so to hell with ZOS. I'll spend my money elsewhere.
Your statement will only be true if when 1.7 comes to live and the veteran system is removed, ZoS gives no Champion Point compensation for the experience between Vr1 and vr14.
Thanks for your post, however I suspect you may have misread what I posted so please accept my apologies.
The reason I'm angry, I and lots of other good folk (including yourself no doubt) have spent months building up their main and alts way past VR1 and for what? To be told "we're changing the system and by the way anything levelled further than VR1 will count for nothing kthxbai".
The game itself lacks enough content to be fresh after 9 months and then they pull the above stunt.. no thanks.
I definitely understand your point. I am just choosing to believe ZoS will change position for a more agreeable compromise and give us Champion Points to compensate for the loss of the Veteran Rank when that loss actually occur (likely on update 1.7).
Why am I choosing to believe them again? Because I really enjoy this game. True, we are lacking content atm, but that happens with every MMO, specially those starting, and the content we got to play, I at least found very enjoyable, specially the quests and the graphics of the game.
I tried playing WildStar and I just couldn't stand the questing and even WoW's quests are... Bland and very repetitive. I think ESO did a good job disguising their quest progression with little interesting stories, so for now I think I will stick around. Come 1.7, if ZoS frustrates my expectation (that are not even that high) then it will be the time to pack my bags and maybe look over at WoW again.3 -
kelly.medleyb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭global_gbb16_ESO wrote: »global_gbb16_ESO wrote: »On an additional note, dev teams do not set their own agenda. Whatever they are working towards (i.e. wiping VR2 to VR14 in preparation for CP), it would have been set by management.
.. or some technical issue that has made them realise they can't audit what has been done so far and thus can't appropriate the correct amount of CP back tn people who have gained ranks past VR1. Which if true is ludicrous.
Like i said earlier, they've wasted many months of my work trying to build my characters past VR1 with no prior warning so to hell with ZOS. I'll spend my money elsewhere.
Your statement will only be true if when 1.7 comes to live and the veteran system is removed, ZoS gives no Champion Point compensation for the experience between Vr1 and vr14.
Thanks for your post, however I suspect you may have misread what I posted so please accept my apologies.
The reason I'm angry, I and lots of other good folk (including yourself no doubt) have spent months building up their main and alts way past VR1 and for what? To be told "we're changing the system and by the way anything levelled further than VR1 will count for nothing kthxbai".
The game itself lacks enough content to be fresh after 9 months and then they pull the above stunt.. no thanks.
I definitely understand your point. I am just choosing to believe ZoS will change position for a more agreeable compromise and give us Champion Points to compensate for the loss of the Veteran Rank when that loss actually occur (likely on update 1.7).
Why am I choosing to believe them again? Because I really enjoy this game. True, we are lacking content atm, but that happens with every MMO, specially those starting, and the content we got to play, I at least found very enjoyable, specially the quests and the graphics of the game.
I tried playing WildStar and I just couldn't stand the questing and even WoW's quests are... Bland and very repetitive. I think ESO did a good job disguising their quest progression with little interesting stories, so for now I think I will stick around. Come 1.7, if ZoS frustrates my expectation (that are not even that high) then it will be the time to pack my bags and maybe look over at WoW again.
This pretty much sums my attitude up too, I promised myself I'd give them a year and with 3 months to go it's looking promising. If I do leave I will probably come back when everything established and Beta is officially over
1 -
Grao✭✭✭✭✭
✭kelly.medleyb14_ESO wrote: »global_gbb16_ESO wrote: »global_gbb16_ESO wrote: »On an additional note, dev teams do not set their own agenda. Whatever they are working towards (i.e. wiping VR2 to VR14 in preparation for CP), it would have been set by management.
.. or some technical issue that has made them realise they can't audit what has been done so far and thus can't appropriate the correct amount of CP back tn people who have gained ranks past VR1. Which if true is ludicrous.
Like i said earlier, they've wasted many months of my work trying to build my characters past VR1 with no prior warning so to hell with ZOS. I'll spend my money elsewhere.
Your statement will only be true if when 1.7 comes to live and the veteran system is removed, ZoS gives no Champion Point compensation for the experience between Vr1 and vr14.
Thanks for your post, however I suspect you may have misread what I posted so please accept my apologies.
The reason I'm angry, I and lots of other good folk (including yourself no doubt) have spent months building up their main and alts way past VR1 and for what? To be told "we're changing the system and by the way anything levelled further than VR1 will count for nothing kthxbai".
The game itself lacks enough content to be fresh after 9 months and then they pull the above stunt.. no thanks.
I definitely understand your point. I am just choosing to believe ZoS will change position for a more agreeable compromise and give us Champion Points to compensate for the loss of the Veteran Rank when that loss actually occur (likely on update 1.7).
Why am I choosing to believe them again? Because I really enjoy this game. True, we are lacking content atm, but that happens with every MMO, specially those starting, and the content we got to play, I at least found very enjoyable, specially the quests and the graphics of the game.
I tried playing WildStar and I just couldn't stand the questing and even WoW's quests are... Bland and very repetitive. I think ESO did a good job disguising their quest progression with little interesting stories, so for now I think I will stick around. Come 1.7, if ZoS frustrates my expectation (that are not even that high) then it will be the time to pack my bags and maybe look over at WoW again.
