Cheating and Exploits

Dubhliam

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hi everyone,

We wanted to reiterate here what we said on ESO Live today, for anyone who wasn't able to tune in. We have rolled out additional anti-cheat measures, with more to come. We know everyone in this thread is well aware of this, but we would like to remind all of our players that the use of third party cheat software is grounds for a permanent ban.

This is great news @ZOS_JessicaFolsom if you guys will stick to it. I would gladly resub if I see results but I hope that guys are now serious about permanent meaning permanent.

Ok...one admitted cheat engine user in that other thread and only a 72 hour ban is quite disappointing.

I think it is fine for a first offense. Give the person a chance to clean up their act. If they don't then hit them with the ban hammer.

No. A person using a 3rd party program should receive NO chance to clean up their act. They willfully chose to cheat by downloading the program and using it to gain advantage. These people should be banned for life.

Now exploiting an ingame mechanic should probably be on a strike system. I can see where this would be advantageous.

I'd like to think that people can be redeemed. If they end up getting banned it is on them but at least we could say we honestly tried.

Remove their achievements and make them start over if necessary but banning should be a last resort.

Sorry we are going to have to disagree because these cheat engine users should be gone. People can be redeemed. They just need to be redeemed on another game.

It works like this in real life too. People do bad things and have to pay for them. They pay the price for it and can change but their life is never the same.

These cheaters can change their ways but they need to move on from here.

I haven't played much of the PVP in this game so maybe I'm simply not understanding the scale of the problem . I remember seeing bothers for a while and I'm assuming they got banned.

You seem to be asking for an extreme solution though. Will it really work the way you think it will work?

I still think taking away ill gotten gains putting them at level 1, stripping them of all champion points and gear would be much better. They can't play the martyr role. They don't benefit from cheating. With the cheater brand over their head for six months they will have to reform or no one will play with them. If they shape up great. If not the social systems of the world will shun them.

Let's see... stripping away all levels, CP, gear and achievements...
Basically they would get a free new account with their old character names.

Wouldn't it be smarter for ZOS to simply let them BUY new accounts?
After all, the game is almost always on discount sale.

Zoner

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hi everyone,

We wanted to reiterate here what we said on ESO Live today, for anyone who wasn't able to tune in. We have rolled out additional anti-cheat measures, with more to come. We know everyone in this thread is well aware of this, but we would like to remind all of our players that the use of third party cheat software is grounds for a permanent ban.

This is great news @ZOS_JessicaFolsom if you guys will stick to it. I would gladly resub if I see results but I hope that guys are now serious about permanent meaning permanent.

Ok...one admitted cheat engine user in that other thread and only a 72 hour ban is quite disappointing.

I think it is fine for a first offense. Give the person a chance to clean up their act. If they don't then hit them with the ban hammer.

No. A person using a 3rd party program should receive NO chance to clean up their act. They willfully chose to cheat by downloading the program and using it to gain advantage. These people should be banned for life.

Now exploiting an ingame mechanic should probably be on a strike system. I can see where this would be advantageous.

I'd like to think that people can be redeemed. If they end up getting banned it is on them but at least we could say we honestly tried.

Remove their achievements and make them start over if necessary but banning should be a last resort.

Sorry we are going to have to disagree because these cheat engine users should be gone. People can be redeemed. They just need to be redeemed on another game.

It works like this in real life too. People do bad things and have to pay for them. They pay the price for it and can change but their life is never the same.

These cheaters can change their ways but they need to move on from here.

I haven't played much of the PVP in this game so maybe I'm simply not understanding the scale of the problem . I remember seeing bothers for a while and I'm assuming they got banned.

You seem to be asking for an extreme solution though. Will it really work the way you think it will work?

I still think taking away ill gotten gains putting them at level 1, stripping them of all champion points and gear would be much better. They can't play the martyr role. They don't benefit from cheating. With the cheater brand over their head for six months they will have to reform or no one will play with them. If they shape up great. If not the social systems of the world will shun them.

Problem is that some of the people who got unbanned already had previous strikes against their accounts, some even for previous exploiting/cheating.

In my opinion, considering that there is no way to unknowingly or accidentally install cheat engine and jack up your stats or ulti or whatever, there should be no second chances. It's premeditated and very deliberate. It gets an instant permaban in pretty much every other game, this one should be no different.

Thornen

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Dubhliam wrote: »

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

cecibergesnrb18_ESO wrote: »

Zenimax:

I'm really dissapointed. You still didn't fix the wall leap, I just saw the DC emperor (Azura, NA) not only jumping to the top floor of bleaker's (even higher than other keeps) but also passing through the grating where you normaly place the oil, just to make it more hilarious and clear how broken is your game.

What are you expecting? That players won't cheat? There will be always cheaters, people without principles. If you are not going to fix it then don't say it's against the rules. Make up your mind, make it legal and we will all forget siege weapons if that's what you want, we'll make it all a big boring deathmatch.

Not gonna lie, I don't think they can fix this issue without disabling gap closers entirely. If it comes down to that then they can disable them in Cyrodiil (but not IC) so they don't kill them entirely.

Are you serious? You're talking as if gap closers got introduced into the game four weeks ago.
Gap closers were working correctly up until DB, with a few "mishaps" where a charge would not connect because of a tiny obstacle or slight terrain difference.

This is a clear example how much ZOS cares about PvP.
They'd much rather ruin the whole PvP experience than inconvenience PvE players when a skill bugs out now and then.

