Grim Focus Permaglow

Nebs

Vrelanier wrote: »

It bothers me that there's no counter for the stacks anymore. With my internet and computer I know my light attacks don't always register in game. Now without the stack counter it makes the skill feel really unreliable. But I do like it when it eventually procs, so I got that goin for me which is nice.

This is the exact problem for me, too. I've even found that it inconsistently highlights the skill (As an aside, it also highlights nearly all of my permanent buffs on screen that I add using the add-on S'rendarr but that might just be an add-on thing).

Not being able to rely on that damn glow changing when at full stacks really sucks. It's hardly clear at all when its ready and my internet connection really doesn't help.

aspergalas4

The devs just need to quietly fix their mistake and change it to 5 stacks only, don't even address it if saving face is the issue. Just change it. All this back and forth between us players is ultimately pointless. We need the game to progress and that includes all the individual skill changes. Just because it wasn't just at 5 stacks before doesn't mean it can't be refined further into just 5 stacks which is what the general consensus of feedback here, on the official Elder Scrolls online forums, suggests people want.

Glowing effect only visible when unsheathed at 5 stacks only to replace the icon change indicator that has been removed already. There is your solution, and the only one as far as I can see that addresses the issue without creating more problems or making people unhappy. Just get on with it.

Araneae6537

Arcanasx wrote: »

Araneae6537 wrote: »

Arcanasx wrote: »

Araneae6537 wrote: »

Arcanasx wrote: »

For all the "make it glow at 5 stacks only" comments. It hasn't worked that way before. And no one has complained about it previously. The glow was already there regardless of how many stacks, and you should've always seen the glow at all times whenever you're expecting or in combat anyways; considering how important the skill is.

It would be a lot more reasonable to advocate for removing the glow when weapons are unsheathed, similar to how enchants and arms pack visuals work, instead of using the new passive glow as a pretext to completely change the way the glow effect works simply because you personally don't like it.

Also, I wouldn't try to use the "majority" argument considering it has been mostly the same posters sticking around continuously making new posts to keep the thread going.

My weapons didn’t have constant red blobs around them before just from having a skill slotted and having it on whenever weapons are unsheathed would be as bad for me as it obliterates the weapon style I paid for. If a skill requires being cast to make an effect, that’s not the same thing at all. I don’t see any point in the current effect since it doesn’t mean anything, but I’m all for ZOS making such weapon effects/styles available to those who like the look.

Were you not already "obliterating" the weapon style you paid for before, whenever you would activate the skill, which should have been there whenever your weapons are unsheathed?

Previously, at what point would you unsheathe your weapons, yet decide not to have the skill activated? Because having your weapons unsheathed typically means your fighting, which again, considering the historical importance of the skill, should've always been active at all times during combat anyways.

If this is about RPing and wanting to take a picture of your NB with weapons out but you don't like the glow...just unslot it, take the picture, then put it back on whenever you're going to start content where you'd want to use the skill.

Complaining about having passive glow while your weapons are sheathed in a city is one thing, but asking for the glow to be removed for most of combat (the 5 stacks example) is a far more intrusive change considering how the skill has previously visually functioned compared to the new passive glow, especially since you have the choice to just unslot the skill whenever you're not expecting combat.

If an effect is only effective upon activating the skill, then I can have it there in case I need it but that doesn’t mean I use it the moment I unsheathe my weapons. Maybe you might more often in PvP? Idk, I never played NB much in PvP, but I only used the Grim Focus in boss fights. But I’d rather have it there for when I need it rather than have to stop and slot it just to not have this constant effect.

I’m all for people having options and ZOS should give everyone regardless of class the option to have glowing weapons of whatever color. I don’t like it. I tried to ignore it but it just looks too awful IMHO. I’m glad you like it, or notice no difference, or whatever, but I chose nightblade to have fewer effects in my face and I simply want the skills to visually work as they did before.

So in a way you've already been playing un-optimally if you haven't been activating the skill against non-boss NPCs because you're missing out on the passive weapon/spell damage bonus per stack. Personally I really don't think going out of your way to play un-optimally is a good enough reason to change the skill to only glow at max stacks like others have suggested here.

While I'm definitely all for having more options available for visual choice, unfortunately the only realistic compromise I can see them even do at this point is to disable the glow when your weapons are sheathed, other than reverting the change and making it an activated skill again. If they change it to glow at max stacks only, people absolutely will be upset and complain about it; just look at the agrees and awesome's on the threads second post on the first page. Its nowhere near as one sided as some people have been claiming here.

I wouldn’t call not casting Grim Focus before dispatching some mob that’s going down in a few hits anyway as going out of my way to play “un-optimally” but okay.

