Ragnaroek93 wrote: »Smashing some potatoes on console and tbagging them is a good proofRagnaroek93 wrote: »Do you realise that cloak is the defining ability of the nightblade, especially the magicka nightblade?
You keep asking to nerf the cloak to what end? Have you tried playing a magNB and found out that it is way to easy thanks to the cloak? What are your defences in BG as a magNB? You are a mage that can sneak, that's all, but a poor mage, because you lack any burst damage. I main a mnb and cloak does not save me that often, because it is so easy to counter!!! So I can't even imagine what will be fair play to you while fighting a STEALTHY class, the nightblade. Stealth and cloak is the reason I picked this class from the very begining, and at that time I did not had pvp in mind at all... just that cloak is a fun ability a trademark of the nightblade, a rogue/thief class in RPGs. So even if you keep spaming it, there are so many aoe's and dots that get you out of it, you can really use it effectively for a split second, then you really need act - either flee, or reengage in a new attack. But the problem is, once your enemies know you are around and using cloak, they activate their defences, pots, aoe spams, and act weary, so the cloak is not going to work for long.
The whole skill tree of the mnb is imagined to put pressure on the target with snares and dots, but you do not have a burst attack like the stamblade has with snipe, you have to build it up hoping that by the time you get the bow proc your target is still in range or has not destroyed you. I am really wondering if you know what you are talking about, when you discuss cloak nerfs.
So yea, snipe is bad because it is cheap, you do not need much skill to find a sweet spot and keep ganking people. But you can't also just nerf it to the ground, making snipe hit like a wet noodle. Snipers are usually easy to destroy if you get close to them because they fear melee combat, and are not prepaired for it. So each thing has a counter, and the nice thing about PvP is working to find out these counters, finding what works for you and getting better at it. Asking for nerfs on forums is not one of those counters.
Majority of the best magblades don't even use cloak. And no, you don't need it for open world.
Have you tried playing magblade without it?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YuzJ2N2yg8w
Try pulling that off by spamming Cloak as a magblade lol. You won't.
You want to say stamblade needs cloak spam?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pt0qj6YzH9A&t=175s
Yes, he has cloak on his bar but look at how many times he actually uses it. If Cloak increased in cost by 500% for 10 seconds after use, this guy wouldn't even be affected by it. Why? Because he's a good stamblade that knows how to play.
And for a direct comparison:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EQcY4GPJU6s&t=1m36s
I'm not even a good stamblade. If you look at the last fight you can see how I literally don't cloak once in the 1v1 and get an easy dub.
Every single night blade that says Cloak is weak is bad.
Cloak is a crutch for bad players. People think that you need Cloak to play a stamblade. You don't. You need skill to play it, arguably less than other classes in the current meta, but flat out removing Cloak wouldn't even destroy the class. It would make it significantly weaker, but the first 2 videos prove you don't need it, and you especially don't need to spam it. The last clip shows the kind of players that crutch on Cloak spam. All you're doing is setting a glass ceiling for yourself by relying on Cloak.
If you don't think Cloak can't be nerfed because it would destroy nightblades...well you're just bad.
So now I am a bad player because I slot cloak? Or because some other players prefer not to use it, is it bad, and since it is bad, should it also become worse, with a nerf? What is the logic? BTW... I am not interested in stamblades, they have access to FM and other tools, I play a magicka nightblade. Also Cyrodiil pvp is different than noncp BG pvp.
This is one of the problems here... many people talk about a very specific situation and playstyle, which they try to overlap to the whole game, including pve, instead of mentioning something like: IN Cp AvA PvP, in 1vX or zerg vs zerg, there is this problem with _insert skill_. My proposal is this, I did a test with this build and came up with these conclusions.... Most people just vent their anger after losing some games or skirmishes.
Also you are referring to your playstyle and preference, which is not optimal or fun for everyone. Same with the OP... don't tell me the skills I use are bad or have to be nerfed, or if you do, come with some constructive feedback which is not going to antagonise players. Saying the ping is low is not really a balance issue.
