PTS Combat Test - Discussion Thread

flevi

I was expecting something like:
- since the game is unplayable, other than picking flowers and decorating house, we will redirect our focus on fixing the issue we've caused this patch, maybe considering reverting to a playable version (even last patch) until we manage to fix it.

But no, all you guys made this year was focusing on how to ruin the end game experience, how to make skills function even worse (look at necromancer here for example) and how to add more shiny thingies that people can buy to decorate the digital castles they own.

I actually liked this game, but it's unplayable, can't enjoy it and it seems that you guys don't give a crap about it.

Anhedonie

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hi all, thanks for posting all your thoughts here. Just to make sure it's seen, Brian posted an update on these PTS changes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6696597/#Comment_6696597

Thank you for not going through with these changes.
I must say, speeding up heavy attacks and removing snare during heavies would be a really cool idea.

Etrella

So when does the PTS go back to the way it was? Or do we have to wait till the 20th for next PTS? @ZOS_GinaBruno

Kencan333ub17_ESO

What if they made main spammable attacks in eso do more damage? That would sort of lower the entry point for good dps-parses from newbies, while still maintaing the ceiling for vets?

usmcjdking

The general idea was good on paper, just waaaaaaaaaaaay too complicated and unnecessary. I don't think anyone argues that LA dmg needs to be reduced and heavy attacks (esp slow ass 2H and WW heavy) need to be substantially buffed, but this PTS was way too convoluted.

John_Falstaff

usmcjdking wrote: »

The general idea was good on paper, just waaaaaaaaaaaay too complicated and unnecessary. I don't think anyone argues that LA dmg needs to be reduced and heavy attacks (esp slow ass 2H and WW heavy) need to be substantially buffed, but this PTS was way too convoluted.

Think again. Not sure where all those "needs" came from. Meddling with LAs and HAs is arbitrary and there's no real need for that.

Banana

John_Falstaff wrote: »

Good decision and pleasant surprise. I'm glad those horrible changes didn't make it to live. Now, I'm still not entirely convinced that it's listening to feedback as opposed to backlash being too strong, and the conclusion was to cater to people who actually play the game as opposed to boil the frog slower next time, but it still gives me hope.

I've never had a boiled frog. How's it taste

Onefrkncrzypope

Banana wrote: »

John_Falstaff wrote: »

Good decision and pleasant surprise. I'm glad those horrible changes didn't make it to live. Now, I'm still not entirely convinced that it's listening to feedback as opposed to backlash being too strong, and the conclusion was to cater to people who actually play the game as opposed to boil the frog slower next time, but it still gives me hope.

I've never had a boiled frog. How's it taste

Fried is better

merevie

So it is very 'successful' experiment but it won't be happening. Excellent. Now perhaps the current problems can be given developer attention.

Lord_Eomer

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

Sad to hear that ZOS has again decided to step away from doing good changes that were planned for LA/MA/HA.

Congratulations on forcing players to perform 50 clicks per second, was planning to come back but staying away form this game is better currently!

I just started playing back after an year in hope for good changes but what a turn down from ZOS as usually!

Lord_Eomer

Lord_Eomer wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

Sad to hear that ZOS has again decided to step away from doing good changes that were planned for LA/MA/HA.

Congratulations on forcing players to perform 50 clicks per second, was planning to come back but staying away form this game is better currently!

I just started playing back after an year in hope for good changes but what a turn down from ZOS as usually!

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

You know why there is very less player base that can do end game PVE contents i.e. Non HM Chapters Vet Trials?

They do have max CP, Best in slot gear but still not able to complete. One of reason is that you need faster mouse clicks or macro to do huge damage in this game not max CP Levels or best Gear etc.

Hooded_1

So I know you guys aren't implementing these changes in the next update, and I am glad that you aren't, because it dramatically changed core mechanics of the game that affected literally every build in the game. But there are a lot of things you guys implemented in this PTS test that were actually really useful, so I hope you don't completely scrap these changes. Just don't put in the major stuff. The things I would like to see:

-LA/HA scaling off of highest offensive stats, since this allows for build variety, specifically on the magicka side of things
-HA cast time tuning, the reduced cast time can allow for faster-paced combat, and specifically will help allow PvPers to land heavy attacks easier.
-Removing the snare when heavy attacking; I really liked this change since it made gameplay a lot more mobile, especially if you're specializing into a heavy attack build like certain magsorc builds.

