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https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/668861
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – November 18
• ESO Store and Account System for maintenance – November 19, 9:00AM EST (14:00 UTC) - 6:00PM EST (23:00 UTC)
• PlayStation®: EU megaserver for maintenance – November 19, 23:00 UTC (6:00PM EST) - November 20, 17:00 UTC (12:00PM EST)
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/668861
Shield Breaker - AKA "I win button"
-
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »A good player shouldn't be able to 1v2 2 other good players, if so there's a problem. With shield-stacking, and again while not a fan I have tested it just to see... I could take on 5 good players for some time. Your average player I could roll over without my health ever being touched thanks to shields. So yeah, suffice to say I never use that tactic as I find it borderline exploiting.
[...]
I doubt anyone could take on 5 good players by yourself.killingspreeb16_ESO wrote: »Well After play with this set,the only sorc i can kill easily are the one who think can facetank me,the good one well i just laugh when i try to light attack them when they just blink away spamming curse/frag minefield etc...
The only i win button here is shield stacking.
so if you want to nerf this set shield stacking should be nerfed too,currently bad or good this is the only counter.
So shieldstacking is OP and your proof is that the good shieldstackers fled while the bad ones died? Ok...phaseadept wrote: »Bring a pocket Healer? That's what most classes do in PvP in other games. I personally don't like to see classes good at everything. . . Sorcerers can tank, dps, escape, and CC. . .
I'd like to see more utility encouraging group play. . .
I think this set is only annoying because it's 1. New and 2. Sorcs have been complaining endlessly about it.
I play my Templar primarily, not exactly good at anything, but keep getting nerfed anyway.
I hate the idea having to bring a Templar for small scale. Just because other classes can't fill the healer roll sufficiently anymore with Healing Ward.
I've seen people take on 5 good players that weren't shield stacking by themselves. Heck 2 of my guildmates are in such scenarios on a regular basis. Although now, they are more cautious but this set hasn't gained much traction to put much of a dent into all of the shield stacking.
And I'm not saying shield stacking is "over powered", I'm saying it's borderline an exploit. My counter wasn't to say that bad ones die, it was to say that someone was complaining on these forums yesterday on the very same topic which got closed and re-directed here, that they were fighting 3 people no problem, have no problem 1v1 Shield Breakers, however when a shield breaker interrupts their 1v3 then they die. Basically they just admitted how ridiculous that is then complained that their cheap methods have a counter when they are outnumbered lmao.
Maybe we have different opinions of what is a "good" player then.
For example, in my eyes, a good player is also defined by the fact he usually will never lose a 2v1 as long as his ally is a good player as well and the enemy no emperor (or extreme cp advantage, wich does not exist in this magnitude).
"Good players" are rare though, and that is not because this game is difficult but because most players don't have a clue and don't care / know how to learn about it.
I know exactly what a good player is, we game daily. If I could make a list by names I would, however we know that's not permissible and don't start acting like it's rare.. there are a lot more good players than you think, sure there are plenty who are clueless but I know a pretty average Sorc that shield stacks that takes on some of the most popular leader board names. You can find some videos if you go search Youtube.
That doesn't change the topic however, the topic is about shield breaker vs shield stacking and shield stacking is viable in many more ways than shield breaker. Shield breaker has 1 purpose for it's 5 pcs bonus, shield stacking goes a veryyyyyyyyyy long way and becomes ridiculous.
LMAO, who cares for the leaderboard?
Bring me some of those "good" players for some duels, either on EU or on PTS if you're playing on NA.
Very curious what "good" means in your opinion, srsly.
For starters, I've never heard of you. LMAO @ PTS.... maybe EU has a shortage good players but NA has a reasonable amount. What do you consider "good"? Do you know that good is not great but better than average? But yes, feel free to come on NA live servers and experience the players we have. I'm sure there are some good players on EU, I just doubt you are one of them.
I'll be looking for your non-shield stacking montage however.
Edit: And yes leaderboard isn't always an indicator as we all know how that can be rigged or attained, however at least in NA, there are some consistencies with some of them... I can't speak for EU but I can for NA. Maybe you just all choose to Emp farm more than we do (although we've had our fair share of it, but not anywhere close to as much these days).
He´s pretty good on his sorc. Sad thing is however good or excellent players without zomgpwn vids don´t have any credibility anymore while above average ones with a montage of scrubs getting wrecked have.
Also lol on that eu bashing...<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 504 -
ThisOnePosts✭✭✭✭✭ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QBDbPvlj-c
Look at the health almost a tiny fraction compared to shields at one point. Health never moving. That's why shield breaker sets aren't enough, there needs to be more counters but a 5 piece set is a good start.
Also even though you weren't talking to me:
Kova, I see your in-game name is listed in your forum signature.. I'll make sure some people keep an eye out for ya with shield-breaker, you know so they can have your support making montages.
I would never resort to such cheap tactics on my Sorc. I prefer to you know... make it a fair fight and have a challenge. My Sorc can put up some sick damage numbers when not focusing on shields, although you can do enough damage to kill people with shields stacked, I prefer to play more aggressively and less like a pansy.
wow @ the video. thats insane. they didnt even dent his hp. he wasnt doing anything skilled. he didnt even have to dodge or do anything. just run around and dps. so glad this set exists now.
There was not a single max level enemy in that video. ffs
6 players were able to attack him 6 times within a 50+sec timeframe thats 1attack per minute for each of them - these players are awesomely good. they will probbably die to a crab...
Oh, so in some threads we have people complaining about lower levels killing them because of the buff they get, but then here that doesn't apply... also what level is this guy? Oh, that's right.. assumptions. Regardless, NOT A SINGLE GOOD DENT INTO HIS HEALTH. 1x per minute? You must've watched the video in slow-mo
you will never see me complain about battlelvled players - they are at best a nuisence but thats all as it takes longer to get rid of them due to their high health pools but because of their horrible offensive resources they are unable to get through my vigor.ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QBDbPvlj-c
Look at the health almost a tiny fraction compared to shields at one point. Health never moving. That's why shield breaker sets aren't enough, there needs to be more counters but a 5 piece set is a good start.
Also even though you weren't talking to me:
Kova, I see your in-game name is listed in your forum signature.. I'll make sure some people keep an eye out for ya with shield-breaker, you know so they can have your support making montages.
I would never resort to such cheap tactics on my Sorc. I prefer to you know... make it a fair fight and have a challenge. My Sorc can put up some sick damage numbers when not focusing on shields, although you can do enough damage to kill people with shields stacked, I prefer to play more aggressively and less like a pansy.
a bit of search would have lead you directly to the never fixed UI bug of not properly "deleted" shields that on top stacks unlimited within the UI but not on the char - with an actual usefull UI wich ZOS failed to deliver on any gameing device you would have seen sth like this:
http://i.imgur.com/8lgF87L.png
and over 200k shield value is in no way possible regardless of the class...
as you can see in your vid the ending of his annulement doesn´t changed the displayed shield value thus it clearly indicates the buginess of the ui but not the actual "OPness" of sorc shield stacking.
I never said there weren't bugs in the UI, I have a Sorc. I can also shield stack 80% of my health with ease and keep applying it. I know some people who have set up their characters to do even MORE. You are confusing a UI glitch with actual shield stacking which is a real thing and not a glitch.
It didn't show the shield numbers in the video. Who knows whether the UI was showing more shield than there is or not but it was showing the health not moving and you never saw his screen flashing red. Even that many noobs of the same level should be able to at least put a dent in the very best of players out in the open like that. It's like they were fighting an IC District boss but all of their damage was just being absorbed and disappearing.
There is no two ways about it. Shield Stacking needed a counter and now it has one. A sorc doesn't need to shield stack to be very good or competitive. If you do, you're doing it wrong.
as the base UI shows health and shields at a 1:1 ratio in your linked vid the shield amount was 90+% of the bar wich resemble to an amount of shields equal to 9x his HP pool with a lets say not uncommon 20k health pool this means ~180.000 shield value and this is impossible to stack in any way or form without the display bug.
so you are not understanding what you are visioning.
I understand exactly what I am "visioning".. I think you mean seeing.
But back on point, there is no evidence as to the numbers of what his health is so you can't say what his shields are but you can see his health is barely ever touched and that's not a UI bug... also again no red flashing of his screen with that many people attacking him.. Maybe he has everything in Magicka? You do know that Sorcs can reach some ridiculous shield levels when set up for it, right?
Here's another video with numbers for ya, watch how the shield stacking allows for this, watch it just zoom up cover his entire health bar quickly over and over:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJI5YqpXbtU
And people complained about Vamps.. shield stackers are just as ridiculous as what the vamp ulti used to do and that you could move away from, shield is cast on the person casting it so there's no stopping it unless it's a a few people, a very bad sorc, someone specifically geared to take out shields, or a longgg shield stacker duel.
