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Just another Sorc Suggestions Thread

Birdovic
Birdovic
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Im pretty much done with expressing my frustration at this point, however, I dont want to stop giving some solutions or ideas. Guess I cant give up fighting mindless nerfs afterall. :neutral:
I mean, the chance that a "lead designer" atleast reads this, is still there, so I will keep posting suggestions.


Honestly, giving feedback is comparable to the "Scathing Mage" Set.

Scathing Mage:
You have a CHANCE on Crit Hits to get a 10% CHANCE to receive extra Spelldmg.

Forum:
Your proposed solution has a CHANCE to be read to get a 10% CHANCE to receive an response and a 0.01% CHANCE to be taken into consideration when doing changes.

Ok enough rant, for real now.

______________________________________________________________________________


Now, for some Suggestions:
Im just throwing ideas around, giving something to discuss, some food for thoughts, maybe catch a Devs eye, stuff like that.
What I want to achieve here, is making the Sorc unique AND useful again, like giving more Group Utilities, make unused Abilities great again(heh), offer new Playstyles, make using Shields as core of your Playstyle AN option again (not the ONLY option), and overall ofc contribute more DPS, while keeping Stam Sorc in mind, too.

- Dark Exchange: While channeling and for 1 second after channeling ends, make immune to CC/Interrupt. When channeling ends, you grant close Allies Minor Intellect for 8 seconds.

- Hardened Ward: Increase the Duration to 8 seconds and increase extra Shield to 50%. Also grants Minor Protection and Minor Vitality for Duration.
Edited: Shield lasts 6 seconds and has 33% more Shield. Also grants Minor Protection and Minor Vitality for 12 Seconds.

- Empowered Ward: Increase Duration to 12 seconds and prevent stuns from stealth/All Stuns(other cc's still work). Also grants a HoT effect(overall amount of healing similar to vigor, but spread over a 12 seconds duration ).
Edited: Increase Duration to 12 seconds and prevent stuns from stealth. Also grants a HoT effect for 8 seconds(healing similar to vigor, but spread over 8 seconds).

- Ball of Lightning: Increase range by 4m. Also absorbs up to 8 Projectiles(any) fired at you for 3 seconds.


Mages Fury:

Endless Fury:
- Increase Damage by 15%, explosion damage also affected. When killing a target, you gain Major Heroism for 9 seconds.
Edited: The Explosion now can proc at 25% health. When killing the target, you gain Major Heroism for 9 seconds, gaining 1 Ultimate every 1.5 seconds.

Mages Wrath:
- Increase Damage by 50%. Explosion damage is not affected.


- Lightning Flood: When Duration is over, it explodes for X damage and inflicts Minor Maim for 10 Seconds to everyone hit.
Edited: Lightning Flood: When Duration is over, it explodes for X Shockdamage, inflicting Minor Maim. Activating the synergy inflicts Major Defile for 8 Seconds on up to 6 hit targets.

- Chrystal Shard:

Chrystal Blast(Morph 1):
- This ability now scales with Max Stamina and Weapon Damage.
When activating, you slam your enemy with a massive chrystal, knocking him back and disorienting for 2.5 seconds (cast time 1 sec), while dealing X damage (X is about a Hardcast Frag dmg).

New: Chrystal Fragment(Morph 2):
- This Ability now deals 5% less damage, but Damage Type is changed from Magic Damage to Shock Damage (-5% dmg because of passive, can proc Desintegrate now)


Encase:

Shattering Prison(Morph 1):
- Damage dealt when Ability ends, is increased by 50%. Also inflicts slow of 25% for 5 seconds.

Restraining Aura (Morph 2; Restraining Prison):
- This is now a Player based AoE with 5m Radius. Enemies hit are immobilized for 4 seconds and are afflicted by Major Breach and Fracture for 8 seconds.


