Spy Addon Group Damage

Xexpo

Bluepitbull13 wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Bluepitbull13 wrote: »

.

unbuffed or buffed?

Buffed ofc, you don't want to get kicked from the party right?

Bluepitbull13

kaer426 wrote: »

Bluepitbull13 wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Bluepitbull13 wrote: »

.

unbuffed or buffed?

Buffed ofc, you don't want to get kicked from the party right?

code65536

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

On the other hand, what was the value added by GD in this run ? NONE.

In a scenario like this, it told us nothing we didn't already know, but this is also the kind of scenario around which much of this theoretical-kicking drama is centered. But there are plenty of scenarios where it's much more useful. Or hell, even just fun.

anitajoneb17_ESO

Bluepitbull13 wrote: »

unbuffed or buffed?

HHHmmmm... provided the character hasn't yet vomited his entire buff food and drink over GroupDamage, I'd say buffed...
(#threadisdying) ;-)

.

Valen_Byte

timidobserver wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

I believe some people can be jerks enough to kick someone for supposedly low DPS EVEN if it's higher than theirs.

I'm sorry, but that's just preposterous.

First, if someone really does stoop that low, I doubt that the existence or non-existence of this addon would affect their behavior or change anything.

Second, who are these mythical uber-jerks that you keep bringing up? Are they really that common, as you seem to suggest? Your tirades against this addon are premised on the behavior of a tiny, rare minority--people who would continue to be jerks with or without such an addon, I might add.

People I met ingame.

[mylife] I'm over 40. Dungeon Master (1987) was my first game. Skyrim (2011) was my 2nd game. ESO is my 3rd game. [/mylife]
In other words, I'm not used to the rude and violent (though harmless) way the younger generation uses nowadays (generation thing like in any generation). I haven't developed a "thicker skin" like many of you might have in other MMOs, and my "standards" might not exactly match those of the "standard MMO player". I'm not telling you this to bore you or anything, nor to say that my point of view is more valid than anyone else's, but just to put it in some kind of context. Starting ESO, I chose a sorcerer because it sounded cool, had no idea what "class" meant or implied, thought it was some kind of RP-archetype.

I *know* that there's many of us around here with a similar profile : not familiar with MMOs, not even gamers, but so hooked by TES5 that we went to ESO for the sake of "Elder Scrolls" ("Skyrim 2"...). Stayed because I love the game, and because of my guild, which is also a haven for people who, like me, cannot cope or better said, don't want to have to cope with everyday's violence / competition in the game, even though it's "normal" in MMOs ... "just ignore them" is not good enough for people like me, we want to be protected. Tamriel is an escape world, I don't want to be confronted with standard jerkiness ingame.

I know ZOS takes care of people like me : TES fans coming from solo games but potentially scared by "MMO mentality". And there's A LOT of us around. They just aren't all as "big-mouthed" as I am on forums.

In short : what might sound to you as "harmless/just ignore" is a "no/no" to people like me. For me there are A LOT of those "uber-jerks" in the game. But maybe you wouldn't even see them, you'd just widely ignore them. I can't.
If you're kicked out of a group you'd just sigh and join another group.
If I get kicked out of a group I'd probably log off for an entire week.
That leads to a risk/benefit analysis of such an addon as GroupDamage to be positive for you and negative for me. I listened and understood and even agreed to most of pro-arguments you brought. They just, imho, didn't outweight the risk. Your equation was different : you understand the risks, but you think the benefits are greater than the risks.

Hope this help understanding my position, which I believe to represent quite a lot of players who don't even dare/bother to read/post on forums.

On a side note, I was very, very eagerly expecting the "PvP part of the justice system" which was cancelled, I am very disappointed about that, which is most certainly due to "carebears like me", so you see, I also have to bow to sensitive people, too...

[Waiting for flames now, as every time anyone says something even remotely sincere and personal].

.

It is rare that I run into something that I can't understand on some level. I can't even begin to fathom the amount of emo required to log off the game for a week over being removed from a group.

L2life

Anita is too kind of a person to tell you like it is. So I will.

You are the kind of person that not only do we not need on the forums and game but also in the real world.

You have no compassion. You have such a low self worth that you have to lash out at a kind hearted person just because they had the nerve to stand up for the 'little guys'. You seem to be that kind of guy.

The mentality that people don't matter, that feelings don't matter, is toxic to not only a game that is based around being social, but toxic in the real world.

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt that you are actually not this kind of cold heartless person in real life. (I hope anyway)

Valen_Byte

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

I believe some people can be jerks enough to kick someone for supposedly low DPS EVEN if it's higher than theirs.

I'm sorry, but that's just preposterous.

First, if someone really does stoop that low, I doubt that the existence or non-existence of this addon would affect their behavior or change anything.

Second, who are these mythical uber-jerks that you keep bringing up? Are they really that common, as you seem to suggest? Your tirades against this addon are premised on the behavior of a tiny, rare minority--people who would continue to be jerks with or without such an addon, I might add.

People I met ingame.

[mylife] I'm over 40. Dungeon Master (1987) was my first game. Skyrim (2011) was my 2nd game. ESO is my 3rd game. [/mylife]
In other words, I'm not used to the rude and violent (though harmless) way the younger generation uses nowadays (generation thing like in any generation). I haven't developed a "thicker skin" like many of you might have in other MMOs, and my "standards" might not exactly match those of the "standard MMO player". I'm not telling you this to bore you or anything, nor to say that my point of view is more valid than anyone else's, but just to put it in some kind of context. Starting ESO, I chose a sorcerer because it sounded cool, had no idea what "class" meant or implied, thought it was some kind of RP-archetype.

I *know* that there's many of us around here with a similar profile : not familiar with MMOs, not even gamers, but so hooked by TES5 that we went to ESO for the sake of "Elder Scrolls" ("Skyrim 2"...). Stayed because I love the game, and because of my guild, which is also a haven for people who, like me, cannot cope or better said, don't want to have to cope with everyday's violence / competition in the game, even though it's "normal" in MMOs ... "just ignore them" is not good enough for people like me, we want to be protected. Tamriel is an escape world, I don't want to be confronted with standard jerkiness ingame.

I know ZOS takes care of people like me : TES fans coming from solo games but potentially scared by "MMO mentality". And there's A LOT of us around. They just aren't all as "big-mouthed" as I am on forums.

In short : what might sound to you as "harmless/just ignore" is a "no/no" to people like me. For me there are A LOT of those "uber-jerks" in the game. But maybe you wouldn't even see them, you'd just widely ignore them. I can't.
If you're kicked out of a group you'd just sigh and join another group.
If I get kicked out of a group I'd probably log off for an entire week.
That leads to a risk/benefit analysis of such an addon as GroupDamage to be positive for you and negative for me. I listened and understood and even agreed to most of pro-arguments you brought. They just, imho, didn't outweight the risk. Your equation was different : you understand the risks, but you think the benefits are greater than the risks.

And I don't care how tiny a "minority" these "jerks" are. I say "don't give them an extra gun to use". And blame them for being jerks, not me for fearing them.

Hope this help understanding my position, which I believe to represent quite a lot of players who don't even dare/bother to read/post on forums.

