The future of the User interface which is currently awfull.

Wykkyd

OrangeTheCat wrote: »

The minimal UI in ESO is supposed to enhance "immersion".

Correction: That's the excuse that was used.

Note: Early beta ESO had minimaps, nameplates and a plethora of other UI elements that were all dumped and abandoned mid-way through beta, with "immersion" as the excuse.

TehMagnus

Wykkyd wrote: »

OrangeTheCat wrote: »

The minimal UI in ESO is supposed to enhance "immersion".

Correction: That's the excuse that was used.

Note: Early beta ESO had minimaps, nameplates and a plethora of other UI elements that were all dumped and abandoned mid-way through beta, with "immersion" as the excuse.

Totally agree with you on that one thus the " " around immersion. Good to see the point of view of people actually making the addons that bring basic UI features ZOS refuses to support. Guess it costs less to make other people do your work for free..

Shaun98ca2

Draxuul wrote: »

As long as any of the changes made are optional , i don't have an issue with it .

Biggest issue with options is IF it affects gameplay then its not really an option any more you choose either or your doing it wrong.

Plain and simple.

So lets take the quick potion set up.

Currently I like it as I simply DONT have to rely on it. Having all your quick slot items become press able keys just makes that much more keys I have to press when I simply cant while keeping my hand on the WASD keys.

So when the quick slots gets changed now im at a disadvantage.

Lets now add hotbar abilities to be slotted endlessly.

I can really only press 1-5 so again now im at a disadvantage.

Being constantly at a disadvantage I can never truly compete so at that point its really not worth playing any more.

A LOT of design decisions people blame on console are really due to the limitations of the left hand sitting on the WASD keys attempting to play an MMO.

It makes more sense to have your entire player base playing on equal footing instead of having SO many people at a constant disadvantage because some can while others cant.


________________________________________________________________________


As for the immersion stuff like mini maps.........Well they left that to addons because....well you weren't going to us the ingame one anyways so why develop one when people will use the addon version anyways.

seneferab16_ESO

Shaun98ca2 wrote: »

A LOT of design decisions people blame on console are really due to the limitations of the left hand sitting on the WASD keys attempting to play an MMO.

See, the problem here is that I don't think the people who do NOT want the quickslot wheel should suffer just because you don't feel like moving a finger away from WASD to press another button and then put it back again.

Options.
If you feel this would give you a disadvantage and you think it'll be too hard to learn new keybinds, maybe you should challenge yourself and try binding everything and ONLY using keybinds for a day or two; ie force yourself to start picking up new habits regarding keyboard and keybinds. It's annoying at first, but you'll be surpriced how fast it goes from annoyance to muscle memory.

If it's hard to remembert what you bound where, write a little note and stick it to it's key. It's what I did to force myself out of my early MMO habit as a clicker.

GnatB

To be honest, I'm "fine" with the concept of the quick item wheel, if it was actually implemented well.

Just that letting go of the "Q" button should simply use the highlighted item. You shouldn't have to press it twice to use something other than the last used item. That's just stupid. (yes, stupid)

Change the "wheel" so there is an empty slot in the middle, and a cancel slot on the bottom. When you let go of "Q" it uses whatever item is highlighted. Allow input to the wheel even when hidden, along with options for how fast the wheel shows up. Tap q will use the middle item. press q->mouse twitch->release q will use whatever item is in the direction you twitched the mouse. Done, fast, easy. And those with smaller hands (or whatever) won't be at any disadvantage.

Shaun98ca2

seneferab16_ESO wrote: »

Shaun98ca2 wrote: »

A LOT of design decisions people blame on console are really due to the limitations of the left hand sitting on the WASD keys attempting to play an MMO.

See, the problem here is that I don't think the people who do NOT want the quickslot wheel should suffer just because you don't feel like moving a finger away from WASD to press another button and then put it back again.

