Balance direction in Update 13

Izaki · January 2017

technohic wrote: »

IzakiBrotherSs wrote: »

So no one even cares about stamina builds in PvE DPS?.. I understand hating on them in PvP, but to not see how they have been over nerfed and no one making mention of it kinda baffles me.

Well yeah. Quite a few people seem to care and I am hoping they have something for Stamplars in "PTS3"

Yeah but all the justified complaints about Curse, Strife, Radiant and Blazing seem to take up all the space. Not enough of us defending the stam boys. We really gotta get ZOS to see that they went down a little too hard on the nerf hammer for pve stamina dps.

zyk · January 2017

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Betheny wrote: »

Gamers who need things "simplified" shouldn't be playing games!

So because i'm an older gamer and slower... I shouldn't be playing games? That's a pretty narrow view don't you think?

I'm older and slower too. But I don't want ezmode. When the day comes that I can no longer compete, so be it. I'll do something else. I don't want crutches to help me compete against better players. It's fair neither to them nor me.

Instead of giving slower players crutches, why don't you create tools to right-size competition? For example, in Cyrodiil, create gameplay that encourages the best players to compete against each other for the best rewards. Since launch, the opposite has happened because farming less effective players is most profitable.

If competition was right-sized, you would have less need for training wheels like proc sets, easy healing and the current manifestation of heavy armor.

Your approach to balancing competition has failed because good players have taken the tools you've given slow players to create burst builds with unlimited sustain, tank builds with unlimited healing, etc... The casualties are the players who refuse to adapt to the tank/proc paradigm because it results in poor gameplay.

cschwingeb14_ESO · January 2017

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

[*] Haunting Curse – This one falls into the “simplify” category. The goal was to free up globals for more abilities to be cast with this change. (i.e. – every 10.5 seconds you get to use 3 more abilities) @Alpheu5 has a pretty great image that illustrates this change in this thread.
-rich

I good way to simplify the rotation and still leave this ability available to PvP players would be to have to explode 3.5 seconds after cast, then explode 6 seconds after that.

This frees up globals in PvE rotations in a similar fashion, but allows for PvP burst in a timeframe that is useful

tinythinker · January 2017

@ZOS_RichLambert thanks for the info. It makes giving more useful feedback possible. Many players have previously suggested moving the general power level and challenge toward the mean, while leaving outliers like vMA and vMoL hardmode on one end and starter islands on others. Yet, to pick a popular example from the patch notes, taking the stun from Blazing Spear works against that goal (makes it harder for players who rely on the stun) even though it may make Luminous Shards more appealing (thus achieving a different goal -- simplification of rotations and parity of morph choice). So by knowing the goals you and your staff have in mind, it is easier to understand the changes, to accept the changes, or to offer better alternatives to move toward the balance you are looking for.

To use the example given, there have been numerous suggestions made about that and other highly popular skills since the changes were announced in the patch notes, but the details you offered make for better replies ("give the DoT to Luminous and let Blazing keep its stun", "let Luminous disorient multiple enemies", etc.) which have been offered all over this forum. Would love to hear more about the thinking behind the changes to the most popular skills (and why less popular skills aren't getting attention -- are they in the last round of changes for this PTS cycle?).

zyk wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Betheny wrote: »

Gamers who need things "simplified" shouldn't be playing games!

So because i'm an older gamer and slower... I shouldn't be playing games? That's a pretty narrow view don't you think?

I'm older and slower too. But I don't want ezmode. When the day comes that I can no longer compete, so be it. I'll do something else. I don't want crutches to help me compete against better players. It's neither fair to them or I.

Instead of giving slower players crutches, why don't you instead create tools to right-size competition? For example, in Cyrodiil, create gameplay that encourages the best players to compete against each other for the best rewards. Since launch, the opposite has happened because farming less effective players is most profitable.

If competition was right-sized, you would have less need for training wheels like proc sets, easy healing and the current manifestation of heavy armor.