Bound Armor:

Bound Armaments (Morph 1):

Slotting:
- Light + Heavy attacks deal 15% more Damage
- Max Stamina is increased by 8%
- New: Magicka costs are affected by stamina Cost reductions

On activation:
- grants Minor Berserk for 12 sec
- grants Minor Brutality for 12 sec.
- Removes snares and immobiliziations
- Grants snare immunity for 3 sec.



Bound Aegis (Morph 2):

Slotting:
- Heavy Attacks deal 30% more Damage
- Max Magicka is increased by 8%
- New:Stamina costs are affected by Magicka Cost reductions

On activation:
- Grants Minor Berserk for 12 sec
- Grants Minor Sorcery for 12 sec.
- While active, 10% of incoming Damage is restored as Magicka. This can happen once every 2 seconds.


Daedric Prey:
- New:Cannot be purged
- While an enemy is affected by this Ability, summon time of Pets is halved and costs 20% less.
- The Atronach's Arrival now also benefits from 40% additional Damage from Daedric Prey, if it lands on an affected Enemy.



Ultimates:

Suppression Field:
- Depending on higher Stat Pool(Max Magicka/Max Stamina), the Type of damage changes to Shock Damage (Higher Max Magicka) or to Poison (Higher Max Stamina).
- While Suppression Field is active: Increase every elemental Damage you deal by 20% and Poison Damage by 10%.

Absorption Field:
- Standing inside the Orb grants you and your Allies Minor Slayer. Additionally increases Weapon Crit and Spellcrit by 10% (this is NOT a Major Buff!)

Greater Charged Atronach: (Combination of both morphs)
- Additionally has a powerful Area of Effect attack. Major Berserk synergy can be activated by up to 2 Allies and activation range is increased by 3 meters. The Atronach cannot be CC'ed.

Empowering Atronach:
- On activation: Grants you Major Berserk for 8 seconds or until Atronach dies. When attacking close enemies(7m range), he is using powerful Melee Attacks, dealing Physical Damage, scaling with Weapon Damage and Stamina.

Power Overload:
- Only increases Heavy Attacks damage. Increases Range, Radius and Damage by 35%. While channeling, your Spellresistance and Armor are increased by 5000.

Energy Overload:
- On Activation: Grants Minor(/Major Slayer?), Increasing every Damage you do to Boss Monsters by 5%(/10%?), for 12 seconds


Any ideas? Let me know!
Edited by Birdovic on June 7, 2016 8:17AM
  • dsalter
    dsalter
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    overload is the reason sorcs keep getting nerfed. the class is judged by this crutch ultimate, it needs scrapped
    PLEASE REPLY TO ME WITH @dsalter otherwise i'm likely to miss the reply if its not my own thread

    EU - [Arch Mage Dave] Altmer Sorcerer
    Fight back at the crates and boxes, together we can change things.

  • InvitationNotFound
    InvitationNotFound
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    more shield duration
    more inevitable detonation base damage (for a bigger sorc build variety, see: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/269268/inevitable-detonation )

    and the class might be useful again.
    We want firing off Dark Exchange in the middle of combat to feel awesome... - The Wrobler
    You know you don't have to be here right? - Rich Lambert
    Verrätst du mir deinen Beruf? Ich würde auch gerne mal Annahmen dazu schreiben, wie simple die Aufgaben anderer sind. - Kai Schober

    Addons:
    RdK Group Tool: esoui DE EN FR
    Port to Friend's House: esoui DE EN FR - Library: DE EN
    Yet another Compass: esoui DE EN FR
    Group Buffs: esoui DE EN FR
  • Birdovic
    Birdovic
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    more shield duration
    more inevitable detonation base damage (for a bigger sorc build variety, see: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/269268/inevitable-detonation )

    and the class might be useful again.

    @InvitationNotFound

    I doubt buffing Detonation will do any good. In my eyes, the whole introduction of this ability was a wrong decision to begin with, and VD on top of that was the killing blow(Yes I prefer AoE Caps to be gone^^).

    Sure, bursting in pvp, I get your point. But whatever you do with that Ability, other classes will also benefit from it, everyone has access, thats why I dont support your proposed buff to that Ability. The Sorcerer itself needs buffs.

