Malthorne wrote: »

wazbaumukerb14_ESO wrote: »

Malthorne wrote: »

I’m curious as to how ZOS is handling the overwhelming negative feedback. Are they taking the community’s disappointment to heart and creating action plans to deliver the systems we asked for in the future? Or do they just think that our feedback is more “wahh wahh” and they know what’s best?

It's a modern company so they probably just look at metrics not posts. If people are playing and buying stuff = things are good. The corporate model is to focus on what people do not what they say.

Anyway I can't believe anyone would be opposed to account bound achievements lol. It's completely the norm at this stuff, and frankly almost everything in MMOs should be account-bound all the time. Busywork of redoing stuff on alts is terrible and doesn't respect your time.

Why do you think FFXIV is the number 1 MMO right now? There are a few factors, one of which is their ability to communicate and listen to feedback from their community on various forums and social media.

To be clear, I wasn't defending this practice. I just think it is the way it is.

Blizzard has been getting their lunch eaten recently, and part of the reason is that they completely stopped listening to feedback years ago, trusting completely in their metrics about what players did. Now WoW is probably in the worst shape it has ever been and they are scrambling to undo the damage.

It is a hard line to walk for developers though. Most feedback they're going to get is negative, and that same negativity bias will dominate forums. If they read that here but then see that people are forking over money for crown crates and stuff the forums insist are bad, what conclusion are they supposed to draw?

tmbrinks wrote: »

wazbaumukerb14_ESO wrote: »

SerafinaWaterstar wrote: »

Anyway I can't believe anyone would be opposed to account bound achievements lol. It's completely the norm at this stuff, and frankly almost everything in MMOs should be account-bound all the time. Busywork of redoing stuff on alts is terrible and doesn't respect your time.

It is my choice how I play this game. For me, it’s not ‘busywork’ and I enjoy the time I spend replaying content on my alts.

If this game is going to be ‘once done, no more fun’ then not sure about carrying on playing. This should be optional.

You can still do everything you want, nothing is changing about it. I've read some posts on this and the perspective is interesting (things I never would have considered), but it's important to understand that your perspective is going to be a tiny minority. Modern games have moved to account bound stuff for a good reason.

But it does. Some seek out the challenge of playing other roles and classes.

Some play this MMORPG (where the RP stands for Role-Playing...) as those individual characters... and smashing all the achievements together most definitely "takes something away from them".

Adding just an Account Achievement Overview (similar to what the add-on does for PC players) would be a perfectly valid way to give those that want Account-wide what they need, while still maintaining the individuality of characters for what others need.

There is a middle ground that keeps more engaged and happy. I hope that the language that Gina used in the stream was inaccurate and the truth of the matter is that we're just going to be getting this account overview type thing. But based on their words, I'm not that hopeful.

The amount of dismissive comments towards those advocating for this is astounding.

if there's an easy UI change that would make people happy, that seems fine! But ditching the entire idea of account bound stuff to appease RPers seems unwise.

Again, the genre has shown that people who want to redo everything on every character is a very tiny minority. The biggest MMO in town these days lets you play every class on the same character and receives a lot of praise for it!

wazbaumukerb14_ESO wrote: »

tmbrinks wrote: »

wazbaumukerb14_ESO wrote: »

SerafinaWaterstar wrote: »

Anyway I can't believe anyone would be opposed to account bound achievements lol. It's completely the norm at this stuff, and frankly almost everything in MMOs should be account-bound all the time. Busywork of redoing stuff on alts is terrible and doesn't respect your time.

It is my choice how I play this game. For me, it’s not ‘busywork’ and I enjoy the time I spend replaying content on my alts.

If this game is going to be ‘once done, no more fun’ then not sure about carrying on playing. This should be optional.

You can still do everything you want, nothing is changing about it. I've read some posts on this and the perspective is interesting (things I never would have considered), but it's important to understand that your perspective is going to be a tiny minority. Modern games have moved to account bound stuff for a good reason.

But it does. Some seek out the challenge of playing other roles and classes.

Some play this MMORPG (where the RP stands for Role-Playing...) as those individual characters... and smashing all the achievements together most definitely "takes something away from them".

Adding just an Account Achievement Overview (similar to what the add-on does for PC players) would be a perfectly valid way to give those that want Account-wide what they need, while still maintaining the individuality of characters for what others need.

