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PTS Update 20 - Feedback Thread for Sorcerer
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Zer0oo✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Exactly. One of the few advantages that pet sorcs have in PvP is their ability to LoS using pets and making them untargetable would make pet sorcs more vulnerable to enemy pressure. Also, I don't want the forums to be full of people asking for pet sorc nerfs next patch because there is no longer counterplay against pet sorcs.
I'm not against pets being single-barred. I just don't like the idea of them being immune to damage in PvP.BalticBlues wrote: »
Can you please say what you mean with that?Making sorc pets behave like NB shades would be an awful change. Just no.
Where is there any difference in functionality if a Sorc pet uses only one slot instead of two?
Moreover, if you want, you could still assign two slots in two bars, as it is now.
Perhaps read again what I have written above; maybe you did not understand the concept.
I think it would be maybe even a nerf for them since one of the most annoying things is that you can not really target the sorc when the pets run around.
I still like them to make them immune to siege damage
- Update 23Ice Furnace: This item set now grants Spell Damage, rather than Weapon Damage for the 4 piece bonus0 -
Jimmy_The_Fixer✭✭✭✭✭Great changes, 10/10, shields no longer negate 90% of itemization for both the user and the attacker. Mag sorc VS Mag sorc now incorporates spell resist, spell pen, crit chance, crit modifier, crit resist, et cetera. Cast time is gonna take some getting used to but the good players will adapt.
Why take away the overload bar though? That was fun and cool and unique to sorc, not a balance issue either, nobody was complaining about it.Edited by Jimmy_The_Fixer on October 3, 2018 8:37PM1 -
BrightOblivion✭✭✭✭✭Jimmy_The_Fixer wrote: »Great changes, 10/10, shields no longer negate 90% of itemization for both the user and the attacker. Mag sorc VS Mag sorc now incorporates spell resist, spell pen, crit chance, crit modifier, crit resist, et cetera. Cast time is gonna take some getting used to but the good players will adapt.
Why take away the overload bar though? That was fun and cool and unique to sorc, not a balance issue either, nobody was complaining about it.
If you're still talking cast times, you're two weeks behind (fortunately). It's still insta-cast, but an individual shield's strength tops out at 40% of max health.
As for overload, no idea. "Reasons", I guess.1 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭BrightOblivion wrote: »Jimmy_The_Fixer wrote: »Great changes, 10/10, shields no longer negate 90% of itemization for both the user and the attacker. Mag sorc VS Mag sorc now incorporates spell resist, spell pen, crit chance, crit modifier, crit resist, et cetera. Cast time is gonna take some getting used to but the good players will adapt.
Why take away the overload bar though? That was fun and cool and unique to sorc, not a balance issue either, nobody was complaining about it.
If you're still talking cast times, you're two weeks behind (fortunately). It's still insta-cast, but an individual shield's strength tops out at 40% of max health.
As for overload, no idea. "Reasons", I guess.
Overload likely got the axe because no other class has a third health bar and they probably thought it was "OP".
The actual changes to overload are actually pretty good that help sorc's consistant DPS, so. Not too angrhy about that.0 -
Urvoth✭✭✭✭✭
✭Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »I am totally FOR pets bugfixing.
I am totally AGAINST pets copy and paste from NBs.
If I wanted a fake pet I'd have rolled a NB, I'd enjoyed being overpowered for years, I'd enjoyed being welcome to every trial.
But no. I wanted to play a summoneer with a deeper gameplay than "press button, thingie spawns and does some stuff, thingie goes poof".
When it comes to balance, function should be given far more consideration than ones ability to RP. Pets in their current state don't f'ing work. I am certainly open to suggestions, but two bar toggle is an epic failure.
The atro is a perfect example of how the pets should function. It gets summoned, does its job, then leaves, while only taking 1 bar slot. The other sorc pets could do something similar.1 -
Vahrokh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »I am totally FOR pets bugfixing.
I am totally AGAINST pets copy and paste from NBs.
If I wanted a fake pet I'd have rolled a NB, I'd enjoyed being overpowered for years, I'd enjoyed being welcome to every trial.
But no. I wanted to play a summoneer with a deeper gameplay than "press button, thingie spawns and does some stuff, thingie goes poof".