Again.. stop telling people how to play the game and their chars. (you are telling me that I do not need cloak for the open world, which is clearly a matter of choice, since the open world is the main casual play area of the game).
Your arguments would be valid if the cloak ability would have almost no counter and would create a huge advantage to its user. But it is hardly the case... it is more an annoyance to the one fighting a magblade, and as people know, it has many counters which are not class restricted, this being the reason behind "majority of the best magblades don't even use cloak", as you say. So then, why nerf it or change it? You say it is a crutch for bad players, which I doubt, since it does not make you hard to kill like pre-murkmire shields made you, especially sorc shield. It is convenient to vanish and makes some things easier, same like the sorc's teleport, but does not give you the edge in pvp.
To answer to your question, for pve, I do not slot cloak, but in open world I use it often to skip mobs while questing or travelling. In PvP (I mostly do non cp BGs), I have it slotted, but I do not use it much, because the action is more intense than in zerg pvp where you get heals and buffs for lots of people. As I said.. cloaking does not save you if decent pvp-ers notice you are around. Yes, in Cyro you might find a spot to hide, but in BGs, there is hardly the case or reason to hide, so it really depends so much on the context we are talking.
Don't. Don't argue with magsorc players in this forum. It's pointless.
Uhm ok. First off, my post was made in response to someone who claimed that magblade cannot play without Cloak. @kind_hero you ridicule me for talking out of context but you take my response completely out of its context.
I never directly stated to remove Cloak, nor have I ever done so. My closing argument was that IF Cloak was removed, the night blade class wouldn't even be the worst, simply to prove the point that nightblades do not NEED Cloak as stated by the person I responded too since, like you said it is more of a playstyle choice, but one that the majority posit as the only way for the class to be competitive.
I will say that Cloak needs to be nerfed but Nightblade, especially magblade needs to be buffed defensively. I can go into an objective discussion regarding it but unless you prove that you yourself consider context (based on your previous reply, you do not) than I'm not going to go further.
@Ragnaroek93 My point was that Cloak spam is a crutch, the same way that Shield Stacking is a crutch. Shields got "nerfed" and I actually supported the sentiment, even if it came out to be a net buff. In fact, I'd go so far as to remove shield stacking so long as pets are made reliable (this does not mean buff pets) and Sorc mobility is made less clunky.
I showed proof that a good night blade does not need Cloak spam to perform well in PvP solo. This translates to Cloak being completely unnecessary for group play. What was your point? What did you prove?
Funny how you don't care about sorc nerfs as long as they don't affect petbuilds. Having empowered Shadowrend as #1 dmg source in PvP and pets who deal more damage than proc sets ever did is fine, using Harness Magicka or a Nb class skill on the other side makes you a bad player.
Ragnaroek93 wrote: »Smashing some potatoes on console and tbagging them is a good proofRagnaroek93 wrote: »Do you realise that cloak is the defining ability of the nightblade, especially the magicka nightblade?
You keep asking to nerf the cloak to what end? Have you tried playing a magNB and found out that it is way to easy thanks to the cloak? What are your defences in BG as a magNB? You are a mage that can sneak, that's all, but a poor mage, because you lack any burst damage. I main a mnb and cloak does not save me that often, because it is so easy to counter!!! So I can't even imagine what will be fair play to you while fighting a STEALTHY class, the nightblade. Stealth and cloak is the reason I picked this class from the very begining, and at that time I did not had pvp in mind at all... just that cloak is a fun ability a trademark of the nightblade, a rogue/thief class in RPGs. So even if you keep spaming it, there are so many aoe's and dots that get you out of it, you can really use it effectively for a split second, then you really need act - either flee, or reengage in a new attack. But the problem is, once your enemies know you are around and using cloak, they activate their defences, pots, aoe spams, and act weary, so the cloak is not going to work for long.
