Official Feedback Thread for Sorcerers

Dixa

the pvp and pve discussion needs to be split into two different threads. i'm seeing some of you lose your minds in a single sentence and i can't tell if you are talking about pvp, pve or both.

label your posts pvp or pve please so i can tell what in the hell you are referring to, and whether or not your argument has any actual merit.

thanks.

Erock25

dagonbeer wrote: »

I've also been guilty of sprouting breathless outrage since the release, but we should keep in mind that this is just the 2nd full day of PTS (out of what, 32?), we need to give ZOS time to evaluate feedback and statistics.

@dagonbeer you haven't been around for other pts cycles, have you? They never change much from what is initially deployed.

Yo_Donno

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

I'm ok with a 6 second ward in pvp, but it's far too short for pve. Can you not battle spirit it? So we get a 6 second ward for pvp and a 20 second ward for pve. I'm also pretty damn sore that annulment got buffed. What were you thinking?? Reverse this change please!

This. If every other class basically has hardened ward, a class defining skill what's the point of being a Sorc. I'll say again shields in PVP only last 6 seconds anyway so you didn't really solve the problem just nerfed Sorcs in PVE

Lucious90

can we just make sorc shields critable and increase to 10 seconds? Problem solved across the board

TBois

Just want to add to those who were expecting more useful Stam sorc changes. I am and have been disappointed in where ZOS has taken Stam sorcs since the crit surge dot change.

The change to make thundering presence (now hurricane) physical damage makes it not able to proc disentigrate. This is a unnoticed drawback to the change, and it just makes my spell sword super sad. THIS IS A HUGE RP PROBLEM. I can no longer claim my Stam Spells are the most powerful in the realm and are able to turn my foes to ashes. This has nothing to do with PVE or PVP, just RP. So I expect this to be changed before it hits live or my RP panties will be in a bundle

Minalan

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

I'm ok with a 6 second ward in pvp, but it's far too short for pve. Can you not battle spirit it? So we get a 6 second ward for pvp and a 20 second ward for pve. I'm also pretty damn sore that annulment got buffed. What were you thinking?? Reverse this change please!

Let me quantify the stupidity of this, in case anyone missed this:

Harness Magicka procs frags.
Harness Magicka is about the same size and duration as hardened ward.
Harness Magicka can be cast while hidden, not many people know that. Hardened Ward reveals you.
Harness Magicka returns Magicka, absorbing spell damage, Hardened Ward doesn't.
Harness Magicka absorbs physical damage, just like Hardened Ward.

That's ridiculous, and an obvious giveaway to Magicka nightblades. That's fine, but we have a non class ability that is better than our class skill, which we would be better off using.

Increase the duration of Hardened Ward please. 10 seconds for hardened. 12 for the pet ward morph so that we don't completely screw per builds over.

RoyJade

TBois wrote: »

Just want to add to those who were expecting more useful Stam sorc changes. I am and have been disappointed in where ZOS has taken Stam sorcs since the crit surge dot change.

The change to make thundering presence (now hurricane) physical damage makes it not able to proc disentigrate. This is a unnoticed drawback to the change, and it just makes my spell sword super sad. THIS IS A HUGE RP PROBLEM. I can no longer claim my Stam Spells are the most powerful in the realm and are able to turn my foes to ashes. This has nothing to do with PVE or PVP, just RP. So I expect this to be changed before it hits live or my RP panties will be in a bundle

Or they can do what I've suggested : adding a litthe thunder damage to all stamina damage or weapon attack when surge is active. Like that, you'll be able to turn foes in ash with every weapon attack. It should fit to your RP character even more.

Lucious90

TBois wrote: »

Just want to add to those who were expecting more useful Stam sorc changes. I am and have been disappointed in where ZOS has taken Stam sorcs since the crit surge dot change.

The change to make thundering presence (now hurricane) physical damage makes it not able to proc disentigrate. This is a unnoticed drawback to the change, and it just makes my spell sword super sad. THIS IS A HUGE RP PROBLEM. I can no longer claim my Stam Spells are the most powerful in the realm and are able to turn my foes to ashes. This has nothing to do with PVE or PVP, just RP. So I expect this to be changed before it hits live or my RP panties will be in a bundle

Well since it is for your imaginary ego boost this should be a top priority for ZoS now....