When it comes to balance, function should be given far more consideration than ones ability to RP. Pets in their current state don't f'ing work. I am certainly open to suggestions, but two bar toggle is an epic failure.
Well, I said "summoneer", not "I love wasting 4 hotkeys".Vaerah, Dark Elf Magicka Sorceress
Trials addict, soloer extraordinaire!
Here are my Elder Scrolls Online videos
Here is the Sorcerer Helper addon I have updated to work on current ESO1 -
Vahrokh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »I am totally FOR pets bugfixing.
I am totally AGAINST pets copy and paste from NBs.
If I wanted a fake pet I'd have rolled a NB, I'd enjoyed being overpowered for years, I'd enjoyed being welcome to every trial.
But no. I wanted to play a summoneer with a deeper gameplay than "press button, thingie spawns and does some stuff, thingie goes poof".
When it comes to balance, function should be given far more consideration than ones ability to RP. Pets in their current state don't f'ing work. I am certainly open to suggestions, but two bar toggle is an epic failure.
The atro is a perfect example of how the pets should function. It gets summoned, does its job, then leaves, while only taking 1 bar slot. The other sorc pets could do something similar.
This, in an ideal world.
In the real world, they'd create static pets that cost a crapton of magicka (now we pay it once, then just use the pets abilities at low cost), have cast time like now, could not be "piloted" to the desired NPCs / take aggro and - copying the "perfect example", would leave totally annoying corpses that prevent melee DPS from hitting the boss.Edited by Vahrokh on October 3, 2018 11:51PMVaerah, Dark Elf Magicka Sorceress
Trials addict, soloer extraordinaire!
Here are my Elder Scrolls Online videos
Here is the Sorcerer Helper addon I have updated to work on current ESO3 -
jknight201✭✭✭So for the change to Ward, Zos essentially replaced one stupid change with another. So they *still* don't understand the class. The 40% health limitation means shields will be nearly cut in half for PVE - to solve a PVP "problem"?
So what's the point of hardened ward now, since shield strength is capped? Maybe Zos didn't really think about that.
Ward was one of the class defining skills for sorcerers. Since Zos doesn't understand the class, and obviously has no long-term vision for it, sure - let's nerf the few things that make the class unique so sorcs will play like a general magicka toon with a staff.
Zos, you're 0 for 2 on trying to "fix" a problem with shields that doesn't even exist. You want to "solve" shield stacking? Here's an idea - make shields so they don't stack.1 -
Biro123✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭jknight201 wrote: »So for the change to Ward, Zos essentially replaced one stupid change with another. So they *still* don't understand the class. The 40% health limitation means shields will be nearly cut in half for PVE - to solve a PVP "problem"?
So what's the point of hardened ward now, since shield strength is capped? Maybe Zos didn't really think about that.
Ward was one of the class defining skills for sorcerers. Since Zos doesn't understand the class, and obviously has no long-term vision for it, sure - let's nerf the few things that make the class unique so sorcs will play like a general magicka toon with a staff.
Zos, you're 0 for 2 on trying to "fix" a problem with shields that doesn't even exist. You want to "solve" shield stacking? Here's an idea - make shields so they don't stack.
Except that it's to fix a PVE problem, not PvP(but broke PvP sorcs in the process). And they never said they want to 'solve' stacking.Minalan owes me a beer.
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Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.3 -
NyxWrench✭✭✭
That's a good point. Combined with my ruminations over in another thread (post here), I think I can see now how it was a deliberate choice.Except that it's to fix a PVE problem, not PvP(but broke PvP sorcs in the process). And they never said they want to 'solve' stacking.
Basically, one shield will likely not be enough to keep you alive, assuming your setup remains in the "pure DPS" mode. You have one of three choices to stay alive:
1) Raise defense, now that shields are affected by resistance. This will require sacrificing offensive stats.
2) Raise health, which is both a direct increase to survivability, and raises the cap on the shields. This will likely require sacrificing magicka.
3) Stack shields. This requires sacrificing an action bar slot, which is an indirect hit to damage potential.