It is obvious Zenimax wants to fix gap closers. However, the problem is they cannot seem to get it right. They stop people from jumping walls and then they bug out everywhere else just because of a little bump in the ground... So they fix that only to undo the fix to prevent wall jumping. It's clear that after all this time they cannot seem to invest the proper amount of time to fix this issue. Therefore if they want to stop the exploiters they can either police their own game or take the band-aid approach and disable gap closers in Cyrodiil only, but not Gold Coast and Imperial City of course, so that the exploiters curse their actions that led to such a penalty, whichever happens.

Sure I don't want to see gap closers disabled because it would indeed suck but what other options do Zenimax have at the moment if they're not willing to patrol their game? The exploiting has to stop, and Zenimax needs to stop them. One way, or another...

It's funny because up until they tried to fix Templars toppling charge (wich was the only broken gap closer) everything was fine...now they're just adding more broken fixes upon broken fixes. Zos have an inability to admit mistakes in all aspects of the game from development onwards, this means all we are going to see in the future are more broken fixes on broken fixes.

Niastissa

Dubhliam wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hi everyone,

We wanted to reiterate here what we said on ESO Live today, for anyone who wasn't able to tune in. We have rolled out additional anti-cheat measures, with more to come. We know everyone in this thread is well aware of this, but we would like to remind all of our players that the use of third party cheat software is grounds for a permanent ban.

This is great news @ZOS_JessicaFolsom if you guys will stick to it. I would gladly resub if I see results but I hope that guys are now serious about permanent meaning permanent.

Ok...one admitted cheat engine user in that other thread and only a 72 hour ban is quite disappointing.

I think it is fine for a first offense. Give the person a chance to clean up their act. If they don't then hit them with the ban hammer.

No. A person using a 3rd party program should receive NO chance to clean up their act. They willfully chose to cheat by downloading the program and using it to gain advantage. These people should be banned for life.

Now exploiting an ingame mechanic should probably be on a strike system. I can see where this would be advantageous.

I'd like to think that people can be redeemed. If they end up getting banned it is on them but at least we could say we honestly tried.

Remove their achievements and make them start over if necessary but banning should be a last resort.

Sorry we are going to have to disagree because these cheat engine users should be gone. People can be redeemed. They just need to be redeemed on another game.

It works like this in real life too. People do bad things and have to pay for them. They pay the price for it and can change but their life is never the same.

These cheaters can change their ways but they need to move on from here.

I haven't played much of the PVP in this game so maybe I'm simply not understanding the scale of the problem . I remember seeing bothers for a while and I'm assuming they got banned.

You seem to be asking for an extreme solution though. Will it really work the way you think it will work?

I still think taking away ill gotten gains putting them at level 1, stripping them of all champion points and gear would be much better. They can't play the martyr role. They don't benefit from cheating. With the cheater brand over their head for six months they will have to reform or no one will play with them. If they shape up great. If not the social systems of the world will shun them.

Let's see... stripping away all levels, CP, gear and achievements...
Basically they would get a free new account with their old character names.

Wouldn't it be smarter for ZOS to simply let them BUY new accounts?
After all, the game is almost always on discount sale.

No because it isn't a free new account. Did I forget to say the cheater label is applied to their name? If so that too. They are then either going to live with the shame fusing the cheater account or go buy another account and not cheat.

Much better to shame them.

Pomaikai

Sharee wrote: »

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Disabling gap closers would trigger a domino effect of inbalances that would cause way more issues than the current occassional people teleporting where they should not.

The problem is that it's becoming less occasional, and much much much more common. We have entire guild crews running right now whose sole purpose is to take Keeps by exploiting gap closers.

Pomaikai

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hi everyone,

We wanted to reiterate here what we said on ESO Live today, for anyone who wasn't able to tune in. We have rolled out additional anti-cheat measures, with more to come. We know everyone in this thread is well aware of this, but we would like to remind all of our players that the use of third party cheat software is grounds for a permanent ban.

This is great news @ZOS_JessicaFolsom if you guys will stick to it. I would gladly resub if I see results but I hope that guys are now serious about permanent meaning permanent.

Ok...one admitted cheat engine user in that other thread and only a 72 hour ban is quite disappointing.

I think it is fine for a first offense. Give the person a chance to clean up their act. If they don't then hit them with the ban hammer.

No. A person using a 3rd party program should receive NO chance to clean up their act. They willfully chose to cheat by downloading the program and using it to gain advantage. These people should be banned for life.

Now exploiting an ingame mechanic should probably be on a strike system. I can see where this would be advantageous.

I'd like to think that people can be redeemed. If they end up getting banned it is on them but at least we could say we honestly tried.

Remove their achievements and make them start over if necessary but banning should be a last resort.

Not for using a 3rd party cheat program. No, not ever. One strike and you are gone for good. No take backs, no second chances, and no changing your mind like ZOS has done. Not ever!

clayandaudrey_ESO

Pomaikai wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hi everyone,

We wanted to reiterate here what we said on ESO Live today, for anyone who wasn't able to tune in. We have rolled out additional anti-cheat measures, with more to come. We know everyone in this thread is well aware of this, but we would like to remind all of our players that the use of third party cheat software is grounds for a permanent ban.

This is great news @ZOS_JessicaFolsom if you guys will stick to it. I would gladly resub if I see results but I hope that guys are now serious about permanent meaning permanent.

Ok...one admitted cheat engine user in that other thread and only a 72 hour ban is quite disappointing.

I think it is fine for a first offense. Give the person a chance to clean up their act. If they don't then hit them with the ban hammer.

No. A person using a 3rd party program should receive NO chance to clean up their act. They willfully chose to cheat by downloading the program and using it to gain advantage. These people should be banned for life.

Now exploiting an ingame mechanic should probably be on a strike system. I can see where this would be advantageous.

