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What happened to " we will track your exp earned " ????( Gina Bruno answered this 12/28/2014)
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Inklings✭✭✭✭✭@XGP
As someone who has been playing MMOs for almost 2 decades now, i can safely say you are in the minority with your "DEFINITION of CONTENT." You are trying to pass off game mechanics as content and the two are considered different by the majority of players.
Edited by Inklings on December 30, 2014 10:36PM9 -
whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭@XGP
As someone who has been playing MMOs for almost 3 decades now, i can safely say you are in the minority with your "DEFINITION of CONTENT." You are trying to pass off game mechanics as content and the two are considered different by the majority of players.
Exactly..Signed, Kotaro Atani.PS5 NAVR16/ CP 160 Khajiit Nightblade of the Aldmeri Dominion, Guildmaster and Assassin of the Queen's Hand guild on NA PC. PvP Officer in the WOLF guild on NA PS5, and of course Master Thief. Currently 3600 CP out of 3600 CP on NA PS5. Currently 810 CP on NA PC (used for PTS testing purposes only). On PS5 I am also a Master Crafter, all traits done and learned, Jewelry crafting done. all Motifs learned on PS5 except for maybe two-three Motifs. All Companions are Max level as are their Skills.Warrior, Lover, Thief.... Nightblade. Aldmeri Dominion For Life! For the Queen!! Go Dominion or go home ! "I have no hatred for the races of Man, but they are young. Like all children, they are driven by emotion. They lack the wisdom that comes with age. I would sooner place an Altmer infant on the Ruby Throne than surrender Tamriel to their capricious whims. The Altmer, the Bosmer and the Khajiit share the common traits of intelligence, patience and reason. We do not seek riches or plunder. Domination is not our goal, nor is the acclamation of power for its own sake. Today we make our stand. Today we take back the Ruby Throne, which is ours by ancient right and the blessings of the Divines. Stand with us." ―Your Queen Commands, Ayrenn Arana Aldmeri.(All 18 characters are AD only! This one is a AD Loyalist)Member of ESO Since January 29, 2014, started early Access 3/30/14 on PC, currently subbed on NA PS5 and on NA PC. Note- I only use PC for PTS testing purposes, the PS5 is my dedicated Game Platform.Note- for those that don't know how to say Kotaro Atani it's "Ko tar row Ah ta ni" (Ko with a Oh sound, tar which sounds like the sticky black tar stuff, row like rowing a boat, Ah with a AHHHH sound, Ta with a Tahhh sound, Neeee which sounds like knee)"The blowing sands of time wipe clean the footprints of the past...""Moonsugar may be the key to paradise, but it is through a false door...""A perfect society is always elsewhere..."- Unknown book of Khajiiti proverbs.6 -
DanielMaxwell✭✭✭DanielMaxwell wrote: »
perhaps i should have made it clearer for @XGP , while technically the champion system and justice system can be called content . We do not know what playable content for the justice system will actually make it to live , that depends on feedback during the PTS period . As for the champion system there is no new non repeatable content coming with it .DanielMaxwell wrote: »New content is the champion system and the justice system o.O
those are two game mechanic systems not actual content .
content would be new dungeons , quests , or zones
neither the champion system or the justice system is adding any content that we the players are aware of .
One of the big mistakes being made by ZOS is launching the champion system without including new content for players to run to progress in the champion system.
Game Mechanics are things that trigger with things you do in the game. Some of champion system will do this but its still new content cause it is not somthing that is in the game currently now.
OMG! READ! I said Playable Content!! Of course the patch has new content... It is an update for gods sakes >.> It is just not a shinny new dungeon or trial or an adventure zone, or imperial city. It is a bunch of little dailies and a ton of changes to your stats and abilities...
nobody knows if there will be any repeatable content released with the justice system or if any that is released will also provide progression in the champion system for level capped players .
Progression in the champion system is for level capped characters only , and they have not announced any new end game playable content (no new dungeons , zones , or quests for level capped characters).
the champion system is a new leveling system so it does count towards the bridge for end game content. It's just the first phase we will all test it on PTS regardless. But you're general sence of content is not evryones DEFINITION of CONTENT.
there are different types of content
there is mechanical content , things like the champion system , or the justice system .
there is payable content , things like dungeons , quests , zones , and systems like the justice system when it is fully implemented.
some new content will fall into both of those groupings . The justice system when fully implemented is one of those .
you are right that not everyone will use the same definition for what is content .3 -
Audigy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I still can't see that anyone is really losing anything... you can still do whatever it is you do in the game after these changes, can't you?
I get that a lot of people have a sense of entitlement because of the many hours of "work" they spent playing a game, but it just isn't something I can identify with. (No, that's not an invitation for someone to explain it again. I get it. My mind just doesn't work that way.)
When in phase 4 veteran ranks are removed Vr1 player will ends up with 30CP + CP from content(non repeatable) +from killing NPC's + CP from PvP+ repeatable quests.
Vr14 player ends up with 30CP+from killing NPC's+ CP from PvP+ repeatable quests. Vr14 gets no CP from content they completed before phase 3!
And yet a VR 14 will end up with more CP than the Casual, as the CS is based on time played and not content done.
Why is this so hard to understand for you?
If you keep playing as much as you did before, then you will still have more CPs with 1.7. Casuals who are not yet VR 14, don't automatically play much more and quests wont give more XP either. It simply put doesn't matter what you do with 1.6, the XP gain will be equal no matter if you quest, do a daily, run a dungeon or a trial.
So yes, you will still be the biggest fish in the water, now relax
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Grao✭✭✭✭✭
✭I still can't see that anyone is really losing anything... you can still do whatever it is you do in the game after these changes, can't you?
I get that a lot of people have a sense of entitlement because of the many hours of "work" they spent playing a game, but it just isn't something I can identify with. (No, that's not an invitation for someone to explain it again. I get it. My mind just doesn't work that way.)
When in phase 4 veteran ranks are removed Vr1 player will ends up with 30CP + CP from content(non repeatable) +from killing NPC's + CP from PvP+ repeatable quests.
Vr14 player ends up with 30CP+from killing NPC's+ CP from PvP+ repeatable quests. Vr14 gets no CP from content they completed before phase 3!
And yet a VR 14 will end up with more CP than the Casual, as the CS is based on time played and not content done.
Why is this so hard to understand for you?
If you keep playing as much as you did before, then you will still have more CPs with 1.7. Casuals who are not yet VR 14, don't automatically play much more and quests wont give more XP either. It simply put doesn't matter what you do with 1.6, the XP gain will be equal no matter if you quest, do a daily, run a dungeon or a trial.
So yes, you will still be the biggest fish in the water, now relax
^ Someone that clearly has no idea what he is saying. Nice picture though
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Jaxsun✭✭✭✭Hello all,
The sole reason why we do Quests is to level up our skill lines, our vet ranks, and our skills to morph. I think everyone that has done all the quests in the game and finished everything has been rewarded with skill points, atribution points, dye colors, and the titles. These's where the reasons for completeing the game for those mile stones and rewards. You can complain about every little detail but it will not change the overall outcome. Be glad that we are getting Champion points.
I my self have completed most of the game content. But you guys are also missing the one importand thing even if you complete everything now and don't have much to do they will release more content with more dyes more achivements more quests for you to level. So just be patient more will come when its supposed to.