You have several routes to choose from, but all of them require sacrificing offense for survivability. The question is, how much offense are you sacrificing? I suspect that the devs are aiming for a sustainable offense somewhere in the 30k-35k range — plenty good for completing content, but bringing people down from the clouds they were in where they could have max offense and survive just fine.
For easier content, you can still go on the pure offense route. They haven't gimped the max potential, only the effective potential in the 'current' content.
Now, why are they only doing this to sorcerers? I would guess two reasons: first, just to see whether it works the way they hope; and second, because changing every class in the game at the same time would be a hideous balancing nightmare. They apparently already have plans to change up sorcerer's offense anyway, so they might as well get these balancing changes in beforehand and see how things shake out.
This does leave an update cycle where sorcerers are horribly gimped compared to the ace nightblades and such. The devs may have decided that that was an acceptable sacrifice for the long-term health of the game, if this works the way they hope.
This does leave a great big question mark about how the other jobs will be affected in the next patch. The main problem is that it's hard to take away any additional survivability from nightblade (it's already squishy, and largely relies on dodging, which doesn't have much trade-off potential). Maybe require stealth for the crazy high damage numbers? I dunno, I'm not a good judge of tradeoff potential for the other classes.
Anyway, I think that this is a deliberate movement towards requiring serious consideration about how to survive these challenges, as that has the side implication that more thought needs to be given to the healer side of things, which was another topic that seemed to be getting some traction.2 -
BretonMage✭✭✭✭✭
✭The atro is a perfect example of how the pets should function. It gets summoned, does its job, then leaves, while only taking 1 bar slot. The other sorc pets could do something similar.
Hmm... I hate having to double-bar the summon, but personally would vastly prefer a permanent summon as a toggle rather than an atronach-like summon for 20 seconds. If you’re using the pet to heal, then you basically have to cast 2 abilities just to get a heal - because we know the pet will always disappear at the most inopportune times.3 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
That's a good point. Combined with my ruminations over in another thread (post here), I think I can see now how it was a deliberate choice.Except that it's to fix a PVE problem, not PvP(but broke PvP sorcs in the process). And they never said they want to 'solve' stacking.
Basically, one shield will likely not be enough to keep you alive, assuming your setup remains in the "pure DPS" mode. You have one of three choices to stay alive:
1) Raise defense, now that shields are affected by resistance. This will require sacrificing offensive stats.
2) Raise health, which is both a direct increase to survivability, and raises the cap on the shields. This will likely require sacrificing magicka.
3) Stack shields. This requires sacrificing an action bar slot, which is an indirect hit to damage potential.
You have several routes to choose from, but all of them require sacrificing offense for survivability. The question is, how much offense are you sacrificing? I suspect that the devs are aiming for a sustainable offense somewhere in the 30k-35k range — plenty good for completing content, but bringing people down from the clouds they were in where they could have max offense and survive just fine.
For easier content, you can still go on the pure offense route. They haven't gimped the max potential, only the effective potential in the 'current' content.
Now, why are they only doing this to sorcerers? I would guess two reasons: first, just to see whether it works the way they hope; and second, because changing every class in the game at the same time would be a hideous balancing nightmare. They apparently already have plans to change up sorcerer's offense anyway, so they might as well get these balancing changes in beforehand and see how things shake out.
This does leave an update cycle where sorcerers are horribly gimped compared to the ace nightblades and such. The devs may have decided that that was an acceptable sacrifice for the long-term health of the game, if this works the way they hope.
This does leave a great big question mark about how the other jobs will be affected in the next patch. The main problem is that it's hard to take away any additional survivability from nightblade (it's already squishy, and largely relies on dodging, which doesn't have much trade-off potential). Maybe require stealth for the crazy high damage numbers? I dunno, I'm not a good judge of tradeoff potential for the other classes.
Anyway, I think that this is a deliberate movement towards requiring serious consideration about how to survive these challenges, as that has the side implication that more thought needs to be given to the healer side of things, which was another topic that seemed to be getting some traction.
If this is true, and ZOS intends to do this to every class in future, I will leave on the spot.
Make another difficulty if you cant stand how good people have got it now. Nerf me, and I take my buisness elsewhere. How hard is this to figure out, ZOS?