I'd like to think that people can be redeemed. If they end up getting banned it is on them but at least we could say we honestly tried.

Remove their achievements and make them start over if necessary but banning should be a last resort.

Not for using a 3rd party cheat program. No, not ever. One strike and you are gone for good. No take backs, no second chances, and no changing your mind like ZOS has done. Not ever!

So much this.

Dubhliam

Niastissa wrote: »

Dubhliam wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hi everyone,

We wanted to reiterate here what we said on ESO Live today, for anyone who wasn't able to tune in. We have rolled out additional anti-cheat measures, with more to come. We know everyone in this thread is well aware of this, but we would like to remind all of our players that the use of third party cheat software is grounds for a permanent ban.

This is great news @ZOS_JessicaFolsom if you guys will stick to it. I would gladly resub if I see results but I hope that guys are now serious about permanent meaning permanent.

Ok...one admitted cheat engine user in that other thread and only a 72 hour ban is quite disappointing.

I think it is fine for a first offense. Give the person a chance to clean up their act. If they don't then hit them with the ban hammer.

No. A person using a 3rd party program should receive NO chance to clean up their act. They willfully chose to cheat by downloading the program and using it to gain advantage. These people should be banned for life.

Now exploiting an ingame mechanic should probably be on a strike system. I can see where this would be advantageous.

I'd like to think that people can be redeemed. If they end up getting banned it is on them but at least we could say we honestly tried.

Remove their achievements and make them start over if necessary but banning should be a last resort.

Sorry we are going to have to disagree because these cheat engine users should be gone. People can be redeemed. They just need to be redeemed on another game.

It works like this in real life too. People do bad things and have to pay for them. They pay the price for it and can change but their life is never the same.

These cheaters can change their ways but they need to move on from here.

I haven't played much of the PVP in this game so maybe I'm simply not understanding the scale of the problem . I remember seeing bothers for a while and I'm assuming they got banned.

You seem to be asking for an extreme solution though. Will it really work the way you think it will work?

I still think taking away ill gotten gains putting them at level 1, stripping them of all champion points and gear would be much better. They can't play the martyr role. They don't benefit from cheating. With the cheater brand over their head for six months they will have to reform or no one will play with them. If they shape up great. If not the social systems of the world will shun them.

Let's see... stripping away all levels, CP, gear and achievements...
Basically they would get a free new account with their old character names.

Wouldn't it be smarter for ZOS to simply let them BUY new accounts?
After all, the game is almost always on discount sale.

No because it isn't a free new account. Did I forget to say the cheater label is applied to their name? If so that too. They are then either going to live with the shame fusing the cheater account or go buy another account and not cheat.

Much better to shame them.

Okay... if they get a "cheater" title that cannot be removed, I am in total agreement.
Heck, I'd even let them keep their level and CP as long as they would be recognized as proven Hackers.

clayandaudrey_ESO

Dubhliam wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

Dubhliam wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hi everyone,

We wanted to reiterate here what we said on ESO Live today, for anyone who wasn't able to tune in. We have rolled out additional anti-cheat measures, with more to come. We know everyone in this thread is well aware of this, but we would like to remind all of our players that the use of third party cheat software is grounds for a permanent ban.

This is great news @ZOS_JessicaFolsom if you guys will stick to it. I would gladly resub if I see results but I hope that guys are now serious about permanent meaning permanent.

Ok...one admitted cheat engine user in that other thread and only a 72 hour ban is quite disappointing.

I think it is fine for a first offense. Give the person a chance to clean up their act. If they don't then hit them with the ban hammer.

No. A person using a 3rd party program should receive NO chance to clean up their act. They willfully chose to cheat by downloading the program and using it to gain advantage. These people should be banned for life.

Now exploiting an ingame mechanic should probably be on a strike system. I can see where this would be advantageous.

I'd like to think that people can be redeemed. If they end up getting banned it is on them but at least we could say we honestly tried.

Remove their achievements and make them start over if necessary but banning should be a last resort.

Sorry we are going to have to disagree because these cheat engine users should be gone. People can be redeemed. They just need to be redeemed on another game.

It works like this in real life too. People do bad things and have to pay for them. They pay the price for it and can change but their life is never the same.

These cheaters can change their ways but they need to move on from here.

I haven't played much of the PVP in this game so maybe I'm simply not understanding the scale of the problem . I remember seeing bothers for a while and I'm assuming they got banned.

You seem to be asking for an extreme solution though. Will it really work the way you think it will work?

I still think taking away ill gotten gains putting them at level 1, stripping them of all champion points and gear would be much better. They can't play the martyr role. They don't benefit from cheating. With the cheater brand over their head for six months they will have to reform or no one will play with them. If they shape up great. If not the social systems of the world will shun them.

Let's see... stripping away all levels, CP, gear and achievements...
Basically they would get a free new account with their old character names.

Wouldn't it be smarter for ZOS to simply let them BUY new accounts?
After all, the game is almost always on discount sale.

No because it isn't a free new account. Did I forget to say the cheater label is applied to their name? If so that too. They are then either going to live with the shame fusing the cheater account or go buy another account and not cheat.

Much better to shame them.

Okay... if they get a "cheater" title that cannot be removed, I am in total agreement.
Heck, I'd even let them keep their level and CP as long as they would be recognized as proven Hackers.

That would break ZOS' own policy on naming and shaming. Better for them to just show the cheaters the door.

NobleNerd

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hi everyone,

We wanted to reiterate here what we said on ESO Live today, for anyone who wasn't able to tune in. We have rolled out additional anti-cheat measures, with more to come. We know everyone in this thread is well aware of this, but we would like to remind all of our players that the use of third party cheat software is grounds for a permanent ban.

