PTS Update 20 - Feedback Thread for Sorcerer

ccmedaddy · October 2018

^ I don't know how many times this has been pointed out in various threads but.... the shield nerf is primarily a PvE nerf. Blame those "toxic" PvEers who have been complaining about how braindead easy 99% of PvE content is with those OP 20k+ shields. xD

ezio45 · October 2018

@ZOS_RobGarrett

so when is zos gunna give sorc and actual heal......

Biro123 · October 2018

TheWorldsLastChance wrote: »

This might have been the single worst patch I have ever seen in MMO history. And I have almost played them all, even the ones you haven't heard of.

Look at what SWTOR did to their healers in patch 3.3, and how they server merged twice immediately afterwards because of how bad their population dropped.
Look at what LOTRO did to their hunters.
Those are NOT examples to follow.

When you take someone's character that they have poured hours of love into and make it a laughing stock of the game, they don't like that. They unsubscribe and leave your game, to never come back.

Things were fine the way they were before. I would be happier if you just left us alone. But you have to listen to PvP whiners who want to be gods with little to no time and effort to building their characters, and have to punish the class where people go when they are willing to put thousands (literally, THOUSANDS) of hours each to make their character stronger and better.

I have 2,000 hours clocked on my Sorc alone and nearly all of it has been devoted to making her strong in PvE, and because you listen to the PvP whiners who have never played magsorc for a day in their lives,

I am having something I worked very, very hard for taken away from me when I did nothing wrong. It's not fair.

I don't PvP, none of my guilds PvP. We don't like the toxicity of the ESO PvP community.

We avoid the forums because we know that this is where the PvP Community's toxicity is the worst.

Yes, my sorc can pull 40.9k dps.
But every class (even Wardens) can pass 40k. Some classes (Dragonknights, Nightblades, Templars) can even break 55k nearing to 60k.
I even have a guidlie with a stamDK who can pull 67k dps.
But like the sorcerers, he has put close to 6,000 hours of time, thought, practice, failure, frustration, consideration, and love into his character. He has almost 1300cp, and I have never encountered someone with more love for this game than him.

Why is it us you punish?

Because we are the class people choose when wanting to solo?
Because we are the class people choose when wanting to PvE?
Because we are the most people choose when wanting to play the most stereotypical magic user of ESO?
Because we are the ones people choose when wanting to control elements (ice, lightning, fire, darkness)
Because we are the ones people choose when wanting to play a summoner fantasy?

Things were fine the way they were before. Shields are reduced ANYWAYS in PvP.

Find a system to make the classes you want to nerf weaker in PvP and only in PvP - like you do with the personal shields already. You shouldn't ruin your PvE to tune to your PvP. PvEr's hate PvP, and they hate it even more when their characters are ruined to the likes of the PvP whiners.

I have already canceled my ESO plus and started to recommend interested friends to stay away from this game.
I give my word that I will single-handedly sell your game 50 copies if you undo these changes. I love this game dearly and have been making it grow one player every couple of days anyway. I am a guild leader of a large multi-gaming community that plays MMOs and our ESO section has 120 people online on Discord right now. Most of these players are my friends from past MMOs. Don't believe me? PM me, I'll give you the link.

If this patch goes through, I am taking my family & friends to never return.

Ahh, the standard 'PVPers are all toxic and Its all PVPs fault' thread.

I know you won't listen, but these nerfs are aimed primarily at PVE (to give healers a role), yet inadvertently destroy the class for PVP much more completely.
Think yourself lucky that while you hide from the forums, you have all these 'toxic PVPers' here fighting in your corner for you.

TheWorldsLastChance · October 2018

Okay, please try to overloook the portion of my post where I talked about PvPers and look at everything else.

Other classes have better survivability
Other classes have better damage
Other classes have better healing
Other classes have better everything

What are they going to accomplish by taking my character I spent 2,000+ hours of my life and making her arguably the worst at everything in the game?

Any character can be good if you pour thousands of hours of love into them. Why nerf the sorcs?

Is it because unlike the magblade, magdk, and warden - they are actually
oh, i can't believe i'm going to say this
FUN?!
No, no, no, no, go back. Your game can't be fun! That's why you're nerfing Sorcs.

I don't see a single person who has genuinely played sorc for a day in their life saying "yeah this patch was a good one"

I wouldn't be surprised if the people who do "support" it are the developers who made the bad decisions, defending their horrific mistakes with anonymity.

Seriously - PvErs and PvPers alike agree that this patch was terrible and one of the worst patches of MMO history.

That's how you know that you messed something up, baad.

Expansions are supposed to grow games and be good, draw players back.

Not make their current playerbase frustrated, angry, disappointed, and so many other things. Because when they screw their playerbase like they've screwed sorcerors, the players leave.