Options.
If you feel this would give you a disadvantage and you think it'll be too hard to learn new keybinds, maybe you should challenge yourself and try binding everything and ONLY using keybinds for a day or two; ie force yourself to start picking up new habits regarding keyboard and keybinds. It's annoying at first, but you'll be surpriced how fast it goes from annoyance to muscle memory.

If it's hard to remembert what you bound where, write a little note and stick it to it's key. It's what I did to force myself out of my early MMO habit as a clicker.

But again you seem to be thinking about yourself. Its very difficult for many of people to press anything past the 5 key with their hand rested on the WASD keys.

The current set puts it so nobody is at an advantage or disadvantage.

See your trying to talk down to me about using more keybinds but really its all about simple limitations of the left hand you can really only move so far with your hand on the WASD keys.

Maybe YOU can move past the 5 key while using WASD. Good your thinking about yourself not the better of the game but the better for YOU. Its not about you its about ALL the players as a whole.

Swampster

Shaun98ca2 wrote: »

seneferab16_ESO wrote: »

Shaun98ca2 wrote: »

A LOT of design decisions people blame on console are really due to the limitations of the left hand sitting on the WASD keys attempting to play an MMO.

See, the problem here is that I don't think the people who do NOT want the quickslot wheel should suffer just because you don't feel like moving a finger away from WASD to press another button and then put it back again.

Options.
If you feel this would give you a disadvantage and you think it'll be too hard to learn new keybinds, maybe you should challenge yourself and try binding everything and ONLY using keybinds for a day or two; ie force yourself to start picking up new habits regarding keyboard and keybinds. It's annoying at first, but you'll be surpriced how fast it goes from annoyance to muscle memory.

If it's hard to remembert what you bound where, write a little note and stick it to it's key. It's what I did to force myself out of my early MMO habit as a clicker.

But again you seem to be thinking about yourself. Its very difficult for many of people to press anything past the 5 key with their hand rested on the WASD keys.

The current set puts it so nobody is at an advantage or disadvantage.

See your trying to talk down to me about using more keybinds but really its all about simple limitations of the left hand you can really only move so far with your hand on the WASD keys.

Maybe YOU can move past the 5 key while using WASD. Good your thinking about yourself not the better of the game but the better for YOU. Its not about you its about ALL the players as a whole.

Except your entire argument is a moot point as they allow addons which do most of these things anyway.. which unless by your reckoning everybody is using the same addons then people are going to be at a disadvantage.

If you think they limited/designed the UI in such a a crippled way because a few people can't use more than 5 buttons with their left hand then I think you're working too hard to convince yourself they did a good job at UI design!

snowmanflvb14_ESO

there are addons that address almost everyone of your complaints. Might I suggest one such as quickslot to handle your consumable issue:
http://www.esoui.com/downloads/info258-GreymindQuickSlotBar.html

The UI was designed to be minimal since people could use add-ons to create and UI that works for them. Although, some of the UI seems to be designed with consoles in mind I would refer you to many games such as GW2 or NWO as two other games that have a similar set up and were not designed with the announced intent of going to consoles. Might I also suggest you bind keys to your mouse if you feel you do not want to move your hand or stretch your fingers to hit a key

TehMagnus

snowmanflvb14_ESO wrote: »

there are addons that address almost everyone of your complaints. Might I suggest one such as quickslot to handle your consumable issue:
http://www.esoui.com/downloads/info258-GreymindQuickSlotBar.html

The UI was designed to be minimal since people could use add-ons to create and UI that works for them. Although, some of the UI seems to be designed with consoles in mind I would refer you to many games such as GW2 or NWO as two other games that have a similar set up and were not designed with the announced intent of going to consoles. Might I also suggest you bind keys to your mouse if you feel you do not want to move your hand or stretch your fingers to hit a key

The UI wasn't designed to be minimal, it had a lot of nice stuff at the beginning. The problem is that when you change your code somewhere that impacts some of the UI features, you also need to modify the code of the features (just look at the addons that haven't worked after big releases & need to be updated). The more features you have, the more code you need to maintain and the more things you need to test. It takes testing and Dev resources.

