Gaze of Sithis

Volckodav

LinearParadox wrote: »

WolfyRaps wrote: »

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

If it didn't have both of those drawbacks, even just having only one of them, I'd readily agree it would be OP, but both of those drawbacks, together... I don't think it's going to be an issue. Not everything can be roll-dodged. Try tanking through an 80K damage tooltip Soul Assault, that you can't roll dodge, without being able to block. That's going to HURT.
Nevermind the loss of block mitigation immediately disqualifies this item from any high-end PvE as there's too many "block or die" mechanics, most of which, again, can't be roll dodged.

Exactly what I was thinking....cant wait to completely destroying these guys that will stand up in my burst obliged to eat everything because THEY CANNOT BLOCK IT mouahahahaha

let them run it please!!!

Athan1

Sounds OP. Who blocks anyway?

Sanguinor2

Tannus15 wrote: »

you do sacrifice a monster set and can't run the vate dagger with 2 5pc setup so there is that.
also you can't run harpooner kilt which it looks like will be the goto trials mythic.

this setup is strong, and possibly great for vMA or vVH for anyone who is struggling and has a class self heal, but i really can't see it being a trials setup beyond helping people learn the mechanics.

Will be a case by case for sure if it is run at all. I wouldnt touch it in vAS+2 for example, would like to block the poison cone thank you very much. If I wanted to do no death vmol or tick tock for example it might actually be worth considering slotting it, dps checks are years old anyway and will be met regardless what monster set/arena weapon/whatever you give up for it.

divnyi

Athan1 wrote: »

Sounds OP. Who blocks anyway?

I block even in light. Don't underestimate how much 0.5s block+heal can do when you are low.

WolfyRaps

relentless_turnip wrote: »

I thought I'd test it for myself. I can't duel on PTS I have it installed on a *** laptop and my latency from the EU is unplayable in PvP. However I thought I'd try something hard. So I solo'd a dragon in southern elsweyr... It wasnt hard even. I have tried this a couple of times on live and normally get one shot at some point. I have got close before, but die... This is probably also achievable with pale order, the difference being is pale order is half as effective in PvP and only when you are on the offence.

I ran night mother's gaze, titanborn, 1 piece domihaus and sithis I just threw a random damage build together. I had daring Corsair bow on backbar on a stamsorc. I had 30k resists and 33k health, 7k WD and a butt load of pen.

My early conclusion is that it is totally busted. I really want to use this too, but I think it needs to be 30-50% less effective on the health and armor.

I may try duelling tomorrow, but I never trust the result tbh with the issues I stated above.

Thank you for testing it. I havent had time to get to PTS yet..

Yes it looks like the most OP item they ever introduced in the game..

If it goes live it will be meta on every build.. I will even use it on my usually blocking stamcro in medium armor and just put bow back bar for more damage and roll dodge the incoming ults..

oscarovegren

Dracane wrote: »

I am looking forward to using this on my pve tank. I anticipated health values like this when I read the spoilers.
But almost 11k armor seems very excessive even for my purpose. I could drop any resistance set and defending and still reach the cap.

I would be rather surprised if this goes live.
Thinking of Werewolves with this, is a highly dreadful thought.

So how are you planning on survive mechanics and hold aggro without block mitigation?

master_vanargand

oscarovegren wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

I am looking forward to using this on my pve tank. I anticipated health values like this when I read the spoilers.
But almost 11k armor seems very excessive even for my purpose. I could drop any resistance set and defending and still reach the cap.

I would be rather surprised if this goes live.
Thinking of Werewolves with this, is a highly dreadful thought.

So how are you planning on survive mechanics and hold aggro without block mitigation?