DEVS DROP WHAT YOU ARE DOING........ YOU ARE RUINING MUH IMMERSION!!

/endsarc

Spearblade

RoyJade wrote: »

TBois wrote: »

Just want to add to those who were expecting more useful Stam sorc changes. I am and have been disappointed in where ZOS has taken Stam sorcs since the crit surge dot change.

The change to make thundering presence (now hurricane) physical damage makes it not able to proc disentigrate. This is a unnoticed drawback to the change, and it just makes my spell sword super sad. THIS IS A HUGE RP PROBLEM. I can no longer claim my Stam Spells are the most powerful in the realm and are able to turn my foes to ashes. This has nothing to do with PVE or PVP, just RP. So I expect this to be changed before it hits live or my RP panties will be in a bundle

Or they can do what I've suggested : adding a litthe thunder damage to all stamina damage or weapon attack when surge is active. Like that, you'll be able to turn foes in ash with every weapon attack. It should fit to your RP character even more.

Either that, or make Disintegrate and the other Shock passives in Storm Calling more...broad. "Storm Calling ability damage can cause X damage, Increases Storm Calling ability damage by X"

RoyJade

That's not a good idea, because magsorc will loose damage on atro, twilight, volatile familiar, all staff skills and on set who does thunder damage.

PainfulFAFA

Lets take a look all the stuff available for stam sorc vs every other class.

The only buffs within the sorc tree that relevant to a stam sorc are:
Major resolve (physical resistance)
Major ward (spell resistance)
Major expedition (speed)
Major endurance (stam regen)
Minor resolve (physical resistance)
Major brutality ( wpn power)
aaaand thats about it lol.

You can disregard the major brutality from sorcs because it comes from crit surge and we all know healing off of crits in pvp is not viable. Rally is 1000000x better.

The extra stam regen is nice BUT you need an ability slotted. Ive never heard of a viable stam sorc pet build so your only options are bound armaments or atronach.
Thats a tough choice. Give up 2 slots on ur bars, or give up and ultimate(or two ultimates if you want regen even after switching bars). GG

So all theres left is speed and resistances. However, every other class has access to resistance buffs. NB, DK, And Temp all have resistance buffs.
That leaves speed as the only unique buff within the sorc tree that is relevant to stam sorcs....

And yet the combat team calls this balance??
And lets not forget the new Hurricane no longer procs disintegrate and still lasts 15 seconds....

Every other class has better stuff like
Major/minor defile
Major/minor mending
Major/minor breach
Major/minor fracture
Major/minor brutality
Major/minor endurance
Major/minor vitality
Major/minor protection

that doesnt require you to give up bar slots and/or ultimate slots.
98% of sorc passives benefit magicka sorcs and their pets more than stam sorc...
Only 2 abilities have stam morphs...

Ill end my thoughts by saying that Hurricane will be just as useless as Crystal Blast.

Thelon

Bad Sorcs be like



Good Sorcs be like

CyrusArya

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

Lets take a look all the stuff available for stam sorc vs every other class.

The only buffs within the sorc tree that relevant to a stam sorc are:
Major resolve (physical resistance)
Major ward (spell resistance)
Major expedition (speed)
Major endurance (stam regen)
Minor resolve (physical resistance)
Major brutality ( wpn power)
aaaand thats about it lol.

You can disregard the major brutality from sorcs because it comes from crit surge and we all know healing off of crits in pvp is not viable. Rally is 1000000x better.

The extra stam regen is nice BUT you need an ability slotted. Ive never heard of a viable stam sorc pet build so your only options are bound armaments or atronach.
Thats a tough choice. Give up 2 slots on ur bars, or give up and ultimate(or two ultimates if you want regen even after switching bars). GG

So all theres left is speed and resistances. However, every other class has access to resistance buffs. NB, DK, And Temp all have resistance buffs.
That leaves speed as the only unique buff within the sorc tree that is relevant to stam sorcs....

And yet the combat team calls this balance??
And lets not forget the new Hurricane no longer procs disintegrate and still lasts 15 seconds....

