Crystal Frags nerf?! No stun

Beardimus · September 2017

Honestly, the folks coming here to suggest this is a buff are really clutching at straws. Certain build types of Sorc have has nothing but Nerf after Nerf (DW / Overload) and even this clear big Nerf for PvP people suggest is a buff. It's hilarious. Anyone hard casting a frag in PvP is dead.

Deader than dead. Reader than the dead horse in the Auction House threads.

Hopefully the Nerf Sorc threads will go silent now finally (jokes)

Apherius · September 2017

Beardimus wrote: »

Honestly, the folks coming here to suggest this is a buff are really clutching at straws. Certain build types of Sorc have has nothing but Nerf after Nerf (DW / Overload) and even this clear big Nerf for PvP people suggest is a buff. It's hilarious. Anyone hard casting a frag in PvP is dead.

Deader than dead. Reader than the dead horse in the Auction House threads.

Hopefully the Nerf Sorc threads will go silent now finally (jokes)

Someone should do a poll about " Nerf X ? which class is the next ? "

xiZeroPointix · September 2017

ZOS_Wrobel
2:24PM
Staff Post
We’d like to touch on a couple things we’re looking to iterate on for this class. First, some of you have mentioned that the Summon Charged Atronach AoE can occasionally miss targets that are right next to it. To address this, we plan to change the AoE pattern to a single circle instead of 5 small circles. We’ve also seen reports of an issue with Overload where the bound armor can persist even when it’s not on your bar; we’re investigating this issue.

Lastly, we’ve seen some of you mention that the new Rune Prison is quite powerful in PVP - we’re looking at adjusting the cost to help counter this. In addition, we’ve been evaluating the Crystal Shard skill line and its morphs and are planning to make some adjustments. The base stun component is going to be removed from the ability and instead placed on the Crystal Blast morph. This will make the choice between Crystal Fragments and Crystal Blast much more interesting as you are choosing between a CC and AoE damage vs. increased burst damage.

Thanks for taking the time to hop on the PTS and test out the changes

The changes havent happened yet and he wanted a shock and awe campaign before a final decision was made. Sounds like frags will recieve increased burst damage potenial to compensate for the cc loss. Blast will have an aoe cc that can stun multiple targets now, bringing it more in line with fear (still might be quite a bit weaker tho) a stun will make it easier to proc offbalance/ concussion then line up a force pulse (for status effects) curse fury dead. I was triggered at first, but maybe after some consideration, this might be something worth testing along with the new rune prison. Both morphs should have a chance to insta proc tho

SodanTok · September 2017

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

laced wrote: »

Izaki wrote: »

xiZeroPointix wrote: »

Guys i inderstand the skill..but the specifics are unclear. Is frags getting a damage buff due to loosing its cc and does the each of the aoe shards from blast able to stun multiple targets? Maybe reduce the cast time of blast a little would help.

Nah Frags remains as it is now except it loses the CC. Blast stays the same.

#BothMorphsInstantCastIsTheAnswer

Both morphs should NOT have instant cast. Where is snipes instant cast , hmmm? Why does sorc get to have instant cast high damage abilites and no one else? Templar loses damage for instant cast, uppercut has no instant cast, and snipe has no instant cast.

No one in the right mind would use snipe in direct engagements, there are other skills better suited, like PI. Do sorcs have the option to do so or do they depend on frags (bc they are instant sometimes), Hmmmmm?

There are no skills actually, thats why you are forced to use snipe (dive on warden) or not trying to play ranged stamina character. Thats what cast time abilities do to people. Punish them for using them for minimum gain. Maybe that is needed. Remove instant proc from frag and let sorcs flood the forum for 3months till next patch, maybe that would open the eyes and lead finally to removal of cast time on abilities that have long and slow travel time.

xiZeroPointix · September 2017

This will give sorcs a good powerful cc (possibly the best sorcs have in there kit now)at great cost tho. Boost the damage to frags and lower the cast time on blast and this might be very viable. That means 3 targets will have to face tank all of your damage can we bypass cc immunity as well

mwahaaha

Joy_Division · September 2017

Can someone explain what exactly is the difference between Rune Prison on Live and Rune Prison on the PTS?