I never claimed the argument was one sided and have tried to understand why people like it and what would be optimal for everyone, so that’s a straw-man argument.

No one needs an in-your-face effect to tell you that you have a skill slotted, that’s just dumb. Now people have said that they like the glow because it fits their theme for the character and if you can get an effect that you like for free, that surely beats a Crown weapon style. That is understandable and I would really like to see ZOS fix Grim Focus and then add an optional glow channel for weapon dyes or make some weapon styles freely available.

aspergalas4

I would really like to see ZOS fix Grim Focus and then add an optional glow channel for weapon dyes or make some weapon styles freely available.[/quote]

An unlockable set of glowing effects in their own channel in the outfit station is an excellent suggestion, and could draw upon some of the unique glowing effects from in game sets already present. It would also provide players a way of getting rid of the rather unattractive enchant and poison effects seen on unsheathed weapons (that we can no longer see thanks to the permanent grim focus bug). Great idea.

Arcanasx

Araneae6537 wrote: »

Arcanasx wrote: »

Araneae6537 wrote: »

Arcanasx wrote: »

Araneae6537 wrote: »

Arcanasx wrote: »

For all the "make it glow at 5 stacks only" comments. It hasn't worked that way before. And no one has complained about it previously. The glow was already there regardless of how many stacks, and you should've always seen the glow at all times whenever you're expecting or in combat anyways; considering how important the skill is.

It would be a lot more reasonable to advocate for removing the glow when weapons are unsheathed, similar to how enchants and arms pack visuals work, instead of using the new passive glow as a pretext to completely change the way the glow effect works simply because you personally don't like it.

Also, I wouldn't try to use the "majority" argument considering it has been mostly the same posters sticking around continuously making new posts to keep the thread going.

My weapons didn’t have constant red blobs around them before just from having a skill slotted and having it on whenever weapons are unsheathed would be as bad for me as it obliterates the weapon style I paid for. If a skill requires being cast to make an effect, that’s not the same thing at all. I don’t see any point in the current effect since it doesn’t mean anything, but I’m all for ZOS making such weapon effects/styles available to those who like the look.

Were you not already "obliterating" the weapon style you paid for before, whenever you would activate the skill, which should have been there whenever your weapons are unsheathed?

Previously, at what point would you unsheathe your weapons, yet decide not to have the skill activated? Because having your weapons unsheathed typically means your fighting, which again, considering the historical importance of the skill, should've always been active at all times during combat anyways.

If this is about RPing and wanting to take a picture of your NB with weapons out but you don't like the glow...just unslot it, take the picture, then put it back on whenever you're going to start content where you'd want to use the skill.

Complaining about having passive glow while your weapons are sheathed in a city is one thing, but asking for the glow to be removed for most of combat (the 5 stacks example) is a far more intrusive change considering how the skill has previously visually functioned compared to the new passive glow, especially since you have the choice to just unslot the skill whenever you're not expecting combat.

If an effect is only effective upon activating the skill, then I can have it there in case I need it but that doesn’t mean I use it the moment I unsheathe my weapons. Maybe you might more often in PvP? Idk, I never played NB much in PvP, but I only used the Grim Focus in boss fights. But I’d rather have it there for when I need it rather than have to stop and slot it just to not have this constant effect.

I’m all for people having options and ZOS should give everyone regardless of class the option to have glowing weapons of whatever color. I don’t like it. I tried to ignore it but it just looks too awful IMHO. I’m glad you like it, or notice no difference, or whatever, but I chose nightblade to have fewer effects in my face and I simply want the skills to visually work as they did before.

So in a way you've already been playing un-optimally if you haven't been activating the skill against non-boss NPCs because you're missing out on the passive weapon/spell damage bonus per stack. Personally I really don't think going out of your way to play un-optimally is a good enough reason to change the skill to only glow at max stacks like others have suggested here.

While I'm definitely all for having more options available for visual choice, unfortunately the only realistic compromise I can see them even do at this point is to disable the glow when your weapons are sheathed, other than reverting the change and making it an activated skill again. If they change it to glow at max stacks only, people absolutely will be upset and complain about it; just look at the agrees and awesome's on the threads second post on the first page. Its nowhere near as one sided as some people have been claiming here.

I wouldn’t call not casting Grim Focus before dispatching some mob that’s going down in a few hits anyway as going out of my way to play “un-optimally” but okay.

I never claimed the argument was one sided and have tried to understand why people like it and what would be optimal for everyone, so that’s a straw-man argument.