All of these things listed don't dramatically change core gameplay mechanics, and in my opinion augment and make better what is already there.

Gnortranermara

Didn't work first try, so give up? This idea had real potential, and with a few tweaks it could've massively improved the game.

I suppose dev time is better spent fixing performance right now. Put out the fires first, but a modified version of this change should be revisited in the future.

Onefrkncrzypope

Lord_Eomer wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

Sad to hear that ZOS has again decided to step away from doing good changes that were planned for LA/MA/HA.

Congratulations on forcing players to perform 50 clicks per second, was planning to come back but staying away form this game is better currently!

I just started playing back after an year in hope for good changes but what a turn down from ZOS as usually!

It's 2 buttons per second. Also you need to realize what this means for the entering players. I ran a guild for a long time for this reason. I would take some one who was interested in pve and put hours into their build and rotations alongside them. I invested in hours of knowing every class rotation and dedicated thousands of mats(because console) to perfect dps for others. I tank. The first, easiest, and most rewarding step to higher dps was learning to correctly weave, also not animation cancelling. AC came later to squeeze out the last bit or dps.

Weaving a very strong light attack between skills made people jump almost 5k in one practice rotation back in the days I worked with people.

Btw yes I also taught tanks to light weave. Keeps that ulti gain going and refresh fb enchant.

Weaving a light attack is for the lower end players. That was why they were buffed in the first place.

ZeroXFF

Onefrkncrzypope wrote: »

Lord_Eomer wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

Sad to hear that ZOS has again decided to step away from doing good changes that were planned for LA/MA/HA.

Congratulations on forcing players to perform 50 clicks per second, was planning to come back but staying away form this game is better currently!

I just started playing back after an year in hope for good changes but what a turn down from ZOS as usually!

It's 2 buttons per second. Also you need to realize what this means for the entering players. I ran a guild for a long time for this reason. I would take some one who was interested in pve and put hours into their build and rotations alongside them. I invested in hours of knowing every class rotation and dedicated thousands of mats(because console) to perfect dps for others. I tank. The first, easiest, and most rewarding step to higher dps was learning to correctly weave, also not animation cancelling. AC came later to squeeze out the last bit or dps.

Weaving a very strong light attack between skills made people jump almost 5k in one practice rotation back in the days I worked with people.

Btw yes I also taught tanks to light weave. Keeps that ulti gain going and refresh fb enchant.

Weaving a light attack is for the lower end players. That was why they were buffed in the first place.

Blocking gives the same ulti buff, and weapon skills (i.e. taunt) apply the enchant. I don't know what you were teaching them, but it wasn't tanking that you taught... And while we're explaining game mechanics - LA weaving is animation cancelling, you're cancelling the LA animation by doing it.

Weaving is not for "lower end" players. The "lower end" players don't know about it, because it's unintuitive. That's why you had to teach them in the first place. And even after you teach them, they jump by 5k - not 20k as is the case with the "higher end" players. So removing LA weaving would help the "lower end" players by shrinking the gap by 15k. And buffing the skills up to make sure the DPS ceiling remains the same to keep up with the content would mean that those "lower end" players would get a massive buff.

Onefrkncrzypope

ZeroXFF wrote: »

Onefrkncrzypope wrote: »

Lord_Eomer wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

Sad to hear that ZOS has again decided to step away from doing good changes that were planned for LA/MA/HA.

Congratulations on forcing players to perform 50 clicks per second, was planning to come back but staying away form this game is better currently!

I just started playing back after an year in hope for good changes but what a turn down from ZOS as usually!

It's 2 buttons per second. Also you need to realize what this means for the entering players. I ran a guild for a long time for this reason. I would take some one who was interested in pve and put hours into their build and rotations alongside them. I invested in hours of knowing every class rotation and dedicated thousands of mats(because console) to perfect dps for others. I tank. The first, easiest, and most rewarding step to higher dps was learning to correctly weave, also not animation cancelling. AC came later to squeeze out the last bit or dps.

Weaving a very strong light attack between skills made people jump almost 5k in one practice rotation back in the days I worked with people.