On a side note, I was very, very eagerly expecting the "PvP part of the justice system" which was cancelled, I am very disappointed about that, which is most certainly due to "carebears like me", so you see, I also have to bow to sensitive people, too...



[Waiting for flames now, as every time anyone says something even remotely sincere and personal].

.

If you happen to play AD on PC. You are the kind of person that BYTE would love have join our ranks. We play on blackwater with the goal being to have fun and help new players. You can message me here or in game @stoobzz.

Good luck to you. See you in Tamriel!

sadownik

Valen_Byte wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

I believe some people can be jerks enough to kick someone for supposedly low DPS EVEN if it's higher than theirs.

I'm sorry, but that's just preposterous.

First, if someone really does stoop that low, I doubt that the existence or non-existence of this addon would affect their behavior or change anything.

Second, who are these mythical uber-jerks that you keep bringing up? Are they really that common, as you seem to suggest? Your tirades against this addon are premised on the behavior of a tiny, rare minority--people who would continue to be jerks with or without such an addon, I might add.

People I met ingame.

[mylife] I'm over 40. Dungeon Master (1987) was my first game. Skyrim (2011) was my 2nd game. ESO is my 3rd game. [/mylife]
In other words, I'm not used to the rude and violent (though harmless) way the younger generation uses nowadays (generation thing like in any generation). I haven't developed a "thicker skin" like many of you might have in other MMOs, and my "standards" might not exactly match those of the "standard MMO player". I'm not telling you this to bore you or anything, nor to say that my point of view is more valid than anyone else's, but just to put it in some kind of context. Starting ESO, I chose a sorcerer because it sounded cool, had no idea what "class" meant or implied, thought it was some kind of RP-archetype.

I *know* that there's many of us around here with a similar profile : not familiar with MMOs, not even gamers, but so hooked by TES5 that we went to ESO for the sake of "Elder Scrolls" ("Skyrim 2"...). Stayed because I love the game, and because of my guild, which is also a haven for people who, like me, cannot cope or better said, don't want to have to cope with everyday's violence / competition in the game, even though it's "normal" in MMOs ... "just ignore them" is not good enough for people like me, we want to be protected. Tamriel is an escape world, I don't want to be confronted with standard jerkiness ingame.

I know ZOS takes care of people like me : TES fans coming from solo games but potentially scared by "MMO mentality". And there's A LOT of us around. They just aren't all as "big-mouthed" as I am on forums.

In short : what might sound to you as "harmless/just ignore" is a "no/no" to people like me. For me there are A LOT of those "uber-jerks" in the game. But maybe you wouldn't even see them, you'd just widely ignore them. I can't.
If you're kicked out of a group you'd just sigh and join another group.
If I get kicked out of a group I'd probably log off for an entire week.
That leads to a risk/benefit analysis of such an addon as GroupDamage to be positive for you and negative for me. I listened and understood and even agreed to most of pro-arguments you brought. They just, imho, didn't outweight the risk. Your equation was different : you understand the risks, but you think the benefits are greater than the risks.

Hope this help understanding my position, which I believe to represent quite a lot of players who don't even dare/bother to read/post on forums.

On a side note, I was very, very eagerly expecting the "PvP part of the justice system" which was cancelled, I am very disappointed about that, which is most certainly due to "carebears like me", so you see, I also have to bow to sensitive people, too...

[Waiting for flames now, as every time anyone says something even remotely sincere and personal].

.

It is rare that I run into something that I can't understand on some level. I can't even begin to fathom the amount of emo required to log off the game for a week over being removed from a group.

L2life

Anita is too kind of a person to tell you like it is. So I will.

You are the kind of person that not only do we not need on the forums and game but also in the real world.

You have no compassion. You have such a low self worth that you have to lash out at a kind hearted person just because they had the nerve to stand up for the 'little guys'. You seem to be that kind of guy.

The mentality that people don't matter, that feelings don't matter, is toxic to not only a game that is based around being social, but toxic in the real world.

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt that you are actually not this kind of cold heartless person in real life. (I hope anyway)

I cannot phatom what stands behind that message? What wounded mind would treat such incident in the way described. Why the drama? Are you both from some kind of shelterd community? Dont you know that contrary to some people beliefs some people out there are simply a@@holes?

And it might sound shocking but they still be a@@holes without that add on.

I really dont like the direction this game heads. Im far from top players, hell i dont play at all lately but i didnt mind getting kicked from pug because i sucked - it just made me to try get better.

Is this what the game is bound to become?

Jaeysa

@anitajoneb17_ESO - where is the mention of violence coming up? Most people have agreed there are jerks, but being kicked unjustly from a group isn't violent. It fricken sucks, but it's not violent. I understand your views to a certain extent, though I can't really wrap my head around logging off for an entire week just because of one or two bad apples.

timidobserver

Valen_Byte wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

I believe some people can be jerks enough to kick someone for supposedly low DPS EVEN if it's higher than theirs.

I'm sorry, but that's just preposterous.

First, if someone really does stoop that low, I doubt that the existence or non-existence of this addon would affect their behavior or change anything.

Second, who are these mythical uber-jerks that you keep bringing up? Are they really that common, as you seem to suggest? Your tirades against this addon are premised on the behavior of a tiny, rare minority--people who would continue to be jerks with or without such an addon, I might add.

People I met ingame.

[mylife] I'm over 40. Dungeon Master (1987) was my first game. Skyrim (2011) was my 2nd game. ESO is my 3rd game. [/mylife]
In other words, I'm not used to the rude and violent (though harmless) way the younger generation uses nowadays (generation thing like in any generation). I haven't developed a "thicker skin" like many of you might have in other MMOs, and my "standards" might not exactly match those of the "standard MMO player". I'm not telling you this to bore you or anything, nor to say that my point of view is more valid than anyone else's, but just to put it in some kind of context. Starting ESO, I chose a sorcerer because it sounded cool, had no idea what "class" meant or implied, thought it was some kind of RP-archetype.

I *know* that there's many of us around here with a similar profile : not familiar with MMOs, not even gamers, but so hooked by TES5 that we went to ESO for the sake of "Elder Scrolls" ("Skyrim 2"...). Stayed because I love the game, and because of my guild, which is also a haven for people who, like me, cannot cope or better said, don't want to have to cope with everyday's violence / competition in the game, even though it's "normal" in MMOs ... "just ignore them" is not good enough for people like me, we want to be protected. Tamriel is an escape world, I don't want to be confronted with standard jerkiness ingame.

I know ZOS takes care of people like me : TES fans coming from solo games but potentially scared by "MMO mentality". And there's A LOT of us around. They just aren't all as "big-mouthed" as I am on forums.

In short : what might sound to you as "harmless/just ignore" is a "no/no" to people like me. For me there are A LOT of those "uber-jerks" in the game. But maybe you wouldn't even see them, you'd just widely ignore them. I can't.
If you're kicked out of a group you'd just sigh and join another group.
If I get kicked out of a group I'd probably log off for an entire week.
That leads to a risk/benefit analysis of such an addon as GroupDamage to be positive for you and negative for me. I listened and understood and even agreed to most of pro-arguments you brought. They just, imho, didn't outweight the risk. Your equation was different : you understand the risks, but you think the benefits are greater than the risks.