The whole skill tree of the mnb is imagined to put pressure on the target with snares and dots, but you do not have a burst attack like the stamblade has with snipe, you have to build it up hoping that by the time you get the bow proc your target is still in range or has not destroyed you. I am really wondering if you know what you are talking about, when you discuss cloak nerfs.
So yea, snipe is bad because it is cheap, you do not need much skill to find a sweet spot and keep ganking people. But you can't also just nerf it to the ground, making snipe hit like a wet noodle. Snipers are usually easy to destroy if you get close to them because they fear melee combat, and are not prepaired for it. So each thing has a counter, and the nice thing about PvP is working to find out these counters, finding what works for you and getting better at it. Asking for nerfs on forums is not one of those counters.
Majority of the best magblades don't even use cloak. And no, you don't need it for open world.
Have you tried playing magblade without it?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YuzJ2N2yg8w
Try pulling that off by spamming Cloak as a magblade lol. You won't.
You want to say stamblade needs cloak spam?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pt0qj6YzH9A&t=175s
Yes, he has cloak on his bar but look at how many times he actually uses it. If Cloak increased in cost by 500% for 10 seconds after use, this guy wouldn't even be affected by it. Why? Because he's a good stamblade that knows how to play.
And for a direct comparison:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EQcY4GPJU6s&t=1m36s
I'm not even a good stamblade. If you look at the last fight you can see how I literally don't cloak once in the 1v1 and get an easy dub.
Every single night blade that says Cloak is weak is bad.
Cloak is a crutch for bad players. People think that you need Cloak to play a stamblade. You don't. You need skill to play it, arguably less than other classes in the current meta, but flat out removing Cloak wouldn't even destroy the class. It would make it significantly weaker, but the first 2 videos prove you don't need it, and you especially don't need to spam it. The last clip shows the kind of players that crutch on Cloak spam. All you're doing is setting a glass ceiling for yourself by relying on Cloak.
If you don't think Cloak can't be nerfed because it would destroy nightblades...well you're just bad.
So now I am a bad player because I slot cloak? Or because some other players prefer not to use it, is it bad, and since it is bad, should it also become worse, with a nerf? What is the logic? BTW... I am not interested in stamblades, they have access to FM and other tools, I play a magicka nightblade. Also Cyrodiil pvp is different than noncp BG pvp.
This is one of the problems here... many people talk about a very specific situation and playstyle, which they try to overlap to the whole game, including pve, instead of mentioning something like: IN Cp AvA PvP, in 1vX or zerg vs zerg, there is this problem with _insert skill_. My proposal is this, I did a test with this build and came up with these conclusions.... Most people just vent their anger after losing some games or skirmishes.
Also you are referring to your playstyle and preference, which is not optimal or fun for everyone. Same with the OP... don't tell me the skills I use are bad or have to be nerfed, or if you do, come with some constructive feedback which is not going to antagonise players. Saying the ping is low is not really a balance issue.
Again.. stop telling people how to play the game and their chars. (you are telling me that I do not need cloak for the open world, which is clearly a matter of choice, since the open world is the main casual play area of the game).
Your arguments would be valid if the cloak ability would have almost no counter and would create a huge advantage to its user. But it is hardly the case... it is more an annoyance to the one fighting a magblade, and as people know, it has many counters which are not class restricted, this being the reason behind "majority of the best magblades don't even use cloak", as you say. So then, why nerf it or change it? You say it is a crutch for bad players, which I doubt, since it does not make you hard to kill like pre-murkmire shields made you, especially sorc shield. It is convenient to vanish and makes some things easier, same like the sorc's teleport, but does not give you the edge in pvp.
To answer to your question, for pve, I do not slot cloak, but in open world I use it often to skip mobs while questing or travelling. In PvP (I mostly do non cp BGs), I have it slotted, but I do not use it much, because the action is more intense than in zerg pvp where you get heals and buffs for lots of people. As I said.. cloaking does not save you if decent pvp-ers notice you are around. Yes, in Cyro you might find a spot to hide, but in BGs, there is hardly the case or reason to hide, so it really depends so much on the context we are talking.