Then again, there''s only so bloody much they can do to the other classes at this point. But if we are all to endure a similar mangling, and they cannot be disuaded, and they will not remove the CP system, it's time to leave.Edited by Doctordarkspawn on October 4, 2018 4:24AM1 -
Lylith✭✭✭✭✭
✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »BrightOblivion wrote: »Jimmy_The_Fixer wrote: »Great changes, 10/10, shields no longer negate 90% of itemization for both the user and the attacker. Mag sorc VS Mag sorc now incorporates spell resist, spell pen, crit chance, crit modifier, crit resist, et cetera. Cast time is gonna take some getting used to but the good players will adapt.
Why take away the overload bar though? That was fun and cool and unique to sorc, not a balance issue either, nobody was complaining about it.
If you're still talking cast times, you're two weeks behind (fortunately). It's still insta-cast, but an individual shield's strength tops out at 40% of max health.
As for overload, no idea. "Reasons", I guess.
Overload likely got the axe because no other class has a third health bar and they probably thought it was "OP".
The actual changes to overload are actually pretty good that help sorc's consistant DPS, so. Not too angrhy about that.
no other class is required to double/triple slot skills, either.
the original devs had the right of it. imho.
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ezio45✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »BrightOblivion wrote: »Jimmy_The_Fixer wrote: »Great changes, 10/10, shields no longer negate 90% of itemization for both the user and the attacker. Mag sorc VS Mag sorc now incorporates spell resist, spell pen, crit chance, crit modifier, crit resist, et cetera. Cast time is gonna take some getting used to but the good players will adapt.
Why take away the overload bar though? That was fun and cool and unique to sorc, not a balance issue either, nobody was complaining about it.
If you're still talking cast times, you're two weeks behind (fortunately). It's still insta-cast, but an individual shield's strength tops out at 40% of max health.
As for overload, no idea. "Reasons", I guess.
Overload likely got the axe because no other class has a third health bar and they probably thought it was "OP".
The actual changes to overload are actually pretty good that help sorc's consistant DPS, so. Not too angrhy about that.
no other class is required to double/triple slot skills, either.
the original devs had the right of it. imho.
why arnt these guys around anymore? They MADE the classes, they gave me everything i like about my class. new guys have done nothing but ruin classes for YEARS and not improved them in a single way....8 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »BrightOblivion wrote: »Jimmy_The_Fixer wrote: »Great changes, 10/10, shields no longer negate 90% of itemization for both the user and the attacker. Mag sorc VS Mag sorc now incorporates spell resist, spell pen, crit chance, crit modifier, crit resist, et cetera. Cast time is gonna take some getting used to but the good players will adapt.
Why take away the overload bar though? That was fun and cool and unique to sorc, not a balance issue either, nobody was complaining about it.
If you're still talking cast times, you're two weeks behind (fortunately). It's still insta-cast, but an individual shield's strength tops out at 40% of max health.
As for overload, no idea. "Reasons", I guess.
Overload likely got the axe because no other class has a third health bar and they probably thought it was "OP".
The actual changes to overload are actually pretty good that help sorc's consistant DPS, so. Not too angrhy about that.
no other class is required to double/triple slot skills, either.
the original devs had the right of it. imho.
why arnt these guys around anymore? They MADE the classes, they gave me everything i like about my class. new guys have done nothing but ruin classes for YEARS and not improved them in a single way....
They got booted most likely for making the game PVP-focused on a subscription model with a predominantly single player franchise and expecting it to be profitable.
They essentially make the game DAOC at launch. DAOC wasn't profitable when you were appealing to Skyrim players.1 -
ezio45✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »BrightOblivion wrote: »Jimmy_The_Fixer wrote: »Great changes, 10/10, shields no longer negate 90% of itemization for both the user and the attacker. Mag sorc VS Mag sorc now incorporates spell resist, spell pen, crit chance, crit modifier, crit resist, et cetera. Cast time is gonna take some getting used to but the good players will adapt.
Why take away the overload bar though? That was fun and cool and unique to sorc, not a balance issue either, nobody was complaining about it.
If you're still talking cast times, you're two weeks behind (fortunately). It's still insta-cast, but an individual shield's strength tops out at 40% of max health.
As for overload, no idea. "Reasons", I guess.
