PTS Update 28 - Feedback Thread for Housing

ZOS_GinaBruno

This is the official feedback thread for the new homes and furnishings. Specific feedback that the team is looking for includes the following:

• What are your favorite and least favorite things about each home?
• Did you encounter anything unexpected in either home?
• Do you have any other feedback or suggestions for these homes or furnishings?

Mix

I feel I must address the issue of "Dwarven" furniture first.

I love and hate the Markarth Dwarven stuff. It is beautiful and detailed and there is a good selection of items BUT it doesn't match ANY of my current Dwarven items at all. The stone is so white compared to the dark of the current dwarven and I suppose the reachmen polished the metal to a fine shine for some unknown reason (apologies if that is explained but I don't intend to quest on the PTS).

I tried to capture this in a screenshot.



It is so inherently mis-matched being so polished and such light coloured stone. I had hoped to fill in some of the "gaps" in the selection of current dwarven furniture with some new pieces but currently I think the only two pieces that will fit in are the
Frustrum Cage Lamps.



It is so tough because the artists and designers and whatnot did a fantastic job on the new items, it is kind of heartbreaking they don't match the current colours. Could we maybe get a few with recolours? Maybe the chair, one of the tables and the big shiny urn (which looks like the urn with poison in it during Peryite's quest in TES5) to be tarnished and dark stone?

CaffeinatedMayhem

• What are your favorite and least favorite things about each home?
• Did you encounter anything unexpected in either home?
• Do you have any other feedback or suggestions for these homes or furnishings?

I absolutely love the layout of Stone Eagle, the water garden especially. And I can jump down from each level! This is fun
The sky in Shalidor's is amazing.

Least favorite... Stone Eagle is a bit of a mess to get around. Not that unusual for Dwemer places in general, but I feel the stairways could have been better named (mezzanine instead of "north", Overlook instead of "west" etc)
Shalidor's - the towers. If I were to purchase this home I'll be spending a lot of my item slots covering up the rickety stairs/bridge. I might even block out the towers entirely, and just make a crypt.

No unexpected encounters. Edit: I found the secret entrance to Stone Eagle... thanks @Mix

Feedback:
The Markarth dwarven is nice! Love the frame lamps, wall reliefs, and so many of the pieces have dual uses (that corner bench is almost a functional sundial) However, I'm also pretty sure the Dwemer didn't make screens out of granite slabs, I was hoping for more simply metallic furnishings.

The Stone Garden furnishing pack... nice that we can get the modified dwarven alchemy lab stuff. Bloodknight target dummy is meh for me, but I do want all the nice red stuff. FYI - the vats in this pack have the grab point at the top instead of the bottom, so "aligning to floor" puts the furnishing out of sight.

Soooo those blue Vampire lights in Nighthollow keep? Same as in Castle Thorn? We gets them yes? YES?????

And finally...*ahem*....*cough*...*clears throat*... WHERE ARE THE MUSHROOMS? Yes, all the mushrooms in Blackreach? Where are they? Those vines with white lights? yes? why can I not have them? I WILL GIVE YOU MONEY FOR ALL OF THEM

Mix

Stone Eagle Aerie

Favourite Thing: The multi-level terrace with the incredible view.
Least Favourite Thing: the entrance hall with the pool immediately inside, felt a bit strange to have that directly across from the front door.
Unexpected: the lift behind the waterfall that went to the Outlaw Refuge, this was amazing to find
Other Feedback: I like that the home is sectioned off into smaller rooms/areas which will make it easier to block areas if a player finds they don't have enough item slots to decorate the entire place the way they want.

Shalidor's Shrouded Realm

Firstly, I thought (idk why) that this was a pocket realm of Sheogorath. I was a bit disappointed to not find anything truly bizarre as I explored around (no random stacks of furniture, no cheese, water flowing in the downward direction). After a brief discussion with a guildmate I realized I misread the name. Maybe I really want a mad little pocket realm of my own?

Favourite Thing: the vertical height of the home, towers to undercroft was really nice
Least Favourite Thing: lack of guard rails...of course I did MEAN to test if you could jump off anyways and what would happen but that test was conducted earlier than I planned...
Unexpected: the undercroft area, initially walking in I thought it would be the towers and the stairs down to the edge, I didn't actually expect there to be a tunnel and underground area too!
Other Feedback: The atmosphere surrounding the place is very interesting and complex and a bit like looking at pictures of galaxies combined with that sheen you see when oil sits on water and looks rainbow-y.

Epona222

I like both new homes VERY much.

Markarth:

I wish the interior of the Markarth home had as much impact as the terraces (which are beyond beautiful) - the interior is disproportionately long corridors and staircases to the small and underwhelming size of rooms. If you raised the ceiling a bit on the main room it would feel less claustrophobic. Increasing the size of some of the alcoves by just a small amount so that a couple of furnishings could be reasonably placed there would be good.