Most Addon makers that keep developing their addons go to PTS so they can have the update ready. If they can do it, ZOS could do it. The problem is that you need at least two devs to work on that, that know their way around the UI features and maintain them (minimum 2 because if one is sick or gets hired somewhere else, you need to keep knowledge inside the company and someone capable of working).

It's cheaper to let players design addons hence their "minimalist UI choice" which is nothing else than a $$$ choice.

I almost hope someone ends up exploiting the API so they have to stop providing it and are forced to do their job on the User Interface...

VycDarkshadow

Never saw the need for a minimap when you can simply memorize your surroundings. By the time i've visited a city three times, i know exactly where everything is in that town, and no longer even use my map to double-check. To date, i still do not use any add-ons except for Skyshards and (rarely) Treasure Maps, as i find them distracting and/or simply in my way during gameplay.

As far as the "Q" slot goes, i keep one (sometimes a second as a backup in case i'm running low) healing potions, my food buff, and my pet on my bar. That's all i need. I don't need stamina or magicka potions because i can still light and heavy attack without them. I simply wait until my stamina or magicka builds up on its own, then use what i wish to use. As long as it dies and i live, i'm happy. I am not a speedrunner, and i don't care how long it takes for something to die. I only care that i don't die trying to kill it.

I do agree with the guild stores being a mess, though, but i found that (for example, Kuta), you can set Enchantment, Runes, Legendary, and hit the search button. If there's any Kuta, they show up. Searching for white items, however, can be a royal pain.

VycDarkshadow

Super_Sonico wrote: »

I agree except for numbers. I want to see numbers. That allows for a tuning of the character you can't get otherwise. No point in telling me a skill uses 300 stamina or 300 magicka if I can't see when I'm down to 30% of my pool and only have 500 left. It makes a difference on what I do and the strategies I use.

So I only use FTC.

Why would you need numbers? If you can use a skill, it lights up. If you can't, it doesn't. Combined with a little mental math (for example, noticing you have 2k stamina and you're at a quarter tank, that tells you that you have around 500 stamina left), that's all you need to know.

TehMagnus

VycDarkshadow wrote: »

Super_Sonico wrote: »

I agree except for numbers. I want to see numbers. That allows for a tuning of the character you can't get otherwise. No point in telling me a skill uses 300 stamina or 300 magicka if I can't see when I'm down to 30% of my pool and only have 500 left. It makes a difference on what I do and the strategies I use.

So I only use FTC.

Why would you need numbers? If you can use a skill, it lights up. If you can't, it doesn't. Combined with a little mental math (for example, noticing you have 2k stamina and you're at a quarter tank, that tells you that you have around 500 stamina left), that's all you need to know.

No it isn't. FTC gives you DPS information, a recap of what your highest damage sources are, a combat cloud that show how much damage each skill is doing, if it's critical or normal damage, it can give you indications on the fact you're low on stamina or mana etc etc: things you can't "mentally calculate" on a fight lasting longer than 20 seconds where you've better things to do like avoiding red one shotting circles. Any player that hopes to get better at any game needs this kind of information.

Just because YOU aren't interested, doesn't mean a great great number of players are, heck, FTC has been downloaded by half a million people and I'm not sure that counts people downloading it from Minion like myself and many others.

As for "yah, just remember the map": NO. We want the most basic thing that has existed for more than 10 years in any self respecting game (and that existed at the beginning of TESO's development): a minimap, heck even runescape has a minimap...

If you don't need all that stuff, you can just disable it and keep playing with the simplistic UI.

Attorneyatlawl

VycDarkshadow wrote: »

Super_Sonico wrote: »

I agree except for numbers. I want to see numbers. That allows for a tuning of the character you can't get otherwise. No point in telling me a skill uses 300 stamina or 300 magicka if I can't see when I'm down to 30% of my pool and only have 500 left. It makes a difference on what I do and the strategies I use.

So I only use FTC.