No one needs an in-your-face effect to tell you that you have a skill slotted, that’s just dumb. Now people have said that they like the glow because it fits their theme for the character and if you can get an effect that you like for free, that surely beats a Crown weapon style. That is understandable and I would really like to see ZOS fix Grim Focus and then add an optional glow channel for weapon dyes or make some weapon styles freely available.

It is when you're doing dungeons, trials and arenas...I'm obviously not talking about overland mobs; because when you mentioned you only use it against bosses, that's the impression I got. So if you're usually doing overland content, then you really don't need to slot it then, unless you come across a world boss in which case you can put it on for the fight.

You personally may have not claimed its a one sided argument, but what i'm pointing out is that there's many here in this thread who seem to believe so. I did in my last post say "Its nowhere near as one sided as some people have been claiming here", so that wasn't even directed at you. A strawman would be me trying to point out your "No one needs an in-your-face effect to tell you that you have a skill slotted, that’s just dumb.", and then claiming that you must believe people who enjoy the glow are dumb, but of course I don't think that's your intention.

I have mentioned that if you remove the glow, people will obviously be upset, then I pointed out the thread's 2nd post as proof, because clearly there are those who believe that those who do want the glow are an underwhelming minority who's opinion's shouldn't be taken into account..."we're the majority and ZOS should listen to us..." kind of rhetoric.

katanagirl1

Arcanasx wrote: »

For all the "make it glow at 5 stacks only" comments. It hasn't worked that way before. And no one has complained about it previously. The glow was already there regardless of how many stacks, and you should've always seen the glow at all times whenever you're expecting or in combat anyways; considering how important the skill is.

It would be a lot more reasonable to advocate for removing the glow when weapons are sheathed, similar to how enchants and arms pack visuals work, instead of using the new passive glow as a pretext to completely change the way the glow effect works simply because you personally don't like it.

Also, I wouldn't try to use the "majority" argument considering it has been mostly the same posters sticking around continuously making new posts to keep the thread going.

Edit: Meant to say sheathed.

The first statement is not true for me.

I only saw the glow when I had 5 stacks and the skill was ready to fire.

NoticeMeArkay

Just chiming in to let people know that as soon as somebody contributes a pro-argument, not a subjective opinion containing nothing but "I like it.", I will happily add it to the summary and repost it along with the collection of already reported issues in order to allow new participants of the discussion quickly pick up on the topic and to provide stances of both sides every now and then so folks don't have to run through every single page again.

...And perhaps to one day have a developer find his way here and pick up on the long discussed issue.

Tell us how the permanent glow positively adds to your combat or overall game experience.
Not the change in mechanic, that's not the topic. Just the permanent glow.

It seems like most people who appeared to be pro-glow, forget to leave any arguments explaining why.
If I overlooked any, please let me know.

And also please refrain from making any wild assumptions about other users, belittling people for their position or overall misusing this thread as a platform to blow of steam and seeking trouble without adding anything to the discussion.
Not adressing anybody in particular. - Thank you.

Tyrant_Tim

NoticeMeArkay wrote: »

It seems like most people who appeared to be pro-glow, forget to leave any arguments explaining why.
If I overlooked any, please let me know.

I mentioned it earlier in the thread, and I’m sure most people who like the effect, agree to this reason…

I like that the glow is a quasi-arms pack.

Imagine this… so you just bought the new Maarselok arms pack, now what if you could take off that effect native to those weapons and put it on EVERY existing motif in the game?

That is what the new Grim Focus visual is, a Nightblade themed (red Nightblade color found on other skills) arms pack for every weapon, no matter what motif or style the weapon is.

NoticeMeArkay

Tyrant_Tim wrote: »

I mentioned it earlier in the thread, and I’m sure most people who like the effect, agree to this reason…

I like that the glow is a quasi-arms pack.

Imagine this… so you just bought the new Maarselok arms pack, now what if you could take off that effect native to those weapons and put it on EVERY existing motif in the game?

That is what the new Grim Focus visual is, a Nightblade themed (red Nightblade color found on other skills) arms pack for every weapon, no matter what motif or style the weapon is.

I don't think I've replied to that idea yet, so I'll take the chance to do it now.

1.) I'd absolutely love if players were free to chose their visuals freely in all regards, including set and weapon effects, to add to their personal experience. What I'd like to add is that it would be necessary to still show the actual effect applied in regards of PvP to allow for the opponent to have a chance on guessing what their enemy might bring to the table.
If it would be possible for the game to properly toggle between a table of visible effects for cyro and a table for the rest of the game, that is. On the other hand I can't tell how much worse performance would get if the game, or the players client, would have to load two tables into the queue or if they were actually able to perform a clean switch without any cash trash left behind.