There's no way on Earth you are stopping me if I shield stack on my sorc without help from others or you leveling the playing field with a shield breaker set in which when a non-shield NB is your next fight, you realize what you sacrificed just to focus on fighting people with ridiculous triple stacked shields.
You show me one of the best two Sorcs on both Servers killing way less skilled players.
And call that equal to this...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ucmjldufa6U
Best two sorcs? Good, but I wouldn't go that far. Regardless that bit is a matter of opinion, what's not is how do you know the skill level of those he's battling? You are making assumptions.
Here's a whole bunch of videos to choose from, where in most are shield stacking with 3 shields:
https://www.google.com/#q=ESO+sorc+1vx&tbm=vid
here is a bunch of DKs:
https://www.google.de/?gfe_rd=cr&ei=1RLsVZX5Coir8weEg4TwAw#tbm=vid&q=ESO+DK+1vx
Templar(even more vids than sorcs^^ temps are cleary out of whack):
https://www.google.de/?gfe_rd=cr&ei=1RLsVZX5Coir8weEg4TwAw#tbm=vid&q=ESO+templar+1vx
and NBs:
https://www.google.de/?gfe_rd=cr&ei=1RLsVZX5Coir8weEg4TwAw#tbm=vid&q=ESO+NB+1vx
so what again was your point all 4 classes are capable of rocking the *** out of noobs who are needed in case of 1vsX as two or more good players whipe the floor with any opponents class.
Now if you took any two of those players and put them against a medicore sorc shield stacker, they'd most likely have no chance.
Search the forums for shield stacking.... there aren't an over-abundance of NBs running around 1vXing anyone. Dks used to... Temps used to... once in a while they still do, but I see Sorcs doing it on a regular basis and the videos are popping up like crazy.. look how many within the last few months across all platforms. Go on, go search again.1 -
ThisOnePosts✭✭✭✭✭ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »A good player shouldn't be able to 1v2 2 other good players, if so there's a problem. With shield-stacking, and again while not a fan I have tested it just to see... I could take on 5 good players for some time. Your average player I could roll over without my health ever being touched thanks to shields. So yeah, suffice to say I never use that tactic as I find it borderline exploiting.
[...]
I doubt anyone could take on 5 good players by yourself.killingspreeb16_ESO wrote: »Well After play with this set,the only sorc i can kill easily are the one who think can facetank me,the good one well i just laugh when i try to light attack them when they just blink away spamming curse/frag minefield etc...
The only i win button here is shield stacking.
so if you want to nerf this set shield stacking should be nerfed too,currently bad or good this is the only counter.
So shieldstacking is OP and your proof is that the good shieldstackers fled while the bad ones died? Ok...phaseadept wrote: »Bring a pocket Healer? That's what most classes do in PvP in other games. I personally don't like to see classes good at everything. . . Sorcerers can tank, dps, escape, and CC. . .
I'd like to see more utility encouraging group play. . .
I think this set is only annoying because it's 1. New and 2. Sorcs have been complaining endlessly about it.
I play my Templar primarily, not exactly good at anything, but keep getting nerfed anyway.
I hate the idea having to bring a Templar for small scale. Just because other classes can't fill the healer roll sufficiently anymore with Healing Ward.
I've seen people take on 5 good players that weren't shield stacking by themselves. Heck 2 of my guildmates are in such scenarios on a regular basis. Although now, they are more cautious but this set hasn't gained much traction to put much of a dent into all of the shield stacking.
And I'm not saying shield stacking is "over powered", I'm saying it's borderline an exploit. My counter wasn't to say that bad ones die, it was to say that someone was complaining on these forums yesterday on the very same topic which got closed and re-directed here, that they were fighting 3 people no problem, have no problem 1v1 Shield Breakers, however when a shield breaker interrupts their 1v3 then they die. Basically they just admitted how ridiculous that is then complained that their cheap methods have a counter when they are outnumbered lmao.
Maybe we have different opinions of what is a "good" player then.
For example, in my eyes, a good player is also defined by the fact he usually will never lose a 2v1 as long as his ally is a good player as well and the enemy no emperor (or extreme cp advantage, wich does not exist in this magnitude).
"Good players" are rare though, and that is not because this game is difficult but because most players don't have a clue and don't care / know how to learn about it.
I know exactly what a good player is, we game daily. If I could make a list by names I would, however we know that's not permissible and don't start acting like it's rare.. there are a lot more good players than you think, sure there are plenty who are clueless but I know a pretty average Sorc that shield stacks that takes on some of the most popular leader board names. You can find some videos if you go search Youtube.
That doesn't change the topic however, the topic is about shield breaker vs shield stacking and shield stacking is viable in many more ways than shield breaker. Shield breaker has 1 purpose for it's 5 pcs bonus, shield stacking goes a veryyyyyyyyyy long way and becomes ridiculous.
LMAO, who cares for the leaderboard?
Bring me some of those "good" players for some duels, either on EU or on PTS if you're playing on NA.
Very curious what "good" means in your opinion, srsly.
For starters, I've never heard of you. LMAO @ PTS.... maybe EU has a shortage good players but NA has a reasonable amount. What do you consider "good"? Do you know that good is not great but better than average? But yes, feel free to come on NA live servers and experience the players we have. I'm sure there are some good players on EU, I just doubt you are one of them.
I'll be looking for your non-shield stacking montage however.
Edit: And yes leaderboard isn't always an indicator as we all know how that can be rigged or attained, however at least in NA, there are some consistencies with some of them... I can't speak for EU but I can for NA. Maybe you just all choose to Emp farm more than we do (although we've had our fair share of it, but not anywhere close to as much these days).
He´s pretty good on his sorc. Sad thing is however good or excellent players without zomgpwn vids don´t have any credibility anymore while above average ones with a montage of scrubs getting wrecked have.
Also lol on that eu bashing...
"pretty good", okay so not great. Didn't think so and that was an assumption since I haven't heard of him but yep, at least it was a correct one.
Also I wasn't bashing EU. I said clearly I can't speak for EU as I don't play on the EU mega-server, I can only speak from experiences on NA PC and NA XB1.0 -
ThisOnePosts✭✭✭✭✭Hmm. So shield stackers are vulnerable to shield breaker. They don't like it.
Is there another counter to the max magicka shield stack build? Don't tell me to attack the stamina pool. Don't tell me to L2P. Don't tell me to just leave sorcs alone.
We all tried all of that *** for six months. Six months of you guys face tanking unholy amounts of dps.
Meanwhile, how many sorc forum superheroes have we had to see post 1vx vids of them exploiting with double mundus and overload bug? And there was only a smattering of criticism. None of you ever offered a real solution to the problem of shield stacking. And those damn exploiters only made the perception worse.
Now there is 1! set, that is suboptimal against literally everything else, and is only for medium armor users that counters shield stacking.
So you are pissed. What should you do?
Try attacking the stamina pool? Leave those with shield breaker alone? L2P?
I'm at a loss here.
QFT0 -
ToRelax✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭This thread is golden, pls don't stop. The only tears I shed are of joy right now, but please continue, it's too awesome.
DAGON - ALTADOON - CHIM - GHARTOK
The Covenant is broken. The Enemy has won...
Elo'dryel - Sorc - AR 50 - Hopesfire - EP EU1 -
ThisOnePosts✭✭✭✭✭This thread is golden, pls don't stop. The only tears I shed are of joy right now, but please continue, it's too awesome.
Oh yep I'm sure. I already imagine you were raging at the screen as your shield stacking didn't hold up against someone earlier and so you turned to the forums. LOL 0 -
FriedEggSandwich✭✭✭✭✭
✭ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QBDbPvlj-c
Look at the health almost a tiny fraction compared to shields at one point. Health never moving. That's why shield breaker sets aren't enough, there needs to be more counters but a 5 piece set is a good start.
Also even though you weren't talking to me:
Kova, I see your in-game name is listed in your forum signature.. I'll make sure some people keep an eye out for ya with shield-breaker, you know so they can have your support making montages.
I would never resort to such cheap tactics on my Sorc. I prefer to you know... make it a fair fight and have a challenge. My Sorc can put up some sick damage numbers when not focusing on shields, although you can do enough damage to kill people with shields stacked, I prefer to play more aggressively and less like a pansy.
a bit of search would have lead you directly to the never fixed UI bug of not properly "deleted" shields that on top stacks unlimited within the UI but not on the char - with an actual usefull UI wich ZOS failed to deliver on any gameing device you would have seen sth like this:
http://i.imgur.com/8lgF87L.png
and over 200k shield value is in no way possible regardless of the class...
as you can see in your vid the ending of his annulement doesn´t changed the displayed shield value thus it clearly indicates the buginess of the ui but not the actual "OPness" of sorc shield stacking.
I never said there weren't bugs in the UI, I have a Sorc. I can also shield stack 80% of my health with ease and keep applying it. I know some people who have set up their characters to do even MORE. You are confusing a UI glitch with actual shield stacking which is a real thing and not a glitch.