Your approach to balancing competition has failed because good players have taken the tools you've given slow players to create burst builds with unlimited sustain, tank builds with unlimited healing, etc... The casualties are the players who refuse to adapt to the tank/proc paradigm because it results in poor gameplay.

Trying to divide this into EZmode vs. Hardmode isn't the way to go. Many players of all ages are good at or enjoy some things moreso than others. You are correct about sets meant to close the gap being used to make too strong characters even stronger, which gets at the issue of roles and playstyle diversity. If PvE and PvP revolve around a DPS check as the primary feature 24/7, "fixes" will always be highly prone to backfire.

There are soooo many ways to deal with this, and many have been suggested repeatedly. Would love to hear what ZOS has talked about internally (even just a peak). You can have trash mobs and bosses that don't just melt if hit with too much burst. There is if I recall a mechanic that is kind of anti-DPS in White-Gold Tower but there are many ways to make other roles more valuable.

For PvP there can be a set that breaks the "I have to use damage shields 24/7 if I wear light armor" meta, to suggest something that gets out of the rut that many players fall into. Or sets that let people do what they enjoy most in AvA without being locked into a couple of roles with the same playstyle going on month after month, year after year.

From this thread:
Siegeproof - Wearer takes 50% less from siege engines.

Engineer - Siege engines decay 50% slower when run by the wearer and fire 25% faster for 25% more damage.

Standard Bearer - Wearer takes 60% less damage and deals 40% more damage when fighting on a flag.

There is the idea of having certain stats be inverse to one another so that if you choose to stack something really high you give up something else and acquire a weakness. It is applicable to PvE and PvP.

Many players have offered ideas better than these I just don't have the links as handy. But the point isn't the specific suggestions but the direction they indicate for balance. They point away from just nerfing and buffing base power levels and toward using complimentary and antagonistic options for balance.

Venscal · January 2017

Has there ever been any thought to player's with a constantly high Ping Rate In regards to balance.

I main a sorc and with an average ping of 300-350 and trying to maintain any rotation especially if it involves using a shield in between or swapping weapon bars it is nearly impossible to keep up with players with a much lower ping even NPC's some times.
For this reason i very rarely have any success duelling or 1x1 and tend not to enjoy this part of the game.

bitels · January 2017

@ZOS_RichLambert
Is direction of lowering a celing and simplifying combat could lead to the AC changes? Or could you please confirm that you didnt change your mind about it being skill based feature that will stay in game?

lefthandovgod · January 2017

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Update 13 has been out on the PTS for almost a week now and there’s been a lot of good feedback and questions posted with regards to the balance changes. I wanted to take a few moments to briefly discuss the overall direction for these changes so you can hopefully start to see why these changes are occurring.

For Update 13, our overall goal was to lessen the gap between the top and bottom. (in terms of overall damage output, coordinated vs. uncoordinated, small and large scale PVE & PVP) This doesn’t mean all classes are perfectly equal in all ways or that we want to remove skill from the game. We want to establish a solid baseline so that we can better tune and tweak balance. For this update we attacked this problem from multiple angles by doing the following:
Lowering the ceiling on the top damage

Raising the floor on the bottom damage

Simplifying some of the more intense rotations to make them a bit easier for players of all skill levels

Some of you will probably ask how the above goals translate into the changes we made. Here are some notes on a couple of the more hotly debated ones so you can see how they fit into the bigger picture:
Proc Sets – This change falls directly into the “lower the ceiling” category for both PVP and PVE. We wanted to reduce the overall burst potential without dramatically lowering sustain. There have been a lot of comments on this change, specifically from the PVP side where sets not critting will not help because of the Impenetrable trait - Impen does not reduce the chance of being crit - it reduces the damage of the crit that hits you.