Using the Vampire's Mist Form may be a good idea.
Mist Form's 75% damage reduction works much like a block.

relentless_turnip

WolfyRaps wrote: »

relentless_turnip wrote: »

I thought I'd test it for myself. I can't duel on PTS I have it installed on a *** laptop and my latency from the EU is unplayable in PvP. However I thought I'd try something hard. So I solo'd a dragon in southern elsweyr... It wasnt hard even. I have tried this a couple of times on live and normally get one shot at some point. I have got close before, but die... This is probably also achievable with pale order, the difference being is pale order is half as effective in PvP and only when you are on the offence.

I ran night mother's gaze, titanborn, 1 piece domihaus and sithis I just threw a random damage build together. I had daring Corsair bow on backbar on a stamsorc. I had 30k resists and 33k health, 7k WD and a butt load of pen.

My early conclusion is that it is totally busted. I really want to use this too, but I think it needs to be 30-50% less effective on the health and armor.

I may try duelling tomorrow, but I never trust the result tbh with the issues I stated above.

Thank you for testing it. I havent had time to get to PTS yet..

Yes it looks like the most OP item they ever introduced in the game..

If it goes live it will be meta on every build.. I will even use it on my usually blocking stamcro in medium armor and just put bow back bar for more damage and roll dodge the incoming ults..

You can still block the Cc's and I have been doing exactly this. Obviously a dragon isn't a fair test for its viability in PvP. I would say though I have tried to solo dragons with pale order and I think I could do it with enough determination, but it is much harder than this was and you have to consider that pale order is half as effective in PvP.

Being basically unable to test it in PvP on the PTS I often check a builds viability by fighting world bosses. It just gives me a feel for how often I am having to actively heal etc... the loss of block can't really be measured this way, but I know how often I use it in PvP and it is mainly for blocking Cc's and reducing damage from telegraphed skills etc... Only the latter will be effected.

Dunning_Kruger

Duels on pts with gaze let’s you turn off your brain. It will be perfect for the average player in Cyro. They can’t block anyways because they never got better. So this helps them spam skills at 28m without getting lawnchaired in 2 seconds.

Viewsfrom6ix

Is this ZOS's way to get people to buy the chapter then nerf it?

TX12001rwb17_ESO

Simple Solution = Instead of the 10k extra armor simply have it apply permanent Major Resolve.

Major Resolve grants around 5k armor and is much more balanced then 10k armor, Major Resolve cannot be stacked with itself, it wont make Werewolves unkillable because they already have Major Resolve applied by default and sorcerers already gain Major Resolve from their lightning form.

TX12001rwb17_ESO

Viewsfrom6ix wrote: »

Is this ZOS's way to get people to buy the chapter then nerf it?

Plenty of people have already brought the chapter long before such items were revealed.

Grebcol

GoS is complete broken. As NB i Steamroll with it. ZoS should delete this piece of OPness.

Firstmep

Tannus15 wrote: »

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

1. Cant be used with any monster set
2. Cant be used with any other mythic
3. Gives approx 16% dmg mitigation that has a direct counter to (seems in line with malacath)
4. No block mitigation
5. Health regen is cut in half

For the opportunity cost it better be BAMF

I was gonna point that out, than I saw your post.
You kinda nailed it. People are thinking that you will be able to use it with allessian, but that is not the case since health recovery will be useless next patch. Besides, next patch it will be super easy to stack penetration (weapon trait item set). So you can get 20K easily, so I would imagine most builds will run at least 10K.. so again combain that with brutality ring and you are countering it TWICE.

Paradoxically, if this item will be nerfed, it will be because of PvE, not PvP. Somehow no one ever thought that DPS will run it. No need for tank / support if every one will have it. End-game PvE were using Stranglers and, surprise - ZOS nerfed Stranglers as they underestimated what end-game PvE-ers can do.

this.



hurricane with medium dps sets and 2 stat food.
with the clannfear summoned it's actually 32k max health, 30k resists. Crazy stronk.

I built a stamplar with 2 procset, 7k wpd, 35k hp, close to 40k resist with this set.
This cannot go live as is.
With this on you don't even have the need for block, so the downside is pretty much negligible.

relentless_turnip

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Simple Solution = Instead of the 10k extra armor simply have it apply permanent Major Resolve.