Hope this help understanding my position, which I believe to represent quite a lot of players who don't even dare/bother to read/post on forums.

On a side note, I was very, very eagerly expecting the "PvP part of the justice system" which was cancelled, I am very disappointed about that, which is most certainly due to "carebears like me", so you see, I also have to bow to sensitive people, too...

[Waiting for flames now, as every time anyone says something even remotely sincere and personal].

.

It is rare that I run into something that I can't understand on some level. I can't even begin to fathom the amount of emo required to log off the game for a week over being removed from a group.

L2life

Anita is too kind of a person to tell you like it is. So I will.

You are the kind of person that not only do we not need on the forums and game but also in the real world.

You have no compassion. You have such a low self worth that you have to lash out at a kind hearted person just because they had the nerve to stand up for the 'little guys'. You seem to be that kind of guy.

The mentality that people don't matter, that feelings don't matter, is toxic to not only a game that is based around being social, but toxic in the real world.

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt that you are actually not this kind of cold heartless person in real life. (I hope anyway)

So, it makes me some kind of cold, evil, heartless, person with no compassion that thinks people and feelings don't matter because I think it is utterly ridiculous to ragequit the game for a week over being removed from a group. Okay, I guess that makes sense .

anitajoneb17_ESO

Jaeysa wrote: »

@anitajoneb17_ESO - where is the mention of violence coming up? Most people have agreed there are jerks, but being kicked unjustly from a group isn't violent. It fricken sucks, but it's not violent. I understand your views to a certain extent, though I can't really wrap my head around logging off for an entire week just because of one or two bad apples.

@Valen_Byte : well thank you very much for your support and recognition, that's very nice. I play on PC/EU/DC so I guess I cannot join your guild but thank you very much anyway.

@Jaeysa : not sure how to answer this... I could give examples, but then everyone would comment "this is ok, this isn't, in my book... bla bla bla" and it would all go bad.
Let's just mention that "logging off for a week" doesn't necessarily mean "hiding under your quilt crying", but simply "I don't play a game to be confronted to such a**h**, let's play something else or do something else with my free time" (healthy reaction). It can also mean "I suck too much at this game, people don't want me, I'd better go play something else" (less healthy reaction). The problem is that in both cases, the player is gone... players leaving is not good for the game.

As to "violence"... I guess you know that "violence" is not only defined by the physical wounds it leaves... and since we're in a video game, obviously noone is physically hurt... still words and attitudes can hurt a lot. Not always intentionnally (many cultures, backgrounds, generations, mixed in such a game). There are also people who enjoy hurting others, just like IRL (but there are enough of them IRL, don't want to be confronted with this again in a game).

I enjoy PvP but I switch off whispers whenever I PvP. Hate whispers or humiliating do hurt me no matter how I rationalize them.
I could avoid the LFG tool altogether but then... if everyone like me does this, LFG PUGs are just gonna be a bunch of a**h** and agressive people mixed with thick-skinned nice people ?? ... and many people will leave after completing all soloable content just because the LFG tool isn't welcoming ?

There's also the risk of the "I'm sensitive" dictature, so I understand that it's hard to set up a standard, which in turn should not be *my* standard. But everyone could at least be careful to talk or act in the game like if everyone was worth getting to know first, it would make life a bit easier, I guess. You can "bro" and /rekt and *moth**fu**er" and kick your best friend as much as you like, but some more distance is welcome with strangers until you know them better.

.

anitajoneb17_ESO

timidobserver wrote: »

So, it makes me some kind of cold, evil, heartless, person with no compassion that thinks people and feelings don't matter because I think it is utterly ridiculous to ragequit the game for a week over being removed from a group. Okay, I guess that makes sense .

Just think about it. It does make sense.

.

Jaeysa

@anitajoneb17_ESO

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

There's also the risk of the "I'm sensitive" dictature, so I understand that it's hard to set up a standard, which in turn should not be *my* standard. But everyone could at least be careful to talk or act in the game like if everyone was worth getting to know first, it would make life a bit easier, I guess. You can "bro" and /rekt and *moth**fu**er" and kick your best friend as much as you like, but some more distance is welcome with strangers until you know them better.

You should talk to zone chat more than PuGs. By and large PuGs have been quiet(majority), friendly(large minority), or hostile(small minority). Instead of punishing the first two, perhaps reports should be answered timely and people should use them against those who are deserving.

As for you being sensitive? Eh....to me you are, but I'd rather people say what they mean than hide it because they feel people are going to jump/gaslight them.

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

As to "violence"... I guess you know that "violence" is not only defined by the physical wounds it leaves... and since we're in a video game, obviously noone is physically hurt... still words and attitudes can hurt a lot. Not always intentionnally (many cultures, backgrounds, generations, mixed in such a game). There are also people who enjoy hurting others, just like IRL (but there are enough of them IRL, don't want to be confronted with this again in a game).

I think of violence in video games to be things like stalking and direct/veiled threats. Which happens, hasn't happened to me on ESO but it's happened in wow. People saying that I suck(has happened. Has also been correct at times) might hurt my feelings but doesn't make me fear for my safety.

timidobserver

sadownik wrote: »

Valen_Byte wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

I believe some people can be jerks enough to kick someone for supposedly low DPS EVEN if it's higher than theirs.

I'm sorry, but that's just preposterous.

First, if someone really does stoop that low, I doubt that the existence or non-existence of this addon would affect their behavior or change anything.

Second, who are these mythical uber-jerks that you keep bringing up? Are they really that common, as you seem to suggest? Your tirades against this addon are premised on the behavior of a tiny, rare minority--people who would continue to be jerks with or without such an addon, I might add.

People I met ingame.

[mylife] I'm over 40. Dungeon Master (1987) was my first game. Skyrim (2011) was my 2nd game. ESO is my 3rd game. [/mylife]
In other words, I'm not used to the rude and violent (though harmless) way the younger generation uses nowadays (generation thing like in any generation). I haven't developed a "thicker skin" like many of you might have in other MMOs, and my "standards" might not exactly match those of the "standard MMO player". I'm not telling you this to bore you or anything, nor to say that my point of view is more valid than anyone else's, but just to put it in some kind of context. Starting ESO, I chose a sorcerer because it sounded cool, had no idea what "class" meant or implied, thought it was some kind of RP-archetype.

I *know* that there's many of us around here with a similar profile : not familiar with MMOs, not even gamers, but so hooked by TES5 that we went to ESO for the sake of "Elder Scrolls" ("Skyrim 2"...). Stayed because I love the game, and because of my guild, which is also a haven for people who, like me, cannot cope or better said, don't want to have to cope with everyday's violence / competition in the game, even though it's "normal" in MMOs ... "just ignore them" is not good enough for people like me, we want to be protected. Tamriel is an escape world, I don't want to be confronted with standard jerkiness ingame.

I know ZOS takes care of people like me : TES fans coming from solo games but potentially scared by "MMO mentality". And there's A LOT of us around. They just aren't all as "big-mouthed" as I am on forums.