From what I recall, Rune Prison is a disorient, which means it cannot be blocked and CCs opponents. Being a disorient the CC stays on the target until it is broken either by a CC break or by direct damage (as per the morph). Since most semi-competant opponents immediate CC breaks stuns, what exactly was the functional difference? I don;t remember if Rune Prison could be dodged, but maybe it couldn't be (petrify for instance was a disorient that could not be dodged, or at least I don't think so).

So on Live right now, sorcs can pretty much auto CC anyone without immunity within 28 meters. Yet just about all sorcerers chose the Defensive rune morph. Before Wrobel decided he had to nerf Crystal Frags, he came to the conclusion the capacity for a sorc to CC anyone without immunity within 28 meters was strong and warranted adjustments ... but couldn't sorcerers already do this? Why were sorcerers going to abandon their previous choice on Live?

Kilandros · September 2017

I think the removal of the stun is dumb and unnecessary, but this is being blown out of proportion. Good sorcs were already using stuns like Dawnbreaker so they could land CF--they weren't using CF as a stun to land something else.

Jaxaxo · September 2017

@Joy_Division
Rune Prison: This ability and its morphs are no longer 30-second disorients. Instead, they are 2.5-second stuns that cannot be blocked or dodged, and they can be placed on multiple targets.

Rune Cage (Rune Prison morph): This morph now deals damage to the enemy if the stun lasts its full duration.

The Defensive Rune morph continues to place a buff on you that will stun the next enemy that damages you.

Zer0oo · September 2017

Joy_Division wrote: »

Can someone explain what exactly is the difference between Rune Prison on Live and Rune Prison on the PTS?

From what I recall, Rune Prison is a disorient, which means it cannot be blocked and CCs opponents. Being a disorient the CC stays on the target until it is broken either by a CC break or by direct damage (as per the morph). I don;t remember if Rune Prison could be dodged, but maybe they couldn't be (petrify for instance was a disorient that could not be dodged, or at least I don't think so).

So on Live right now, sorcs can pretty much auto CC anyone without immunity within 28 meters. Yet just about all sorcerers chose the Defensive rune morph. Before Wrobel decided he had to nerf Crystal Frags, he came to the conclusion the capacity for a sorc to CC anyone without immunity within 28 meters was strong and warranted adjustments ... but couldn't sorcerers already do this? Why were sorcerers going to abandon their previous choice on Live?

Well, templers lost their cc on shards because they couldn't fix that burning light broke the cc. The warden birds are undodge able because the animation was too slow. The vampire ulti does no longer make you invisible since they couldn't fix that everything broke invisibility. Camo hunter did 1shot ppl in pvp so they removed the active skill completely. Petrify is now only melee because you should use stone fist.

You see the pattern? And you ask really why the make things like that?

Lexxypwns · September 2017

Huge nerf to sorc, there's no two ways about it. Now you need to use streak or rune cage to set up the burst. One of which is difficult to time, the other means you lose a very very valuable skill slot. You're either dropping harness, boundless, conversion, or surge/entropy to run rune cage and losing either of them is gonna hurt your build

Vapirko · September 2017

I’m going to relish this sweet moment when sorcs got their first real nerf that’s going to impact their combat in a very tangible way. Now I’m going to sit here and say exactly what all the mag sorcs said when stam classes got hit by so many nerfs.

L2P, you’re clearly over reacting, stop the whining and crying. This is absolutely necessary, it’s been a long time coming. You need to stop relying on abilities and actually git gud.

CyrusArya · September 2017

Vapirko wrote: »

I’m going to relish this sweet moment when sorcs got their first real nerf that’s going to impact their combat in a very tangible way. Now I’m going to sit here and say exactly what all the mag sorcs said when stam classes got hit by so many nerfs.

L2P, you’re clearly over reacting, stop the whining and crying. This is absolutely necessary, it’s been a long time coming. You need to stop relying on abilities and actually git gud.