Or properly swap between "Spell visuals on own character" on and off. But I have little to no hope for that since the recently (Time flies...) added toggle for visible companions and pets near crafting stations and bankers also doesn't exactly work
as promised. Anyways, if there's be an option for a toggle that doesn't force anybody to missout against their will, you can count on my vote is what I'm saying.


Outside of PvP? Great. - The issue I see in regards of the current state of Grim Focus is that in this particular case, people don't have a choice. And I think giving people the choice over what or if any effect should be visible would be a change both parties would greatly benefit from. And happened to be the choice people had beforehand.

--> I also want to add that neither me, nor as I think many (Not all, some left their argumentations rather vague) but many would agree that we don't want to take something from those who enjoy the effect on their own character.

We don't want the glow be forced onto us. Just as I don't want to take any creative freedom from other nightblade players.

If you got a bit more time to read, allow me to elaborate further:

It looks less like an intended change than a bug to me and other people, which is also why worry rises over potential future conflicts in code matter. - Like the Harpooner's Wading kilt for example. If you've used it before, perhaps you've noticed that the blue swirling effect can also become permanent just as the sound effect connected to it which keeps on looping. Also not an intended change, but a bug left unconsidered since 2021. It's been a while since then and I don't want to add more things to the list of the ever-forgotten visual or audio bugs. (It's also the reason why you sometimes get to see blue, floating, arm-shaped stuff in the middle of streets, dugeons or trials. Also caused by the unintended permanence of HWK in collaboration with something else.)

Btw, if you're a fan of a red magic effects surrounding your character's silhouette go check out the new nightblade set in the endless archive. The glow comes with an added subtle partible effect, looks like magic dissolves in the air around you. Nothing for my nightblade but pretty neat and up to the standard of visual effects that were overall presented this year... .


However, if you say that "Offers a free visual similar to a weapon pack for nightblade players" makes for a pro-argument and if being unable to use any pre-purchased weapon packs or choosing only one effect in the future is not an issue big enough to consider to change then I'll add it to the list in my next summary post.

Edit: Changed the last sentence because it read different than I intended.

Araneae6537

katanagirl1 wrote: »

Arcanasx wrote: »

For all the "make it glow at 5 stacks only" comments. It hasn't worked that way before. And no one has complained about it previously. The glow was already there regardless of how many stacks, and you should've always seen the glow at all times whenever you're expecting or in combat anyways; considering how important the skill is.

It would be a lot more reasonable to advocate for removing the glow when weapons are sheathed, similar to how enchants and arms pack visuals work, instead of using the new passive glow as a pretext to completely change the way the glow effect works simply because you personally don't like it.

Also, I wouldn't try to use the "majority" argument considering it has been mostly the same posters sticking around continuously making new posts to keep the thread going.

Edit: Meant to say sheathed.

The first statement is not true for me.

I only saw the glow when I had 5 stacks and the skill was ready to fire.

That’s what I remember as well! I remember the skill causing the weapons to “flare” rather than a persistent unchanging effect like the current red permablob. From what some have been saying, I was beginning to think I’d misremembered.

Tyrant_Tim wrote: »

NoticeMeArkay wrote: »

It seems like most people who appeared to be pro-glow, forget to leave any arguments explaining why.
If I overlooked any, please let me know.

I mentioned it earlier in the thread, and I’m sure most people who like the effect, agree to this reason…

I like that the glow is a quasi-arms pack.

Imagine this… so you just bought the new Maarselok arms pack, now what if you could take off that effect native to those weapons and put it on EVERY existing motif in the game?

That is what the new Grim Focus visual is, a Nightblade themed (red Nightblade color found on other skills) arms pack for every weapon, no matter what motif or style the weapon is.

That’s interesting, because if the only way that arms packs could be applied was to ALL your weapons or none, then I would never get any arms packs, even if they were free. But then I prefer subtler effects, which is part of why I created more nightblades than other classes. It would be really cool though if we could mix and match weapon motifs and effects as you describe! I’m all about options and character customization.

Arcanasx

katanagirl1 wrote: »

Arcanasx wrote: »

For all the "make it glow at 5 stacks only" comments. It hasn't worked that way before. And no one has complained about it previously. The glow was already there regardless of how many stacks, and you should've always seen the glow at all times whenever you're expecting or in combat anyways; considering how important the skill is.

It would be a lot more reasonable to advocate for removing the glow when weapons are sheathed, similar to how enchants and arms pack visuals work, instead of using the new passive glow as a pretext to completely change the way the glow effect works simply because you personally don't like it.

Also, I wouldn't try to use the "majority" argument considering it has been mostly the same posters sticking around continuously making new posts to keep the thread going.