Shalidor's: I really like this and it is very reminiscent of Redoubts in the Reach in TES V, I am expecting Reach bandits to start shooting arrows and magic at me any minute! Does the sky change colour according to the time of day? I have seen pink and green and now it is turning cyan - I really like this although it may make it difficult to choose lighting schemes! It is better than the endless dull blue of Coldharbour ambient light though Tip for exploring this house, if you have the Wild Hunt ring, take it off or risk overshooting the various stair and walkways and plunging into the abyss

dcam86b14_ESO

What are your favorite and least favorite things about each home?

Eagle was amazingly put together. I liked that you could clean up the fetishes. The water at the entrance was a bit odd, perhpas making that area a bit smaller, open it up for more furnishings to be placed.

Shalidors realm, the sky is by far the best thing. Didn't like the bridge, seemed a bit poor for a mage such as shalidor.

Did you encounter anything unexpected in either home?
lots of water in the eagle home but was much welcomed.



Do you have any other feedback or suggestions for these homes or furnishings?

shalidors realm sun was a bit bright but other than that I was pleased.

Asdara

PLEASE!!!!
REMOVE THE SUN IN SHALIDOR POCKET REALM!!!!
ITS RUINING EVERYTHING, this is supposed to be a magic earie realm like the preview below.

NOT APOCRYPHA VIBE EVERYTHING TURN GREEN I CAN'T LOOK AT THE SKY BECAUSE ITS TOO BRIGHT.





I CAN'T EVEN SEE THE SKY WHICH THE POINT OF THIS HOUSE!!!!
FIX FIX FIX PLZ

Epona222

That is a fair point, it is quite bright and the glare from it could be toned down considerably without affecting the overall lighting and ambience negatively.

RaddlemanNumber7

Shalidor's Shrouded Realm

Least Favourite Thing

When you leave the house the first thing you see is a dead deer, front and centre in your field of vision. Very, very bad. Not something I'd ever want to look at on stepping out of my front door.

SantieClaws

The thoughts of this one.

This one has been looking for a suitable home for her dwemer apprentice, Alderman Snowball Dugglby, for some time.

The Markarth house is beautiful. Palatial. Someone will love it.

However it is just too big. It's the home of someone who wants to be seen and known and throw big parties.

It is not the home of a gentleman who likes nothing more than to tinker secretly with his cogs and bolts.

So this one thinks perhaps the other place might be much more suitable for his needs.

The towers - it is a shame you cannot look out over the very highest one and see something but this one understands the need for caution.

The solitude structural furnishings could work quite well at this location but Khajiit will wait until she herself arrives in Test Tamriel to try out this sort of thing.

The sky - this one would have preferred normal lighting, or at least the option for this, but it is what it is and Khajiit cannot change the sky.

The swirly rock a la Newgrange just before you go inside is quite low resolution and very noticeable. Please make the carving a little more defined as otherwise it is very nice.

Yours with paws
Santie Claws

thegreatme

I really wanted to like the Shalidor house and almost considered buying it. Granted part of my reason for wanting to buy it was the sky that was both previewed and that shows up at night when I first showed up. As I was checking it out and commenting to friends, the sky was very nice. Could be used for multiple purposes along the lines of the "daedric pocket realm".

I could easily claim it to be a realm of Nocturnal (my favorite prince), though the sky more readily reminded me of Azura's realm when we walk the path of stars with Khunzar'ri. Point being it could easily pass for lots of different things besides something tied to Shally-whatever-the-heck-don't-care.

This was at the very least, passable for a nice look on a otherworldly-plain house while also hitting on some Nordic themes, both of which I could easily appreciate.



And it almost had me fooled. Until I came back during the daytime when the sun comes out and washes the sky green for some ungodly reason. Suffice to say a house I thought I'd really enjoy I won't even be touching. Partially because the sun is absolutely and horribly blinding, which was already bad enough in the Psijic Villa with its eternal daytime, but this somehow manages to be far, far worse.

Suffice to say, my friends have dubbed this the Holy Shrek House.



The dwarven house in Markarth is nice and a very likely buy, but the Shreklidor house is a hard pass. Even if they fixed the sky, I'll never be able to see this house the same way again. Certainly not enough to spend 80-100$ on it.

ixie

I agree the sun is really blinding during the green phase

SidraWillowsky

The new Dwarven furniture is SO SO SO disappointing. Aside from being boring (beds, tables, chairs... where's the cool new workshop stuff?), IT DOESN'T MATCH THE CURRENT DWEMER FURNISHINGS or just the Dwemer style in general.