Every other class has better stuff like
Major defile
Major mending
Major breach
Major fracture

that doesnt require you to give up bar slots and/or ultimate slots.
98% of sorc passives benefit magicka sorcs and their pets more than stam sorc...
Only 2 abilities have stam morphs...

Ill end my thoughts by saying that Hurricane will be just as useless as Crystal Blast.

While I'm not disagreeing that stam sorc could deserve some more love, you're overlooking one major buff they got and that is the change to negate and silencing. Stam sorcs can absolutely murder magicka builds with that ability now, in a way other stam builds cannot. I can see it being extremely useful in all types of PvP. Also consider that stam sorcs get the cheapest and also potentially hardest hitting dawn breakers. I wanna roll a stam sorc just to play around with these two ultis.

Edit: oh, and also stam sorcs get a 3rd bar which is pretty awesome. I think the utility of that is one of the best things about stam sorc.

Mojomonkeyman

CyrusArya wrote: »

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

Lets take a look all the stuff available for stam sorc vs every other class.

The only buffs within the sorc tree that relevant to a stam sorc are:
Major resolve (physical resistance)
Major ward (spell resistance)
Major expedition (speed)
Major endurance (stam regen)
Minor resolve (physical resistance)
Major brutality ( wpn power)
aaaand thats about it lol.

You can disregard the major brutality from sorcs because it comes from crit surge and we all know healing off of crits in pvp is not viable. Rally is 1000000x better.

The extra stam regen is nice BUT you need an ability slotted. Ive never heard of a viable stam sorc pet build so your only options are bound armaments or atronach.
Thats a tough choice. Give up 2 slots on ur bars, or give up and ultimate(or two ultimates if you want regen even after switching bars). GG

So all theres left is speed and resistances. However, every other class has access to resistance buffs. NB, DK, And Temp all have resistance buffs.
That leaves speed as the only unique buff within the sorc tree that is relevant to stam sorcs....

And yet the combat team calls this balance??
And lets not forget the new Hurricane no longer procs disintegrate and still lasts 15 seconds....

Every other class has better stuff like
Major defile
Major mending
Major breach
Major fracture

that doesnt require you to give up bar slots and/or ultimate slots.
98% of sorc passives benefit magicka sorcs and their pets more than stam sorc...
Only 2 abilities have stam morphs...

Ill end my thoughts by saying that Hurricane will be just as useless as Crystal Blast.

While I'm not disagreeing that stam sorc could deserve some more love, you're overlooking one major buff they got and that is the change to negate and silencing. Stam sorcs can absolutely murder magicka builds with that ability now, in a way other stam builds cannot. I can see it being extremely useful in all types of PvP. Also consider that stam sorcs get the cheapest and also potentially hardest hitting dawn breakers. I wanna roll a stam sorc just to play around with these two ultis.

Edit: oh, and also stam sorcs get a 3rd bar which is pretty awesome. I think the utility of that is one of the best things about stam sorc.

I share your opinion.

FriedEggSandwich

Minalan wrote: »

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

I'm ok with a 6 second ward in pvp, but it's far too short for pve. Can you not battle spirit it? So we get a 6 second ward for pvp and a 20 second ward for pve. I'm also pretty damn sore that annulment got buffed. What were you thinking?? Reverse this change please!

Let me quantify the stupidity of this, in case anyone missed this:

Harness Magicka procs frags.
Harness Magicka is about the same size and duration as hardened ward.
Harness Magicka can be cast while hidden, not many people know that. Hardened Ward reveals you.
Harness Magicka returns Magicka, absorbing spell damage, Hardened Ward doesn't.
Harness Magicka absorbs physical damage, just like Hardened Ward.

That's ridiculous, and an obvious giveaway to Magicka nightblades. That's fine, but we have a non class ability that is better than our class skill, which we would be better off using.

Increase the duration of Hardened Ward please. 10 seconds for hardened. 12 for the pet ward morph so that we don't completely screw per builds over.

You misunderstood; I'm sore cos every magicka class now has access to a ward that is potentially better than hardened ward. I haven't been on pts yet so I could be wrong, so I'm not that sore yet.

PainfulFAFA

CyrusArya wrote: »

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

Lets take a look all the stuff available for stam sorc vs every other class.