In short : what might sound to you as "harmless/just ignore" is a "no/no" to people like me. For me there are A LOT of those "uber-jerks" in the game. But maybe you wouldn't even see them, you'd just widely ignore them. I can't.
If you're kicked out of a group you'd just sigh and join another group.
If I get kicked out of a group I'd probably log off for an entire week.
That leads to a risk/benefit analysis of such an addon as GroupDamage to be positive for you and negative for me. I listened and understood and even agreed to most of pro-arguments you brought. They just, imho, didn't outweight the risk. Your equation was different : you understand the risks, but you think the benefits are greater than the risks.

Hope this help understanding my position, which I believe to represent quite a lot of players who don't even dare/bother to read/post on forums.

On a side note, I was very, very eagerly expecting the "PvP part of the justice system" which was cancelled, I am very disappointed about that, which is most certainly due to "carebears like me", so you see, I also have to bow to sensitive people, too...

[Waiting for flames now, as every time anyone says something even remotely sincere and personal].

.

It is rare that I run into something that I can't understand on some level. I can't even begin to fathom the amount of emo required to log off the game for a week over being removed from a group.

L2life

Anita is too kind of a person to tell you like it is. So I will.

You are the kind of person that not only do we not need on the forums and game but also in the real world.

You have no compassion. You have such a low self worth that you have to lash out at a kind hearted person just because they had the nerve to stand up for the 'little guys'. You seem to be that kind of guy.

The mentality that people don't matter, that feelings don't matter, is toxic to not only a game that is based around being social, but toxic in the real world.

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt that you are actually not this kind of cold heartless person in real life. (I hope anyway)

I cannot phatom what stands behind that message? What wounded mind would treat such incident in the way described. Why the drama? Are you both from some kind of shelterd community? Dont you know that contrary to some people beliefs some people out there are simply a@@holes?

And it might sound shocking but they still be a@@holes without that add on.

I really dont like the direction this game heads. Im far from top players, hell i dont play at all lately but i didnt mind getting kicked from pug because i sucked - it just made me to try get better.

Is this what the game is bound to become?

Yup I agree.

In ESO, some people have the most interesting reasons for kicking people from groups. For example, I watched a guy sit there for like 15 minutes kicking over 50 people from a group because they wanted group finder to put their friend from another alliance in the group. No one should be ragequitting the game because they ran into someone like this in the group finder.

If someone is emotionally sensitive enough to ragequit the game for a week over being kicked from a group, they should be battling for a group kick vote system, in which everyone has to agree in order to kick someone, rather than waging war against an addon.

Jaeysa

timidobserver wrote: »

In ESO, some people have the most interesting reasons for kicking people from groups. For example, I watched a guy sit there for like 15 minutes kicking over 50 people from a group because they wanted group finder to put their friend from another alliance in the group. No one should be ragequitting the game because they ran into someone like this in the group finder.

If someone is emotionally sensitive enough to ragequit the game for a week over being kicked from a group, they should be battling for a group kick vote system, in which everyone has to agree in order to kick someone, rather than waging war against an addon.

This -needs- to happen. I don't understand why it's not in the game.

Valen_Byte

timidobserver wrote: »

Valen_Byte wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

I believe some people can be jerks enough to kick someone for supposedly low DPS EVEN if it's higher than theirs.

I'm sorry, but that's just preposterous.

First, if someone really does stoop that low, I doubt that the existence or non-existence of this addon would affect their behavior or change anything.

Second, who are these mythical uber-jerks that you keep bringing up? Are they really that common, as you seem to suggest? Your tirades against this addon are premised on the behavior of a tiny, rare minority--people who would continue to be jerks with or without such an addon, I might add.

People I met ingame.

[mylife] I'm over 40. Dungeon Master (1987) was my first game. Skyrim (2011) was my 2nd game. ESO is my 3rd game. [/mylife]
In other words, I'm not used to the rude and violent (though harmless) way the younger generation uses nowadays (generation thing like in any generation). I haven't developed a "thicker skin" like many of you might have in other MMOs, and my "standards" might not exactly match those of the "standard MMO player". I'm not telling you this to bore you or anything, nor to say that my point of view is more valid than anyone else's, but just to put it in some kind of context. Starting ESO, I chose a sorcerer because it sounded cool, had no idea what "class" meant or implied, thought it was some kind of RP-archetype.

I *know* that there's many of us around here with a similar profile : not familiar with MMOs, not even gamers, but so hooked by TES5 that we went to ESO for the sake of "Elder Scrolls" ("Skyrim 2"...). Stayed because I love the game, and because of my guild, which is also a haven for people who, like me, cannot cope or better said, don't want to have to cope with everyday's violence / competition in the game, even though it's "normal" in MMOs ... "just ignore them" is not good enough for people like me, we want to be protected. Tamriel is an escape world, I don't want to be confronted with standard jerkiness ingame.

I know ZOS takes care of people like me : TES fans coming from solo games but potentially scared by "MMO mentality". And there's A LOT of us around. They just aren't all as "big-mouthed" as I am on forums.

In short : what might sound to you as "harmless/just ignore" is a "no/no" to people like me. For me there are A LOT of those "uber-jerks" in the game. But maybe you wouldn't even see them, you'd just widely ignore them. I can't.
If you're kicked out of a group you'd just sigh and join another group.
If I get kicked out of a group I'd probably log off for an entire week.
That leads to a risk/benefit analysis of such an addon as GroupDamage to be positive for you and negative for me. I listened and understood and even agreed to most of pro-arguments you brought. They just, imho, didn't outweight the risk. Your equation was different : you understand the risks, but you think the benefits are greater than the risks.

Hope this help understanding my position, which I believe to represent quite a lot of players who don't even dare/bother to read/post on forums.

On a side note, I was very, very eagerly expecting the "PvP part of the justice system" which was cancelled, I am very disappointed about that, which is most certainly due to "carebears like me", so you see, I also have to bow to sensitive people, too...

[Waiting for flames now, as every time anyone says something even remotely sincere and personal].

.

It is rare that I run into something that I can't understand on some level. I can't even begin to fathom the amount of emo required to log off the game for a week over being removed from a group.

L2life

Anita is too kind of a person to tell you like it is. So I will.

You are the kind of person that not only do we not need on the forums and game but also in the real world.

You have no compassion. You have such a low self worth that you have to lash out at a kind hearted person just because they had the nerve to stand up for the 'little guys'. You seem to be that kind of guy.

The mentality that people don't matter, that feelings don't matter, is toxic to not only a game that is based around being social, but toxic in the real world.

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt that you are actually not this kind of cold heartless person in real life. (I hope anyway)

So, it makes me some kind of cold, evil, heartless, person with no compassion that thinks people and feelings don't matter because I think it is utterly ridiculous to ragequit the game for a week over being removed from a group. Okay, I guess that makes sense .

Yup you got it.

You have no idea what someone is going through in there real lives. People play games to get away from stress and have a good time. Then they come across someone like you.

Perhaps the person you kicked from the group just lost a loved one. Or just lost there job. Or a million other things in life that can beat you down.

I realize you are a supper tough guy. That's all well and good. Im not saying you should be a puss. But, a real man has compassion and cares for others. Because they realize that life can be hard and you have no idea what someone is going through.

sadownik

Valen_Byte wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

Valen_Byte wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

I believe some people can be jerks enough to kick someone for supposedly low DPS EVEN if it's higher than theirs.

I'm sorry, but that's just preposterous.