It didn't show the shield numbers in the video. Who knows whether the UI was showing more shield than there is or not but it was showing the health not moving and you never saw his screen flashing red. Even that many noobs of the same level should be able to at least put a dent in the very best of players out in the open like that. It's like they were fighting an IC District boss but all of their damage was just being absorbed and disappearing.
There is no two ways about it. Shield Stacking needed a counter and now it has one. A sorc doesn't need to shield stack to be very good or competitive. If you do, you're doing it wrong.
as the base UI shows health and shields at a 1:1 ratio in your linked vid the shield amount was 90+% of the bar wich resemble to an amount of shields equal to 9x his HP pool with a lets say not uncommon 20k health pool this means ~180.000 shield value and this is impossible to stack in any way or form without the display bug.
so you are not understanding what you are visioning.
I understand exactly what I am "visioning".. I think you mean seeing.
But back on point, there is no evidence as to the numbers of what his health is so you can't say what his shields are but you can see his health is barely ever touched and that's not a UI bug... also again no red flashing of his screen with that many people attacking him.. Maybe he has everything in Magicka? You do know that Sorcs can reach some ridiculous shield levels when set up for it, right?
Here's another video with numbers for ya, watch how the shield stacking allows for this, watch it just zoom up cover his entire health bar quickly over and over:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJI5YqpXbtU
And people complained about Vamps.. shield stackers are just as ridiculous as what the vamp ulti used to do and that you could move away from, shield is cast on the person casting it so there's no stopping it unless it's a a few people, a very bad sorc, someone specifically geared to take out shields, or a longgg shield stacker duel.
There's no way on Earth you are stopping me if I shield stack on my sorc without help from others or you leveling the playing field with a shield breaker set in which when a non-shield NB is your next fight, you realize what you sacrificed just to focus on fighting people with ridiculous triple stacked shields.
You show me one of the best two Sorcs on both Servers killing way less skilled players.
And call that equal to this...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ucmjldufa6U
Best two sorcs? Good, but I wouldn't go that far. Regardless that bit is a matter of opinion, what's not is how do you know the skill level of those he's battling? You are making assumptions.
Here's a whole bunch of videos to choose from, where in most are shield stacking with 3 shields:
https://www.google.com/#q=ESO+sorc+1vx&tbm=vid
You made some assumptions about the players in the video you posted too. You're losing credibility. As for the last video; look how quickly his shields drop though, think about how easy it would have been for one or more of them to finish him off with a cc damage combo while his shield was at its lowest. Take a player who has made it to the high ranks of moon and stars and throw them in with sub v14 veterans and lieutenants and this will happen.Edited by FriedEggSandwich on 6 September 2015 10:44PC | EU1 -
Grimbim✭✭Little rational arguments for the shield breaker set in it's current form, primarily hatred and spitefulness against sorcs. Like before in the concurrent pts thread about the shield breaker set. It's interesting that most of the players with there biased "arguments" have a nb as their main...
Apart from this, shield stacking and the shield breaker set suck. ZOS should remove both. Maybe remove the bubble from steadfast ward and morphs and make it an instant heal or like vigor. Replace the annulment bubble by another useful defense ability.Edited by Grimbim on 6 September 2015 10:492 -
ToRelax✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ViciousWayz wrote: »This thread is golden, pls don't stop. The only tears I shed are of joy right now, but please continue, it's too awesome.
Oh yep I'm sure. I already imagine you were raging at the screen as your shield stacking didn't hold up against someone earlier and so you turned to the forums. LOL
Actually I've not been playing today at all and yesterday I was theorycrafting a DK build.
But to get this going again, aka on topic:ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »A good player shouldn't be able to 1v2 2 other good players, if so there's a problem. With shield-stacking, and again while not a fan I have tested it just to see... I could take on 5 good players for some time. Your average player I could roll over without my health ever being touched thanks to shields. So yeah, suffice to say I never use that tactic as I find it borderline exploiting.
[...]
I doubt anyone could take on 5 good players by yourself.killingspreeb16_ESO wrote: »Well After play with this set,the only sorc i can kill easily are the one who think can facetank me,the good one well i just laugh when i try to light attack them when they just blink away spamming curse/frag minefield etc...
The only i win button here is shield stacking.
so if you want to nerf this set shield stacking should be nerfed too,currently bad or good this is the only counter.
So shieldstacking is OP and your proof is that the good shieldstackers fled while the bad ones died? Ok...phaseadept wrote: »Bring a pocket Healer? That's what most classes do in PvP in other games. I personally don't like to see classes good at everything. . . Sorcerers can tank, dps, escape, and CC. . .
I'd like to see more utility encouraging group play. . .
I think this set is only annoying because it's 1. New and 2. Sorcs have been complaining endlessly about it.
I play my Templar primarily, not exactly good at anything, but keep getting nerfed anyway.
I hate the idea having to bring a Templar for small scale. Just because other classes can't fill the healer roll sufficiently anymore with Healing Ward.
I've seen people take on 5 good players that weren't shield stacking by themselves. Heck 2 of my guildmates are in such scenarios on a regular basis. Although now, they are more cautious but this set hasn't gained much traction to put much of a dent into all of the shield stacking.
And I'm not saying shield stacking is "over powered", I'm saying it's borderline an exploit. My counter wasn't to say that bad ones die, it was to say that someone was complaining on these forums yesterday on the very same topic which got closed and re-directed here, that they were fighting 3 people no problem, have no problem 1v1 Shield Breakers, however when a shield breaker interrupts their 1v3 then they die. Basically they just admitted how ridiculous that is then complained that their cheap methods have a counter when they are outnumbered lmao.
Maybe we have different opinions of what is a "good" player then.
For example, in my eyes, a good player is also defined by the fact he usually will never lose a 2v1 as long as his ally is a good player as well and the enemy no emperor (or extreme cp advantage, wich does not exist in this magnitude).
"Good players" are rare though, and that is not because this game is difficult but because most players don't have a clue and don't care / know how to learn about it.
I know exactly what a good player is, we game daily. If I could make a list by names I would, however we know that's not permissible and don't start acting like it's rare.. there are a lot more good players than you think, sure there are plenty who are clueless but I know a pretty average Sorc that shield stacks that takes on some of the most popular leader board names. You can find some videos if you go search Youtube.
That doesn't change the topic however, the topic is about shield breaker vs shield stacking and shield stacking is viable in many more ways than shield breaker. Shield breaker has 1 purpose for it's 5 pcs bonus, shield stacking goes a veryyyyyyyyyy long way and becomes ridiculous.
LMAO, who cares for the leaderboard?
Bring me some of those "good" players for some duels, either on EU or on PTS if you're playing on NA.
Very curious what "good" means in your opinion, srsly.
For starters, I've never heard of you. LMAO @ PTS.... maybe EU has a shortage good players but NA has a reasonable amount. What do you consider "good"? Do you know that good is not great but better than average? But yes, feel free to come on NA live servers and experience the players we have. I'm sure there are some good players on EU, I just doubt you are one of them.
I'll be looking for your non-shield stacking montage however.
Edit: And yes leaderboard isn't always an indicator as we all know how that can be rigged or attained, however at least in NA, there are some consistencies with some of them... I can't speak for EU but I can for NA. Maybe you just all choose to Emp farm more than we do (although we've had our fair share of it, but not anywhere close to as much these days).
So you are not coming to fight me and just assume I'm not as good as I pretend, despite me being the only one willing to prove it?ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QBDbPvlj-c
Look at the health almost a tiny fraction compared to shields at one point. Health never moving. That's why shield breaker sets aren't enough, there needs to be more counters but a 5 piece set is a good start.
Also even though you weren't talking to me:
Kova, I see your in-game name is listed in your forum signature.. I'll make sure some people keep an eye out for ya with shield-breaker, you know so they can have your support making montages.
I would never resort to such cheap tactics on my Sorc. I prefer to you know... make it a fair fight and have a challenge. My Sorc can put up some sick damage numbers when not focusing on shields, although you can do enough damage to kill people with shields stacked, I prefer to play more aggressively and less like a pansy.
a bit of search would have lead you directly to the never fixed UI bug of not properly "deleted" shields that on top stacks unlimited within the UI but not on the char - with an actual usefull UI wich ZOS failed to deliver on any gameing device you would have seen sth like this:
http://i.imgur.com/8lgF87L.png
and over 200k shield value is in no way possible regardless of the class...
as you can see in your vid the ending of his annulement doesn´t changed the displayed shield value thus it clearly indicates the buginess of the ui but not the actual "OPness" of sorc shield stacking.
I never said there weren't bugs in the UI, I have a Sorc. I can also shield stack 80% of my health with ease and keep applying it. I know some people who have set up their characters to do even MORE. You are confusing a UI glitch with actual shield stacking which is a real thing and not a glitch.