This is great news @ZOS_JessicaFolsom if you guys will stick to it. I would gladly resub if I see results but I hope that guys are now serious about permanent meaning permanent.

Ok...one admitted cheat engine user in that other thread and only a 72 hour ban is quite disappointing.

I think it is fine for a first offense. Give the person a chance to clean up their act. If they don't then hit them with the ban hammer.

No. A person using a 3rd party program should receive NO chance to clean up their act. They willfully chose to cheat by downloading the program and using it to gain advantage. These people should be banned for life.

Now exploiting an ingame mechanic should probably be on a strike system. I can see where this would be advantageous.

I'd like to think that people can be redeemed. If they end up getting banned it is on them but at least we could say we honestly tried.

Remove their achievements and make them start over if necessary but banning should be a last resort.

Sorry we are going to have to disagree because these cheat engine users should be gone. People can be redeemed. They just need to be redeemed on another game.

It works like this in real life too. People do bad things and have to pay for them. They pay the price for it and can change but their life is never the same.

These cheaters can change their ways but they need to move on from here.

I like to believe that people can be redeemed, but in cases like this companies need to take the hard love approach. Look to Wall Street as a great example. The Market Crash of 2008 had little to no one taking responsibility for it. No CEO lost their jobs, no great consequence for any of their greedy actions. What ended up happening is they were bailed out and less than 2 months after they gave themselves bonuses and raises...... cheaters do not change!

If people feel like they got away with something they will just figure out how to do it again.

Dubhliam

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Dubhliam wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

Dubhliam wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Niastissa wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hi everyone,

We wanted to reiterate here what we said on ESO Live today, for anyone who wasn't able to tune in. We have rolled out additional anti-cheat measures, with more to come. We know everyone in this thread is well aware of this, but we would like to remind all of our players that the use of third party cheat software is grounds for a permanent ban.

This is great news @ZOS_JessicaFolsom if you guys will stick to it. I would gladly resub if I see results but I hope that guys are now serious about permanent meaning permanent.

Ok...one admitted cheat engine user in that other thread and only a 72 hour ban is quite disappointing.

I think it is fine for a first offense. Give the person a chance to clean up their act. If they don't then hit them with the ban hammer.

No. A person using a 3rd party program should receive NO chance to clean up their act. They willfully chose to cheat by downloading the program and using it to gain advantage. These people should be banned for life.

Now exploiting an ingame mechanic should probably be on a strike system. I can see where this would be advantageous.

I'd like to think that people can be redeemed. If they end up getting banned it is on them but at least we could say we honestly tried.

Remove their achievements and make them start over if necessary but banning should be a last resort.

Sorry we are going to have to disagree because these cheat engine users should be gone. People can be redeemed. They just need to be redeemed on another game.

It works like this in real life too. People do bad things and have to pay for them. They pay the price for it and can change but their life is never the same.

These cheaters can change their ways but they need to move on from here.

I haven't played much of the PVP in this game so maybe I'm simply not understanding the scale of the problem . I remember seeing bothers for a while and I'm assuming they got banned.

You seem to be asking for an extreme solution though. Will it really work the way you think it will work?

I still think taking away ill gotten gains putting them at level 1, stripping them of all champion points and gear would be much better. They can't play the martyr role. They don't benefit from cheating. With the cheater brand over their head for six months they will have to reform or no one will play with them. If they shape up great. If not the social systems of the world will shun them.

Let's see... stripping away all levels, CP, gear and achievements...
Basically they would get a free new account with their old character names.

Wouldn't it be smarter for ZOS to simply let them BUY new accounts?
After all, the game is almost always on discount sale.

No because it isn't a free new account. Did I forget to say the cheater label is applied to their name? If so that too. They are then either going to live with the shame fusing the cheater account or go buy another account and not cheat.

Much better to shame them.

Okay... if they get a "cheater" title that cannot be removed, I am in total agreement.
Heck, I'd even let them keep their level and CP as long as they would be recognized as proven Hackers.

That would break ZOS' own policy on naming and shaming. Better for them to just show the cheaters the door.

If players are allowed to break ZOS' Terms of Service, do they get to complain?

All jokes aside, I know ZOS would never do that.
Which is why they better grow a backbone soon and start banning players using 3rd party programs to cheat with no remorse.

At the stage the game is currently in, there is no simple solution for catching hackers.
It may have been possible to create a game with no client side trust, but that train has long passed in my opinion.
Searching algorithms will always result in a few false positives, and even those that did cheat will appeal with the "I was banned by accident" justification. So that is also not ideal.

The resources they spend reading and resolving appeal tickets would have been better spent if they actually logged into their game and monitored reported or tagged players, then banning them when proven they were hacking.
With no right for an appeal.

LastAmbushOnEarth

if cheaters and bottters in the game
at least its a good sign - the game still popular!

NobleNerd

LastAmbushOnEarth wrote: »

if cheaters and bottters in the game
at least its a good sign - the game still popular!

LOL... these are just normal players taking advantage of broken coding and game mechanics. There are no gold sellers in this game. They left about a few months after it launched because there was no profit in it. If you see gold sellers coming back then it is a sign that the game is popular, they only try to stick around in games that have a thriving population.... heck I still run into them in WoW.

AnnieBeGood

ZOS is not and should not tell us how they are detecting cheaters. That would be stupid like the speed cop announcing he would be in that lay by at this time for however long.
But I was in Cyro this afternoon, and I am a terribad pvp-er, but I did manage to stay alive longer, indeed even manage to kill some enemies before I crumbled helpless to the ground.Their health was going down, their stamina was not lasting quite so long so my conclusion is a lot more people have rethought their actions.
Or of course I have suddenly improved. Oh lol ....... as if.