What exactly was nerfed about stam classes in the last year that impacted their combat in a tangible way? If you think stam classes have actually been significantly nerfed over and over then it's clear you're a baddie.

Vapirko · September 2017

@CyrusArya HAHAHAHAHAH. You have got to be kidding me right? I’m sorry but if you haven’t paid any attention to stam nerfs then I’m not gonna bother to go and list them all out for you.

Kilandros · September 2017

Lexxypwns wrote: »

Huge nerf to sorc, there's no two ways about it. Now you need to use streak or rune cage to set up the burst. One of which is difficult to time, the other means you lose a very very valuable skill slot. You're either dropping harness, boundless, conversion, or surge/entropy to run rune cage and losing either of them is gonna hurt your build

This thread is blowing my mind right now.

What "burst" are you using CF to set up?

Curse? Not blockable - don't need to CC the target to set that one up.

Meteor? I'm going to start blocking or misting when I see the telegraph, so I'll be blocking your CF too.

Dawnbreaker? If you're using CF to land your DB, then lol. You've got it backwards.

CF is your burst. If you haven't been using those other CCs to set up and land an unblocked CF then you've been playing Sorc like a pug.

CyrusArya · September 2017

Vapirko wrote: »

@CyrusArya HAHAHAHAHAH. You have got to be kidding me right? I’m sorry but if you haven’t paid any attention to stam nerfs then I’m not gonna bother to go and list them all out for you.

No I'm not kidding at all. I main a stamplar. Based on my personal experience and what I've seen fighting with and against good stamina players (read: players who don't cry about nerfs or struggle against sorcs), they have been consistently strong for a very long time. Please, name one nerf where a core stamina ability had an important aspect of it stripped away since wrecking blow lots it's empower.

Vapirko · September 2017

@CyrusArya why do you assume that damage skills are the only way stamina has been nerfed? DKs have seen massive sustain nerfs and our passives stripped to the ground. NBs receive some sort of nerf nearly every patch and now we’re getting our main CC nerfed for no reason. Mag sorcs have had it coming for a long time and I fully agree with most of ZOS changes even if it means some changes to the way I play as well. In fact, if you don’t believe me why not go make a thread titled, “why doesn’t stamina get nerfed,” and then get back to me with the responses.

Ace_SiN · September 2017

The design of Sorc has always been bad since launch, imo. They have too much stacked for them. I can't think of any other PvP game where having a CC attached to your hardest hitting skill(and it's spammable) was an acceptable form of balance.
Combine that with a pre-execute(and auto execute) and things get silly. This overstacking design is not limited to Sorc though. Since launch ZOS has had a nasty habit of just piling on the benefits and/or just ignoring how spam heavy the design of this game is with their changes. This is a step in the right direction for PvP. If only they'd put more effort into the rest of the design flaws(like aoe caps..)

Joy_Division · September 2017

Zer0oo wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Can someone explain what exactly is the difference between Rune Prison on Live and Rune Prison on the PTS?

From what I recall, Rune Prison is a disorient, which means it cannot be blocked and CCs opponents. Being a disorient the CC stays on the target until it is broken either by a CC break or by direct damage (as per the morph). I don;t remember if Rune Prison could be dodged, but maybe they couldn't be (petrify for instance was a disorient that could not be dodged, or at least I don't think so).

So on Live right now, sorcs can pretty much auto CC anyone without immunity within 28 meters. Yet just about all sorcerers chose the Defensive rune morph. Before Wrobel decided he had to nerf Crystal Frags, he came to the conclusion the capacity for a sorc to CC anyone without immunity within 28 meters was strong and warranted adjustments ... but couldn't sorcerers already do this? Why were sorcerers going to abandon their previous choice on Live?

Well, templers lost their cc on shards because they couldn't fix that burning light broke the cc. The warden birds are undodge able because the animation was too slow. The vampire ulti does no longer make you invisible since they couldn't fix that everything broke invisibility. Camo hunter did 1shot ppl in pvp so they removed the active skill completely. Petrify is now only melee because you should use stone fist.