Btw yes I also taught tanks to light weave. Keeps that ulti gain going and refresh fb enchant.

Weaving a light attack is for the lower end players. That was why they were buffed in the first place.

Blocking gives the same ulti buff, and weapon skills (i.e. taunt) apply the enchant. I don't know what you were teaching them, but it wasn't tanking that you taught... And while we're explaining game mechanics - LA weaving is animation cancelling, you're cancelling the LA animation by doing it.

Weaving is not for "lower end" players. The "lower end" players don't know about it, because it's unintuitive. That's why you had to teach them in the first place. And even after you teach them, they jump by 5k - not 20k as is the case with the "higher end" players. So removing LA weaving would help the "lower end" players by shrinking the gap by 15k. And buffing the skills up to make sure the DPS ceiling remains the same to keep up with the content would mean that those "lower end" players would get a massive buff.

I said I main a tank and you neglect to mention off tanks that have down times of damage intake and also the enchant on the front bar were most tanks have no dots to proc.

Animation cancelling and weaving are two different thing in ESO.

AC can never be removed from then game because of blocking incoming damage was thought to supercede animation of skills. That's were block cancelling animation came from.

Weaving a La in a chain with a skill cast is weaving.

I also had to teach them that vma staffs work on their back bar. That uppercuts that hit 20k each time your cast doesn't amount to 20kdps. No game is fully intuitive. That why there are guides walkthrough even before the internet.

How is standing there with two daggers or giant axe or staff that shoots fire balls equiped just for stats make anymore sense?

If you want intuitive, why does one race do better than anything or one? Why are Stam skills now on mag dps?

The difference between the two paths is accepting rules and trying to change the rules to your own liking.

I argued that the change to light attacks only cemented bash weaving and la weaving and only hurts lower end players by raising the APM. Many before me and after shared that view. This also widened gap leaving the middling players because they might have a decent rotation but it's not perfect and probably doesn't have bash weaving. What about them? Just because light attacks didn't sit well with your player vision of the game they need to lose their progress?

Also why are you on the forums for a game you don't play? Why are you in the PTS discussion for changes in a game you don't play? Why would someone who dislikes a game enough not to play have enough knowledge to weigh in on changes in the game that they aren't even experiencing?

I'm not asking rude rehtorical questions. You are welcome to comment.

As for the discussion, the change didn't go through and it's great because there has been way too many sweeping changes recently and the only ones who keep up are the endgamers. So thank you ZoS and I am sorry for backlash that came from it. Believe me though that this precycle discussion of changes is the best concept your team has come up with. Please don't lock the door again. Everyone loves your creation let's all make it better together.

Stam whip

Olauron

Onefrkncrzypope wrote: »

AC can never be removed from then game because of blocking incoming damage was thought to supercede animation of skills. That's were block cancelling animation came from.

That is incorrect. AC can be effectively removed by implementing full cancel, when cancelling an animation means cancelling all the effects of cancelled skill. Then AC would be used only for emergency blocking or weapon swapping and not for increasing dps.

ZeroXFF

Onefrkncrzypope wrote: »

ZeroXFF wrote: »

Onefrkncrzypope wrote: »

Lord_Eomer wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

Sad to hear that ZOS has again decided to step away from doing good changes that were planned for LA/MA/HA.

Congratulations on forcing players to perform 50 clicks per second, was planning to come back but staying away form this game is better currently!

I just started playing back after an year in hope for good changes but what a turn down from ZOS as usually!

It's 2 buttons per second. Also you need to realize what this means for the entering players. I ran a guild for a long time for this reason. I would take some one who was interested in pve and put hours into their build and rotations alongside them. I invested in hours of knowing every class rotation and dedicated thousands of mats(because console) to perfect dps for others. I tank. The first, easiest, and most rewarding step to higher dps was learning to correctly weave, also not animation cancelling. AC came later to squeeze out the last bit or dps.

Weaving a very strong light attack between skills made people jump almost 5k in one practice rotation back in the days I worked with people.

Btw yes I also taught tanks to light weave. Keeps that ulti gain going and refresh fb enchant.

Weaving a light attack is for the lower end players. That was why they were buffed in the first place.