Overload likely got the axe because no other class has a third health bar and they probably thought it was "OP".
The actual changes to overload are actually pretty good that help sorc's consistant DPS, so. Not too angrhy about that.
no other class is required to double/triple slot skills, either.
the original devs had the right of it. imho.
why arnt these guys around anymore? They MADE the classes, they gave me everything i like about my class. new guys have done nothing but ruin classes for YEARS and not improved them in a single way....
They got booted most likely for making the game PVP-focused on a subscription model with a predominantly single player franchise and expecting it to be profitable.
They essentially make the game DAOC at launch. DAOC wasn't profitable when you were appealing to Skyrim players.
DAOC?0 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »BrightOblivion wrote: »Jimmy_The_Fixer wrote: »Great changes, 10/10, shields no longer negate 90% of itemization for both the user and the attacker. Mag sorc VS Mag sorc now incorporates spell resist, spell pen, crit chance, crit modifier, crit resist, et cetera. Cast time is gonna take some getting used to but the good players will adapt.
Why take away the overload bar though? That was fun and cool and unique to sorc, not a balance issue either, nobody was complaining about it.
If you're still talking cast times, you're two weeks behind (fortunately). It's still insta-cast, but an individual shield's strength tops out at 40% of max health.
As for overload, no idea. "Reasons", I guess.
Overload likely got the axe because no other class has a third health bar and they probably thought it was "OP".
The actual changes to overload are actually pretty good that help sorc's consistant DPS, so. Not too angrhy about that.
no other class is required to double/triple slot skills, either.
the original devs had the right of it. imho.
why arnt these guys around anymore? They MADE the classes, they gave me everything i like about my class. new guys have done nothing but ruin classes for YEARS and not improved them in a single way....
They got booted most likely for making the game PVP-focused on a subscription model with a predominantly single player franchise and expecting it to be profitable.
They essentially make the game DAOC at launch. DAOC wasn't profitable when you were appealing to Skyrim players.
DAOC?
Dark age of camelot, a PVP MMO that was one of the first of it's time.
And yes. They took a single player franchise and made it PVP focused. Within the first year it had to drop sub requirement just to retain player and then new staff were hired, one of whom is the current combat designer. Who has proceeded to make similar design decisions from the first update forward.
It was universally opposed and so the trend has continued, one man cramming his vision of balance on a game whom he didn't understand design wise in the first place.Edited by Doctordarkspawn on October 4, 2018 5:56AM5 -
Morgul667✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »BrightOblivion wrote: »Jimmy_The_Fixer wrote: »Great changes, 10/10, shields no longer negate 90% of itemization for both the user and the attacker. Mag sorc VS Mag sorc now incorporates spell resist, spell pen, crit chance, crit modifier, crit resist, et cetera. Cast time is gonna take some getting used to but the good players will adapt.
Why take away the overload bar though? That was fun and cool and unique to sorc, not a balance issue either, nobody was complaining about it.
If you're still talking cast times, you're two weeks behind (fortunately). It's still insta-cast, but an individual shield's strength tops out at 40% of max health.
As for overload, no idea. "Reasons", I guess.
Overload likely got the axe because no other class has a third health bar and they probably thought it was "OP".
The actual changes to overload are actually pretty good that help sorc's consistant DPS, so. Not too angrhy about that.
There were a fee complains that overload third bar was clunky so they probably just removed it....
0 -
Alaztor91✭✭✭✭✭So... any ideas on how ZOS is going to prevent the Dampen Magic and Hardened Ward morphs from becoming basically useless if the 40% hp cap goes live? What about Bastion?
1 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭So... any ideas on how ZOS is going to prevent the Dampen Magic and Hardened Ward morphs from becoming basically useless if the 40% hp cap goes live? What about Bastion?
As far as we know, bastion doesn't do anything it doesn't allready do, meaning sorcs are essentially going to either have to go full in on that CP (which grants a fair bit of resistances) and either add storm form to their rotations or...I guess pray for more shields.1 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »BrightOblivion wrote: »Jimmy_The_Fixer wrote: »Great changes, 10/10, shields no longer negate 90% of itemization for both the user and the attacker. Mag sorc VS Mag sorc now incorporates spell resist, spell pen, crit chance, crit modifier, crit resist, et cetera. Cast time is gonna take some getting used to but the good players will adapt.