Stun Removal on Blazing Spear – This change falls into the “simplify” category. We increased the duration of the damage on this ability to simplify the rotation. In addition we removed the stun component. Now the morph choices are more damage or more resources and disorient. (CC)

Radiant Destruction – This one is definitely in the “lower the ceiling” category. It was strong in both PVE and PVP and needed adjustment.

Haunting Curse – This one falls into the “simplify” category. The goal was to free up globals for more abilities to be cast with this change. (i.e. – every 10.5 seconds you get to use 3 more abilities) @Alpheu5 has a pretty great image that illustrates this change in this thread.

I didn't touch on every change or class, but I hope that sheds some light into how and why we've made some of the changes we've made. We have a lot more balance changes planned, but due to how our build cycle works, most of them won't make the next PTS build - they should hopefully make PTS3 though.

It should also be noted that what is on PTS now is our first pass at these changes. We’re evaluating all of them and will make adjustments based on both feedback and data collected, so please continue to test them on PTS and give feedback.

-rich

The thing that scares me the most about this, is how you are taking all of my hard work (almost 4000 hours into this game) and basically saying that "you got to good at this game" and now need to put me back in my place... I put a lot of time into actually playing this game, researching and trying to figure out how to coordinate my groups to utilize the the sets and skills that YOU gave us, to beat the content that YOU created for us. If you made things too hard, then I should not be punished because you want to make it easier for newer and other specific people. If you want to raise the floor, it may irk some people, but you should definitely not be purposefully lowering the ceiling. This has nothing to do with age, skill level or anything else besides the fact that I have actual time into getting to that ceiling, which you are now telling me was time well wasted.... I understand you need to progress newer people faster as an MMO gets older, or else you will never get new players. But why such a low blow to the people who have stayed loyal and worked hard to get to the point they are at?

SublimeSparo · January 2017

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

I'm sorry, but Lol @ All the people telling Rich not to be a gamer because he does not share your views on difficulty or balance. Bonus lol for all the old jokes. I didn't think 30's was the point where crippling arthwrytis sets in.

Personally waiting to see the next additions to the PTS. I want to see more strides taken to lower the damage ceiling, raise the damage floor and balance around that. Because honestly? This game needs it bad.

I'm 30 this year and have had a form of arthritis since i was 20. I don't think age or disabilities should have any consideration with regards to balancing a game.

Digiman · January 2017

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Betheny wrote: »

Gamers who need things "simplified" shouldn't be playing games!

So because i'm an older gamer and slower... I shouldn't be playing games? That's a pretty narrow view don't you think?

@ZOS_RichLambert they are angry, it seems like their playstyle is being completely gutted because you want to cause less pressure on using an ability that is clearly a DPS decrease without compensating it.

A lot of changes have happened to Sorcerer, some good most bad. The class itself just isn't that fun to play where I am forced to dual bar pets and bound armor to keep active. It's very restrictive. We are forced into restictive builds to remain relevant while other classes can be inventive with their own and weapons they pick.

I know nothing is going to change and there will probably be more nerfs for this class that I disagree with but you have to accept the anger of loyal players to a class that is in strife.

Doubt you would read this or even care about it. But wanted to at least put my thoughts out somewhere.