It didn't show the shield numbers in the video. Who knows whether the UI was showing more shield than there is or not but it was showing the health not moving and you never saw his screen flashing red. Even that many noobs of the same level should be able to at least put a dent in the very best of players out in the open like that. It's like they were fighting an IC District boss but all of their damage was just being absorbed and disappearing.
There is no two ways about it. Shield Stacking needed a counter and now it has one. A sorc doesn't need to shield stack to be very good or competitive. If you do, you're doing it wrong.
as the base UI shows health and shields at a 1:1 ratio in your linked vid the shield amount was 90+% of the bar wich resemble to an amount of shields equal to 9x his HP pool with a lets say not uncommon 20k health pool this means ~180.000 shield value and this is impossible to stack in any way or form without the display bug.
so you are not understanding what you are visioning.
I understand exactly what I am "visioning".. I think you mean seeing.
But back on point, there is no evidence as to the numbers of what his health is so you can't say what his shields are but you can see his health is barely ever touched and that's not a UI bug... also again no red flashing of his screen with that many people attacking him.. Maybe he has everything in Magicka? You do know that Sorcs can reach some ridiculous shield levels when set up for it, right?
Here's another video with numbers for ya, watch how the shield stacking allows for this, watch it just zoom up cover his entire health bar quickly over and over:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJI5YqpXbtU
And people complained about Vamps.. shield stackers are just as ridiculous as what the vamp ulti used to do and that you could move away from, shield is cast on the person casting it so there's no stopping it unless it's a a few people, a very bad sorc, someone specifically geared to take out shields, or a longgg shield stacker duel.
There's no way on Earth you are stopping me if I shield stack on my sorc without help from others or you leveling the playing field with a shield breaker set in which when a non-shield NB is your next fight, you realize what you sacrificed just to focus on fighting people with ridiculous triple stacked shields.
You show me one of the best two Sorcs on both Servers killing way less skilled players.
And call that equal to this...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ucmjldufa6U
Best two sorcs? Good, but I wouldn't go that far. Regardless that bit is a matter of opinion, what's not is how do you know the skill level of those he's battling? You are making assumptions.
Here's a whole bunch of videos to choose from, where in most are shield stacking with 3 shields:
https://www.google.com/#q=ESO+sorc+1vx&tbm=vid
I am basing my opinions on what I see combined with my own experiences. I fought German on PTS during 2.0 and without trying to brag, I am a very good Sorc myself. I see the mistakes the enemies are doing in 1vX videos.
Compare that to your claim that shieldstacking would be as rediculous as vampirism once was. I have never seen a video of a shieldstacker who was fighting an enemy zerg solo and chatting meanwhile...
No, comparing it to Vampirism is exactly right. Answer this, are you able to make your way into a zerg and get on out with maybe a kill or two without shield stacking? What about with?
Sure the batswarm thing was more intense when more noobs were present because they'd stand right in it, but that's a whole other issue. There is no standing in shields. It's you stacking them on yourself.
You are on here fighting really hard on behalf of shield stacking. It must be really your one dimension.
Pro tip: L2P without shield stacking or find a way to avoid shield breakers, because either ZOS is going to continue with making counters for things or they'll nerf shield stacking into the ground which hopefully isn't the case as no one likes nerfs. At least counters provide more initiative to play and adapt, becoming a better player. You choose instead to cling on to shield stacking being 100% viable instead of looking through unbiased eyes and seeing just how one-sided it is... now while non-shield breakers are still having a hard time with shield-stackers, shield stackers will have a battle on their hand with those geared to take them on. Stop the crying already, it's beginning to look desperate.
How on earth is shieldstacking comparable to 0 cost batswarm? I would take the latter anyday and wipe the floor with all those zergs lol.DAGON - ALTADOON - CHIM - GHARTOK
The Covenant is broken. The Enemy has won...
Elo'dryel - Sorc - AR 50 - Hopesfire - EP EU1 -
RoamingRiverElk✭✭✭✭✭ViciousWayz wrote: »And I'm not saying shield stacking is "over powered", I'm saying it's borderline an exploit.
Then all those attacks that neutralize hardened ward with one attack must be borderline exploits too...Dalris Aalr - Magicka (Stamina) DK | Dalfish - Magicka Sorc | Dal Aalr - Magicka Warden | Dalrish - Mag/Stam NB | Irana Aalr - PvE Templar1 -
RoamingRiverElk✭✭✭✭✭ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »A good player shouldn't be able to 1v2 2 other good players, if so there's a problem. With shield-stacking, and again while not a fan I have tested it just to see... I could take on 5 good players for some time. Your average player I could roll over without my health ever being touched thanks to shields. So yeah, suffice to say I never use that tactic as I find it borderline exploiting.
[...]
I doubt anyone could take on 5 good players by yourself.killingspreeb16_ESO wrote: »Well After play with this set,the only sorc i can kill easily are the one who think can facetank me,the good one well i just laugh when i try to light attack them when they just blink away spamming curse/frag minefield etc...
The only i win button here is shield stacking.
so if you want to nerf this set shield stacking should be nerfed too,currently bad or good this is the only counter.
So shieldstacking is OP and your proof is that the good shieldstackers fled while the bad ones died? Ok...phaseadept wrote: »Bring a pocket Healer? That's what most classes do in PvP in other games. I personally don't like to see classes good at everything. . . Sorcerers can tank, dps, escape, and CC. . .
I'd like to see more utility encouraging group play. . .
I think this set is only annoying because it's 1. New and 2. Sorcs have been complaining endlessly about it.
I play my Templar primarily, not exactly good at anything, but keep getting nerfed anyway.
I hate the idea having to bring a Templar for small scale. Just because other classes can't fill the healer roll sufficiently anymore with Healing Ward.
I've seen people take on 5 good players that weren't shield stacking by themselves. Heck 2 of my guildmates are in such scenarios on a regular basis. Although now, they are more cautious but this set hasn't gained much traction to put much of a dent into all of the shield stacking.
And I'm not saying shield stacking is "over powered", I'm saying it's borderline an exploit. My counter wasn't to say that bad ones die, it was to say that someone was complaining on these forums yesterday on the very same topic which got closed and re-directed here, that they were fighting 3 people no problem, have no problem 1v1 Shield Breakers, however when a shield breaker interrupts their 1v3 then they die. Basically they just admitted how ridiculous that is then complained that their cheap methods have a counter when they are outnumbered lmao.
Maybe we have different opinions of what is a "good" player then.
For example, in my eyes, a good player is also defined by the fact he usually will never lose a 2v1 as long as his ally is a good player as well and the enemy no emperor (or extreme cp advantage, wich does not exist in this magnitude).
"Good players" are rare though, and that is not because this game is difficult but because most players don't have a clue and don't care / know how to learn about it.
I know exactly what a good player is, we game daily. If I could make a list by names I would, however we know that's not permissible and don't start acting like it's rare.. there are a lot more good players than you think, sure there are plenty who are clueless but I know a pretty average Sorc that shield stacks that takes on some of the most popular leader board names. You can find some videos if you go search Youtube.
That doesn't change the topic however, the topic is about shield breaker vs shield stacking and shield stacking is viable in many more ways than shield breaker. Shield breaker has 1 purpose for it's 5 pcs bonus, shield stacking goes a veryyyyyyyyyy long way and becomes ridiculous.
LMAO, who cares for the leaderboard?
Bring me some of those "good" players for some duels, either on EU or on PTS if you're playing on NA.
Very curious what "good" means in your opinion, srsly.
For starters, I've never heard of you. LMAO @ PTS.... maybe EU has a shortage good players but NA has a reasonable amount. What do you consider "good"? Do you know that good is not great but better than average? But yes, feel free to come on NA live servers and experience the players we have. I'm sure there are some good players on EU, I just doubt you are one of them.
I'll be looking for your non-shield stacking montage however.
Edit: And yes leaderboard isn't always an indicator as we all know how that can be rigged or attained, however at least in NA, there are some consistencies with some of them... I can't speak for EU but I can for NA. Maybe you just all choose to Emp farm more than we do (although we've had our fair share of it, but not anywhere close to as much these days).
He´s pretty good on his sorc. Sad thing is however good or excellent players without zomgpwn vids don´t have any credibility anymore while above average ones with a montage of scrubs getting wrecked have.
Also lol on that eu bashing...
"pretty good", okay so not great. Didn't think so and that was an assumption since I haven't heard of him but yep, at least it was a correct one.
Also I wasn't bashing EU. I said clearly I can't speak for EU as I don't play on the EU mega-server, I can only speak from experiences on NA PC and NA XB1.
