No Proc in No CP = No Good

DrSlaughtr

This is the worst decision they could have made. Relegating the no proc Cyrodiil to no cp is a huge mistake. You're immediately shutting out players who want to go back to no proc but will be forced to choose between no proc sets or using their CP they spent years earning.

Furthermore making either BR of GH no proc would have brought balance to the two campaign populations, which is desperately needed.

Way to go. You missed a wide open dunk to win the game.

Alucardo

Funny how you mention balance and CP. CP is the ONLY factor that creates imbalance between players. Some have a lot, and some don't have many, which is why many of us enjoy the no cp campaign where everybody is on equal footing.
Bringing no proc to a no cp campaign means new and returning players with really low CP can enjoy PvP without proc sets or higher champion point players.
I know a lot of you will hate me for this, but I think it's great.

DrSlaughtr

They could have still have Raven no proc.

But to your point, based on that logic no one should be using CP gear. If you really want everyone to be on equal footing.

YandereGirlfriend

I still have not received a definitive answer as to whether or not Ravenwatch is getting cannibalized for the No-Proc Frankenstein.

I asked about a zillion times in their stream but was ignored every time.

All of Ravenwatch is hoping that they do the right thing and create a separate campaign for that game mode.

colossalvoids

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

I still have not received a definitive answer as to whether or not Ravenwatch is getting cannibalized for the No-Proc Frankenstein.

I asked about a zillion times in their stream but was ignored every time.

All of Ravenwatch is hoping that they do the right thing and create a separate campaign for that game mode.

Pretty sure they've repeatedly said a new one and it would be pretty logical decision. Anyway we'll be able to tell tomorrow already.

Tigor

Good decision in the purpose to bring everyone closer in a fair competition. Where is the verification this is going to happen?

Why? Some quick thoughts:
A: Not everyone knows what proc sets are the best to use.
B: Not everyone has the DLC's and access to equipment.
C: Not everyone has the same amound of CP.
D : CP is making the fights shifty.
E: Not everyone is playing the OP class.
F: The campaign will become more lively.
G: Less strong farming (ball) groups.
H: Not everyone is playing in a group
I: It could be Ravenwatch.
J: More attractive to new players.

Luke_Flamesword

CP campaigns are mess - there are a lot almost immortal players and fights longs forever, because people just can't kill each other

Also in no CP procs are more deadly and makes more inbalance, so it's definetely there should be no-proc. It's like Gina said - no-proc, no-CP, no-hammer - it will pure, vanilla Cyrodiil and I like it

Alucardo

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

I still have not received a definitive answer as to whether or not Ravenwatch is getting cannibalized for the No-Proc Frankenstein.

I asked about a zillion times in their stream but was ignored every time.

All of Ravenwatch is hoping that they do the right thing and create a separate campaign for that game mode.

Not a bad question really. I mean, are they going to have the population to split it into two separate campaigns? I wouldn't think so.

MrMazurski

Tigor wrote: »

Good decision in the purpose to bring everyone closer in a fair competition. Where is the verification this is going to happen?

Why? Some quick thoughts:
A: Not everyone knows what proc sets are the best to use.
B: Not everyone has the DLC's and access to equipment.
C: Not everyone has the same amound of CP.
D : CP is making the fights shifty.
E: Not everyone is playing the OP class.
F: The campaign will become more lively.
G: Less strong farming (ball) groups.
H: Not everyone is playing in a group
I: It could be Ravenwatch.
J: More attractive to new players.

Powerful skill, do something or spam dots. The opponent gets damage from heaven.

No proc = player skill vs player skill, class vs class. No dmg from others sources

I miss for no proc Cyro

Qrähe

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

I still have not received a definitive answer as to whether or not Ravenwatch is getting cannibalized for the No-Proc Frankenstein.

I asked about a zillion times in their stream but was ignored every time.

All of Ravenwatch is hoping that they do the right thing and create a separate campaign for that game mode.

Ehhhhh.... maybe you should include the asterisk for all and then put under it, "Not all or remotely close to all."

YandereGirlfriend

Qrähe wrote: »

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

I still have not received a definitive answer as to whether or not Ravenwatch is getting cannibalized for the No-Proc Frankenstein.

I asked about a zillion times in their stream but was ignored every time.

All of Ravenwatch is hoping that they do the right thing and create a separate campaign for that game mode.