Vahrokh · October 2018

Biro123 wrote: »

TheWorldsLastChance wrote: »

This might have been the single worst patch I have ever seen in MMO history. And I have almost played them all, even the ones you haven't heard of.

Look at what SWTOR did to their healers in patch 3.3, and how they server merged twice immediately afterwards because of how bad their population dropped.
Look at what LOTRO did to their hunters.
Those are NOT examples to follow.

When you take someone's character that they have poured hours of love into and make it a laughing stock of the game, they don't like that. They unsubscribe and leave your game, to never come back.

Things were fine the way they were before. I would be happier if you just left us alone. But you have to listen to PvP whiners who want to be gods with little to no time and effort to building their characters, and have to punish the class where people go when they are willing to put thousands (literally, THOUSANDS) of hours each to make their character stronger and better.

I have 2,000 hours clocked on my Sorc alone and nearly all of it has been devoted to making her strong in PvE, and because you listen to the PvP whiners who have never played magsorc for a day in their lives,

I am having something I worked very, very hard for taken away from me when I did nothing wrong. It's not fair.

I don't PvP, none of my guilds PvP. We don't like the toxicity of the ESO PvP community.

We avoid the forums because we know that this is where the PvP Community's toxicity is the worst.

Yes, my sorc can pull 40.9k dps.
But every class (even Wardens) can pass 40k. Some classes (Dragonknights, Nightblades, Templars) can even break 55k nearing to 60k.
I even have a guidlie with a stamDK who can pull 67k dps.
But like the sorcerers, he has put close to 6,000 hours of time, thought, practice, failure, frustration, consideration, and love into his character. He has almost 1300cp, and I have never encountered someone with more love for this game than him.

Why is it us you punish?

Because we are the class people choose when wanting to solo?
Because we are the class people choose when wanting to PvE?
Because we are the most people choose when wanting to play the most stereotypical magic user of ESO?
Because we are the ones people choose when wanting to control elements (ice, lightning, fire, darkness)
Because we are the ones people choose when wanting to play a summoner fantasy?

Things were fine the way they were before. Shields are reduced ANYWAYS in PvP.

Find a system to make the classes you want to nerf weaker in PvP and only in PvP - like you do with the personal shields already. You shouldn't ruin your PvE to tune to your PvP. PvEr's hate PvP, and they hate it even more when their characters are ruined to the likes of the PvP whiners.

I have already canceled my ESO plus and started to recommend interested friends to stay away from this game.
I give my word that I will single-handedly sell your game 50 copies if you undo these changes. I love this game dearly and have been making it grow one player every couple of days anyway. I am a guild leader of a large multi-gaming community that plays MMOs and our ESO section has 120 people online on Discord right now. Most of these players are my friends from past MMOs. Don't believe me? PM me, I'll give you the link.

If this patch goes through, I am taking my family & friends to never return.

Ahh, the standard 'PVPers are all toxic and Its all PVPs fault' thread.

I know you won't listen, but these nerfs are aimed primarily at PVE (to give healers a role), yet inadvertently destroy the class for PVP much more completely.
Think yourself lucky that while you hide from the forums, you have all these 'toxic PVPers' here fighting in your corner for you.

I fail to see why making pets UTTERLY USELESS would give healers a role, but they are doing it anyway, on top of the never ending plethora of horripilant nerfs they have slammed against my class.

Biro123 · October 2018

Vahrokh wrote: »

Biro123 wrote: »

TheWorldsLastChance wrote: »

This might have been the single worst patch I have ever seen in MMO history. And I have almost played them all, even the ones you haven't heard of.

Look at what SWTOR did to their healers in patch 3.3, and how they server merged twice immediately afterwards because of how bad their population dropped.
Look at what LOTRO did to their hunters.
Those are NOT examples to follow.

When you take someone's character that they have poured hours of love into and make it a laughing stock of the game, they don't like that. They unsubscribe and leave your game, to never come back.

Things were fine the way they were before. I would be happier if you just left us alone. But you have to listen to PvP whiners who want to be gods with little to no time and effort to building their characters, and have to punish the class where people go when they are willing to put thousands (literally, THOUSANDS) of hours each to make their character stronger and better.

I have 2,000 hours clocked on my Sorc alone and nearly all of it has been devoted to making her strong in PvE, and because you listen to the PvP whiners who have never played magsorc for a day in their lives,

I am having something I worked very, very hard for taken away from me when I did nothing wrong. It's not fair.

I don't PvP, none of my guilds PvP. We don't like the toxicity of the ESO PvP community.

We avoid the forums because we know that this is where the PvP Community's toxicity is the worst.