This pretty much sums my attitude up too, I promised myself I'd give them a year and with 3 months to go it's looking promising. If I do leave I will probably come back when everything established and Beta is officially over
Yup, a complete change of systems just proves this game was released a little too fast. It is still fun though, even if frustrating when Patches come around
2 -
EQBallzz✭✭✭✭✭
✭global_gbb16_ESO wrote: »global_gbb16_ESO wrote: »On an additional note, dev teams do not set their own agenda. Whatever they are working towards (i.e. wiping VR2 to VR14 in preparation for CP), it would have been set by management.
.. or some technical issue that has made them realise they can't audit what has been done so far and thus can't appropriate the correct amount of CP back tn people who have gained ranks past VR1. Which if true is ludicrous.
Like i said earlier, they've wasted many months of my work trying to build my characters past VR1 with no prior warning so to hell with ZOS. I'll spend my money elsewhere.
Your statement will only be true if when 1.7 comes to live and the veteran system is removed, ZoS gives no Champion Point compensation for the experience between Vr1 and vr14.
Thanks for your post, however I suspect you may have misread what I posted so please accept my apologies.
The reason I'm angry, I and lots of other good folk (including yourself no doubt) have spent months building up their main and alts way past VR1 and for what? To be told "we're changing the system and by the way anything levelled further than VR1 will count for nothing kthxbai".
The game itself lacks enough content to be fresh after 9 months and then they pull the above stunt.. no thanks.
I definitely understand your point. I am just choosing to believe ZoS will change position for a more agreeable compromise and give us Champion Points to compensate for the loss of the Veteran Rank when that loss actually occur (likely on update 1.7).
Why am I choosing to believe them again? Because I really enjoy this game. True, we are lacking content atm, but that happens with every MMO, specially those starting, and the content we got to play, I at least found very enjoyable, specially the quests and the graphics of the game.
I tried playing WildStar and I just couldn't stand the questing and even WoW's quests are... Bland and very repetitive. I think ESO did a good job disguising their quest progression with little interesting stories, so for now I think I will stick around. Come 1.7, if ZoS frustrates my expectation (that are not even that high) then it will be the time to pack my bags and maybe look over at WoW again.
It's cool that you have found justification to continue playing (and paying) based on the *hope* that they current plan will be changed but I don't think I will be doing that. I think some of us don't want to continue investing more time and money into a system that will pull the rug out from under us come 1.7.
If they haven't changed course by the time 1.6 releases and make some kind of clear statements to that effect I think I would rather let my account expire and then just come back later if it turns out they changed their minds for 1.7. Not going to continue throwing good money/time after bad when I have little reason to trust ZOS to do the right thing at this point.3 -
Bouvin✭✭✭✭✭
✭Francescolg wrote: »No one deserves a compensation in CP for endgame content done after reaching VR14! Your time spent the last 4-5 months is worth personal experience! You also had the chance to make new friends!
- Endgame Raiders have their golden items, undaunted skills and the entertaining group-experiences they will nether forget doing all those dungeons!
- Endgame PvP'ers have their decorative PvP-rank and PvP-skills and lots of hours spent in the Horse Simulator 2014, which they can upgrade to the "Farming Simulator" game for even more PvP. They now can spend CP to buy a farmer horse, if they do not have one so far.
- Never do math like: level 50 +14VR +30 CP -14VR +xx CP +10 level (next upgrade) or you will be banned from the game for conspiracy!
It's not the time spent past VR14. It's the time spent past VR1, on all characters you leveled past VR1.
VR1-14 = 2x longer than 1-50.5 -
Grao✭✭✭✭✭
✭global_gbb16_ESO wrote: »global_gbb16_ESO wrote: »On an additional note, dev teams do not set their own agenda. Whatever they are working towards (i.e. wiping VR2 to VR14 in preparation for CP), it would have been set by management.
.. or some technical issue that has made them realise they can't audit what has been done so far and thus can't appropriate the correct amount of CP back tn people who have gained ranks past VR1. Which if true is ludicrous.
Like i said earlier, they've wasted many months of my work trying to build my characters past VR1 with no prior warning so to hell with ZOS. I'll spend my money elsewhere.
Your statement will only be true if when 1.7 comes to live and the veteran system is removed, ZoS gives no Champion Point compensation for the experience between Vr1 and vr14.
Thanks for your post, however I suspect you may have misread what I posted so please accept my apologies.
The reason I'm angry, I and lots of other good folk (including yourself no doubt) have spent months building up their main and alts way past VR1 and for what? To be told "we're changing the system and by the way anything levelled further than VR1 will count for nothing kthxbai".
The game itself lacks enough content to be fresh after 9 months and then they pull the above stunt.. no thanks.
I definitely understand your point. I am just choosing to believe ZoS will change position for a more agreeable compromise and give us Champion Points to compensate for the loss of the Veteran Rank when that loss actually occur (likely on update 1.7).
Why am I choosing to believe them again? Because I really enjoy this game. True, we are lacking content atm, but that happens with every MMO, specially those starting, and the content we got to play, I at least found very enjoyable, specially the quests and the graphics of the game.