Why would you need numbers? If you can use a skill, it lights up. If you can't, it doesn't. Combined with a little mental math (for example, noticing you have 2k stamina and you're at a quarter tank, that tells you that you have around 500 stamina left), that's all you need to know.

This is why we need numbers:

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/131271/definitive-spell-resist-penetration-sharpened-trait-results-thread-bugs-stam-imbalance-and-why

GnatB

To be fair, without harvestmap (or similar addon) the minimap isn't really all THAT necessary. Particularly since group members still don't seem to update correctly on maps at all. Main *or* mini.

Tankqull

Draxuul wrote: »

What about those of us who do not want more things on the UI ?

The UI in this game is one of the things i love the most . The less boxes i see on my screen and the more happy i am .

So just in case Zenimax wants to, at some point, consider changing the UI, i say , make it possible for people to customize their UI, add stuff to it if and only if they want it.

Personnaly i don't want my UI to have more stuff. I want my screen to be as empty as possible . I have never downloaded any add ons for that exact reason .

I want to see the world , not numbers.

Draxuul

well just open up the API again like at the end of beta. you can still run around with no information if you like, but those who do want to know if their teammates should be cleansed or not should have an option (addons) to get those informations.

Shaun98ca2 wrote: »

A LOT of design decisions people blame on console are really due to the limitations of the left hand sitting on the WASD keys attempting to play an MMO.

well the limitation is comming from having no option to use key modifiers(shift, crtl, alt) in this game wich is nothing but plain stupid.

Gillysan

The current vanilla UI is not minimalist. It simply sucks. It's pointed out by more than one person in this thread that functionality and minimalist can be implemented together. This current UI is simply awful. It's a bit of a cluster you-know-what.

If it wasn't for the addons I would have canceled my subscription after the first month. This UI would have been too frustrating to deal with. IMO the people who don't use addons are either blissfully ignorant, masochist, or simply unbalanced. You must spend every day in a summer dress, wearing a fedora and drinking evening tea with Cadwell.

zhevon

You need numbers to you can tell the devs whats broken; which is the real reason they gutted the UI.

Meggedo

The UI in ESO is one of the things I hate the most about this game. Yes it is designed with a console set up in mind allowing for a cross platform release I am guessing at some point. Out of all the UI's I have seen since 98 SWTOR has the single most customizable, user friendly, and functional one. I don't need to get add ons, which potentially leave your system open to hacks, doing privacy and security I know this, just like Facebook's apps. The vulnerabilities lie in the apps not using encrypted elements which allows people to go in and plunk a single cookie out of your browser folder, and I have all your info, thank you very much. PC and Console's are based on two entirely different thought processes, while I have all three (actually all three system types Xbox, PS and my PC), I didn't build my PC based on the use of a joy stick. I don't think most hardcore PC gamers do either, they build it to actually play a gamer with better graphical capabilities, and functionality. My system cost me a large chunk of change to build, and to be pigeon holed into some second rate console type UI is pathetic, and shows a general lack of MMO knowledge on the DEVs point; or it could be just a profit driven decision to cash out on gamers. PC gamers invest in things like specialized keyboards, gaming mouse, and various other equipment. We also tend to make our systems upgradeable and not subject to the proprietary whim of Sony and Microsoft to tell us how we should play, or when they feel we should upgrade it. The biggest supporters of the UI I find are the ones who have junk computers, or are limited to spending no more than $700 for their console crap. PC gamers, such as myself, and many other I know feel that the dev teams have done nothing less than dumb down the UI for a console because of the above stated reasons, or it was just easier to build off of what was done for them already. This is my sytem build and I know the Xbox 1 (Which I have development kits for the Kinnect system) or PS4 can even touch. Thank You to the DEV team for lumping all of the PC gamers in with limited console user.
NZXT Phantom Case
PC Silencer MK III 1200w Power Supply
AMD 8350 Bulldozer (OC to 4.28 Ghz)
ASUS Crossfire V Formula z
32 gigs Corsair Platinum 1866 (OC to 2033)
(2) GTX690 SLI
Hauppauge 2225 TV Tuner Card w/DVR
Intel Series 325 160 gig SSD (Dedicated Strictly to OS and related drivers)
OCZ Vertex 4 128 gig SSD (Dedicated strictly to games)
Seagate 3 TB HDD 7200rpm with 64mb Cache (Back Ups/ File Libraries/ and a host of other low demand system use apps)
Aero Cool 2100
NZXT Hue
NZXT Multicard Reader
LG Blu-Ray Burner w/ M DISC capability
Corsair H100 Liquid Cooler
(4) 140mm Fans on Radiator
(3) 120mm Fans
(2) 140mm Fans
Sony 500 Watt 5.1 DTS Dolby Surround System
(3) 39” Magnavox 1080p LCD TV Monitors
Windows 7 Ultimate
Adobe CS6 Master Suite
MS Office with full Share point set up
Plus just about every other piece of Legal software you could want
STRIKE 7 Gaming Keyboard
RAT 7 Gaming Mouse
This has a little more options than a 5 slot UI usability, as most gamers do. I will admit that consoles sell more than gaming PCs simply because for the low price of $600 you can play COD on a big TV. Unlike the PC which I could run it on 8 of them. If you need a screen shot of the customizable UI on SWTOR just let me know and I will toss one up, or go give it a try as it is F2P. That is the saddest thing, ESO you got ganked $80 for the imperial version, and bent over for the subscription for a console UI.