Why take away the overload bar though? That was fun and cool and unique to sorc, not a balance issue either, nobody was complaining about it.
If you're still talking cast times, you're two weeks behind (fortunately). It's still insta-cast, but an individual shield's strength tops out at 40% of max health.
As for overload, no idea. "Reasons", I guess.
Overload likely got the axe because no other class has a third health bar and they probably thought it was "OP".
The actual changes to overload are actually pretty good that help sorc's consistant DPS, so. Not too angrhy about that.
If you look at situational + underpowerformign sorc abilities like: boundless, powersurge, mines - overload imo was op - when working with the thought of making these mentioned abilities a bit more universially useful and competetive for an actual barslot on your average sorc build.
Removing the overload bar opens up a lot of potential for reevaluating the usefulness of niche sorc spells. Now that only has to happen aslwell...Edited by Derra on October 4, 2018 6:26AM<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 501 -
ezio45✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »BrightOblivion wrote: »Jimmy_The_Fixer wrote: »Great changes, 10/10, shields no longer negate 90% of itemization for both the user and the attacker. Mag sorc VS Mag sorc now incorporates spell resist, spell pen, crit chance, crit modifier, crit resist, et cetera. Cast time is gonna take some getting used to but the good players will adapt.
Why take away the overload bar though? That was fun and cool and unique to sorc, not a balance issue either, nobody was complaining about it.
If you're still talking cast times, you're two weeks behind (fortunately). It's still insta-cast, but an individual shield's strength tops out at 40% of max health.
As for overload, no idea. "Reasons", I guess.
Overload likely got the axe because no other class has a third health bar and they probably thought it was "OP".
The actual changes to overload are actually pretty good that help sorc's consistant DPS, so. Not too angrhy about that.
no other class is required to double/triple slot skills, either.
the original devs had the right of it. imho.
why arnt these guys around anymore? They MADE the classes, they gave me everything i like about my class. new guys have done nothing but ruin classes for YEARS and not improved them in a single way....
They got booted most likely for making the game PVP-focused on a subscription model with a predominantly single player franchise and expecting it to be profitable.
They essentially make the game DAOC at launch. DAOC wasn't profitable when you were appealing to Skyrim players.
DAOC?
Dark age of camelot, a PVP MMO that was one of the first of it's time.
And yes. They took a single player franchise and made it PVP focused. Within the first year it had to drop sub requirement just to retain player and then new staff were hired, one of whom is the current combat designer. Who has proceeded to make similar design decisions from the first update forward.
It was universally opposed and so the trend has continued, one man cramming his vision of balance on a game whom he didn't understand design wise in the first place.
WAIT THIS HAS BEEN A THING? like this isnt speculation, this actually happened?
of course things are gunna be screwed up, im not even mad at wrobel anymore. of course noone know how to balance the classes, they fired all the people who made them!!!1 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »BrightOblivion wrote: »Jimmy_The_Fixer wrote: »Great changes, 10/10, shields no longer negate 90% of itemization for both the user and the attacker. Mag sorc VS Mag sorc now incorporates spell resist, spell pen, crit chance, crit modifier, crit resist, et cetera. Cast time is gonna take some getting used to but the good players will adapt.
Why take away the overload bar though? That was fun and cool and unique to sorc, not a balance issue either, nobody was complaining about it.
If you're still talking cast times, you're two weeks behind (fortunately). It's still insta-cast, but an individual shield's strength tops out at 40% of max health.
As for overload, no idea. "Reasons", I guess.
Overload likely got the axe because no other class has a third health bar and they probably thought it was "OP".
The actual changes to overload are actually pretty good that help sorc's consistant DPS, so. Not too angrhy about that.
no other class is required to double/triple slot skills, either.
the original devs had the right of it. imho.
why arnt these guys around anymore? They MADE the classes, they gave me everything i like about my class. new guys have done nothing but ruin classes for YEARS and not improved them in a single way....
They got booted most likely for making the game PVP-focused on a subscription model with a predominantly single player franchise and expecting it to be profitable.