Just download PTS already, I'll come watch your duel. ^^Dalris Aalr - Magicka (Stamina) DK | Dalfish - Magicka Sorc | Dal Aalr - Magicka Warden | Dalrish - Mag/Stam NB | Irana Aalr - PvE Templar1 -
ViciousWayz wrote: »mjones433b16_ESO wrote: »
You get a buff while in Cyrodiil. All players do. Check under your character sheet while in Cyrodiil for "Battle Spirit" and hover your mouse over it.
ye but why does my magic go down by 10k??0 -
mjones433b16_ESO wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »mjones433b16_ESO wrote: »
You get a buff while in Cyrodiil. All players do. Check under your character sheet while in Cyrodiil for "Battle Spirit" and hover your mouse over it.
ye but why does my magic go down by 10k??
You're not a v14+, so you are being battleleved.You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life.
Winston Churchill0 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »A good player shouldn't be able to 1v2 2 other good players, if so there's a problem. With shield-stacking, and again while not a fan I have tested it just to see... I could take on 5 good players for some time. Your average player I could roll over without my health ever being touched thanks to shields. So yeah, suffice to say I never use that tactic as I find it borderline exploiting.
[...]
I doubt anyone could take on 5 good players by yourself.killingspreeb16_ESO wrote: »Well After play with this set,the only sorc i can kill easily are the one who think can facetank me,the good one well i just laugh when i try to light attack them when they just blink away spamming curse/frag minefield etc...
The only i win button here is shield stacking.
so if you want to nerf this set shield stacking should be nerfed too,currently bad or good this is the only counter.
So shieldstacking is OP and your proof is that the good shieldstackers fled while the bad ones died? Ok...phaseadept wrote: »Bring a pocket Healer? That's what most classes do in PvP in other games. I personally don't like to see classes good at everything. . . Sorcerers can tank, dps, escape, and CC. . .
I'd like to see more utility encouraging group play. . .
I think this set is only annoying because it's 1. New and 2. Sorcs have been complaining endlessly about it.
I play my Templar primarily, not exactly good at anything, but keep getting nerfed anyway.
I hate the idea having to bring a Templar for small scale. Just because other classes can't fill the healer roll sufficiently anymore with Healing Ward.
I've seen people take on 5 good players that weren't shield stacking by themselves. Heck 2 of my guildmates are in such scenarios on a regular basis. Although now, they are more cautious but this set hasn't gained much traction to put much of a dent into all of the shield stacking.
And I'm not saying shield stacking is "over powered", I'm saying it's borderline an exploit. My counter wasn't to say that bad ones die, it was to say that someone was complaining on these forums yesterday on the very same topic which got closed and re-directed here, that they were fighting 3 people no problem, have no problem 1v1 Shield Breakers, however when a shield breaker interrupts their 1v3 then they die. Basically they just admitted how ridiculous that is then complained that their cheap methods have a counter when they are outnumbered lmao.
Maybe we have different opinions of what is a "good" player then.
For example, in my eyes, a good player is also defined by the fact he usually will never lose a 2v1 as long as his ally is a good player as well and the enemy no emperor (or extreme cp advantage, wich does not exist in this magnitude).
"Good players" are rare though, and that is not because this game is difficult but because most players don't have a clue and don't care / know how to learn about it.
I know exactly what a good player is, we game daily. If I could make a list by names I would, however we know that's not permissible and don't start acting like it's rare.. there are a lot more good players than you think, sure there are plenty who are clueless but I know a pretty average Sorc that shield stacks that takes on some of the most popular leader board names. You can find some videos if you go search Youtube.
That doesn't change the topic however, the topic is about shield breaker vs shield stacking and shield stacking is viable in many more ways than shield breaker. Shield breaker has 1 purpose for it's 5 pcs bonus, shield stacking goes a veryyyyyyyyyy long way and becomes ridiculous.
LMAO, who cares for the leaderboard?
Bring me some of those "good" players for some duels, either on EU or on PTS if you're playing on NA.
Very curious what "good" means in your opinion, srsly.
For starters, I've never heard of you. LMAO @ PTS.... maybe EU has a shortage good players but NA has a reasonable amount. What do you consider "good"? Do you know that good is not great but better than average? But yes, feel free to come on NA live servers and experience the players we have. I'm sure there are some good players on EU, I just doubt you are one of them.
I'll be looking for your non-shield stacking montage however.
Edit: And yes leaderboard isn't always an indicator as we all know how that can be rigged or attained, however at least in NA, there are some consistencies with some of them... I can't speak for EU but I can for NA. Maybe you just all choose to Emp farm more than we do (although we've had our fair share of it, but not anywhere close to as much these days).
He´s pretty good on his sorc. Sad thing is however good or excellent players without zomgpwn vids don´t have any credibility anymore while above average ones with a montage of scrubs getting wrecked have.
Also lol on that eu bashing...
"pretty good", okay so not great. Didn't think so and that was an assumption since I haven't heard of him but yep, at least it was a correct one.
Also I wasn't bashing EU. I said clearly I can't speak for EU as I don't play on the EU mega-server, I can only speak from experiences on NA PC and NA XB1.
Pretty good in that context means he can go toe to toe with about every good player i know of.
Can´t comment on greatness in this games context - i think it´s safe to say he´s in the top 5% for eu pvp players.<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 502 -
Sublime✭✭✭✭ViciousWayz wrote: »As you probably realized, the last patch contained a set that makes shields useles as only defensive tool. In that regard I'd like to encourage my fellow class-mates (not correlation intended, seriously) to produce and share ideas on how to successfully 1vX as 2.1 sorcerer.
To start it off I'd like to share an idea that I had some days ago:
I'm still going to use the triple shield combo as it still is really strong against anybody that doesn't use shieldbreaker.
Now to avoid shieldbreaker I have to either find a way to eat less light attacks or get more consistent heals.
As combat basically got slowed down by 50%, having 20k HP isn't that important anymore, which allows me to go for stam/magicka regen drinks.
......................
That's a quote from another thread (it's a long, theory-crafting post) but as you can see, the bolded part. They say: "triple shield combo is really strong against anybody that doesn't use shieldbreaker".
I have a Sorc. I know this to be true. Who are you fooling by trying to dismiss this? There it is, another Sorc actually admitting that it's very strong against anybody not using that set. If you keep trying to apply your shields while fighting someone using that set, all you are doing is wasting your magicka while they get to damage you, AS INTENDED. So... BATTLE IT OUT. Like PVP is supposed to. Oh, shield breaker??? Don't spam your triple shields, simple. If your setup is entirely for the purpose of relying on that, you can't expect a 100% fool-proof system. Let's say 10% of all players start using shield breaker (which is a very high number atm), that would mean against 90% of the player base you'll have a severe advantage, if let's say all skills are equal (player skills). Do you really think that it's not ridiculous? And you cry that a very small percent of the player base can keep you from doing the same routine you will do versus every single person? Every class has to mix it up depending on who they are fighting, why should 1 class have an exception? And yes I know you can shield stack on Temps/DKs but on a Sorc you can do it on a whole other level especially since most are running resto on at least one of their bars and getting that third shield + healing.
Fun facts:
- I haven't played 2.1 on live yet, so all my knowledge is from PTS.
- This setup hasn't been tested yet, so this whole post is base on theory only.
Since the shieldbreaker set is the only nerf to shields, it results in a very polarized view on combat including shields. If sh8eldbreaker is included, shields will appear contraproductive to medicore, whereas if the set doesn't play a part shields will retain the same streangth they had in 2.0. In the end I'd suggest to rather give the skills their deserved nerf instead of giving the player a choice to either make some sacrifices and stomp shieldusers or be forced to face the untouched shields of 2.0.EU | For those who want to improve their behaviour: the science behind shaping player bahaviour (presentation)2 -
killingspreeb16_ESO✭✭✭✭ViciousWayz wrote: »A good player shouldn't be able to 1v2 2 other good players, if so there's a problem. With shield-stacking, and again while not a fan I have tested it just to see... I could take on 5 good players for some time. Your average player I could roll over without my health ever being touched thanks to shields. So yeah, suffice to say I never use that tactic as I find it borderline exploiting.
[...]
I doubt anyone could take on 5 good players by yourself.killingspreeb16_ESO wrote: »Well After play with this set,the only sorc i can kill easily are the one who think can facetank me,the good one well i just laugh when i try to light attack them when they just blink away spamming curse/frag minefield etc...
The only i win button here is shield stacking.
so if you want to nerf this set shield stacking should be nerfed too,currently bad or good this is the only counter.
So shieldstacking is OP and your proof is that the good shieldstackers fled while the bad ones died? Ok...phaseadept wrote: »Bring a pocket Healer? That's what most classes do in PvP in other games. I personally don't like to see classes good at everything. . . Sorcerers can tank, dps, escape, and CC. . .
I'd like to see more utility encouraging group play. . .
I think this set is only annoying because it's 1. New and 2. Sorcs have been complaining endlessly about it.
I play my Templar primarily, not exactly good at anything, but keep getting nerfed anyway.
I hate the idea having to bring a Templar for small scale. Just because other classes can't fill the healer roll sufficiently anymore with Healing Ward.