Edit: Meant to say sheathed.

The first statement is not true for me.

I only saw the glow when I had 5 stacks and the skill was ready to fire.

That's odd, because it was true for me. I remember before when it was an activated skill, I would cast it, which would put the red glow on my weapons (regardless of stacks), and then I would go to the outfit station. I would then go over different weapon styles and arms packs knowing that I'm always going to have the glow anytime I activate it, because I'd like to see how they would look whenever I'd have the effect on.

emilyhyoyeon

Arcanasx wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

Arcanasx wrote: »

For all the "make it glow at 5 stacks only" comments. It hasn't worked that way before. And no one has complained about it previously. The glow was already there regardless of how many stacks, and you should've always seen the glow at all times whenever you're expecting or in combat anyways; considering how important the skill is.

It would be a lot more reasonable to advocate for removing the glow when weapons are sheathed, similar to how enchants and arms pack visuals work, instead of using the new passive glow as a pretext to completely change the way the glow effect works simply because you personally don't like it.

Also, I wouldn't try to use the "majority" argument considering it has been mostly the same posters sticking around continuously making new posts to keep the thread going.

Edit: Meant to say sheathed.

The first statement is not true for me.

I only saw the glow when I had 5 stacks and the skill was ready to fire.

That's odd, because it was true for me. I remember before when it was an activated skill, I would cast it, which would put the red glow on my weapons (regardless of stacks),

This is also how I remember it

NoticeMeArkay

emilyhyoyeon wrote: »

This is also how I remember it

The skill would apply a glow effect once the skill was activated and the glow would disappear again once the ability ran out or when the proc got triggered without recasting the spell afterwards.

Arcanasx

aspergalas4 wrote: »

[Snip]

The indicator is still there, they just changed it from a different icon at max stacks to a glowing, shimmering border now.

The passive glow is not a bug, unless you're talking about removing the skill from your bar and the glow is still there on console. On PC its working as intended.

The only potential oversight involved is the glow effect showing on sheathed gloambound weapons and seeing the glow when you're in the scrying UI, otherwise its working as intended.

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Just wanted to follow up here. Thanks for the feedback so far. The Grim Focus glow is working as intended currently. However, we are monitoring player feedback on this. In feedback, please make sure to note why you like or dislike the glow, as we have seen player feedback regarding both.

Changing it so it only glows at max stacks does not solve the issue, because obviously, there's a lot of people who like the glow as is; just compare the amount of reaction's between this threads #1 and #2 posts on the first page.

This attempt to phrase it as "this is a bug and bugs need to be fixed, and this is how you fix this" can be seen as an underhanded attempt to invalidate the opinions of those who do like the glow by calling their opinion based on the result of a "bug", and therefore their opinion should be ignored and dismissed...

[Edited quote]

Jaraal

NoticeMeArkay wrote: »

emilyhyoyeon wrote: »

This is also how I remember it

The skill would apply a glow effect once the skill was activated and the glow would disappear again once the ability ran out or when the proc got triggered without recasting the spell afterwards.

Rather interesting considering that crux were originally a perma-effect, but enough people complained about it that they made it disappear after 30 seconds. And yet, the Grim Focus glow has always been temporary, and they made it permanent.

Does anyone know why?

NoticeMeArkay

Jaraal wrote: »

Rather interesting considering that crux were originally a perma-effect, but enough people complained about it that they made it disappear after 30 seconds. And yet, the Grim Focus glow has always been temporary, and they made it permanent.

Does anyone know why?

Wild guess? They didn't make it permanent, they found it to be permanent after they changed the ability from "Requires manual activation" to "permanently active", like a sort of hard code error they couldn't get rid of in time and just fed to the live servers.

Like so much other stuff that didn't make the cut and still got fed into player clients and the live server without being fixed in the past years... .

It's the only guess I have, nothing else appears fitting.

Also to the people who first complained that people arguing against the permanent glow appear to be the only ones sticking around to ... *checks notes* ...continously make new posts to keep the thread going? Ok then...
Things would less repetitive in here, if we wouldn't have to continously explain our argumentations over and over again, because certain folks, who still didn't deliver a pro-argument, keep on skipping paragraphs while reading. It's a bit tiresome, admittedly.

And personally I wouldn't take the large mass of reactions on the very first two posts in here as a valid vote, because...

Not only do you not take into consideration that the first two posts of this thread were made before people had a chance delivering proper feedback and reports on the issues accompanied by the glow in this thread, Nor do you take into consideration that there's a high chance that players visited once, when they saw a new thread, commented or "reacted" without the necessary feedback received (or considering to have a look at the previously delivered feedback in the pts section) and left forever.