I tried playing WildStar and I just couldn't stand the questing and even WoW's quests are... Bland and very repetitive. I think ESO did a good job disguising their quest progression with little interesting stories, so for now I think I will stick around. Come 1.7, if ZoS frustrates my expectation (that are not even that high) then it will be the time to pack my bags and maybe look over at WoW again.
It's cool that you have found justification to continue playing (and paying) based on the *hope* that they current plan will be changed but I don't think I will be doing that. I think some of us don't want to continue investing more time and money into a system that will pull the rug out from under us come 1.7.
If they haven't changed course by the time 1.6 releases and make some kind of clear statements to that effect I think I would rather let my account expire and then just come back later if it turns out they changed their minds for 1.7. Not going to continue throwing good money/time after bad when I have little reason to trust ZOS to do the right thing at this point.
They do need to release a statement regarding what will happen come 1.7, hope will only get me so far. It is hope, not foolishness. ^^2 -
Francescolg wrote: »No one deserves a compensation in CP for endgame content done after reaching VR14! Your time spent the last 4-5 months is worth personal experience! You also had the chance to make new friends!
- Endgame Raiders have their golden items, undaunted skills and the entertaining group-experiences they will never forget doing all those dungeons!
- Endgame PvP'ers have their decorative PvP-rank and PvP-skills and lots of hours spent in the Horse Simulator 2014, which they can upgrade to the "Farming Simulator" game for even more PvP. They now can spend CP to buy a farmer horse, if they do not have one so far.
- Never do math like: level 50 +14VR +30 CP -14VR +xx CP +10 level (next upgrade) or you will be banned from the game for conspiracy!
@Grao: this is why my patience is gone with certain types of people. ZoS is easy to deal with- stop paying them. the ones that chim in with these notions are people that others have to work and play with, in the game. these statements are just SOOO old and played out and they don't even touch the topic at all regarding the VR to CS conversion which this and many threads are about.
not only that, they said they are reevaluating content and gear. so gear can be drastically changed along with the content difficulty. the vr14 golds now, may stay gold, but they can possibly be nerfed or simply grandfathered so that next gear-upgrade cycle may not be upgrades, leaving the second generation of gear upgrades being the only set to boost your character (which might be another year from now). they may change the set bonuses in such a way, that the gold items no longer apply with your play-style, especially since abilities are also being changed. this concept can be applied to the PVP specific sets (if any) as well. however, no one seems to care about the gear or the skill changes; just the experience conversion and rightly so. i sure didn't play a game for faux-life-experiences.
the VR14 "power over the VR1" is only a limited time experience. if you are concerned about that, then tell ZoS that they need to NOT implement the VR system replacement WITH the VR system in place. what they should do/have done is just remove VRs, add within the trees the equivalent attribute/skill points currently available (applying them properly to the current VRs), follow through with the Oct 3rd statement, and install the CS progression. in less time than it took to get VR14 you can get the same attribute points/skill points and invest them sooner to give you the "feel good" equality.
the math equation people are only concerned with is (x) VR exp = (Y) CP exp. no body is interested in anything but the conversion that ZoS changed midstream...I will work. I will save. I will sacrifice. I will endure. I will fight cheerfully and do my utmost, as if the whole issue of the struggle depended on me alone.
Martin A. Treptow
1894-19180 -
Grao✭✭✭✭✭
✭ahstin2001nub18_ESO wrote: »Francescolg wrote: »No one deserves a compensation in CP for endgame content done after reaching VR14! Your time spent the last 4-5 months is worth personal experience! You also had the chance to make new friends!
- Endgame Raiders have their golden items, undaunted skills and the entertaining group-experiences they will never forget doing all those dungeons!
- Endgame PvP'ers have their decorative PvP-rank and PvP-skills and lots of hours spent in the Horse Simulator 2014, which they can upgrade to the "Farming Simulator" game for even more PvP. They now can spend CP to buy a farmer horse, if they do not have one so far.
- Never do math like: level 50 +14VR +30 CP -14VR +xx CP +10 level (next upgrade) or you will be banned from the game for conspiracy!
@Grao: this is why my patience is gone with certain types of people. ZoS is easy to deal with- stop paying them. the ones that chim in with these notions are people that others have to work and play with, in the game. these statements are just SOOO old and played out and they don't even touch the topic at all regarding the VR to CS conversion which this and many threads are about.
not only that, they said they are reevaluating content and gear. so gear can be drastically changed along with the content difficulty. the vr14 golds now, may stay gold, but they can possibly be nerfed or simply grandfathered so that next gear-upgrade cycle may not be upgrades, leaving the second generation of gear upgrades being the only set to boost your character (which might be another year from now). they may change the set bonuses in such a way, that the gold items no longer apply with your play-style, especially since abilities are also being changed. this concept can be applied to the PVP specific sets (if any) as well. however, no one seems to care about the gear or the skill changes; just the experience conversion and rightly so. i sure didn't play a game for faux-life-experiences.
the VR14 "power over the VR1" is only a limited time experience. if you are concerned about that, then tell ZoS that they need to NOT implement the VR system replacement WITH the VR system in place. what they should do/have done is just remove VRs, add within the trees the equivalent attribute/skill points currently available (applying them properly to the current VRs), follow through with the Oct 3rd statement, and install the CS progression. in less time than it took to get VR14 you can get the same attribute points/skill points and invest them sooner to give you the "feel good" equality.
the math equation people are only concerned with is (x) VR exp = (Y) CP exp. no body is interested in anything but the conversion that ZoS changed midstream...
