He says already. Meaning currently. I'm clarifying how much Helping Hands will net you right now. No idea what it's going to be post-update.The_Outsider wrote: »Helping Hands will net you 2,000 Stam with ~40k Max Stam. That's hardly minuscule.Helping Hands is already a minuscule Stamina return, even for Stamknights. Battle Roar is powerful, but it's also the only thing that MagKnights have for sustain, and nerfing it is especially horrible when you consider that the class fights with attrition. How can you win through attrition if you always have worse sustain than your opponent?
Battle Roar will return more Health and Stamina for mDKs now. The change is part of a overarching combat change to prevent resource return from stacking 1 attribute to high heaven.
Winning through attrition is the old DK way. With buffs to whip, Leap, Flame staff, the popularity of BSW, and a BoL-esqe health, mDKs are burstier than ever in PVP.
Umm no ...not 2000 it's more like 1000..... max stam has nothing to do with it now it's level based... you get a break even at around 18k stam.... Battle Roar returns less stam .... your major mending is gutted... cost of block is x2 ... 30% increase the cost vigor ..... 10% more for all stam abilities...
I agree that magicka DKs did not take it on the chin as much as stam did .... as a class stam DKs are hurting
Band Camp statements: To state "But this one time I saw X doing X... so that justifies X" Refers to the Band camp statement.
Coined by Maxwell
The_Outsider wrote: »I'm clarifying how much Helping Hands will net you right now. No idea what it's going to be post-update
Band Camp statements: To state "But this one time I saw X doing X... so that justifies X" Refers to the Band camp statement.
Coined by Maxwell
The_Outsider wrote: »He says already. Meaning currently. I'm clarifying how much Helping Hands will net you right now. No idea what it's going to be post-update.The_Outsider wrote: »Helping Hands will net you 2,000 Stam with ~40k Max Stam. That's hardly minuscule.Helping Hands is already a minuscule Stamina return, even for Stamknights. Battle Roar is powerful, but it's also the only thing that MagKnights have for sustain, and nerfing it is especially horrible when you consider that the class fights with attrition. How can you win through attrition if you always have worse sustain than your opponent?
Battle Roar will return more Health and Stamina for mDKs now. The change is part of a overarching combat change to prevent resource return from stacking 1 attribute to high heaven.
Winning through attrition is the old DK way. With buffs to whip, Leap, Flame staff, the popularity of BSW, and a BoL-esqe health, mDKs are burstier than ever in PVP.
Umm no ...not 2000 it's more like 1000..... max stam has nothing to do with it now it's level based... you get a break even at around 18k stam.... Battle Roar returns less stam .... your major mending is gutted... cost of block is x2 ... 30% increase the cost vigor ..... 10% more for all stam abilities...
I agree that magicka DKs did not take it on the chin as much as stam did .... as a class stam DKs are hurting
Vigor, block and I think it's 5% more (?), those things affect all stam classes.
Buuuut I agree, the Igneous shield nerf is damn heavy... Although my sNB has no sympathy for your newfound lack of major mending.
The_Outsider wrote: »He says already. Meaning currently. I'm clarifying how much Helping Hands will net you right now. No idea what it's going to be post-update.The_Outsider wrote: »Helping Hands will net you 2,000 Stam with ~40k Max Stam. That's hardly minuscule.Helping Hands is already a minuscule Stamina return, even for Stamknights. Battle Roar is powerful, but it's also the only thing that MagKnights have for sustain, and nerfing it is especially horrible when you consider that the class fights with attrition. How can you win through attrition if you always have worse sustain than your opponent?
Battle Roar will return more Health and Stamina for mDKs now. The change is part of a overarching combat change to prevent resource return from stacking 1 attribute to high heaven.
Winning through attrition is the old DK way. With buffs to whip, Leap, Flame staff, the popularity of BSW, and a BoL-esqe health, mDKs are burstier than ever in PVP.
Umm no ...not 2000 it's more like 1000..... max stam has nothing to do with it now it's level based... you get a break even at around 18k stam.... Battle Roar returns less stam .... your major mending is gutted... cost of block is x2 ... 30% increase the cost vigor ..... 10% more for all stam abilities...
I agree that magicka DKs did not take it on the chin as much as stam did .... as a class stam DKs are hurting
Vigor, block and I think it's 5% more (?), those things affect all stam classes.
Buuuut I agree, the Igneous shield nerf is damn heavy... Although my sNB has no sympathy for your newfound lack of major mending.
-30% increase in vigor costs...
-Blocking has been changed with multiple hits it's 50% more...
Your stam Night blade will have no trouble with DKs my brothers stamblade destroyed me in a duel where I knew he was coming last night... before last night it was longer and I usually edged him out... now I'm destroyed rather quickly ...he is actually doing more damage now then before ...