Ehhhhh.... maybe you should include the asterisk for all and then put under it, "Not all or remotely close to all."

The number of No-Proc zealots is vanishingly small... both in ESO in general as well as in Ravenwatch itself.

Some players enjoyed it for a week or two but quickly grew bored of using the same 19 sets for months on end. Nobody that I know is interested in seeing that ruleset return.

Most of the No-Proc proponents play in CP because they actually enjoy getting stats and abilities "for free", just not, strangely enough, from their item selections.

In any case though, nobody volunteered Ravenwatch for this change. These changes will kill Ravenwatch for the many players who currently enjoy the format and it will become a sad little slum for the small handful of YouTube 1vX'ers (and their hangers-on...) that have been the ones pushing for these changes all along.

It must never be forgotten that the No-Proc tests were an unpopular failure. Not only were there no performance improvements to speak of but campaign populations declined noticeably toward the end of the test period when the novelty effect had run its course and players realized that the utopia that they had been promised had not actually arrived.

Qrähe

Gonna disagree, it wasn't popular among the ball groups and they left except 1 or 2 that adapted. The rest couldn't and disappeared, because suddenly they got beat badly in every fight when they couldn't be carried by sets. It was still populated about the same level and even more so towards the end of that campaign.

Tigor

Really lets not proc in no cp, it will better prevent from lag favor and server priority. Everyone knows this, no proc testing and polling underlined it. And now relax! 🏕

Abyssmol

No proc Cyrodiil- the ultimate test to see if the loud voices in the forum represent the pvp community. If only a hand full of players play the no-proc Cyrodiil then ZOS should just ignore the forum completely. I can't wait to see the results!!!😁

Beardimus

NoCP is the best PvP anyway..

DrSlaughtr

I totally support a no cp no proc camp. But no proc worked great in GH and BR. One of them should be made no proc.

And again, if you're arguing that some people are at a disadvantage because of lower CP I have two retorts.

One, they can go no cp right now but most don't.

Two, if that's your thinking, them every piece of gear should be dropped to level 50 in no cp. Because if i'm 1 CP with level 50 gear I'm at a huge disadvantage to someone running 160 gear.

Amottica

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

I still have not received a definitive answer as to whether or not Ravenwatch is getting cannibalized for the No-Proc Frankenstein.

I asked about a zillion times in their stream but was ignored every time.

All of Ravenwatch is hoping that they do the right thing and create a separate campaign for that game mode.

Have they ever renamed all the campaigns to avoid such issues?

UnkindnessOfRavens

Amottica wrote: »

Have they ever renamed all the campaigns to avoid such issues?

Indeed they have. The current campaigns are all named after Greymoor locations. Prior to that, they were named after Elsweyr dragons. Prior to that, they were named after Morrowind false gods, etc... No reason they won't have a new round of Blackwood-based names with U31, and can add a fifth option.

Starshadw

Alucardo wrote: »

Funny how you mention balance and CP. CP is the ONLY factor that creates imbalance between players. Some have a lot, and some don't have many, which is why many of us enjoy the no cp campaign where everybody is on equal footing.
Bringing no proc to a no cp campaign means new and returning players with really low CP can enjoy PvP without proc sets or higher champion point players.
I know a lot of you will hate me for this, but I think it's great.

This isn't as true as it used to be. The new/current CP system, with the four slottable active skills, alleviates the extreme imbalance we saw in CP 1.0. And, with the most recent changes made, in how many points can go in passive perks, etc., the field is even more balanced. It's true that if you have less CP, you're going to have to be very specific in where you spend your points because you don't have extra to spare - but it's not the same as it was before the new CP system was implemented.

Thraben

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

I

All of Ravenwatch is hoping that they do the right thing and create a separate campaign for that game mode.

Please abstain from making such strong statements. You may have personal reasons for it, and things might be different in the US, but

Tigor and I represent a substantial part of Europe's veteran NoCP campaign playerbase, something you probably did not know. We haven't been involved in the decision, but if the Devs would have asked me, I would have estimated - based on guild members' stated opinion -, that among those, roughly 60% are in favor of the NoCP No Proc campaign, 30% don't care, and mainly only the Bombblade players are against it.

My personal opinion should be clear, as one can easily see on my avatar. I will miss my beloved Deadroth. But sometimes you have to see the greater good as well as the clear majority independent of personal desires.


For now, it is more important to change how VD works, and then buff Proximity Detonation to compensate for it, so that Bomblade players can still have fun in a No-Proc environment.