Well, yes. On my post (link in my signature) I mentioned this problem is of ZoS creation. Systems that were never meant to coexist shouldn't be forced to, alas, ZoS needs to test out parts of the Champion System and they don't have a large test server or many official, hired, beta testers.
As for the skill changes, I think that is to be expected. ESO is still a new game, there are abilities that are trully useless, so having those replaced will be good. Having Destro and Resto staff scale from spell power makes perfect sense... So those changes, they worry me because I will need to relearn my class, but at the same time they excite me cause I will have to relearn my class and maybe the new rotations will be nicer. Who knows. (I play a Sorcerer and our rotation can't get more boring then it was)
Finally, but not least at all, changes to gear. That is coming, we all know. Since the veteran ranks are being retired with them go the gear requirements of the veteran system... How it will work only the gods and the Devs know... I sure have no idea what will be done, specially concerning crafted gear.0 -
Unlikely_Ghostbuster✭✭✭✭I had hope for the last week or two ZOS had better sense than this. People have quoted @ZOS_MariaAliprando numerous times saying they "are tracking" our progress so that we'd be compensated for our time invested when the Champion System is implemented.
I haven't played since December 19th, when I first learned ZOS was going back on their word, but I have been checking back periodically to see whether or not ZOS was *truly* intent on invalidating hundreds of hours of my time.
This is the treatment we should expect from this studio from here on out. Even if ZOS comes to their senses and they change their minds, the damage is done.
/unsubbed
/moving-on
I will, however, take notice when the console release of this game comes and goes with a whimper. ZOS used up all of the Elder Scrolls franchise loyalty momentum when the PC version launched. The "new players" ZOS keeps prioritizing over the current players do not exist, so the projections they're using to justify this boneheaded decision are wrong.
I'm really sorry this game is going to flop. It had a lot of potential. It's a shame the people in charge of it aren't more competent (or honest). You can't make promises to your customers and break them without consequences. Period. I have too much self-respect to keep playing now that ZOS has proven itself untrustworthy.11 -
eventide03b14a_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
Sadly, I expect to see a lot more of these posts. Normally I wouldn't take /quit posts very seriously but in this case I do think there might be quite a backlash from this. Nobody likes to feel like their time is trivialized and this decision to completely reverse their position to track XP isn't even necessary. My hope is that this blows over and update 6 is a huge success and a lot of fun. I'm not confident that will be case though.Unlikely_Ghostbuster wrote: »I had hope for the last week or two ZOS had better sense than this. People have quoted @ZOS_MariaAliprando numerous times saying they "are tracking" our progress so that we'd be compensated for our time invested when the Champion System is implemented.
I haven't played since December 19th, when I first learned ZOS was going back on their word, but I have been checking back periodically to see whether or not ZOS was *truly* intent on invalidating hundreds of hours of my time.
This is the treatment we should expect from this studio from here on out. Even if ZOS comes to their senses and they change their minds, the damage is done.
/unsubbed
/moving-on
I will, however, take notice when the console release of this game comes and goes with a whimper. ZOS used up all of the Elder Scrolls franchise loyalty momentum when the PC version launched. The "new players" ZOS keeps prioritizing over the current players do not exist, so the projections they're using to justify this boneheaded decision are wrong.
I'm really sorry this game is going to flop. It had a lot of potential. It's a shame the people in charge of it aren't more competent (or honest). You can't make promises to your customers and break them without consequences. Period. I have too much self-respect to keep playing now that ZOS has proven itself untrustworthy.
:trollin:8 -
Tavore1138✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭global_gbb16_ESO wrote: »global_gbb16_ESO wrote: »On an additional note, dev teams do not set their own agenda. Whatever they are working towards (i.e. wiping VR2 to VR14 in preparation for CP), it would have been set by management.
.. or some technical issue that has made them realise they can't audit what has been done so far and thus can't appropriate the correct amount of CP back tn people who have gained ranks past VR1. Which if true is ludicrous.
Like i said earlier, they've wasted many months of my work trying to build my characters past VR1 with no prior warning so to hell with ZOS. I'll spend my money elsewhere.
Your statement will only be true if when 1.7 comes to live and the veteran system is removed, ZoS gives no Champion Point compensation for the experience between Vr1 and vr14.
Thanks for your post, however I suspect you may have misread what I posted so please accept my apologies.
The reason I'm angry, I and lots of other good folk (including yourself no doubt) have spent months building up their main and alts way past VR1 and for what? To be told "we're changing the system and by the way anything levelled further than VR1 will count for nothing kthxbai".
The game itself lacks enough content to be fresh after 9 months and then they pull the above stunt.. no thanks.