AyeshaBelladonna · January 2017

please please PLEASE consider getting something more in the works for separating pvp vs pve player skills. trying to balance skills on character types that may use the same skills but in many cases have them applied in completely different ways or builds makes us have to rework our builds every time you guys try to 'level the playing field' and it usually winds up penalizing one or the other (pve vs pvp) without actually leveling out either. example, that last leveling changes to sort made my magsorc useless in pvp but too op in pve. i had her nicely balanced to work in either with just a gear change and then i had to decide which way i wanted to play her because she could no longer easily do both. i was unhappy, but hey- it made us choose where we wanted to excel most. now you are saying you are re-balancing everything again..... which means all the work i just put into her to make her great in pve and fun ill have to do over again because now you don't want us making completely different build choices for it again? maybe i misunderstand..... but i have magplars too. again, totally different builds for pve and pvp.... pve ok yeah Radiant Destruction/oppression, it was a little TOO effective, but unless someone is REALLY lucky with keeping line of sight and has the new channel abilities sets on it never seemed to work worth crap in pvp. now they just got straight nerfed with their only execute and it will make pvp use useless and pve far less effective.... wouldn't a better solution been to leave its dmg alone but perhaps make it more on par with the range of say the nb execute and drop it from 50% to the same 25% everyone else executes are at? ...and nothing else is getting a buff to help balance the loss of execute effectiveness on magplar builds. Maybe I've missed something in the build changes but this really seems like I'm losing ground to the stam players on all my magic builds 2 major patches in a row, all in the name of balance that I'm not actually seeing. Can anyone suggest some things i can try to make my magic toons feel the 'balancing' a little less because as of right now its just kinda depressing to play mag builds on most of my toons.

(Note: due to mac pts client issues i have had to remake toons a lot to try and experience the changes and have only been able to do them one skill change at a time before having to remake the toon so i haven't gotten to test it much, but no-one seems to be having as much trouble as i am so any suggestions for templar and sorc would be great because checking out one change at a time and not in combination makes me sad)

STEVIL · January 2017

Betheny wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Betheny wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Betheny wrote: »

Gamers who need things "simplified" shouldn't be playing games!

So because i'm an older gamer and slower... I shouldn't be playing games? That's a pretty narrow view don't you think?

You're not that old yet mate, a more complex rotation is just a matter of practice. A LOT of it, just to get the muscle memory down. The "over 40" crowd in my guild do just fine, no reflex problems or slowness. They do say their fingers hurt a little after hours of PVP play, but it's totally worth it.

Besides, I plan on playing video games until they stick me in the ground dead. It's awesome that some of you older guys are still playing.

PS: If you think a 3.5 second curse is too short, how about a 6 second shield?

Hey that's a really good point - people who need help with their response time or whatever are going to find the six second shield a major problem.

@ZOS_RichLambert

VC...

Not talking about VC.

Six second shields is barely enough time to lay down a shield/defense and swap weapon bars get off some damage before you have to bulk up again with the shields.

They want to reduce damage, if they do that sorcerers will be in front of enemies even longer...that means defense will be needed more.

Longer shield length is desperately needed.

Nope... but front bar shields are good things.

Betheny · January 2017

STEVIL wrote: »

Betheny wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Betheny wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Betheny wrote: »

Gamers who need things "simplified" shouldn't be playing games!

So because i'm an older gamer and slower... I shouldn't be playing games? That's a pretty narrow view don't you think?

You're not that old yet mate, a more complex rotation is just a matter of practice. A LOT of it, just to get the muscle memory down. The "over 40" crowd in my guild do just fine, no reflex problems or slowness. They do say their fingers hurt a little after hours of PVP play, but it's totally worth it.

Besides, I plan on playing video games until they stick me in the ground dead. It's awesome that some of you older guys are still playing.

PS: If you think a 3.5 second curse is too short, how about a 6 second shield?

Hey that's a really good point - people who need help with their response time or whatever are going to find the six second shield a major problem.

@ZOS_RichLambert

VC...

Not talking about VC.

Six second shields is barely enough time to lay down a shield/defense and swap weapon bars get off some damage before you have to bulk up again with the shields.

They want to reduce damage, if they do that sorcerers will be in front of enemies even longer...that means defense will be needed more.

Longer shield length is desperately needed.

Nope... but front bar shields are good things.

Uh huh...uh huh...then you still have to weapon swap to get your attacks off.

Betheny · January 2017

If it's not clear - six second shields are too short.

Birdovic · January 2017

Oh man, New PTS Update tomorrow.
As I know from ZOS, they will probably do something like

"alright guys, we listened to your feedback and changed haunting curse to explode every 5sec instead of every 6sec".

Still I want and hope for a pleasant surprise like just reverting the change completely or even combining haunting curse with daedric prey as me and many many others wished.