They essentially make the game DAOC at launch. DAOC wasn't profitable when you were appealing to Skyrim players.
DAOC?
Dark age of camelot, a PVP MMO that was one of the first of it's time.
And yes. They took a single player franchise and made it PVP focused. Within the first year it had to drop sub requirement just to retain player and then new staff were hired, one of whom is the current combat designer. Who has proceeded to make similar design decisions from the first update forward.
It was universally opposed and so the trend has continued, one man cramming his vision of balance on a game whom he didn't understand design wise in the first place.
WAIT THIS HAS BEEN A THING? like this isnt speculation, this actually happened?
of course things are gunna be screwed up, im not even mad at wrobel anymore. of course noone know how to balance the classes, they fired all the people who made them!!!
Are you kidding me? The man they originally hired for combat design and balance was a DAOC veteran and that were his credentials.
The difference is, while his version was not only balls hard but inaccessable AF, he at least could design some good system fundementals.Edited by Doctordarkspawn on October 4, 2018 6:13AM3 -
ezio45✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »BrightOblivion wrote: »Jimmy_The_Fixer wrote: »Great changes, 10/10, shields no longer negate 90% of itemization for both the user and the attacker. Mag sorc VS Mag sorc now incorporates spell resist, spell pen, crit chance, crit modifier, crit resist, et cetera. Cast time is gonna take some getting used to but the good players will adapt.
Why take away the overload bar though? That was fun and cool and unique to sorc, not a balance issue either, nobody was complaining about it.
If you're still talking cast times, you're two weeks behind (fortunately). It's still insta-cast, but an individual shield's strength tops out at 40% of max health.
As for overload, no idea. "Reasons", I guess.
Overload likely got the axe because no other class has a third health bar and they probably thought it was "OP".
The actual changes to overload are actually pretty good that help sorc's consistant DPS, so. Not too angrhy about that.
no other class is required to double/triple slot skills, either.
the original devs had the right of it. imho.
why arnt these guys around anymore? They MADE the classes, they gave me everything i like about my class. new guys have done nothing but ruin classes for YEARS and not improved them in a single way....
They got booted most likely for making the game PVP-focused on a subscription model with a predominantly single player franchise and expecting it to be profitable.
They essentially make the game DAOC at launch. DAOC wasn't profitable when you were appealing to Skyrim players.
DAOC?
Dark age of camelot, a PVP MMO that was one of the first of it's time.
And yes. They took a single player franchise and made it PVP focused. Within the first year it had to drop sub requirement just to retain player and then new staff were hired, one of whom is the current combat designer. Who has proceeded to make similar design decisions from the first update forward.
It was universally opposed and so the trend has continued, one man cramming his vision of balance on a game whom he didn't understand design wise in the first place.
WAIT THIS HAS BEEN A THING? like this isnt speculation, this actually happened?
of course things are gunna be screwed up, im not even mad at wrobel anymore. of course noone know how to balance the classes, they fired all the people who made them!!!
Are you kidding me? The man they originally hired for combat design and balance was a DAOC veteran and that were his credentials.
The difference is, while his version was not only balls hard but inaccessable AF, he at least could design some good system fundementals.
omg....literally this all makes sense now....1 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »BrightOblivion wrote: »Jimmy_The_Fixer wrote: »Great changes, 10/10, shields no longer negate 90% of itemization for both the user and the attacker. Mag sorc VS Mag sorc now incorporates spell resist, spell pen, crit chance, crit modifier, crit resist, et cetera. Cast time is gonna take some getting used to but the good players will adapt.
Why take away the overload bar though? That was fun and cool and unique to sorc, not a balance issue either, nobody was complaining about it.
If you're still talking cast times, you're two weeks behind (fortunately). It's still insta-cast, but an individual shield's strength tops out at 40% of max health.
As for overload, no idea. "Reasons", I guess.
Overload likely got the axe because no other class has a third health bar and they probably thought it was "OP".
The actual changes to overload are actually pretty good that help sorc's consistant DPS, so. Not too angrhy about that.
no other class is required to double/triple slot skills, either.
the original devs had the right of it. imho.
why arnt these guys around anymore? They MADE the classes, they gave me everything i like about my class. new guys have done nothing but ruin classes for YEARS and not improved them in a single way....