Wykkyd

@Meggedo‌, add-ons couldn't hack you if they tried. This reveals how little you know about them.

They are plain text.
They can't talk to anything but the game client.
They can't talk to anything on your system, not even a text file.
The game client itself actually executes them, and limits what they can do.

So, unless you, for some reason, distrust the ESO game client, your fears are 100% unfounded.

Facebook apps compile and execute on their own against your system, your browser and Facebook's API. Of COURSE those can hack you.

Spreading unrealistic fears is just a sign of ignorance, not wisdom.

TehMagnus

Agree I actually wish we could do more with the addons. If addons like Atlas could automatically send/retrieve loot table data directly from a server it would be awesome...

stefan.gustavsonb16_ESO

The big problem for me is not the console style UI for combat, or the simplistic "clean" interfaces for inventory etc, lacking the detail you usually find on a typical PC interface. The current UI design would be terrible even on a console with a joystick-type hand controller. The incessant scrolling, the clunky and awkward controls, the lack of information, the lack of consistency in naming and grouping, everything in the design reeks of beginner's mistakes, a rush to release and a lack of testing.

Oblivion was mostly OK on a console, as was Skyrim, even if I preferred the PC version with some UI add-ons. Both had long scroll lists that became tedious after a while, but their vanilla UIs were reasonably well designed and executed. The current vanilla UI of ESO would not be OK even on a console.

Wykkyd

zhevon wrote: »

You need numbers to you can tell the devs whats broken; which is the real reason they gutted the UI.

Conspiracy theory.

ZOS staff still argues internally to this day over nameplates, minimaps, etc. They're players too and are as divided on the UI as the playerbase is.

What shut down the UI was anti-MMOer sentiment. "Don't be an elitist and make me play the way you do." That. Period. Fear of elitism, people forcing others to use cookiecutter specs, fear of things like WoW's "Gear Score" addon.

All fears that the UI limitations don't really stop. They make it harder, but elitists find a way. And even now trials pugs require dps minimums, cookiecutter specs exist and people in pugs still check your gear if they don't like your performance.

All just as I, andany others, predicted over a year ago.

TehMagnus

Wykkyd wrote: »

zhevon wrote: »

You need numbers to you can tell the devs whats broken; which is the real reason they gutted the UI.

Conspiracy theory.

ZOS staff still argues internally to this day over nameplates, minimaps, etc. They're players too and are as divided on the UI as the playerbase is.

What shut down the UI was anti-MMOer sentiment. "Don't be an elitist and make me play the way you do." That. Period. Fear of elitism, people forcing others to use cookiecutter specs, fear of things like WoW's "Gear Score" addon.