Blocking gives the same ulti buff, and weapon skills (i.e. taunt) apply the enchant. I don't know what you were teaching them, but it wasn't tanking that you taught... And while we're explaining game mechanics - LA weaving is animation cancelling, you're cancelling the LA animation by doing it.

Weaving is not for "lower end" players. The "lower end" players don't know about it, because it's unintuitive. That's why you had to teach them in the first place. And even after you teach them, they jump by 5k - not 20k as is the case with the "higher end" players. So removing LA weaving would help the "lower end" players by shrinking the gap by 15k. And buffing the skills up to make sure the DPS ceiling remains the same to keep up with the content would mean that those "lower end" players would get a massive buff.

I said I main a tank and you neglect to mention off tanks that have down times of damage intake and also the enchant on the front bar were most tanks have no dots to proc.

Animation cancelling and weaving are two different thing in ESO.

AC can never be removed from then game because of blocking incoming damage was thought to supercede animation of skills. That's were block cancelling animation came from.

Weaving a La in a chain with a skill cast is weaving.

I also had to teach them that vma staffs work on their back bar. That uppercuts that hit 20k each time your cast doesn't amount to 20kdps. No game is fully intuitive. That why there are guides walkthrough even before the internet.

How is standing there with two daggers or giant axe or staff that shoots fire balls equiped just for stats make anymore sense?

If you want intuitive, why does one race do better than anything or one? Why are Stam skills now on mag dps?

The difference between the two paths is accepting rules and trying to change the rules to your own liking.

I argued that the change to light attacks only cemented bash weaving and la weaving and only hurts lower end players by raising the APM. Many before me and after shared that view. This also widened gap leaving the middling players because they might have a decent rotation but it's not perfect and probably doesn't have bash weaving. What about them? Just because light attacks didn't sit well with your player vision of the game they need to lose their progress?

Also why are you on the forums for a game you don't play? Why are you in the PTS discussion for changes in a game you don't play? Why would someone who dislikes a game enough not to play have enough knowledge to weigh in on changes in the game that they aren't even experiencing?

I'm not asking rude rehtorical questions. You are welcome to comment.

As for the discussion, the change didn't go through and it's great because there has been way too many sweeping changes recently and the only ones who keep up are the endgamers. So thank you ZoS and I am sorry for backlash that came from it. Believe me though that this precycle discussion of changes is the best concept your team has come up with. Please don't lock the door again. Everyone loves your creation let's all make it better together.

Stam whip

1. It doesn't need to be a dot to apply an enchant, it needs to be a weapon skill that does its damage "externally" (i.e. direct damage attacks - like a taunt, or a ground dot).
2. LA weaving is a sub-category of AC. LAs are the lowest item on the AC priority list, being cancelled by basically anything, but that doesn't make it not AC to do LA weaving.

Why would someone who dislikes a game enough not to play have enough knowledge to weigh in on changes in the game that they aren't even experiencing?

Just because I haven't played much in the past few months doesn't mean I have never played. I played the game since 2015 and I know more about it than most people, especially about how LA weaving works. If people were disqualified from commenting based on their knowledge about the game or especially a specific game mechanic being discussed, you would be disqualified before me.

The changes were scrapped because they were not doing what they were supposed to do, but that doesn't mean that the underlying problem doesn't exist, it only means that the proposed solution of resolving it didn't work. Making LAs have the same priority as skills on the AC priority list would actually address this problem.

And the arguments along the lines of "don't change any game mechanic because there are people who like it as it is" can be applied to literally every change. If this logic was an argument, the game would have had no changes since release, and all DDs would be mag sorcs. Changes are made to improve the game, and just because what I propose does not align with your vision of the game, doesn't mean the proposed changes are not a significant improvement.

Onefrkncrzypope

ZeroXFF wrote: »

Onefrkncrzypope wrote: »

ZeroXFF wrote: »

Onefrkncrzypope wrote: »

Lord_Eomer wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

Sad to hear that ZOS has again decided to step away from doing good changes that were planned for LA/MA/HA.

Congratulations on forcing players to perform 50 clicks per second, was planning to come back but staying away form this game is better currently!

I just started playing back after an year in hope for good changes but what a turn down from ZOS as usually!