The only buffs within the sorc tree that relevant to a stam sorc are:
Major resolve (physical resistance)
Major ward (spell resistance)
Major expedition (speed)
Major endurance (stam regen)
Minor resolve (physical resistance)
Major brutality ( wpn power)
aaaand thats about it lol.

You can disregard the major brutality from sorcs because it comes from crit surge and we all know healing off of crits in pvp is not viable. Rally is 1000000x better.

The extra stam regen is nice BUT you need an ability slotted. Ive never heard of a viable stam sorc pet build so your only options are bound armaments or atronach.
Thats a tough choice. Give up 2 slots on ur bars, or give up and ultimate(or two ultimates if you want regen even after switching bars). GG

So all theres left is speed and resistances. However, every other class has access to resistance buffs. NB, DK, And Temp all have resistance buffs.
That leaves speed as the only unique buff within the sorc tree that is relevant to stam sorcs....

And yet the combat team calls this balance??
And lets not forget the new Hurricane no longer procs disintegrate and still lasts 15 seconds....

Every other class has better stuff like
Major defile
Major mending
Major breach
Major fracture

that doesnt require you to give up bar slots and/or ultimate slots.
98% of sorc passives benefit magicka sorcs and their pets more than stam sorc...
Only 2 abilities have stam morphs...

Ill end my thoughts by saying that Hurricane will be just as useless as Crystal Blast.

While I'm not disagreeing that stam sorc could deserve some more love, you're overlooking one major buff they got and that is the change to negate and silencing. Stam sorcs can absolutely murder magicka builds with that ability now, in a way other stam builds cannot. I can see it being extremely useful in all types of PvP. Also consider that stam sorcs get the cheapest and also potentially hardest hitting dawn breakers. I wanna roll a stam sorc just to play around with these two ultis.

I agree that dawnbreaker on a stam sorc may be the hardest hitting ult because stam sorcs have the best max stam potential (in theory), but Incapacitating Strike now doing disease may be even more powerful and perhaps the best stamina ult in the game.

But whats the point of having a lot of stam if youre gonna get 1 shotted and out-healed. Stamplars are the hardest thing to kill this patch because of major mending. 1 vigor and theyre back up to 100 a second.

I like the negate changes too but that one is a tough thing to theory craft with since theres alot more i would like to test.
However, i predict it wont be as viable as you think since it costs 192 and one can just step out of it.

As for sorcs having a 3rd bar, how is having a 3rd bar going to provide stam sorcs with more defenses/survivability? Because the only things that you can put and use while in Overload are sorc abilites, guild abilities, and alliance war abilities, none of which give any significant buffs.

Minalan

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

I'm ok with a 6 second ward in pvp, but it's far too short for pve. Can you not battle spirit it? So we get a 6 second ward for pvp and a 20 second ward for pve. I'm also pretty damn sore that annulment got buffed. What were you thinking?? Reverse this change please!

Let me quantify the stupidity of this, in case anyone missed this:

Harness Magicka procs frags.
Harness Magicka is about the same size and duration as hardened ward.
Harness Magicka can be cast while hidden, not many people know that. Hardened Ward reveals you.
Harness Magicka returns Magicka, absorbing spell damage, Hardened Ward doesn't.
Harness Magicka absorbs physical damage, just like Hardened Ward.

That's ridiculous, and an obvious giveaway to Magicka nightblades. That's fine, but we have a non class ability that is better than our class skill, which we would be better off using.

Increase the duration of Hardened Ward please. 10 seconds for hardened. 12 for the pet ward morph so that we don't completely screw per builds over.

You misunderstood; I'm sore cos every magicka class now has access to a ward that is potentially better than hardened ward. I haven't been on pts yet so I could be wrong, so I'm not that sore yet.

'Potentially'?

I'll be on PTS tonight to look at this cluster****.

Thal

I think others have mentioned the idea of a spell sword for stamina sorc - rather than a stamina ability that seems to never come, we could instead go with a magic buff that charges your stamina attacks with lightning, giving 20% chance to electrocute enemies, knocking them down for 2 seconds and dealing lightning damage. Attacks also "splash" lightning damage for 10% of damage dealt to nearby enemies. Applies minor force buff.

Seems fun

CyrusArya

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

I agree that dawnbreaker on a stam sorc may be the hardest hitting ult because stam sorcs have the best max stam potential (in theory), but Incapacitating Strike now doing disease may be even more powerful and perhaps the best stamina ult in the game.