Just like on every other platform that offers reactions.

But if you insist that the "likes" or "reactions" on a post tell enough about wether or not people prefer the glow, fell free to make such a post under the next summary containing both pro and contra arguments.
What better vote can you ask for than one with informed participants?

Braffin

Tyrant_Tim wrote: »

NoticeMeArkay wrote: »

It seems like most people who appeared to be pro-glow, forget to leave any arguments explaining why.
If I overlooked any, please let me know.

I mentioned it earlier in the thread, and I’m sure most people who like the effect, agree to this reason…

I like that the glow is a quasi-arms pack.

Imagine this… so you just bought the new Maarselok arms pack, now what if you could take off that effect native to those weapons and put it on EVERY existing motif in the game?

That is what the new Grim Focus visual is, a Nightblade themed (red Nightblade color found on other skills) arms pack for every weapon, no matter what motif or style the weapon is.

Although I'd prefer my weapons not to glow all time, I don't have any issues with the glow per se, but the specific way of implementation and the corresponding results:

1) While I'd be all up to more different effects to further customize our toons, those effects shouldn't be tied to an actual skill in any case. If they had done it properly, they'd for example implemented an additional "gear" slot for adding those effects to our characters. This would also open up the possibility to enlargen this system by adding various effects as rewards into the game.
2) Visuals of actual skills should always add gameplay-wise relevant information for the player. Now, what information exactly is provided by the red glow? That I slotted the skill. Very useful indeed. As "compensation" we lost the stack-counter, so the amount of information actually decreased, while unnecessarily the difference between pc and consoles were broadened, as the latter can't bypass this decision by using addons.
3) Connected to my previous point, I don't understand how it's helpful, that only the player using Grim Focus is able to see this effect, while it's invisible for everyone around them.
4) Grim Focus has nothing to do with scrying. Nonetheless the whole color scheme of the scrying interface is changed if this skill is equipped. That's clearly a bug and definitely not "working as intended". So once again we talk about failed communication by outright not telling the truth to their customers.

Long story short: I'm with you, that more various visuals are welcome to customize our toons, but the way it was done with Grim Focus is a prime example for not how to do it.

LukosCreyden

Ok. If the glow is intentional, why does my stam sorc not have the glow from bound armaments? You know the one, the wispy purple aura you used to get when activating the skill. Why do NB's get a red glow always on, but we can't have our purple aura? If both classes had this aesthetic permanently active when the skill is slotted, I'd be more inclined to agree that the change is intentional.

As for the arms pack thing. I do not main NB, in fact, I barely play it nowadays. However, I do own some arms packs. If NB was my baby, my main class, I would be upset that the glow permanently overwrites the glow of my weapon, or muddles it, whilst giving my character a red light that forever follows them. Unslotting the skill is not an option, as the skill is mandatory for NB if you care about doing damage. Unslotting the skill outside of combat is cumbersome and a poor fix, especially on console. As such, I agree with the idea that the glow should appear- and remain- when you have gained five stacks. It serves more of a useful gameplay purpose this way, and allows people to run around with the red glow if they wish.

There are three options available that I can see.
1. Revert the skill completely. This is a bad idea.
2. Keep the glow permanent. This has proven to be very unpopular amongst a lot of people on the forums and in -game.
3. Have the glow appear and remain as long as you have five stacks. This serves an actual gameplay purpose and also serves as a compromise between those who like the glow, and those who do not.

Muizer

NoticeMeArkay wrote: »

Wild guess? They didn't make it permanent, they found it to be permanent after they changed the ability from "Requires manual activation" to "permanently active", like a sort of hard code error they couldn't get rid of in time and just fed to the live servers.

What happened is actually simple:

Before:
- 'dead cast' required to activate
- red glow to indicate active state

After:
- 'dead cast' no longer required to activate
- red glow to indicate active state

The obvious explanation here is that the devs changed the mechanics and left the visual effect the same.

The reason I want to point that out is that it did not involve any decision about, or change to the visuals. If there was any mistake, it's one of omission:

1) the visuals align poorly with weapons (an old bug become more noticeable now it's visible outside of combat)
2) there's a visual cue for something that does not need a cue anymore.

Solutions would be to turn it into a more subdued visual effect, or be used as a visual cue for when the ability is ready to fire.
I don't think there's much of a case for removing it completely. Red is the common theme for nightblade abilities. It fits the theme. Perhaps it should be overridden by other effects, but not completely removed.

ZOS_Icy

Greetings,

After removing some unnecessary back and forth from this thread, we would like everyone to keep posts on the subject at hand, civil, and constructive. If there may be any questions in regards to the rules, please feel free to review them here.