Youre missing the point completely. Its not about what is to come. Its about what we just did. A lot of the player base was ready to unsub a few months ago. We had already completed all or at least most the stuff you had listed. There was no real reason for a lot of us to keep playing. We did so cause when we asked why should keep playing we were told we'd be rewarded for the time, money and effort we put forward for the next few months. There were other peoplewho stepped away from PvP, trails, dungeson and other things to farm this xp that was promised to be be converted to CP, when they could have been progressing their characters in other ways. This has NOTHING to do with what is about to come with 1.6. Its about what we just did for the last 3 months.
First of all look at what you described is opportunity cost. You put all that time into the game and gain experience that was invalid to gain when that expericen gain is automatic even if you Grind or just play the game in the general sence. Secondly any experince u gained would not go to waste if you have skills still to level up. so the point overall is not missed why complain about content that is not yet out.
One, i don't understand your first point at all. You need to word that a bit better.
Your second point is moot and holds no water. Sorry to be harsh, but ALL my skills, and both of their morphs for each have been maxed out since we had a vr10 cap. I played this game for the last 3 months to earn converted xp. There are a lot of players like me. You dont dangle a carrot out in front of your playerbase with promises to obtain that veggy, only to take the carrot away after you have their money. Its NOT a good business practice. That's not how you treat paying customers.
are you trying to validate you're game time and want to get rewared for playing somthing u pay for? even if they promised or not we are all still getting 30CP to make things even regardless. come people grind to vet 14 some actualy finish the whole game. But there are still a huge HUGE amount of dailys to do mobs to kill to gain EXP.
Yes, that is exactly the point. They lied to us to get our money and are not going to deliver what we paid for.7 -
Merlin13KAGL wrote: »What other aspects of the game? Seriously... It is an MMO, or you quest, or you grind (both for leveling), you do PvP and you work professions. My main character has all exploration achievements, all quests completed, all professions leveled to maxed... And I didn't take that many hours to reach vr3 >.<
And none of your arguments play any role on ZoS decision. Their decision (as they've stated in another forum post) is based only in the need to flatten the differences between vr1s and the other vr levels because they are abolishing those differences.
Coming 1.7 we will all have the power or of a vr1 or of a vr14 or something in between, no matter what rank we are currently on the veteran system! Isn't that great?
@Grao , did you read the part of my post that said that was an extreme example? Some RP, some craft, collect, interact with Guildies.
720 hours equates to 30 days in game played and does not somehow obligate someone to be at any particular level. What about people that enjoy making alts, repeatedly? Is their time somehow worth less?
How about 8 characters at 125 hours each, trying different builds or alliances?
You, and however many other people, have determined where someone should be at given a certain amount of time and you have determined, arbitrarily, what that is or is not supposed to be worth.
The 'you didn't do it this way' or 'you didn't reach this goal, so you do/don't deserve this reward' is BS.
Your RANK is your reward. The benefits that come with it, skillpoints, attribute points, gear, time mastering your skills is your reward. Changing how that is viewed will not change those gains.
None of your arguments play any role in their decision either.
That is my very point.
They're looking at the entire player base, not just the ones that have somehow determined they are 'worth more.'
I've got max level characters. I've got characters that are not.
People are making assumptions about how the transition to no-VR's is going to work when ZOS has probably not decided themselves.
One month's sub $ is one month's sub $. Period.
This "I'm more important that the next guy, so change it or I'll leave" crap is ridiculous. If you don't like it when it comes out, walk on.
The game will continue either way.
the above is rife with inane drivel....
i have all but 1 trade skill maxed and i am vr7, so that for sure makes me equal to a vr14 with no trade skills..... THEY ARE TWO SEPERATE THINGS....
trade skills have their own experience- i maxed it. level grinding has its own experience level, which veteran ranks are attached to and are to be replaced by CPs- i don't have it maxed. the mere fact that the character progression isn't maxed MAKES me unequal to a VR14. if you want to stand around shooting the bull or crafting, thats on you. if you want to level and work towards character progression (the numbers that make you kill faster) thats on you as well. neglect either and that is on you.... its all equal but they are completely separate systems.I will work. I will save. I will sacrifice. I will endure. I will fight cheerfully and do my utmost, as if the whole issue of the struggle depended on me alone.
Martin A. Treptow
1894-19181 -
Bouvin✭✭✭✭✭
✭@XGP
As someone who has been playing MMOs for almost 2 decades now, i can safely say you are in the minority with your "DEFINITION of CONTENT." You are trying to pass off game mechanics as content and the two are considered different by the majority of players.
Your making me miss Ultima Online. That and the crap being pulled with the CP points...0 -
Averya_Teira✭✭✭✭✭New content is the champion system and the justice system o.O
That's not content... just sayin'Hello all,
The sole reason why we do Quests is to level up our skill lines, our vet ranks, and our skills to morph. I think everyone that has done all the quests in the game and finished everything has been rewarded with skill points, atribution points, dye colors, and the titles. These's where the reasons for completeing the game for those mile stones and rewards. You can complain about every little detail but it will not change the overall outcome. Be glad that we are getting Champion points.
I my self have completed most of the game content. But you guys are also missing the one importand thing even if you complete everything now and don't have much to do they will release more content with more dyes more achivements more quests for you to level. So just be patient more will come when its supposed to.
Youre missing the point completely. Its not about what is to come. Its about what we just did. A lot of the player base was ready to unsub a few months ago. We had already completed all or at least most the stuff you had listed. There was no real reason for a lot of us to keep playing. We did so cause when we asked why should keep playing we were told we'd be rewarded for the time, money and effort we put forward for the next few months. There were other peoplewho stepped away from PvP, trails, dungeson and other things to farm this xp that was promised to be be converted to CP, when they could have been progressing their characters in other ways. This has NOTHING to do with what is about to come with 1.6. Its about what we just did for the last 3 months.
First of all look at what you described is opportunity cost. You put all that time into the game and gain experience that was invalid to gain when that expericen gain is automatic even if you Grind or just play the game in the general sence. Secondly any experince u gained would not go to waste if you have skills still to level up. so the point overall is not missed why complain about content that is not yet out.
One, i don't understand your first point at all. You need to word that a bit better.
Your second point is moot and holds no water. Sorry to be harsh, but ALL my skills, and both of their morphs for each have been maxed out since we had a vr10 cap. I played this game for the last 3 months to earn converted xp. There are a lot of players like me. You dont dangle a carrot out in front of your playerbase with promises to obtain that veggy, only to take the carrot away after you have their money. Its NOT a good business practice. That's not how you treat paying customers.
are you trying to validate you're game time and want to get rewared for playing somthing u pay for? even if they promised or not we are all still getting 30CP to make things even regardless. come people grind to vet 14 some actualy finish the whole game. But there are still a huge HUGE amount of dailys to do mobs to kill to gain EXP.
That's not the point. The point is we were told XP would be converted so people played according to that statement. Which we now know, was a lie.DanielMaxwell wrote: »
perhaps i should have made it clearer for @XGP , while technically the champion system and justice system can be called content . We do not know what playable content for the justice system will actually make it to live , that depends on feedback during the PTS period . As for the champion system there is no new non repeatable content coming with it .DanielMaxwell wrote: »New content is the champion system and the justice system o.O
those are two game mechanic systems not actual content .
content would be new dungeons , quests , or zones
neither the champion system or the justice system is adding any content that we the players are aware of .
One of the big mistakes being made by ZOS is launching the champion system without including new content for players to run to progress in the champion system.
Game Mechanics are things that trigger with things you do in the game. Some of champion system will do this but its still new content cause it is not somthing that is in the game currently now.