Bromburak

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hi everyone,

We wanted to reiterate here what we said on ESO Live today, for anyone who wasn't able to tune in. We have rolled out additional anti-cheat measures, with more to come. We know everyone in this thread is well aware of this, but we would like to remind all of our players that the use of third party cheat software is grounds for a permanent ban.

But fixes and improvements that don't work as expected on your side are part of the cheating and exploit topic so how can we discuss this as customers when there is always impact on disciplinary actions what is against forum rules? Please explain.

On the other hand you have tried to improve your cheat detection system but apparently it also resulted in some false positives. For example banning players that are using refreshing path and sprint as NB in VMA and we are not allowed to discuss such customers cases. Well actually it's part of testing especially when it was reproducable so it's odd to ignore this.

Are you aware of the fact that some players are afraid to use skills that provide speed just because things like that happened? So basically you have customers that avoid playing specific content and skills because nobody knows what is going on since your changes and of course honest players don't want to run in a false positive trap because of possible bugs on your side.

While I really appreciate your personal help and close work with community @ZOS_JessicaFolsom and @ZOS_KaiSchober there are so many severe customer issues that leave the impression that customers are being ignored whenever it's a critical issue on your side that actually should be cleary communicated. The silence on some topics confirm this.

There is no cheat page or anything similar either, and why do you allow gap closer exploiter and DKs still jump into closed keeps without any consequences? It's a known issue since ages and you said the DK fix is not that easy like Ambush on NB 2 weeks ago. So you basically cannot provide a solution but still allow every exploiter to continue because it has no consequences. Now please explain, why should customers accept this?

I only can speak for my self and not for the community but I feel that we are left alone as ESO fans and customers.

All I am asking for is a better communication.
Many things didn't change or make old problems worst in a new way, I want to trust the company that you represent.
But if the silence continues on severe topics like cheating and exploiting I can't.

Elsonso

Bromburak wrote: »

Are you aware of the fact that some players are afraid to use skills that provide speed just because things like that happened? So basically you have customers that avoid playing specific content and skills because nobody knows what is going on since your changes and of course honest players don't want to run in a false positive trap because of possible bugs on your side.



All I am asking for is a better communication.

As far as communication goes, I agree.

However, I think that being afraid to use active and passive speed boosting abilities in the game is forum generated hysteria.

LastAmbushOnEarth

NobleNerd wrote: »

LastAmbushOnEarth wrote: »

if cheaters and bottters in the game
at least its a good sign - the game still popular!

LOL... these are just normal players taking advantage of broken coding and game mechanics. There are no gold sellers in this game. They left about a few months after it launched because there was no profit in it. If you see gold sellers coming back then it is a sign that the game is popular, they only try to stick around in games that have a thriving population.... heck I still run into them in WoW.

@NobleNerd i will dissapoint you
but thereris ALOT goldsellers in this game
and gold have a good price
just google

they just stop advertise their services in the chats and ingame mails

Bromburak

lordrichter wrote: »

Bromburak wrote: »

Are you aware of the fact that some players are afraid to use skills that provide speed just because things like that happened? So basically you have customers that avoid playing specific content and skills because nobody knows what is going on since your changes and of course honest players don't want to run in a false positive trap because of possible bugs on your side.



All I am asking for is a better communication.

As far as communication goes, I agree.

However, I think that being afraid to use active and passive speed boosting abilities in the game is forum generated hysteria.

It's easy to say that all NBs that could reproduce the issue in VMA were banned for 72 hours are only hysteria, imo it's pretty ignorant. However we think about reaction of other players that are afraid or not, it's still a result of non existing communication in this matter.

NobleNerd

LastAmbushOnEarth wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

LastAmbushOnEarth wrote: »

if cheaters and bottters in the game
at least its a good sign - the game still popular!

LOL... these are just normal players taking advantage of broken coding and game mechanics. There are no gold sellers in this game. They left about a few months after it launched because there was no profit in it. If you see gold sellers coming back then it is a sign that the game is popular, they only try to stick around in games that have a thriving population.... heck I still run into them in WoW.

@NobleNerd i will dissapoint you
but thereris ALOT goldsellers in this game
and gold have a good price
just google

they just stop advertise their services in the chats and ingame mails

There is a website for every MMO to purchase gold. Even EQ and EQII have websites. If they aren't in the game then there isn't much of a focus or demand for it.

clayandaudrey_ESO

Bromburak wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hi everyone,

We wanted to reiterate here what we said on ESO Live today, for anyone who wasn't able to tune in. We have rolled out additional anti-cheat measures, with more to come. We know everyone in this thread is well aware of this, but we would like to remind all of our players that the use of third party cheat software is grounds for a permanent ban.

But fixes and improvements that don't work as expected on your side are part of the cheating and exploit topic so how can we discuss this as customers when there is always impact on disciplinary actions what is against forum rules? Please explain.

On the other hand you have tried to improve your cheat detection system but apparently it also resulted in some false positives. For example banning players that are using refreshing path and sprint as NB in VMA and we are not allowed to discuss such customers cases. Well actually it's part of testing especially when it was reproducable so it's odd to ignore this.

Are you aware of the fact that some players are afraid to use skills that provide speed just because things like that happened? So basically you have customers that avoid playing specific content and skills because nobody knows what is going on since your changes and of course honest players don't want to run in a false positive trap because of possible bugs on your side.

While I really appreciate your personal help and close work with community @ZOS_JessicaFolsom and @ZOS_KaiSchober there are so many severe customer issues that leave the impression that customers are being ignored whenever it's a critical issue on your side that actually should be cleary communicated. The silence on some topics confirm this.

