Honestly, the folks coming here to suggest this is a buff are really clutching at straws. Certain build types of Sorc have has nothing but Nerf after Nerf (DW / Overload) and even this clear big Nerf for PvP people suggest is a buff. It's hilarious. Anyone hard casting a frag in PvP is dead.
Deader than dead. Reader than the dead horse in the Auction House threads.
Hopefully the Nerf Sorc threads will go silent now finally (jokes)
Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »xiZeroPointix wrote: »Guys i inderstand the skill..but the specifics are unclear. Is frags getting a damage buff due to loosing its cc and does the each of the aoe shards from blast able to stun multiple targets? Maybe reduce the cast time of blast a little would help.
Nah Frags remains as it is now except it loses the CC. Blast stays the same.
#BothMorphsInstantCastIsTheAnswer
Both morphs should NOT have instant cast. Where is snipes instant cast , hmmm? Why does sorc get to have instant cast high damage abilites and no one else? Templar loses damage for instant cast, uppercut has no instant cast, and snipe has no instant cast.
No one in the right mind would use snipe in direct engagements, there are other skills better suited, like PI. Do sorcs have the option to do so or do they depend on frags (bc they are instant sometimes), Hmmmmm?
ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Short answer is DKs likely won't be seeing a ton of changes before we go live; this class is still quite powerful (as it should be being a tank), even after some of the adjustments we've made to other classes and abilities.
Joy_Division wrote: »Can someone explain what exactly is the difference between Rune Prison on Live and Rune Prison on the PTS?
From what I recall, Rune Prison is a disorient, which means it cannot be blocked and CCs opponents. Being a disorient the CC stays on the target until it is broken either by a CC break or by direct damage (as per the morph). I don;t remember if Rune Prison could be dodged, but maybe they couldn't be (petrify for instance was a disorient that could not be dodged, or at least I don't think so).
So on Live right now, sorcs can pretty much auto CC anyone without immunity within 28 meters. Yet just about all sorcerers chose the Defensive rune morph. Before Wrobel decided he had to nerf Crystal Frags, he came to the conclusion the capacity for a sorc to CC anyone without immunity within 28 meters was strong and warranted adjustments ... but couldn't sorcerers already do this? Why were sorcerers going to abandon their previous choice on Live?
- Update 23Ice Furnace: This item set now grants Spell Damage, rather than Weapon Damage for the 4 piece bonus
I’m going to relish this sweet moment when sorcs got their first real nerf that’s going to impact their combat in a very tangible way. Now I’m going to sit here and say exactly what all the mag sorcs said when stam classes got hit by so many nerfs.
L2P, you’re clearly over reacting, stop the whining and crying. This is absolutely necessary, it’s been a long time coming. You need to stop relying on abilities and actually git gud.
Huge nerf to sorc, there's no two ways about it. Now you need to use streak or rune cage to set up the burst. One of which is difficult to time, the other means you lose a very very valuable skill slot. You're either dropping harness, boundless, conversion, or surge/entropy to run rune cage and losing either of them is gonna hurt your build
ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Short answer is DKs likely won't be seeing a ton of changes before we go live; this class is still quite powerful (as it should be being a tank), even after some of the adjustments we've made to other classes and abilities.
@CyrusArya HAHAHAHAHAH. You have got to be kidding me right? I’m sorry but if you haven’t paid any attention to stam nerfs then I’m not gonna bother to go and list them all out for you.
Joy_Division wrote: »Can someone explain what exactly is the difference between Rune Prison on Live and Rune Prison on the PTS?
From what I recall, Rune Prison is a disorient, which means it cannot be blocked and CCs opponents. Being a disorient the CC stays on the target until it is broken either by a CC break or by direct damage (as per the morph). I don;t remember if Rune Prison could be dodged, but maybe they couldn't be (petrify for instance was a disorient that could not be dodged, or at least I don't think so).