OMG! READ! I said Playable Content!! Of course the patch has new content... It is an update for gods sakes >.> It is just not a shinny new dungeon or trial or an adventure zone, or imperial city. It is a bunch of little dailies and a ton of changes to your stats and abilities...
nobody knows if there will be any repeatable content released with the justice system or if any that is released will also provide progression in the champion system for level capped players .
Progression in the champion system is for level capped characters only , and they have not announced any new end game playable content (no new dungeons , zones , or quests for level capped characters).
the champion system is a new leveling system so it does count towards the bridge for end game content. It's just the first phase we will all test it on PTS regardless. But you're general sence of content is not evryones DEFINITION of CONTENT.
Well his definition is what content is for the majority of players, not yours...Hello all,
The sole reason why we do Quests is to level up our skill lines, our vet ranks, and our skills to morph. I think everyone that has done all the quests in the game and finished everything has been rewarded with skill points, atribution points, dye colors, and the titles. These's where the reasons for completeing the game for those mile stones and rewards. You can complain about every little detail but it will not change the overall outcome. Be glad that we are getting Champion points.
I my self have completed most of the game content. But you guys are also missing the one importand thing even if you complete everything now and don't have much to do they will release more content with more dyes more achivements more quests for you to level. So just be patient more will come when its supposed to.
Youre missing the point completely. Its not about what is to come. Its about what we just did. A lot of the player base was ready to unsub a few months ago. We had already completed all or at least most the stuff you had listed. There was no real reason for a lot of us to keep playing. We did so cause when we asked why should keep playing we were told we'd be rewarded for the time, money and effort we put forward for the next few months. There were other peoplewho stepped away from PvP, trails, dungeson and other things to farm this xp that was promised to be be converted to CP, when they could have been progressing their characters in other ways. This has NOTHING to do with what is about to come with 1.6. Its about what we just did for the last 3 months.
First of all look at what you described is opportunity cost. You put all that time into the game and gain experience that was invalid to gain when that expericen gain is automatic even if you Grind or just play the game in the general sence. Secondly any experince u gained would not go to waste if you have skills still to level up. so the point overall is not missed why complain about content that is not yet out.
One, i don't understand your first point at all. You need to word that a bit better.
Your second point is moot and holds no water. Sorry to be harsh, but ALL my skills, and both of their morphs for each have been maxed out since we had a vr10 cap. I played this game for the last 3 months to earn converted xp. There are a lot of players like me. You dont dangle a carrot out in front of your playerbase with promises to obtain that veggy, only to take the carrot away after you have their money. Its NOT a good business practice. That's not how you treat paying customers.
are you trying to validate you're game time and want to get rewared for playing somthing u pay for? even if they promised or not we are all still getting 30CP to make things even regardless. come people grind to vet 14 some actualy finish the whole game. But there are still a huge HUGE amount of dailys to do mobs to kill to gain EXP.
And you don't ? Huh ? What's the point of doing ANYTHING in life if you don't get ''rewarded'' for it... ?
Edited by Averya_Teira on December 31, 2014 3:46AM5 -
Grao✭✭✭✭✭
✭What people don't seem to understand is that we don't really care how many points we get, well, at least I don't. Our complain is that the champion system is being installed to replace the veteran system and upon inauguration this new system is being instructed to ignore previous progression. Instead ZoS created an arbitrary, random rule to replace the workings of the CS on this one instance.
Vr1s haven't leveled within the veteran ranks, so they shouldn't get any champion point. Considering that to get to vr14 you gather enough experience to gain 52 CPs, giving the Vr1s 30 free CPs is (or will be once the new system is fully implemented) the same as making all current vr1s into vr10s. Giving the vr14s that same amount of points means demoting them to that same rank.
Why is ZoS doing this? To prepare for the complete removal of the veteran system. They are doing it in preparation to completely discard all the progression (exp) you've gathered past vr1. Does that sounds fair to any of you? Does it sound right? From vr1 to vr14 we gather 13 million exp points. That is what ZoS is trying to ignore.
Actually, I guess that is not very precise. They are giving everyone 30 Cps, that is equivalent to 7.5 million exp, that leaves the small amount of 5.5 million exp. Oh, wait! It isn't a small amount, is it? 5.500.000 exp.Edited by Grao on December 31, 2014 4:23AM5 -
Artis✭✭✭✭✭
✭And yet a VR 14 will end up with more CP than the Casual, as the CS is based on time played and not content done.
Why is this so hard to understand for you?
If you keep playing as much as you did before, then you will still have more CPs with 1.7.
Then what was the problem to "track XP" if it's time dependent? It's even easier to track time, /played does it for you any time. YOu just need to see what was this number for each character when on Oct 3.
But no, most likely they won't reward me with CP for just being and online and chatting (finding a group) or trading.
I am pretty sure that CP will be rewarded for XP and players who have quests left can and will get it faster.
I have nothing left to do but grind, which I won't do because it's not fun. And I bet they won't scale XP so that for 2 trials(for coffers) and 7 dungeons(for dailies) I will get as much XP as another player would get for a week of questing.
I remember, it would take 1 to 2 days to complete the entire veteran zone. I bet they won't make it so that, say, 9 AA runs will give me as much XP because in this case people will just grind trials and spend almost no efforts and time.
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Guppet✭✭✭✭✭
✭And yet a VR 14 will end up with more CP than the Casual, as the CS is based on time played and not content done.
Why is this so hard to understand for you?
If you keep playing as much as you did before, then you will still have more CPs with 1.7.
Then what was the problem to "track XP" if it's time dependent? It's even easier to track time, /played does it for you any time. YOu just need to see what was this number for each character when on Oct 3.
But no, most likely they won't reward me with CP for just being and online and chatting (finding a group) or trading.
I am pretty sure that CP will be rewarded for XP and players who have quests left can and will get it faster.
I have nothing left to do but grind, which I won't do because it's not fun. And I bet they won't scale XP so that for 2 trials(for coffers) and 7 dungeons(for dailies) I will get as much XP as another player would get for a week of questing.
I remember, it would take 1 to 2 days to complete the entire veteran zone. I bet they won't make it so that, say, 9 AA runs will give me as much XP because in this case people will just grind trials and spend almost no efforts and time.
I keep seeing this said. If you have ran out of the content you enjoy, that is your issue, not the champion system.
If they gave you 100 extra CP, you would still have no content that you enjoy to do.
Why are you still playing if you have no more content you enjoy?
The fact is, anyone that is still here and still enjoying it, is doing some form of content (or they are not playing at all), that content will award XP, be it currently or after the rebalance of XP awards.12 -
Kaliki✭✭✭✭I keep seeing this said. If you have ran out of the content you enjoy, that is your issue, not the champion system.
If they gave you 100 extra CP, you would still have no content that you enjoy to do.
Why are you still playing if you have no more content you enjoy?
The fact is, anyone that is still here and still enjoying it, is doing some form of content (or they are not playing at all), that content will award XP, be it currently or after the rebalance of XP awards.
Its about not getting CP for the content we enjoyed, but that doesnt mean I don't enjoy the game now.
But if I want to get CP now I would have to grind, which I don't enjoy. Otherwise I'd just do a few select things which would grant very little CP, which is also fine.
However, the issue remains that they take away most of my XP earned so far and make my time spent in the game worth less than that of other players.
You can twist that around as you like, but deleting progress of player A while rewarding player B is not fair. And spare me the "life's not fair, deal with it" – I am only here to voice my opinion as long as I have game time left and as long as you keep refueling the debate. ;-PEdited by Kaliki on December 31, 2014 11:50AM- Templars: Slower by Design® -6 -
Lettigall✭✭✭✭✭
✭Thank you for getting back to me with clarification, I can completely see where you're coming from now.
