Maintenance for the week of April 13:
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 13
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 13
Update 50 is now available for testing on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/categories/pts
What happened to " we will track your exp earned " ????( Gina Bruno answered this 12/28/2014)
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Heruthema✭✭✭✭DanielMaxwell wrote: »It's the last line that keeps standing out where Kai said and I quote "But we want to make sure that players who have already completed most of the content , are not disadvantaged in earnings of other points champion."
So what did he mean by that? I read it as they are still concerned and do want to compensate but have not yet decided how.
that is really up to you , you can wait and see what happens or you can draw a conclusion based on the information you currently have and hope for what you consider the best outcome.
I read it as current plans may change based on feedback from the PTS .
That is pretty much how I read it also. That was my whole point that nothing has been written in stone except that when 1.6 rolls out we will get 30CP, subject to change of course. We are not even at PTS 1.6 yet let alone 1.7. I do believe that VR2-14 will be compensated eventually.1 -
OrphanHelgen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I understood that it is easier to gain xp, if you have been away from the game for a while. I also assume that is account wide. But does anyone know how long you have to be away from the game to gain this advantage?PC, EU server, Ebonheart Pact
Finally a reason not to play League of Legends0 -
DanielMaxwell✭✭✭DanielMaxwell wrote: »It's the last line that keeps standing out where Kai said and I quote "But we want to make sure that players who have already completed most of the content , are not disadvantaged in earnings of other points champion."
So what did he mean by that? I read it as they are still concerned and do want to compensate but have not yet decided how.
that is really up to you , you can wait and see what happens or you can draw a conclusion based on the information you currently have and hope for what you consider the best outcome.
I read it as current plans may change based on feedback from the PTS .
That is pretty much how I read it also. That was my whole point that nothing has been written in stone except that when 1.6 rolls out we will get 30CP, subject to change of course. We are not even at PTS 1.6 yet let alone 1.7. I do believe that VR2-14 will be compensated eventually.
I do not think they will , but I am also of the opinion that they should not be giving out any points in the champion system based on what players have done prior to the implementation of that system .
regardless of what ZOS decides to do I will play until 1.6 goes live and then make any decisions based on the live version of that patch.1 -
Grao✭✭✭✭✭
✭DanielMaxwell wrote: »It's the last line that keeps standing out where Kai said and I quote "But we want to make sure that players who have already completed most of the content , are not disadvantaged in earnings of other points champion."
So what did he mean by that? I read it as they are still concerned and do want to compensate but have not yet decided how.
that is really up to you , you can wait and see what happens or you can draw a conclusion based on the information you currently have and hope for what you consider the best outcome.
I read it as current plans may change based on feedback from the PTS .
That is pretty much how I read it also. That was my whole point that nothing has been written in stone except that when 1.6 rolls out we will get 30CP, subject to change of course. We are not even at PTS 1.6 yet let alone 1.7. I do believe that VR2-14 will be compensated eventually.
The problem is, until ZoS says those with characters at vr1 or above (up to the release of 1.6) will be compensate for their accumulated experience once the veteran ranks are removed what stand is their previous statement; That we will be given 30 Champion Points at the release of 1.6 and nothing more further down the line.
And that is probably exactly what ZoS intends to do. If they intend to be fair and offer us extra CPs at 1.7 (or whenever they retire the Veteran Ranks) don't you think they'd have cleared that to us already? Why would ZoS be keeping so silent on this posts, only coming around to Moderate, but never to answer? It is because they know the answer they have will only make things worse.
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Joejudas✭✭✭✭✭I'm the OP on this and I agree with alot of you guys. I'm just hoping that before 1.7 we get a little extra CP....but as of right now we aren't. Lets all hope it's gets better0
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Grao✭✭✭✭✭
✭I'm the OP on this and I agree with alot of you guys. I'm just hoping that before 1.7 we get a little extra CP....but as of right now we aren't. Lets all hope it's gets better
Good to see you are still around @Joejudas!