So on Live right now, sorcs can pretty much auto CC anyone without immunity within 28 meters. Yet just about all sorcerers chose the Defensive rune morph. Before Wrobel decided he had to nerf Crystal Frags, he came to the conclusion the capacity for a sorc to CC anyone without immunity within 28 meters was strong and warranted adjustments ... but couldn't sorcerers already do this? Why were sorcerers going to abandon their previous choice on Live?
Well, templers lost their cc on shards because they couldn't fix that burning light broke the cc. The warden birds are undodge able because the animation was too slow. The vampire ulti does no longer make you invisible since they couldn't fix that everything broke invisibility. Camo hunter did 1shot ppl in pvp so they removed the active skill completely. Petrify is now only melee because you should use stone fist.
You see the pattern? And you ask really why the make things like that?
When people asked to buff Elemental Storm (not Eye of the Storm in particular), they did not ask to buff the damage of each tick by the massive 50% damage increase that it got. Likewise, just about every decent player asked for Eye of the Storm in particular to be nerfed due to how crazy it was in PvP after the 50% damage buff.
Don't worry though. wrobel said on ESO Live that they have plans for Eye of the Storm as well. Finally lol
Joy_Division wrote: »Joy_Division wrote: »Can someone explain what exactly is the difference between Rune Prison on Live and Rune Prison on the PTS?
From what I recall, Rune Prison is a disorient, which means it cannot be blocked and CCs opponents. Being a disorient the CC stays on the target until it is broken either by a CC break or by direct damage (as per the morph). I don;t remember if Rune Prison could be dodged, but maybe they couldn't be (petrify for instance was a disorient that could not be dodged, or at least I don't think so).
So on Live right now, sorcs can pretty much auto CC anyone without immunity within 28 meters. Yet just about all sorcerers chose the Defensive rune morph. Before Wrobel decided he had to nerf Crystal Frags, he came to the conclusion the capacity for a sorc to CC anyone without immunity within 28 meters was strong and warranted adjustments ... but couldn't sorcerers already do this? Why were sorcerers going to abandon their previous choice on Live?
Well, templers lost their cc on shards because they couldn't fix that burning light broke the cc. The warden birds are undodge able because the animation was too slow. The vampire ulti does no longer make you invisible since they couldn't fix that everything broke invisibility. Camo hunter did 1shot ppl in pvp so they removed the active skill completely. Petrify is now only melee because you should use stone fist.
You see the pattern? And you ask really why the make things like that?
I know why Zos is doing stuff like this - in their minds homogenization and ripping the soul out of classes constitutes "improvement." What I am not sure is what are the practical differences between the rune Prison on Live and the one on PTS. As far as I know, if I am disoriented then I am CCed even if I am blocking and I am 9 times out of 10 going to cc break it before taking direct damage (unless I am getting zerged down). If I am stun with what's on PTS, I am CCed even if I am blocking and will 10 times out of 10 going to cc break.
I do agree a stun the goes through block is on paper stronger than a disorient because the target can't get bailed out by direct damage (and I'm still not sure how disorient interacts with dodge). But that's an Xv1 situation and if sorcerers valued the defensive aspect of Defensive Rune, I'm not sure I comprehend what makes what's on the PTS so much more appealing that would prompt Wrobel to make these further changes with regards to sorcerers.
So just asking for clarification.
They specifically called out the Eye of the Storm morph on ESO Live, and said they don't want to change the Elemental Rage morph at all since that would mess with PvE.SaintSubwayy wrote: »
When people asked to buff Elemental Storm (not Eye of the Storm in particular), they did not ask to buff the damage of each tick by the massive 50% damage increase that it got. Likewise, just about every decent player asked for Eye of the Storm in particular to be nerfed due to how crazy it was in PvP after the 50% damage buff.
Don't worry though. wrobel said on ESO Live that they have plans for Eye of the Storm as well. Finally lol
We'll see, I hope they dont nerf the stationary into the ground, for PVE's sake ^^
For eye of the sotrm I hope that they find a good way to keep it good in PVP but not as OP as it's now.