In regards to the latest response that you linked, I can see why that would be cause for concern. My understanding of it is that the system may have failed to track XP past 14 (I can't 100% this, as a lot of the Dev/Community team are still out for the holidays). What we can't have lost is the amount of XP gained between 1 and 14, as that's a set amount. If you're VR14, you've got it. I agree that this point could do with some clarification.
In regards to the latter point, we do not have any information at this time that would either prove or disprove that different VRanks will be handled differently. Yes, at this point everyone will be given 30CP, but the power difference between a VR1 and VR14 will remain. How phase 4 will handle a difference in VRanks has not been offered yet.
The point in your response that I most agree with is the potential for CP from content (non-repeatable quests) that a lower VRank will have over a higher VRank. In that regard I'm afraid I have no information, but I will point out that there are a number of repeatable quests and end game content (trials, Undaunted etc.) that lower VRanks do not have access to, or the ability to complete. In completing these, you'll be able to make gains that a lower rank player won't be able to, but will get through quests. Unfortunately I can't say if these will be comparable without having numbers in front of me (which I would love to have access to).
Once the teams are back, I will personally push for more clarification on this one. I know they don't like to post too many specifics, but I will do my best to fight the player corner on this one, as you're the ones that have dedicated yourselves to playing, so it's my job to support you!
I can't make any promises, especially time wise, but I will do what I can to get the thread updated with additional information in the near future.
I hope that goes some way to allaying your concerns, and I apologize for any confusion this has caused. I wish you the best of luck in your adventures, and please don't hesitate to contact us again if there's anything else we can help you with!
Warmest regards,
Lloyd
The Elder Scrolls Online Team
Yesterday I had nice conversation with support and seems devs are keeping them in dark as same as us.
Some men just want to watch the world burn... I just want a cold beer!12 -
Gilvoth✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭And yet a VR 14 will end up with more CP than the Casual, as the CS is based on time played and not content done.
Why is this so hard to understand for you?
If you keep playing as much as you did before, then you will still have more CPs with 1.7.
Then what was the problem to "track XP" if it's time dependent? It's even easier to track time, /played does it for you any time. YOu just need to see what was this number for each character when on Oct 3.
But no, most likely they won't reward me with CP for just being and online and chatting (finding a group) or trading.
I am pretty sure that CP will be rewarded for XP and players who have quests left can and will get it faster.
I have nothing left to do but grind, which I won't do because it's not fun. And I bet they won't scale XP so that for 2 trials(for coffers) and 7 dungeons(for dailies) I will get as much XP as another player would get for a week of questing.
I remember, it would take 1 to 2 days to complete the entire veteran zone. I bet they won't make it so that, say, 9 AA runs will give me as much XP because in this case people will just grind trials and spend almost no efforts and time.
I keep seeing this said. If you have ran out of the content you enjoy, that is your issue, not the champion system.
If they gave you 100 extra CP, you would still have no content that you enjoy to do.
Why are you still playing if you have no more content you enjoy?
The fact is, anyone that is still here and still enjoying it, is doing some form of content (or they are not playing at all), that content will award XP, be it currently or after the rebalance of XP awards.
i have never had any love for the content, eso is a complete backwards setting and description of morrowind where it was suppose to have originated, the devs have no clue what morrowind even is nor her culture or peoples nor history. they seem to be in-love with skyrim and oblivion to the point where morrowind was destroyed and non-existant in eso.
your view of why i am upset with the champion system is completely false and as far from reality as east is from the west. allow me to explain the truth of why i personaly am upset with the rediculas 30 cp
i play eso for the pvp and my love of morrowind, even tho morrowind is non-existant in eso i still seek after her.
so as i pvp i allways try to stay competitive and up to speed with all the other people which is only natural.
since we were told specificly the following
WHAT WE WERE PROMISSED:
ZOS_MariaAliprando wrote: »
Greetings! I am Maria Aliprando, Gameplay Designer on the Champion System.
Should players that are VR1+ still work towards VR12 or should they just wait until the new changes.
Continue to play! We are tracking your XP as you advance your way through Veteran Ranks and even past VR14. When the Champion System comes out we will reward you points right away based on the amount of XP you have earned up to a cap. In general, most people won’t reach the cap and we do not know what that cap is yet. We're still working out that value and making sure to take a look at the XP you all are earning.
that led me to believe that in order to stay competitive in pvp i needed to finish all i could in the pve area so that i would be prepared for the champion system release.
however this was a lie we were told because
WHAT WE ARE GETTING:
ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »
Hi guys, just wanted to pop in and put this to rest. What Kai said a few days ago is correct. Just to make sure we're all on the same page, once Update 6 is released and you have at least one Veteran Rank character, all your characters will receive 30 Champion Points - no more, no less. This will only occur at the onset of Update 6; after this is released, you will gain Champion Points one at a time as designed
this is unfair, unpolished and unwanted and has nothing to do with what you mentioned and has Everything to do with being forced into making a new character in order to be competitive and fair in the new update coming in just a few weeks destroys all the work i did on the v14 character i have.
if the quests and matterial was infact repeatable it would not be an issue and no one would be complaining.
Edited by Gilvoth on December 31, 2014 1:03PM6 -
Merlin13KAGL✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭ahstin2001nub18_ESO wrote: »i have all but 1 trade skill maxed and i am vr7, so that for sure makes me equal to a vr14 with no trade skills..... THEY ARE TWO SEPERATE THINGS....
trade skills have their own experience- i maxed it. level grinding has its own experience level, which veteran ranks are attached to and are to be replaced by CPs- i don't have it maxed. the mere fact that the character progression isn't maxed MAKES me unequal to a VR14. if you want to stand around shooting the bull or crafting, thats on you. if you want to level and work towards character progression (the numbers that make you kill faster) thats on you as well. neglect either and that is on you.... its all equal but they are completely separate systems.
TL;DR, eh, @ahstin2001nub18_ESO ? Perhaps you should follow the whole thread and it would make more sense.
No one, save you, is speaking of trade skills.
The complaint (I'll summarize for you) involves the 100's more hours put in by some than by others beyond VR14.
The complaint, while note entirely invalid, will probably not see any change come to pass.
There was no grandfathered Undaunted Rep.
There was no bonus to Master Enchanters when they revamped the crafting progression. (Yeah, that's a trade skill, but included here strictly for example.)
There is an obvious difference between time spent /emoting and time performing in game functions. Common sense indicates that most are probably making good use of their time. Not everyone's power leveling, not everyone's RPing a minute for minute daily routine. Give me a break.
Some people have more levels, more XP's, more overall XP's (all alts), and more time in game. Will they see anything from it?
No one knows.
To be honest, I'm trying to figure out wth your complaint is, exactly?
Just because you don't like the way something is doesn't necessarily make it wrong...
Earn it.
IRL'ing for a while for assorted reasons, in forum, and in game.I am neither warm, nor fuzzy...
Probably has checkbox on Customer Service profile that say High Aggro, 99% immunity to BS0 -
Guppet✭✭✭✭✭
✭dwemer_paleologist wrote: »And yet a VR 14 will end up with more CP than the Casual, as the CS is based on time played and not content done.
Why is this so hard to understand for you?
If you keep playing as much as you did before, then you will still have more CPs with 1.7.
Then what was the problem to "track XP" if it's time dependent? It's even easier to track time, /played does it for you any time. YOu just need to see what was this number for each character when on Oct 3.