First, if someone really does stoop that low, I doubt that the existence or non-existence of this addon would affect their behavior or change anything.

Second, who are these mythical uber-jerks that you keep bringing up? Are they really that common, as you seem to suggest? Your tirades against this addon are premised on the behavior of a tiny, rare minority--people who would continue to be jerks with or without such an addon, I might add.

People I met ingame.

[mylife] I'm over 40. Dungeon Master (1987) was my first game. Skyrim (2011) was my 2nd game. ESO is my 3rd game. [/mylife]
In other words, I'm not used to the rude and violent (though harmless) way the younger generation uses nowadays (generation thing like in any generation). I haven't developed a "thicker skin" like many of you might have in other MMOs, and my "standards" might not exactly match those of the "standard MMO player". I'm not telling you this to bore you or anything, nor to say that my point of view is more valid than anyone else's, but just to put it in some kind of context. Starting ESO, I chose a sorcerer because it sounded cool, had no idea what "class" meant or implied, thought it was some kind of RP-archetype.

I *know* that there's many of us around here with a similar profile : not familiar with MMOs, not even gamers, but so hooked by TES5 that we went to ESO for the sake of "Elder Scrolls" ("Skyrim 2"...). Stayed because I love the game, and because of my guild, which is also a haven for people who, like me, cannot cope or better said, don't want to have to cope with everyday's violence / competition in the game, even though it's "normal" in MMOs ... "just ignore them" is not good enough for people like me, we want to be protected. Tamriel is an escape world, I don't want to be confronted with standard jerkiness ingame.

I know ZOS takes care of people like me : TES fans coming from solo games but potentially scared by "MMO mentality". And there's A LOT of us around. They just aren't all as "big-mouthed" as I am on forums.

In short : what might sound to you as "harmless/just ignore" is a "no/no" to people like me. For me there are A LOT of those "uber-jerks" in the game. But maybe you wouldn't even see them, you'd just widely ignore them. I can't.
If you're kicked out of a group you'd just sigh and join another group.
If I get kicked out of a group I'd probably log off for an entire week.
That leads to a risk/benefit analysis of such an addon as GroupDamage to be positive for you and negative for me. I listened and understood and even agreed to most of pro-arguments you brought. They just, imho, didn't outweight the risk. Your equation was different : you understand the risks, but you think the benefits are greater than the risks.

Hope this help understanding my position, which I believe to represent quite a lot of players who don't even dare/bother to read/post on forums.

On a side note, I was very, very eagerly expecting the "PvP part of the justice system" which was cancelled, I am very disappointed about that, which is most certainly due to "carebears like me", so you see, I also have to bow to sensitive people, too...

[Waiting for flames now, as every time anyone says something even remotely sincere and personal].

.

It is rare that I run into something that I can't understand on some level. I can't even begin to fathom the amount of emo required to log off the game for a week over being removed from a group.

L2life

Anita is too kind of a person to tell you like it is. So I will.

You are the kind of person that not only do we not need on the forums and game but also in the real world.

You have no compassion. You have such a low self worth that you have to lash out at a kind hearted person just because they had the nerve to stand up for the 'little guys'. You seem to be that kind of guy.

The mentality that people don't matter, that feelings don't matter, is toxic to not only a game that is based around being social, but toxic in the real world.

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt that you are actually not this kind of cold heartless person in real life. (I hope anyway)

So, it makes me some kind of cold, evil, heartless, person with no compassion that thinks people and feelings don't matter because I think it is utterly ridiculous to ragequit the game for a week over being removed from a group. Okay, I guess that makes sense .

Yup you got it.

You have no idea what someone is going through in there real lives. People play games to get away from stress and have a good time. Then they come across someone like you.

Perhaps the person you kicked from the group just lost a loved one. Or just lost there job. Or a million other things in life that can beat you down.

I realize you are a supper tough guy. That's all well and good. Im not saying you should be a puss. But, a real man has compassion and cares for others. Because they realize that life can be hard and you have no idea what someone is going through.

What kind of argumentation is that? Yes people should be good to each other, yes often they are not. But how it is connected to the existance of add on allowing to see other people stats?

And on top of that you accuse @timidobserver of not being a real man, i mean have you thought about him? Perhaps he just lost a loved one. Or just lost his job. Or a million other things in life that could beat him down? Words hurt you know.

Kyoma

Valen_Byte wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

Valen_Byte wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

I believe some people can be jerks enough to kick someone for supposedly low DPS EVEN if it's higher than theirs.

I'm sorry, but that's just preposterous.

First, if someone really does stoop that low, I doubt that the existence or non-existence of this addon would affect their behavior or change anything.

Second, who are these mythical uber-jerks that you keep bringing up? Are they really that common, as you seem to suggest? Your tirades against this addon are premised on the behavior of a tiny, rare minority--people who would continue to be jerks with or without such an addon, I might add.

People I met ingame.

[mylife] I'm over 40. Dungeon Master (1987) was my first game. Skyrim (2011) was my 2nd game. ESO is my 3rd game. [/mylife]
In other words, I'm not used to the rude and violent (though harmless) way the younger generation uses nowadays (generation thing like in any generation). I haven't developed a "thicker skin" like many of you might have in other MMOs, and my "standards" might not exactly match those of the "standard MMO player". I'm not telling you this to bore you or anything, nor to say that my point of view is more valid than anyone else's, but just to put it in some kind of context. Starting ESO, I chose a sorcerer because it sounded cool, had no idea what "class" meant or implied, thought it was some kind of RP-archetype.

I *know* that there's many of us around here with a similar profile : not familiar with MMOs, not even gamers, but so hooked by TES5 that we went to ESO for the sake of "Elder Scrolls" ("Skyrim 2"...). Stayed because I love the game, and because of my guild, which is also a haven for people who, like me, cannot cope or better said, don't want to have to cope with everyday's violence / competition in the game, even though it's "normal" in MMOs ... "just ignore them" is not good enough for people like me, we want to be protected. Tamriel is an escape world, I don't want to be confronted with standard jerkiness ingame.

I know ZOS takes care of people like me : TES fans coming from solo games but potentially scared by "MMO mentality". And there's A LOT of us around. They just aren't all as "big-mouthed" as I am on forums.

In short : what might sound to you as "harmless/just ignore" is a "no/no" to people like me. For me there are A LOT of those "uber-jerks" in the game. But maybe you wouldn't even see them, you'd just widely ignore them. I can't.
If you're kicked out of a group you'd just sigh and join another group.
If I get kicked out of a group I'd probably log off for an entire week.
That leads to a risk/benefit analysis of such an addon as GroupDamage to be positive for you and negative for me. I listened and understood and even agreed to most of pro-arguments you brought. They just, imho, didn't outweight the risk. Your equation was different : you understand the risks, but you think the benefits are greater than the risks.

Hope this help understanding my position, which I believe to represent quite a lot of players who don't even dare/bother to read/post on forums.

On a side note, I was very, very eagerly expecting the "PvP part of the justice system" which was cancelled, I am very disappointed about that, which is most certainly due to "carebears like me", so you see, I also have to bow to sensitive people, too...

[Waiting for flames now, as every time anyone says something even remotely sincere and personal].

.