Yes, my sorc can pull 40.9k dps.
But every class (even Wardens) can pass 40k. Some classes (Dragonknights, Nightblades, Templars) can even break 55k nearing to 60k.
I even have a guidlie with a stamDK who can pull 67k dps.
But like the sorcerers, he has put close to 6,000 hours of time, thought, practice, failure, frustration, consideration, and love into his character. He has almost 1300cp, and I have never encountered someone with more love for this game than him.

Why is it us you punish?

Because we are the class people choose when wanting to solo?
Because we are the class people choose when wanting to PvE?
Because we are the most people choose when wanting to play the most stereotypical magic user of ESO?
Because we are the ones people choose when wanting to control elements (ice, lightning, fire, darkness)
Because we are the ones people choose when wanting to play a summoner fantasy?

Things were fine the way they were before. Shields are reduced ANYWAYS in PvP.

Find a system to make the classes you want to nerf weaker in PvP and only in PvP - like you do with the personal shields already. You shouldn't ruin your PvE to tune to your PvP. PvEr's hate PvP, and they hate it even more when their characters are ruined to the likes of the PvP whiners.

I have already canceled my ESO plus and started to recommend interested friends to stay away from this game.
I give my word that I will single-handedly sell your game 50 copies if you undo these changes. I love this game dearly and have been making it grow one player every couple of days anyway. I am a guild leader of a large multi-gaming community that plays MMOs and our ESO section has 120 people online on Discord right now. Most of these players are my friends from past MMOs. Don't believe me? PM me, I'll give you the link.

If this patch goes through, I am taking my family & friends to never return.

Ahh, the standard 'PVPers are all toxic and Its all PVPs fault' thread.

I know you won't listen, but these nerfs are aimed primarily at PVE (to give healers a role), yet inadvertently destroy the class for PVP much more completely.
Think yourself lucky that while you hide from the forums, you have all these 'toxic PVPers' here fighting in your corner for you.

I fail to see why making pets UTTERLY USELESS would give healers a role, but they are doing it anyway, on top of the never ending plethora of horripilant nerfs they have slammed against my class.

You know fine well that the shield nerf is to make health bars move down so healers can move em back up.
They just completely forgot about pets and are knee-jerking to try to fix it.

Bergzorn · October 2018

Biro123 wrote: »

Vahrokh wrote: »

Biro123 wrote: »

TheWorldsLastChance wrote: »

This might have been the single worst patch I have ever seen in MMO history. And I have almost played them all, even the ones you haven't heard of.

Look at what SWTOR did to their healers in patch 3.3, and how they server merged twice immediately afterwards because of how bad their population dropped.
Look at what LOTRO did to their hunters.
Those are NOT examples to follow.

When you take someone's character that they have poured hours of love into and make it a laughing stock of the game, they don't like that. They unsubscribe and leave your game, to never come back.

Things were fine the way they were before. I would be happier if you just left us alone. But you have to listen to PvP whiners who want to be gods with little to no time and effort to building their characters, and have to punish the class where people go when they are willing to put thousands (literally, THOUSANDS) of hours each to make their character stronger and better.

I have 2,000 hours clocked on my Sorc alone and nearly all of it has been devoted to making her strong in PvE, and because you listen to the PvP whiners who have never played magsorc for a day in their lives,

I am having something I worked very, very hard for taken away from me when I did nothing wrong. It's not fair.

I don't PvP, none of my guilds PvP. We don't like the toxicity of the ESO PvP community.

We avoid the forums because we know that this is where the PvP Community's toxicity is the worst.

Yes, my sorc can pull 40.9k dps.
But every class (even Wardens) can pass 40k. Some classes (Dragonknights, Nightblades, Templars) can even break 55k nearing to 60k.
I even have a guidlie with a stamDK who can pull 67k dps.
But like the sorcerers, he has put close to 6,000 hours of time, thought, practice, failure, frustration, consideration, and love into his character. He has almost 1300cp, and I have never encountered someone with more love for this game than him.

Why is it us you punish?

Because we are the class people choose when wanting to solo?
Because we are the class people choose when wanting to PvE?
Because we are the most people choose when wanting to play the most stereotypical magic user of ESO?
Because we are the ones people choose when wanting to control elements (ice, lightning, fire, darkness)
Because we are the ones people choose when wanting to play a summoner fantasy?

Things were fine the way they were before. Shields are reduced ANYWAYS in PvP.

Find a system to make the classes you want to nerf weaker in PvP and only in PvP - like you do with the personal shields already. You shouldn't ruin your PvE to tune to your PvP. PvEr's hate PvP, and they hate it even more when their characters are ruined to the likes of the PvP whiners.

I have already canceled my ESO plus and started to recommend interested friends to stay away from this game.
I give my word that I will single-handedly sell your game 50 copies if you undo these changes. I love this game dearly and have been making it grow one player every couple of days anyway. I am a guild leader of a large multi-gaming community that plays MMOs and our ESO section has 120 people online on Discord right now. Most of these players are my friends from past MMOs. Don't believe me? PM me, I'll give you the link.