There is no cheat page or anything similar either, and why do you allow gap closer exploiter and DKs still jump into closed keeps without any consequences? It's a known issue since ages and you said the DK fix is not that easy like Ambush on NB 2 weeks ago. So you basically cannot provide a solution but still allow every exploiter to continue because it has no consequences. Now please explain, why should customers accept this?

I only can speak for my self and not for the community but I feel that we are left alone as ESO fans and customers.

All I am asking for is a better communication.
Many things didn't change or make old problems worst in a new way, I want to trust the company that you represent.
But if the silence continues on severe topics like cheating and exploiting I can't.

I play a nightblade and I have and continue to use all these abilities to increase speed and I have not been banned. I am not saying there weren't some false positives but wouldn't I have been caught in it as well since I do these same things that people say caused the false positives?

UltimaJoe777

lordrichter wrote: »

KingMagaw wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

Why they do not take this opportunity to ban, suspend, or kick players that are misbehaving, is the real key. The only reason that I can think of is that they cannot use this method of enforcement effectively without having an army of employees in the game 24 hours per day. It would be like trying to turn off Niagara Falls with a plastic shovel and a pail filled with sand. Therefore, those who can pop into the game are not tasked with enforcement.

You see 1 GM in game enforcing there TOS this would right away cut down the amount of cheating going on.

But if your asking why THIS company doesn't spend money (GM's in game) to ban cheaters/hackers only to lose money on them not subbing or buying some aesthetic junk from crown store then i can only say you must be a new player. Almost everything i have witnessed to date has shown a lack of integrity on their part.

Probably going to get suspended again posting in this topic but i keep checking here for some miracle post.

Yeah, the "cop sitting on the side of the road" scenario. It works. The real question is how many people would see the GM in a game this size. I have seen a GM in game 2 times, none recently, and consider myself lucky.

As for their "lack of integrity", all I have to say to that is that I have been around for a very long time and do not subscribe to that line of thinking. While I do not know why they don't pop into the game and immediately disintegrate cheaters in a flashy manner, I don't think that it is due to a lack of integrity. From what I see, they tend to respond slowly, and tend to do it with a budget in mind, but that has nothing to do with integrity.

We sit here on the forums in judgement of ZOS based on anecdotal testimony that covers a small population of players. We have no visibility to the bigger picture and our facts are limited. Because ZOS does not talk specifics, the forum gets to set the message for ZOS, and that is unfortunate. It is this "forum message" that leads to people saying things like "lack of integrity".

We, in the forum, base our judgements on anecdotal testimony of questionable reliability and tend to extrapolate events beyond that which we see. When a half dozen (or so) people are suspended for cheating, at least one of them for a second time, some in the forum respond like hundreds were caught in a faulty automated wave. Likewise, when we hear about a handful of people who were unbanned, some in the forum respond like no one was banned. If a Twitch streamer gets a temporary reprieve and a "4th strike", some act like Twitch streamers are above the law, just because they cannot see if non-Twitch streamers have also received this. Today, we have a claim that ZOS did nothing about a race hate situation, with no evidence that they did nothing about it the first time, and will ignore it the second time, and the some of the forum responses are predictable.

I liked the idea that ZOS post numbers periodically. I don't want names, or scenarios, but it would be nice to see "warnings", "suspensions", and "permanent ban" numbers. I like this just to combat what I expect is a false impression held by "the forum".

For a GM to properly police a game they would have to hide. Every MMO has an invisibility option GMs can use to hide their presence from other players entirely, thus letting them catch people in the act. If cheaters and exploiters knew GMs in ESO were doing that they may think twice about cheating/exploiting due to the risk of getting caught.

Bromburak

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Bromburak wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hi everyone,

We wanted to reiterate here what we said on ESO Live today, for anyone who wasn't able to tune in. We have rolled out additional anti-cheat measures, with more to come. We know everyone in this thread is well aware of this, but we would like to remind all of our players that the use of third party cheat software is grounds for a permanent ban.

But fixes and improvements that don't work as expected on your side are part of the cheating and exploit topic so how can we discuss this as customers when there is always impact on disciplinary actions what is against forum rules? Please explain.

On the other hand you have tried to improve your cheat detection system but apparently it also resulted in some false positives. For example banning players that are using refreshing path and sprint as NB in VMA and we are not allowed to discuss such customers cases. Well actually it's part of testing especially when it was reproducable so it's odd to ignore this.

Are you aware of the fact that some players are afraid to use skills that provide speed just because things like that happened? So basically you have customers that avoid playing specific content and skills because nobody knows what is going on since your changes and of course honest players don't want to run in a false positive trap because of possible bugs on your side.

While I really appreciate your personal help and close work with community @ZOS_JessicaFolsom and @ZOS_KaiSchober there are so many severe customer issues that leave the impression that customers are being ignored whenever it's a critical issue on your side that actually should be cleary communicated. The silence on some topics confirm this.

There is no cheat page or anything similar either, and why do you allow gap closer exploiter and DKs still jump into closed keeps without any consequences? It's a known issue since ages and you said the DK fix is not that easy like Ambush on NB 2 weeks ago. So you basically cannot provide a solution but still allow every exploiter to continue because it has no consequences. Now please explain, why should customers accept this?

I only can speak for my self and not for the community but I feel that we are left alone as ESO fans and customers.

All I am asking for is a better communication.
Many things didn't change or make old problems worst in a new way, I want to trust the company that you represent.
But if the silence continues on severe topics like cheating and exploiting I can't.

I play a nightblade and I have and continue to use all these abilities to increase speed and I have not been banned. I am not saying there weren't some false positives but wouldn't I have been caught in it as well since I do these same things that people say caused the false positives?