Where i said the sorc run away?re read my post please.
the bad Sorc (not shieldstacker) died because he try to facetank people like he used to in 1.6,sadly for him right now there is a counter.
and the good one is not the one who run away form the fight,but know how to positioning himself,blink away from melee place minefield heal himself and deal dmg from range etc.
You just want to facetank 6 people like in 1.6 with no counter?
this set is a good counter to the sorc who keep stay in melee range and try to tank 5 people at once,and then is useless against every other build that' don't rely on shield.
if they nerf shieldstacking and rework this set i will be more than happy.
(sorry for the bad english)0 -
paulsimonps✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭My feeling about this thread and the fact that my DK Tank spec only for defense can kill sorcs super easy with shield breaker as long as they keep spamming shields:
0 -
ToRelax✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭killingspreeb16_ESO wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »A good player shouldn't be able to 1v2 2 other good players, if so there's a problem. With shield-stacking, and again while not a fan I have tested it just to see... I could take on 5 good players for some time. Your average player I could roll over without my health ever being touched thanks to shields. So yeah, suffice to say I never use that tactic as I find it borderline exploiting.
[...]
I doubt anyone could take on 5 good players by yourself.killingspreeb16_ESO wrote: »Well After play with this set,the only sorc i can kill easily are the one who think can facetank me,the good one well i just laugh when i try to light attack them when they just blink away spamming curse/frag minefield etc...
The only i win button here is shield stacking.
so if you want to nerf this set shield stacking should be nerfed too,currently bad or good this is the only counter.
So shieldstacking is OP and your proof is that the good shieldstackers fled while the bad ones died? Ok...phaseadept wrote: »Bring a pocket Healer? That's what most classes do in PvP in other games. I personally don't like to see classes good at everything. . . Sorcerers can tank, dps, escape, and CC. . .
I'd like to see more utility encouraging group play. . .
I think this set is only annoying because it's 1. New and 2. Sorcs have been complaining endlessly about it.
I play my Templar primarily, not exactly good at anything, but keep getting nerfed anyway.
I hate the idea having to bring a Templar for small scale. Just because other classes can't fill the healer roll sufficiently anymore with Healing Ward.
Where i said the sorc run away?re read my post please.
the bad Sorc (not shieldstacker) died because he try to facetank people like he used to in 1.6,sadly for him right now there is a counter.
and the good one is not the one who run away form the fight,but know how to positioning himself,blink away from melee place minefield heal himself and deal dmg from range etc.
You just want to facetank 6 people like in 1.6 with no counter?
this set is a good counter to the sorc who keep stay in melee range and try to tank 5 people at once,and then is useless against every other build that' don't rely on shield.
if they nerf shieldstacking and rework this set i will be more than happy.
(sorry for the bad english)
If a Sorc ever "face tanked" 6 people in 1.6, they were bad.
It took only 2 competent stamina players to force me to try to escape (wich would not always work either), and I could "tank" at most 2 competent magicka builds by using BoL (wich is nerfed now).
Did you actually use light bow attacks? I don't quite see how attacking from range is going to save a player against someone using this set effectively.
If a Sorc was able to kill you solo from range while you did pressure on him with shieldbreaker + bow, then yes, you're not as good of a player as he was.DAGON - ALTADOON - CHIM - GHARTOK
The Covenant is broken. The Enemy has won...
Elo'dryel - Sorc - AR 50 - Hopesfire - EP EU0 -
killingspreeb16_ESO✭✭✭✭killingspreeb16_ESO wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »A good player shouldn't be able to 1v2 2 other good players, if so there's a problem. With shield-stacking, and again while not a fan I have tested it just to see... I could take on 5 good players for some time. Your average player I could roll over without my health ever being touched thanks to shields. So yeah, suffice to say I never use that tactic as I find it borderline exploiting.
[...]
I doubt anyone could take on 5 good players by yourself.killingspreeb16_ESO wrote: »Well After play with this set,the only sorc i can kill easily are the one who think can facetank me,the good one well i just laugh when i try to light attack them when they just blink away spamming curse/frag minefield etc...
The only i win button here is shield stacking.
so if you want to nerf this set shield stacking should be nerfed too,currently bad or good this is the only counter.
So shieldstacking is OP and your proof is that the good shieldstackers fled while the bad ones died? Ok...phaseadept wrote: »Bring a pocket Healer? That's what most classes do in PvP in other games. I personally don't like to see classes good at everything. . . Sorcerers can tank, dps, escape, and CC. . .
I'd like to see more utility encouraging group play. . .
I think this set is only annoying because it's 1. New and 2. Sorcs have been complaining endlessly about it.
I play my Templar primarily, not exactly good at anything, but keep getting nerfed anyway.
I hate the idea having to bring a Templar for small scale. Just because other classes can't fill the healer roll sufficiently anymore with Healing Ward.
Where i said the sorc run away?re read my post please.
the bad Sorc (not shieldstacker) died because he try to facetank people like he used to in 1.6,sadly for him right now there is a counter.
and the good one is not the one who run away form the fight,but know how to positioning himself,blink away from melee place minefield heal himself and deal dmg from range etc.
You just want to facetank 6 people like in 1.6 with no counter?
this set is a good counter to the sorc who keep stay in melee range and try to tank 5 people at once,and then is useless against every other build that' don't rely on shield.
if they nerf shieldstacking and rework this set i will be more than happy.
(sorry for the bad english)
If a Sorc ever "face tanked" 6 people in 1.6, they were bad.
It took only 2 competent stamina players to force me to try to escape (wich would not always work either), and I could "tank" at most 2 competent magicka builds by using BoL (wich is nerfed now).
Did you actually use light bow attacks? I don't quite see how attacking from range is going to save a player against someone using this set effectively.
If a Sorc was able to kill you solo from range while you did pressure on him with shieldbreaker + bow, then yes, you're not as good of a player as he was.
nope i don't play with a bow,dual wield main bar and two hand support/utility bar so nope i don't have any ranged attack,dunno how is this set with bow maybe i will give it a try later0 -
ToRelax✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭killingspreeb16_ESO wrote: »killingspreeb16_ESO wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »A good player shouldn't be able to 1v2 2 other good players, if so there's a problem. With shield-stacking, and again while not a fan I have tested it just to see... I could take on 5 good players for some time. Your average player I could roll over without my health ever being touched thanks to shields. So yeah, suffice to say I never use that tactic as I find it borderline exploiting.
[...]
I doubt anyone could take on 5 good players by yourself.killingspreeb16_ESO wrote: »Well After play with this set,the only sorc i can kill easily are the one who think can facetank me,the good one well i just laugh when i try to light attack them when they just blink away spamming curse/frag minefield etc...
The only i win button here is shield stacking.
so if you want to nerf this set shield stacking should be nerfed too,currently bad or good this is the only counter.
So shieldstacking is OP and your proof is that the good shieldstackers fled while the bad ones died? Ok...phaseadept wrote: »Bring a pocket Healer? That's what most classes do in PvP in other games. I personally don't like to see classes good at everything. . . Sorcerers can tank, dps, escape, and CC. . .
I'd like to see more utility encouraging group play. . .
I think this set is only annoying because it's 1. New and 2. Sorcs have been complaining endlessly about it.
I play my Templar primarily, not exactly good at anything, but keep getting nerfed anyway.
I hate the idea having to bring a Templar for small scale. Just because other classes can't fill the healer roll sufficiently anymore with Healing Ward.
Where i said the sorc run away?re read my post please.
the bad Sorc (not shieldstacker) died because he try to facetank people like he used to in 1.6,sadly for him right now there is a counter.
and the good one is not the one who run away form the fight,but know how to positioning himself,blink away from melee place minefield heal himself and deal dmg from range etc.
You just want to facetank 6 people like in 1.6 with no counter?
this set is a good counter to the sorc who keep stay in melee range and try to tank 5 people at once,and then is useless against every other build that' don't rely on shield.
if they nerf shieldstacking and rework this set i will be more than happy.
(sorry for the bad english)
If a Sorc ever "face tanked" 6 people in 1.6, they were bad.
It took only 2 competent stamina players to force me to try to escape (wich would not always work either), and I could "tank" at most 2 competent magicka builds by using BoL (wich is nerfed now).
Did you actually use light bow attacks? I don't quite see how attacking from range is going to save a player against someone using this set effectively.
If a Sorc was able to kill you solo from range while you did pressure on him with shieldbreaker + bow, then yes, you're not as good of a player as he was.
nope i don't play with a bow,dual wield main bar and two hand support/utility bar so nope i don't have any ranged attack,dunno how is this set with bow maybe i will give it a try later
Well I don't have much of a problem with this set combined with melee weapons. It adds a threat, but I have to try and stay out of range as much as possible anyway, that is true. It would still be pretty broken when you attack people in mistform, blocking, fossilized etc. though.DAGON - ALTADOON - CHIM - GHARTOK
The Covenant is broken. The Enemy has won...