    So:
    The sorcerer needs Improvements in a way, which only the class itself can benefit from: CLASS ABILITIES.

    And there are many ways to do so, thats why I showed some examples.


    @dsalter

    Not the only reason, but definetly one. What needs to be done is, offering other/stronger possible ways to do PvE Content.
    As for VMoL, Overloads burst time is simply too short, thats why I think this is a good starting point.

    The hardest content can only be done with a Rotation, which does not nonstop rely on an Ultimate.
    So what should be done?
    Changes to existing Abilities need to happen, changes which offer Rotations including Sorc class abilities and which surpass the boring but effective overload spam.

    Again: Class Abilities. My proposed Negate Magic Morph changes sound overkill, but thats because they offer Buffs/Debuffs, no other class can contribute to the fight.

    Who wouldnt want someone in the group, who can grant everyone Minor Slayer or a unique Spellcrit+Weapon crit chance increase(which can be stacked with Minor/Major Crit Buffs) at the same time?

    If a sorc can do great DPS again with a unique rotation and has exclusive access to some awesome buffs/group buffs, atleast in PvE the sorcerer will be welcome again.
    Edited by Birdovic on June 5, 2016 8:53PM
  • InvitationNotFound
    InvitationNotFound
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    @andypappb16_ESO

    You should differentiate between proximity detonation and inevitable detonation. while i don't see a problem with the proximity detonation, inevitable detonation was rarely used by ballgroups and there not an issue at all. with this nerf you directly affect the amount of viable sorc builds, as it was part of certain, rarely seen, builds. Therefore it would definitely increase the variety of builds, if this skill gets improved.

    At the end of the day it doesn't matter, if it's a class ability or not. the class should be fun to play with the skills you have available. in the current state it isn't due to:
    - reduced mobility (hurricane reduced the speed boost from 40% to 10%)
    - reduced shield duration (you have to hammer the same button all over again, while it costs have been increased)
    - made inevitable detonation and trapping webs useless for magicka sorcs

    of course, these changes affect magicka and not stamina sorcs. stamina sorcs are a complete other topic.

    this leads to a very reduced set of different magicka sorc builds. and they are generally boring and not fun at all to play (even they might, depending on the situation, still perform okay - depending on the build and player).
    If a sorc can do great DPS again with a unique rotation and has exclusive access to some awesome buffs/group buffs, atleast in PvE the sorcerer will be welcome again.
    Sorry, but I still wouldn't want to play sorc in pve then... dps wasn't that good before and they won't make it better. and playing as the buff bot sounds rather boring.

    or in other words: unfortunately, i don't see any of the changes you proposed to make sorc fun to play again.
    We want firing off Dark Exchange in the middle of combat to feel awesome... - The Wrobler
    You know you don't have to be here right? - Rich Lambert
    Verrätst du mir deinen Beruf? Ich würde auch gerne mal Annahmen dazu schreiben, wie simple die Aufgaben anderer sind. - Kai Schober

    Addons:
    RdK Group Tool: esoui DE EN FR
    Port to Friend's House: esoui DE EN FR - Library: DE EN
    Yet another Compass: esoui DE EN FR
    Group Buffs: esoui DE EN FR
  • Birdovic
    Birdovic
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    @InvitationNotFound

    Dont worry, I kept both morphs in mind. I used that typical Daedric Curse + Det + Dawnbreaker/Other Ult + Streak into crowd Combo all the time myself when it still was "unique" and at some point it wasnt rare at all, everyone doing it.

    Im more worried about Dawnbreaker, if it comes to Non-class abilities tho. They really shouldve kept one morph Magicka. "Fighter guild is only useful for stamina and Mages Guild only useful for Magicka" is such a narrow minded Mindset (That was the explanation for Dawnbreaker changes).