You might don't know how to reproduce the VMA temp ban and not fast enough like most VMA top scoring players.
We all don't know the factors that can trigger the cheat detection tool for anomaly detection.

A fact is that there are false positives and exactly thats why this needs some clarification because you cannot classify all customers as guilty until proven innocence without explaining such severe mistakes. It's just not acceptable for customers.

But now lets talk about the worst thing of all, why would a game company decide to ban cheaters only for 72 hours when they are certain their cheat detection tool is working as expected? Wouldn't it result in a perma ban right away?

I totally agree with ZOS that they cannot discuss details with us because privacy rules and all the relations to disciplinary action makes things more complicated but at least they could make themselves clear about cheating and give us more reasons to trust in what are they actually doing. Currently I highly doubt that this is the case and the ongoing silence is not changing anything.

Again, @ZOS_JessicaFolsom already confirmed that cheating is not tolerated and results in perma bans by ZOS but reality is different sometimes. On top of it we have lifted perma bans (cannot be discussed because of privacy rules and criticism on disciplinary actions are not allowed) , we know reported well known cheaters with tons of proven video material and they are still in this game etc..

It's a shame that this happens in a game we love to play and thats why it's important to discuss and clarify things with help of ZOS.

clayandaudrey_ESO

Bromburak wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Bromburak wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hi everyone,

We wanted to reiterate here what we said on ESO Live today, for anyone who wasn't able to tune in. We have rolled out additional anti-cheat measures, with more to come. We know everyone in this thread is well aware of this, but we would like to remind all of our players that the use of third party cheat software is grounds for a permanent ban.

But fixes and improvements that don't work as expected on your side are part of the cheating and exploit topic so how can we discuss this as customers when there is always impact on disciplinary actions what is against forum rules? Please explain.

On the other hand you have tried to improve your cheat detection system but apparently it also resulted in some false positives. For example banning players that are using refreshing path and sprint as NB in VMA and we are not allowed to discuss such customers cases. Well actually it's part of testing especially when it was reproducable so it's odd to ignore this.

Are you aware of the fact that some players are afraid to use skills that provide speed just because things like that happened? So basically you have customers that avoid playing specific content and skills because nobody knows what is going on since your changes and of course honest players don't want to run in a false positive trap because of possible bugs on your side.

While I really appreciate your personal help and close work with community @ZOS_JessicaFolsom and @ZOS_KaiSchober there are so many severe customer issues that leave the impression that customers are being ignored whenever it's a critical issue on your side that actually should be cleary communicated. The silence on some topics confirm this.

There is no cheat page or anything similar either, and why do you allow gap closer exploiter and DKs still jump into closed keeps without any consequences? It's a known issue since ages and you said the DK fix is not that easy like Ambush on NB 2 weeks ago. So you basically cannot provide a solution but still allow every exploiter to continue because it has no consequences. Now please explain, why should customers accept this?

I only can speak for my self and not for the community but I feel that we are left alone as ESO fans and customers.

All I am asking for is a better communication.
Many things didn't change or make old problems worst in a new way, I want to trust the company that you represent.
But if the silence continues on severe topics like cheating and exploiting I can't.

I play a nightblade and I have and continue to use all these abilities to increase speed and I have not been banned. I am not saying there weren't some false positives but wouldn't I have been caught in it as well since I do these same things that people say caused the false positives?

You might don't know how to reproduce the VMA temp ban and not fast enough like most VMA top scoring players.
We all don't know the factors that can trigger the cheat detection tool for anomaly detection.

A fact is that there are false positives and exactly thats why this needs some clarification because you cannot classify all customers as guilty until proven innocence without explaining such severe mistakes. It's just not acceptable for customers.

But now lets talk about the worst thing of all, why would a game company decide to ban cheaters only for 72 hours when they are certain their cheat detection tool is working as expected? Wouldn't it result in a perma ban right away?

I totally agree with ZOS that they cannot discuss details with us because privacy rules and all the relations to disciplinary action makes things more complicated but at least they could make themselves clear about cheating and give us more reasons to trust in what are they actually doing. Currently I highly doubt that this is the case and the present silence is not changing anything.

Which is why I called for ZOS way early in this thread to publicly announce their policy on cheating and then adhered to to policy they set forth. Not doing so is hurting the confidence people have in this game and when confidence in a product goes down...well.

Thalmor-Nordmaster

Just experienced a nasty round of Cheating while defending Sejanus. I am done. Some cheat detection. Reporting does not seem to do anything. I will not pay to play games this broke. Sorry zenimax your CS and attitude are not to my liking. No more sub from me. I will check in to do my writs and that's it.

kevlarto_ESO

Well cheaters seem to be out in force today, I just saw a plyer go to 0 health then started to do a dance emote with 0 health then heal from 0 to full at the snap of a finger, I want that heal please..LOL

And it was not the phoenix set, or lag.

I don't know how much longer I can continue to play with cheaters running rampant in game..

NobleNerd

kevlarto_ESO wrote: »

Well cheaters seem to be out in force today, I just saw a plyer go to 0 health then started to do a dance emote with 0 health then heal from 0 to full at the snap of a finger, I want that heal please..LOL

And it was not the phoenix set, or lag.

I don't know how much longer I can continue to play with cheaters running rampant in game..

Would love to have some video of these things still happening. I know not everyone thinks to record when they are playing, but the more the proof is saturated here and on youtube and other websites... the more ZOS will be forced to deal with it!

Egonieser

lordrichter wrote: »

Bromburak wrote: »

Are you aware of the fact that some players are afraid to use skills that provide speed just because things like that happened? So basically you have customers that avoid playing specific content and skills because nobody knows what is going on since your changes and of course honest players don't want to run in a false positive trap because of possible bugs on your side.