I feel like your housing team is constantly trolling us. There is something wrong or off about 80% of the furnishings in the game, and all of the new Dwemer stuff is added right to that pile. At this point I feel like they actively try to make housing as frustrating as possible.

mbeetley_ESO

I'd echo the comments of Santie Claws about Stone Eagle Aerie. It's just too big. Vlindrel Hall was the player home in Markarth in TESV, and provided a marvelous (and, I thought obvious) opportunity to provide a medium Dwemer home for players.

I don't have any objection to places the size of Stone Eagle Aerie for players who want such places, I just had hoped since Lucky Cat that we would start to get some reasonably-sized homes with DLCs. But as both homes with Markarth are 700 slots with Plus, I fear they're going back to offering nothing but giant homes for over 10k crowns.

Chryseia

I am loving that the structure in Shalidor's realm has *real* windows. That you can see through. I would love to see more of that in other homes going forward.

Cireous

Stone Eagle Aerie:
Favorite things:

• Jumping to my death off balconies, not dying, and sometimes even landing in water. I didn't know this was a feature I so desperately needed, until now.
• A bathing room when first entering the building. I don't know how people see this as a negative. If you put water in every room, in every building, ever, I'm pretty sure I'd be elated.
• I love these smaller interiors with identifiable rooms you have been giving us as of late. It's more realistic looking and much easier on our furnishing limits, as well.
• It can't be understated just how awesome these views of Markarth are. I guess I just wish I could see all the tiny, busy people below.

Least Favorite thing:

• Absolutely nothing. I don't even particularly care for the dwarven-dwemery bits in the game, and this is still one of the coolest houses, ever.

Wizardy towers, I forget the name:
Favorite things:

• Wizard towers! Excuse me, Skyrimy-bandity wizard towers!! Which is even better.
• Purple Skies!
• A lower dungeony looking floor!

Least Favorite things:

• There doesn't seem to be a lot of space to decorate inside the towery part of the towers, but I'm sure I'll make due somehow.
• Could use more... water.

Other suggestions:

• Can we get Dwarven structure recipes as rewards for dailies in The Reach at some point? Absolutely love this means of getting structural patterns in Western Skyrim. It's a great feature, let's keep it.