If this patch goes through, I am taking my family & friends to never return.

Ahh, the standard 'PVPers are all toxic and Its all PVPs fault' thread.

I know you won't listen, but these nerfs are aimed primarily at PVE (to give healers a role), yet inadvertently destroy the class for PVP much more completely.
Think yourself lucky that while you hide from the forums, you have all these 'toxic PVPers' here fighting in your corner for you.

I fail to see why making pets UTTERLY USELESS would give healers a role, but they are doing it anyway, on top of the never ending plethora of horripilant nerfs they have slammed against my class.

They just completely forgot about [X] and are knee-jerking to try to fix it.

This holds for A LOT of changes they make to their game.

Galarthor · October 2018

TheWorldsLastChance wrote: »

This might have been the single worst patch I have ever seen in MMO history. And I have almost played them all, even the ones you haven't heard of.

Look at what SWTOR did to their healers in patch 3.3, and how they server merged twice immediately afterwards because of how bad their population dropped.
Look at what LOTRO did to their hunters.
Those are NOT examples to follow.

When you take someone's character that they have poured hours of love into and make it a laughing stock of the game, they don't like that. They unsubscribe and leave your game, to never come back.

Things were fine the way they were before. I would be happier if you just left us alone. But you have to listen to PvP whiners who want to be gods with little to no time and effort to building their characters, and have to punish the class where people go when they are willing to put thousands (literally, THOUSANDS) of hours each to make their character stronger and better.

I have 2,000 hours clocked on my Sorc alone and nearly all of it has been devoted to making her strong in PvE, and because you listen to the PvP whiners who have never played magsorc for a day in their lives,

I am having something I worked very, very hard for taken away from me when I did nothing wrong. It's not fair.

I don't PvP, none of my guilds PvP. We don't like the toxicity of the ESO PvP community.

We avoid the forums because we know that this is where the PvP Community's toxicity is the worst.

Yes, my sorc can pull 40.9k dps.
But every class (even Wardens) can pass 40k. Some classes (Dragonknights, Nightblades, Templars) can even break 55k nearing to 60k.
I even have a guidlie with a stamDK who can pull 67k dps.
But like the sorcerers, he has put close to 6,000 hours of time, thought, practice, failure, frustration, consideration, and love into his character. He has almost 1300cp, and I have never encountered someone with more love for this game than him.

Why is it us you punish?

Because we are the class people choose when wanting to solo?
Because we are the class people choose when wanting to PvE?
Because we are the most people choose when wanting to play the most stereotypical magic user of ESO?
Because we are the ones people choose when wanting to control elements (ice, lightning, fire, darkness)
Because we are the ones people choose when wanting to play a summoner fantasy?

Things were fine the way they were before. Shields are reduced ANYWAYS in PvP.

Find a system to make the classes you want to nerf weaker in PvP and only in PvP - like you do with the personal shields already. You shouldn't ruin your PvE to tune to your PvP. PvEr's hate PvP, and they hate it even more when their characters are ruined to the likes of the PvP whiners.

I have already canceled my ESO plus and started to recommend interested friends to stay away from this game.

If this patch goes through, I am taking my family & friends to never return.

This could have been a great post and ZOS might have listened to it. But when you start posting false facts you lose all credibility. ZOS stated multiple times that the shield nerf is PvE motivated. So why would they listen to somebody who is trying to make their case by twisting ZOS every word?

joaaocaampos · October 2018

Hardened Ward, Dampen Magic and Bastion need a rework.

Hardened Ward, Dampen Magic and Bastion are now completely useless, because a Magicka Char will generally have enough Magicka to get Empowered Ward and Harness Magicka to the 40% Max Health Cap. So Hardened Ward and Dampen Magic will no longer grant the morph bonus of a stronger shield, it will just be a Morph that gives nothing.

Hardened Ward, Dampen Magic and Bastion should not increase the shield strenght but the Health based cap, make it +20% for Hardened Ward, +25% for Bastion, and Dampen Magic should increase the cap by 3% for each piece of light armor worn. BUT... looking at the Shattering Blows, Bastion should be a counterpoint! Not just Bastion, but Hardened Ward and Dampen Magic as well.

Shattering Blows: Increases your damage against targets with a damage shield by [0-25]%.

What is the real counterpoint to Shattering Blows? Yes, something like Protection (Minor/Major Protection) buff! So... This should be the new Bastion effect: Reduces damage taken while using a damage shield ability by [0-25]%.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RobGarrett Hardened Ward, Dampen Magic and Bastion need a rework! After Patch 4.2.2, Empowered Ward and Harness Magicka are the only morph choices. Something needs to be done before Patch 4.2.5 (when go live)!