Major Resolve grants around 5k armor and is much more balanced then 10k armor, Major Resolve cannot be stacked with itself, it wont make Werewolves unkillable because they already have Major Resolve applied by default and sorcerers already gain Major Resolve from their lightning form.

It would be totally pointless if this is what it did. There would be no point to having a curse aspect to it. As you are the choosing this over your class access to major resolve. If it granted the same value as major resolve, but you couldn't block damage it would be closer to balance for sure. In general the values just need to come down a lot.

ResidentContrarian

Just tested the set piece and its not balanced in PvE nor PvP. It literally made me immortal minus one shots in PvE, and I am awful at the game, and a ResidentContrarian...

relentless_turnip

ResidentContrarian wrote: »

Just tested the set piece and its not balanced in PvE nor PvP. It literally made me immortal minus one shots in PvE, and I am awful at the game, and a ResidentContrarian...

I know man, I tried it week 1 and solo'd a dragon in southern elsweyr. Something I am yet to do on live. I haven't tested in a duel because PvP is unplayable on PTS from EU on my old pc(which is where I have PTS installed). I often test the survivability of a build on world bosses anyway.

Waffennacht

relentless_turnip wrote: »

ResidentContrarian wrote: »

Just tested the set piece and its not balanced in PvE nor PvP. It literally made me immortal minus one shots in PvE, and I am awful at the game, and a ResidentContrarian...

I know man, I tried it week 1 and solo'd a dragon in southern elsweyr. Something I am yet to do on live. I haven't tested in a duel because PvP is unplayable on PTS from EU on my old pc(which is where I have PTS installed). I often test the survivability of a build on world bosses anyway.

They're all stupidly ez to solo on a solo build

relentless_turnip

Waffennacht wrote: »

relentless_turnip wrote: »

ResidentContrarian wrote: »

Just tested the set piece and its not balanced in PvE nor PvP. It literally made me immortal minus one shots in PvE, and I am awful at the game, and a ResidentContrarian...

I know man, I tried it week 1 and solo'd a dragon in southern elsweyr. Something I am yet to do on live. I haven't tested in a duel because PvP is unplayable on PTS from EU on my old pc(which is where I have PTS installed). I often test the survivability of a build on world bosses anyway.

They're all stupidly ez to solo on a solo build

I'm not testing how easy they are to solo. I essentially gauge how often I have to go to my back bar to burst heal or whatever. If my hots or whatever means are enough to keep me on my front bar I tend to find it works well in PvP. Not always, but it is something I think I started doing because of PTS performance.
I don't think dragons are particularly easy to solo on any build. I have tried briefly in the past, but normally got one shot at some point. Not an issue with gaze of sithis.

Sahidom

Sithis helmet out of the gate is powerful for what benefits you gain. The item alone isn't enough for me to buy the expansion.

In PVP, the extra 10k resistance with the current level of armor pen/damage on live server won't change or slow the outcome in a BG/proc setting; I know procs are getting tamed in the PTS, however, the mythic is geared to sell;

You would gain better results with Conquerer + Defending on a s/b defense bar or +16% healing from Powered restoration staff that can be flipped for the equivalent Spinners/Springs offense with Sharpened. You sacrifice a thread of magic/stamina but each are needed in PVP content to fuel utility or core combat skills.

And you don't need the expansion to use Conquerer set.

Joy_Division

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Simple Solution = Instead of the 10k extra armor simply have it apply permanent Major Resolve.

Major Resolve grants around 5k armor and is much more balanced then 10k armor, Major Resolve cannot be stacked with itself, it wont make Werewolves unkillable because they already have Major Resolve applied by default and sorcerers already gain Major Resolve from their lightning form.

Probably wouldn't wear it. That buff is pretty much mandatory for not getting melted so I'm going to use it anyway. I'll take a one piece Domihaus instead, be able to use block and wear a different mythic (like Torc).