You see the pattern? And you ask really why the make things like that?

I know why Zos is doing stuff like this - in their minds homogenization and ripping the soul out of classes constitutes "improvement." What I am not sure is what are the practical differences between the rune Prison on Live and the one on PTS. As far as I know, if I am disoriented then I am CCed even if I am blocking and I am 9 times out of 10 going to cc break it before taking direct damage (unless I am getting zerged down). If I am stun with what's on PTS, I am CCed even if I am blocking and will 10 times out of 10 going to cc break.

I do agree a stun the goes through block is on paper stronger than a disorient because the target can't get bailed out by direct damage (and I'm still not sure how disorient interacts with dodge). But that's an Xv1 situation and if sorcerers valued the defensive aspect of Defensive Rune, I'm not sure I comprehend what makes what's on the PTS so much more appealing that would prompt Wrobel to make these further changes with regards to sorcerers.

So just asking for clarification.

SaintSubwayy · September 2017

Vaoh wrote: »

When people asked to buff Elemental Storm (not Eye of the Storm in particular), they did not ask to buff the damage of each tick by the massive 50% damage increase that it got. Likewise, just about every decent player asked for Eye of the Storm in particular to be nerfed due to how crazy it was in PvP after the 50% damage buff.

Don't worry though. wrobel said on ESO Live that they have plans for Eye of the Storm as well. Finally lol

We'll see, I hope they dont nerf the stationary into the ground, for PVE's sake ^^
For eye of the sotrm I hope that they find a good way to keep it good in PVP but not as OP as it's now.

NBrookus · September 2017

Joy_Division wrote: »

Zer0oo wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Can someone explain what exactly is the difference between Rune Prison on Live and Rune Prison on the PTS?

From what I recall, Rune Prison is a disorient, which means it cannot be blocked and CCs opponents. Being a disorient the CC stays on the target until it is broken either by a CC break or by direct damage (as per the morph). I don;t remember if Rune Prison could be dodged, but maybe they couldn't be (petrify for instance was a disorient that could not be dodged, or at least I don't think so).

So on Live right now, sorcs can pretty much auto CC anyone without immunity within 28 meters. Yet just about all sorcerers chose the Defensive rune morph. Before Wrobel decided he had to nerf Crystal Frags, he came to the conclusion the capacity for a sorc to CC anyone without immunity within 28 meters was strong and warranted adjustments ... but couldn't sorcerers already do this? Why were sorcerers going to abandon their previous choice on Live?

Well, templers lost their cc on shards because they couldn't fix that burning light broke the cc. The warden birds are undodge able because the animation was too slow. The vampire ulti does no longer make you invisible since they couldn't fix that everything broke invisibility. Camo hunter did 1shot ppl in pvp so they removed the active skill completely. Petrify is now only melee because you should use stone fist.

You see the pattern? And you ask really why the make things like that?

I know why Zos is doing stuff like this - in their minds homogenization and ripping the soul out of classes constitutes "improvement." What I am not sure is what are the practical differences between the rune Prison on Live and the one on PTS. As far as I know, if I am disoriented then I am CCed even if I am blocking and I am 9 times out of 10 going to cc break it before taking direct damage (unless I am getting zerged down). If I am stun with what's on PTS, I am CCed even if I am blocking and will 10 times out of 10 going to cc break.

I do agree a stun the goes through block is on paper stronger than a disorient because the target can't get bailed out by direct damage (and I'm still not sure how disorient interacts with dodge). But that's an Xv1 situation and if sorcerers valued the defensive aspect of Defensive Rune, I'm not sure I comprehend what makes what's on the PTS so much more appealing that would prompt Wrobel to make these further changes with regards to sorcerers.

So just asking for clarification.

Sorcs didn't need Rune Prison for the CC when they had streak and frags and dawnbreaker. 6 second shields tho left sorcs without any defense versus surprise attacks -- hence the popularity of defensive rune. It won't save you from every gank, but it saves you from quite a few.