My sugestion!

Bastion: Reduces damage taken while using a damage shield ability by [0-25]%.
Hardened Ward (new morph effect): You gain Minor Protection (while the damage shield is active), reducing your damage taken by 8%.
Dampen Magic (new bonus effect): Reduces damage taken while the damage shield is active by 1% for each piece of Light Armor worn (totaling 7% with 7 pieces).

Agree?

Ranger209 · October 2018

Biro123 wrote: »

You know fine well that the shield nerf is to make health bars move down so healers can move em back up.
They just completely forgot about pets and are knee-jerking to try to fix it.

If this is really the truth, that it is all about making healers feel more relevant in pve, then maybe the correct approach is to make shields work more like a magicka block where it doesn't absorb 100% of the damage in its pool, but mitigates like 80% or 90% of it. So at 80% if you have a 10k shield and get hit by a 3k, 3k, and 4k burst, the shield absorbs 8k of it while 2k of it actually makes its way through and affects your health bar. In this scenario you would still at this point have 2k left of mitigation left on the shield. In doing this you would not cap the shields at all, but instead allow for the health bar to take a small portion of unmitigated damage. At 90% obviously 1k would hit your healthbar while 9k would be mitigated and the shield would have 1k left on it. Sorcs would need some work done on self healing to make this viable for solo play perhaps. Shields would last a little longer, 10% or 20 % longer, but not mitigate 100% of the damage thrown their way.

glorinand · October 2018

Yes, you tell them! We categorically reject these dumb changes, which make our characters unplayable. We are not going to invest hundreds of hours into switching to new mains with different classes and focuses. You can keep your villas, indrik feathers, fancy chapters, events and other shining baubles. You ruin the game for us - we leave. And if so, then good riddance, because a team that makes changes, which are so unprecedentedly foolish and not thought through in any way just cannot be trusted. And a team, which does not listen to its users, but instead insists on not reverting its mistakes - in deaf and blind stubbornness - just does not deserve customers. Admit your fault. Revert the changes.

To all these people trying to make constructive comments - don't try to be constructive about destructive changes: it doesn't make sense. There is a reason why the problem with shields on live cannot be fixed - it is merely because there IS no problem. Magicka classes should have strong shields. They should not need huge health pools or heavy armor to survive. If they do, then this is not the game I purchased in 2014. That one was about playing the way you want.

BretonMage · October 2018

Here's an idea, instead of nerfing shields to make healers more relevant, why don't they make healers much more powerful? Give them more and stronger buffs to work with, more powerful abilities? That way, solo players don't get penalised, and groups with healers have better advantages.

Alaztor91 · October 2018

Ranger209 wrote: »

If this is really the truth, that it is all about making healers feel more relevant in pve, then maybe the correct approach is to make shields work more like a magicka block where it doesn't absorb 100% of the damage in its pool, but mitigates like 80% or 90% of it. So at 80% if you have a 10k shield and get hit by a 3k, 3k, and 4k burst, the shield absorbs 8k of it while 2k of it actually makes its way through and affects your health bar. In this scenario you would still at this point have 2k left of mitigation left on the shield. In doing this you would not cap the shields at all, but instead allow for the health bar to take a small portion of unmitigated damage. At 90% obviously 1k would hit your healthbar while 9k would be mitigated and the shield would have 1k left on it. Sorcs would need some work done on self healing to make this viable for solo play perhaps. Shields would last a little longer, 10% or 20 % longer, but not mitigate 100% of the damage thrown their way.

I really think that something like this is the best solution, by now it's pretty obvious that the shield nerf was 100% targeted for PvE. Make it so that damage shields absorb between 75% - 90% of incoming damage affected by resistances/penetration and crit damage/crit resistances and then you can tweak stuff like shield strength, duration, cost, etc.

After that you can tweak stuff like surge, dark deal, passives, etc to increase healing to compensate for the damage passing through(and ofc for other magicka classes that might also need it)

These last changes like the health % cap and now making pets immune to damage in certain PvE content are just band aids to a problem that ZOS created in the first PTS patch.

Juhasow · October 2018

BretonMage wrote: »

Here's an idea, instead of nerfing shields to make healers more relevant, why don't they make healers much more powerful? Give them more and stronger buffs to work with, more powerful abilities? That way, solo players don't get penalised, and groups with healers have better advantages.

Problem is PvE power creep is already too high and making it even higher would just make the game stupidly easy. Over 3 years we've been buffed through CP system with more and more CP to spend and new stronger sets and lot of game machanics changes. It's kinda obvious devs needs to take something away so they're choosing nerfing abilities.

kind_hero · October 2018

TheWorldsLastChance wrote: »

Is it because unlike the magblade, magdk, and warden - they are actually
oh, i can't believe i'm going to say this
FUN?!
No, no, no, no, go back. Your game can't be fun! That's why you're nerfing Sorcs.