Don't. Don't argue with magsorc players in this forum. It's pointless.
Uhm ok. First off, my post was made in response to someone who claimed that magblade cannot play without Cloak. @kind_hero you ridicule me for talking out of context but you take my response completely out of its context.
I never directly stated to remove Cloak, nor have I ever done so. My closing argument was that IF Cloak was removed, the night blade class wouldn't even be the worst, simply to prove the point that nightblades do not NEED Cloak as stated by the person I responded too since, like you said it is more of a playstyle choice, but one that the majority posit as the only way for the class to be competitive.
I will say that Cloak needs to be nerfed but Nightblade, especially magblade needs to be buffed defensively. I can go into an objective discussion regarding it but unless you prove that you yourself consider context (based on your previous reply, you do not) than I'm not going to go further.
@Ragnaroek93 My point was that Cloak spam is a crutch, the same way that Shield Stacking is a crutch. Shields got "nerfed" and I actually supported the sentiment, even if it came out to be a net buff. In fact, I'd go so far as to remove shield stacking so long as pets are made reliable (this does not mean buff pets) and Sorc mobility is made less clunky.
I showed proof that a good night blade does not need Cloak spam to perform well in PvP solo. This translates to Cloak being completely unnecessary for group play. What was your point? What did you prove?
Funny how you don't care about sorc nerfs as long as they don't affect petbuilds. Having empowered Shadowrend as #1 dmg source in PvP and pets who deal more damage than proc sets ever did is fine, using Harness Magicka or a Nb class skill on the other side makes you a bad player.
It's enough proof that defensively, nightblades do not need Cloak in open world, as solo play is where the damage:mitigation/healing ratio leans most towards damage. In a group, cloak is useless since you have so much allies to LoS and constant heals. In a duel, magblades do not use Cloak, and a stamblade is better off running shadow image for the minor maim. So three areas of PvP: Solo, group and duels: none of which need Cloak to be competitive, in fact, you are better off not using Cloak unless you are a stamblade, and even than you get better results by using it sparingly, not between every light attack.
Please highlight where I said anything that you are referring to. Please point out where I stated any of the claims that you try to attribute to me simply because you have no counter argument to the fact the I provided visual evidence that Cloak is not mandatory.
I even stated that magblades should get a significant defensive buff, and that night blade as a whole needs a defensive buff. Did you read that? Are you against buffing Nightblades?
Uhm ok. First off, my post was made in response to someone who claimed that magblade cannot play without Cloak. @kind_hero you ridicule me for talking out of context but you take my response completely out of its context.
I never directly stated to remove Cloak, nor have I ever done so. My closing argument was that IF Cloak was removed, the night blade class wouldn't even be the worst, simply to prove the point that nightblades do not NEED Cloak as stated by the person I responded too since, like you said it is more of a playstyle choice, but one that the majority posit as the only way for the class to be competitive.
I will say that Cloak needs to be nerfed but Nightblade, especially magblade needs to be buffed defensively. I can go into an objective discussion regarding it but unless you prove that you yourself consider context (based on your previous reply, you do not) than I'm not going to go further.
@Ragnaroek93 My point was that Cloak spam is a crutch, the same way that Shield Stacking is a crutch. Shields got "nerfed" and I actually supported the sentiment, even if it came out to be a net buff. In fact, I'd go so far as to remove shield stacking so long as pets are made reliable (this does not mean buff pets) and Sorc mobility is made less clunky.
I showed proof that a good night blade does not need Cloak spam to perform well in PvP solo. This translates to Cloak being completely unnecessary for group play. What was your point? What did you prove?
OK.. I also replied to more coments than just yours, so sorry for taking out of context in regards to your opinion.
