John_Falstaff wrote: »

As a follow-up, forgot 15% from CP passive - accounting for that, equilibrium point between old and new stats (with Endurance) would be around 1000 base regen. If the build sits around or below that (and runs CP passive, Major Endurance and optionally Minor), regen either will be the same or better than before, or so it would seem.

The passive will be buff in any pve situation imaginable as the equilibrium point is much higher than you assume. New 75 recovery on khajiit is 127 recovery after buffs at minimum and on most builds to something like 148 on vampire nightblades.
So even at lowest the point would be at 1270 base recovery. At most builds have 958 recovery (dubious + stormfist) so only if they bothered to put 2 recovery enchants on their jewelry (nobody serious in pve would ever do this) they would get more.

Why in the Dark Elf passive Resist Flame 3% Max Magicka became 600 Max Health?

I am very impressed, these changes look really good. I see less punishment for picking non meta race/class combinations and clear distinction between races strengths.

4/4 all my MagDD's are dark elves. This pushes me to make them PVP builds, but what will i do at trials? I hope Necromancer's MagDD role will be nice and will be my mainlike DD toon.

My opinions in general;

Many players' MagDD's are dark elves. ZOS could consider this.

Argonian nerf is normal i think.

StamSorc redguard will be the luckiest redguard.

Bretons became more flexible at magicka roles.

Nords extra ulti is nice but still they can only play tank role and i was expecting better buffs for them.

Orcs will be new most popular StamDDs.

Wood Elves could get bit extra Bow damage. They won't be a good choice. Only maybe for battlegrounds.

Let's see them all at PTS but i guess converting max stats percentages to flat damages will be also an all around nerf. I hope it won't. So many things to change but probably i won't use racial change token if it's also changing appearence, cause i love my toons.

I can hear Bretons from all over Tamriel singing and enjoying these changes. I'm a little bitter over the Argonian changes, but it is currently out-performing most of the other classes.

Good job on this changes.

seen that a lot of player has more character the fairest thing is to give 1 per character personally I have 9 !!!

Dunmer and Khajiit could need some love in my opinion, everything else looks good. Can't wait to see the new Woodelf and Orc passives in PvP, that should be amazing.

Developer Comment
Spoiler
Argonians by nature are resilient creatures, adapting to their surroundings and accumulating themselves to the environment. Their ability to shrug off potent diseases makes them harder to take down, and their connection with the Hist empowers their will for life. Their bonus to Healing Done makes them gifted at healing themselves or their allies, while their resource return after drinking a potion helps them stay in the fight. Regardless of their role, their ability to recuperate and get back into the fray is something to respect.

I apologize if someone mentioned this before, but I haven't read all the responses yet (and I can't seem to use the search function on the current thread only).
I believe the above word in bold, "accumulating", should be "acclimating".

Only one race change per account after such huge changes??
You guys are criminals in every way

Please give us more than one race change token. You've literally changed complete builds, and with that being said it's only fair that you give us race change tokens for every character. Make them expire after a month, but actually do something for your community. A lot of us are not happy and one race change token is not enough. This would make the community really happy.

Also it'll prevent people from going to PayPal to get their money back.

Still changes nothing! Zos? Where is "Allow more effective options when picking a race for each role in tanking, healing, or damage dealing". Argonian, Altmer and Redguard still totaly BIS.

Khajiit themed chapter upcoming, huge nerf to Khajiit. Well played ZoS, well played

welcome orc master race, it seems redguard is worse than wood elf now on terms of recovery aswell, orc seems to be in the middle of all with extra wep dmg

So, lets summarize:
- altmer and dunmer even stronger than before
- imperial red diamond garbage as it was
- orc made into mandatory noob choice for poison injection/2h nabs inp pvp even more than before
- straight up nerf to nord tanking, resist caps are easy to reach, 6% mitigation was better
- breton templar healer even better
- redguard even more buffed as pve stam build

Very good reasons to change passives, nicely shown though process aaand totally wrong conclusions and changes. Instead narrow the gap between races its made wider than before and will end up with even more restrictive race choices for specific roles.

LOL... Wouldn't enjoy being the fella whose job is to wade through the furore of backlash these changes are generating.

I read through a few pages of the community's response and picked up a distinct feeling of unhappy campers about. To be fair, there are also some people who are happy - a reason to play as a magicka based kitty? Yay! I suppose my plans, for going magicka based khajit necromancer with the upcoming expansion, wont be utterly deranged after all.