And I don't think we should get more CPs right now. I think ZoS should change how this 30 "free" CPs will be distributed, so those that enter Vr1 after the patch drops still get the same advantage, otherwise, while trying to balance out the levels, they will be creating imbalance.
On 1.7 or whenever the veteran system is retired, then I think those currently (before the release of 1.6) on veteran levels should have their current exp (before 1.6) converted to champion points.
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Joejudas✭✭✭✭✭I'm the OP on this and I agree with alot of you guys. I'm just hoping that before 1.7 we get a little extra CP....but as of right now we aren't. Lets all hope it's gets better
Good to see you are still around @Joejudas!
And I don't think we should get more CPs right now. I think ZoS should change how this 30 "free" CPs will be distributed, so those that enter Vr1 after the patch drops still get the same advantage, otherwise, while trying to balance out the levels, they will be creating imbalance.
On 1.7 or whenever the veteran system is retired, then I think those currently (before the release of 1.6) on veteran levels should have their current exp (before 1.6) converted to champion points.
That's what I'm hoping0 -
Leijona✭✭✭✭✭Kai told us, that they don't plan to compensate us in any way at a later point. His last sentence only indicates, that they might raise the XP you get for doing things like grinding, PvP, trials or dungeons.
But what you have allready done will still be lost.
When I asked that question, my husband told me, that this was allready clear and I said to him, that there will still be players, who will think a compensation might occure at a later point. That's why I asked, so we have an official answer written down.
They say, they don't compensate us for the "tracked XP" (I believe, they never tracked anything), so the cap between players wouldn't get to big. A compensation at a later point would have the same effect, as a compensation with 1.6. So it would be naive to expect a later compensation.Edited by Leijona on January 8, 2015 8:18AM6 -
Grao✭✭✭✭✭
✭Kai told us, that they don't plan to compensate us in any way at a later point. His last sentence only indicates, that they might raise the XP you get for doing things like grinding, PvP, trials or dungeons.
But what you have allready done will still be lost.
When I asked that question, my husband told me, that this was allready clear and I said to him, that there will still be players, who will think a compensation might occure at a later point. That's why I asked, so we have an official answer written down.
They say, they don't compensate us for the "tracked XP" (I believe, they never tracked anything), so the cap between players wouldn't get to big. A compensation at a later point would have the same effect, as a compensation with 1.6. So it would be naive to expect a later compensation.
I really hope you are wrong, I don't want to be forced away from ESO and that is precisely what will happen if ZoS current position stands come 1.7. What is fair is fair, I am not asking for CPs for all the experience gathered after I reached VR14, only the equivalent in CPs to my 14 veteran ranks when those are removed.
If ZoS is not able to offer me that compensation, as a matter of principle I will have to take my leave. I'd prefer not to.4 -
Leijona✭✭✭✭✭Well, as we just had to find out, ZOS is not too reliable on their statements. So the statement, that they don't plan to transfer our XP from V1 to V14 into CP at a later point, might change, sure.
I wouldn't expect it though, as their reason to not do it with 1.6 won't be gone with 1.7.
But besides experience you also gained ability and skill points and I think they will not take them away when the veteran ranks will be removed. I mean, that's still not very satisfying, but at least it's something ... kind of ... yaaa, not really ^^Edited by Leijona on January 8, 2015 1:19PM0 -
Grao✭✭✭✭✭
✭Well, as we just had to find out, ZOS is not too reliable on their statements. So the statement, that they don't plan to transfer our XP from V1 to V14 into CP at a later point, might change, sure.
I wouldn't expect it though, as their reason to not do it with 1.6 won't be gone with 1.7.
But besides experience you also gained ability and skill points and I think they will not take them away when the veteran ranks will be removed. I mean, that's still not very satisfying, but at least it's something ... kind of ... yaaa, not really ^^
Abilities are getting changed, so we will be forced to level several from scratch and skill points have nothing to do with progression nor do they increase your character's power, just its flexibility.