If that happens, I feel like they truly started listening to the community and my faith in ZOS decisions has been restored a bit.

Dymence · January 2017

Birdovic wrote: »

Oh man, New PTS Update tomorrow.
As I know from ZOS, they will probably do something like

"alright guys, we listened to your feedback and changed haunting curse to explode every 5sec instead of every 6sec".

Still I want and hope for a pleasant surprise like just reverting the change completely or even combining haunting curse with daedric prey as me and many many others wished.

If that happens, I feel like they truly started listening to the community and my faith in ZOS decisions has been restored a bit.

Any big changes are likely going to be in the 3rd PTS cycle, rather than tomorrows'.

Birdovic · January 2017

@Dymence

Ah I see.
Alright, then lets hope for pleasant surprises over the whole PTS testing period instead. As long as they listen and won't let some questionable / unwanted decisions come to live servers again, despite all the feedback, im fine.

The Uninvited · January 2017

STEVIL wrote: »

Mojomonkeyman wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Betheny wrote: »

Gamers who need things "simplified" shouldn't be playing games!

So because i'm an older gamer and slower... I shouldn't be playing games? That's a pretty narrow view don't you think?

Sorry Rich, I`m close to my 40s and I don`t feel any decline in my abilities that would be noticable on non high-end esports level and I`m pretty sure it will be same thing in 10 years. I mean you don`t make playing a guitar or piano artificially easier the older the user gets.

You pov is as narrow, and you know it. I don`t wan`t my or others age to be your argument, I feel it`s discriminating. Quite the opposite, I wish you would focus a bit more on bringing back the difficulty and skill rquirements of games back in the day.

i wish i was still close to my 40s - from either side.

Me too, just passed the 46 mark today... So, close to my 50's now I guess.

Sharee · January 2017

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

We know that burst is really important in PVP

A magicka dragonknight says hello...

Rohamad_Ali · January 2017

bitels wrote: »

@ZOS_RichLambert
Is direction of lowering a celing and simplifying combat could lead to the AC changes? Or could you please confirm that you didnt change your mind about it being skill based feature that will stay in game?

Someone's Grandmother might try to animation cancel and break their hip . I've seen it before . We should remove dangerous animation canceling or allow macros for players in their golden years .

Jackey · January 2017

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

[*] Stun Removal on Blazing Spear – This change falls into the “simplify” category. We increased the duration of the damage on this ability to simplify the rotation. In addition we removed the stun component. Now the morph choices are more damage or more resources and disorient. (CC)

Please, leave Blazing Spear alone

STEVIL · January 2017

Betheny wrote: »

If it's not clear - six second shields are too short.

It is clear you think that or at least they may be too short for you for some content.

Its certainly not clear its an objective truth and there is circumstantial evidence zos thinks 6s timing is adequate and some non-circumstantial evidence others are making it work quite well.

Betheny · January 2017

STEVIL wrote: »

Betheny wrote: »

If it's not clear - six second shields are too short.

It is clear you think that or at least they may be too short for you for some content.

Its certainly not clear its an objective truth and there is circumstantial evidence zos thinks 6s timing is adequate and some non-circumstantial evidence others are making it work quite well.

Not many sorcs think six second shields is long enough.

All that's clear about your post is you have taken exception to the thought of longer shield length.

technohic · January 2017

Betheny wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Betheny wrote: »

If it's not clear - six second shields are too short.

It is clear you think that or at least they may be too short for you for some content.

Its certainly not clear its an objective truth and there is circumstantial evidence zos thinks 6s timing is adequate and some non-circumstantial evidence others are making it work quite well.

Not many sorcs think six second shields is long enough.

All that's clear about your post is you have taken exception to the thought of longer shield length.

