Mojomonkeyman wrote: »

IAVITNI wrote: »

Mojomonkeyman wrote: »

I'd highly prefer an enemy targetable hot/dot gapcloser moprh instead. I dislike nature's grasp a lot since its too restricting (useless in solo play) and not really worth a slot if you play in a stand-your-ground grp.

Well there are 2 morphs. An offensive gap closer makes no sense but a tether like Scourge Harvester would be nice.

The skill looks like it has good synergy with the bear ultimate but the ultimate sucks for most gameplay and you can't even target the bear or any other pets with the skill. They create a pet baased class but give the class 0 pet synergy.

The skill is great if you have slower mount speed than your group xD

I think an offensive morph makes lots of sense when thinking about nature themed abilities in the game (stranglers i.e.), especially when considering the lack of cc there could be some rly interesting options for a unique warden cc not tied to damage.

Not interested in taking anything away if a skill is enjoyed. I mean, we have 2 morphs. Nonetheless, in my personal opinion there is (almost) always something better to slot than grasp (might be related to my playstyle, solo or in non-mobile smallgrp).

Sorry let me clarify. I love the idea of an offensive morph. But a gap closer doesn't make sense on a magden when birds incentives maintaining distance.

An offensive morph would be very welcomed on my build, especially if it worked like Scourge Harvester, where you steal Health from your opponent. My biggest issue with Nature's Grasp is that you lose out on a lot of great passives if you don't use a Green Balance skill, but if you do, your damage/utility tends to fall short.

@Amdar_Godkiller has got a great point in that Warden skills are too funneled into their roles. Most other DPS skills have at least 3 purposes; damage + utility + debuff/buff. Warden skills tend to only offer 2 things at best. If my damage is good I feel I lack utility/survivability and vice versa. And while I understand that sounds like balance, it feels more like I have adequate damage but no utility/survivability and vice versa. Skills just do to little.

Small QoL changes would make the class competitive at least in PvP, like buff duration increases/resets, minor buffs/debuffs on damage skills and small damage components on some Green Balance skills.

For PvE, reducing the duration of the bear to say 5 seconds and reducing the cost to around 50 could turn it into a spammable ultimate. Obviously damage/utility of the skill would need to be buffed but it would create a very unique and interactive pet playstyle as opposed to just having the bear out and going about your rotation.

Personally, I would love if Warden's got an native increase to Shield duration for 2 seconds. It would make a big difference with the class.

So they're nerfing the bear by a whopping 30%!!? Not buffing winters embrace? The only bone their throwing at us is a 1% increase damage on animal companions passive and screaming cliff racer damage now scales from what ever distance away we are the nerf done to the bear alone doesn't even make up for that? Like wtf...so wardens will hit even worse than wet noodles.

Well guys, they didnt learn to read it seems, they miss that part at school.

Xerge wrote: »

So what purpose does the bear serve if it is doing subpar DPS. A clunky execute?

Guess it's 3 bloodthirsty, and we create our own type of execute?

I am kind of at a complete and total loss here, what is a reason to play this class? Any reason? It seems like its main selling point is pretty severely gutted now, when the class felt in dire needs of buffing and gets nerfs instead or changes no one asked for or cared about.. Is there anything at all they excel at? I'm not trolling or exaggerating to make a point, I would just genuinely like to know.

Only 2? Uh... well..

1. Warden dps is complete garbage in PvE (very underwhelming, under 30k dps in endgame (both stam and magicka), compared to other classes at 40k+ dps).
2. No ice dps, although that seems to be the most unique thing about warden is their ice abilities. Make that a dps viable skill, maybe frozen enemies explode for extra dmg when the root ends. Or they "shatter", dealing dmg in a aoe when they die while frozen, etc etc

Galarthor wrote: »

My main two grievances with Wardens are
2) The warden as a class has just access to too many buffs and debuffs compared to other classes. Need any specific buff or debuff? Just ask your friendly Warden! I think a rebalancing of the access to the major and minor buffs of this game across all character classes is necessary.

Its hard to know for sure, but there is some background that that is exactly what was intended by ZOS as part of the design!! It is what makes a Warden a Warden. If eveyone have everything just with nothing more then a modified animation, what's the point. There is the very same issue on the Warden side, "I want the same DPS as that class". Well you want to play a DPS class, roll one of that class. You want to go into Cyrodiil and offer assist damage, maims, slows, heals, Minor Intellect, Minor Endurance, Minor Toughness, Ice Armor resistance, "group" Ultis like permafrost, etc then play a Warden.

A class should have a clear purpose and role and be able to do a good job filling that role. I don't think they've done that with Wardens (yet), and worse that the community is forcing ZOS to walk back from that. They SHOULD NOT!!

@Joy_Division

PLEASE BRING UP A REVERT TO ARTIC BLAST. Make the heal 2 people thing constant and put the stun on the other morph PLEASE

This was one of the most interesting ability in the game ZOS. PLEASEbring this up to get changed this back. Allowed for very niche but fun useful builds in PvP and allowed a tank to contribute a little damage in PvE, But more importantly it was ICE damage. That would proc chilled. Now there is less abilities to use that can cause chilled. WHICH IS A WARDEN STAPLE IT IS A PASSIVE!

cpuScientist wrote: »

@Joy_Division

PLEASE BRING UP A REVERT TO ARTIC BLAST. Make the heal 2 people thing constant and put the stun on the other morph PLEASE

This was one of the most interesting ability in the game ZOS. PLEASEbring this up to get changed this back. Allowed for very niche but fun useful builds in PvP and allowed a tank to contribute a little damage in PvE, But more importantly it was ICE damage. That would proc chilled. Now there is less abilities to use that can cause chilled. WHICH IS A WARDEN STAPLE IT IS A PASSIVE!