But whats the point of having a lot of stam if youre gonna get 1 shotted and out-healed. Stamplars are the hardest thing to kill this patch because of major mending. 1 vigor and theyre back up to 100 a second.

I like the negate changes too but that one is a tough thing to theory craft with since theres alot more i would like to test.
However, i predict it wont be as viable as you think since it costs 192 and one can just step out of it.

It's true it's quite expensive and one can just walk out of it, but that's only if you think about the skill in a vacuum. In the heat of battle, wether that be a duel or just open world, I really can see this skill catching people extremely off guard. Don't sleep on the ability to completely shut down magicka builds independent of CC immunity. Or in other words, the thought of getting ccd inside a 12 second negate should be terrifying to any magika build. Due to the nature of stamina burst vs magika sorc burst, I can honestly see this ulti being even better on stam builds than magicka builds in solo or small scale PvP/duels. It might be expensive, but it's a bigger game changer than anything else that comes to mind.


In groups it will be absolutely brutal either way. Caltrops/negate/hurricane/steel tornado comes across to me as one of the most fun and deadly combos in this zergs on steroids meta we're currently playing. Of course this is all in theory and I've yet to test it out, but I think it looks quite promising. Maybe not as good as other classes, but it still something!

In regards to the third bar, you can't think of just one non weapon ability that might aide survivability on a stamina build? The new bone shield alone makes that bar useful, especially if you're good at cancelling the overload animation. It allows you to run a wider variety of builds than other classes on various weapon sets. My DK for example would kill for just one extra slot so I could run Rapids on a 2h/sword and board build. But instead I'm forced to run a bow or compromise my dps/survivability for mobility. That's just one example, but you get the idea

Armann

We've been asking for a stam crystal shard morph for ages, not gonna happen folks. Push for changes where they might actually happen, like Bound Armor.

I'd like to see them do something cool with Bound Armor as currently it's a boring skill, in DB we won't even have the visuals. Keep the passive bonuses when slotted and when you activate the skill it will show the visuals while the active effect is on.

Bound Aegis
Activating this will apply a damage shield equal to % of attribute that will refresh every x second for x seconds.

Bound Armaments
Activating this will summon 2 daedric blades that will attack targets within x meters of the caster.

These are just examples but you get the idea and would make Bound Armor more fun to use compared to what it currently does.

Another skill that I want to see brought more into use again is Ball of Lightning, give it the Eclipse treatment that Templars got and let it absorb all projectiles.

dodgehopper_ESO

GreatWhite000 wrote: »

Stam sorcs still lack support in the class passives and boundless storm will still be preferred in PvP for the extra speed (and PvE stam sorcs will still be a joke as far as trials and whatnot go).

The nerf to magicka sorc shields (hardened ward) is huge and is going to result in a giant loss of survivability for sorcs, especially in PvP where sorcs are really squishy without their shields up.

Overall, I'm really sad that mag sorcs got such a nerf and that stam sorcs didn't get the buff they were promised. I think I'm gonna go ahead and delete my stam sorc on live because it's such a pointless waste of a character slot (and potential).

Actually Stam Sorcs have some good class passives. Sorcs have great passive regeneration (20% health/stam and 10% mag). Bound Armaments is nice but its problem is that its a toggle and not a clicky. The weapon damage bonus you can get from being a Storc is rather nice as well. All that being said I do think they could stand to improve in other areas like Surge for instance.

dodgehopper_ESO

Armann wrote: »

We've been asking for a stam crystal shard morph for ages, not gonna happen folks. Push for changes where they might actually happen, like Bound Armor.

I'd like to see them do something cool with Bound Armor as currently it's a boring skill, in DB we won't even have the visuals. Keep the passive bonuses when slotted and when you activate the skill it will show the visuals while the active effect is on.

Bound Aegis
Activating this will apply a damage shield equal to % of attribute that will refresh every x second for x seconds.

Bound Armaments
Activating this will summon 2 daedric blades that will attack targets within x meters of the caster.

These are just examples but you get the idea and would make Bound Armor more fun to use compared to what it currently does.