It's 2 buttons per second. Also you need to realize what this means for the entering players. I ran a guild for a long time for this reason. I would take some one who was interested in pve and put hours into their build and rotations alongside them. I invested in hours of knowing every class rotation and dedicated thousands of mats(because console) to perfect dps for others. I tank. The first, easiest, and most rewarding step to higher dps was learning to correctly weave, also not animation cancelling. AC came later to squeeze out the last bit or dps.

Weaving a very strong light attack between skills made people jump almost 5k in one practice rotation back in the days I worked with people.

Btw yes I also taught tanks to light weave. Keeps that ulti gain going and refresh fb enchant.

Weaving a light attack is for the lower end players. That was why they were buffed in the first place.

Blocking gives the same ulti buff, and weapon skills (i.e. taunt) apply the enchant. I don't know what you were teaching them, but it wasn't tanking that you taught... And while we're explaining game mechanics - LA weaving is animation cancelling, you're cancelling the LA animation by doing it.

Weaving is not for "lower end" players. The "lower end" players don't know about it, because it's unintuitive. That's why you had to teach them in the first place. And even after you teach them, they jump by 5k - not 20k as is the case with the "higher end" players. So removing LA weaving would help the "lower end" players by shrinking the gap by 15k. And buffing the skills up to make sure the DPS ceiling remains the same to keep up with the content would mean that those "lower end" players would get a massive buff.

I said I main a tank and you neglect to mention off tanks that have down times of damage intake and also the enchant on the front bar were most tanks have no dots to proc.

Animation cancelling and weaving are two different thing in ESO.

AC can never be removed from then game because of blocking incoming damage was thought to supercede animation of skills. That's were block cancelling animation came from.

Weaving a La in a chain with a skill cast is weaving.

I also had to teach them that vma staffs work on their back bar. That uppercuts that hit 20k each time your cast doesn't amount to 20kdps. No game is fully intuitive. That why there are guides walkthrough even before the internet.

How is standing there with two daggers or giant axe or staff that shoots fire balls equiped just for stats make anymore sense?

If you want intuitive, why does one race do better than anything or one? Why are Stam skills now on mag dps?

The difference between the two paths is accepting rules and trying to change the rules to your own liking.

I argued that the change to light attacks only cemented bash weaving and la weaving and only hurts lower end players by raising the APM. Many before me and after shared that view. This also widened gap leaving the middling players because they might have a decent rotation but it's not perfect and probably doesn't have bash weaving. What about them? Just because light attacks didn't sit well with your player vision of the game they need to lose their progress?

Also why are you on the forums for a game you don't play? Why are you in the PTS discussion for changes in a game you don't play? Why would someone who dislikes a game enough not to play have enough knowledge to weigh in on changes in the game that they aren't even experiencing?

I'm not asking rude rehtorical questions. You are welcome to comment.

As for the discussion, the change didn't go through and it's great because there has been way too many sweeping changes recently and the only ones who keep up are the endgamers. So thank you ZoS and I am sorry for backlash that came from it. Believe me though that this precycle discussion of changes is the best concept your team has come up with. Please don't lock the door again. Everyone loves your creation let's all make it better together.

Stam whip

1. It doesn't need to be a dot to apply an enchant, it needs to be a weapon skill that does its damage "externally" (i.e. direct damage attacks - like a taunt, or a ground dot).
2. LA weaving is a sub-category of AC. LAs are the lowest item on the AC priority list, being cancelled by basically anything, but that doesn't make it not AC to do LA weaving.

Why would someone who dislikes a game enough not to play have enough knowledge to weigh in on changes in the game that they aren't even experiencing?

Just because I haven't played much in the past few months doesn't mean I have never played. I played the game since 2015 and I know more about it than most people, especially about how LA weaving works. If people were disqualified from commenting based on their knowledge about the game or especially a specific game mechanic being discussed, you would be disqualified before me.

The changes were scrapped because they were not doing what they were supposed to do, but that doesn't mean that the underlying problem doesn't exist, it only means that the proposed solution of resolving it didn't work. Making LAs have the same priority as skills on the AC priority list would actually address this problem.

And the arguments along the lines of "don't change any game mechanic because there are people who like it as it is" can be applied to literally every change. If this logic was an argument, the game would have had no changes since release, and all DDs would be mag sorcs. Changes are made to improve the game, and just because what I propose does not align with your vision of the game, doesn't mean the proposed changes are not a significant improvement.