bluebird

~~~~~ PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF THE GODS, READ THIS ~~~~~

Feedback about the Dwemer style in Housing and Furnishing (for the 3rd time)

I was going to go on a non-matchy white Dwemer rant (again), but @Mix already beat me to it...
I 100% agree with her post, please ZOS devs, read her comment too.
So this isn't just me, this has been bothering a lot of other people for a while.
Plus the whole issue could have been entirely avoided by making more sensible design decisions.

Mix wrote: »

I feel I must address the issue of "Dwarven" furniture first.

I love and hate the Markarth Dwarven stuff. It is beautiful and detailed and there is a good selection of items BUT it doesn't match ANY of my current Dwarven items at all. The stone is so white compared to the dark of the current dwarven and I suppose the reachmen polished the metal to a fine shine for some unknown reason (apologies if that is explained but I don't intend to quest on the PTS).

I tried to capture this in a screenshot.



It is so inherently mis-matched being so polished and such light coloured stone. I had hoped to fill in some of the "gaps" in the selection of current dwarven furniture with some new pieces but currently I think the only two pieces that will fit in are the
Frustrum Cage Lamps.



It is so tough because the artists and designers and whatnot did a fantastic job on the new items, it is kind of heartbreaking they don't match the current colours. Could we maybe get a few with recolours? Maybe the chair, one of the tables and the big shiny urn (which looks like the urn with poison in it during Peryite's quest in TES5) to be tarnished and dark stone?

---

I MUST also add that I pointed out why adding white Dwemer recolours is a terrible idea on every PTS feedback thread, from Frostvault Chasm to Stillwaters Retreat, to now Stone Eagle Aerie. But here we go again.

For some reason (some mysterious, confusing reason) you decided that you would add a house with the new Dwemer style that would be white and gold. It's understandable that the art team would have wanted to create white Dwemer assets (to copy Skyrim's Markarth more closely which was indeed paler than ESO Dwemer architecture). But it's NOT understandable why the housing team chooses those assets for housing over other, already existing Dwemer assets. The art team's current work SHOULDN'T BE THE DETERMINING FACTOR IN THE HOUSING TEAM'S ADDITIONS TO HOUSING.

Ideally, the Housing and Furnishing systems should take several things into consideration:

1. An awareness of what's already there (e.g. we have 6 basic wooden benches, maybe we don't need 6 more).
2. What's not yet there, and could bear development (e.g. Ayleid and Dwemer furniture have existed since forever yet none of them have a matching house; there's also no Bosmer notable house while other races got one or several already).
3. Responding to community needs (e.g. people ask for structural items, let's add them - thanks for adding the Solitude structurals last patch btw, it was widely applauded by the community)
4. Tapping into new styles and themes (this is original stuff that emerges from development, such as the Morrowind styles that were added to the game with Vvardenfell, or the Murkmire style houses Grand Topal and Lakemire Xanmeer).

Houses and Furniture shouldn't be added seemingly in a vacuum, on a flavour-of-the-month basis. In isolation, the S.E.A house and its white-gold furniture are a wonderful creation, a beautiful art-deco-vibe luxurious house complex with fabulous water features! BUT you can't just look at things in isolation. It seems very much like you just decide to add things because 'Art worked on this now, let's add this as a house'. It's hard to explain otherwise why Dwemer, a core style ingame with tons of assets got 3 houses with none of them match this established style? What was the rationale behind Frostvault Chasm, other than 'The art team did Frostvault dungeon assets now, let's add them as a house' even though it doesn't fit in with the Dwemer aesthetic at all and matches exactly 0% of Dwemer furniture. NONE of the three Dwemer houses match Dwemer furniture OF WHICH THERE WERE 96 in the game already for years. (I also feel like the discussion wouldn't be this bad right now, if Frostvault Chasm had been a proper slate-and-bronze Dwemer house, instead of white and icy; which compounds the crimes of the two more white Dwemer houses this year).



Are you aware of this? Is the art team aware of this? That there are NINETY-SIX slate and bronze Dwemer furniture, including Dwemer luxury furniture, and TWO CROWN STORE Dwemer furnishing packs (Forge-Lord's bundle and Dwarven Pipes bundle)? Furniture which match the DOZENS of Dwemer delves, dungeons and public dungeon assets that are ALL OVER the game from Alikr to Vvardenfell? And yet haven't got a single proper Dwemer style house since 2017? But keep adding icy or otherwise white recoloured Dwemer houses (3!!!) instead? Whyyy???

Was your solution that you now added a third white Dwemer house in a row, and added 40 white-and-gold Dwemer furniture to go with it? A third white Dwemer house that doesn't match the already existing 96 Dwemer furniture, and 40 new-Dwemer furniture which do not match the already existing 96 Dwemer furniture. How does that make sense? Please, someone explain this to me!

• If the white-and-gold Dwemer furniture was a FULL SET, it would "only" make the old Dwemer items obsolete, but at least we would have a matching Dwemer house and a matching Dwemer furniture set. As it stands, old Dwemer furniture (which are a majority of Dwemer furniture at the ratio of 96 vs 40) are obsolete anyway because they have no matching Dwemer house, and since the minority of new Dwemer furniture have a matching house they will be more favoured than the old style with no matching house.
• But it's not even a full matched set, as several items are missing from the new style. You recoloured some lamps, which now exist in 'old Dwemer' and 'new Dwemer' versions, but a whole array of furniture are ONLY available in ONE of the styles. Suite stuff (beds, dresser, etc) are only available in new Dwemer. Workshop (pipes, machines, forge, fans, vents, workbenches, Dwarven construct parts) and Structural items (platforms, stairs, pillar) and other iconic pieces (Dwemer Throne, Dwemer Fountain) are only available in old Dwemer. Neither of the sets can furnish a cohesive home, each have major blindspots ('Do I want a Dwemer bedroom and diner with no matching workshop; or a Dwemer workshop and gallery with no parlor stuff?'). This issue would have been entirely avoidable if you had used the new Dwemer furniture to complete the already existing set, instead of adding a recoloured Dwemer variant that is equally lacking but in different ways now.
• Even if you released the old Dwemer items with the new Dwemer recolour reskin so that we would have a full matching set now, it would devalue the existing Dwemer style even further; and even if you finally release an old Dwemer house to match the old Dwemer furniture, it won't be compatible with the new white-gold items. Essentially we end up with a lot of wasted potential and wasted work.
• We have reached the absurd situation where 'Dwemer' furniture (the new white-gold one, that got a matching white-gold house) FIT IN WITH CLOCKWORK HOUSE better than they do with the other half of 'Dwemer' furniture. (See 'old Dwemer' vs 'new Dwemer' side-by-side image above, compared to the Clockwork house furnished with 'new Dwemer' below).