All fears that the UI limitations don't really stop. They make it harder, but elitists find a way. And even now trials pugs require dps minimums, cookiecutter specs exist and people in pugs still check your gear if they don't like your performance.

All just as I, andany others, predicted over a year ago.

Of course it doesn't stop anything.

When running trials with people from our guilds and friend lists that we know can perform and DPS, UI won't stop us from just knowing that one of the new players doesn't cut it and a quick look at who's doing what during a fight is enough to catch a newb (depending on the aim of the run, like: not a speed run, the newb wont get auto kick ofc, but educated).

There isn't even need to check for armor since armor is actually meaningless in instances like AA (as people running naked runs have prooved) and most of times, players who know what skills & specs to use evidently know what armor goes along with it since, like it or not, (and I'm amazed this word isn't more used in forums) there is a metagame.

The way of thinking you describe is exactly the same that pushes people to reject "Inspect gear" because they think it can prevent elitist behavior...

Tamanous

Zos has already mentioned incoming improvements for banks. No idea when though. Most of the other features the OP wants is answered by addons. It is approach they wanted. Possibly for console porting but I do not buy that excuse for everything many posters accuse it for. It is a lazy argument.

I do not see many of the options people want being offered outside of addons. I find I do not have to use many addons. If banks could be searched easier there is little reason for addons. Even the stands damage numbers flying around the screen in every video we see is utterly pointless. You can't see those numbers in combat and most only use that bloated UI addon because they have become used to seeing numbers flying around their screen from other games. Even for raiding and damage testing you only need logs or a good recount type program.

I highly doubt a single player can defend the use and benefit of 5 layers of small damage numbers on their screen. It is pointless. Icons for debuffs and perhaps reactionary promps for the lazy players requiring cheating to get ahead is indeed useful. Map reveal mods is simply cheating even though nobody admits it but they are used commonly and should be options.

There is little real need for many addons as it stands. Most are nothing more than tools for lazy people. Some UI tweaks are required to be sure but not as much as many think. Sadly all these requests for massive UI overhauls come from mmo players who became pampered by games that made you play the UI over the game. These players are slow to adapt or perhaps incapable of it.

I personally want better bank searching and perhaps a better built in quick slot function (although I use a simple quick slot addon that allows combo hotkey function to swap but you still need to hit Q to activate the slot. Works fine for the most part and one gets used to 2 clicks instead of one).

Attorneyatlawl

magnusnet wrote: »

Wykkyd wrote: »

zhevon wrote: »

You need numbers to you can tell the devs whats broken; which is the real reason they gutted the UI.

Conspiracy theory.

ZOS staff still argues internally to this day over nameplates, minimaps, etc. They're players too and are as divided on the UI as the playerbase is.

What shut down the UI was anti-MMOer sentiment. "Don't be an elitist and make me play the way you do." That. Period. Fear of elitism, people forcing others to use cookiecutter specs, fear of things like WoW's "Gear Score" addon.

All fears that the UI limitations don't really stop. They make it harder, but elitists find a way. And even now trials pugs require dps minimums, cookiecutter specs exist and people in pugs still check your gear if they don't like your performance.

All just as I, andany others, predicted over a year ago.

Of course it doesn't stop anything.

When running trials with people from our guilds and friend lists that we know can perform and DPS, UI won't stop us from just knowing that one of the new players doesn't cut it and a quick look at who's doing what during a fight is enough to catch a newb (depending on the aim of the run, like: not a speed run, the newb wont get auto kick ofc, but educated).

There isn't even need to check for armor since armor is actually meaningless in instances like AA (as people running naked runs have prooved) and most of times, players who know what skills & specs to use evidently know what armor goes along with it since, like it or not, (and I'm amazed this word isn't more used in forums) there is a metagame.

The way of thinking you describe is exactly the same that pushes people to reject "Inspect gear" because they think it can prevent elitist behavior...