Another skill that I want to see brought more into use again is Ball of Lightning, give it the Eclipse treatment that Templars got and let it absorb all projectiles.

Interesting idea on the clicky Bound skill. This is more in line with what I'm thinking as well.

PainfulFAFA

CyrusArya wrote: »

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

I agree that dawnbreaker on a stam sorc may be the hardest hitting ult because stam sorcs have the best max stam potential (in theory), but Incapacitating Strike now doing disease may be even more powerful and perhaps the best stamina ult in the game.

But whats the point of having a lot of stam if youre gonna get 1 shotted and out-healed. Stamplars are the hardest thing to kill this patch because of major mending. 1 vigor and theyre back up to 100 a second.

I like the negate changes too but that one is a tough thing to theory craft with since theres alot more i would like to test.
However, i predict it wont be as viable as you think since it costs 192 and one can just step out of it.

It's true it's quite expensive and one can just walk out of it, but that's only if you think about the skill in a vacuum. In the heat of battle, wether that be a duel or just open world, I really can see this skill catching people extremely off guard. Don't sleep on the ability to completely shut down magicka builds independent of CC immunity. Or in other words, the thought of getting ccd inside a 12 second negate should be terrifying to any magika build. Due to the nature of stamina burst vs magika sorc burst, I can honestly see this ulti being even better on stam builds than magicka builds in solo or small scale PvP/duels. It might be expensive, but it's a bigger game changer than anything else that comes to mind.

The only way i see negate being a big game changer, is if the silence effect is still on them even after they step out of it forcing them to double CC break (if i used another CC combined with the silence).

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

GreatWhite000 wrote: »

Stam sorcs still lack support in the class passives and boundless storm will still be preferred in PvP for the extra speed (and PvE stam sorcs will still be a joke as far as trials and whatnot go).

The nerf to magicka sorc shields (hardened ward) is huge and is going to result in a giant loss of survivability for sorcs, especially in PvP where sorcs are really squishy without their shields up.

Overall, I'm really sad that mag sorcs got such a nerf and that stam sorcs didn't get the buff they were promised. I think I'm gonna go ahead and delete my stam sorc on live because it's such a pointless waste of a character slot (and potential).

Actually Stam Sorcs have some good class passives. Sorcs have great passive regeneration (20% health/stam and 10% mag). Bound Armaments is nice but its problem is that its a toggle and not a clicky. The weapon damage bonus you can get from being a Storc is rather nice as well. All that being said I do think they could stand to improve in other areas like Surge for instance.

The problem with Bound armaments is not only the toggle.
Its the fact that you are forced into giving up 2 slots, sacrificing good Ults, or splitting it up (1 ultimate, 1 slot). THEN the toggle becomes a problem since it toggles off every time you swap! ><

Kattatonia

I think we all understand that the changes to shields was done primarily for PvP purposes, but it's very unfair to those of us who enjoy PvE. I can't even rez a player before my shields go off. That's kind of insane, and unreasonable.

I don't see the problem in reducing them to 10 or 12 seconds for Cyrodiil, but in PvE? 6 Seconds? I honestly don't know what to think.

I have defended this game to my friends and guildies. I have said they need to be patient - that things will get better, but this change has very nearly lost me as a player. THREE of my V16 toons are Sorcs, and I am pretty heartbroken that this shield thing is even a half-way serious consideration. It's just not reasonable.

Through all the changes, I have never, EVER complained, until now. I really want to keep playing my sorcs, as they're my favorite class, but this change may cause me to abandon them altogether.

Yo_Donno

It seems like most people are ecstatic about the changes to the new Hurricane and Negate magic. The problem lies in the shields. By reading all 9 pages of this thread I have come to this conclusion:

Great job with Negate Magic, I love that this ability is now a viable option in PVP and PVE alike. Stam Sorcs could definitely use a little more love but– I love the changes to Hurricane; its definitely a step in the right direction.