My main is a nightblade, but you know why I made and sometimes play a magsorc? Because as you say, it is FUN.. feels so different, especially when using the things they are nerfing now, shields, boundless, etc. You are right.. I hope they will listen. It is the only class that really feels like a mage (the others are more like warrior, paladin, vampire, hunter)

BretonMage · October 2018

Juhasow wrote: »

BretonMage wrote: »

Here's an idea, instead of nerfing shields to make healers more relevant, why don't they make healers much more powerful? Give them more and stronger buffs to work with, more powerful abilities? That way, solo players don't get penalised, and groups with healers have better advantages.

Problem is PvE power creep is already too high and making it even higher would just make the game stupidly easy. Over 3 years we've been buffed through CP system with more and more CP to spend and new stronger sets and lot of game machanics changes. It's kinda obvious devs needs to take something away so they're choosing nerfing abilities.

I understand, but maybe nerfing survivability wasn't the best solution. I'm not the expert here, obviously, but it seems to me there are a myriad ways they could have done this: CP cap? Or even diminishing returns for higher CP levels? I don't think penalising mid-level players who are already struggling to manage their survivability and damage output is the best way forward.

BalticBlues · October 2018

Juhasow wrote: »

It's kinda obvious devs needs to take something away so they're choosing nerfing abilities.

If CP is the problem, instead of crippling the gameplay we love,
ZOS should rather abolish the ill-designed CP system.

[snip]
[edited for baiting]

ezio45 · October 2018

BalticBlues wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

It's kinda obvious devs needs to take something away so they're choosing nerfing abilities.

If CP is the problem, instead of crippling the gameplay we love,
ZOS should rather abolish the ill-designed CP system.

[snip]

problem is the game is designed around it, look what happened with the removed the champoin points from morrowind. now no one can sustain. theyve been making content harder to keep up with it and they remove it and were all screwed. not to mention they have nerfed literally everything to the ground to keep up with it

[edited to remove quote]

Zer0oo · October 2018

Ok i played my sorc today again in pvp after more or less having him banked. Holy *** the class is a hollow shell what it used to be and a real mess in every aspect that made it fun. Is there really no dev that even took a look at the class and had some kind of concept for it?

Mobil? - no snared to dead and gap close spammed
cc? - a clunky class skill that is not worth it spot and an expensive destro cc that only works if you have farmed vDSA
getting hard countered?- yes everyone runs wings, nb go in stealth to slot shieldbreaker, easy to dodge or purge the burst
sustain?- only if run dark deal
free skill spots? - no because sorc has no overloaded skills that are needed with limited skillbar space and lost now even the third bar
good heal- no heal at all and they even nerfed healing ward
class defense - will get nerfed hard next patch and is already not so good outnumber, is an active defense so is expensive and one mistake will get you killed
grp support?- negate but nothing else unless you play some kind of root tank

also holy *** is streak *** now with all the delay in the lag and the fake root+getting stack in the air just to wait till you fall down.

Vudokan · October 2018

I have been a loyal subscriber for years now, never missing a month of Plus, and buying crowns at nearly every sale. I even bought both of the new 'chapters' even though they were a 'free DLC' bait-and-switch. I have been enjoying and supporting this game, because I have enjoyed my sorc. If these sorc nerfs go live, particularly the shield cast time, I will unsub and never spend another red cent in this game again. I feel as betrayed by this as I did when LotRO destroyed the hunter class. I left LotRO and never looked back. I can do it again.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_MattFiror @ZOS_Wrobel

Andferne · October 2018

ezio45 wrote: »

@ZOS_RobGarrett

so when is zos gunna give sorc and actual heal......

Probably the same day we get a class spammable.

maboleth · October 2018

Vudokan wrote: »

I have been a loyal subscriber for years now, never missing a month of Plus, and buying crowns at nearly every sale. I even bought both of the new 'chapters' even though they were a 'free DLC' bait-and-switch. I have been enjoying and supporting this game, because I have enjoyed my sorc. If these sorc nerfs go live, particularly the shield cast time, I will unsub and never spend another red cent in this game again. I feel as betrayed by this as I did when LotRO destroyed the hunter class. I left LotRO and never looked back. I can do it again.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_MattFiror @ZOS_Wrobel

Cast time is off (finally!) but prepare for slight (or not so slight, we'll see) shield strengths.

Juhasow · October 2018

ezio45 wrote: »

BalticBlues wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

It's kinda obvious devs needs to take something away so they're choosing nerfing abilities.

If CP is the problem, instead of crippling the gameplay we love,
ZOS should rather abolish the ill-designed CP system.

