The Gold Road Chapter – which includes the Scribing system – and Update 42 is now available to test on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/656454/

"You will not be able to outfit your character in class styles other than your current class."

  • Pr0Skygon
    Pr0Skygon
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    JakaWild wrote: »
    AScarlato wrote: »
    Guess I'm the only person here who likes some class-unique motifs in MMOs. One won't kill anyone.

    That said people can already look like other classes, themactically, with the motifs we have so the sanctity of these sets is a bit strange.

    Nah you aren't the only one. Its honestly about time they do more class specific things. Hopefully Zos sticks to their decision.

    Tbh zos has cultivated the responses you see here. Years of "you should be able to have & do everything" has ruined people's perception of what multi-class mmos are suppose to be like.

    You'd think people don't have access to hundreds & hundreds of motif's usable on any class based on these comments. Add something unique to classes? no way! we want bland and everything to be the same! bah.

    Many of us have played plenty of traditional MMO's where things were class locked. The restrictive, class-specific cliche's in them were stifling. (And still are, in many instances.)

    ESO is a breath of fresh air by comparison. I don't understand why people want to go back to the stone age of MMO's, when this game offers so much more. Many people are tired of what MMO's are "supposed to look like" and having to dress a class according to someones narrow ideas and limited imagination. ZOS is a leader in breaking this trend, and its a good thing.

    ESO never had these problems. Now, people want to introduce them, literally begging to have restrictions placed on them.

    You want bland? Bland is MMO's where every single gear style is class restricted.

    People aren't reacting the way they are because there aren't hundreds of styles already in the game. They are reacting like this because they see the beginnings of a bad idea beginning to form in the minds of the developers, based on the requests of a few, and they want to nip it in the bud before it gets worse.

    This is a move backwards compared to the rather progressive style system we have in this game, and I don't blame anyone for objecting to it.

    Strongly disagree with this take. Having uniqueness and feel to your appearance base on your class, vs having access to every single style to mix and match; those 2 concepts are 2 different tastes in fashion, not an upgrade or downgrade from one another.

    Also, it is 1 style, and that 1 style is already call "class style", based on "class set", and you're upset that it is "class specific"?
    Bruh, it's just 1 style, there's already more than 120 style that are unified for all classes, can we not have 1 oddball out of the pack?

    You want bland? Bland is when you can't tell what class a person is based on their outfit alone. We already have thousands of robe wearing DKs, chainmail Sorc, Templar with only a towel on their body, Warden that looks like they just skinned Bambi's mom, a "stealthy" Nightblade with blue LED full heavy armor and flashlight eyes.

    I love these weirdo styles, and having 1 single class specific style will not tarnish this, at all. If anything, it will strengthen the sense of freedom in fashion styling. If every single style is "creative", then none is. You need a contrast in fashion style to make things feel special again.

    And please stop advocating against this idea with the "every single x is y" kind of mentality, because that's very much not what ESO is, right from the beginning. ESO have class specific skill lines, but also universal skill lines that every can access. Both things can exist at the same time, you don't have to choose 1 or another. One is not the upgrade from another or vice versa, they are 2 different tastes of the same aspect.
  • ArchangelIsraphel
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    Pr0Skygon wrote: »
    JakaWild wrote: »
    AScarlato wrote: »
    Guess I'm the only person here who likes some class-unique motifs in MMOs. One won't kill anyone.

    That said people can already look like other classes, themactically, with the motifs we have so the sanctity of these sets is a bit strange.

    Nah you aren't the only one. Its honestly about time they do more class specific things. Hopefully Zos sticks to their decision.

    Tbh zos has cultivated the responses you see here. Years of "you should be able to have & do everything" has ruined people's perception of what multi-class mmos are suppose to be like.

    You'd think people don't have access to hundreds & hundreds of motif's usable on any class based on these comments. Add something unique to classes? no way! we want bland and everything to be the same! bah.

    Many of us have played plenty of traditional MMO's where things were class locked. The restrictive, class-specific cliche's in them were stifling. (And still are, in many instances.)

    ESO is a breath of fresh air by comparison. I don't understand why people want to go back to the stone age of MMO's, when this game offers so much more. Many people are tired of what MMO's are "supposed to look like" and having to dress a class according to someones narrow ideas and limited imagination. ZOS is a leader in breaking this trend, and its a good thing.