WreckfulAbandon · September 2017

awful change

HoloYoitsu · September 2017

@Joy_Division

The quick answer is that there is no functional difference for Rune Cage on PTS vs Live. The new version is a stun w/ a negligible dmg component that triggers if they sit through the full duration (like Shattering Prison). The main difference is in the ease of use, not in it allowing a new combo. Everything the "nerf sorc" potatos are rambling on about with regards to "new" Rune Cage rotation for the most part ignores the fact that that same exact rotation can be used on Live - though reliably only in 1v1s since the Live version breaks on direct dmg. So if we go by their logic, then every sorc ever should be already using Rune Cage setups on Live in duels. All i can say is from what I've seen, the majority in fact don't.

On a side note, I'm so enthused to see all these people coming out of the woodwork to suddenly start towing the line that Frags CC component "needed" to be nerfed all along. It's almost as if they simply wanted sorc nerfed in some way and the second Wrobel came out with a new nerf idea that none of them had even thought of, they just gobble it up.

Let's see, here's the closest thread I can find asking specifically for a Frags CC nerf. It's from a month ago, but mhh where are all the people agreeing and saying the CC is too powerful and needs to go? Oh right, they aren't there and the vast majority agreed that this guy's complaint was a L2P issue. So mind telling me what drastically changed about sorc in the last 35 days?

Here's an idea for the whiners: if Frags CC is so ungodly OP, why don't you slot a reflect - or did you forget those existed?

Vaoh · September 2017

SaintSubwayy wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

When people asked to buff Elemental Storm (not Eye of the Storm in particular), they did not ask to buff the damage of each tick by the massive 50% damage increase that it got. Likewise, just about every decent player asked for Eye of the Storm in particular to be nerfed due to how crazy it was in PvP after the 50% damage buff.

Don't worry though. wrobel said on ESO Live that they have plans for Eye of the Storm as well. Finally lol

We'll see, I hope they dont nerf the stationary into the ground, for PVE's sake ^^
For eye of the sotrm I hope that they find a good way to keep it good in PVP but not as OP as it's now.

They specifically called out the Eye of the Storm morph on ESO Live, and said they don't want to change the Elemental Rage morph at all since that would mess with PvE.

ak_pvp · September 2017

HoloYoitsu wrote: »

@Joy_Division

The quick answer is that there is no functional difference for Rune Cage on PTS vs Live. The new version is a stun w/ a negligible dmg component that triggers if they sit through the full duration (like Shattering Prison). The main difference is in the ease of use, not in it allowing a new combo. Everything the "nerf sorc" potatos are rambling on about with regards to "new" Rune Cage rotation for the most part ignores the fact that that same exact rotation can be used on Live - though reliably only in 1v1s since the Live version breaks on direct dmg. So if we go by their logic, then every sorc ever should be already using Rune Cage setups on Live in duels. All i can say is from what I've seen, the majority in fact don't.

On a side note, I'm so enthused to see all these people coming out of the woodwork to suddenly start towing the line that Frags CC component "needed" to be nerfed all along. It's almost as if they simply wanted sorc nerfed in some way and the second Wrobel came out with a new nerf idea that none of them had even thought of, they just gobble it up.

Let's see, here's the closest thread I can find asking specifically for a Frags CC nerf. It's from a month ago, but mhh where are all the people agreeing and saying the CC is too powerful and needs to go? Oh right, they aren't there and the vast majority agreed that this guy's complaint was a L2P issue. So mind telling me what drastically changed about sorc in the last 35 days?

Here's an idea for the whiners: if Frags CC is so ungodly OP, why don't you slot a reflect - or did you forget those existed?

Many people don't want frags nerfed, especially a *** nerf like this. They just don't want rune prison, so feel frags is a compromise.

"Ignores the fact that that same exact rotation can be used on Live." Yes, the curse> execute>cage>frags can be. But it has other uses now, i.e. against a tanky target to keep beating on them for longer if they are low on stam, as opposed to it breaking straight away. Its also usable in groups. prison definitely a buff, if it was for DKs, then it is for sorcs.

Sorc itself ame out different but both buffed and nerfed. Better than some classes...