[snip]

problem is the game is designed around it, look what happened with the removed the champoin points from morrowind. now no one can sustain. theyve been making content harder to keep up with it and they remove it and were all screwed. not to mention they have nerfed literally everything to the ground to keep up with it

Problem is that people got use to new easier playstyles so quickly they've forgot around what gameplay game was oroginally designed in 2014. It was harsh and punishing , sustain was designed to be hard same as survivality and people really needed to make build decisions instead of brainlesly going for full offensive stats. Everyone cried and still cries that Morrowind nerfed sustain but in reality even after Morrowind sustain was 10 times better then before Tamriel Unlimited. The problem is community is just concerned when there is lot of nerfs at once but is totally ok when we're getting hugely overbuffed which later causes issues. Morrowind nerfs were the resuls of constant buffs we were getting since Tamriel Unlimited release and constant power creep increase caused by that. At certain point champion points combined with constant addition of new better sets and game mechanics improvements started to make content too easy but people simply got used to it and when developer decided to bring game back to the roots with Morrowind everyone started to complain because everyone got used to new easier and faster playstyle. Champion points issue itself is much more complex and to truly balance the game there would be need of huge rework to CP system.

[edited to remove quote]

ezio45 · October 2018

Juhasow wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

BalticBlues wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

It's kinda obvious devs needs to take something away so they're choosing nerfing abilities.

If CP is the problem, instead of crippling the gameplay we love,
ZOS should rather abolish the ill-designed CP system.

[snip]

problem is the game is designed around it, look what happened with the removed the champoin points from morrowind. now no one can sustain. theyve been making content harder to keep up with it and they remove it and were all screwed. not to mention they have nerfed literally everything to the ground to keep up with it

Problem is that people got use to new easier playstyles so quickly they've forgot around what gameplay game was oroginally designed in 2014. It was harsh and punishing , sustain was designed to be hard same as survivality and people really needed to make build decisions instead of brainlesly going for full offensive stats. Everyone cried and still cries that Morrowind nerfed sustain but in reality even after Morrowind sustain was 10 times better then before Tamriel Unlimited. The problem is community is just concerned when there is lot of nerfs at once but is totally ok when we're getting hugely overbuffed which later causes issues. Morrowind nerfs were the resuls of constant buffs we were getting since Tamriel Unlimited release and constant power creep increase caused by that. At certain point champion points combined with constant addition of new better sets and game mechanics improvements started to make content too easy but people simply got used to it and when developer decided to bring game back to the roots with Morrowind everyone started to complain because everyone got used to new easier and faster playstyle. Champion points issue itself is much more complex and to truly balance the game there would be need of huge rework to CP system.

ok take 12 players no champ points alocated and run vhof and we can talk

[edited to remove quote]

Kova · October 2018

So did we hear if shattering blows and oblivion damage sets are still going to be in the game?

Also, I've finally accepted that I'm fine with being a glass cannon. That means I'll melt everyone and die easy, right? That's the trade off, right? So I get to completely melt the stamwarden that will dawnbreaker me to death in a second, right? What about the healplar, I get to gank him too since I'm easily killed, right? That's the logic, right?

Can't wait to just choose pure offense over survival. It will definitely let me kill heavy armor opponents who can do the very thing everyone complains sorcs do, right? So excited.

jeskah · October 2018

Juhasow wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

BalticBlues wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

It's kinda obvious devs needs to take something away so they're choosing nerfing abilities.

If CP is the problem, instead of crippling the gameplay we love,
ZOS should rather abolish the ill-designed CP system.

[snip]

problem is the game is designed around it, look what happened with the removed the champoin points from morrowind. now no one can sustain. theyve been making content harder to keep up with it and they remove it and were all screwed. not to mention they have nerfed literally everything to the ground to keep up with it

Problem is that people got use to new easier playstyles so quickly they've forgot around what gameplay game was oroginally designed in 2014. It was harsh and punishing , sustain was designed to be hard same as survivality and people really needed to make build decisions instead of brainlesly going for full offensive stats. Everyone cried and still cries that Morrowind nerfed sustain but in reality even after Morrowind sustain was 10 times better then before Tamriel Unlimited. The problem is community is just concerned when there is lot of nerfs at once but is totally ok when we're getting hugely overbuffed which later causes issues. Morrowind nerfs were the resuls of constant buffs we were getting since Tamriel Unlimited release and constant power creep increase caused by that. At certain point champion points combined with constant addition of new better sets and game mechanics improvements started to make content too easy but people simply got used to it and when developer decided to bring game back to the roots with Morrowind everyone started to complain because everyone got used to new easier and faster playstyle. Champion points issue itself is much more complex and to truly balance the game there would be need of huge rework to CP system.

Before one tamriel by my rexollextion, while sustain was demanding, with good group play you were more than okay. After cp system... It become a non issue even with bad group play.