I have said more than enough in this thread (btw, in regards to the remark about the futility of arguing with mag sorcs on the forum, I main a magblade and have magsorc as an active alt ) so what I want to conclude is that adjustments might be needed or whatever, but I really dislike when people are calling for nerfs in regards to class identity abilities which will make all classes look the same.
ESO is based on a role playing game, that's why we pick classes when we start the game. Nightblade is a class that can sneak and vanish to attack from the shadows (ok, all classes can sneak, but you get my point). Sorceror is a class that can call lighning and teleport, DK can transform into a "dragon", and so on. These differences should not be blurred just for pvp sake. Sure, the game lets you play outside of these archetypes, but I am sure everyone who has a nightblade, slots cloak when doing Thieves Guild/DB missions
Ragnaroek93 wrote: »Smashing some potatoes on console and tbagging them is a good proofRagnaroek93 wrote: »Do you realise that cloak is the defining ability of the nightblade, especially the magicka nightblade?
You keep asking to nerf the cloak to what end? Have you tried playing a magNB and found out that it is way to easy thanks to the cloak? What are your defences in BG as a magNB? You are a mage that can sneak, that's all, but a poor mage, because you lack any burst damage. I main a mnb and cloak does not save me that often, because it is so easy to counter!!! So I can't even imagine what will be fair play to you while fighting a STEALTHY class, the nightblade. Stealth and cloak is the reason I picked this class from the very begining, and at that time I did not had pvp in mind at all... just that cloak is a fun ability a trademark of the nightblade, a rogue/thief class in RPGs. So even if you keep spaming it, there are so many aoe's and dots that get you out of it, you can really use it effectively for a split second, then you really need act - either flee, or reengage in a new attack. But the problem is, once your enemies know you are around and using cloak, they activate their defences, pots, aoe spams, and act weary, so the cloak is not going to work for long.
The whole skill tree of the mnb is imagined to put pressure on the target with snares and dots, but you do not have a burst attack like the stamblade has with snipe, you have to build it up hoping that by the time you get the bow proc your target is still in range or has not destroyed you. I am really wondering if you know what you are talking about, when you discuss cloak nerfs.
So yea, snipe is bad because it is cheap, you do not need much skill to find a sweet spot and keep ganking people. But you can't also just nerf it to the ground, making snipe hit like a wet noodle. Snipers are usually easy to destroy if you get close to them because they fear melee combat, and are not prepaired for it. So each thing has a counter, and the nice thing about PvP is working to find out these counters, finding what works for you and getting better at it. Asking for nerfs on forums is not one of those counters.
Majority of the best magblades don't even use cloak. And no, you don't need it for open world.
Have you tried playing magblade without it?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YuzJ2N2yg8w
Try pulling that off by spamming Cloak as a magblade lol. You won't.
You want to say stamblade needs cloak spam?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pt0qj6YzH9A&t=175s
Yes, he has cloak on his bar but look at how many times he actually uses it. If Cloak increased in cost by 500% for 10 seconds after use, this guy wouldn't even be affected by it. Why? Because he's a good stamblade that knows how to play.
And for a direct comparison:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EQcY4GPJU6s&t=1m36s
I'm not even a good stamblade. If you look at the last fight you can see how I literally don't cloak once in the 1v1 and get an easy dub.
Every single night blade that says Cloak is weak is bad.
Cloak is a crutch for bad players. People think that you need Cloak to play a stamblade. You don't. You need skill to play it, arguably less than other classes in the current meta, but flat out removing Cloak wouldn't even destroy the class. It would make it significantly weaker, but the first 2 videos prove you don't need it, and you especially don't need to spam it. The last clip shows the kind of players that crutch on Cloak spam. All you're doing is setting a glass ceiling for yourself by relying on Cloak.
If you don't think Cloak can't be nerfed because it would destroy nightblades...well you're just bad.