Elo'dryel - Sorc - AR 50 - Hopesfire - EP EU0 -
killingspreeb16_ESO✭✭✭✭killingspreeb16_ESO wrote: »killingspreeb16_ESO wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »A good player shouldn't be able to 1v2 2 other good players, if so there's a problem. With shield-stacking, and again while not a fan I have tested it just to see... I could take on 5 good players for some time. Your average player I could roll over without my health ever being touched thanks to shields. So yeah, suffice to say I never use that tactic as I find it borderline exploiting.
[...]
I doubt anyone could take on 5 good players by yourself.killingspreeb16_ESO wrote: »Well After play with this set,the only sorc i can kill easily are the one who think can facetank me,the good one well i just laugh when i try to light attack them when they just blink away spamming curse/frag minefield etc...
The only i win button here is shield stacking.
so if you want to nerf this set shield stacking should be nerfed too,currently bad or good this is the only counter.
So shieldstacking is OP and your proof is that the good shieldstackers fled while the bad ones died? Ok...phaseadept wrote: »Bring a pocket Healer? That's what most classes do in PvP in other games. I personally don't like to see classes good at everything. . . Sorcerers can tank, dps, escape, and CC. . .
I'd like to see more utility encouraging group play. . .
I think this set is only annoying because it's 1. New and 2. Sorcs have been complaining endlessly about it.
I play my Templar primarily, not exactly good at anything, but keep getting nerfed anyway.
I hate the idea having to bring a Templar for small scale. Just because other classes can't fill the healer roll sufficiently anymore with Healing Ward.
Where i said the sorc run away?re read my post please.
the bad Sorc (not shieldstacker) died because he try to facetank people like he used to in 1.6,sadly for him right now there is a counter.
and the good one is not the one who run away form the fight,but know how to positioning himself,blink away from melee place minefield heal himself and deal dmg from range etc.
You just want to facetank 6 people like in 1.6 with no counter?
this set is a good counter to the sorc who keep stay in melee range and try to tank 5 people at once,and then is useless against every other build that' don't rely on shield.
if they nerf shieldstacking and rework this set i will be more than happy.
(sorry for the bad english)
If a Sorc ever "face tanked" 6 people in 1.6, they were bad.
It took only 2 competent stamina players to force me to try to escape (wich would not always work either), and I could "tank" at most 2 competent magicka builds by using BoL (wich is nerfed now).
Did you actually use light bow attacks? I don't quite see how attacking from range is going to save a player against someone using this set effectively.
If a Sorc was able to kill you solo from range while you did pressure on him with shieldbreaker + bow, then yes, you're not as good of a player as he was.
nope i don't play with a bow,dual wield main bar and two hand support/utility bar so nope i don't have any ranged attack,dunno how is this set with bow maybe i will give it a try later
Well I don't have much of a problem with this set combined with melee weapons. It adds a threat, but I have to try and stay out of range as much as possible anyway, that is true. It would still be pretty broken when you attack people in mistform, blocking, fossilized etc. though.
well i think a sorc should always try to avoid the melee range(if play the ranged type magic caster)if this set is really broken with a bow can be fixed by change how it works on ranged weapon or something like that,still i pref a rework of the set since i find it nearly useless outside of dueling sorc and a nerf or change to shield stacking.0 -
AlcastClass RepresentativeI am laughing my ass of Sorcs trying to spam Shield at 2% HP and then 1 LA=RIP. Why dont they just put mutagen/Cprayer on the bar to restore health. But I guess that is too much to ask.Edited by Alcast on 6 September 2015 13:38https://alcasthq.com - Alcasthq.com Builds & Guides
https://eso-hub.com - ESO-Hub.com Sets, Skills, Guides & News
https://dwemerautomaton.com - Discord, Telegram & Twitch Command Bot3 -
CP5✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »A good player shouldn't be able to 1v2 2 other good players, if so there's a problem. With shield-stacking, and again while not a fan I have tested it just to see... I could take on 5 good players for some time. Your average player I could roll over without my health ever being touched thanks to shields. So yeah, suffice to say I never use that tactic as I find it borderline exploiting.
Now if all you do is look for low ranking people who are just adjusting to PVP and 1v4 them.. well that's a very noobish way to go about it. I look for the biggest and baddest to fight, not the weakest and most novice.
Shield breaker does not do irresistible damage to anything other than those WITH SHIELDS UP. Just like a bow user can wreck themselves when I am on my DK and use scales or any ranged user really. Or I could be on my Temp and let my shield absorb all of those attacks and then blast them with it.
There should be a counter to everything in this game. If you can snipe yourself on scales for much more than a measly 2k damage, then it's fine. Because if I am on my sorc, I'm not focused on shields. Yes I'm aware of how they stack and I have no interest in doing such weak, border-line exploiting moves. I don't have to worry about my shields being stacked because I will be fighting back instead of waiting until they are gassed from my shields while doing tiny attacks in between.
I think this set is great but it's not enough. There needs to be more ways to counter things from all classes, not just the 3 classes that can spam extra shields.
I hate nerfs, and I'd rather them keep adding more stuff (such as this set for countering cheap moves) than start taking away, but I guess we'll see.
Excuse me, i'll just be, a healer using healing ward, a dk using igneous shield, a random trying to help with barrier and long behold now you're taking irresistible damage with no way to prevent it because someone else gave you a shield. With how smart heals place shields healing ward will likely get a lot of flack for lining people up to be destroyed by this set. But yes, lets only bash on sorcs because so many people got mad at them, totally justifies the sets existence.
Do you even know what you're talking about? What is the shield Nightblade's have? Oh... oh that's right. None. Have you tested shield-breaker? Do you have maxed characters of each class that you do both PVE and PVP with? It sure doesn't sound like it. Shield-breaker is the bane to shield-stacking but shield-stacking circumvents EVERYTHING except Zergs although sometimes provides a survivable means as said person escapes a zerg.
It only works while a shield is up. So if you aren't spamming endless shields and stacking them, it won't be a problem. Shield had ZERO COUNTERS. Now it has a fair one. For every 10 shield-stacking pvpers there may now be 2 or 3 shield breakers. Oh what's that??? The scale balancing? Oh, amazing.
Signed,
Someone who plays every class
You missed my point completely. You don't always have a say if you get shielded or not, anyone near you can give you one and if this set becomes popular then that helpful person just lined you up to be killed. So please, keep cheering about how this set is the nerf sorcs deserved and ignore the fact that it isn't a punishment for the evil and spiteful shield stackers, but for anyone who uses shields at all, and anyone who has an ally nearby.
And about your "pro tip," 1, it doesn't only punish shield stackers, avoiding people using this set will be rare because of how popular it'll likely be, and as much as i'm for counter-play this set is a band-aid fix that'll do nothing more than give satisfaction to the people who hate others so much for using shields, and divide the community more. But yes, lets ignore all of that and go kill them evil sorcs. P.S. none of my sorcs use hardened ward, and none of my characters even use more than one shield, if any.1 -
rfennell_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ViciousWayz wrote: »https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJI5YqpXbtU
And people complained about Vamps.. shield stackers are just as ridiculous as what the vamp ulti used to do and that you could move away from, shield is cast on the person casting it so there's no stopping it unless it's a a few people, a very bad sorc, someone specifically geared to take out shields, or a longgg shield stacker duel.
That guy was also the worst case scenario with shield stacking and was banned. I know the claim was it was because of a name, but we all know ZOS doesn't ban for names and that's a pretty shaky story. I think every thread he ever made and every comment he ever made was also expunged from the forums.
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Tankqull✭✭✭✭✭
✭I am laughing my ass of Sorcs trying to spam Shield at 2% HP and then 1 LA=RIP. Why dont they just put mutagen/Cprayer on the bar to restore health. But I guess that is too much to ask.
because of this:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=ZEhL_DonvnU spelling and grammar errors are free to be abused
Sallington wrote: »Anything useful that players are wanting added into the game all fall under the category of "Yer ruinin my 'mersion!"2 -
BalticBlues✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭
So the helpful people giving you shields for protection now even cause your doom?!?anyone near you can give you one and if this set becomes popular then that helpful person just lined you up to be killed.
This is getting from bad to worse.
As a Templar, I often cast a shield around a wounded guys.
Instead of protection this will now mark them for final doom.
How much can a developer break the community?
Do the devs even play Sorcs and Templars in their own game?
Edited by BalticBlues on 6 September 2015 15:010 -
CP5✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭BalticBlues wrote: »
So the helpful people giving you shields to protect now even cause your doom?!?anyone near you can give you one and if this set becomes popular then that helpful person just lined you up to be killed.
This is getting from bad to worse.
Also as a Templar, I often cast a shield around wounded people.
Instead of protection this will now mark them for final doom.
How much can a developer break the community?
Do the devs even play Sorcs and Templars in their own game?