-
The_Outsider wrote: »The_Outsider wrote: »He says already. Meaning currently. I'm clarifying how much Helping Hands will net you right now. No idea what it's going to be post-update.The_Outsider wrote: »Helping Hands will net you 2,000 Stam with ~40k Max Stam. That's hardly minuscule.Helping Hands is already a minuscule Stamina return, even for Stamknights. Battle Roar is powerful, but it's also the only thing that MagKnights have for sustain, and nerfing it is especially horrible when you consider that the class fights with attrition. How can you win through attrition if you always have worse sustain than your opponent?
Battle Roar will return more Health and Stamina for mDKs now. The change is part of a overarching combat change to prevent resource return from stacking 1 attribute to high heaven.
Winning through attrition is the old DK way. With buffs to whip, Leap, Flame staff, the popularity of BSW, and a BoL-esqe health, mDKs are burstier than ever in PVP.
Umm no ...not 2000 it's more like 1000..... max stam has nothing to do with it now it's level based... you get a break even at around 18k stam.... Battle Roar returns less stam .... your major mending is gutted... cost of block is x2 ... 30% increase the cost vigor ..... 10% more for all stam abilities...
I agree that magicka DKs did not take it on the chin as much as stam did .... as a class stam DKs are hurting
Vigor, block and I think it's 5% more (?), those things affect all stam classes.
Buuuut I agree, the Igneous shield nerf is damn heavy... Although my sNB has no sympathy for your newfound lack of major mending.
-30% increase in vigor costs...
-Blocking has been changed with multiple hits it's 50% more...
Your stam Night blade will have no trouble with DKs my brothers stamblade destroyed me in a duel where I knew he was coming last night... before last night it was longer and I usually edged him out... now I'm destroyed rather quickly ...he is actually doing more damage now then before ...
-
Right, all Stam classes cast Vigor and Block. Vigor and 5% Ability cost increase are just a blanket Stam nerf.
I just covet buffs I don't have. Want all buffs.
I'm not sure why his NB would hit you harder. No damage buffs for NB that I saw.
The_Outsider wrote: »The_Outsider wrote: »He says already. Meaning currently. I'm clarifying how much Helping Hands will net you right now. No idea what it's going to be post-update.The_Outsider wrote: »Helping Hands will net you 2,000 Stam with ~40k Max Stam. That's hardly minuscule.Helping Hands is already a minuscule Stamina return, even for Stamknights. Battle Roar is powerful, but it's also the only thing that MagKnights have for sustain, and nerfing it is especially horrible when you consider that the class fights with attrition. How can you win through attrition if you always have worse sustain than your opponent?
Battle Roar will return more Health and Stamina for mDKs now. The change is part of a overarching combat change to prevent resource return from stacking 1 attribute to high heaven.
Winning through attrition is the old DK way. With buffs to whip, Leap, Flame staff, the popularity of BSW, and a BoL-esqe health, mDKs are burstier than ever in PVP.
Umm no ...not 2000 it's more like 1000..... max stam has nothing to do with it now it's level based... you get a break even at around 18k stam.... Battle Roar returns less stam .... your major mending is gutted... cost of block is x2 ... 30% increase the cost vigor ..... 10% more for all stam abilities...
I agree that magicka DKs did not take it on the chin as much as stam did .... as a class stam DKs are hurting
Vigor, block and I think it's 5% more (?), those things affect all stam classes.
Buuuut I agree, the Igneous shield nerf is damn heavy... Although my sNB has no sympathy for your newfound lack of major mending.
-30% increase in vigor costs...
-Blocking has been changed with multiple hits it's 50% more...
Your stam Night blade will have no trouble with DKs my brothers stamblade destroyed me in a duel where I knew he was coming last night... before last night it was longer and I usually edged him out... now I'm destroyed rather quickly ...he is actually doing more damage now then before ...
-
Right, all Stam classes cast Vigor and Block. Vigor and 5% Ability cost increase are just a blanket Stam nerf.
I just covet buffs I don't have. Want all buffs.
I'm not sure why his NB would hit you harder. No damage buffs for NB that I saw.
25 % direct damage buff champion tree... that's how...
I know all classes get this nerf ... I play all 4 stam classes ... I'm telling you the stam DK is by far the weakest at this point
Integral1900 wrote: »Rally, igneous weapons and dump cp in the new physical damage section, now buffed up just go and find baddies
Seriously, you'd think the sky was falling in, all my alts use heavy attacks and mostly two handed weapons, I use so little juice I took the points out of warlord months ago
Relax folks, every time they do big changes the panic merchants fire up that it's the end of the world, ain't happened yet baby
Integral1900 wrote: »Rally, igneous weapons and dump cp in the new physical damage section, now buffed up just go and find baddies
Seriously, you'd think the sky was falling in, all my alts use heavy attacks and mostly two handed weapons, I use so little juice I took the points out of warlord months ago
Relax folks, every time they do big changes the panic merchants fire up that it's the end of the world, ain't happened yet baby
Band Camp statements: To state "But this one time I saw X doing X... so that justifies X" Refers to the Band camp statement.