So now I am a bad player because I slot cloak? Or because some other players prefer not to use it, is it bad, and since it is bad, should it also become worse, with a nerf? What is the logic? BTW... I am not interested in stamblades, they have access to FM and other tools, I play a magicka nightblade. Also Cyrodiil pvp is different than noncp BG pvp.
This is one of the problems here... many people talk about a very specific situation and playstyle, which they try to overlap to the whole game, including pve, instead of mentioning something like: IN Cp AvA PvP, in 1vX or zerg vs zerg, there is this problem with _insert skill_. My proposal is this, I did a test with this build and came up with these conclusions.... Most people just vent their anger after losing some games or skirmishes.
Also you are referring to your playstyle and preference, which is not optimal or fun for everyone. Same with the OP... don't tell me the skills I use are bad or have to be nerfed, or if you do, come with some constructive feedback which is not going to antagonise players. Saying the ping is low is not really a balance issue.
Again.. stop telling people how to play the game and their chars. (you are telling me that I do not need cloak for the open world, which is clearly a matter of choice, since the open world is the main casual play area of the game).
Your arguments would be valid if the cloak ability would have almost no counter and would create a huge advantage to its user. But it is hardly the case... it is more an annoyance to the one fighting a magblade, and as people know, it has many counters which are not class restricted, this being the reason behind "majority of the best magblades don't even use cloak", as you say. So then, why nerf it or change it? You say it is a crutch for bad players, which I doubt, since it does not make you hard to kill like pre-murkmire shields made you, especially sorc shield. It is convenient to vanish and makes some things easier, same like the sorc's teleport, but does not give you the edge in pvp.
To answer to your question, for pve, I do not slot cloak, but in open world I use it often to skip mobs while questing or travelling. In PvP (I mostly do non cp BGs), I have it slotted, but I do not use it much, because the action is more intense than in zerg pvp where you get heals and buffs for lots of people. As I said.. cloaking does not save you if decent pvp-ers notice you are around. Yes, in Cyro you might find a spot to hide, but in BGs, there is hardly the case or reason to hide, so it really depends so much on the context we are talking.
Don't. Don't argue with magsorc players in this forum. It's pointless.
Uhm ok. First off, my post was made in response to someone who claimed that magblade cannot play without Cloak. @kind_hero you ridicule me for talking out of context but you take my response completely out of its context.
I never directly stated to remove Cloak, nor have I ever done so. My closing argument was that IF Cloak was removed, the night blade class wouldn't even be the worst, simply to prove the point that nightblades do not NEED Cloak as stated by the person I responded too since, like you said it is more of a playstyle choice, but one that the majority posit as the only way for the class to be competitive.
I will say that Cloak needs to be nerfed but Nightblade, especially magblade needs to be buffed defensively. I can go into an objective discussion regarding it but unless you prove that you yourself consider context (based on your previous reply, you do not) than I'm not going to go further.
@Ragnaroek93 My point was that Cloak spam is a crutch, the same way that Shield Stacking is a crutch. Shields got "nerfed" and I actually supported the sentiment, even if it came out to be a net buff. In fact, I'd go so far as to remove shield stacking so long as pets are made reliable (this does not mean buff pets) and Sorc mobility is made less clunky.
I showed proof that a good night blade does not need Cloak spam to perform well in PvP solo. This translates to Cloak being completely unnecessary for group play. What was your point? What did you prove?
Funny how you don't care about sorc nerfs as long as they don't affect petbuilds. Having empowered Shadowrend as #1 dmg source in PvP and pets who deal more damage than proc sets ever did is fine, using Harness Magicka or a Nb class skill on the other side makes you a bad player.
It's enough proof that defensively, nightblades do not need Cloak in open world, as solo play is where the damage:mitigation/healing ratio leans most towards damage. In a group, cloak is useless since you have so much allies to LoS and constant heals. In a duel, magblades do not use Cloak, and a stamblade is better off running shadow image for the minor maim. So three areas of PvP: Solo, group and duels: none of which need Cloak to be competitive, in fact, you are better off not using Cloak unless you are a stamblade, and even than you get better results by using it sparingly, not between every light attack.