• And conversely, we got a 'Dwemer' house (the third white one, after Frostvault Chasm, Stillwaters Retreat and now Stone Eagle Aerie) that FITS IN WITH AYLEID AND ALINOR FURNITURE better than it does with the majority of 'Dwemer' furniture (the original 96 slate-bronze ones). (See 'new Dwemer' and Ayleid and Alinor comparison in the 'new Dwemer' house, in the image twice below).

This also brings up the issue of style identity and incursion. 'Old' Dwemer style, the majority (96) of the existing Dwemer furniture had a distinct visual identity (slate stone and dark bronze metal), a style that was present in all Dwemer architecture too (which we didn't get as a house at all). The 'new' Dwemer style is white stone and gold metal. As I mentioned in the list above with the Ayleid and Alinor comparison, white stone already had an association: Ayleid, and the old Aldmeri (Alinor Timeworn) style from which the Alinor style developed. The gold colour of 'new Dwemer' is also only slightly paler than the brass of Clockwork, making the contrast between the old and new Dwemer styles greater than the contrast between the new Dwemer and completely different styles. I mentioned this in another thread (about Alinor and Vampire wood furniture which are similarly plain brown, similarly Gothic and similarly spikey; resulting in there being more difference within the Alinor and Vampire styles each, and less difference between some Alinor and Vampire items side by side) inhabiting a visual identity that is far too similar, and I'll say it again: it would be reassuring if the Art Team developed styles with an awareness of what's already covered ingame, and if the Housing team would chose those assets to convert into player Houses and Furniture that make most sense for the Housing system itself, not just the most current brain-child of an artist who may not be aware of everything that's already ingame.

---

Now, granted, I made some assumptions in my comment that may not be true. I don't actually know what determines art direction and housing decisions for example (it may have been 'It's white dwemer house and white dwemer furniture, or nothing at all this year'), I can only comment on what I see on the consumer end. And that is curiously confusing decisions that must have lead us to this outcome.

I also realize that not everyone cares about this, so it will probably come across as melodramatic whining to many. There will be plenty of people who will love the house anyway; hell, even I love the design and aesthetic in isolation. I'm just incredibly frustrated of how it fits (or rather doesn't fit) in with existing design and the existing items. (And yes I know, some people will use and will continue to use Dwemer furniture in non-Dwemer houses, or don't care about matching at all; but please let's not be dismissive of the issue based on exceptions and people who have no strong interest in it either way).

Regarding the tone of my comment, I hope that it will be permissible on the Forums, and won't come across as rude. There is incredulity to be sure, and I'm metaphorically tearing my hair out in frustration. I also use capitals and bolds - not to shout at people or come across as threatening, but to convey emphasis and the sheer absurdity of the situation. No offense is meant to any devs, even if my comment comes across presumptuous at times. If a mod does feel like they need to censor it in some way, I only ask that they please remove only the offending bits without deleting the whole thing, which I think has a lot of reasonable points overall, that I feel need to be said.

If anybody has made it through the whole thing, thanks for reading. I'll tie myself to some old slate-and-bronze Dwemer furniture as weights, and throw myself off the not-matching white-and-gold Dwemer balcony into the waterfalls below now, to cool down. I obviously need it after all this, lol.

TheImperfect

I love both of the new homes. I think they are pretty much what players have asked for previously and have a lot of potential for building. I was blown away by Shalidor's and love it a lot but when I saw the Markarth home it is next level awesome and I love them both but hands down the Markarth home's layout, design and details are amazing. The layout of Shalidor's is great too especially for building on, the sky is divine and layout really great.

I think the new furnishings are awesome especially the really cool dwarven achievement furnishings. The reach items are great too I'd like to see more.
I would say the vampire furniture pack is very good but it seems like a good lot of items if you were creating a lab and wanted some pods full and some pods empty but I'd have liked just a little more variation in the item pack. There were some good items in Greymoor keep like lab jars etc that would be good in there.

I tried the new music boxes and the Almalexia ones design is spectacular. The only things is they both played what I think is 'Blood and Glory' (not sure), maybe the music isn't ready yet or it's a glitch.

TheImperfect

I have to say that I really prefer the new brighter shinier looking dwemer stuff and honestly it makes sense to me that some dwemer stuff may be more eroded and tarnished and some areas may have gathered more dirt or dust making the stonework darker. I know this seems to irritate other players who want to match furniture, it would be nice if there were new versions made of the old furniture in the more shiny style for them. Only items that don't exist, eg benches exist in both styles, no need to redo even if the design is slightly different. Dwarven turbines don't seem to be in the new shiny stuff so maybe they could get a polished version.

King_Jude

My main issue is the furniture item limit, and the lack of redguard furnishing in the game, No large redguard floor platforms, no redguard stairs, and No redguard Walls. I have a redguard home "Princely Dawnlight Palace", and like to remain to that theme, but my main issue is the special furnishing's limit.

You can only place "10" "special furnishings", and the items that count as special furnishings that shouldn't kills my theme. For example The "Replica Cursed Orb of Meridia" is registered as a "Special Furnishings" I bought 13 to place into my Mundus stones, but I have other special furnishings in my home, I even removed my Cadwells Portal that I bought out the crown store, and I still have 5 orbs of meridia left over which was a waste of 500k because I didn't know it was going to limit me on the lighting.

Also please release the Manor of Relvery!

Fata1moose

Do you have any other feedback or suggestions for these homes or furnishings?

I would still like to see some Solitude and Vampiric stuff that is seemingly missing at the end of the year long story.

These fur lines chairs:



Vampiric blood apparatus:


Also the home good furnisher in Markarth has the same items as the home good furnisher in Solitude, some different trees/foliage would be nice.

SidraWillowsky

bluebird wrote: »

(snipped bc long)

EXACTLY... I wish I could "Awesome" this a million times. I love all things Dwemer, so I was really excited for new furnishings... this is a massive disappointment.

Epona222

bluebird wrote: »