I'm not sure what caused ZOS to think that nerfing shields was necessary but I do think complaints from people who main in other classes played a significant role in this. There are certainly things about shield stacking that are different from the defense mechanisms of other classes, but it's not better. People who complain about shield stacking have obviously never played as a Sorc and noticed how annoying it is to get a Nightblade to low health only to have them cloak, run away, regain their resources and have the power to decide if they want to start the fight over or not. They don't understand how annoying it is to watch helplessly as your own Crystal Frag, built for max damage is reflected back at you using Reflective Scales knocks you down, halves your health and makes you susceptible to a wrecking blow spam till you're dead. To watch a Templar BoL spam until his friend comes to save him. All this and the only two classes whose defenses were nerfed in PVP would be Templars and Sorcs. Now, dropping the duration of a Sorc's shields has little effect in PVP; They only lasted for about 6 seconds anyway. It doesn't address the unjustifiable complaints at all, while making Sorcs the most useless class for PVE raids and dungeons.

Granted, using a Sorc in PVE with 20 second shields is a little easier than any other class, but dropping the shield duration by over 3 times what it used to be forces a Sorc to choose: Will I try not to get one-shotted by a wet napkin or will I try to actually have some sustainable DPS? You used to be able to have both, at a slightly higher rate than any other class, but now you are easily out survived by a Nightblade running a rudimentary siphon heal and spamming Teleport Strikes with damage output at 20k per strike.

I like most of the changes ZoS has made this patch. Poison making is amazing. Dark Brotherhood looks awesome. I can't speak for the other classes cause all my Vet Characters are Sorcs. The only change you've made that I really take issue with is the shield duration.

I really love to play as a Sorc, it's my favorite class by far and I will be sad if my Vet 16s are all rendered useless. I won't threaten to leave this game or re-roll (Cause let's be honest nobody cares) or cause any other problems because I love this game and I still have hope for it. The only thing I will do is spam this thread in the hopes that someone will hear me and consider what they're doing to Sorcs in PVE, before they get so eager to make sure they aren't as powerful in PVP.

bloodenragedb14_ESO

[

Yo_Donno wrote: »

It seems like most people are ecstatic about the changes to the new Hurricane and Negate magic. The problem lies in the shields. By reading all 9 pages of this thread I have come to this conclusion:

Great job with Negate Magic, I love that this ability is now a viable option in PVP and PVE alike. Stam Sorcs could definitely use a little more love but– I love the changes to Hurricane; its definitely a step in the right direction.

I'm not sure what caused ZOS to think that nerfing shields was necessary but I do think complaints from people who main in other classes played a significant role in this. There are certainly things about shield stacking that are different from the defense mechanisms of other classes, but it's not better. People who complain about shield stacking have obviously never played as a Sorc and noticed how annoying it is to get a Nightblade to low health only to have them cloak, run away, regain their resources and have the power to decide if they want to start the fight over or not. They don't understand how annoying it is to watch helplessly as your own Crystal Frag, built for max damage is reflected back at you using Reflective Scales knocks you down, halves your health and makes you susceptible to a wrecking blow spam till you're dead. To watch a Templar BoL spam until his friend comes to save him. All this and the only two classes whose defenses were nerfed in PVP would be Templars and Sorcs. Now, dropping the duration of a Sorc's shields has little effect in PVP; They only lasted for about 6 seconds anyway. It doesn't address the unjustifiable complaints at all, while making Sorcs the most useless class for PVE raids and dungeons.

Granted, using a Sorc in PVE with 20 second shields is a little easier than any other class, but dropping the shield duration by over 3 times what it used to be forces a Sorc to choose: Will I try not to get one-shotted by a wet napkin or will I try to actually have some sustainable DPS? You used to be able to have both, at a slightly higher rate than any other class, but now you are easily out survived by a Nightblade running a rudimentary siphon heal and spamming Teleport Strikes with damage output at 20k per strike.

I like most of the changes ZoS has made this patch. Poison making is amazing. Dark Brotherhood looks awesome. I can't speak for the other classes cause all my Vet Characters are Sorcs. The only change you've made that I really take issue with is the shield duration.

I really love to play as a Sorc, it's my favorite class by far and I will be sad if my Vet 16s are all rendered useless. I won't threaten to leave this game or cause any other problems other than spamming this thread in the hopes that someone will hear and consider what they're doing to Sorcs in PVE, before they get so eager to make sure they aren't as powerful in PVP.