Please highlight where I said anything that you are referring to. Please point out where I stated any of the claims that you try to attribute to me simply because you have no counter argument to the fact the I provided visual evidence that Cloak is not mandatory.
I even stated that magblades should get a significant defensive buff, and that night blade as a whole needs a defensive buff. Did you read that? Are you against buffing Nightblades?
You want to see nightblade? Let's make cloak just cleance 5 negative effects and give minor vitality for 3 sec
Some changes proposed new on discord:
Cloak is given the mist form treatment. There’s absolutely no reason for it to function differently.
Snipe and Bow ult swap, with snipe now being an ultimate and bow ult being the Bow spammable as a channel similar to flurry. Drastically improves bow PvE DPS as well.
Timestop heal negation and snare removed but the animation is sped up to compensate and the CC breaking of it needs to be fixed.
Earthgore reworked as an AOE remove all negative effects when you heal an ally below 50%, healing component completely removed.
I agree but seeing as magblade is on it's last leg ATM I don't see nerfing cloak as a good idea at all especially since there are many counters in existence. If magblade wasn't so crappy right now I'd be down to talk about cloak changes though.
I actually play MagNB, and to tell you the truth if cloak was reworked to remove snares and given the mist form treatment I would prefer it to the current state it is in personally and actually slot it. Snares are my #1 weakness on magblade.Do you realise that cloak is the defining ability of the nightblade, especially the magicka nightblade?
You keep asking to nerf the cloak to what end? Have you tried playing a magNB and found out that it is way to easy thanks to the cloak? What are your defences in BG as a magNB? You are a mage that can sneak, that's all, but a poor mage, because you lack any burst damage. I main a mnb and cloak does not save me that often, because it is so easy to counter!!! So I can't even imagine what will be fair play to you while fighting a STEALTHY class, the nightblade. Stealth and cloak is the reason I picked this class from the very begining, and at that time I did not had pvp in mind at all... just that cloak is a fun ability a trademark of the nightblade, a rogue/thief class in RPGs. So even if you keep spaming it, there are so many aoe's and dots that get you out of it, you can really use it effectively for a split second, then you really need act - either flee, or reengage in a new attack. But the problem is, once your enemies know you are around and using cloak, they activate their defences, pots, aoe spams, and act weary, so the cloak is not going to work for long.
The whole skill tree of the mnb is imagined to put pressure on the target with snares and dots, but you do not have a burst attack like the stamblade has with snipe, you have to build it up hoping that by the time you get the bow proc your target is still in range or has not destroyed you. I am really wondering if you know what you are talking about, when you discuss cloak nerfs.
So yea, snipe is bad because it is cheap, you do not need much skill to find a sweet spot and keep ganking people. But you can't also just nerf it to the ground, making snipe hit like a wet noodle. Snipers are usually easy to destroy if you get close to them because they fear melee combat, and are not prepaired for it. So each thing has a counter, and the nice thing about PvP is working to find out these counters, finding what works for you and getting better at it. Asking for nerfs on forums is not one of those counters.
I play MagNB and I don’t use cloak. In fact, most MagNBs I know don’t use cloak. https://youtu.be/YuzJ2N2yg8w
Haashhtaag wrote: »Earthgore is a carry in PvE^^^
I’ve completed all endgame Vet content without earthgore. Tbh it acts as a failsafe mechanic to save groups from deaths when they mess up, essentially carrying them.
It’d do well to make endgame content more difficult and healer reliant by nerfing earthgore. I don’t think any actual endgame player has ever thought earthgore was healthy for Endgame PVE.
If endgame elites feel like a set is a carry. They have the choice not to use it. Simple.