As a Templar, I tend to agree as blazing has always been that long but it still serves a purpose. The problem is, that's how they really addressed shield stacking rather than adjusting individual shield values or limiting to just 1 at a time. The long duration made for a meta as equally skewed as our instagib proc or tank meta we have now.

ku5h · January 2017

hassubhai wrote: »

As someone who plays exclusively plays pvp games i can tell you one things which must remain to keep the pvp successful there is one factor. That factor is skill, skill difference is what makes pvp. The entire reason players even pit themselves against eachother is as a test of skill. Ofcourse this isnt the case for some on and off pvp players but anyone who has any serious interest in pvp values skill difference over anything else.

So why are we catering towards new players, for what reason? I seriously am missing the logic and would be extremely grateful if zos could explain why they want to lower the skill ceiling and floor. Nothing good ever comes from oversimplifying. Make things require skill and effort, i seriously just dont understand why anyone would think that a new non experienced player should win a fight vs a much better player just because of their armour or how forgiving the game mechanics are.

It's because we live in a "Even a little fat kid deserves a trophy" society now. Consolation trophies and all that.
Remember when trophies were reserved for very best of the best!? Those days are gone, God forbid we hurt someones feelings because he suck at something. Safe space and all that.

STEVIL · January 2017

Betheny wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Betheny wrote: »

If it's not clear - six second shields are too short.

It is clear you think that or at least they may be too short for you for some content.

Its certainly not clear its an objective truth and there is circumstantial evidence zos thinks 6s timing is adequate and some non-circumstantial evidence others are making it work quite well.

Not many sorcs think six second shields is long enough.

All that's clear about your post is you have taken exception to the thought of longer shield length.

I have seen shields longer than the current 6 to 10s duration. I prefer this to that.

I dont believe longer shields than the 6 to 10s we have now are desparately needed - but apparantly you do.

Thats where we disagree.

For me most of the time shields are needed i run them on front bar and its relatively uncommon for them to last the full durations more than say half the time.

I mean, really, an 18k shield lasting 6s means you suffered less than 3k total dps against you during that period.

I havent found anything desperate from 3k total dps enemies in a while on my non-newbie characters.

So to me, if the shield gets knocked down more often thsn it runs out the clock, more duration isnt a desperate need.

If the opposition damage is so weak it wont drop the shields before the duration, the situation isnt desperate barting maybe a few set piece dps trick challenges.

Imx many sorcs simpky adapted to the change, many referred to it as more annoying than significant.

But, clearly, for some, it made for a a desperate situation.

I think an interesting idea zos might should look into are having some shields with lower protections but longer durations for those low threat but desperate situations. Maybe have the shield last 20s at say half the power BUT regenerate some every second...

Not one i would jump to myself

xblackroxe · January 2017

STEVIL wrote: »

Betheny wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Betheny wrote: »

If it's not clear - six second shields are too short.

It is clear you think that or at least they may be too short for you for some content.

Its certainly not clear its an objective truth and there is circumstantial evidence zos thinks 6s timing is adequate and some non-circumstantial evidence others are making it work quite well.

Not many sorcs think six second shields is long enough.

All that's clear about your post is you have taken exception to the thought of longer shield length.

I have seen shields longer than the current 6 to 10s duration. I prefer this to that.

I dont believe longer shields than the 6 to 10s we have now are desparately needed - but apparantly you do.

Thats where we disagree.

For me most of the time shields are needed i run them on front bar and its relatively uncommon for them to last the full durations more than say half the time.

I mean, really, an 18k shield lasting 6s means you suffered less than 3k total dps against you during that period.

I havent found anything desperate from 3k total dps enemies in a while on my non-newbie characters.

So to me, if the shield gets knocked down more often thsn it runs out the clock, more duration isnt a desperate need.

If the opposition damage is so weak it wont drop the shields before the duration, the situation isnt desperate barting maybe a few set piece dps trick challenges.

Imx many sorcs simpky adapted to the change, many referred to it as more annoying than significant.

But, clearly, for some, it made for a a desperate situation.