    ESO never had these problems. Now, people want to introduce them, literally begging to have restrictions placed on them.

    You want bland? Bland is MMO's where every single gear style is class restricted.

    People aren't reacting the way they are because there aren't hundreds of styles already in the game. They are reacting like this because they see the beginnings of a bad idea beginning to form in the minds of the developers, based on the requests of a few, and they want to nip it in the bud before it gets worse.

    This is a move backwards compared to the rather progressive style system we have in this game, and I don't blame anyone for objecting to it.

    Strongly disagree with this take. Having uniqueness and feel to your appearance base on your class, vs having access to every single style to mix and match; those 2 concepts are 2 different tastes in fashion, not an upgrade or downgrade from one another.

    Also, it is 1 style, and that 1 style is already call "class style", based on "class set", and you're upset that it is "class specific"?
    Bruh, it's just 1 style, there's already more than 120 style that are unified for all classes, can we not have 1 oddball out of the pack?

    You want bland? Bland is when you can't tell what class a person is based on their outfit alone. We already have thousands of robe wearing DKs, chainmail Sorc, Templar with only a towel on their body, Warden that looks like they just skinned Bambi's mom, a "stealthy" Nightblade with blue LED full heavy armor and flashlight eyes.

    I love these weirdo styles, and having 1 single class specific style will not tarnish this, at all. If anything, it will strengthen the sense of freedom in fashion styling. If every single style is "creative", then none is. You need a contrast in fashion style to make things feel special again.

    And please stop advocating against this idea with the "every single x is y" kind of mentality, because that's very much not what ESO is, right from the beginning. ESO have class specific skill lines, but also universal skill lines that every can access. Both things can exist at the same time, you don't have to choose 1 or another. One is not the upgrade from another or vice versa, they are 2 different tastes of the same aspect.

    It is a downgrade when users want to mix and match styles, and can not do so, because of a class restriction preventing it.

    Why do things need to be "special"? Sorry, but I don't share your mentality in regards to the need to be "special". The ability to wear anything we want, any way we want, is already special. A contrast isn't required to make that unique, or creative.

    Edit to add that we already have "special" styles, in the form of styles that can be gained through various content, and the fact that those styles can be mixed any way we want, makes them better.

    Sure. Both things can exist at the same time. But there are users who don't want that to be the case, especially when it's a rather arbitrary change to a system that was fine to begin with. As I said before, part of the reason a single style is upsetting so many, is because they don't want to see this kind of thing going forwards. Just because two ideas can exist at the same time, doesn't mean that people want it that way, or even that its a good idea.

    Edited by ArchangelIsraphel on January 30, 2024 8:22AM
    Legends never die
    They're written down in eternity
    But you'll never see the price it costs
    The scars collected all their lives
    When everything's lost, they pick up their hearts and avenge defeat
    Before it all starts, they suffer through harm just to touch a dream
    Oh, pick yourself up, 'cause
    Legends never die
  • Bjergenen
    Bjergenen
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    Pr0Skygon wrote: »
    JakaWild wrote: »
    AScarlato wrote: »
    Guess I'm the only person here who likes some class-unique motifs in MMOs. One won't kill anyone.

    That said people can already look like other classes, themactically, with the motifs we have so the sanctity of these sets is a bit strange.

    Nah you aren't the only one. Its honestly about time they do more class specific things. Hopefully Zos sticks to their decision.

    Tbh zos has cultivated the responses you see here. Years of "you should be able to have & do everything" has ruined people's perception of what multi-class mmos are suppose to be like.

    You'd think people don't have access to hundreds & hundreds of motif's usable on any class based on these comments. Add something unique to classes? no way! we want bland and everything to be the same! bah.

    Many of us have played plenty of traditional MMO's where things were class locked. The restrictive, class-specific cliche's in them were stifling. (And still are, in many instances.)

    ESO is a breath of fresh air by comparison. I don't understand why people want to go back to the stone age of MMO's, when this game offers so much more. Many people are tired of what MMO's are "supposed to look like" and having to dress a class according to someones narrow ideas and limited imagination. ZOS is a leader in breaking this trend, and its a good thing.

    ESO never had these problems. Now, people want to introduce them, literally begging to have restrictions placed on them.

    You want bland? Bland is MMO's where every single gear style is class restricted.