Also, on 1.7 (or whenever the veteran ranks are retired) the problem mentioned by ZoS will be gone. The reason they gave not to offer us all our converted experience on update 1.6 is that doing so would increase the power gap between the different levels too greatly and that is due to two progression systems being in place (which is stupid... They shouldn't release the Champion System and keep the veteran ranks in place, both systems were never meant to work together).
Once the veteran ranks are gone, then giving us that have played the game for so long shouldn't be a problem, more, it would only be fair. If ZoS can't understand that, then this game is just not worth playing anymore.4 -
Leijona✭✭✭✭✭It might be a matter of opinion, if the gap problem remains or not. Nevertheless, the official statement is, that there are no plans to convert XP from V1 to V14 into CP at a later point.0
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Voodoo✭✭✭✭ZOS is simply counting on what alot of developers count on and that is the short term memory of a gamer!
It is a little known fact that gamers have a memory of between three weeks to one month. After that period things will simmer down and the gamer will fall into what is known as the "Suckle Period". This is a time when the gamer still holds a sense of resentment towards the game and often doesnt understand why but finds that he/she is really enjoying getting back into playing again.
The Suckle Period passes rather quickly, lasting usually no more than a week or so, and then it is business as usual with the gamer back to enjoying the game until the next large crisis between the gamer and the games developers arise. The cycle repeats infinitum.
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Leijona✭✭✭✭✭Does this mean, we are allready in that "Suckle Period"? Because I don't feel like playing as much as before December again yet. Either my memory is longer or my "Suckle Period" takes longer ...3
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Morshire✭✭✭✭@Voodoo - I don't know whether to roll on the floor laughing, or get my pitchfork out and scream at the insult. They way you put it makes me want to leave now so that I do not fall into that example.
@Liejona - You are correct about the statement. Gino answered, in this post I believe, that Kia was correct and we would get no more, no less than 30CP. BUT...
ZOS said they would listen to the players, hence all the posts on this topic. They said they would not leave players at a disadvantage from gaining CP. They have come back and made corrections/changes based on testing. (This whole topic stems from one of those statements) People who truly like this game and want to see it succeed are holding out hope that this can, and will, get corrected somehow. Anyone who enjoys this game doesn't want to see a mass exodus, nor do they want to rage quit over being "mislead". But if we take what was said so far, and just accept it for what it is, then we have to either quit and find a new game, or we have to do the whole "Suckling" thing mentioned above.
And if we have to believe there is no hope to change coarse, then everyone be wary. ZOS is setting precedence by "making the game equal." Next time a wave of new players come in and scream about the gap of "newbies" and "vet" players, it may be your levels or gear that gets reset without compensation. Think not, they are about to either prove, or disprove, that very soon. So just stay toned and the future will be revealed.
Personally, if I have to "suckle" anything, well let's just say it will be at home with my wife and I won't be posting it here.
Follow me if I advance, Kill me if I retreat, Avenge me if I die.
When this immediate evil power has been defeated, we shall not yet have won the long battle with the elemental barbarities. Another evil, it may be an invisible adversary, will attempt, again, and yet again, to destroy our frail civilization. Is it true, I wonder, that the only way to escape a war is to be in it?
If I die, you are forgiven, If I live, I will kill you.1 -
Joejudas✭✭✭✭✭It's not just skill points....it's the fact a vr1 still has all the content to do a vr14 cant....content we thought we were going to get exp for that we aren't going to get now. It's putting vr14 people at a disadvantage going down the road....which is why a bunch might just leave the game5
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Grao✭✭✭✭✭
✭ZOS is simply counting on what alot of developers count on and that is the short term memory of a gamer!
It is a little known fact that gamers have a memory of between three weeks to one month. After that period things will simmer down and the gamer will fall into what is known as the "Suckle Period". This is a time when the gamer still holds a sense of resentment towards the game and often doesnt understand why but finds that he/she is really enjoying getting back into playing again.
The Suckle Period passes rather quickly, lasting usually no more than a week or so, and then it is business as usual with the gamer back to enjoying the game until the next large crisis between the gamer and the games developers arise. The cycle repeats infinitum.