On reflect. DK reflect has been gutted, 2 duration limits, high cost, some projectiles ignore it, and status effects still go through. Reflective stance is one projectile only, so casting it isn't the most worth, maybe next patch though.

Chrlynsch · September 2017

Meanwhile in Cyrodiil

Vapirko · September 2017

SaintSubwayy wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

When people asked to buff Elemental Storm (not Eye of the Storm in particular), they did not ask to buff the damage of each tick by the massive 50% damage increase that it got. Likewise, just about every decent player asked for Eye of the Storm in particular to be nerfed due to how crazy it was in PvP after the 50% damage buff.

Don't worry though. wrobel said on ESO Live that they have plans for Eye of the Storm as well. Finally lol

We'll see, I hope they dont nerf the stationary into the ground, for PVE's sake ^^
For eye of the sotrm I hope that they find a good way to keep it good in PVP but not as OP as it's now.

Wrobel mentioned that he’s aware of the impact on pve and that eots will be adjusted by not the stationary morph. Which makes sense, the stationary morph isn’t the issue.

HoloYoitsu · September 2017

ak_pvp wrote: »

HoloYoitsu wrote: »

@Joy_Division

The quick answer is that there is no functional difference for Rune Cage on PTS vs Live. The new version is a stun w/ a negligible dmg component that triggers if they sit through the full duration (like Shattering Prison). The main difference is in the ease of use, not in it allowing a new combo. Everything the "nerf sorc" potatos are rambling on about with regards to "new" Rune Cage rotation for the most part ignores the fact that that same exact rotation can be used on Live - though reliably only in 1v1s since the Live version breaks on direct dmg. So if we go by their logic, then every sorc ever should be already using Rune Cage setups on Live in duels. All i can say is from what I've seen, the majority in fact don't.

On a side note, I'm so enthused to see all these people coming out of the woodwork to suddenly start towing the line that Frags CC component "needed" to be nerfed all along. It's almost as if they simply wanted sorc nerfed in some way and the second Wrobel came out with a new nerf idea that none of them had even thought of, they just gobble it up.

Let's see, here's the closest thread I can find asking specifically for a Frags CC nerf. It's from a month ago, but mhh where are all the people agreeing and saying the CC is too powerful and needs to go? Oh right, they aren't there and the vast majority agreed that this guy's complaint was a L2P issue. So mind telling me what drastically changed about sorc in the last 35 days?

Here's an idea for the whiners: if Frags CC is so ungodly OP, why don't you slot a reflect - or did you forget those existed?

Many people don't want frags nerfed, especially a *** nerf like this. They just don't want rune prison, so feel frags is a compromise.

"Ignores the fact that that same exact rotation can be used on Live." Yes, the curse> execute>cage>frags can be. But it has other uses now, i.e. against a tanky target to keep beating on them for longer if they are low on stam, as opposed to it breaking straight away. Its also usable in groups. prison definitely a buff, if it was for DKs, then it is for sorcs.

Sorc itself ame out different but both buffed and nerfed. Better than some classes...

On reflect. DK reflect has been gutted, 2 duration limits, high cost, some projectiles ignore it, and status effects still go through. Reflective stance is one projectile only, so casting it isn't the most worth, maybe next patch though.

I have to disagree w/ you on your reflect stance. It was a stupid change but Scales is hardly "gutted" just because it doesn't reflect an infinite number of projectiles anymore, the pain is mostly felt when being zergged down. And with the Force Pulse change (another stupid change), it's even easier to counter Frags w/ Scales. Is Scales expensive? Yes. But it has the power to completely shut down a sorc's burst ability at will. And while we're talking about skill costs, with Wrobel's promised cost increase Rune Prison may end up costing a comparable amount to Scales. Likewise with Defensive Stance, the fact that it's limited to one projectile isn't an issue now with the Force Pulse change. It's a cheap skill that stays up for 30 sec and can be kept up 100% against Frags

Anyway not directed at you, but I'd like to reiterate what I said in the other thread for ppl who don't like the new Rune Cage: removing CC from Frags just makes the new Rune Cage combo stronger, it's not any kind of "buff this nerf that" tradeoff. If Frags kept the CC you would have to be less liberal in spamming Frags every proc if you were trying to do the Rune Cage combo because you don't have control over the timing of the CC that way. So if you don't like the new Rune Cage, you should be shouting for Wrobel to leave Frags alone.