    People aren't reacting the way they are because there aren't hundreds of styles already in the game. They are reacting like this because they see the beginnings of a bad idea beginning to form in the minds of the developers, based on the requests of a few, and they want to nip it in the bud before it gets worse.

    This is a move backwards compared to the rather progressive style system we have in this game, and I don't blame anyone for objecting to it.

    Strongly disagree with this take. Having uniqueness and feel to your appearance base on your class, vs having access to every single style to mix and match; those 2 concepts are 2 different tastes in fashion, not an upgrade or downgrade from one another.

    Also, it is 1 style, and that 1 style is already call "class style", based on "class set", and you're upset that it is "class specific"?
    Bruh, it's just 1 style, there's already more than 120 style that are unified for all classes, can we not have 1 oddball out of the pack?

    You want bland? Bland is when you can't tell what class a person is based on their outfit alone. We already have thousands of robe wearing DKs, chainmail Sorc, Templar with only a towel on their body, Warden that looks like they just skinned Bambi's mom, a "stealthy" Nightblade with blue LED full heavy armor and flashlight eyes.

    I love these weirdo styles, and having 1 single class specific style will not tarnish this, at all. If anything, it will strengthen the sense of freedom in fashion styling. If every single style is "creative", then none is. You need a contrast in fashion style to make things feel special again.

    And please stop advocating against this idea with the "every single x is y" kind of mentality, because that's very much not what ESO is, right from the beginning. ESO have class specific skill lines, but also universal skill lines that every can access. Both things can exist at the same time, you don't have to choose 1 or another. One is not the upgrade from another or vice versa, they are 2 different tastes of the same aspect.
    uh waste of time we wont convince you nor you wont convince us. Im only hoping that fact that majority of playerbase dont want this class specific outfit style will be enough for ZOS to change this decision. There wouldn't be such a problem if one part of added styles (Soulcleaver mask) wasnt so unique and fashion-changing :) And no that one odball of style wont add any freedom in fashion styling as freedom is by definition "the condition or right of being able or allowed to do, say, think, etc. whatever you want to, without being controlled or limited" and limiting even that one style is against it. And that statement "if every single style is "creative", then none is" is somewhat similar to famous quote from Mies Van der Rohe "less is more" which is just terribly stupid saying but in opposite direction

    edit: did little oopsie translating from my native language :p
    Edited by Bjergenen on January 30, 2024 9:06AM
  • IncultaWolf
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    Lags wrote: »
    "Style Pages for Class Sets are now available in the Infinite Archive to collect. Style Pages are curated and will drop for your class first. Other Style Pages will drop after a set is complete. All pages are usable, but you will not be able to outfit your character in class styles other than your current class."

    So. What exactly is the point of the style page, then? With every other page, be that style page or motif page, you can wear whatever you please regardless of class, race or equipment.
    Why is this the exception? What is there to gain from this? The main reason most people have been looking forward to the class sets as style pages is, primarily, the nightblade mask. And most people can't access that because they need to be a nightblade to equip it, exactly like the armor piece?

    This goes against the idea of style/motif pages to begin with.

    have to agree this is terrible, was deff looking forward to using the nightblade mask. 90% of the stuff they come out with is so lame, but the mask is a bit different. Guess ill only be using on my nb, which i think ill be playing more next update after reading the patch notes.

    I think like 99% of the players here just wanted the nightblade mask lol
  • Pixiepumpkin
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    I guess the saying in video game development "Cool is the Rule", does not apply here.

    So lame, just so so lame.
    "𝕰𝖛𝖊𝖓 𝕲𝖔𝖉𝖘 𝖉𝖎𝖘𝖑𝖎𝖐𝖊 𝖙𝖍𝖊 𝖆𝖇𝖘𝖔𝖑𝖚𝖙𝖊, 𝖋𝖔𝖗 𝖎𝖙 𝖘𝖙𝖎𝖓𝖐𝖘 𝖔𝖋 𝖘𝖔𝖒𝖊𝖙𝖍𝖎𝖓𝖌 𝖑𝖆𝖗𝖌𝖊𝖗 𝖙𝖍𝖆𝖓 𝖙𝖍𝖊𝖒𝖘𝖊𝖑𝖛𝖊𝖘." ― Sotha Sil
    PC/NA
  • lillybit
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    Pr0Skygon wrote: »
    To be fair, if something is already named "class style", you should assume it is a class specific thing. But if you're advocating against it, then I don't want to ever hear you talk about "class identity" ever. You guys should really make it clear of what you want. I've been hearing about class identity this, class identity that for years now. And now when the game is actively enforcing via appearance, you guys are driven mad.
    I love ESO, but the community on this forum are all over the place with their values. Pick one, it's either enforcing class identity with unique feel to them, or class is just a template and everything should be unified.