But no, most likely they won't reward me with CP for just being and online and chatting (finding a group) or trading.
I am pretty sure that CP will be rewarded for XP and players who have quests left can and will get it faster.
I have nothing left to do but grind, which I won't do because it's not fun. And I bet they won't scale XP so that for 2 trials(for coffers) and 7 dungeons(for dailies) I will get as much XP as another player would get for a week of questing.
I remember, it would take 1 to 2 days to complete the entire veteran zone. I bet they won't make it so that, say, 9 AA runs will give me as much XP because in this case people will just grind trials and spend almost no efforts and time.
I keep seeing this said. If you have ran out of the content you enjoy, that is your issue, not the champion system.
If they gave you 100 extra CP, you would still have no content that you enjoy to do.
Why are you still playing if you have no more content you enjoy?
The fact is, anyone that is still here and still enjoying it, is doing some form of content (or they are not playing at all), that content will award XP, be it currently or after the rebalance of XP awards.
i have never had any love for the content, eso is a complete backwards setting and description of morrowind where it was suppose to have originated, the devs have no clue what morrowind even is nor her culture or peoples nor history. they seem to be in-love with skyrim and oblivion to the point where morrowind was destroyed and non-existant in eso.
your view of why i am upset with the champion system is completely false and as far from reality as east is from the west. allow me to explain the truth of why i personaly am upset with the rediculas 30 cp
i play eso for the pvp and my love of morrowind, even tho morrowind is non-existant in eso i still seek after her.
so as i pvp i allways try to stay competitive and up to speed with all the other people which is only natural.
since we were told specificly the following
WHAT WE WERE PROMISSED:
ZOS_MariaAliprando wrote: »
Greetings! I am Maria Aliprando, Gameplay Designer on the Champion System.
Should players that are VR1+ still work towards VR12 or should they just wait until the new changes.
Continue to play! We are tracking your XP as you advance your way through Veteran Ranks and even past VR14. When the Champion System comes out we will reward you points right away based on the amount of XP you have earned up to a cap. In general, most people won’t reach the cap and we do not know what that cap is yet. We're still working out that value and making sure to take a look at the XP you all are earning.
that led me to believe that in order to stay competitive in pvp i needed to finish all i could in the pve area so that i would be prepared for the champion system release.
however this was a lie we were told because
WHAT WE ARE GETTING:
ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »
Hi guys, just wanted to pop in and put this to rest. What Kai said a few days ago is correct. Just to make sure we're all on the same page, once Update 6 is released and you have at least one Veteran Rank character, all your characters will receive 30 Champion Points - no more, no less. This will only occur at the onset of Update 6; after this is released, you will gain Champion Points one at a time as designed
this is unfair, unpolished and unwanted and has nothing to do with what you mentioned and has Everything to do with being forced into making a new character in order to be competitive and fair in the new update coming in just a few weeks destroys all the work i did on the v14 character i have.
if the quests and matterial was infact repeatable it would not be an issue and no one would be complaining.
But if the only thing you are here for is PVP (Morowwind is not here), surly you disliked doing cadwells silver and gold. So you would probably have preferred not to do it, but felt the need, as it was quicker XP than PVP. That reeks of "I had to go up a hill backwards in the snow, so everyone must".
Removing it is better for future players like yourself.
So the content you actually enjoy is still available to you (PVP) and they have said they are going to rebalance its XP gains.
So your actually upset because you assume they will not balance the XP correctly, you assume. You also assume that if they get the balance wrong, it will be detrimental to your play style. They could just as easily screw it up the opposite way and it end up with PVP awarding more than questing. You know nothing of the rebalance till it happens.4 -
Gilvoth✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭dwemer_paleologist wrote: »And yet a VR 14 will end up with more CP than the Casual, as the CS is based on time played and not content done.
Why is this so hard to understand for you?
If you keep playing as much as you did before, then you will still have more CPs with 1.7.
Then what was the problem to "track XP" if it's time dependent? It's even easier to track time, /played does it for you any time. YOu just need to see what was this number for each character when on Oct 3.
But no, most likely they won't reward me with CP for just being and online and chatting (finding a group) or trading.
I am pretty sure that CP will be rewarded for XP and players who have quests left can and will get it faster.
I have nothing left to do but grind, which I won't do because it's not fun. And I bet they won't scale XP so that for 2 trials(for coffers) and 7 dungeons(for dailies) I will get as much XP as another player would get for a week of questing.
I remember, it would take 1 to 2 days to complete the entire veteran zone. I bet they won't make it so that, say, 9 AA runs will give me as much XP because in this case people will just grind trials and spend almost no efforts and time.
I keep seeing this said. If you have ran out of the content you enjoy, that is your issue, not the champion system.
If they gave you 100 extra CP, you would still have no content that you enjoy to do.
Why are you still playing if you have no more content you enjoy?
The fact is, anyone that is still here and still enjoying it, is doing some form of content (or they are not playing at all), that content will award XP, be it currently or after the rebalance of XP awards.
i have never had any love for the content, eso is a complete backwards setting and description of morrowind where it was suppose to have originated, the devs have no clue what morrowind even is nor her culture or peoples nor history. they seem to be in-love with skyrim and oblivion to the point where morrowind was destroyed and non-existant in eso.
your view of why i am upset with the champion system is completely false and as far from reality as east is from the west. allow me to explain the truth of why i personaly am upset with the rediculas 30 cp
i play eso for the pvp and my love of morrowind, even tho morrowind is non-existant in eso i still seek after her.
so as i pvp i allways try to stay competitive and up to speed with all the other people which is only natural.
since we were told specificly the following
WHAT WE WERE PROMISSED:
ZOS_MariaAliprando wrote: »
Greetings! I am Maria Aliprando, Gameplay Designer on the Champion System.
Should players that are VR1+ still work towards VR12 or should they just wait until the new changes.
Continue to play! We are tracking your XP as you advance your way through Veteran Ranks and even past VR14. When the Champion System comes out we will reward you points right away based on the amount of XP you have earned up to a cap. In general, most people won’t reach the cap and we do not know what that cap is yet. We're still working out that value and making sure to take a look at the XP you all are earning.
that led me to believe that in order to stay competitive in pvp i needed to finish all i could in the pve area so that i would be prepared for the champion system release.
however this was a lie we were told because
WHAT WE ARE GETTING:
ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »
Hi guys, just wanted to pop in and put this to rest. What Kai said a few days ago is correct. Just to make sure we're all on the same page, once Update 6 is released and you have at least one Veteran Rank character, all your characters will receive 30 Champion Points - no more, no less. This will only occur at the onset of Update 6; after this is released, you will gain Champion Points one at a time as designed
this is unfair, unpolished and unwanted and has nothing to do with what you mentioned and has Everything to do with being forced into making a new character in order to be competitive and fair in the new update coming in just a few weeks destroys all the work i did on the v14 character i have.
if the quests and matterial was infact repeatable it would not be an issue and no one would be complaining.
But if the only thing you are here for is PVP (Morowwind is not here), surly you disliked doing cadwells silver and gold. So you would probably have preferred not to do it, but felt the need, as it was quicker XP than PVP. That reeks of "I had to go up a hill backwards in the snow, so everyone must".
Removing it is better for future players like yourself.
So the content you actually enjoy is still available to you (PVP) and they have said they are going to rebalance its XP gains.