It is rare that I run into something that I can't understand on some level. I can't even begin to fathom the amount of emo required to log off the game for a week over being removed from a group.

L2life

Anita is too kind of a person to tell you like it is. So I will.

You are the kind of person that not only do we not need on the forums and game but also in the real world.

You have no compassion. You have such a low self worth that you have to lash out at a kind hearted person just because they had the nerve to stand up for the 'little guys'. You seem to be that kind of guy.

The mentality that people don't matter, that feelings don't matter, is toxic to not only a game that is based around being social, but toxic in the real world.

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt that you are actually not this kind of cold heartless person in real life. (I hope anyway)

So, it makes me some kind of cold, evil, heartless, person with no compassion that thinks people and feelings don't matter because I think it is utterly ridiculous to ragequit the game for a week over being removed from a group. Okay, I guess that makes sense .

Yup you got it.

You have no idea what someone is going through in there real lives. People play games to get away from stress and have a good time. Then they come across someone like you.

Perhaps the person you kicked from the group just lost a loved one. Or just lost there job. Or a million other things in life that can beat you down.

I realize you are a supper tough guy. That's all well and good. Im not saying you should be a puss. But, a real man has compassion and cares for others. Because they realize that life can be hard and you have no idea what someone is going through.

But it is not the responsibility of this addon or the people in the group to take into consideration what a person might be going thru, especially something extreem that is being suggested. So why does this even matter in this discussion?

timidobserver

sadownik wrote: »

Valen_Byte wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

Valen_Byte wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

I believe some people can be jerks enough to kick someone for supposedly low DPS EVEN if it's higher than theirs.

I'm sorry, but that's just preposterous.

First, if someone really does stoop that low, I doubt that the existence or non-existence of this addon would affect their behavior or change anything.

Second, who are these mythical uber-jerks that you keep bringing up? Are they really that common, as you seem to suggest? Your tirades against this addon are premised on the behavior of a tiny, rare minority--people who would continue to be jerks with or without such an addon, I might add.

People I met ingame.

[mylife] I'm over 40. Dungeon Master (1987) was my first game. Skyrim (2011) was my 2nd game. ESO is my 3rd game. [/mylife]
In other words, I'm not used to the rude and violent (though harmless) way the younger generation uses nowadays (generation thing like in any generation). I haven't developed a "thicker skin" like many of you might have in other MMOs, and my "standards" might not exactly match those of the "standard MMO player". I'm not telling you this to bore you or anything, nor to say that my point of view is more valid than anyone else's, but just to put it in some kind of context. Starting ESO, I chose a sorcerer because it sounded cool, had no idea what "class" meant or implied, thought it was some kind of RP-archetype.

I *know* that there's many of us around here with a similar profile : not familiar with MMOs, not even gamers, but so hooked by TES5 that we went to ESO for the sake of "Elder Scrolls" ("Skyrim 2"...). Stayed because I love the game, and because of my guild, which is also a haven for people who, like me, cannot cope or better said, don't want to have to cope with everyday's violence / competition in the game, even though it's "normal" in MMOs ... "just ignore them" is not good enough for people like me, we want to be protected. Tamriel is an escape world, I don't want to be confronted with standard jerkiness ingame.

I know ZOS takes care of people like me : TES fans coming from solo games but potentially scared by "MMO mentality". And there's A LOT of us around. They just aren't all as "big-mouthed" as I am on forums.

In short : what might sound to you as "harmless/just ignore" is a "no/no" to people like me. For me there are A LOT of those "uber-jerks" in the game. But maybe you wouldn't even see them, you'd just widely ignore them. I can't.
If you're kicked out of a group you'd just sigh and join another group.
If I get kicked out of a group I'd probably log off for an entire week.
That leads to a risk/benefit analysis of such an addon as GroupDamage to be positive for you and negative for me. I listened and understood and even agreed to most of pro-arguments you brought. They just, imho, didn't outweight the risk. Your equation was different : you understand the risks, but you think the benefits are greater than the risks.

Hope this help understanding my position, which I believe to represent quite a lot of players who don't even dare/bother to read/post on forums.

On a side note, I was very, very eagerly expecting the "PvP part of the justice system" which was cancelled, I am very disappointed about that, which is most certainly due to "carebears like me", so you see, I also have to bow to sensitive people, too...

[Waiting for flames now, as every time anyone says something even remotely sincere and personal].

.

It is rare that I run into something that I can't understand on some level. I can't even begin to fathom the amount of emo required to log off the game for a week over being removed from a group.

L2life

Anita is too kind of a person to tell you like it is. So I will.

You are the kind of person that not only do we not need on the forums and game but also in the real world.

You have no compassion. You have such a low self worth that you have to lash out at a kind hearted person just because they had the nerve to stand up for the 'little guys'. You seem to be that kind of guy.

The mentality that people don't matter, that feelings don't matter, is toxic to not only a game that is based around being social, but toxic in the real world.

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt that you are actually not this kind of cold heartless person in real life. (I hope anyway)

So, it makes me some kind of cold, evil, heartless, person with no compassion that thinks people and feelings don't matter because I think it is utterly ridiculous to ragequit the game for a week over being removed from a group. Okay, I guess that makes sense .

Yup you got it.

You have no idea what someone is going through in there real lives. People play games to get away from stress and have a good time. Then they come across someone like you.

Perhaps the person you kicked from the group just lost a loved one. Or just lost there job. Or a million other things in life that can beat you down.

I realize you are a supper tough guy. That's all well and good. Im not saying you should be a puss. But, a real man has compassion and cares for others. Because they realize that life can be hard and you have no idea what someone is going through.

And on top of that you accuse @timidobserver of not being a real man, i mean have you thought about him? Perhaps he just lost a loved one. Or just lost his job. Or a million other things in life that could beat him down? Words hurt you know.

None of these things are the case. I simply think that quitting the game for a week over getting kick from a group is an overreaction.

sadownik

timidobserver wrote: »

sadownik wrote: »

Valen_Byte wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

Valen_Byte wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

I believe some people can be jerks enough to kick someone for supposedly low DPS EVEN if it's higher than theirs.

I'm sorry, but that's just preposterous.

First, if someone really does stoop that low, I doubt that the existence or non-existence of this addon would affect their behavior or change anything.

Second, who are these mythical uber-jerks that you keep bringing up? Are they really that common, as you seem to suggest? Your tirades against this addon are premised on the behavior of a tiny, rare minority--people who would continue to be jerks with or without such an addon, I might add.

People I met ingame.

[mylife] I'm over 40. Dungeon Master (1987) was my first game. Skyrim (2011) was my 2nd game. ESO is my 3rd game. [/mylife]
In other words, I'm not used to the rude and violent (though harmless) way the younger generation uses nowadays (generation thing like in any generation). I haven't developed a "thicker skin" like many of you might have in other MMOs, and my "standards" might not exactly match those of the "standard MMO player". I'm not telling you this to bore you or anything, nor to say that my point of view is more valid than anyone else's, but just to put it in some kind of context. Starting ESO, I chose a sorcerer because it sounded cool, had no idea what "class" meant or implied, thought it was some kind of RP-archetype.