I definitely understand your point. I am just choosing to believe ZoS will change position for a more agreeable compromise and give us Champion Points to compensate for the loss of the Veteran Rank when that loss actually occur (likely on update 1.7).
Why am I choosing to believe them again? Because I really enjoy this game. True, we are lacking content atm, but that happens with every MMO, specially those starting, and the content we got to play, I at least found very enjoyable, specially the quests and the graphics of the game.
I tried playing WildStar and I just couldn't stand the questing and even WoW's quests are... Bland and very repetitive. I think ESO did a good job disguising their quest progression with little interesting stories, so for now I think I will stick around. Come 1.7, if ZoS frustrates my expectation (that are not even that high) then it will be the time to pack my bags and maybe look over at WoW again.
It's cool that you have found justification to continue playing (and paying) based on the *hope* that they current plan will be changed but I don't think I will be doing that. I think some of us don't want to continue investing more time and money into a system that will pull the rug out from under us come 1.7.
If they haven't changed course by the time 1.6 releases and make some kind of clear statements to that effect I think I would rather let my account expire and then just come back later if it turns out they changed their minds for 1.7. Not going to continue throwing good money/time after bad when I have little reason to trust ZOS to do the right thing at this point.
They do need to release a statement regarding what will happen come 1.7, hope will only get me so far. It is hope, not foolishness. ^^
The problem is though - lets say they come out this week and go:
"Grao - we assure you that in about 3-4 months once we have tested, released & patched 1.6 and are about to send out 1.7 we will compensate you for the x hundred hours of post level 50 time in the form of some additional CP, we have the numbers."
How based on the current dishonesty could you actually trust that a week before 1.7 drops they wouldn't then come back and say:
"Hey, things change, our word is not our bond, see ya".
??
Because as much as on the surface this is about the number of CP and the time spent the real issue that underpins all the anger and woe is TRUST.
A senior dev told us something that was not true - there was no need to make that promise in such clear terms but they chose to do so.
A senior CS person did not actually apologise (Gina's post was very carefully & deliberately worded to not be an apology).
How can we trust what they tell us in future?Edited by Tavore1138 on January 6, 2015 10:35PMGM - Malazan
Raid Leader - Hungry Wolves
Legio Mortuum1 -
NotSo✭✭✭✭I'm just going to wait quietly for an update from ZOS. Reading everything you guys have to say really sucks.Gar'Sol the Wanderer VR14 Khajiit Sorcerer Spellblade5 -
Grao✭✭✭✭✭
✭SuraklinPrime wrote: »global_gbb16_ESO wrote: »global_gbb16_ESO wrote: »On an additional note, dev teams do not set their own agenda. Whatever they are working towards (i.e. wiping VR2 to VR14 in preparation for CP), it would have been set by management.
.. or some technical issue that has made them realise they can't audit what has been done so far and thus can't appropriate the correct amount of CP back tn people who have gained ranks past VR1. Which if true is ludicrous.
Like i said earlier, they've wasted many months of my work trying to build my characters past VR1 with no prior warning so to hell with ZOS. I'll spend my money elsewhere.
Your statement will only be true if when 1.7 comes to live and the veteran system is removed, ZoS gives no Champion Point compensation for the experience between Vr1 and vr14.
Thanks for your post, however I suspect you may have misread what I posted so please accept my apologies.
The reason I'm angry, I and lots of other good folk (including yourself no doubt) have spent months building up their main and alts way past VR1 and for what? To be told "we're changing the system and by the way anything levelled further than VR1 will count for nothing kthxbai".
The game itself lacks enough content to be fresh after 9 months and then they pull the above stunt.. no thanks.
I definitely understand your point. I am just choosing to believe ZoS will change position for a more agreeable compromise and give us Champion Points to compensate for the loss of the Veteran Rank when that loss actually occur (likely on update 1.7).
Why am I choosing to believe them again? Because I really enjoy this game. True, we are lacking content atm, but that happens with every MMO, specially those starting, and the content we got to play, I at least found very enjoyable, specially the quests and the graphics of the game.
I tried playing WildStar and I just couldn't stand the questing and even WoW's quests are... Bland and very repetitive. I think ESO did a good job disguising their quest progression with little interesting stories, so for now I think I will stick around. Come 1.7, if ZoS frustrates my expectation (that are not even that high) then it will be the time to pack my bags and maybe look over at WoW again.
It's cool that you have found justification to continue playing (and paying) based on the *hope* that they current plan will be changed but I don't think I will be doing that. I think some of us don't want to continue investing more time and money into a system that will pull the rug out from under us come 1.7.
If they haven't changed course by the time 1.6 releases and make some kind of clear statements to that effect I think I would rather let my account expire and then just come back later if it turns out they changed their minds for 1.7. Not going to continue throwing good money/time after bad when I have little reason to trust ZOS to do the right thing at this point.
They do need to release a statement regarding what will happen come 1.7, hope will only get me so far. It is hope, not foolishness. ^^
The problem is though - lets say they come out this week and go:
"Grao - we assure you that in about 3-4 months once we have tested, released & patched 1.6 and are about to send out 1.7 we will compensate you for the x hundred hours of post level 50 time in the form of some additional CP, we have the numbers."