Thank you for your understanding.

aspergalas4

LukosCreyden wrote: »

Ok. If the glow is intentional, why does my stam sorc not have the glow from bound armaments? You know the one, the wispy purple aura you used to get when activating the skill. Why do NB's get a red glow always on, but we can't have our purple aura? If both classes had this aesthetic permanently active when the skill is slotted, I'd be more inclined to agree that the change is intentional.

As for the arms pack thing. I do not main NB, in fact, I barely play it nowadays. However, I do own some arms packs. If NB was my baby, my main class, I would be upset that the glow permanently overwrites the glow of my weapon, or muddles it, whilst giving my character a red light that forever follows them. Unslotting the skill is not an option, as the skill is mandatory for NB if you care about doing damage. Unslotting the skill outside of combat is cumbersome and a poor fix, especially on console. As such, I agree with the idea that the glow should appear- and remain- when you have gained five stacks. It serves more of a useful gameplay purpose this way, and allows people to run around with the red glow if they wish.

There are three options available that I can see.
1. Revert the skill completely. This is a bad idea.
2. Keep the glow permanent. This has proven to be very unpopular amongst a lot of people on the forums and in -game.
3. Have the glow appear and remain as long as you have five stacks. This serves an actual gameplay purpose and also serves as a compromise between those who like the glow, and those who do not.

Well reasoned post. Option 3 is really the only solution at this point. The community has had to brainstorm and develop the fix amongst themselves because of the reluctance to address this BUG. It's just down to the devs to implement said BUG FIX from the feedback given. There has yet to be a reason given that justifies keeping the skill in its current state besides "I like it", well I don't, and most other NBs clearly don't given how vocal we all are about it here in the forums (the official place players provide feedback to the devs of the game).

Ask for a glow cosmetic in the Crown Store or an Outfit station unlockable/collectible if you want that feature, such a cosmetic shouldn't be class exclusive nor locked behind a specific skill anyway.

Jaraal

aspergalas4 wrote: »

The community has had to brainstorm and develop the fix amongst themselves because of the reluctance to address this BUG. It's just down to the devs to implement said BUG FIX from the feedback given.

Except they don't consider it a bug. @ZOS_Kevin stated that Grim Focus was "working as intended."

Jaraal

aspergalas4 wrote: »

Jaraal wrote: »

aspergalas4 wrote: »

The community has had to brainstorm and develop the fix amongst themselves because of the reluctance to address this BUG. It's just down to the devs to implement said BUG FIX from the feedback given.

Except they don't consider it a bug. @ZOS_Kevin stated that Grim Focus was "working as intended."

[Snip]

I've read every post in this thread. What am I missing? Can you show me where anyone from ZOS has said that there is any bug associated with the skill visuals?


A direct quote, emphasis mine:

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Just wanted to follow up here. Thanks for the feedback so far. The Grim Focus glow is working as intended currently. However, we are monitoring player feedback on this. In feedback, please make sure to note why you like or dislike the glow, as we have seen player feedback regarding both.

Personally, I'd rather have the visuals as they were before the combat change. But ZOS likes it the way it is. We can keep debating it until we are blue in the face, but that won't change how they feel about their skill.

[Edited quote for removed content]

NotaDaedraWorshipper

Jaraal wrote: »

Personally, I'd rather have the visuals as they were before the combat change. But ZOS likes it the way it is. We can keep debating it until we are blue in the face, but that won't change how they feel about their skill.

I would like to hear about these feels then, especially related to Bound Armour for sorcerers, which had the same change but that skill got its effect completely removed instead of permanent on.

emilyhyoyeon

Honestly I'd just really appreciate another acknowledgement about this considering that, bug or not, intended by ZOS or not, Kevin did say ''we are monitoring player feedback on this'' in his post.

Next week it'll be 3 months of feedback since his post. Are they still looking for feedback? Any update at all?

Muizer

Given that it's not a critical bug and we've not heard anything concrete, I would expect it to be on the working board with a rather vague description of something like "look into .....", a "low priority" tag and consequently no ETA for implementation. Maybe if we're lucky some dev makes it their Friday afternoon hobby project.

Araneae6537

aspergalas4 wrote: »

Jaraal wrote: »

aspergalas4 wrote: »

Jaraal wrote: »

aspergalas4 wrote: »

The community has had to brainstorm and develop the fix amongst themselves because of the reluctance to address this BUG. It's just down to the devs to implement said BUG FIX from the feedback given.

Except they don't consider it a bug. @ZOS_Kevin stated that Grim Focus was "working as intended."

[Snip]

I've read every post in this thread. What am I missing? Can you show me where anyone from ZOS has said that there is any bug associated with the skill visuals?