Could not have said it better myself.......if i tried i might have come off far more irritated and angry ((mind numbingly so)) than you did, so bravo for keeping your cool and explaining things in a way i have been struggling to do throughout this entire ordeal

Tyrannitar

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

GreatWhite000 wrote: »

Stam sorcs still lack support in the class passives and boundless storm will still be preferred in PvP for the extra speed (and PvE stam sorcs will still be a joke as far as trials and whatnot go).

The nerf to magicka sorc shields (hardened ward) is huge and is going to result in a giant loss of survivability for sorcs, especially in PvP where sorcs are really squishy without their shields up.

Overall, I'm really sad that mag sorcs got such a nerf and that stam sorcs didn't get the buff they were promised. I think I'm gonna go ahead and delete my stam sorc on live because it's such a pointless waste of a character slot (and potential).

Actually Stam Sorcs have some good class passives. Sorcs have great passive regeneration (20% health/stam and 10% mag). Bound Armaments is nice but its problem is that its a toggle and not a clicky. The weapon damage bonus you can get from being a Storc is rather nice as well. All that being said I do think they could stand to improve in other areas like Surge for instance.

Do you run a stam sorc? Our class passives are decent, but our endgame dps isn't. Like not even a little. I run 3.8k weap dmg, 83% weapon crit, and have 2k regen. Even if I ran warrior over thief, that's 4.1k weap dmg and 65% weapon crit. I can only pull 26k dps with the first build. That doesn't make sense to me.

I see stam DKS and nbs pulling insane DPS #s single target in SO, MoL, even DSA and although I've put in the time and have the skill, my class specialization simply can't pull their numbers. They got buffed, and our only spammable dps just got the cc removed from it.

Buffs for everyone except sorc it seems... >.>

SonOfSune

I really hope this 6 second shield nerf does not hold. I also do not believe increasing to something like 10 or 12 seconds will be much better. Especially since reducing the duration addresses the concerns I have heard.

This feels like a quick and dirty band-aid "fix". What I am hearing from some players is that Shield "stacking" is the issue. Being able to overlay multiple shields is two powerful.

Seems then a real solution would be making it so some shields cannot stack i.e. Hardened Ward and Harness Magicka using the same major and minor buff system used for like armor buffs. This seems like a much better solution, though I assume more difficult to implement.

If you are looking for a quick and dirty fix make shields critable. Either way... this is not the fix.

americansteel

psychotic13 wrote: »

americansteel wrote: »

ButtersEP wrote: »

Wards aren't that strong in Cyrodiil..(already nerfed 50% in Cyrodiil) mainly why I do not PVP only PVE with my Sorc, Sorcs are actually the lowest sustained DPS in the game (not by much) I say this based off a lot (several dozen Blood Spawn Test) across a lot of different end game players (a couple dozen) my trials guild run these tests weekly many of which are top 50 players on the Vmsa weeklys.

With no ultimate's, sustained DPS only currently Mag DK's are number 1, followed by Mag NB's, then Mag Templars then Sorcs, Obviously this changes a bit with ultimate's but overload is not always forever.

This may seem off topic from the ward thread but since Sorcs will need to put more points in health and have a lower Magic pool, that sustained DPS number will be even lower, even more of a DPS loss when having to re-ward a lot.

And correct me if I am wrong Sorc self heals only come from a critical hit with power surge only? Templars & NB's self heal automatically by just well, attacking, DK's can heal as needed, Frags do not always Proc.. and power surge runs out...

I have every kind of character so I can play other classes, I am not so much complaining just pointing some things out.

all wards except hardened ward are uselless.

sorcs have stupid op dps, mobility, pets, OVERLOAD, mines. youre tankier than a HA DK tank and that should not be nor is it fair.

hide behind 3 shields are you afraid to die?

mag DKs still hit like a wet noodle! apply dots my stamplar already killed you.

dont get me started on night blades.

sorcerers bring a massive imbalance to pvp.

God I hate idiots, that's how sorcs work. What class are you?

NB ? You cloak cause you're too afraid to die?
DK ? You reflect cause you're to afraid to die?
Templar? You BoL cause you're afraid to die?

Stop being such a hypocrite and making yourself look stupid, stfu.

god i hate nimrods, DPS right through BoL. the heal is a joke for offense! grow a spine. nuff said rager.

Rylana

Thelon wrote: »

Bad Sorcs be like



Good Sorcs be like

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