Exactly. I argued this exact thing would be both doable and absolutely would be done back last year but it was, of course, not heeded. You cannot artificially stop player behavior, nor should you try to stop them from playing how they want to in their own groups that they are forming. Even without addons we could easily tell who is messing up and not just by watching them, seeing how substituting someone out affects the fights and how quickly the healthbar is going down, etc. rather easily.

In the end all the UI limitations do is frustrate players and inhibit deeper gameplay for those who want it, while not alleviating any UI clutter for those who don't as they could simply leave options such as those disabled anyway. It also affects the ability of critical combat bugs and misconceptions such as the data I posted about extensively here: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/131271/definitive-spell-resist-penetration-sharpened-trait-results-thread-bugs-stam-imbalance-and-why , from being caught in a timely manner, which harms the game as a whole.

GnatB

Wykkyd wrote: »

@Meggedo‌, add-ons couldn't hack you if they tried. This reveals how little you know about them.

They are plain text.
They can't talk to anything but the game client.
They can't talk to anything on your system, not even a text file.
The game client itself actually executes them, and limits what they can do.

True, but a lot of addons come in zip files/add-on managers/etc. which *could* be malicious.

idahogeekette

"REPLY" button on mail!!!!!

Maybe a do-not-sell toggle on some equipment.

And YES yes YES on the potion wheel! At least make each SLOT keybindable. I didn't find the add-on worked well because of the way it had to work with the built in limitations.

TehMagnus

Guess we can sum this up for the moderators silently reading our posts:

- UI limitations don't stop Elitism. Nothing can stop Elitism. (heck even if you completely remove the addons API it will still be possible to just ask some questions to test the pugs and see if they know their stuff as well as watch them fail during raids).
- A quick look @ ESOUI most popular section can let you know which add-ons and features are the most popular in the game.
- Most people agree that some basic interfaces like banking, Guild storage, grouping need work. <= You should start with this In my humble opinion.
- Quite a few of them find the Q potion selection wheel to be extremely user-unfriendly (and I'm being polite with my choice of words).
- A lot would like to see some basic addons implemented to the game and, amongst those who don't feel the need for those addons, most don't care if they are implemented as long as they can disable them.

TehMagnus

GnatB wrote: »

Wykkyd wrote: »

@Meggedo‌, add-ons couldn't hack you if they tried. This reveals how little you know about them.

They are plain text.
They can't talk to anything but the game client.
They can't talk to anything on your system, not even a text file.
The game client itself actually executes them, and limits what they can do.

True, but a lot of addons come in zip files/add-on managers/etc. which *could* be malicious.

Yeah, like everything else on the internet.. The add-ons are really safe, it's the launchers that inject code you need to worry about.

Attorneyatlawl

magnusnet wrote: »

GnatB wrote: »

Wykkyd wrote: »

@Meggedo‌, add-ons couldn't hack you if they tried. This reveals how little you know about them.

They are plain text.
They can't talk to anything but the game client.
They can't talk to anything on your system, not even a text file.
The game client itself actually executes them, and limits what they can do.

True, but a lot of addons come in zip files/add-on managers/etc. which *could* be malicious.

Yeah, like everything else on the internet.. The add-ons are really safe, it's the launchers that inject code you need to worry about.

Yup. I download the actual zip files, rather than relying on third parties, and install them myself .

magnusnet wrote: »

Guess we can sum this up for the moderators silently reading our posts:

- UI limitations don't stop Elitism. Nothing can stop Elitism. (heck even if you completely remove the addons API it will still be possible to just ask some questions to test the pugs and see if they know their stuff as well as watch them fail during raids).
- A quick look @ ESOUI most popular section can let you know which add-ons and features are the most popular in the game.
- Most people agree that some basic interfaces like banking, Guild storage, grouping need work. <= You should start with this In my humble opinion.
- Quite a few of them find the Q potion selection wheel to be extremely user-unfriendly (and I'm being polite with my choice of words).
- A lot would like to see some basic addons implemented to the game and amongst those who don't feel the need for those addons, they don't care as long as they can disable them.

I think that's a fair summary.