    Class identity has nothing to do with appearance. You can be a proud Scot without ever wearing a kilt and someone else wearing one isn't declaring they're Scottish. You can identify as female without wearing skirts and dresses and wear a tux as a woman. Clothing doesn't define what someone is and shouldn't be restricted because of an arbitrary rule that is totally inconsistent with the rest of the game.
    PS4 EU
  • colossalvoids
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    So next update racial motives will be converted to be race locked to accommodate the change lmao?
  • Rasande_Robin
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    Yeah, nightblade mask is the best and even I've looked forward to such a mask. But oh well...
    PC/EU: Orcana "something"-stone
  • SpacemanSpiff1
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    zos completely removed any reason to further farm IA.

    cant say im surprised.
  • Circuitous
    Circuitous
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    Just adding my dislike to the pile.
    Thank Stendarr it’s Fredas.
    Elanirne: Altmer Templar Healer, DC
    Auria Dolabella: Imperial Nightblade Tank, DC
  • code65536
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    The styles aren't just in the thematic style of each class; they also display the unique emblem of each class.

    It would look kind of tacky for a sorc to run around with the nightblade logo on their chest.
    Nightfighters ― PC/NA and PC/EU

    Dungeons and Trials:
    Personal best scores:
    Dungeon trifectas:
    Media: YouTubeTwitch
  • Entaro
    Entaro
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    Please make these tradable so I can sell them for millions. Also I agree with the sentiment that there shouldn't be class restriction on the outfits. Let people look how they want to look. You can already transmog heavy armor look onto light armor, maces onto daggers, etc..
    Edited by Entaro on January 30, 2024 12:33PM
  • jlats
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    code65536 wrote: »
    The styles aren't just in the thematic style of each class; they also display the unique emblem of each class.

    It would look kind of tacky for a sorc to run around with the nightblade logo on their chest.

    I mean people in real life walk about wearing logos of sports teams, bands and designers that they have no affiliation with other than liking/supporting, so I don’t really think it’s a big deal.
  • code65536
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    jlats wrote: »
    I mean people in real life walk about wearing logos of sports teams, bands and designers that they have no affiliation with other than liking/supporting

    It would be more like a player of a sports team wearing the jersey of a rival team.

    There is a precedent, BTW, for restricted cosmetics. The Alliance Rider Outfit will only display the colors of that character's alliance. Your DC character does not have the option to say, "I like red, so I'll wear the EP version of this costume".

    There are hundreds of styles and costumes. It's fine to have a small handful that are identity-restricted.
    Nightfighters ― PC/NA and PC/EU

    Dungeons and Trials:
    Personal best scores:
    Dungeon trifectas:
    Media: YouTubeTwitch
  • Tensar
    Tensar
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    Tensar wrote: »
    please keep this restriction, it's a good idea

    Why?

    Because it's a class design, it would make no sense to be available for everybody. Sadly this game often give everything to everybody so it will probably change. I think it's better when everybody can't have everything.

    It reinforce class identity.

    If people like a class motif the devs should do similars cloths in other motifs but nothing more.
  • ZigoSid
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    code65536 wrote: »
    The styles aren't just in the thematic style of each class; they also display the unique emblem of each class.

    It would look kind of tacky for a sorc to run around with the nightblade logo on their chest.

    But a green skinned, pink glowy eyed human, dressed as a daedric prince, outfit dyed in vibrant orange, mounting some space bear who farts rainbows, etc is perfectly fine :*

    Edited by ZigoSid on January 30, 2024 12:52PM
  • jlats
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    code65536 wrote: »
    jlats wrote: »
    I mean people in real life walk about wearing logos of sports teams, bands and designers that they have no affiliation with other than liking/supporting

    It would be more like a player of a sports team wearing the jersey of a rival team.

