kaithuzar wrote: »

@Everyone saying soul harvest doesn't need a buff; you're dead wrong & here's why:
90% of the pvp meta at this point in time & for the past few months at least, has been tanky stam players with min-maxed healing & defense, tanking with sword & board, seventh legion, & either pariah, fortified brass, pirate skeleton, chudan, etc... SOLELY RELYING ON DAWNBREAKER TO KILL their opponents, and it's an AOE knockdown!
The problem here is that what these players are doing is the MOST EFFECTIVE METHOD & we need something to counter it!

It's pretty sad when even magsorcs slot dawnbreaker...

kaithuzar wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

@Everyone saying soul harvest doesn't need a buff; you're dead wrong & here's why:
90% of the pvp meta at this point in time & for the past few months at least, has been tanky stam players with min-maxed healing & defense, tanking with sword & board, seventh legion, & either pariah, fortified brass, pirate skeleton, chudan, etc... SOLELY RELYING ON DAWNBREAKER TO KILL their opponents, and it's an AOE knockdown!
The problem here is that what these players are doing is the MOST EFFECTIVE METHOD & we need something to counter it!

It's pretty sad when even magsorcs slot dawnbreaker...

I wouldn't say that everyone is running DB, only 3 stambuilds are as it's the best ult for them, stamdk use Leap while stamnb is running incap.
The other 3 classes don't have access to such a good ultimate so they are running DB.
For magclasses they are running different ults and DB isn't on top of their useage at all.
Magnb is either running incap or soul tether
Magdk is running leap
Magplar is often only used as a heal bot so no offensive ult there
Magwarden is running sleet storm
Magsorc is the only class that uses DB although with the new rune prison meteor is much more effective

Please tell me where you play pc na/eu, Xbox, PS4 & what campaign

kaithuzar wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

@Everyone saying soul harvest doesn't need a buff; you're dead wrong & here's why:
90% of the pvp meta at this point in time & for the past few months at least, has been tanky stam players with min-maxed healing & defense, tanking with sword & board, seventh legion, & either pariah, fortified brass, pirate skeleton, chudan, etc... SOLELY RELYING ON DAWNBREAKER TO KILL their opponents, and it's an AOE knockdown!
The problem here is that what these players are doing is the MOST EFFECTIVE METHOD & we need something to counter it!

It's pretty sad when even magsorcs slot dawnbreaker...

I wouldn't say that everyone is running DB, only 3 stambuilds are as it's the best ult for them, stamdk use Leap while stamnb is running incap.
The other 3 classes don't have access to such a good ultimate so they are running DB.
For magclasses they are running different ults and DB isn't on top of their useage at all.
Magnb is either running incap or soul tether
Magdk is running leap
Magplar is often only used as a heal bot so no offensive ult there
Magwarden is running sleet storm
Magsorc is the only class that uses DB although with the new rune prison meteor is much more effective

I guess the meta is just slightly different na vs eu
So I'll make a few adjustments to what i see:
1) stam nb can easily run db & be successful, it depends grately on group vs solo & number of opponents you're anticipating

2) in NA magplar can be very effective as a dps in small man cyro & can use db as well (the traditional setup was duel wield + sword & board); the way we typically run is "everyone bring your own heals/sustain/dmg".

3) db beats out meteor in my opinion due to increased damage against vampires, which are still plentiful & because it's fast & catches people off guard coming from a magic player i.e... you won't know you're hit with it until your dead as a quick streak to get behind & by the time you turn the camera angle you've already taken it to the face.

So outside of the 3 classes you already mentioned (stam sorc, stam Templar, stam warden), now we have stam nb, mag Templar, & mag sorc that can all be top end players in pvp capable of utilizing dawnbreaker effectively.

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Solariken wrote: »

Please remember it's that turd Champion system that artificially skews morph viability and crappy CP design is what you should be campaigning against.

Can never be said enough. CP is destroying this game.

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Solariken wrote: »

Please remember it's that turd Champion system that artificially skews morph viability and crappy CP design is what you should be campaigning against.

Can never be said enough. CP is destroying this game.

This is a dead meme from 2016. CP has been significantly more balanced than non-CP ever since the Morrowind reworks did away with permablocking and infinite sustain. The only thing that CP really imbalances is defiles, but those are plenty strong in non-CP already. Non-CP heavily favors stamina over magicka and favors external damage sources like procs, poisons, and siege.

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

I wanna see Soul Harvest ulty gen get a cool-down. Would prefer to see less destros in pvp.