~~~~~ PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF THE GODS, READ THIS ~~~~~

Feedback about the Dwemer style in Housing and Furnishing (for the 3rd time)

I was going to go on a non-matchy white Dwemer rant (again), but @Mix already beat me to it...
I 100% agree with her post, please ZOS devs, read her comment too.
So this isn't just me, this has been bothering a lot of other people for a while.
Plus the whole issue could have been entirely avoided by making more sensible design decisions.

Mix wrote: »

I feel I must address the issue of "Dwarven" furniture first.

I love and hate the Markarth Dwarven stuff. It is beautiful and detailed and there is a good selection of items BUT it doesn't match ANY of my current Dwarven items at all. The stone is so white compared to the dark of the current dwarven and I suppose the reachmen polished the metal to a fine shine for some unknown reason (apologies if that is explained but I don't intend to quest on the PTS).

I tried to capture this in a screenshot.



It is so inherently mis-matched being so polished and such light coloured stone. I had hoped to fill in some of the "gaps" in the selection of current dwarven furniture with some new pieces but currently I think the only two pieces that will fit in are the
Frustrum Cage Lamps.



It is so tough because the artists and designers and whatnot did a fantastic job on the new items, it is kind of heartbreaking they don't match the current colours. Could we maybe get a few with recolours? Maybe the chair, one of the tables and the big shiny urn (which looks like the urn with poison in it during Peryite's quest in TES5) to be tarnished and dark stone?

---

I MUST also add that I pointed out why adding white Dwemer recolours is a terrible idea on every PTS feedback thread, from Frostvault Chasm to Stillwaters Retreat, to now Stone Eagle Aerie. But here we go again.

For some reason (some mysterious, confusing reason) you decided that you would add a house with the new Dwemer style that would be white and gold. It's understandable that the art team would have wanted to create white Dwemer assets (to copy Skyrim's Markarth more closely which was indeed paler than ESO Dwemer architecture). But it's NOT understandable why the housing team chooses those assets for housing over other, already existing Dwemer assets. The art team's current work SHOULDN'T BE THE DETERMINING FACTOR IN THE HOUSING TEAM'S ADDITIONS TO HOUSING.

Ideally, the Housing and Furnishing systems should take several things into consideration:

1. An awareness of what's already there (e.g. we have 6 basic wooden benches, maybe we don't need 6 more).
2. What's not yet there, and could bear development (e.g. Ayleid and Dwemer furniture have existed since forever yet none of them have a matching house; there's also no Bosmer notable house while other races got one or several already).
3. Responding to community needs (e.g. people ask for structural items, let's add them - thanks for adding the Solitude structurals last patch btw, it was widely applauded by the community)
4. Tapping into new styles and themes (this is original stuff that emerges from development, such as the Morrowind styles that were added to the game with Vvardenfell, or the Murkmire style houses Grand Topal and Lakemire Xanmeer).

Houses and Furniture shouldn't be added seemingly in a vacuum, on a flavour-of-the-month basis. In isolation, the S.E.A house and its white-gold furniture are a wonderful creation, a beautiful art-deco-vibe luxurious house complex with fabulous water features! BUT you can't just look at things in isolation. It seems very much like you just decide to add things because 'Art worked on this now, let's add this as a house'. It's hard to explain otherwise why Dwemer, a core style ingame with tons of assets got 3 houses with none of them match this established style? What was the rationale behind Frostvault Chasm, other than 'The art team did Frostvault dungeon assets now, let's add them as a house' even though it doesn't fit in with the Dwemer aesthetic at all and matches exactly 0% of Dwemer furniture. NONE of the three Dwemer houses match Dwemer furniture OF WHICH THERE WERE 96 in the game already for years. (I also feel like the discussion wouldn't be this bad right now, if Frostvault Chasm had been a proper slate-and-bronze Dwemer house, instead of white and icy; which compounds the crimes of the two more white Dwemer houses this year).