Coined by Maxwell
The_Outsider wrote: »The_Outsider wrote: »The_Outsider wrote: »He says already. Meaning currently. I'm clarifying how much Helping Hands will net you right now. No idea what it's going to be post-update.The_Outsider wrote: »Helping Hands will net you 2,000 Stam with ~40k Max Stam. That's hardly minuscule.Helping Hands is already a minuscule Stamina return, even for Stamknights. Battle Roar is powerful, but it's also the only thing that MagKnights have for sustain, and nerfing it is especially horrible when you consider that the class fights with attrition. How can you win through attrition if you always have worse sustain than your opponent?
Battle Roar will return more Health and Stamina for mDKs now. The change is part of a overarching combat change to prevent resource return from stacking 1 attribute to high heaven.
Winning through attrition is the old DK way. With buffs to whip, Leap, Flame staff, the popularity of BSW, and a BoL-esqe health, mDKs are burstier than ever in PVP.
Umm no ...not 2000 it's more like 1000..... max stam has nothing to do with it now it's level based... you get a break even at around 18k stam.... Battle Roar returns less stam .... your major mending is gutted... cost of block is x2 ... 30% increase the cost vigor ..... 10% more for all stam abilities...
I agree that magicka DKs did not take it on the chin as much as stam did .... as a class stam DKs are hurting
Vigor, block and I think it's 5% more (?), those things affect all stam classes.
Buuuut I agree, the Igneous shield nerf is damn heavy... Although my sNB has no sympathy for your newfound lack of major mending.
-30% increase in vigor costs...
-Blocking has been changed with multiple hits it's 50% more...
Your stam Night blade will have no trouble with DKs my brothers stamblade destroyed me in a duel where I knew he was coming last night... before last night it was longer and I usually edged him out... now I'm destroyed rather quickly ...he is actually doing more damage now then before ...
-
Right, all Stam classes cast Vigor and Block. Vigor and 5% Ability cost increase are just a blanket Stam nerf.
I just covet buffs I don't have. Want all buffs.
I'm not sure why his NB would hit you harder. No damage buffs for NB that I saw.
25 % direct damage buff champion tree... that's how...
I know all classes get this nerf ... I play all 4 stam classes ... I'm telling you the stam DK is by far the weakest at this point
Ya possibly. There should be at least 1 more round of change revisions before the actually update hits so I guess we'll just have to see what they do. Sorcs didn't get any nerfs this update so I'm wondering which community will now be the loudest, DKs or Templars?
FloppyTouch wrote: »When you have people like fengrush going to ZoS hq to help with balance this is want you get no nerf to Stam sorc but huge nerfs to any class they had issues fighting.
I'm very upset myself I'm just going to farm now. Already cancel my pre order like ZoS even cares but it's the best I can do.
This hurts Stam dk a lot but also mdk too is a huge nerf to dk in general.
You know these changes if they stay like this will be on the base game and not just those that get Morrowind
Consider the Following:I honestly have to agree with the Zen Team's nerfs to DK. Good job team.
- Dragon Knights are more leaned as tanks. DPS should not be their go.
- The ARE "unkillable" DKs out there. Twenty people hitting a DK that never runs out of stamina or magicka; infinite block. Health never goes down until there are at least thirty people.
- A lot of DKs spam igneous shield infinitely, making them deathless.
- Helping hands give DKs extra blocking fuel + ultimate attribute refund = infinite block, health.
In my opinion the changes are good.
Not everything makes total sense, but at least it is important again to have ressouce management...come on...who crafted a recovery glyph the last months??
I invested 15min and have a working setup for my magicka PVP DK...loose a little bit spelldamage, but with the double cp damage bonus my damage will be higher.
en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=13645
And you won't have any stamina problems anymore. Magicka sustain is also fine with magicka furnace and engine guardian.
In my opinion the changes are good.
Not everything makes total sense, but at least it is important again to have ressouce management...come on...who crafted a recovery glyph the last months??
I invested 15min and have a working setup for my magicka PVP DK...loose a little bit spelldamage, but with the double cp damage bonus my damage will be higher.
en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=13645
And you won't have any stamina problems anymore. Magicka sustain is also fine with magicka furnace and engine guardian.
there is no cp on battlegrounds dude
and srly why inner light over Flames of oblivion?
magictucktuck wrote: »Now maybe I'm wrong, I do play stam DK so the guy running around saying you don't play dk STFU can leave me alone.
But is anyone looking at these nerfs as a whole? everyone is getting nerfed resource wise. If only US dk's could get this on demand stam return we would be OP. (well warden will have a small amount now, but so do we still! just a little less to be in line with everyone else, but its still more than most others can say)
everyone is just QQ about their class not realizing that EVERYONE took a nerf so I would hope that this keeps us all on the same level and require us to manage our resources.
Band Camp statements: To state "But this one time I saw X doing X... so that justifies X" Refers to the Band camp statement.
Coined by Maxwell
Band Camp statements: To state "But this one time I saw X doing X... so that justifies X" Refers to the Band camp statement.
Coined by Maxwell