A direct quote, emphasis mine:

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Just wanted to follow up here. Thanks for the feedback so far. The Grim Focus glow is working as intended currently. However, we are monitoring player feedback on this. In feedback, please make sure to note why you like or dislike the glow, as we have seen player feedback regarding both.

Personally, I'd rather have the visuals as they were before the combat change. But ZOS likes it the way it is. We can keep debating it until we are blue in the face, but that won't change how they feel about their skill.

[Snip]

Well said! [Edit: I was agreeing that the glow currently doesn’t serve any purpose, as the player knows what skills they have slotted. Instead a cosmetic change is forced on all nightblades and I don’t see any justification for this.] Ideally, ZOS could also listen to the positive feedback about this presumably unintended constant glow and give us more options for customizing our weapons, ideally at the dye station so accessible to everyone. I was thinking about this, and while I prefer more mundane non-glowing weapons on most of my characters, it would be cool for one of my nightblades if the weapons could have a shadow sort of effect, maybe with some subtle purple, to go with the Evergloam theme.

[Edited quotes for removed content]

Jaraal

aspergalas4 wrote: »

Jaraal wrote: »

aspergalas4 wrote: »

Jaraal wrote: »

aspergalas4 wrote: »

The community has had to brainstorm and develop the fix amongst themselves because of the reluctance to address this BUG. It's just down to the devs to implement said BUG FIX from the feedback given.

Except they don't consider it a bug. @ZOS_Kevin stated that Grim Focus was "working as intended."

[Snip]

I've read every post in this thread. What am I missing? Can you show me where anyone from ZOS has said that there is any bug associated with the skill visuals?


A direct quote, emphasis mine:

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Just wanted to follow up here. Thanks for the feedback so far. The Grim Focus glow is working as intended currently. However, we are monitoring player feedback on this. In feedback, please make sure to note why you like or dislike the glow, as we have seen player feedback regarding both.

Personally, I'd rather have the visuals as they were before the combat change. But ZOS likes it the way it is. We can keep debating it until we are blue in the face, but that won't change how they feel about their skill.

[Snip]

You say it's a bug, and ZOS says it's working as intended. Therefore, it's not a bug that they overlooked before releasing the modified skill to the PTS for 5 weeks (with similar feedback) before releasing to the live servers.

I'm with you. The glow used to be an indicator that the skill was active, until it expired 30 seconds later. There is literally no reason to have the glow at all now, as it's original purpose (as a timer) has been revoked. It is now merely a cosmetic that ZOS added as a permanent visual effect. Not a bug.

[Edited quotes for removed content]

Rowjoh

As a costume designer the glow inspired me to create a whacky jobble-top that won a fashion award at my local fete.

Araneae6537

Jaraal wrote: »

aspergalas4 wrote: »

Jaraal wrote: »

aspergalas4 wrote: »

Jaraal wrote: »

aspergalas4 wrote: »

The community has had to brainstorm and develop the fix amongst themselves because of the reluctance to address this BUG. It's just down to the devs to implement said BUG FIX from the feedback given.

Except they don't consider it a bug. @ZOS_Kevin stated that Grim Focus was "working as intended."

[Snip]

I've read every post in this thread. What am I missing? Can you show me where anyone from ZOS has said that there is any bug associated with the skill visuals?


A direct quote, emphasis mine:

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Just wanted to follow up here. Thanks for the feedback so far. The Grim Focus glow is working as intended currently. However, we are monitoring player feedback on this. In feedback, please make sure to note why you like or dislike the glow, as we have seen player feedback regarding both.

Personally, I'd rather have the visuals as they were before the combat change. But ZOS likes it the way it is. We can keep debating it until we are blue in the face, but that won't change how they feel about their skill.

[Snip]

You say it's a bug, and ZOS says it's working as intended. Therefore, it's not a bug that they overlooked before releasing the modified skill to the PTS for 5 weeks (with similar feedback) before releasing to the live servers.

I'm with you. The glow used to be an indicator that the skill was active, until it expired 30 seconds later. There is literally no reason to have the glow at all now, as it's original purpose (as a timer) has been revoked. It is now merely a cosmetic that ZOS added as a permanent visual effect. Not a bug.

[Edited quotes for removed content]

That depends perhaps on how one defines a bug, which seems a bit tangential to me. Furthermore, on console, the permanent red blobs appear just for assigning skill points — are you saying that any skill should work like that?

Edit: I think I missed the important point for what was in bold. We agree there is no reason for this permanent visual effect (nothing against those who like it, but such effects should be optional and available for everyone regardless of class and at the same time, forced on no one).