I run trials that aren’t made up of elite players, and we still wipe. Endgame players that can beat content naked and with their eyes closed, shouldn’t even be giving their opinions on the game difficulty for less skilled players. Just my opinion.Earthgore is a carry in PvE^^^
I’ve completed all endgame Vet content without earthgore. Tbh it acts as a failsafe mechanic to save groups from deaths when they mess up, essentially carrying them.
It’d do well to make endgame content more difficult and healer reliant by nerfing earthgore. I don’t think any actual endgame player has ever thought earthgore was healthy for Endgame PVE.
If endgame elites feel like a set is a carry. They have the choice not to use it. Simple.
I run trials that aren’t made up of elite players, and we still wipe. Endgame players that can beat content naked and with their eyes closed, shouldn’t even be giving their opinions on the game difficulty for less skilled players. Just my opinion.
So would you rather this set carry your group and actually putting in the work to better your group so this set isn’t necessary?
What really needs to be nerfed are healing springs, wings, permafrost, negate, and the damage boost DKs have against knocked down opponents.
The fact that this silly thread was made just shows how overpowered they are. People would rather continue with ball groups and complain about their pvp choices having counters. Looks to me like some have been doing it for so long they’ve confused themselves relying on these OP abilities for ‘skill’, to the point they’ve stopped playing the classes without them.
Whenever someone asks to win at the character creation screen something is broken. Choosing a certain class is not skill, to then ask for other classes to be nerfed when you already have an advantage is pathetic.
GeneralRoadkill wrote: »O boo hoo, a game has an assassin class that can go invisible and do what assassins should do - assassinate a target and slip away to fight another day. If you can’t figure out how to play against that, then cry me a river so tracking you will be all the easier. You want the game to be easier, this will at least remove the effort of having to track you since I can follow your wailing, Moaning Myrtle.
For those who legitimately want to learn to play, I find acid spray, caltrops and steel tornado pop me out of stealth most often so have at it! (Detect pots and Flare also work pretty well for the few who use these.)
It's funny how you say that, as NBs will be the ones crying rivers next patch if curse-eater stays the same
GeneralRoadkill wrote: »It's funny how you say that, as NBs will be the ones crying rivers next patch if curse-eater stays the same
That’s fine, I’ve never had any problems with anything in the game (balance-wise). Some things are annoying af, but I get over it and adapt to the changes as they come. Not everyone is so quick to adapt, and instead cling to outdated builds and ideals.
Some people are also completely unaware that people have been crying about cloak since launch and that it has already been nerfed to oblivion and back several times, but can’t blame OP since he is in PS4 and wasn’t there for it all.
The skill provides way too much at the moment. You can completely reset fights, suppress DoTs, force misses, and as an escape tool it works better than Streak because anyone with half a brain will know not to run and Cloak in a straight line. And you can do all this without investing into magicka sustain as a night blade. I can sustain Cloak to the point where I can survive an entire 24 man searching for a single nightblade with average 1 out of every 4 potions providing magicka sustain.
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A fair fight means both players have equal opportunity to hit the other. In the case of Cloak, only 1 player has the option of hitting the other, outside of hard counters such as detect pots that should never have been introduced anyways.
Eh doubt people would have a problem if basic detect and stealth pots were available at every vendor in PvP-land. Why that's not the case makes little sense to me considering both mechanics are almost exclusively used in PvP, but who knows how ZOS applies logic these days...
DoonerSeraph wrote: »About cloak, I find it annoying but still fine, also there are detect potions and the new Sentry set (not sure if someone will use it tho), maybe increase the radius of magelight and expert hunter, anti-stealth specific skills that suck very badly.
GeneralRoadkill wrote: »lol
Eh doubt people would have a problem if basic detect and stealth pots were available at every vendor in PvP-land. Why that's not the case makes little sense to me considering both mechanics are almost exclusively used in PvP, but who knows how ZOS applies logic these days...
Now that is something I could get behind. Very good idea, we need more outside the box ideas like this instead of just trying to nerf everything!