I *know* that there's many of us around here with a similar profile : not familiar with MMOs, not even gamers, but so hooked by TES5 that we went to ESO for the sake of "Elder Scrolls" ("Skyrim 2"...). Stayed because I love the game, and because of my guild, which is also a haven for people who, like me, cannot cope or better said, don't want to have to cope with everyday's violence / competition in the game, even though it's "normal" in MMOs ... "just ignore them" is not good enough for people like me, we want to be protected. Tamriel is an escape world, I don't want to be confronted with standard jerkiness ingame.

I know ZOS takes care of people like me : TES fans coming from solo games but potentially scared by "MMO mentality". And there's A LOT of us around. They just aren't all as "big-mouthed" as I am on forums.

In short : what might sound to you as "harmless/just ignore" is a "no/no" to people like me. For me there are A LOT of those "uber-jerks" in the game. But maybe you wouldn't even see them, you'd just widely ignore them. I can't.
If you're kicked out of a group you'd just sigh and join another group.
If I get kicked out of a group I'd probably log off for an entire week.
That leads to a risk/benefit analysis of such an addon as GroupDamage to be positive for you and negative for me. I listened and understood and even agreed to most of pro-arguments you brought. They just, imho, didn't outweight the risk. Your equation was different : you understand the risks, but you think the benefits are greater than the risks.

Hope this help understanding my position, which I believe to represent quite a lot of players who don't even dare/bother to read/post on forums.

On a side note, I was very, very eagerly expecting the "PvP part of the justice system" which was cancelled, I am very disappointed about that, which is most certainly due to "carebears like me", so you see, I also have to bow to sensitive people, too...

[Waiting for flames now, as every time anyone says something even remotely sincere and personal].

.

It is rare that I run into something that I can't understand on some level. I can't even begin to fathom the amount of emo required to log off the game for a week over being removed from a group.

L2life

Anita is too kind of a person to tell you like it is. So I will.

You are the kind of person that not only do we not need on the forums and game but also in the real world.

You have no compassion. You have such a low self worth that you have to lash out at a kind hearted person just because they had the nerve to stand up for the 'little guys'. You seem to be that kind of guy.

The mentality that people don't matter, that feelings don't matter, is toxic to not only a game that is based around being social, but toxic in the real world.

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt that you are actually not this kind of cold heartless person in real life. (I hope anyway)

So, it makes me some kind of cold, evil, heartless, person with no compassion that thinks people and feelings don't matter because I think it is utterly ridiculous to ragequit the game for a week over being removed from a group. Okay, I guess that makes sense .

Yup you got it.

You have no idea what someone is going through in there real lives. People play games to get away from stress and have a good time. Then they come across someone like you.

Perhaps the person you kicked from the group just lost a loved one. Or just lost there job. Or a million other things in life that can beat you down.

I realize you are a supper tough guy. That's all well and good. Im not saying you should be a puss. But, a real man has compassion and cares for others. Because they realize that life can be hard and you have no idea what someone is going through.

And on top of that you accuse @timidobserver of not being a real man, i mean have you thought about him? Perhaps he just lost a loved one. Or just lost his job. Or a million other things in life that could beat him down? Words hurt you know.

None of these things are the case. I simply think that quitting the game for a week over getting kick from a group is an overreaction.

Im sorry, i just cant handle that demagogic @Valen_Byte argumentation, perhaps using sarcasm was not necessary here but all i wrote is true. There is no connection between the incident described and the add on. There is absolute certainty that add on or not such things will happen and we can only hope they wont happen often. Any measures taken to eradicate such behavior in my opinion will cause more harm than that situation. Thats it.

Valen_Byte

My posts have nothing to do with the topic...admittedly....I just have something inside me that makes me stick up for people. My original post was directed at one person who made a comment that was also off topic. I really don't care about the addon. I care about people.

eliisra

Jaeysa wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

In ESO, some people have the most interesting reasons for kicking people from groups. For example, I watched a guy sit there for like 15 minutes kicking over 50 people from a group because they wanted group finder to put their friend from another alliance in the group. No one should be ragequitting the game because they ran into someone like this in the group finder.

If someone is emotionally sensitive enough to ragequit the game for a week over being kicked from a group, they should be battling for a group kick vote system, in which everyone has to agree in order to kick someone, rather than waging war against an addon.

This -needs- to happen. I don't understand why it's not in the game.

Because it takes ZoS 1-2 years to implement something lol.

However, the outcome is usually the same regardless if leader kicks or a vote kick is being done.

My experience from loads of other MMMORPG's is that 9/10 pugs will click "yes" for kicking someone. Like it doesn't matter who that person is or if he did something wrong, when the the die is cast everyone votes to kick. They do it automatically because brain afk or some messed up players psychology causing them to always chose the evil option. I cant even begin to understand it.

I even had raids wipe in online games because some moron accidentally clicked vote kick on the healer. All the pugs goes "yes" and a perfectly amazing healer gets zones out in the middle of a fight

timidobserver

Valen_Byte wrote: »

My posts have nothing to do with the topic...admittedly....I just have something inside me that makes me stick up for people. My original post was directed at one person who made a comment that was also off topic. I really don't care about the addon. I care about people.

I feel honored that you came here specifically to rage at me lol. Carry on.

HeroOfNone

Heya folks, I know this isn't the guild recruitment forums, but just a plug to Dungeon Dwellers, a guild that runs dungeons in a friendly group without requiring folks to play a specific build. Our rule, "don't be a D***", established by our founder @yodased . Run this Addon, don't run this Addon, as long as the boss is dead is all that matters. If the boss doesn't die, we'll work to adapt, change tactics, and treat it as a training exercise until we run out of time and can't continue

The only time that DPS should really matter is when you want to improve your DPS. We've helped several improve over the past few months when asked without giving requirements onto them. you may not be able to complete some bosses without the right DPS mix, but that's no reason you shouldn't have fun or be forced into a build.

if interested in joining contact @Shunravi, @Some_Guy, or myself and I'm sure we can work something out =3

Some_Guy

HeroOfNone wrote: »

Heya folks, I know this isn't the guild recruitment forums, but just a plug to Dungeon Dwellers, a guild that runs dungeons in a friendly group without requiring folks to play a specific build. Our rule, "don't be a D***", established by our founder @yodased . Run this Addon, don't run this Addon, as long as the boss is dead is all that matters. If the boss doesn't die, we'll work to adapt, change tactics, and treat it as a training exercise until we run out of time and can't continue

The only time that DPS should really matter is when you want to improve your DPS. We've helped several improve over the past few months when asked without giving requirements onto them. you may not be able to complete some bosses without the right DPS mix, but that's no reason you shouldn't have fun or be forced into a build.

if interested in joining contact @Shunravi, @Some_Guy, or myself and I'm sure we can work something out =3

I agree. That is all. Carry on.

coolmodi

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

So, it makes me some kind of cold, evil, heartless, person with no compassion that thinks people and feelings don't matter because I think it is utterly ridiculous to ragequit the game for a week over being removed from a group. Okay, I guess that makes sense .

Just think about it. It does make sense.

No, no it doesn't. Beeing a super sensitive incredibly fragile human beeing is NOT normal in any way, otherwise we wouldn't have made it so far. But it's modern to rather try to adapt everything to the few borderline mental people rather than them adapt to reality. Imho that's a dangerous development and people like you support it. Just look at what happened with Matt Taylor, that's what happens if you give crazy people too much attention.