All that both changes combined does is force sorcs to lose a bar slot front barring Rune Cage, homogenizing the playstyle even more than it already is. Either that, or take Frags off and start spamming Fire Clench like a complete potato.

Jade1986 · September 2017

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

laced wrote: »

Izaki wrote: »

xiZeroPointix wrote: »

Guys i inderstand the skill..but the specifics are unclear. Is frags getting a damage buff due to loosing its cc and does the each of the aoe shards from blast able to stun multiple targets? Maybe reduce the cast time of blast a little would help.

Nah Frags remains as it is now except it loses the CC. Blast stays the same.

#BothMorphsInstantCastIsTheAnswer

Both morphs should NOT have instant cast. Where is snipes instant cast , hmmm? Why does sorc get to have instant cast high damage abilites and no one else? Templar loses damage for instant cast, uppercut has no instant cast, and snipe has no instant cast.

No one in the right mind would use snipe in direct engagements, there are other skills better suited, like PI. Do sorcs have the option to do so or do they depend on frags (bc they are instant sometimes), Hmmmmm?

Poison injection doesnt have near the damage of snipe. Not even remotely. Sorcs do have other options, many more options in fact, we have snipe and pi, end of story.

SodanTok · September 2017

laced wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

laced wrote: »

Izaki wrote: »

xiZeroPointix wrote: »

Guys i inderstand the skill..but the specifics are unclear. Is frags getting a damage buff due to loosing its cc and does the each of the aoe shards from blast able to stun multiple targets? Maybe reduce the cast time of blast a little would help.

Nah Frags remains as it is now except it loses the CC. Blast stays the same.

#BothMorphsInstantCastIsTheAnswer

Both morphs should NOT have instant cast. Where is snipes instant cast , hmmm? Why does sorc get to have instant cast high damage abilites and no one else? Templar loses damage for instant cast, uppercut has no instant cast, and snipe has no instant cast.

No one in the right mind would use snipe in direct engagements, there are other skills better suited, like PI. Do sorcs have the option to do so or do they depend on frags (bc they are instant sometimes), Hmmmmm?

Poison injection doesnt have near the damage of snipe. Not even remotely. Sorcs do have other options, many more options in fact, we have snipe and pi, end of story.

You forgot the most important skill. 10m range knockback/disorient

Lexxypwns · September 2017

Kilandros wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

Huge nerf to sorc, there's no two ways about it. Now you need to use streak or rune cage to set up the burst. One of which is difficult to time, the other means you lose a very very valuable skill slot. You're either dropping harness, boundless, conversion, or surge/entropy to run rune cage and losing either of them is gonna hurt your build

This thread is blowing my mind right now.

What "burst" are you using CF to set up?

Curse? Not blockable - don't need to CC the target to set that one up.

Meteor? I'm going to start blocking or misting when I see the telegraph, so I'll be blocking your CF too.

Dawnbreaker? If you're using CF to land your DB, then lol. You've got it backwards.

CF is your burst. If you haven't been using those other CCs to set up and land an unblocked CF then you've been playing Sorc like a pug.

I use streak in exactly that manner, something @Beardimus and I have discussed. I didn't say this like it was something new to CC prior to frags. But calling a proc'ed frag your whole burst is laughable. Perhaps against soft targets, but against good players the extra GCD you save by having the CC attached to frag is 18% of your burst window. With this change if you land curse, frag, combo and the opponent is at 21% health they heal up and you have to reset. Now if I catch you with the combo but don't proc fury I can easily drop a light weave on you and get the kill.

How you can say reducing burst windows by that significant of a margin isn't a huge nerf confuses me.

I'm not a sorc main and I don't really care about this nerf, but that doesn't mean it's not big and probably needless