How based on the current dishonesty could you actually trust that a week before 1.7 drops they wouldn't then come back and say:
"Hey, things change, our word is not our bond, see ya".
??
Because as much as on the surface this is about the number of CP and the time spent the real issue that underpins all the anger and woe is TRUST.
A senior dev told us something that was not true - there was no need to make that promise in such clear terms but they chose to do so.
A senior CS person did not actually apologise (Gina's post was very carefully & deliberately worded to not be an apology).
How can we trust what they tell us in future?
I know it will be hard to trust ZoS again after their latest statements concerning the conversion of Experience to Champion Points, but I'd still prefer a statement to nothing and nothing is what we have right now.
Although I've been combative on the forum, it is only because I want an answer and because I actually care about the game, I care enough to understand why ZoS can't give us all the Champion Points we are owed right now. It is true that with the Veteran System still in place, granting us access to all of those champion points would create too big of a discrepancy between levels.
So I understand why ZoS changed their initial plans despite the promised made to the community month ago, I am reasonable enough to see that. I hope ZoS is reasonable enough to see our side too and come around with a plan that works both for them and the game and for us who have been playing ESO for months and months.
We need that answer, we need to see their plans changing now, before the release of 1.6. This 30 'free' champion points, they are not a good precedence to a system just being implemented... Right now, that is not unfair to those already at vr1 or above (since the veteran system provides us character progression already), but it is definitely unfair to those not at the veteran ranks... Can you imagine... If you reach vr1 one day after 1.6 is released, you will get no point at all according to ZoS current plan... That alone will create some severe imbalance between older and new players.3 -
EQBallzz✭✭✭✭✭
✭SuraklinPrime wrote: »global_gbb16_ESO wrote: »global_gbb16_ESO wrote: »On an additional note, dev teams do not set their own agenda. Whatever they are working towards (i.e. wiping VR2 to VR14 in preparation for CP), it would have been set by management.
.. or some technical issue that has made them realise they can't audit what has been done so far and thus can't appropriate the correct amount of CP back tn people who have gained ranks past VR1. Which if true is ludicrous.
Like i said earlier, they've wasted many months of my work trying to build my characters past VR1 with no prior warning so to hell with ZOS. I'll spend my money elsewhere.
Your statement will only be true if when 1.7 comes to live and the veteran system is removed, ZoS gives no Champion Point compensation for the experience between Vr1 and vr14.
Thanks for your post, however I suspect you may have misread what I posted so please accept my apologies.
The reason I'm angry, I and lots of other good folk (including yourself no doubt) have spent months building up their main and alts way past VR1 and for what? To be told "we're changing the system and by the way anything levelled further than VR1 will count for nothing kthxbai".
The game itself lacks enough content to be fresh after 9 months and then they pull the above stunt.. no thanks.
I definitely understand your point. I am just choosing to believe ZoS will change position for a more agreeable compromise and give us Champion Points to compensate for the loss of the Veteran Rank when that loss actually occur (likely on update 1.7).
Why am I choosing to believe them again? Because I really enjoy this game. True, we are lacking content atm, but that happens with every MMO, specially those starting, and the content we got to play, I at least found very enjoyable, specially the quests and the graphics of the game.
I tried playing WildStar and I just couldn't stand the questing and even WoW's quests are... Bland and very repetitive. I think ESO did a good job disguising their quest progression with little interesting stories, so for now I think I will stick around. Come 1.7, if ZoS frustrates my expectation (that are not even that high) then it will be the time to pack my bags and maybe look over at WoW again.
It's cool that you have found justification to continue playing (and paying) based on the *hope* that they current plan will be changed but I don't think I will be doing that. I think some of us don't want to continue investing more time and money into a system that will pull the rug out from under us come 1.7.
If they haven't changed course by the time 1.6 releases and make some kind of clear statements to that effect I think I would rather let my account expire and then just come back later if it turns out they changed their minds for 1.7. Not going to continue throwing good money/time after bad when I have little reason to trust ZOS to do the right thing at this point.
They do need to release a statement regarding what will happen come 1.7, hope will only get me so far. It is hope, not foolishness. ^^
The problem is though - lets say they come out this week and go:
"Grao - we assure you that in about 3-4 months once we have tested, released & patched 1.6 and are about to send out 1.7 we will compensate you for the x hundred hours of post level 50 time in the form of some additional CP, we have the numbers."
How based on the current dishonesty could you actually trust that a week before 1.7 drops they wouldn't then come back and say:
"Hey, things change, our word is not our bond, see ya".
??
Because as much as on the surface this is about the number of CP and the time spent the real issue that underpins all the anger and woe is TRUST.
A senior dev told us something that was not true - there was no need to make that promise in such clear terms but they chose to do so.
A senior CS person did not actually apologise (Gina's post was very carefully & deliberately worded to not be an apology).
How can we trust what they tell us in future?
I know it will be hard to trust ZoS again after their latest statements concerning the conversion of Experience to Champion Points, but I'd still prefer a statement to nothing and nothing is what we have right now.
Although I've been combative on the forum, it is only because I want an answer and because I actually care about the game, I care enough to understand why ZoS can't give us all the Champion Points we are owed right now. It is true that with the Veteran System still in place, granting us access to all of those champion points would create too big of a discrepancy between levels.