So your actually upset because you assume they will not balance the XP correctly, you assume. You also assume that if they get the balance wrong, it will be detrimental to your play style. They could just as easily screw it up the opposite way and it end up with PVP awarding more than questing. You know nothing of the rebalance till it happens.
wrong, i am a nightblade so i would NOT be getting new cp, basicly everything you just said is totaly not even in view of the truth of the matters involved. i dont wish to write a full 112 page explanation of it so i will surfice to just state the following and will not be responding any further to your comment
" i spend almost my entire time in pvp and completed ALL of the quests in all 3 alliances to stay competitive in pvp, with the 30 champion points being given to my v14 stamina build nightblade i will not be able to keep up with lower level people who are able to do the quests in all 3 alliances and many other things that i allready completed and can not complete again due to us having been lied to. so in order to stay competitive in pvp i am forced to make the decision to make a new character or leave eso."
3 -
Guppet✭✭✭✭✭
✭dwemer_paleologist wrote: »dwemer_paleologist wrote: »And yet a VR 14 will end up with more CP than the Casual, as the CS is based on time played and not content done.
Why is this so hard to understand for you?
If you keep playing as much as you did before, then you will still have more CPs with 1.7.
Then what was the problem to "track XP" if it's time dependent? It's even easier to track time, /played does it for you any time. YOu just need to see what was this number for each character when on Oct 3.
But no, most likely they won't reward me with CP for just being and online and chatting (finding a group) or trading.
I am pretty sure that CP will be rewarded for XP and players who have quests left can and will get it faster.
I have nothing left to do but grind, which I won't do because it's not fun. And I bet they won't scale XP so that for 2 trials(for coffers) and 7 dungeons(for dailies) I will get as much XP as another player would get for a week of questing.
I remember, it would take 1 to 2 days to complete the entire veteran zone. I bet they won't make it so that, say, 9 AA runs will give me as much XP because in this case people will just grind trials and spend almost no efforts and time.
I keep seeing this said. If you have ran out of the content you enjoy, that is your issue, not the champion system.
If they gave you 100 extra CP, you would still have no content that you enjoy to do.
Why are you still playing if you have no more content you enjoy?
The fact is, anyone that is still here and still enjoying it, is doing some form of content (or they are not playing at all), that content will award XP, be it currently or after the rebalance of XP awards.
i have never had any love for the content, eso is a complete backwards setting and description of morrowind where it was suppose to have originated, the devs have no clue what morrowind even is nor her culture or peoples nor history. they seem to be in-love with skyrim and oblivion to the point where morrowind was destroyed and non-existant in eso.
your view of why i am upset with the champion system is completely false and as far from reality as east is from the west. allow me to explain the truth of why i personaly am upset with the rediculas 30 cp
i play eso for the pvp and my love of morrowind, even tho morrowind is non-existant in eso i still seek after her.
so as i pvp i allways try to stay competitive and up to speed with all the other people which is only natural.
since we were told specificly the following
WHAT WE WERE PROMISSED:
ZOS_MariaAliprando wrote: »
Greetings! I am Maria Aliprando, Gameplay Designer on the Champion System.
Should players that are VR1+ still work towards VR12 or should they just wait until the new changes.
Continue to play! We are tracking your XP as you advance your way through Veteran Ranks and even past VR14. When the Champion System comes out we will reward you points right away based on the amount of XP you have earned up to a cap. In general, most people won’t reach the cap and we do not know what that cap is yet. We're still working out that value and making sure to take a look at the XP you all are earning.
that led me to believe that in order to stay competitive in pvp i needed to finish all i could in the pve area so that i would be prepared for the champion system release.
however this was a lie we were told because
WHAT WE ARE GETTING:
ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »
Hi guys, just wanted to pop in and put this to rest. What Kai said a few days ago is correct. Just to make sure we're all on the same page, once Update 6 is released and you have at least one Veteran Rank character, all your characters will receive 30 Champion Points - no more, no less. This will only occur at the onset of Update 6; after this is released, you will gain Champion Points one at a time as designed
this is unfair, unpolished and unwanted and has nothing to do with what you mentioned and has Everything to do with being forced into making a new character in order to be competitive and fair in the new update coming in just a few weeks destroys all the work i did on the v14 character i have.
if the quests and matterial was infact repeatable it would not be an issue and no one would be complaining.
But if the only thing you are here for is PVP (Morowwind is not here), surly you disliked doing cadwells silver and gold. So you would probably have preferred not to do it, but felt the need, as it was quicker XP than PVP. That reeks of "I had to go up a hill backwards in the snow, so everyone must".
Removing it is better for future players like yourself.
So the content you actually enjoy is still available to you (PVP) and they have said they are going to rebalance its XP gains.
So your actually upset because you assume they will not balance the XP correctly, you assume. You also assume that if they get the balance wrong, it will be detrimental to your play style. They could just as easily screw it up the opposite way and it end up with PVP awarding more than questing. You know nothing of the rebalance till it happens.
wrong, i am a nightblade so i would NOT be getting new cp, basicly everything you just said is totaly not even in view of the truth of the matters involved. i dont wish to write a full 112 page explanation of it so i will surfice to just state the following and will not be responding any further to your comment
" i spend almost my entire time in pvp and completed ALL of the quests in all 3 alliances to stay competitive in pvp, with the 30 champion points being given to my v14 stamina build nightblade i will not be able to keep up with lower level people who are able to do the quests in all 3 alliances and many other things that i allready completed and can not complete again due to us having been lied to. so in order to stay competitive in pvp i am forced to make the decision to make a new character or leave eso."
Wow it really sounds like you did not read one word of what you quoted from myself, as you basically just confirmed every last thing I had said lol. I don't blame you for not responding any further, it would only be detrimental to your argument, such as it is lol.3 -
knightblaster✭✭✭Nazon_Katts wrote: »
Actually, even WoW, the pinnacle *cough* of a vertical progression system, doesn't take power from existing characters. In all of Azeroth - up to the new expansion's zone - you'll remain the demigod you used to be. Only if you buy it and set foot into new lands, you'll have to start anew.
This is true, but thy manage it both by (1) catch-up systems (which were themselves unpopular with the more advanced players, but were done anyway) and (2) periodic resets with expansions where everyone goes to the starting line again. Both seem like a better approach than this one, even though the design of this game is very different.
0 -
Pathfinder✭✭✭knightblaster wrote: »Nazon_Katts wrote: »
Actually, even WoW, the pinnacle *cough* of a vertical progression system, doesn't take power from existing characters. In all of Azeroth - up to the new expansion's zone - you'll remain the demigod you used to be. Only if you buy it and set foot into new lands, you'll have to start anew.
This is true, but thy manage it both by (1) catch-up systems (which were themselves unpopular with the more advanced players, but were done anyway) and (2) periodic resets with expansions where everyone goes to the starting line again. Both seem like a better approach than this one, even though the design of this game is very different.
I said this in a different thread, but ZOS should just reset everyone's toons to lv0 and stick us back in a Cold Harbor cell. Blame it on Molag Bal and be done with it.
Main
Malfahri del Sol Imperial Templar (stamplar *new respec) PC/NA/Trueflame6 -
AngryNord✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Pathfinder wrote: »knightblaster wrote: »Nazon_Katts wrote: »
Actually, even WoW, the pinnacle *cough* of a vertical progression system, doesn't take power from existing characters. In all of Azeroth - up to the new expansion's zone - you'll remain the demigod you used to be. Only if you buy it and set foot into new lands, you'll have to start anew.