It was don't change game mechanics because I like it the way it is. It was don't change it because someone including me doesn't like the rules.

Dps isn't a person but a number but game slang.

AC and weaving
They are two different perceived mechanics regardless of underlying similarities. You even say La weaving is the animation cancelling but is reality with the technical term approach you have, skills are the issue because they supercede and cancel light attacks.

I too have been playing since launch.

The two weapon skills a tank uses are taunt and heroic slash, neither should be used often enough to keep enchants up.

There is no problem with weaving. It doesn't cause performance issues, all classes can do it, and is intended. Intended by the devs.

Weaving allows for fuildity and constant action and input in this game. Removing LA removes an actionable rotation to one similar to tab target/cool down. That is not the direction the devs want to go in(so far).

Player perception is a dangerous thing to follow in games. Most of the time, devs following this view too close cause games to sour.

You didn't like mechanics of the game so you left or didn't, you still care enough to bemoan the devs for their community supported rollback of this change. Them the breaks.

If animation cancelling urks you so much than you lose out on alot of games. Because it's not a new concept in gaming.

Arkangeloski

majulook wrote: »

The PTS Patch notes say this: Unarmed Heavy Attacks now deal approximately 24% more damage.

What is a Unarmed Heavy Attack?

majulook wrote: »

The PTS Patch notes say this: Unarmed Heavy Attacks now deal approximately 24% more damage.

What is a Unarmed Heavy Attack?

Overload!?

ZOS_Volpe

Greetings,

We have recently removed some unnecessary back and forth from this thread. This is a reminder to keep the discussion civil and constructive. Please keep our Community Rules in mind moving forward.

Aedaryl

Arkangeloski wrote: »

majulook wrote: »

The PTS Patch notes say this: Unarmed Heavy Attacks now deal approximately 24% more damage.

What is a Unarmed Heavy Attack?

majulook wrote: »

The PTS Patch notes say this: Unarmed Heavy Attacks now deal approximately 24% more damage.

What is a Unarmed Heavy Attack?

Overload!?

Unarmed = without weapon = just your fist.

nhaley54ub17_ESO2

I love this game I’ve had since launch of pc and console. With that being said I’ll be the first to admit I’ll the definition of a casual player. I’ve made multiple alts, deleted high level characters, spent hundreds maybe thousands in the crown store and I still don’t have 810 CP. I was looking forward to ZOS working on a way to make Endgame content accessible to players like me. I’ve known about light and heavy attack weaving but it just doesn’t feel right or look right if you’re playing to have fun. Do you have to “animation cancel” to feel powerful in God of War, or even in Skyrim? I know the concept is a skill separator in MMO’s, but it would nice not to have to be a pro to beat VMA or feel the need to “practice or have someone teach me a rotation” just to deal decent damage.

I like the proposed plan to simply increase the damage of skills and abilities. This would make it so casuals like myself can do enough damage to complete endgame content while still keeping the skill gap for those who want to animation cancel and weave. I understand that top players may find the game too easy, but I’m sure ZOS keeps track of how many players complete endgame content and they’re skill level. I guess 20-33% of all players are the elite who completed all the endgame content and the rest are casuals who come and go like myself. I would to feel more powerful in combat without weaving one day, so I will look forward to what the community and ZOS decide is best.

Dusk_Coven

Onefrkncrzypope wrote: »

There is no problem with weaving. It doesn't cause performance issues, all classes can do it, and is intended. Intended by the devs.

…

If animation cancelling urks you so much than you lose out on alot of games. Because it's not a new concept in gaming.

All animation cancelling including LA weaving was NEVER intended. It was discovered by the players and FOOLISHLY allowed by the devs. Resulting in years of combat balancing mess. Why do you think there's a mess right now that they're trying to fix?
Just the fact that an animation is cancelled is completely unintended. No point making animations then, just make a tap clicker game.