    At the end of the day it doesn't matter, if it's a class ability or not. the class should be fun to play with the skills you have available. in the current state it isn't due to:

    So we could just go ahead and delete all Class Skill Trees, because, doesnt matter right? :smiley:
    The Class Abilities ARE THE REASON the sorc is not fun to play.
    When someone thinks of a Sorc its usually
    "Overload Spammer Noob"
    "Shield Spammer Noob"
    and to top it off: "streak spammer noob"

    Why is that?
    It is because these are the only effective Abilities a sorc arsenal consists of and therefore is often seen.
    But not only that:
    They are too effective: With one push, a sorc receives lots of Defense (Shield, which is not a lot this patch anymore) or deals lots of Damage(overload).
    On top of that the rest is either underwhelming damagewise or disappointing when it comes to utility.
    So why do we need more? Lets keep it simple and boring, leave everything else to rot(rest of sorc abilities).
    Sadly there is no reason to slot like 50% of Sorc Class Abilities.
    A Nightblade as example, is great, it has many possibilities for different playstyles or builds.

    - reduced mobility (hurricane reduced the speed boost from 40% to 10%)
    - reduced shield duration (you have to hammer the same button all over again, while it costs have been increased)
    - made inevitable detonation and trapping webs useless for magicka sorcs

    1) Hurricane isnt relevant at all for a Magicka Sorc, I want the overall movement speed to be fixed already (they said it will)
    2) Reduced duration + buffs to other classes is the problem
    3) Agree + Dawnbreaker

    this leads to a very reduced set of different magicka sorc builds. and they are generally boring and not fun at all to play (even they might, depending on the situation, still perform okay - depending on the build and player).
    Sorry, but I still wouldn't want to play sorc in pve then... dps wasn't that good before and they won't make it better. and playing as the buff bot sounds rather boring.

    So what you're saying is no to overall changed Class Abilities, which make you stronger, support your team and allow for tons of new builds, but instead you see a buff to detonation as the solution to the whole Sorc Problem and want to keep pulling that boring det+curse combo again?

    Now im certain: I disagree with you^^
  • InvitationNotFound
    InvitationNotFound
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    i had 3 points ;) inevitable deto (not proximity) is only one of them.

    the combination of those make the difference. if you fix those three points, you're almost where you were as before (except the buffs of other classes, poisons and that ****).

    regarding Dawnbreaker: well, i was rarely using this ulti so i currently do no miss it personally. but of course, for sorc variety the change was bad.

    of course, adding some useful class abilities wouldn't be bad, but:
    - it shouldn't end in a pve build related to being a buff bot
    - the skills should make sense in pvp. can't see much in your suggestions i'd like to see there, despite numbers and stuff are missing.

    e.g.: lightning flood. chances of people staying in there and waiting for the explosion is very small. i'm not using this skill right now in pvp and i most like won't when adjusting my build. adding a fancy explosion (or want to make it so strong that it becomes the new deto^^) and some debuffs, which can easily be purged wouldn't change anything at all in my opinion.

    furthermore, i doubt our balance lord mr wrobler would implement a single skill as suggested and would find a "better" way to achieve something that is completely wrong. chances are higher that new abilities will introduce a ton of s*** whereas a simple revert might not mess up the whole game. so yes, i'd prefer to revert the changes instead of some fancy new stuff to which we have to stick at least 3-6 month before any changes are being made to them again.
    We want firing off Dark Exchange in the middle of combat to feel awesome... - The Wrobler
    You know you don't have to be here right? - Rich Lambert
    Verrätst du mir deinen Beruf? Ich würde auch gerne mal Annahmen dazu schreiben, wie simple die Aufgaben anderer sind. - Kai Schober

    Addons:
    RdK Group Tool: esoui DE EN FR
    Port to Friend's House: esoui DE EN FR - Library: DE EN
    Yet another Compass: esoui DE EN FR
    Group Buffs: esoui DE EN FR
  • GreatWhite000
    GreatWhite000
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    I think 10 or 12 seconds for the ward would make sorc bearable again, til then it's a damage lacking class that has basically had one of it's class defining skills nerfed into the ground. I can't DPS a high-damage boss very well because I either die trying to put forth actual damage or I do hardly any damage due to the fact that shields are constantly being re-applied when there used to be ample time to reapply them when they were low and get some actual damage in. The damage to surge is a joke.
  • Mordenkainen
    Mordenkainen
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    For all the shield fans in this post. Just today We had a sorc keeping almost a whole 20 man group busy, constantly putting 23k shields up


    Hardened Ward and all that stuff can die in a nerf-fire for all I care.