    There is a precedent, BTW, for restricted cosmetics. The Alliance Rider Outfit will only display the colors of that character's alliance. Your DC character does not have the option to say, "I like red, so I'll wear the EP version of this costume".

    There are hundreds of styles and costumes. It's fine to have a small handful that are identity-restricted.

    I personally disagree and think my analogy holds as I don’t think classes are all automatically rivals? And sports people/musicians etc wear other teams and bands merch all the time, just not obviously Big Rivals ones, which again I don’t think classes are.

    It’s no different to all the people not from New York that wear big NYC hoodies or whatever, imo.

    I think the alliance rider thing is less of an issue because the only change is colour, and if that’s a big issue then there’s extremely similar stuff you can wear and dye that colour, but some of the class set stuff is really unique and can’t really be replicated.

    Also, sorry to be really annoying about it, if you really wanted to you could change alliance, but we are unable to change class.
  • This_0ne
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    code65536 wrote: »
    The styles aren't just in the thematic style of each class; they also display the unique emblem of each class.

    It would look kind of tacky for a sorc to run around with the nightblade logo on their chest.

    hey, can we finally have the right to roleplay an inelegant character without sense of style?
  • KlauthWarthog
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    I am kinda curious about what else will get arbitrarily restricted. They have gone through the work of coding whatever was necessary to get this restriction in place, and I doubt they will stop at that.
  • tomofhyrule
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    code65536 wrote: »
    jlats wrote: »
    I mean people in real life walk about wearing logos of sports teams, bands and designers that they have no affiliation with other than liking/supporting

    It would be more like a player of a sports team wearing the jersey of a rival team.

    There is a precedent, BTW, for restricted cosmetics. The Alliance Rider Outfit will only display the colors of that character's alliance. Your DC character does not have the option to say, "I like red, so I'll wear the EP version of this costume".

    There are hundreds of styles and costumes. It's fine to have a small handful that are identity-restricted.

    And yet, we can put our Companions in that Alliance look. And in my game, that means Bastian ("That's how we do things in Daggerfall!") is sporting red, which makes no sense whatsoever. We also are perfectly able to wear all of the Alliance styles, no matter which alliance we are.

    Also, that specific costume is one costume for all three alliances. And we even may see our character wearing the 'wrong' one in Battlegrounds when it 'changes' your alliance. We don't have any "your character cannot use this" since it just colors the costume differently - still the same, but a different color. Even the face markings you get for the "Glory of the [Alliance]" are unlocked for everyone, so all of my characters can wear red face paint and eyes despite fighting for the wrong alliances.

    The issue is that it's not "the same outfit with different insignia," it's totally different looks that are locked unnecessarily. None of the other Outfit styles are locked for any reason, and those styles are not locked currently on live.

    Again, the weapon styles do work that way - they are the same physical model with a class-specific insignia. I don't think anyone would care if those are locked (but why tho? If you don't want a different class, just don't use it?). But for armor pieces that have no insignia whatsoever, there's no reason to lock it.
    Edited by tomofhyrule on January 30, 2024 1:37PM
  • BetweenMidgets
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    Just adding my voice to the dissent. Bad choice on ZoS' part.
  • Kendaric
    Kendaric
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    Tensar wrote: »

    Because it's a class design, it would make no sense to be available for everybody. Sadly this game often give everything to everybody so it will probably change. I think it's better when everybody can't have everything.

    It reinforce class identity.

    If people like a class motif the devs should do similars cloths in other motifs but nothing more.

    And how often do you see anyone even wearing their class sets/styles? It does absolutely nothing for class identity and neither should it.
    What it does is needlessly restricting people's freedom in creating outfits.

    I assume you'd be in favor of restricting weapon types as well since most MMORPGs do that? Or maybe have your armor choices tied to your alliance/faction?
      PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!. Outfit slots not being accountwide is ridiculous given their price. PC EU/PC NA roleplayer and solo PvE quester
    • tomofhyrule
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      Tensar wrote: »
      Tensar wrote: »
      please keep this restriction, it's a good idea

      Why?
      It reinforce class identity.

      I'm just now imagining that the (single) piece of class-specific fashion available to characters is imagined as one of the cores of the class identity. As in, a new place that the devs can tweak, whether sensibly or questionably.