I really wish I was like that. I really like ESO, but I did cancel my subscription once when problems I couldn't deal with were taking months to be fixed. I will have to do it again now, it seems.
And yes, I only came back once the problems I had with the game were patched or were about to be patched (Update 1.5)0 -
Morshire✭✭✭✭@Joejudas - I agree with you for all the same reasons. I am just trying to point out how this can effect the long term of the game. I am not trying to belittle the comments from this thread or the others like it. Personally my VR5 has taken me, "casually" playing, far too much effort to have some brand spanking new VR1 that might only be 2 secs old at launch of 1.6 to be equal in CP points. And making all the effort spent for any VR level to be equal is also wrong. And having non repeatable quests and their CP gain taken from those that have completed them is wrong and puts the disadvantage on those same players who have already put in a ton of time. In being "fair" and "equalizing" the game is a dangerous precedence being set. The game will never be "fair" in the sense that some players have infinite time to game (some even do it as a living) versus the 9-5 person who only gets X hours a week to play. And if this game is going to continue with this trend, then people are going to be able to constantly expect to have their progress removed for the sake of "balancing" the game every time ZOS introduces something new.
Sorry, edited so I didn't sound like a bigger moron.Edited by Morshire on January 8, 2015 2:32PMFollow me if I advance, Kill me if I retreat, Avenge me if I die.
When this immediate evil power has been defeated, we shall not yet have won the long battle with the elemental barbarities. Another evil, it may be an invisible adversary, will attempt, again, and yet again, to destroy our frail civilization. Is it true, I wonder, that the only way to escape a war is to be in it?
If I die, you are forgiven, If I live, I will kill you.3 -
Joejudas✭✭✭✭✭@Joejudas - I agree with you for all the same reasons. I am just trying to point out how this can effect the long term of the game. I am not trying to belittle the comments from this thread or the others like it. Personally my VR5 has taken me, "casually" playing, far too much effort to have some brand spanking new VR1 that might only be 2 secs old at launch of 1.6 to be equal in CP points. And making all the effort spent for any VR level to be equal is also wrong. And having non repeatable quests and their CP gain taken from those that have completed them is wrong and puts the disadvantage on those same players who have already put in a ton of time. In being "fair" and "equalizing" the game is a dangerous precedence being set. The game will never be "fair" in the sense that some players have infinite time to game (some even do it as a living) versus the 9-5 person who only gets X hours a week to play. And if this game is going to continue with this trend, then people are going to be able to constantly expect to have their progress removed for the sake of "balancing" the game every time ZOS introduces something new.
Sorry, edited so I didn't sound like a bigger moron.
Let me just point out no one is a moron for expressing their opinion on anything. I think the enlightenment system is a good way to balance exp gain for more casual players. Also as a more hardcore player who is an officer in a large guild.....I take the time to let the more casual player in on my knowledge of the game they might not have yet. That's important.
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Grao✭✭✭✭✭
✭@Joejudas - I agree with you for all the same reasons. I am just trying to point out how this can effect the long term of the game. I am not trying to belittle the comments from this thread or the others like it. Personally my VR5 has taken me, "casually" playing, far too much effort to have some brand spanking new VR1 that might only be 2 secs old at launch of 1.6 to be equal in CP points. And making all the effort spent for any VR level to be equal is also wrong. And having non repeatable quests and their CP gain taken from those that have completed them is wrong and puts the disadvantage on those same players who have already put in a ton of time. In being "fair" and "equalizing" the game is a dangerous precedence being set. The game will never be "fair" in the sense that some players have infinite time to game (some even do it as a living) versus the 9-5 person who only gets X hours a week to play. And if this game is going to continue with this trend, then people are going to be able to constantly expect to have their progress removed for the sake of "balancing" the game every time ZOS introduces something new.
Sorry, edited so I didn't sound like a bigger moron.
Let me just point out no one is a moron for expressing their opinion on anything. I think the enlightenment system is a good way to balance exp gain for more casual players. Also as a more hardcore player who is an officer in a large guild.....I take the time to let the more casual player in on my knowledge of the game they might not have yet. That's important.