Are you aware of this? Is the art team aware of this? That there are NINETY-SIX slate and bronze Dwemer furniture, including Dwemer luxury furniture, and TWO CROWN STORE Dwemer furnishing packs (Forge-Lord's bundle and Dwarven Pipes bundle)? Furniture which match the DOZENS of Dwemer delves, dungeons and public dungeon assets that are ALL OVER the game from Alikr to Vvardenfell? And yet haven't got a single proper Dwemer style house since 2017? But keep adding icy or otherwise white recoloured Dwemer houses (3!!!) instead? Whyyy???

Was your solution that you now added a third white Dwemer house in a row, and added 40 white-and-gold Dwemer furniture to go with it? A third white Dwemer house that doesn't match the already existing 96 Dwemer furniture, and 40 new-Dwemer furniture which do not match the already existing 96 Dwemer furniture. How does that make sense? Please, someone explain this to me!

• If the white-and-gold Dwemer furniture was a FULL SET, it would "only" make the old Dwemer items obsolete, but at least we would have a matching Dwemer house and a matching Dwemer furniture set. As it stands, old Dwemer furniture (which are a majority of Dwemer furniture at the ratio of 96 vs 40) are obsolete anyway because they have no matching Dwemer house, and since the minority of new Dwemer furniture have a matching house they will be more favoured than the old style with no matching house.
• But it's not even a full matched set, as several items are missing from the new style. You recoloured some lamps, which now exist in 'old Dwemer' and 'new Dwemer' versions, but a whole array of furniture are ONLY available in ONE of the styles. Suite stuff (beds, dresser, etc) are only available in new Dwemer. Workshop (pipes, machines, forge, fans, vents, workbenches, Dwarven construct parts) and Structural items (platforms, stairs, pillar) and other iconic pieces (Dwemer Throne, Dwemer Fountain) are only available in old Dwemer. Neither of the sets can furnish a cohesive home, each have major blindspots ('Do I want a Dwemer bedroom and diner with no matching workshop; or a Dwemer workshop and gallery with no parlor stuff?'). This issue would have been entirely avoidable if you had used the new Dwemer furniture to complete the already existing set, instead of adding a recoloured Dwemer variant that is equally lacking but in different ways now.
• Even if you released the old Dwemer items with the new Dwemer recolour reskin so that we would have a full matching set now, it would devalue the existing Dwemer style even further; and even if you finally release an old Dwemer house to match the old Dwemer furniture, it won't be compatible with the new white-gold items. Essentially we end up with a lot of wasted potential and wasted work.
• We have reached the absurd situation where 'Dwemer' furniture (the new white-gold one, that got a matching white-gold house) FIT IN WITH CLOCKWORK HOUSE better than they do with the other half of 'Dwemer' furniture. (See 'old Dwemer' vs 'new Dwemer' side-by-side image above, compared to the Clockwork house furnished with 'new Dwemer' below).
• And conversely, we got a 'Dwemer' house (the third white one, after Frostvault Chasm, Stillwaters Retreat and now Stone Eagle Aerie) that FITS IN WITH AYLEID AND ALINOR FURNITURE better than it does with the majority of 'Dwemer' furniture (the original 96 slate-bronze ones). (See 'new Dwemer' and Ayleid and Alinor comparison in the 'new Dwemer' house, in the image twice below).

This also brings up the issue of style identity and incursion. 'Old' Dwemer style, the majority (96) of the existing Dwemer furniture had a distinct visual identity (slate stone and dark bronze metal), a style that was present in all Dwemer architecture too (which we didn't get as a house at all). The 'new' Dwemer style is white stone and gold metal. As I mentioned in the list above with the Ayleid and Alinor comparison, white stone already had an association: Ayleid, and the old Aldmeri (Alinor Timeworn) style from which the Alinor style developed. The gold colour of 'new Dwemer' is also only slightly paler than the brass of Clockwork, making the contrast between the old and new Dwemer styles greater than the contrast between the new Dwemer and completely different styles. I mentioned this in another thread (about Alinor and Vampire wood furniture which are similarly plain brown, similarly Gothic and similarly spikey; resulting in there being more difference within the Alinor and Vampire styles each, and less difference between some Alinor and Vampire items side by side) inhabiting a visual identity that is far too similar, and I'll say it again: it would be reassuring if the Art Team developed styles with an awareness of what's already covered ingame, and if the Housing team would chose those assets to convert into player Houses and Furniture that make most sense for the Housing system itself, not just the most current brain-child of an artist who may not be aware of everything that's already ingame.

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Now, granted, I made some assumptions in my comment that may not be true. I don't actually know what determines art direction and housing decisions for example (it may have been 'It's white dwemer house and white dwemer furniture, or nothing at all this year'), I can only comment on what I see on the consumer end. And that is curiously confusing decisions that must have lead us to this outcome.