At the end of the day, it still stands that these changes are necessary and long overdue. While I do not think all of them are well though out, taken as a whole, this list is an improvement over the previous set up.

The move away from percentage based mechanics is something I whole heatedly approve, though given their abundance in the system, not sure how much of a a difference it will ultimately do. Percentage based systems are what I generally ascribe as "lazy design" mentality. They are easy to set up, they feel easy to understand, and look smart. But the problem with such designs is, that people in general, do not understand the full weight of the exponential function. Percentage based systems will almost always go out of whack, and lead to stats way outside of the expected boundaries.

Setting up a system based on fixed numbers, will help to keep the system in check, but is also a lot harder thing to do correctly. And given the number of moving parts in ESO mechanics, it's not something I would tackle. Well not without one seriously hefty pay check at least.

The thing to keep in mind is, that math is hard. Anyone who tells you otherwise is lying. Coming up with solid mechanics is not an easy task, and ESO has never, in any of it's incarnations, had solid math behind it. Balancing this mess is a thankless task.

As far as racial bonuses and traits go... Well this is my actual feedback fort he devs:

Racial bonuses do not matter.

At all.

You really should just remove them from the game. They do not serve any positive function.

Each race is already distinct as is. They are distinct in their appearance and with the cultural and social trapping that come with them. Those differences are enough to make each race feel different. And that is all that should matter about picking your race.

Character identity and aptitude should be left for the player to decide.

Even if you want to force some sort of objective racial aptitude differences into your made up world, the scope of those difference would still tend to mean, that there is enough variance within each race for outlier individuals to appear. Case in point: Shalidor, the immensely powerful nord archmage. What if I want to play as Shally 2.0? Well, not gonna happen with these, or the previous, racial bonuses.

The second thing to keep in mind, is that online environment fosters competitive game play. And it does it to such a degree, that even people who do not usually care about min-maxing their characters, will feel the pressure to conform to what ever is considered to be meta.

This is partly due to social pressure (imagine showing up for the raid sporting your magicka based orc healer? You would face massive amount of derision for running sucha sub-optimal and unorthodox build) and partly due to being constantly measured against other players. Even if the difference in capability is less than 5%, you will constantly be reminded that you are not as powerful as people running other builds. And that your lack of power is not due to your personal ability, but due to simply picking the non meta race for your build.

The end result is, that people will crunch the numbers, and the top choice will present it self. And then people are encouraged, by the mechanisms i mentioned above, to adopt a build using those choices.

As things stand, with these racial bonuses, there is absolutely no point in playing a magicka based DPS character that is not a a high-elf! There is no incentive what so ever to be a magicka based red-guard, nor is there a reason to play as a stamina based breton at all. No matter what your playstyle is, there is a bis race for it. And no matter what race you want to play, there is an optimal playstyle for it.

Playing against the racial stereotype would be like playing with one hand tied behind your back. Sure you can do it, even be successful with it. But you'd be constantly gimping yourself, and the other players around you would also, both actively and passively, constantly remind you of said fact. And that would get old real quick.

For some players, a cool character concept is enough to put up with the constant reminders and derision. But you'd hafta be pretty dedicated to your idea, to keep up with all the crap you'd take for running an orc healer.

Finally... Moving to flat bonuses is gonna reign in some of the more extreme builds people have come up with. There is going to be a significant power reduction for some builds. And people utilizing those builds are gonna resist these changes.

Most will adapt I think. The shield nerfs from last update, already shifted the meta somewhat away form max mag stacking, and many stam based builds weren't stacking stam all that high anyway. For stam, the focus has been weapon damage and now mag is also swinging towards max spell damage. I bet you can come up with some atrociously high spell damage scores for your high elf mag sorc and break the expected boundaries once more.

So to sum it up, all that will really happen is, that the meta will shift some. People who are constantly race changing, in their pursuit of the meta, will whine about the cost. Most players will adjust their builds a bit. New bis race choices for various builds and play styles will emerge and things will keep on trucking pretty much as they have been so far.

Some diversity in builds is lost, some diversity of choice is gained, but in general, the fact remains, that going against the grain of your race is still a really bad idea.

So, once again - just remove racial bonuses from the game completely and let players play the way the want. All that these bonuses accomplish is to reinforce a tight set of "good" and "bad" build choices.