There is a middle ground that keeps more engaged and happy. I hope that the language that Gina used in the stream was inaccurate and the truth of the matter is that we're just going to be getting this account overview type thing. But based on their words, I'm not that hopeful.

The amount of dismissive comments towards those advocating for this is astounding.

if there's an easy UI change that would make people happy, that seems fine! But ditching the entire idea of account bound stuff to appease RPers seems unwise.

Again, the genre has shown that people who want to redo everything on every character is a very tiny minority. The biggest MMO in town these days lets you play every class on the same character and receives a lot of praise for it!

"Another MMO does it this way" is the worst argument that you can make. Nobody makes anybody "redo everything on every character" in ESO now. But this TAKES AWAY from those that want the choice. You are literally removing a style of play for some people (I don't care how much of a minority they are), when there is an option that DOES NOT DO THAT.

wazbaumukerb14_ESO wrote: »

tmbrinks wrote: »

wazbaumukerb14_ESO wrote: »

SerafinaWaterstar wrote: »

Anyway I can't believe anyone would be opposed to account bound achievements lol. It's completely the norm at this stuff, and frankly almost everything in MMOs should be account-bound all the time. Busywork of redoing stuff on alts is terrible and doesn't respect your time.

It is my choice how I play this game. For me, it’s not ‘busywork’ and I enjoy the time I spend replaying content on my alts.

If this game is going to be ‘once done, no more fun’ then not sure about carrying on playing. This should be optional.

You can still do everything you want, nothing is changing about it. I've read some posts on this and the perspective is interesting (things I never would have considered), but it's important to understand that your perspective is going to be a tiny minority. Modern games have moved to account bound stuff for a good reason.

But it does. Some seek out the challenge of playing other roles and classes.

Some play this MMORPG (where the RP stands for Role-Playing...) as those individual characters... and smashing all the achievements together most definitely "takes something away from them".

Adding just an Account Achievement Overview (similar to what the add-on does for PC players) would be a perfectly valid way to give those that want Account-wide what they need, while still maintaining the individuality of characters for what others need.

There is a middle ground that keeps more engaged and happy. I hope that the language that Gina used in the stream was inaccurate and the truth of the matter is that we're just going to be getting this account overview type thing. But based on their words, I'm not that hopeful.

The amount of dismissive comments towards those advocating for this is astounding.

if there's an easy UI change that would make people happy, that seems fine! But ditching the entire idea of account bound stuff to appease RPers seems unwise.

Again, the genre has shown that people who want to redo everything on every character is a very tiny minority. The biggest MMO in town these days lets you play every class on the same character and receives a lot of praise for it!

It's not just roleplayers. It's everyone who rolls multiple characters in order to play through the game with them, as opposed to rolling them just to try out builds or rush them via 50 levels at an Alik'r dolmen to endgame. They do not form a "very tiny minority". In a current poll (largely taken before the announcement) 25% wanted the current system, and a further 17% wanted only some achievements to be account-wide. A good many of those supporting account-wide achievements in all such polls do not want titles to be account-wide.

Some more feedbacks:

1. Companions
Please make their combat AI more intuitive (ie don’t just stand in the red circle). Let them carry own gears and give us the option to put helmets and adornments on them.

A shady khajit is great , but not sure why we are getting another goody two shoe companion.

Please revise the rapport system (eg you can gift items from time to time to gain positive rapport). Dislike for cooking cheese is just odd. Likewise, Bastian dislikes for opening thieves troves yet pointing out a heavy sack saying, “look! Someone’s loss is others gain” is downright hypocritical.

Mirri and Bastian deserve additional personal storylines and quests. Or maybe just Mirri

2. Storyline
Very excited about the Breton storyline. Just drop the amount of “remind me, who are you/what are we doing?” Type of lines or at least, give them among other options.

3. Swim faster
Sammy is a fat khajit and can’t swim very fast. Sammy accepts that, but his Bosmer alt surely can be speedier?? Since we are going to a watery place, the need to speed swim seems greater, even for Sammy.