ResidentContrarian

relentless_turnip wrote: »

ResidentContrarian wrote: »

Just tested the set piece and its not balanced in PvE nor PvP. It literally made me immortal minus one shots in PvE, and I am awful at the game, and a ResidentContrarian...

I know man, I tried it week 1 and solo'd a dragon in southern elsweyr. Something I am yet to do on live. I haven't tested in a duel because PvP is unplayable on PTS from EU on my old pc(which is where I have PTS installed). I often test the survivability of a build on world bosses anyway.

I was soloing vSO , well there was one other person with me to laugh at the balance of it along the way, so I guess "duo" is the better term...

Firstmep

Sahidom wrote: »

Sithis helmet out of the gate is powerful for what benefits you gain. The item alone isn't enough for me to buy the expansion.

In PVP, the extra 10k resistance with the current level of armor pen/damage on live server won't change or slow the outcome in a BG/proc setting; I know procs are getting tamed in the PTS, however, the mythic is geared to sell;

You would gain better results with Conquerer + Defending on a s/b defense bar or +16% healing from Powered restoration staff that can be flipped for the equivalent Spinners/Springs offense with Sharpened. You sacrifice a thread of magic/stamina but each are needed in PVP content to fuel utility or core combat skills.

And you don't need the expansion to use Conquerer set.

You can stack all that and sithis..

Testing magplar on pts, with sithis and conqueror+defending backbar gets you above 40k resistances.
And you still have a 5pc set open+ let's say 1pc trainee.

Oh sorry forgot to add, that's in light armor btw..

hakan

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

1. Cant be used with any monster set
2. Cant be used with any other mythic
3. Gives approx 16% dmg mitigation that has a direct counter to (seems in line with malacath)
4. No block mitigation
5. Health regen is cut in half

For the opportunity cost it better be BAMF

I was gonna point that out, than I saw your post.
You kinda nailed it. People are thinking that you will be able to use it with allessian, but that is not the case since health recovery will be useless next patch. Besides, next patch it will be super easy to stack penetration (weapon trait item set). So you can get 20K easily, so I would imagine most builds will run at least 10K.. so again combain that with brutality ring and you are countering it TWICE.

Paradoxically, if this item will be nerfed, it will be because of PvE, not PvP. Somehow no one ever thought that DPS will run it. No need for tank / support if every one will have it. End-game PvE were using Stranglers and, surprise - ZOS nerfed Stranglers as they underestimated what end-game PvE-ers can do.

you think they gonna use this on pve? those stats wont save you from one shots bosses or anything serious since you wont have block anymore. Plus one less set bonus.

i dont know why aside from casual overland and dungeon stuff people consider this a pve option

xylena_lazarow

hakan wrote: »

i dont know why aside from casual overland and dungeon stuff people consider this a pve option

I bet ten potatoes that Gaze of Sithis was indeed designed for casual solo PvEers to use alongside their new companions, with zero thought given to what it does to PvP.

etchedpixels

hakan wrote: »

you think they gonna use this on pve? those stats wont save you from one shots bosses or anything serious since you wont have block anymore. Plus one less set bonus.

i dont know why aside from casual overland and dungeon stuff people consider this a pve option

It's a helm so it's one less piece for monster helm. There is a lot of content that can be dodgerolled healed or shielded through especially if that replaces the need to wear any heavier armour pieces. Not all sure but enough.

It certainly looks interesting for farming normal maestrom arena and the like.

ResidentContrarian

hakan wrote: »

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

1. Cant be used with any monster set
2. Cant be used with any other mythic
3. Gives approx 16% dmg mitigation that has a direct counter to (seems in line with malacath)
4. No block mitigation
5. Health regen is cut in half

For the opportunity cost it better be BAMF

I was gonna point that out, than I saw your post.
You kinda nailed it. People are thinking that you will be able to use it with allessian, but that is not the case since health recovery will be useless next patch. Besides, next patch it will be super easy to stack penetration (weapon trait item set). So you can get 20K easily, so I would imagine most builds will run at least 10K.. so again combain that with brutality ring and you are countering it TWICE.