This is true, but thy manage it both by (1) catch-up systems (which were themselves unpopular with the more advanced players, but were done anyway) and (2) periodic resets with expansions where everyone goes to the starting line again. Both seem like a better approach than this one, even though the design of this game is very different.
I said this in a different thread, but ZOS should just reset everyone's toons to lv0 and stick us back in a Cold Harbor cell. Blame it on Molag Bal and be done with it.
That would cause so many unsubs it'd most likely be the end of this game2 -
Gidorick✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Pathfinder wrote: »knightblaster wrote: »Nazon_Katts wrote: »
Actually, even WoW, the pinnacle *cough* of a vertical progression system, doesn't take power from existing characters. In all of Azeroth - up to the new expansion's zone - you'll remain the demigod you used to be. Only if you buy it and set foot into new lands, you'll have to start anew.
This is true, but thy manage it both by (1) catch-up systems (which were themselves unpopular with the more advanced players, but were done anyway) and (2) periodic resets with expansions where everyone goes to the starting line again. Both seem like a better approach than this one, even though the design of this game is very different.
I said this in a different thread, but ZOS should just reset everyone's toons to lv0 and stick us back in a Cold Harbor cell. Blame it on Molag Bal and be done with it.
That's a bit dramatic.What ESO really needs is an Auction Horse.
That's right... Horse.
Click HERE to discuss.
Want more crazy ideas? Check out my Concept Repository!3 -
knightblaster✭✭✭Pathfinder wrote: »knightblaster wrote: »Nazon_Katts wrote: »
Actually, even WoW, the pinnacle *cough* of a vertical progression system, doesn't take power from existing characters. In all of Azeroth - up to the new expansion's zone - you'll remain the demigod you used to be. Only if you buy it and set foot into new lands, you'll have to start anew.
This is true, but thy manage it both by (1) catch-up systems (which were themselves unpopular with the more advanced players, but were done anyway) and (2) periodic resets with expansions where everyone goes to the starting line again. Both seem like a better approach than this one, even though the design of this game is very different.
I said this in a different thread, but ZOS should just reset everyone's toons to lv0 and stick us back in a Cold Harbor cell. Blame it on Molag Bal and be done with it.
That's a bit dramatic.
Right. The "resets" I have seen in other games come along organically with expansions that increase level cap, introduce new gear and skills and so on. It is much easier to swallow there -- although I do remember players grousing when WoW's first expac was released that their top level gear was being replaced quickly in the expac which "trivialized their effort". Of course, they were right -- that was precisely what was happening. But the problem in these games where vertical progression is so intense and meaningful (as compared to, say, EVE, where it's more horizontal), is that unless you have periodic restarts like that, the game becomes very unappetizing for new players due to the power gap (especially in PvP but also in PvE unless there are catch-ups in place).
Of course, it only works well if it is done organically, with the introduction of new levels and content and so on, so that it really is a new start. That's still annoying to some players, but it's generally more acceptable to them than something like this, where there is no new content (at least not significant amounts of it), but a kind of reset happening anyway. The need for periodic resets is clear in a game of this type, but the context in which they come has to include all the other elements of a real new start, complete with content that all players can use to advance. Outside of that context, players will feel like they are simply being robbed.
To address gap issues outside of a real reset, a catch-up mechanism could be employed in lieu of what they are doing here. In other words, lower VR players could earn XP faster in silver/gold to catch up to the higher VR players faster, and close the gap that way without taking anything away from the higher VR players in the interim. This would address the gap issue without completely alienating the high VR players. Yes, some would still grouse about "welfare XP" and "not being fair that it doesn't take as long as it did for me, I put in the work", and so on, and that's natural, but still this would be more acceptable to most than the planned system.
I think ZOS really needs to put more thought into this, and I say this as a player who hasn't played for a few months, does not have a VR14, and would benefit from the system as currently proposed personally.
6 -
Enodoc✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Lloyd seems to understand where we're coming from... I think.Thank you for getting back to me with clarification, I can completely see where you're coming from now.
In regards to the latest response that you linked, I can see why that would be cause for concern. My understanding of it is that the system may have failed to track XP past 14 (I can't 100% this, as a lot of the Dev/Community team are still out for the holidays). What we can't have lost is the amount of XP gained between 1 and 14, as that's a set amount. If you're VR14, you've got it. I agree that this point could do with some clarification.
In regards to the latter point, we do not have any information at this time that would either prove or disprove that different VRanks will be handled differently. Yes, at this point everyone will be given 30CP, but the power difference between a VR1 and VR14 will remain. How phase 4 will handle a difference in VRanks has not been offered yet.
The point in your response that I most agree with is the potential for CP from content (non-repeatable quests) that a lower VRank will have over a higher VRank. In that regard I'm afraid I have no information, but I will point out that there are a number of repeatable quests and end game content (trials, Undaunted etc.) that lower VRanks do not have access to, or the ability to complete. In completing these, you'll be able to make gains that a lower rank player won't be able to, but will get through quests. Unfortunately I can't say if these will be comparable without having numbers in front of me (which I would love to have access to).
Once the teams are back, I will personally push for more clarification on this one. I know they don't like to post too many specifics, but I will do my best to fight the player corner on this one, as you're the ones that have dedicated yourselves to playing, so it's my job to support you!
I can't make any promises, especially time wise, but I will do what I can to get the thread updated with additional information in the near future.
I hope that goes some way to allaying your concerns, and I apologize for any confusion this has caused. I wish you the best of luck in your adventures, and please don't hesitate to contact us again if there's anything else we can help you with!
Warmest regards,
Lloyd
The Elder Scrolls Online Team
Yesterday I had nice conversation with support and seems devs are keeping them in dark as same as us.
Just to draw on this bit that he said:
The point in your response that I most agree with is the potential for CP from content (non-repeatable quests) that a lower VRank will have over a higher VRank. In that regard I'm afraid I have no information, but I will point out that there are a number of repeatable quests and end game content (trials, Undaunted etc.) that lower VRanks do not have access to, or the ability to complete.
All the existing repeatable content (Trials, Undaunted, Craglorn) is for groups, while the non-repeatable quests are solo content. Therefore they are not comparable.UESP: The Unofficial Elder Scrolls Pages - A collaborative source for all knowledge on the Elder Scrolls series since 1995
Join us on Discord - discord.gg/uesp3 -
Grao✭✭✭✭✭
✭.Thank you for getting back to me with clarification, I can completely see where you're coming from now.
In regards to the latest response that you linked, I can see why that would be cause for concern. My understanding of it is that the system may have failed to track XP past 14 (I can't 100% this, as a lot of the Dev/Community team are still out for the holidays). What we can't have lost is the amount of XP gained between 1 and 14, as that's a set amount. If you're VR14, you've got it. I agree that this point could do with some clarification.
In regards to the latter point, we do not have any information at this time that would either prove or disprove that different VRanks will be handled differently. Yes, at this point everyone will be given 30CP, but the power difference between a VR1 and VR14 will remain. How phase 4 will handle a difference in VRanks has not been offered yet.
The point in your response that I most agree with is the potential for CP from content (non-repeatable quests) that a lower VRank will have over a higher VRank. In that regard I'm afraid I have no information, but I will point out that there are a number of repeatable quests and end game content (trials, Undaunted etc.) that lower VRanks do not have access to, or the ability to complete. In completing these, you'll be able to make gains that a lower rank player won't be able to, but will get through quests. Unfortunately I can't say if these will be comparable without having numbers in front of me (which I would love to have access to).
Once the teams are back, I will personally push for more clarification on this one. I know they don't like to post too many specifics, but I will do my best to fight the player corner on this one, as you're the ones that have dedicated yourselves to playing, so it's my job to support you!