You're totally cool with how Artic Blast is on Live?

If the DOUBLE ULTIMATE SLOT Bear debuff change makes it to PvE Live then goodbye Warden Characters!!!
^ Remember to use it with weapon swapping it has to take up both ultimate slots so the 30% redux is actually more like 60% across both bars, at most it should be 15% in PvE and at 30% the PvP gankers will be happy with no Wardens in PvP for them complain about, mind you there will be less wardens in game by then!

Please notice that this is my first ever post., as hadn't bothered previously to activate forum access in years past but finally motivated to now I see something that angers me enough to post.

1) Arctic Blast - PLEASE keep the morph with aoe dot damage. As mentioned by others, it's how we proc Chilled. And aside from finding other ways to proc Chilled; as a Magicka tank/solo focussed character, I don't want to be penalised in the open world context for doing less damage, just for this to be shifted to a projectile from an aoe? Why would I want that? I'm less bothered at the thought of the heal component removed but I do not want a ranged projectile as a tank. I want aoe melee ranged dot because I have taken the time to gather up all mobs and slow them down in melee range for myself in open world content, or for my group in dungeons to dps down. That's what Ice does. Control. The taunt component for ice mage could be toggled to generate agro full stop based on tri stat selected on destro staff?

2) The Bear's dps nerf. The class video introduction, the artwork. Everything lends itself to the Warden having a Bear companion. I like with my other Stam Bow/Bow Warden having a companion due to class fantasy and a strong point of difference from other classes. It Should be included as a permanent staple of all Wardens, whether it's reduced to a buff bear, but reason to keep it - that's the focus. On a class already weak on dps, the biggest buff you could give is damage - but you've taken it from the one thing that's consistent and offered an across the board, overall weaker alternative. The justification of 'oh, this free's you up to use other abilities' You can't predict what people will slot, how often they'll use it, to come up with an average figure that improves of a flat ability with a flat return.

Also, what about animal skin morphs, or even different daedra appearance for pet sorc?

Mojomonkeyman wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

cpuScientist wrote: »

@Joy_Division

PLEASE BRING UP A REVERT TO ARTIC BLAST. Make the heal 2 people thing constant and put the stun on the other morph PLEASE

This was one of the most interesting ability in the game ZOS. PLEASEbring this up to get changed this back. Allowed for very niche but fun useful builds in PvP and allowed a tank to contribute a little damage in PvE, But more importantly it was ICE damage. That would proc chilled. Now there is less abilities to use that can cause chilled. WHICH IS A WARDEN STAPLE IT IS A PASSIVE!

You're totally cool with how Artic Blast is on Live?

Yes, it's one of the best designed existing warden abilities currently on live:
1) Enables and synergizes perfectly with a multitude of builds:
- MagWarden Frost (PvP)
- Healthden (PvP)
- Warden Tank (PvP & PvE)
2) Has unique and desirable functionality:
- Cloak counter
- HoT on demand (layers/combos very well with trellis)
- Sufficient secondary damage source (50% AOE damage of Wall of Elements)
- Chilled & Deepfreeze factory (Higher % chance to proc status effects than any other skill in the kit AOE)
3) Adds to the non-spammy playstyle of wardens due to high cost and over time returns

Summed up, it's a skill that delivers just enough of everything (functionality, flavour, gameplay) to be very good but not too strong. The PTS version of that skill will take more away from the class than it will provide, it will break existing setups and it wont match its current quality of fitting perfectly into the Warden theme, playstyle and synergizing so well with other Warden skills. And I am saying this as someone being very desperate for a CC.

I am maining MagWarden exclusively since VVardenfell and have 2 of them maxed, both AR 33+ and more than 1k BG matches played on each. I am not into PvE, so can't provide too much intel here.

@Joy_Division Complete agree with Mojomoeyman, Arctic Blast is very good. If ZoS wants to change it, move the DoT to the Base morph so that Polar can take advantage it. Then Arctic can be a DPS skill. This is clearly the majority opinion in the Warden Class Rep Discord too.
the Skill isnt perfect, it should be buffed to 30% max health heal total. Either 20%Instant/10%AHoT or 15%Instant/15%HoT than it would be balance with GDB, Clanfear, Cloak, Sunshield

ccmedaddy wrote: »

Maura_Neysa wrote: »

FFS ZoS
Leave Arctic Blast alone or move the it to Base morph. Really though Crystallized Slab is where it belonged. This would force the choice between Major Heroism or Stun, both very good. The instant heal morph of Embrace would also have been a good option, or Frozen Retreat

Great post, but I disagree with this part. First, this would create a situation where magwardens have to choose between CC and Major Heroism while stamwardens get both via weapon skills. Yes, destro clench exists but for frost builds this is not an option.

Also, if the Warden class is going to get 1 hard CC ability, it should be an on-demand stun, not part of a defense mechanism that requires certain conditions to trigger the CC.

So adjust Retreat, or give it to the Grasp, which would actually be perfect because the projectile would give it the perfect amount of counter. While leaving Embrace as the Heal

In terms of damage output, at least when it comes to a target dummy parse, we did acknowledge the classes are relatively close to each other

Is this supposed to be some kind of sick joke? Magdens are parsing like 15% behind all the other magicka classes on PTS.