Paradoxically, if this item will be nerfed, it will be because of PvE, not PvP. Somehow no one ever thought that DPS will run it. No need for tank / support if every one will have it. End-game PvE were using Stranglers and, surprise - ZOS nerfed Stranglers as they underestimated what end-game PvE-ers can do.

you think they gonna use this on pve? those stats wont save you from one shots bosses or anything serious since you wont have block anymore. Plus one less set bonus.

i dont know why aside from casual overland and dungeon stuff people consider this a pve option

Already did in vSO with one other person. Other person not wearing it? Got killed instantly by poison, for me it tickled and I held all the mobs too without dying.

Wasn't even an optimized tanking build either, just one that was geared for "PvP." Seeing that, I know exactly what that means for PvP in the next patch: it's over.

Mythics have always been OP since their inception, but this time though, a single piece of gear letting you practically solo 12-man vet content probably is the worst item to have ever entered the game in terms of balance.

When one piece of gear completely makes the difference between whether a proposition is absurd or valid, then that piece of gear is definitely out of line.

Block mitigation being reduced to zero also means absolutely nothing when you can simply:

[1] stack over 60K hp
[2] shield stack (no joke about this one, you know you have to see it to believe it)
[3] hp% heal stack
[4] slot procs that stack on health like crimson
[5] use reflect /absorb projectile on many ranged one shots + move in a way that prevents one shot

Literally, all the problems and cheese from PvP suddenly becomes valid in PvE once you slot this set on. It's amazing, and it really does let you build immortal builds that would otherwise never exist in the game.

It really shows that this PTS patch is not in a good position.

Don't worry though, they got 750 pen...

GRXRG

It will be nerfed same as Stuhn's Favor, born with over 15k pen if not wrong and after all nerfs now it's 5k.

And who said stamden and stamcro will suffer from using it they never play the pay to win big boys.
They have so many good passives of healing, sustain and mitigation that they can even have roll dodge removed and still compete xD

Jokes apart this set seems pretty problematic and hopefully will se an adjustment before going live.

TX12001rwb17_ESO

relentless_turnip wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Simple Solution = Instead of the 10k extra armor simply have it apply permanent Major Resolve.

Major Resolve grants around 5k armor and is much more balanced then 10k armor, Major Resolve cannot be stacked with itself, it wont make Werewolves unkillable because they already have Major Resolve applied by default and sorcerers already gain Major Resolve from their lightning form.

It would be totally pointless if this is what it did. There would be no point to having a curse aspect to it. As you are the choosing this over your class access to major resolve. If it granted the same value as major resolve, but you couldn't block damage it would be closer to balance for sure. In general the values just need to come down a lot.

Better it be pointless then overpowered.

Tommy_The_Gun

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

relentless_turnip wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Simple Solution = Instead of the 10k extra armor simply have it apply permanent Major Resolve.

Major Resolve grants around 5k armor and is much more balanced then 10k armor, Major Resolve cannot be stacked with itself, it wont make Werewolves unkillable because they already have Major Resolve applied by default and sorcerers already gain Major Resolve from their lightning form.

It would be totally pointless if this is what it did. There would be no point to having a curse aspect to it. As you are the choosing this over your class access to major resolve. If it granted the same value as major resolve, but you couldn't block damage it would be closer to balance for sure. In general the values just need to come down a lot.

Better it be pointless then overpowered.

Pointless = useless... So it is kinda wasted content. No one will bother to farm it.

Major Resolve is a relatively easy to get. If Gaze would provide it instead of 10K armour, I would simply run other set. Chudan + other mythic and keep my 60% block mitigation.

Anything lower than 10K means that no-block mitigation would have to be reworked into something else. And this trade-off is basically the whole idea behind this set...