I think an interesting idea zos might should look into are having some shields with lower protections but longer durations for those low threat but desperate situations. Maybe have the shield last 20s at say half the power BUT regenerate some every second...

Not one i would jump to myself

Well what say is true that when you are on defense shields wont stay the whole duration. But thats only half of the story.

The problem is without any reliable heal you have to keep shields up also during you offense to not get cc'd without shields up. And that makes it harder to sustain and dps opponents.

I dont think sorc are terrible now but a bump to ~10 sec shields would be quite nice.

Grunim · January 2017

The Uninvited wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Mojomonkeyman wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Betheny wrote: »

Gamers who need things "simplified" shouldn't be playing games!

So because i'm an older gamer and slower... I shouldn't be playing games? That's a pretty narrow view don't you think?

Sorry Rich, I`m close to my 40s and I don`t feel any decline in my abilities that would be noticable on non high-end esports level and I`m pretty sure it will be same thing in 10 years. I mean you don`t make playing a guitar or piano artificially easier the older the user gets.

You pov is as narrow, and you know it. I don`t wan`t my or others age to be your argument, I feel it`s discriminating. Quite the opposite, I wish you would focus a bit more on bringing back the difficulty and skill rquirements of games back in the day.

i wish i was still close to my 40s - from either side.

Me too, just passed the 46 mark today... So, close to my 50's now I guess.

Don't worry, you can still enjoy ESO over 50.

Wolfchild07 · January 2017

@ZOS_RichLambert

Can we please get a taunt added to the werewolf skill line? You could just add an extra passive for tank werewolves to take. The ult is otherwise pointless as a tank as you can't hold aggro of bosses.

Betheny · January 2017

xblackroxe wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Betheny wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Betheny wrote: »

If it's not clear - six second shields are too short.

It is clear you think that or at least they may be too short for you for some content.

Its certainly not clear its an objective truth and there is circumstantial evidence zos thinks 6s timing is adequate and some non-circumstantial evidence others are making it work quite well.

Not many sorcs think six second shields is long enough.

All that's clear about your post is you have taken exception to the thought of longer shield length.

I have seen shields longer than the current 6 to 10s duration. I prefer this to that.

I dont believe longer shields than the 6 to 10s we have now are desparately needed - but apparantly you do.

Thats where we disagree.

For me most of the time shields are needed i run them on front bar and its relatively uncommon for them to last the full durations more than say half the time.

I mean, really, an 18k shield lasting 6s means you suffered less than 3k total dps against you during that period.

I havent found anything desperate from 3k total dps enemies in a while on my non-newbie characters.

So to me, if the shield gets knocked down more often thsn it runs out the clock, more duration isnt a desperate need.

If the opposition damage is so weak it wont drop the shields before the duration, the situation isnt desperate barting maybe a few set piece dps trick challenges.

Imx many sorcs simpky adapted to the change, many referred to it as more annoying than significant.

But, clearly, for some, it made for a a desperate situation.

I think an interesting idea zos might should look into are having some shields with lower protections but longer durations for those low threat but desperate situations. Maybe have the shield last 20s at say half the power BUT regenerate some every second...

Not one i would jump to myself

Well what say is true that when you are on defense shields wont stay the whole duration. But thats only half of the story.

The problem is without any reliable heal you have to keep shields up also during you offense to not get cc'd without shields up. And that makes it harder to sustain and dps opponents.

I dont think sorc are terrible now but a bump to ~10 sec shields would be quite nice.

Agreed, 10 second shields would give some breathing room for applying damage, light armour sorcs are very squishy.

Hand_Bacon · January 2017

Obviously the biggest issue facing ESO were sorc pets.

At the beginning of every trial there is a call for sorc pets to be summoned.

At regular intervals in pvp there are calls for people to check their sorc pets.

True Stories.

If the cumulative time spent on changing sorc pets, from launch until now, was saved...it could have been used to add some real content.

I think I summoned one once...but it was an accident.