      Next update patch notes: "We found that NBs were doing too much burst damage in PvP, so we nerfed their fashion by adding a hat to the Soulcleaver outfit style so you can't see their hair anymore. This will make fewer people play NB, and therefore the damage of NBs will decrease."
    • Tra_Lalan
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      This is a very bad idea, please change it.
      Those pages are added later to the content so that it stays alive, and we have a reason to play some more of IA.
      But why should I play IA more and farm those style pages if I can't use it on all of my characters?
      Instead of giving us new rewards earned by playing the game, you decide to put limitations on those that already exist? Style pages are part of cosmetics, they are part of fashion. They are also one of those rewards that many players are excited about. As rewards they shouldn't have limitations to use.
      You already can't use those sets on other classes so that is how they remain unique and bound to a class. This is fine, but leave style pages out of it. Many of those style pages are very cool, and I was looking forward to use them, now they just seem meh.
    • Blood_again
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      ZoS, please reconsider the idea with outfits restrictions by classes.
      I have characters of all classes, but it will be painful.

      I am absolutely for the idea to have some sets class-restricted. It is good and interesting.

      But I'm totally against any restrictions for styles, outfits and cosmetics.
      Please let our characters look as we want. No matter which class, race, skills or math marks they have.
    • FluffyBird
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      You can be a Dunmer necromancer from the Mages Guild fighting for the Covenant, dressed in yellow Thieves Guild armor with some argonian dagger that is actually a mace, wearing the most ridiculous flashy skin and riding a mount that seems to burn everything with the light of a thousand suns with its mere presence (reminder: out hero is a necro).
      And (soon) have your necromantic skills have the color of the freshest rose petal.

      But noooooo with these particular styles we must preserve class identity
    • AScarlato
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      FluffyBird wrote: »
      You can be a Dunmer necromancer from the Mages Guild fighting for the Covenant, dressed in yellow Thieves Guild armor with some argonian dagger that is actually a mace, wearing the most ridiculous flashy skin and riding a mount that seems to burn everything with the light of a thousand suns with its mere presence (reminder: out hero is a necro).
      And (soon) have your necromantic skills have the color of the freshest rose petal.

      But noooooo with these particular styles we must preserve class identity

      Well to me the answer should have been more sensible restrictions. Not further opening the floodgates of absurdity.
    • Sallymen
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      On one hand, I get why people are upset that the class style motifs are restricted. On the other hand, we have had alliance restricted costumes, pets, and mounts for 9 years. It is not the end of the world to have a handful of styles be restricted versus over hundreds of different styles. I hope the devs reconsider but at the same time it does look goofy to see a templar rocking a necromancer setup.
      Current Undaunted Key Count: 4,902
    • PrincessOfThieves
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      code65536 wrote: »
      The styles aren't just in the thematic style of each class; they also display the unique emblem of each class.

      It would look kind of tacky for a sorc to run around with the nightblade logo on their chest.

      But you can dress as an EP knight when you're actually a DC healer. Wearing other classes emblems is not so different.
      Sallymen wrote: »
      On one hand, I get why people are upset that the class style motifs are restricted. On the other hand, we have had alliance restricted costumes, pets, and mounts for 9 years. It is not the end of the world to have a handful of styles be restricted versus over hundreds of different styles. I hope the devs reconsider but at the same time it does look goofy to see a templar rocking a necromancer setup.

      My templar is already a vampire and she wears Worm cult chest style :p
      I also have an arcanist who wears only red and a sorc who dresses like a holy knight.
      Edited by PrincessOfThieves on January 30, 2024 3:58PM
    • Vulkunne
      Vulkunne
      ✭✭✭✭✭
      "Style Pages for Class Sets are now available in the Infinite Archive to collect. Style Pages are curated and will drop for your class first. Other Style Pages will drop after a set is complete. All pages are usable, but you will not be able to outfit your character in class styles other than your current class."

      So. What exactly is the point of the style page, then? With every other page, be that style page or motif page, you can wear whatever you please regardless of class, race or equipment.
      Why is this the exception? What is there to gain from this? The main reason most people have been looking forward to the class sets as style pages is, primarily, the nightblade mask. And most people can't access that because they need to be a nightblade to equip it, exactly like the armor piece?

      This goes against the idea of style/motif pages to begin with.

      Wow. This post is like a hot knife thru butter. Well said and well done.
      "Today victory is mine. Long live the Empire."
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