So I understand why ZoS changed their initial plans despite the promised made to the community month ago, I am reasonable enough to see that. I hope ZoS is reasonable enough to see our side too and come around with a plan that works both for them and the game and for us who have been playing ESO for months and months.
We need that answer, we need to see their plans changing now, before the release of 1.6. This 30 'free' champion points, they are not a good precedence to a system just being implemented... Right now, that is not unfair to those already at vr1 or above (since the veteran system provides us character progression already), but it is definitely unfair to those not at the veteran ranks... Can you imagine... If you reach vr1 one day after 1.6 is released, you will get no point at all according to ZoS current plan... That alone will create some severe imbalance between older and new players.
I'm not as understanding as you. I'm not buying this excuse. There is nobody stopping them from tracking the XP/quests/vet levels (or whatever metric they want to use for conversion to CP) up to the launch of 1.6 and then marking everyone's account with whatever CP equivalent that equates to but then not awarding those points until 1.7 goes live (and the vet levels are removed). That would allow everyone to still have their progress count for something and not overpower players while vet levels and the CS are running in parallel. It's really not that difficult if it's something they wanted/intended to do.
It seems clear they are using this as an excuse to reset the players who have spent the most time so that they can wring out even more subscription time from people who will essentially have to double up on hundreds of hours of progression. I hope that I'm wrong but that's what it looks like to me.9 -
smacx250✭✭✭✭✭As far as I've seen, there hasn't been any conclusive statement about what will happen with XP and CP as of 1.7. And given the fallout of a certain previous forward looking statement, I guess I wouldn't expect one for 1.7, or read too much into it should one be made.
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Joejudas✭✭✭✭✭yeah it was settled for the time being....we will see going forward...but no one knows and we wont know until later.0
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i have defended ZOS on many occassions in the last year. i am calm rational adult who prides myself on not NERD RAGING or rage quitting. i can handle not awarding us character points for experience gained past v14 if it unbalances the system. that being said V14s are well within their rights to be furious if all vet toons are rolled back to 50 and awarded 30 points for all. its lazy and unacceptable. we aren't asking for a thousand points, simply some compensation for the effort and time spent leveling from vr1 to vr14. we are NOT in the same place as a brand new vr1, and refuse to be treated as such. even if its only 2-5 points per vet rank, that atleast shows some form of compensation on ZOS's part. ZOS needs to do some explaining and throw us a bone here or they will see ALOT of subscriptions being dropped, no doubt about it.Edited by badmojo0777b14_ESO on January 7, 2015 5:56AM9
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anitajoneb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Answer to what ??? We HAVE an answer, not everyone likes this answer but that will most likely not change said answer so let it be... this is getting truly "too much".7 -
Enodoc✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Still no answer from ZoS...
About what? I don't think there's anything left for them to say based on their current plans.Still no answer from Zenimax...- Everyone gets 30CP when Update 6 is released if they have a Veteran Rank character. (per Gina)
- 30CP is it, all, everything, no more to be added later when they remove Vet Ranks completely. (per Kai)
Unless you want them to address some of the suggestions made here and in other places for them to change those plans, but they would have to talk to the other devs about that for a while longer yet before they can do that.UESP: The Unofficial Elder Scrolls Pages - A collaborative source for all knowledge on the Elder Scrolls series since 1995
Join us on Discord - discord.gg/uesp0 -
hiyde✭✭✭✭✭
✭For me, the issue is very simple:
If you're a VR that hasn't yet run Cadwell's Silver+Gold, you get 30 CP PLUS all the related CP for running those quests when you do.
If you're a VR that HAS run Cadwell's Silver+Gold, you get 30 CP and ZERO CP from running through 100% of all 3 factions.
If you're in the latter group and solo content is your thing - enjoy Cyrodil Dailies because they'll be the only significant source of solo quest XP available to you for a very long time to come. I hope you're good at PvP, because if the number of Cyrodil PvE questers balloons as I expect it to, the gankers will be waiting for you at the quest hubs, as is their right in a PvP zone!
For me, the solution is also very simple:
- Either retroactively grant CP for completed Cadwell's quests to those that have already finished them...
OR
- Give NO CP from Cadwell's Quests to people who run them after the update.
If you want to frontload CP to even out VR's for the sake of balance, that's fine. Just position it as "getting Cadwell's CP in advance" instead of allowing lower levels to double-dip.
To be clear, I'm only talking about the Quest Reward XP (and related CP). We all have the option to go grind mobs whether questing or not.
I may not agree with all of the decisions and changes in direction but I can live with them and hope/trust that ZoS has the best intentions to do what is best for the game...
...but I cannot live with people who ran (a HUGE amount) of content getting zero CP while people who haven't run it yet WILL get the related CP when they do.
We should all be able to play the game and advance without worry of being unequally penalized for it. As it stands now, it is SILLY for solo PvE'rs to run Cadwell's quests until after this gets implemented.
As the GM of a 500 member guild, I am seeing numerous people who are taking a break from the game solely because of this issue. How is that a good thing? Your original intent of "keep playing - we're tracking!" was the right one, even if the implementation needs to change as you flesh it all out.