I'm just a healer and don't want you to die. HEALING WARD... oh wait, now you're dead. Oh well, we sure showed dem sorcs whose boss. There are a lot of helpful shields that someone may want to use but now will just give them a window to be hit with irresistible damage, not to mention all the non-shield stackers who will also get the short end of the stick with this.1 -
Darnathian✭✭✭✭✭
✭ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »A good player shouldn't be able to 1v2 2 other good players, if so there's a problem. With shield-stacking, and again while not a fan I have tested it just to see... I could take on 5 good players for some time. Your average player I could roll over without my health ever being touched thanks to shields. So yeah, suffice to say I never use that tactic as I find it borderline exploiting.
Now if all you do is look for low ranking people who are just adjusting to PVP and 1v4 them.. well that's a very noobish way to go about it. I look for the biggest and baddest to fight, not the weakest and most novice.
Shield breaker does not do irresistible damage to anything other than those WITH SHIELDS UP. Just like a bow user can wreck themselves when I am on my DK and use scales or any ranged user really. Or I could be on my Temp and let my shield absorb all of those attacks and then blast them with it.
There should be a counter to everything in this game. If you can snipe yourself on scales for much more than a measly 2k damage, then it's fine. Because if I am on my sorc, I'm not focused on shields. Yes I'm aware of how they stack and I have no interest in doing such weak, border-line exploiting moves. I don't have to worry about my shields being stacked because I will be fighting back instead of waiting until they are gassed from my shields while doing tiny attacks in between.
I think this set is great but it's not enough. There needs to be more ways to counter things from all classes, not just the 3 classes that can spam extra shields.
I hate nerfs, and I'd rather them keep adding more stuff (such as this set for countering cheap moves) than start taking away, but I guess we'll see.
Excuse me, i'll just be, a healer using healing ward, a dk using igneous shield, a random trying to help with barrier and long behold now you're taking irresistible damage with no way to prevent it because someone else gave you a shield. With how smart heals place shields healing ward will likely get a lot of flack for lining people up to be destroyed by this set. But yes, lets only bash on sorcs because so many people got mad at them, totally justifies the sets existence.
Do you even know what you're talking about? What is the shield Nightblade's have? Oh... oh that's right. None. Have you tested shield-breaker? Do you have maxed characters of each class that you do both PVE and PVP with? It sure doesn't sound like it. Shield-breaker is the bane to shield-stacking but shield-stacking circumvents EVERYTHING except Zergs although sometimes provides a survivable means as said person escapes a zerg.
It only works while a shield is up. So if you aren't spamming endless shields and stacking them, it won't be a problem. Shield had ZERO COUNTERS. Now it has a fair one. For every 10 shield-stacking pvpers there may now be 2 or 3 shield breakers. Oh what's that??? The scale balancing? Oh, amazing.
Signed,
Someone who plays every class
You missed my point completely. You don't always have a say if you get shielded or not, anyone near you can give you one and if this set becomes popular then that helpful person just lined you up to be killed. So please, keep cheering about how this set is the nerf sorcs deserved and ignore the fact that it isn't a punishment for the evil and spiteful shield stackers, but for anyone who uses shields at all, and anyone who has an ally nearby.
And about your "pro tip," 1, it doesn't only punish shield stackers, avoiding people using this set will be rare because of how popular it'll likely be, and as much as i'm for counter-play this set is a band-aid fix that'll do nothing more than give satisfaction to the people who hate others so much for using shields, and divide the community more. But yes, lets ignore all of that and go kill them evil sorcs. P.S. none of my sorcs use hardened ward, and none of my characters even use more than one shield, if any.
You are in the minority unfortunately. The rest caused this. The simple fix was to remove shield stacking. But unfortunately they defended that. This was a terrible fix to be honest.
I have been a dk since launch. I know the feeling when they nerf something and completely change your class. I thought they were done with dk's. I should have kept my mouth shut and not jinxed it
In one fell swoop they killed the last two play styles. Tanking and our class heal.0 -
CP5✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Darnathian wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »ViciousWayz wrote: »A good player shouldn't be able to 1v2 2 other good players, if so there's a problem. With shield-stacking, and again while not a fan I have tested it just to see... I could take on 5 good players for some time. Your average player I could roll over without my health ever being touched thanks to shields. So yeah, suffice to say I never use that tactic as I find it borderline exploiting.
Now if all you do is look for low ranking people who are just adjusting to PVP and 1v4 them.. well that's a very noobish way to go about it. I look for the biggest and baddest to fight, not the weakest and most novice.
Shield breaker does not do irresistible damage to anything other than those WITH SHIELDS UP. Just like a bow user can wreck themselves when I am on my DK and use scales or any ranged user really. Or I could be on my Temp and let my shield absorb all of those attacks and then blast them with it.
There should be a counter to everything in this game. If you can snipe yourself on scales for much more than a measly 2k damage, then it's fine. Because if I am on my sorc, I'm not focused on shields. Yes I'm aware of how they stack and I have no interest in doing such weak, border-line exploiting moves. I don't have to worry about my shields being stacked because I will be fighting back instead of waiting until they are gassed from my shields while doing tiny attacks in between.
I think this set is great but it's not enough. There needs to be more ways to counter things from all classes, not just the 3 classes that can spam extra shields.
I hate nerfs, and I'd rather them keep adding more stuff (such as this set for countering cheap moves) than start taking away, but I guess we'll see.
Excuse me, i'll just be, a healer using healing ward, a dk using igneous shield, a random trying to help with barrier and long behold now you're taking irresistible damage with no way to prevent it because someone else gave you a shield. With how smart heals place shields healing ward will likely get a lot of flack for lining people up to be destroyed by this set. But yes, lets only bash on sorcs because so many people got mad at them, totally justifies the sets existence.
Do you even know what you're talking about? What is the shield Nightblade's have? Oh... oh that's right. None. Have you tested shield-breaker? Do you have maxed characters of each class that you do both PVE and PVP with? It sure doesn't sound like it. Shield-breaker is the bane to shield-stacking but shield-stacking circumvents EVERYTHING except Zergs although sometimes provides a survivable means as said person escapes a zerg.
It only works while a shield is up. So if you aren't spamming endless shields and stacking them, it won't be a problem. Shield had ZERO COUNTERS. Now it has a fair one. For every 10 shield-stacking pvpers there may now be 2 or 3 shield breakers. Oh what's that??? The scale balancing? Oh, amazing.
Signed,
Someone who plays every class
You missed my point completely. You don't always have a say if you get shielded or not, anyone near you can give you one and if this set becomes popular then that helpful person just lined you up to be killed. So please, keep cheering about how this set is the nerf sorcs deserved and ignore the fact that it isn't a punishment for the evil and spiteful shield stackers, but for anyone who uses shields at all, and anyone who has an ally nearby.
And about your "pro tip," 1, it doesn't only punish shield stackers, avoiding people using this set will be rare because of how popular it'll likely be, and as much as i'm for counter-play this set is a band-aid fix that'll do nothing more than give satisfaction to the people who hate others so much for using shields, and divide the community more. But yes, lets ignore all of that and go kill them evil sorcs. P.S. none of my sorcs use hardened ward, and none of my characters even use more than one shield, if any.
You are in the minority unfortunately. The rest caused this. The simple fix was to remove shield stacking. But unfortunately they defended that. This was a terrible fix to be honest.
I have been a dk since launch. I know the feeling when they nerf something and completely change your class. I thought they were done with dk's. I should have kept my mouth shut and not jinxed it
In one fell swoop they killed the last two play styles. Tanking and our class heal.
Glad we agree that this was not a good fix, and I wish they would have put more effort into reworking shields. I wonder how many dk's will remove igneous from their bars and morph ferocious leap to take flight to avoid this sets use. But i'm sure the devs see this set as 'good for the health of the game' and shields will slowly be phased out until this set renders itself useless. Oh well.0 -
zornyan✭✭✭✭✭How about think about what the game is designed around, pve is questing, or fighting world bosses / dolmens, or endgame is trials vdsa etc.
Does shieldbraker effect you there? Nope.
Does the dodge/blocking nerf effect other classes there? Yes.
Pvp is designed around large scale battles, or small mobile groups, everything about pvp is designed around group combat, ic supports smaller groups, cyro supports large groups.
So a sorcerer, by definition, shouldn't be able to repeatedly cast Shields and live forever, they are supposed to be support / dps, not a tank in clothes taking more damage than a sword and board heavy wearing tank.
The idea is that a sorcerer stays with a small group, even just another player, that can tank damage and keep the enemy occupied, so that's what you've got to do.
I'm sorry but every class had a weakness, if you choose to wear clothes instead of armor you should die quickly, you shouldn't be able to sit at the front of a group of enemies, spamming Shields for eternity.
Hell even in bwb pvp on ps4 there's people spamming Shields, the number of sorcerers is insane, it took 4 of us spamming wrecking blow to remove one sorcerer that sat there stacking shields for eternity.1