    I'm sure as hell not a super pro pvp-gamer, but boy am I sick of immortal Sorcerers and Dragon Knights.
    Edited by Mordenkainen on June 6, 2016 10:28AM
  • InvitationNotFound
    InvitationNotFound
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    For all the shield fans in this post. Just today We had a sorc keeping almost a whole 20 man group busy, constantly putting 23k shields up


    Hardened Ward and all that stuff can die in a nerf-fire for all I care.

    I'm sure as hell not a super pro pvp-gamer, but boy am I sick of immortal Sorcerers and Dragon Knights.

    if you fail to kill a single sorc with your 20 man group, i have bad, very bad news for you...

    edit: you probably should start killing crabs in the beginners area again...
    edit #2: and now seriously, go and read some tutorials / build videos etc and learn to play your class. and maybe make the same recommendation to your 19 friends. because failing in a 20vs1 has nothing to do with the strength (OPness) of your opponent.
    Edited by InvitationNotFound on June 6, 2016 10:37AM
    We want firing off Dark Exchange in the middle of combat to feel awesome... - The Wrobler
    You know you don't have to be here right? - Rich Lambert
    Verrätst du mir deinen Beruf? Ich würde auch gerne mal Annahmen dazu schreiben, wie simple die Aufgaben anderer sind. - Kai Schober

    Addons:
    RdK Group Tool: esoui DE EN FR
    Port to Friend's House: esoui DE EN FR - Library: DE EN
    Yet another Compass: esoui DE EN FR
    Group Buffs: esoui DE EN FR
  • Digiman
    Digiman
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    Well empowered ward actually lasts 10 seconds. But personally I think advice for changes on Sorcerers fall on deaf ears and would have no point in suggesting it.

    The class was give and thread by @Wrobel about the changes he made to sorcerers, and was basically "They are fine, deal with it" attitude.

    Personally the class needs a full overhaul. Its broken, ever since they changed light armor to be 1/4 during the removal of soft caps the class headed into a complete design decline into shoving pets on users and making the lynch pin of the classes survivability shields.

    The moment @Wrobel changed that the whole class fell apart. He should be ashamed of it.

    In all honestly this class is going to have to have a full overhaul to justify playing it for fun.

    With rumors of Vvardenfall being the next DLC expansion and it's size from data mining that could take up a year's time before any changes ever happen.
  • Alpheu5
    Alpheu5
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    Two words:

    Pet healthbars
    Dalek-Rok - Argonian Sorcerer || Dalek-Shād - Argonian Nightblade || Dalek-Shul - Argonian Templar || Dalek-Xal - Argonian Dragonknight || Mounts-the-Snout - Argonian Warden || Dalek-Xul - Argonian Necromancer || Two-Spires - Argonian Arcanist || Dalek-Nesh - Argonian Sorcerer || Dalek-Kör - Argonian Dragonknight
    Don't incorporate bugs into your builds, and you won't have [an] issue.
  • Birdovic
    Birdovic
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    For all the shield fans in this post. Just today We had a sorc keeping almost a whole 20 man group busy, constantly putting 23k shields up


    Hardened Ward and all that stuff can die in a nerf-fire for all I care.

    I'm sure as hell not a super pro pvp-gamer, but boy am I sick of immortal Sorcerers and Dragon Knights.

    Well, its not like Shield was "nerfed", actually its doing the same it did before. All it does right now is being an "emergency heal" because it doesnt last long enough anymore, replacing old meta sorc low health, whereas you could use a Healing Ward instead, too. Combined with Harness Magicka the stacking is not gone at all.