PLEASE - just EQUALIZE it, one way or the other. We may not like the choice you go with, but it least it'll apply fairly.
-H
Edited by hiyde on January 7, 2015 7:16PM@Hiyde GM/Founder - Bleakrock Barter Co (Trade Guild - PC/NA) | Blackbriar Barter Co (Trade Guild-PC/NA)9 -
liquid_wolf✭✭✭✭I am disappointed the XP tracking reward/conversion isn't going to happen.
I can understand the change, but it does mean there is no point for me to be playing until 1.6. I'd rather just hold off until PTS and release of 1.6 and continue from where I am currently at.0 -
Kraven✭✭✭✭✭I'm just curious what hair brained genius thought a blatant rip off would go over well? Sad part is there is a large portion of people that don't use the forums and don't even realize this is coming. You think you've got a *** storm now of people highly aggravated?
I've already said it a few times in a few places. No way you slice it does it add up or make any sense at all to completely erase progress that players made. Anything you have done between V1 and V14 is having the reward for doing it just straight removed while anyone who hasn't done it will be rewarded when they do get around to it. I'll go one further. anything at all that you've done between V1 and when 1.6 hits live is trash.
It's sitting there ready to be thrown out but because it's a lazy teenagers job to take the trash out first it has to sit near the trash, right beside the trash but can't be thrown away until it actually starts to stink and rot.
Bad company decisions ruin good games, happens often. A pure disregard for their players that borders on out right disrespect and a flippant back handed "Who cares what those guys say? We do what we want and they'll just have to deal with it."
Some of you insist it's okay. Some of you have no problems at all with the change and some couldn't care less about it. If it doesn't affect you at all then fine, why are you arguing about it? For those that have a real problem with it, and those that are literally walking away from the game because of it. It's between them and ZOS and at this point it's one sided since ZOS won't step up and acknowledge a genuine concern of many players.
ZO doesn't care at all if you quit and walk away. If they did they might have responded to the innumerable posts on this subject already instead of once again blatantly and obviously just straight ignoring a large concern of a large portion of their players. Instead posting self congratulations on winning MMORPG's faux competition, or posting about a missing sound effect from rapids, or wait the "we see no reason for server maintenance at this time" even though there are pages of issues listed due to needing a reset. To be quickly followed by "Oh well we finally tried to play ourselves so we decided a reset was needed, we just didn't care to listen to our players when they said the same thing the day before." might be paraphrasing equals to the same thing though.
If you have no issue, then why are you arguing? Are you suggesting that just because it isn't a concern of yours then it isn't a valid concern for others? That's a little self absorbed, but to be expected here.
V14 - IMPERIAL NIGHTBLADE - DPS/TANK
V13 - BRETON SORCERER - HEALS/DPS
V2 - REDGUARD DRAGONKNIGHT - MELEE DPS
V1 - BRETON TEMPLAR - TANK/DPS
to be continued... Nevermind, no longer "to be continued"7 -
rophez_ESO✭✭✭✭✭Is ZOS just really bad at communicating? When they said they are giving all vet players 30 champion points in 1.6 to avoid further power disparity between players, did they mean because Vet levels are still in place? In 1.7 are they going to allocate more champion points to higher ranked characters to compensate for the removal of the veteran levels? Lloyd's emails make it sound like that is still a possibility. A little more transparency and open dialogue from a dev on this issue would surely be appreciated.0
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Heruthema✭✭✭✭I am confused. Could someone point me to the post where ZOS stated that VR14 would never be compensated for the efforts and accomplishments? I have seen where they said we would not get more than 30CP in 1.6, but I did not see anything that leads me to believe that in 1.7 when VR goes away we would not be compensated.
Just asking...3 -
Jaxsun✭✭✭✭liquid_wolf wrote: »I am disappointed the XP tracking reward/conversion isn't going to happen.
I can understand the change, but it does mean there is no point for me to be playing until 1.6. I'd rather just hold off until PTS and release of 1.6 and continue from where I am currently at.
This is why they told us they were tracking our XP....so that we didn't unsub from October to 1.6, lying for monetary gain...card carrying @$$holes3 -
Joejudas✭✭✭✭✭as of this point we are only getting 30 cp.....they havent said anything about 1.7...but why even get people all freaked out about it for 1.7. we will see and thats all we got so far.1
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Grao✭✭✭✭✭
✭rophez_ESO wrote: »Is ZOS just really bad at communicating? When they said they are giving all vet players 30 champion points in 1.6 to avoid further power disparity between players, did they mean because Vet levels are still in place? In 1.7 are they going to allocate more champion points to higher ranked characters to compensate for the removal of the veteran levels? Lloyd's emails make it sound like that is still a possibility. A little more transparency and open dialogue from a dev on this issue would surely be appreciated.
They are terrible at communicating, between their own departments and with the community.
I spoke to Lloyd as well and after presenting him with direct questions he was left with no answer but "I don't know" and "Only the devs can answer your questions", unfortunately we have no way to talk to the devs other then posting on the forums and we are not getting answers even from the Support, the devs are staying far, far away from this posts.
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