Edit: If you get kicked from a group (becuase you were too bad for the others) you either accept it and go on with your life, or you try to get better. If you actually aren't bad then you'd just accept that those people were a**holes and also go on. Beeing "depressed" over it for a week is rediculous. This isn't a game rated for little kids, and adults shouldn't be so incredibly fragile and sensitive to criticism, not IRL and especially not with an (anonymous) virtual character.

Shunravi

HeroOfNone wrote: »

Heya folks, I know this isn't the guild recruitment forums, but just a plug to Dungeon Dwellers, a guild that runs dungeons in a friendly group without requiring folks to play a specific build. Our rule, "don't be a D***", established by our founder @yodased . Run this Addon, don't run this Addon, as long as the boss is dead is all that matters. If the boss doesn't die, we'll work to adapt, change tactics, and treat it as a training exercise until we run out of time and can't continue

The only time that DPS should really matter is when you want to improve your DPS. We've helped several improve over the past few months when asked without giving requirements onto them. you may not be able to complete some bosses without the right DPS mix, but that's no reason you shouldn't have fun or be forced into a build.

if interested in joining contact @Shunravi, @Some_Guy, or myself and I'm sure we can work something out =3

Yup.

anitajoneb17_ESO

Cool down everyone, basically the discussion about the add-on is finished (unless someone comes up with something new), we've all pretty much said what we had to say, I guess. What we're discussing now is not as closely related to the addon itself, and thus slightly off-topic, but interesting nonetheless.

I just explained why and how some people feel about "being judged" and all... since some of you wondered... I did it knowing that some people would understand, some people would at least accept, and some people wouldn't and probably would flame.
It doesn't matter : what matters is that sensitive people are informed and aware that they're not alone and that there ARE guilds around there that they can join, like Dungeon Dwellers (thanks guys for mentioning it), or @Valen_Byte 's guild . Or my guild for that matter (but we're speaking french). Sensitive people should know that there are possibilities to do the group content without being scared, so that they don't leave the game upon completion of the solo content.

@coolmodi : it's hard to answer to your comment without earning quite a bunch of Godwin's points...
I wonder why disagreeing with someone seems to disconnect your brain. You want ZOS to make an effort for your addon to exist, don't you ? And ZOS specifically said that their priority was to NOT HAVING ANYONE DISCRIMINATED AGAINST. Still you keep repeating over and over that you don't want to take weaker/fragile/sensitive people into consideration, that they should not be considered because they should not be what they are, and you throw insults into the pot. That is, IMHO, not very clever from you.

@Jaeysa : sure if your definition of "violent" is "making me fear for my safety", of course nothing in this game is violent. My definition - in this context - would be "making me feel so bad that it takes the pleasure away from playing the game". Lack of pleasure is what makes people leave the game. People like @coolmodi might be happy about getting rid of sensitive people altogether but ZOS definitely doesn't - as I already stated, the proportion of people in ESO that comes from solo games and rejects the competitive-agressive aspects of MMOs is just huge.

At least I stand to what and who I am (that's my strength). When I'm asked to fill in a spot in a group of people that I don't know yet, I ask openly "are you nice ? Because I have no fun running with people who are not nice".


.

coolmodi

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

it's hard to answer to your comment without earning quite a bunch of Godwin's points...
I wonder why disagreeing with someone seems to disconnect your brain.

@anitajoneb17_ESO Ok, just what? Are you insulting me because I disagree with you? This is too much irony to handle right here.

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

ZOS specifically said that their priority was to NOT HAVING ANYONE DISCRIMINATED AGAINST.

No they haven't. That would be an impossible goal afterall.

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Still you keep repeating over and over that you don't want to take weaker/fragile/sensitive people into consideration, that they should not be considered because they should not be what they are, and you throw insults into the pot. That is, IMHO, not very clever from you.

I'm saying we shouldn't treat beeing sensitive like a 5yo child in a game (and forum) for adults as normal. Everything else is just you again twisting words.

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

People like @coolmodi might be happy about getting rid of sensitive people

Again, you're twisting words. I only ever said..ah whatever, you'll just understand something else again anyways.

I could quote Mark Twain now, but I don't want to insult anybody


Edit: And to elaborate on it a bit more: I have nothing against those (sensitive, without self-esteem and confidence) people, I just don't want the rest to have to adapt to them. I also WAS somewhat like that once, but guess what, I grew out of it. I'd still be the same if everyone else would have changed to make it possible to be like that. I still have a pretty weak self esteem and confidence, but better than not having some at all and not seeing my own faults. And it only gets better.

I don't even know why I write that here, but maybe you'll understand better why I find it absolutely stupid to adapt for those people and also to be like those people. It's just something you should overcome, not something you should be encouraged to stay like.

anitajoneb17_ESO

coolmodi wrote: »

Edit: And to elaborate on it a bit more: I have nothing against those (sensitive, without self-esteem and confidence) people, I just don't want the rest to have to adapt to them. I also WAS somewhat like that once, but guess what, I grew out of it. I'd still be the same if everyone else would have changed to make it possible to be like that. I still have a pretty weak self esteem and confidence, but better than not having some at all and not seeing my own faults. And it only gets better.

I don't even know why I write that here, but maybe you'll understand better why I find it absolutely stupid to adapt for those people and also to be like those people. It's just something you should overcome, not something you should be encouraged to stay like.

See ? from "sensitive" YOU (and you alone) imply "without self-esteem and confidence". I never said that.
Sensitivity is a quality. Caring for others is a quality. Respecting them for what they are is a quality.
Saying "I did it so I expect everyone else to do it too because they can and should" isn't.

Topic-related, what you say to other players is "be good / get good or GTFO, because I want my top-DPS and my quick&smooth pledge". What I say is "let less-good people be comfortable and have fun playing, else you'll scare them away and they'll leave the game".

It could also be summed up this way :
- You say : "if you refuse requirements, stay with your guild and don't use LFG"
- I say "If you want to impose requirements, stay with your guild and don't use LFG".

At this point just let's agree to disagree, because this conversation can only go downhill. I appreciated that you cared to elaborate and I see where you're coming from and hope you're happy with who you are now (but you deserved care and respect before, too). Let's leave it at that.

.

WandaMey

Before you all went on attacking on personalities to make 0 point over pages and pages, Anita was pointing that runs are possible by observing the mechanics whatever the dps.

yes i'm more an asset to the group if I interrupt every enemy heal with *** dps than anyone who hurt his fingers spamming his 3 skills to outdps me with 0 situational relevance.

that what Chip explained too. Zos doesn't want that.

example : tank is having a micro *** because he's outdpsing one dps player? yes maybe if he was more busy doing his tank job, the dps would have his hands free to pull some damages. Teamwork is supposed to be more efficient than the sum of each participants dps, if it isn't then there is a group problem and it's not the output of damages.

Now if you want to improve yourself FTC is enough. be better than yesterday, explain to me the mechanics, if I suck at dpsing find me something useful to do but just stop pissing me off with your number obsession. Unless you find a way to add to the dps all the damages the healer didn't have to heal and the mobs couldn't regen.