All I am asking for is a better communication.

As far as communication goes, I agree.

However, I think that being afraid to use active and passive speed boosting abilities in the game is forum generated hysteria.

If you triggered a false positive, I don't think you would be so calm. I dare not go on my stamina sorcerer since my suspension was lifted on Monday - I literally just use him to craft and do writs, and he used to be my main PvP toon. If ZoS actually acknowledged and communicated this issue with us, I would do otherwise, but the silence is deafening. I'll just play my NB with no speed boosts whatsoever for a while until something changes.

Mureel

lordrichter wrote: »

Bromburak wrote: »

Are you aware of the fact that some players are afraid to use skills that provide speed just because things like that happened? So basically you have customers that avoid playing specific content and skills because nobody knows what is going on since your changes and of course honest players don't want to run in a false positive trap because of possible bugs on your side.



All I am asking for is a better communication.

As far as communication goes, I agree.

However, I think that being afraid to use active and passive speed boosting abilities in the game is forum generated hysteria.

I'm afraid to after what's happened. I am always worried I'll be snagged for nothing. I actually have quit logging on unless I have an event to attend.

Mureel

Bromburak wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

Bromburak wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hi everyone,

We wanted to reiterate here what we said on ESO Live today, for anyone who wasn't able to tune in. We have rolled out additional anti-cheat measures, with more to come. We know everyone in this thread is well aware of this, but we would like to remind all of our players that the use of third party cheat software is grounds for a permanent ban.

But fixes and improvements that don't work as expected on your side are part of the cheating and exploit topic so how can we discuss this as customers when there is always impact on disciplinary actions what is against forum rules? Please explain.

On the other hand you have tried to improve your cheat detection system but apparently it also resulted in some false positives. For example banning players that are using refreshing path and sprint as NB in VMA and we are not allowed to discuss such customers cases. Well actually it's part of testing especially when it was reproducable so it's odd to ignore this.

Are you aware of the fact that some players are afraid to use skills that provide speed just because things like that happened? So basically you have customers that avoid playing specific content and skills because nobody knows what is going on since your changes and of course honest players don't want to run in a false positive trap because of possible bugs on your side.

While I really appreciate your personal help and close work with community @ZOS_JessicaFolsom and @ZOS_KaiSchober there are so many severe customer issues that leave the impression that customers are being ignored whenever it's a critical issue on your side that actually should be cleary communicated. The silence on some topics confirm this.

There is no cheat page or anything similar either, and why do you allow gap closer exploiter and DKs still jump into closed keeps without any consequences? It's a known issue since ages and you said the DK fix is not that easy like Ambush on NB 2 weeks ago. So you basically cannot provide a solution but still allow every exploiter to continue because it has no consequences. Now please explain, why should customers accept this?

I only can speak for my self and not for the community but I feel that we are left alone as ESO fans and customers.

All I am asking for is a better communication.
Many things didn't change or make old problems worst in a new way, I want to trust the company that you represent.
But if the silence continues on severe topics like cheating and exploiting I can't.

I play a nightblade and I have and continue to use all these abilities to increase speed and I have not been banned. I am not saying there weren't some false positives but wouldn't I have been caught in it as well since I do these same things that people say caused the false positives?

You might don't know how to reproduce the VMA temp ban and not fast enough like most VMA top scoring players.
We all don't know the factors that can trigger the cheat detection tool for anomaly detection.

A fact is that there are false positives and exactly thats why this needs some clarification because you cannot classify all customers as guilty until proven innocence without explaining such severe mistakes. It's just not acceptable for customers.

But now lets talk about the worst thing of all, why would a game company decide to ban cheaters only for 72 hours when they are certain their cheat detection tool is working as expected? Wouldn't it result in a perma ban right away?

I totally agree with ZOS that they cannot discuss details with us because privacy rules and all the relations to disciplinary action makes things more complicated but at least they could make themselves clear about cheating and give us more reasons to trust in what are they actually doing. Currently I highly doubt that this is the case and the ongoing silence is not changing anything.

Again, @ZOS_JessicaFolsom already confirmed that cheating is not tolerated and results in perma bans by ZOS but reality is different sometimes. On top of it we have lifted perma bans (cannot be discussed because of privacy rules and criticism on disciplinary actions are not allowed) , we know reported well known cheaters with tons of proven video material and they are still in this game etc..

It's a shame that this happens in a game we love to play and thats why it's important to discuss and clarify things with help of ZOS.

I've been told by smart people and also ZOS that latency spike can trigger it. I still feel paranoid though.

LastAmbushOnEarth

NobleNerd wrote: »

LastAmbushOnEarth wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

LastAmbushOnEarth wrote: »

if cheaters and bottters in the game
at least its a good sign - the game still popular!

LOL... these are just normal players taking advantage of broken coding and game mechanics. There are no gold sellers in this game. They left about a few months after it launched because there was no profit in it. If you see gold sellers coming back then it is a sign that the game is popular, they only try to stick around in games that have a thriving population.... heck I still run into them in WoW.

@NobleNerd i will dissapoint you
but thereris ALOT goldsellers in this game
and gold have a good price
just google

they just stop advertise their services in the chats and ingame mails

There is a website for every MMO to purchase gold. Even EQ and EQII have websites. If they aren't in the game then there isn't much of a focus or demand for it.

@NobleNerd you are so far from truth

okay i will not try to convinience you
and such matter prohibited on the forum
but if you try research first, you will figure out you can earn alot$ by gs in teso
i know few ppl who doing it, and the demand is very high always