I also realize that not everyone cares about this, so it will probably come across as melodramatic whining to many. There will be plenty of people who will love the house anyway; hell, even I love the design and aesthetic in isolation. I'm just incredibly frustrated of how it fits (or rather doesn't fit) in with existing design and the existing items. (And yes I know, some people will use and will continue to use Dwemer furniture in non-Dwemer houses, or don't care about matching at all; but please let's not be dismissive of the issue based on exceptions and people who have no strong interest in it either way).

Regarding the tone of my comment, I hope that it will be permissible on the Forums, and won't come across as rude. There is incredulity to be sure, and I'm metaphorically tearing my hair out in frustration. I also use capitals and bolds - not to shout at people or come across as threatening, but to convey emphasis and the sheer absurdity of the situation. No offense is meant to any devs, even if my comment comes across presumptuous at times. If a mod does feel like they need to censor it in some way, I only ask that they please remove only the offending bits without deleting the whole thing, which I think has a lot of reasonable points overall, that I feel need to be said.

If anybody has made it through the whole thing, thanks for reading. I'll tie myself to some old slate-and-bronze Dwemer furniture as weights, and throw myself off the not-matching white-and-gold Dwemer balcony into the waterfalls below now, to cool down. I obviously need it after all this, lol.

Amazing post making some very good and valid points. I don't particularly go for Dwemer style housing or furnishings as such (and if I get the Markarth one will probably decorate it in a different style - irl I live in a home built in one era but furnish it in more modern themes) but you make some excellent points.

B0SSzombie

As much as it bothers me with the mismatching color schemes for the Dwemer stuff, I fear that it's going to go live that way.

My best idea is that I'll separate "Living" areas with the New stuff and "Engineering" areas with the Old stuff.

thegreatme

Fata1moose wrote: »

Also the home good furnisher in Markarth has the same items as the home good furnisher in Solitude, some different trees/foliage would be nice.

Agreed.

I was also a little disappointed to find how absolutely sparse any Reach-related furnishings are. Not even just in the furnisher... but in the game at all. I get that Reachmen are somewhat minimalistic people in terms of architecture and material wealth but c'mon. This is the season of the Reach and we barely got anything actually tied to the Reach besides a few stick lamps, hide flags, and some mossy pergolas (which I do like btw). Heck, we didn't even get some more universal decoration pieces that could've worked like animal pelts and more assortments of skulls.

Its bad enough most Reach-related furnishings already in game are either exclusively locked behind the Crown Store, some of them seasonal only (Witches Festival), or the lux furnisher. Big sad.

Wolf_Eye

Cireous wrote: »

Wizardy towers, I forget the name:

Least Favorite things:

[*] There doesn't seem to be a lot of space to decorate inside the towery part of the towers, but I'm sure I'll make due somehow.

I could not disagree more.

For once, we get a smallish house and not a giant sprawling mansion , and it is FANTASTIC! I would have preferred a small Western Skyrim Style cabin in the woods *(think of the Hunter's House crafting station location in Western Skyrim which has Stuhn's Favor), but a small Nord style Tower will have to do to satisfy that itch...

Literally every other freaking house is massive; the last time we had small to moderate houses was base game.

The only thing I would ask is for them to lower the bright sun during the daytime hours. Maybe just remove it and make it perpetually night here like they make Psijic Villa perpetually day....

PrimusNephilim

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

This is the official feedback thread for the new homes and furnishings. Specific feedback that the team is looking for includes the following:

• What are your favorite and least favorite things about each home?
• Did you encounter anything unexpected in either home?
• Do you have any other feedback or suggestions for these homes or furnishings?

I think the furniture allotments are too much considering the size of these homes and should be reduced to 400 items

B0SSzombie

I_am_Groot wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

This is the official feedback thread for the new homes and furnishings. Specific feedback that the team is looking for includes the following:

• What are your favorite and least favorite things about each home?
• Did you encounter anything unexpected in either home?
• Do you have any other feedback or suggestions for these homes or furnishings?

I think the furniture allotments are too much considering the size of these homes and should be reduced to 400 items

You want to put LESS furnishings in these massive houses? What?

Jodynn

Still waiting on removing saddle and sitting/laying animations for mounts/pet much like you see animals do all over Tamriel.

My dog at the fire standing ready to jump in, real life dog would be laying there half asleep.

Mysanne

Firstly, I thought (idk why) that this was a pocket realm of Sheogorath.

Yeeesss!!! Me too!

thegreatme

brandoncoffmannub18_ESO wrote: »

Still waiting on removing saddle and sitting/laying animations for mounts/pet much like you see animals do all over Tamriel.

Agreed! There are several obviously mount-sized wolves in Markarth that lie or sit down. It would be super awesome if they could do this in our houses. Maybe as a future update to housing after they're done messing with Pathing?