Agreed. The Enlightenment System seems very good for the casual player and though it may not fully compensate the difference between a hardcore gamer and a casual, it is surely a step on the right direction. That is good for the health of the game, that is balance.
Those 30 "free" champion points, that just doesn't make sense, specially when it is only given to those currently at Vr1 or above, not to every new player as they reach Vr1. So a exception to the Champion System that was insert to prevent imbalance actually causes more imbalance between those already playing and those just starting on the game. It is foolish Zenimax.1 -
Guppet✭✭✭✭✭
✭It's not just skill points....it's the fact a vr1 still has all the content to do a vr14 cant....content we thought we were going to get exp for that we aren't going to get now. It's putting vr14 people at a disadvantage going down the road....which is why a bunch might just leave the game
You are only at a disadvantage if they don't balance xp correctly. I believe this is what Kai was referring to saying you would not be at a disadvantage.
So long as repeatable content awards the same xp as the current VR quests, you are no worse off, for attaining new CP.
Just because people who have not yet done all the quests in the VR1-10 zones, will be able to do them after the patch to get XP, that does not put you at a disadvantage, as the fact you have already done them, means you were going to have to do repeatable content anyway.
And anyone that particularly hates the idea of doing repeatable content, that has already done all the quests, would still have no quests to do even if they had awarded the points for it.
Unfortunately, most people are just treating them balancing it incorrectly as fact, before we even know it.1 -
Morshire✭✭✭✭@Joejudas - I have been on both sides of that coin (back surgery gave me almost 2 years of 24/7 gaming. "Hardcore" gamers, as a general rule, help make the gaming experience better for a lot of casuals. Which is why I am commenting on this so much. Those "hardcore" gamers are the one getting the shaft here, and leaving, so everyone's gaming experience will feel that loss.
@Guppet - correct, but fact is what becomes the unknown here, because they have said "no more, no less". So is that the fact or is something else. (Hence the threads). Simple "balanced" fix VR1= 3CP, VR14 =30CP. (2CP per VR level up to VR14) And 5CP for all who have a VR1 at launch would have basically achieved the same "balancing" without snubbing so many noses. Then people would be crying about the amount of CP, but personally I would not even have a comment.Follow me if I advance, Kill me if I retreat, Avenge me if I die.
When this immediate evil power has been defeated, we shall not yet have won the long battle with the elemental barbarities. Another evil, it may be an invisible adversary, will attempt, again, and yet again, to destroy our frail civilization. Is it true, I wonder, that the only way to escape a war is to be in it?
If I die, you are forgiven, If I live, I will kill you.1 -
Kraven✭✭✭✭✭Plenty have already left.
Even more are on the fence and about to leave.
Even more pay no attention to the forums or upcoming news about the game and will be blind sided when vet levels are removed and they get shafted, then there will be even more leaving.
Some PvPers have left due to lag, imbalance, or lack of new pvp content.
F2P rumors abound.
Some console hopefuls have given up hope.
With no comments to confirm or deny people's concerns since before Christmas. There is no sense at all that ZO even gives a damn. If they don't care about their player's concerns, worries or issues then some players will stop being concerned about the game at all.
I love ESO. Doesn't mean ZO can't drive it into the ground by making bad business decisions. Good design choices can only overcome so many bad policy choices.
The "Wait and see" approach isn't too great if you're waiting for people to leave and then trying to win them back after you've disappointed and run them off in the first place.V14 - IMPERIAL NIGHTBLADE - DPS/TANK
V13 - BRETON SORCERER - HEALS/DPS
V2 - REDGUARD DRAGONKNIGHT - MELEE DPS
V1 - BRETON TEMPLAR - TANK/DPS
to be continued... Nevermind, no longer "to be continued"5 -
Guppet✭✭✭✭✭
✭The single biggest problem, is that they have delayed removing VR levels till 1.7 or later. It makes no sense to have both systems at the same time. It cant be about testing it sooner either as some have VR levels and others don't, so its not balanced anyway.
Saying it will be removed later is like saying go and have fun playing, but when you come back im gonna smack you in the face.