Luke_Flamesword

Some players enjoyed it for a week or two but quickly grew bored of using the same 19 sets for months on end. Nobody that I know is interested in seeing that ruleset return.

In stream Gina confirmed that in no-proc will be much more sets avaiable - probably they will add all these minor/major buffs and other sets with some conditions which are not pure procs.

Marcus_Aurelius

Do we really need a no-proc campaign?
I'm seeing very little use of them now and they usually hit not too hard. At least in no cp.
Is it worth to split the campaign and playerbase in two?

Luke_Flamesword

Yeah, but now procs are destroyed in PvE and this is not good either. It's not only about procs, it will be much healthier for game if some sets can stay good or even op in PvE and are not allowed in PvP (then is no reason to nerf them). So many good sets were nerfed only because they were overused in PvP. Some sets you just can't balance for both PvE and PvP.

InvitationNotFound

Tigor wrote: »

Really lets not proc in no cp, it will better prevent from lag favor and server priority. Everyone knows this, no proc testing and polling underlined it. And now relax! 🏕

It is funny how players still make claims that no-proc improves performance and there won't be as much lag.
Even ZOS said in their statement (before they went no-proc) that the performance got even slightly worse during the no-proc testing.

Just say it 20 more times and it might become reality, right?

Tigor

InvitationNotFound wrote: »

Tigor wrote: »

Really lets not proc in no cp, it will better prevent from lag favor and server priority. Everyone knows this, no proc testing and polling underlined it. And now relax! 🏕

It is funny how players still make claims that no-proc improves performance and there won't be as much lag.
Even ZOS said in their statement (before they went no-proc) that the performance got even slightly worse during the no-proc testing.

Just say it 20 more times and it might become reality, right?

Then I will tell you something more. No need to repeat. I am living in reality and presence. Throwing everything in battle is certainly causing distortion and handicap the area. So do proc sets, I classify that as lag. What ZOS stated is something else.

jaws343

I prefer CP campaigns, but I will most likely jump to maining this new No CP, No Proc campaign, if only to play without the procs. It'll definitely mean I have to retool how I approach builds entirely, but I enjoyed the 3 months of no-proc cyrodil.

spacefracking

I mean, I guess it makes sense if we're considering the campaign to be the "pure gameplay" campaign, but I'd much prefer this mode on an alliance locked server so the pop stays up in off hours, and we only have the CP campaign for that. If the alliance locked 24/7 server is what people consider to be the competitive "main campaign", I'd like it to have some cheese-proofing, to keep the spirit of the 24/7 competitiveness balanced.

Mostly tho, I just play alliance locked CP cyrodiil, and like no proc, so I would like to be humored... Humor me!!!

DrSlaughtr

Making either BR or GH no proc would be the best because it would help balance the populations WHICH IS DESPERATELY NEEDED.

rbfrgsp

The no-proc campaign will always be a secondary campaign. We could argue this back and forth before the test, but they put no-proc on the live server for over two months and it collapsed the population.

Simply put, most people in cyrodiil want proc sets. Whatever we think personally, the players voted with their feet and you cannot really argue it any more.

Now, the worst possible outcome would be to demand a no-proc version of every campaign - thereby further subdividing the PvP population even further. Let's be happy that there is a no-proc, no-CP 'pure gameplay' zone to play in. It's some progress that most players would never have expected to happen this time last year.

ClawOfTheTwoMoons

rbfrgsp wrote: »

The no-proc campaign will always be a secondary campaign. We could argue this back and forth before the test, but they put no-proc on the live server for over two months and it collapsed the population.

Simply put, most people in cyrodiil want proc sets. Whatever we think personally, the players voted with their feet and you cannot really argue it any more.

Now, the worst possible outcome would be to demand a no-proc version of every campaign - thereby further subdividing the PvP population even further. Let's be happy that there is a no-proc, no-CP 'pure gameplay' zone to play in. It's some progress that most players would never have expected to happen this time last year.

Don't know where you were playing, but on PC NA grayhost was popping. Don't spread lies like that. Zos said it themselves there was outpouring support for no proc, but now that its moved to no cp, proponents of crutch sets will say that it was never popular when in fact, the reason it's gonna be dead is because of no cp.

rbfrgsp

PC EU. Every campaign lost at least 50% of its player base through no-proc testing. It's come back somewhat now.