[edited to remove quote]

Juhasow · October 2018

jeskah wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

BalticBlues wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

It's kinda obvious devs needs to take something away so they're choosing nerfing abilities.

If CP is the problem, instead of crippling the gameplay we love,
ZOS should rather abolish the ill-designed CP system.

[snip]

problem is the game is designed around it, look what happened with the removed the champoin points from morrowind. now no one can sustain. theyve been making content harder to keep up with it and they remove it and were all screwed. not to mention they have nerfed literally everything to the ground to keep up with it

Problem is that people got use to new easier playstyles so quickly they've forgot around what gameplay game was oroginally designed in 2014. It was harsh and punishing , sustain was designed to be hard same as survivality and people really needed to make build decisions instead of brainlesly going for full offensive stats. Everyone cried and still cries that Morrowind nerfed sustain but in reality even after Morrowind sustain was 10 times better then before Tamriel Unlimited. The problem is community is just concerned when there is lot of nerfs at once but is totally ok when we're getting hugely overbuffed which later causes issues. Morrowind nerfs were the resuls of constant buffs we were getting since Tamriel Unlimited release and constant power creep increase caused by that. At certain point champion points combined with constant addition of new better sets and game mechanics improvements started to make content too easy but people simply got used to it and when developer decided to bring game back to the roots with Morrowind everyone started to complain because everyone got used to new easier and faster playstyle. Champion points issue itself is much more complex and to truly balance the game there would be need of huge rework to CP system.

Before one tamriel by my rexollextion, while sustain was demanding, with good group play you were more than okay. After cp system... It become a non issue even with bad group play.

One Tamriel ≠ Tamriel Unlimited

[edited to remove quote]

Juhasow · October 2018

ezio45 wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

BalticBlues wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

It's kinda obvious devs needs to take something away so they're choosing nerfing abilities.

If CP is the problem, instead of crippling the gameplay we love,
ZOS should rather abolish the ill-designed CP system.

[snip]

problem is the game is designed around it, look what happened with the removed the champoin points from morrowind. now no one can sustain. theyve been making content harder to keep up with it and they remove it and were all screwed. not to mention they have nerfed literally everything to the ground to keep up with it

Problem is that people got use to new easier playstyles so quickly they've forgot around what gameplay game was oroginally designed in 2014. It was harsh and punishing , sustain was designed to be hard same as survivality and people really needed to make build decisions instead of brainlesly going for full offensive stats. Everyone cried and still cries that Morrowind nerfed sustain but in reality even after Morrowind sustain was 10 times better then before Tamriel Unlimited. The problem is community is just concerned when there is lot of nerfs at once but is totally ok when we're getting hugely overbuffed which later causes issues. Morrowind nerfs were the resuls of constant buffs we were getting since Tamriel Unlimited release and constant power creep increase caused by that. At certain point champion points combined with constant addition of new better sets and game mechanics improvements started to make content too easy but people simply got used to it and when developer decided to bring game back to the roots with Morrowind everyone started to complain because everyone got used to new easier and faster playstyle. Champion points issue itself is much more complex and to truly balance the game there would be need of huge rework to CP system.

ok take 12 players no champ points alocated and run vhof and we can talk

Talk about what that You've missed the point ?

[edited to remove quote]

ezio45 · October 2018

Kova wrote: »

So did we hear if shattering blows and oblivion damage sets are still going to be in the game?

Also, I've finally accepted that I'm fine with being a glass cannon. That means I'll melt everyone and die easy, right? That's the trade off, right? So I get to completely melt the stamwarden that will dawnbreaker me to death in a second, right? What about the healplar, I get to gank him too since I'm easily killed, right? That's the logic, right?

Can't wait to just choose pure offense over survival. It will definitely let me kill heavy armor opponents who can do the very thing everyone complains sorcs do, right? So excited.

except sorc isnt a glass cannon to begin with, out pvp dmg is pretty poor

Lord-Otto · October 2018

ezio45 wrote: »

Kova wrote: »

So did we hear if shattering blows and oblivion damage sets are still going to be in the game?

Also, I've finally accepted that I'm fine with being a glass cannon. That means I'll melt everyone and die easy, right? That's the trade off, right? So I get to completely melt the stamwarden that will dawnbreaker me to death in a second, right? What about the healplar, I get to gank him too since I'm easily killed, right? That's the logic, right?

Can't wait to just choose pure offense over survival. It will definitely let me kill heavy armor opponents who can do the very thing everyone complains sorcs do, right? So excited.

except sorc isnt a glass cannon to begin with, out pvp dmg is pretty poor

He's aware and being sarcastic about it. Of course, he's also right.
Sorcs are all glass now, but since the burst output doesn't justify the burst being backloaded and easily-avoidable, we're nothing cannon.