I think this whole thing would be less painful if they went the whole hog and removed VR completely when they bring in CP.1 -
Kraven✭✭✭✭✭The single biggest problem, is that they have delayed removing VR levels till 1.7 or later. It makes no sense to have both systems at the same time. It cant be about testing it sooner either as some have VR levels and others don't, so its not balanced anyway.
Saying it will be removed later is like saying go and have fun playing, but when you come back im gonna smack you in the face.
I think this whole thing would be less painful if they went the whole hog and removed VR completely when they bring in CP.
This is a terrible idea and would cause even more people to quit.
As it stands when 1.6 hits live and champion system becomes available I'm going to have V14 content to play on my V14 character earning V14 experience toward champion points. Which is why while I far from agree with CP30 it's not going to make me quit. I have the time between 1.6 and the vet removal to earn more CP than a brand new V1 can.
If they removed Vet ranks at the exact same time then it's an even bigger slap in the face. IF they compensated for vet ranks then it might have been a lot better to do it all in one fell swoop BUT with the blanket CP30 decision those of us at V14 HAVE to have that time period to earn more cp than your fresh V1.Edited by Kraven on January 8, 2015 6:07PMV14 - IMPERIAL NIGHTBLADE - DPS/TANK
V13 - BRETON SORCERER - HEALS/DPS
V2 - REDGUARD DRAGONKNIGHT - MELEE DPS
V1 - BRETON TEMPLAR - TANK/DPS
to be continued... Nevermind, no longer "to be continued"2 -
Guppet✭✭✭✭✭
✭The single biggest problem, is that they have delayed removing VR levels till 1.7 or later. It makes no sense to have both systems at the same time. It cant be about testing it sooner either as some have VR levels and others don't, so its not balanced anyway.
Saying it will be removed later is like saying go and have fun playing, but when you come back im gonna smack you in the face.
I think this whole thing would be less painful if they went the whole hog and removed VR completely when they bring in CP.
This is a terrible idea and would cause even more people to quit.
As it stands when 1.6 hits live and champion system becomes available I'm going to have V14 content to play on my V14 character earning V14 experience toward champion points. Which is why while I far from agree with CP30 it's not going to make me quit. I have the time between 1.6 and the vet removal to earn more CP than a brand new V1 can.
If they removed Vet ranks at the exact same time then it's an even bigger slap in the face. IF they compensated for vet ranks then it might have been a lot better to do it all in one fell swoop BUT with the blanket CP30 decision those of us at V14 HAVE to have that time period to earn more cp than your fresh V1.
The whole reason everyone gets 30cp is so its balanced and they can see how it works, only that's not true when there are still Vet levels as people are at different power levels.
If ZOS goes through with giving everyone 30cp in the name of balance, then they better actually deliver that balance.
Doing it over two patches stops it ever being balanced, so they can never get any metrics of how things work, in a balanced environment. Which means they will have created all this drama for no real reason.1 -
Robocles✭✭✭✭✭It's not just skill points....it's the fact a vr1 still has all the content to do a vr14 cant....content we thought we were going to get exp for that we aren't going to get now. It's putting vr14 people at a disadvantage going down the road....which is why a bunch might just leave the game
You are only at a disadvantage if they don't balance xp correctly. I believe this is what Kai was referring to saying you would not be at a disadvantage.
So long as repeatable content awards the same xp as the current VR quests, you are no worse off, for attaining new CP.
Just because people who have not yet done all the quests in the VR1-10 zones, will be able to do them after the patch to get XP, that does not put you at a disadvantage, as the fact you have already done them, means you were going to have to do repeatable content anyway.
And anyone that particularly hates the idea of doing repeatable content, that has already done all the quests, would still have no quests to do even if they had awarded the points for it.
Unfortunately, most people are just treating them balancing it incorrectly as fact, before we even know it.
Except they won't have the points anyone else who's done that content would have. So, either the points mean so little that we shouldn't care... or we will have to find other ways to get them so we can have the same playing field for that exact same repeatable content.2