4. Story mode dungeons
This one just wants the story, not the mutant stones or whatever they are.

And please, for the love of Sithis please don’t turn the card game into a monetisation scheme.

tmbrinks wrote: »

"Another MMO does it this way" is the worst argument that you can make. Nobody makes anybody "redo everything on every character" in ESO now. But this TAKES AWAY from those that want the choice. You are literally removing a style of play for some people (I don't care how much of a minority they are), when there is an option that DOES NOT DO THAT.

Most businesses care about what their competitors are doing and what has been proven to be successful.

Tandor wrote: »

It's not just roleplayers. It's everyone who rolls multiple characters in order to play through the game with them, as opposed to rolling them just to try out builds or rush them via 50 levels at an Alik'r dolmen to endgame. They do not form a "very tiny minority". In a current poll (largely taken before the announcement) 25% wanted the current system, and a further 17% wanted only some achievements to be account-wide. A good many of those supporting account-wide achievements in all such polls do not want titles to be account-wide.

Online polls are unscientific and mean nothing. The number of players who post on the forums, let alone vote in polls, is miniscule and not representative of the playerbase.

This is also why companies tend to ignore feedback in such channels and focus only on the hard metrics they have available.

MEH

Nemeliom wrote: »

You are killing/letting die PvP. A Card game isn't pvp.
Completly disappointed.

To be honest I didn't expect there to be many changes in PvP this year with the massive undertaking of re-architecting the base code of the game. Adding new content or changing the already existing content could further complicate the process or take time away from it. I'm ok with the lack of content for PvP as long as they are focusing on solving the performance issues.....Besides what's the point on getting new content if you can't even enjoy it. I am happy they took into consideration players suggestions on incentivizing PvP modes more, but it feels like the bare minimum. All PvP modes should have incentives, not just IC. And to be honest, I find the new motif to be a little lackluster in comparison to other designs (fang lair, waking flame, etc). There's nothing really outstanding about it for the headache that you'll have to go through to achieve it.

Card Game...
I didn't like Gwent, don't make me play another. I'm happy for roleplayers and players who enjoy mini games, but a card game, as a main feature...really? I've read through many threads on the forums of players asking for things, and this is not one of them. I sincerely hope that this will be merely a side aspect of the game and not essential to obtaining good gear in game.

High Isle
This chapter also seems like the bare minimum as there is nothing ground breaking here as well. They've stuck to their strengths in the designing of a couple of cool looking dungeons and a new trial. But I hope they've increased the difficulty in both, and then don't nerf it when players are crying about not being able to finish it first try. And there's a couple of new sets, of course...but at this point the game needs more than that now. It's been the same thing every new chapter for years and this one seems to have even less than previous ones. I'm hoping this is due to their work on performance. But I would have been happier if they had just forgone the new zone and rebalanced classes, skills, sets, etc. Or added a new class /skill line instead. The game needs a little more diversity now and thats what players have been asking for.

NeeScrolls wrote: »

uhh, that's not how things work actually.

ALL feedback (coherent feedback) is filtered & passed along by the Community Mods/Reps, on a priority basis.

I'm sorry but there is absolutely no proof that this actually happens, certainly not the priority basis. I'm sure someone on the Community team is aware of the widespread disappointment in the chapter but we have no idea if anyone else is aware.

I do think they are actively tracking sales and I'm sure someone with either authority or a powerful voice has seen or made comparisons of the chapter's first day sales to the first day sales in years past. If there is a meaningful decrease from prior years, then those sales numbers will be watched in the weeks ahead to see if it's just a time shift or a downward trend. There might be an assessment of the chapter's offerings if sales are notably behind prior years. We'll never know one way or another.

That being said, we need to consider the possibility that a huge chunk of the ZOS team has been temporarily reallocated to work on Starfield. Microsoft/Bethesda will not endanger that title and will do everything they can to deliver a viable and well-received product on its release date given its likely nine figure sales revenue expectations. The limited scale of changes in the Q1 DLC and the Q2 chapter certainly point to a smaller team working on things nowadays.

LonePirate wrote: »

I'm sure someone on the Community team is aware of the widespread disappointment in the chapter but we have no idea if anyone else is aware.

Widespread disappointment on forums that are chronically negative and posted on not just by active players but also many who haven't played in a long time.

I have heard a lot of positive feedback in game which I feel is much more representative of the playerbase.