    I dont know how a 20 man group couldnt take down a sorcerer, especially after these changes, sounds like that guy just timed dodge rolls + shields + move out of LOS really good, just like Stam Classes dodge roll + shuffle + LOS + heal all the time.

    The most important question: Did he efficiently fight back?
    I doubt it. So that guy was nothing but annoying in the end, achieving nothing again.

    @Digiman

    My hopes for Vvardenfell lie on the Telvanni now. This is where we probably (lorewise)got the most famous Sorcerers (wont ever visit Artaeum I guess). But yeah, "Hope".
    I dont know how often I mentioned "Hope" is all that is left to me with these questionable nerfs/buffs/ gameplay runining decisions^^
    Alpheu5 wrote: »
    Two words:

    Pet healthbars

    Please :neutral:
    Edited by Birdovic on June 6, 2016 11:27AM
  • RebornV3x
    RebornV3x
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    - Hardened Ward: Increase the Duration to 8 seconds and increase extra Shield to 50%. Also grants Minor Protection and Minor Vitality for Duration.
    Not sure increasing the shields by 50% will make a lot of people happy the best we can hope for is the skill to cost less to cast since the duration has been reduced. I really wish they would revert the change to this ability.
    - Endless Fury: Increase Damage by 15%, explosion damage also affected. When killing a target, you gain Major Heroism for 9 seconds.
    How bout its explosion working at 25% up 5% from the current 20% it would be nice for the extra explosion damage to kick in sooner.

    I agree with everything else 100% especially Chrystal Blast and Atronach
    I can live with the shield duration nerf I just wish Sorcs hit harder I don't mind being a glass cannon but sorcs in there current state just don't have a place.
    Xbox One - NA GT: RebornV3x
    I also play on PC from time to time but I just wanna be left alone on there so sorry.
  • Birdovic
    Birdovic
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    RebornV3x wrote: »
    Not sure increasing the shields by 50% will make a lot of people happy the best we can hope for is the skill to cost less to cast since the duration has been reduced. I really wish they would revert the change to this ability.

    Yeah I know, the additional Shield to go from 33% to 50% was to atleast a litte offset the higher damage output from other classes. The Main Purpose of this Ability is access to the 2 Minor Buffs :smile:
    (Thought: "Even if shield down, your healing is better + receive less dmg. Also interesting to stam sorc ;)").

    How bout its explosion working at 25% up 5% from the current 20% it would be nice for the extra explosion damage to kick in sooner.

    Silly me, thats a much better idea. One morph becomes a spammable class ability, the other one a better execute for burst builds. Will edit that :wink:
    Edited by Birdovic on June 6, 2016 12:19PM
  • Birdovic
    Birdovic
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Updated!

    New:
    Chrystal Fragment added
    Daedric Prey added

    Updated:
    - Empowered Ward
    - Hardened Ward
    - Lightning Flood
    - Endless Fury
    Edited by Birdovic on June 6, 2016 12:51PM
  • WardenofArcherus
    Could we dump Ward, giving Annulment the ability to stretch its legs like ZOS seems to want? That frees up a new slot in Daedric Summoning, or Stormcalling (if you move Surge to Daedric Summoning with a name change).
  • Birdovic
    Birdovic
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    Could we dump Ward, giving Annulment the ability to stretch its legs like ZOS seems to want? That frees up a new slot in Daedric Summoning, or Stormcalling (if you move Surge to Daedric Summoning with a name change).

    @WardenofArcherus

    Im no fan of those abilities, too. :smile:
    Thats why I made some suggestions, where the shield is more of a buff and an "emergency-button"(hardened ward, interesting for a stam sorc, too, despite its Magicka cost!) or a healing tool (empowered ward).
    Edited by Birdovic on June 6, 2016 3:17PM
  • Birdovic
    Birdovic
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Updated:
    - Bound Armanents
    - Bound Aegis
    These now support Hybrid Play (and Stam sorc utilizing magicka abilities)

    - Daedric Prey
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