They got booted most likely for making the game PVP-focused on a subscription model with a predominantly single player franchise and expecting it to be profitable.
They essentially make the game DAOC at launch. DAOC wasn't profitable when you were appealing to Skyrim players.
DAOC?
Dark age of camelot, a PVP MMO that was one of the first of it's time.
And yes. They took a single player franchise and made it PVP focused. Within the first year it had to drop sub requirement just to retain player and then new staff were hired, one of whom is the current combat designer. Who has proceeded to make similar design decisions from the first update forward.
It was universally opposed and so the trend has continued, one man cramming his vision of balance on a game whom he didn't understand design wise in the first place.
WAIT THIS HAS BEEN A THING? like this isnt speculation, this actually happened?
of course things are gunna be screwed up, im not even mad at wrobel anymore. of course noone know how to balance the classes, they fired all the people who made them!!!
Are you kidding me? The man they originally hired for combat design and balance was a DAOC veteran and that were his credentials.
The difference is, while his version was not only balls hard but inaccessable AF, he at least could design some good system fundementals.
omg....literally this all makes sense now....
Welcome to my world.
I was there for all of it. I have continually attempted to communicate this to the fanbase. They never lisen.
They never learn.0 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭As for Sorc - what would you expect from a combat designer who reportedly asked the class reps if the lack of bar space is because Sorc „has too many good abilities“?
If the class gets the long needed rework I’ll say that the shield changes were for the better, and the correct choice. It’s just that I doubt very much that it will happen within a reasonable timeframe (cf. Templars).Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 46 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1700+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.5 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Out of curiosity...
For the people that miss Overload's third bar - what builds were you running for what, that needed the third bar?0 -
Tonturri✭✭✭✭✭Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »What about rebate now? It does nothing for stam sorcs, non-pet magsorcs and pve pet sorcs now. Can we finally change it to something useful that every sorc profits from?
Pets won't take damage only in the group content Rob listed. They will still be able to die in overland PvE, PvP, vMA, etc. It still exists, although I must admit my pets usually only die when I unsummon them upon entering a town/bank/trader, etc. So i'm not really getting much use of the passive as it is.
Okay, missed the vma part. But I still think petsorcs can bear the loss of rebate in overland content. This passive is just to niché now.As for Sorc - what would you expect from a combat designer who reportedly asked the class reps if the lack of bar space is because Sorc „has too many good abilities“?
If the class gets the long needed rework I’ll say that the shield changes were for the better, and the correct choice. It’s just that I doubt very much that it will happen within a reasonable timeframe (cf. Templars).
Lol "Too many good abilities."
They're just all equally ass so it looks like we're making 'interesting bar-slot choices', when in reality it's 'what sucks the least' as opposed to 'what do I like/works the best'.
Edit: ZOS, you need to stop nerfing based on statistics. Sometimes people use this or that because it's FUN. And you should make other stuff fun instead of dragging everything ever down into the dirt with all the other unloved toys.Edited by Tonturri on October 4, 2018 7:34AM7 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »What about rebate now? It does nothing for stam sorcs, non-pet magsorcs and pve pet sorcs now. Can we finally change it to something useful that every sorc profits from?
Pets won't take damage only in the group content Rob listed. They will still be able to die in overland PvE, PvP, vMA, etc. It still exists, although I must admit my pets usually only die when I unsummon them upon entering a town/bank/trader, etc. So i'm not really getting much use of the passive as it is.
Okay, missed the vma part. But I still think petsorcs can bear the loss of rebate in overland content. This passive is just to niché now.As for Sorc - what would you expect from a combat designer who reportedly asked the class reps if the lack of bar space is because Sorc „has too many good abilities“?
If the class gets the long needed rework I’ll say that the shield changes were for the better, and the correct choice. It’s just that I doubt very much that it will happen within a reasonable timeframe (cf. Templars).
Lol "Too many good abilities."
They're just all equally ass so it looks like we're making 'interesting bar-slot choices', when in reality it's 'what sucks the least' as opposed to 'what do I like/works the best'.
Very much this - and also chosing complementary skills to those which made sorc builds unbelieveably unflexible for 3 years now.<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 502