I have mixed feelings about the reveal. From everything I've gathered about the game last year, I was lead to believe there would be no new skills/weapons/classes/systems, and I was fine with that. I thought that since none of those shiny new carrots were to appear, that the devs would put a lot more emphasis on story telling. I hope I'm wrong, but the reveal was very... lacking (for lack of a better word) on the story.

I loved the main story in Wrothgar. For me it was so well woven with (most) of the side quests and so impactful that it made me like the zone, even though the geography of the region is one of my least favorites. I loved the side quests in Morrowind - they were long and convoluted, with NPCs that caused guttural reactions. Maybe I'm too much of an optimist, but I'm hoping (still) that this year we get a story that cannot be completed in less than a week.

Since the technical side of the game is tied up rn with delays on hardware and rework of software, let the creative side of the game shine. Give us good stories, which we know you can do. Give us fantastical visuals, but give us a reason to go see them (good side quests).

I was on the fence when they first announced companions, but I've been using, and enjoying them. I'm a "timid" player who sometimes shies away from content for fear of failure. Companions gave me the confidence to try stuff out, and made me realize I wasn't as bad as I thought.
I'm glad there will be new companions because it means there will be more content to play. I don't mind leveling them up.

I'm happy for Spanish speaking players and for the folks on PS who will finally get their trophies (I think it's called?) back.

I'm looking forward to the dungeons - they look very interesting - and the new trial. I was hoping for a new 4 man arena, but maybe it will still come in the 4th quarter.

I'm neutral about the mount and new assistant. I might, eventually, get the new assistant, but I don't see myself buying the new mount.

I don't want global achievements on my account. I understand that this is an MMO and there are other people playing at the same time. I wish there was some way to opt out of it, though.

As I said in the beginning of this post, I wasn't expecting any big news on the technical side, so it was a surprise to see them announce a new system in the form of a side game. I loath card games, but that's beside the point. I worry that other systems that were introduced before will fall by the wayside to focus on the new one*.

There are at least two duel arenas already in game - on in the base game, and one in Arteum. Why not flesh them out? If you feel the need to add a new system, work with assets already in game. Create organized duels, with a leader board. Give PvPers more (and new) ways to play - in the open world, no less. (If dueling around highly populated areas doesn't mess up with performance that much, I doubt getting organized duels in such out of the way places would be a problem)

There are at least 2 places I can think of that already have something that could become mini-games. In Skywatch there is a frog race, and there is a lizard race near Bergama. Once the side quest is completed in those, they could be used as repeatable quests where players get to bet on different frogs/lizards. A fully fleshed out system could be created by giving us the chance to capture and train our own animals.





*Is the focus going to shift away from (lets say) antiquities? Will the newest mythic/cool furnishing/cool-thing-I-really-want be tied to the card game?

I don't understand why we should give constructive feedback when it is ignored. We have been asking for improvement to pvp for literally years and nothing is even addressed until someone questions it on you tube with a dev sitting right there.

I live in hope, but my wallet stays closed as there is nothing in this expansion for me.

I do not play card games especially ones outside the actual game.

I do not play with an annoying companion and I'll never take Mirri out of the box.

I worked hard to get Master Angler and was very proud of that title but titles are now meaningless.

And I love pvp but ball groups and Dark Convergence have ruined that. And I never got over all the really bad changes to armor with procs.

I will now spend what little time I have left on my sub figuring out if there is anything for me to do in this game going forward.

I cancelled my Plus subscription. I figure as far as ZOS is concerned that is the most effective feedback possible.

ATTN: The current graphic of High Isle Collector's Edition items shows the incorrect image for one emote in the High Isle emote pack. The “Own the Throne” emote was in the Ayleid Crown Crate. The emote that will be in the CE is called "Elite Seat" - new screenshot coming soon.
Forum Manager for ZeniMax Online Studio and Elder Scrolls Online
Dev Tracker | Service Alerts | ESO Twitter
#408
12:13PM
Staff Post

Does this mean that those that pre-purchased before the website image change are not getting what was advertised or will ZOS do the right PR thing and provide both emote packages to those who have already pre-purchased ? Afterall, how many eyes looked at the promotional material and signed off on it for publication only to have a player notice it within 24 hours ?
An accidental error still comes across as a "bait and switch" if not honoured correctly.

Also, thanks for the feedback Kevin it's appreciated and hope remains eternal for some positive news over the controversial items being discussed