I can't make any promises, especially time wise, but I will do what I can to get the thread updated with additional information in the near future.
I hope that goes some way to allaying your concerns, and I apologize for any confusion this has caused. I wish you the best of luck in your adventures, and please don't hesitate to contact us again if there's anything else we can help you with!
Warmest regards,
Lloyd
The Elder Scrolls Online Team
Yesterday I had nice conversation with support and seems devs are keeping them in dark as same as us.
Yup, I had a long chat with Lloyd yesterday as well. Apparently this bomb was pushed for him to handle, poor guy. He has as little information as we do which is very unsatisfying and totally not his fault.
What I think will happen if ZoS doesn't give in and apply the rules of the champion system as they were meant to be:
1.6 - Any account with a veteran rank character will receive 30 CPs independent of progression within the current system; independent of exp.
Conjecture: Why is ZoS doing this? Because they want to bring the vr1 power as close as possible to the power of the vr14. They are balancing us out as much as possible, as discreetly as they managed.
1.7 - The end of the veteran system, hail the Champion System.
Conjecture: With vet ranks gone the attribute points given to us as rewards for leveling in the Vranks will also be removed. We will all be given 49 (or 50) attribute points at max level. That will remove any left over difference between the now gone vr1s and vr14s, we will all be the same (except for those that managed to grind more champion points in between 1.6 and 1.7)
Gear will also be rescaled at this point as rank requirements will be gone. How this will work is still vague, but it is obvious armor alone will not maintain the difference in power between those that used to be vr1s and those that used to be vr14s.
If you think about it, it is quite brilliant! Right now they say vr14s will still be stronger then vr1s and therefore we can't complain that vr1s and vr14s are getting the same amount of CPs. And when 1.7 drops ZoS can simply say "Well, you all knew the veteran system was being removed. We already awarded CPs to those that had enough experience to earn them."
And with such a simple ploy they manage to reset the system to 0, or as close to 0 as they dare to attempt.11 -
Grao✭✭✭✭✭
✭Pathfinder wrote: »knightblaster wrote: »Nazon_Katts wrote: »
Actually, even WoW, the pinnacle *cough* of a vertical progression system, doesn't take power from existing characters. In all of Azeroth - up to the new expansion's zone - you'll remain the demigod you used to be. Only if you buy it and set foot into new lands, you'll have to start anew.
This is true, but thy manage it both by (1) catch-up systems (which were themselves unpopular with the more advanced players, but were done anyway) and (2) periodic resets with expansions where everyone goes to the starting line again. Both seem like a better approach than this one, even though the design of this game is very different.
I said this in a different thread, but ZOS should just reset everyone's toons to lv0 and stick us back in a Cold Harbor cell. Blame it on Molag Bal and be done with it.
Sadly, you are closer to the truth then everyone realizes. Of course ZoS won't be so blunt, but they are resetting our characters as much as they dare to do, hoping not to incur on the wrath of their player base.
7 -
xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Hello all,
The sole reason why we do Quests is to level up our skill lines, our vet ranks, and our skills to morph. I think everyone that has done all the quests in the game and finished everything has been rewarded with skill points, atribution points, dye colors, and the titles. These's where the reasons for completeing the game for those mile stones and rewards. You can complain about every little detail but it will not change the overall outcome. Be glad that we are getting Champion points.
I my self have completed most of the game content. But you guys are also missing the one importand thing even if you complete everything now and don't have much to do they will release more content with more dyes more achivements more quests for you to level. So just be patient more will come when its supposed to.
Don't know why people keep saying stuff like this.
You do realize that someone doing quests after CP comes out gets all that PLUS CP right? I do not. I have 5 vets, that's 65m xp worth of quests that I cannot repeat or earn again (and once 1.7 is out, even vet levels will be taken away and all that xp really will be for nothing). I do not like pvp. Dailies are ok, but mostly group related and not enough to earn as much as questing. I do not want to grind. This leaves me with two (and a half with a v5 I have) character slots of quests to earn CP with.
How do people not understand that once the CP system is fully in place after 1.7 that the xp is essentially wasted?? If a v1 player never played from now until june and neither did I with my 5 v14s, we would be the same except for a few extra skill points from doing the quest lines that they can jump in and do - once they do them - they will have the same points PLUS CP from the xp of doing them (that's 13m+ xp from doing the zones unless you skip a lot of stuff). You can get through that in a couple weeks if you really wanted to. Do you know how much slower someone in my position would earn points waiting for members to get online to do a group dungeon daily? and waiting for months to go by when zos puts out new content? (They released one group content zone last year and two vet dungeons last year - that's the only new content they put out and it is all group based).
-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC5 -
xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Thank you for getting back to me with clarification, I can completely see where you're coming from now.
In regards to the latest response that you linked, I can see why that would be cause for concern. My understanding of it is that the system may have failed to track XP past 14 (I can't 100% this, as a lot of the Dev/Community team are still out for the holidays). What we can't have lost is the amount of XP gained between 1 and 14, as that's a set amount. If you're VR14, you've got it. I agree that this point could do with some clarification.
In regards to the latter point, we do not have any information at this time that would either prove or disprove that different VRanks will be handled differently. Yes, at this point everyone will be given 30CP, but the power difference between a VR1 and VR14 will remain. How phase 4 will handle a difference in VRanks has not been offered yet.
The point in your response that I most agree with is the potential for CP from content (non-repeatable quests) that a lower VRank will have over a higher VRank. In that regard I'm afraid I have no information, but I will point out that there are a number of repeatable quests and end game content (trials, Undaunted etc.) that lower VRanks do not have access to, or the ability to complete. In completing these, you'll be able to make gains that a lower rank player won't be able to, but will get through quests. Unfortunately I can't say if these will be comparable without having numbers in front of me (which I would love to have access to).
Once the teams are back, I will personally push for more clarification on this one. I know they don't like to post too many specifics, but I will do my best to fight the player corner on this one, as you're the ones that have dedicated yourselves to playing, so it's my job to support you!
I can't make any promises, especially time wise, but I will do what I can to get the thread updated with additional information in the near future.
I hope that goes some way to allaying your concerns, and I apologize for any confusion this has caused. I wish you the best of luck in your adventures, and please don't hesitate to contact us again if there's anything else we can help you with!
Warmest regards,
Lloyd
The Elder Scrolls Online Team
Yesterday I had nice conversation with support and seems devs are keeping them in dark as same as us.
This is all well and good, but Gina kind of doubled down on the "no more CP coming" already, even when vet levels are removed. That's what causing the problem.
And frankly, the whole "we have access to content a v1 doesn't" is BS. First of all, they can do all undaunted - they scale to level and you can do them whatever level you want. The only thing they really can't do is "be carried" since they won't earn xp if they partner up with people more than 4 levels higher than them, as long as they avoid that they can earn xp virtually any way we can.
Plus, telling me I have to wait for 3 other people or 11 other people to earn XP when a v1 can jump on solo and do quests and earn a sht-ton of xp relatively quickly is BS as well. (Heck, even all the new content added since launch has all been group based).
The fact is, a new vet has the entire game of content ahead of them and a variety of ways to earn XP/CP. A v14 does not.-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC9 -
xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I really think if ZoS would at least reset silver/gold quests (even if they wait until 1.7) for everyone it would solve a lot of this. Sure, some might be mad that the xp they already earned is for naught, but at least everyone will be on the same starting point and be able to earn future points the same way.-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC3