Yes, animation cancelling shows up in a lot of games. And in those games they are systematically REMOVED for good reason whenever the devs didn't plan for it from the very start of combat design. Typically they are unintended, unintuitive, and unbalancing.
Like in Overwatch -- where they had a SENSIBLE evaluation and approach to it:

A Reminder for those who think animation canceling is a part of the game
This was written by Geoff Goodman after the Widowmaker nerf for her animation cancel.
Making the sure game feels responsive and smooth is very important to us. Wherever we can, we make sure that the game responds to player input asap.
However, the one situation where we have to step in and possibly slow things down is when an 'animation canceling' trick is discovered and allows players to significantly increase a characters power.
There are two main problems with just leaving these things in the game as they are.

1. This trick becomes the new balance of the hero. Lets say there is a trick that somehow allowed you to instantly complete McCree's roll instead of waiting for it to complete normally. At that point, the character is much stronger, and might suddenly be a balancing problem. The choices then becomes either fix that bug, or allow it to exist and reduce his power elsewhere. If we decide to reduce his power elsewhere, unless you know how to do this special (and often unintuitive) trick, he will never feel correctly powerful for you.
2. Learning a hero now has to include learning how to abuse these bugs. This is a huge turn off to a lot of players, and can turn a potential favorite hero into a 'will never pick'.

If ZOS wants fast-paced combat, they should introduce an actually intended mechanic that is under their control instead of one where new players are bewildered and come to the forums to discover it's a makes-no-sense exploit that the devs allowed.
Like SWTOR's speed-up stat ALACRITY. http://gq-game-mods.blogspot.com/2020/04/elder-scrolls-online-how-to-introduce-fast-paced-combat.html
It's not reinventing the wheel. Even kid games like Aura Kingdom have a SPD stat to reduce cooldowns in a way that the devs can calculate and control and subsequently balance.
What ESO has is an exploit that is out of their control and they can't properly support and have never balanced their content around.

Onefrkncrzypope

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Onefrkncrzypope wrote: »

There is no problem with weaving. It doesn't cause performance issues, all classes can do it, and is intended. Intended by the devs.

…

If animation cancelling urks you so much than you lose out on alot of games. Because it's not a new concept in gaming.

All animation cancelling including LA weaving was NEVER intended. It was discovered by the players and FOOLISHLY allowed by the devs. Resulting in years of combat balancing mess.
Just the fact that an animation is cancelled is completely unintended. No point making animations then, just make a tap clicker game.

Yes, animation cancelling shows up in a lot of games. And in those games they are systematically REMOVED for good reason whenever the devs didn't plan for it from the very start of combat design. Typically they are unintended, unintuitive, and unbalancing.
Like in Overwatch -- where they had a SENSIBLE evaluation and approach to it:

A Reminder for those who think animation canceling is a part of the game
This was written by Geoff Goodman after the Widowmaker nerf for her animation cancel.
Making the sure game feels responsive and smooth is very important to us. Wherever we can, we make sure that the game responds to player input asap.
However, the one situation where we have to step in and possibly slow things down is when an 'animation canceling' trick is discovered and allows players to significantly increase a characters power.
There are two main problems with just leaving these things in the game as they are.

1. This trick becomes the new balance of the hero. Lets say there is a trick that somehow allowed you to instantly complete McCree's roll instead of waiting for it to complete normally. At that point, the character is much stronger, and might suddenly be a balancing problem. The choices then becomes either fix that bug, or allow it to exist and reduce his power elsewhere. If we decide to reduce his power elsewhere, unless you know how to do this special (and often unintuitive) trick, he will never feel correctly powerful for you.
2. Learning a hero now has to include learning how to abuse these bugs. This is a huge turn off to a lot of players, and can turn a potential favorite hero into a 'will never pick'.

If ZOS wants fast-paced combat, they should introduce an actually intended mechanic that is under their control instead of one where new players are bewildered and come to the forums to discover it's an exploit that the devs allowed.
Like SWTOR's speed-up stat ALACRITY. http://gq-game-mods.blogspot.com/2020/04/elder-scrolls-online-how-to-introduce-fast-paced-combat.html
It's not reinventing the wheel. Even kid games like Aura Kingdom have a SPD stat to reduce cooldowns in a way that the devs can calculate and control and subsequently balance.
What ESO has is an exploit that is out of their control and they can't properly support and have never balanced their content around.

Being able to block damage mid skill was always intended. The adaption to end animations was discovered and there wasn't anything you can do about it because of casting priority.