BohnT wrote: »

JobooAGS wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

arkansas_ESO wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

Izaki wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

None of the death stroke morphs need a buff, incap needs it's stun removed.
Incap is completely overperfoming and arguably the best single target ult in the game, as you said the cc combined with high damage, 20% damage increase and major defile + passives.
On top the stun on incap is broken like many others but incap is the one you can't break free of the most.
I play both stamnb and meele magnb and ofc I'm using incap on both of them. When i count the times an enemy couldn't break free from my incap I always get to ~66% of the times when I'm using incap. People get pinned on the floor and can't react "fast" enough to break free and defend themselves (i mean 2 gcd most of the time). With how much damage the first burst does and how fast nbs can dish out more damage 90% of all builds are dead because of the bugged stun.
This has to end even without the stun incap and nbs are still one of the most powerful classes in the game and are nowhere near "dead" if people start bringing up that reaction

Just fix the stun then? You're describing a bug and using it as a reason for a nerf.

Although, I would definitely get behind removing the stun and increasing the empower to 8 seconds for example. Would really help Stamblade in PvE.

No even with a fixed stun incap is too powerful. I wrote it down in another post about incap why a stun on a high damage ability is a stupid idea.
Stamnb doesn't need more buffs not a single bit, at least not in pvp. PvE is a completely different story but an increase to the bursty nature of stamnb isn't something this game needs, a way of more sustained damage would be fine

Meteor and Dawnbreaker are both high damage and stun on hit, incap isn't an outlier

None of them applies 20% damage taken major defile and are way more expensive + the classes utilising those skills can't dishout burst the same way nb does.

incap is single target, the other 2 are aoe. plus warden uses db and look how many nerf threads they have because of their high BURST

Warden nerf threads are here because they are completely overtuned, just like incap.
If you think dawnbreaker or meteor are better than incap, go ahead and slot them, you'll see how wrong you are

DDuke wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

@DDuke it´s nice how you theorycraft about magblade melee - but don´t forget that one of the core features aiding to stamblades survivability is being able to chain dodgeroll with cloak while being able to remove snares.
On magblade you´d have to run 2h to remove snares - which leaves you with about 25% of the lightattack dmg stamblades have - negating all possible dmg advantages (hint: there are none bc your anytimer does not provide major fracture).

I don´t play too much stamblade - but i played and tested on magblade a lot.

I don't know if being able to shuffle roll really helps that much, I've found that most of the time stamblade needs to do that, the stamblade also needs to Rally in order to even live. So you're stuck in melee range (probably holding block & losing all your stamina), snared to hell & wishing you had a Healing Ward.

Shuffle roll->cloak is also easily countered by streak or gap closer->AoE (i.e. volatile or sweeps).


Regarding damage, remember that most of those stamblades these days have <10k buffed Surprise Attack tooltip, where as my magblade on PTS has 14k on Concealed Weapon with buffs & a 23k tooltip proc set (don't ask me how ).

Don't forget that stamnb gets extra burst via heavy attacks. And i feel that stamnb still deals more burst and can finish people better off who survive the first burst but I'm not sure why

Are you sure stamblade has more burst?

Using a PTS set pre launch, heck even pre first balance? Yeah stamNB has more consistent and usable burst. A non bomber MagNB has to set up will with some projectile and hope for skoria.

A typical rollerblade has a <10k tooltip on Surprise Attack in PvP.

You can even build for full dmg (Spriggan+Hunding's+Kra'gh+Kena) & you'll have less damage than a magblade building for full dmg (Spinner's+War Maiden+Domi+Kena), and that's on Live.

13 827 Concealed tooltip
vs
13 420 Surprise Attack tooltip

...and you get 2317 more pen (i.e. 3,5% more dmg), 1% more crit dmg (as you can and should put less points into spell erosion) with light armor.

So here's a quick comparison:

Magblade
Lotus Fan 13 129 (Empowered with Magelight)
Lotus Fan Tick 832
Tether 21 907
Tether Tick 2110
Lotus Fan Tick 832
Merciless 27 652
Tether Tick 2110
Lotus Fan Tick 832

---

69 404
-Battle Spirit
34 702+83%(crit modifier)=63 504

Stamblade
Ambush 13 110 (Empowered with Magelight)
Incap 22 993 (Empowered with Ambush)
Relentless 29 258 (+20% from Incap)

---

65 361
-Battle Spirit
32 680+82%(crit modifier)=59 478-3.5%(the difference in penetration)=57 396


As you can see, magblade can get not only similar burst, but even better (without Detonation). On Live.

People just don't experiment/theorycraft enough.

RouDeR wrote: »

Make Incap cost 100 ulti (base skill also) , and leave the Soul Harvest at 75 ulti as an additional bonus .

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

How about making the Soul Harvest morph ranged (not 40 metre range ofc)?

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

How about making the Soul Harvest morph ranged (not 40 metre range ofc)?

But that would make it vulnerable to Ball of lightning and shimmering shield etc. It sounds like a decent buff but if you get more counters for Soul Harvest i wouldn't call the change a buff

Didn't ment it to make a projectile. Thought about something like summoning a shade from range at the opponents position which immediately "Incaps" him.

Feanor wrote: »

Should we not have a low cost, semi-spammable ulti option for one or two classes in the game?

No we shouldn’t, and especially not if it is a powerful ability. The words „ulti“ and „spammable“ are contradictory.