HoloYoitsu wrote: »@Joy_Division
The quick answer is that there is no functional difference for Rune Cage on PTS vs Live. The new version is a stun w/ a negligible dmg component that triggers if they sit through the full duration (like Shattering Prison). The main difference is in the ease of use, not in it allowing a new combo. Everything the "nerf sorc" potatos are rambling on about with regards to "new" Rune Cage rotation for the most part ignores the fact that that same exact rotation can be used on Live - though reliably only in 1v1s since the Live version breaks on direct dmg. So if we go by their logic, then every sorc ever should be already using Rune Cage setups on Live in duels. All i can say is from what I've seen, the majority in fact don't.
On a side note, I'm so enthused to see all these people coming out of the woodwork to suddenly start towing the line that Frags CC component "needed" to be nerfed all along. It's almost as if they simply wanted sorc nerfed in some way and the second Wrobel came out with a new nerf idea that none of them had even thought of, they just gobble it up.
Let's see, here's the closest thread I can find asking specifically for a Frags CC nerf. It's from a month ago, but mhh where are all the people agreeing and saying the CC is too powerful and needs to go? Oh right, they aren't there and the vast majority agreed that this guy's complaint was a L2P issue. So mind telling me what drastically changed about sorc in the last 35 days?
Here's an idea for the whiners: if Frags CC is so ungodly OP, why don't you slot a reflect - or did you forget those existed?
SaintSubwayy wrote: »
When people asked to buff Elemental Storm (not Eye of the Storm in particular), they did not ask to buff the damage of each tick by the massive 50% damage increase that it got. Likewise, just about every decent player asked for Eye of the Storm in particular to be nerfed due to how crazy it was in PvP after the 50% damage buff.
Don't worry though. wrobel said on ESO Live that they have plans for Eye of the Storm as well. Finally lol
We'll see, I hope they dont nerf the stationary into the ground, for PVE's sake ^^
For eye of the sotrm I hope that they find a good way to keep it good in PVP but not as OP as it's now.
I have to disagree w/ you on your reflect stance. It was a stupid change but Scales is hardly "gutted" just because it doesn't reflect an infinite number of projectiles anymore, the pain is mostly felt when being zergged down. And with the Force Pulse change (another stupid change), it's even easier to counter Frags w/ Scales. Is Scales expensive? Yes. But it has the power to completely shut down a sorc's burst ability at will. And while we're talking about skill costs, with Wrobel's promised cost increase Rune Prison may end up costing a comparable amount to Scales. Likewise with Defensive Stance, the fact that it's limited to one projectile isn't an issue now with the Force Pulse change. It's a cheap skill that stays up for 30 sec and can be kept up 100% against FragsHoloYoitsu wrote: »@Joy_Division
The quick answer is that there is no functional difference for Rune Cage on PTS vs Live. The new version is a stun w/ a negligible dmg component that triggers if they sit through the full duration (like Shattering Prison). The main difference is in the ease of use, not in it allowing a new combo. Everything the "nerf sorc" potatos are rambling on about with regards to "new" Rune Cage rotation for the most part ignores the fact that that same exact rotation can be used on Live - though reliably only in 1v1s since the Live version breaks on direct dmg. So if we go by their logic, then every sorc ever should be already using Rune Cage setups on Live in duels. All i can say is from what I've seen, the majority in fact don't.
On a side note, I'm so enthused to see all these people coming out of the woodwork to suddenly start towing the line that Frags CC component "needed" to be nerfed all along. It's almost as if they simply wanted sorc nerfed in some way and the second Wrobel came out with a new nerf idea that none of them had even thought of, they just gobble it up.
Let's see, here's the closest thread I can find asking specifically for a Frags CC nerf. It's from a month ago, but mhh where are all the people agreeing and saying the CC is too powerful and needs to go? Oh right, they aren't there and the vast majority agreed that this guy's complaint was a L2P issue. So mind telling me what drastically changed about sorc in the last 35 days?
Here's an idea for the whiners: if Frags CC is so ungodly OP, why don't you slot a reflect - or did you forget those existed?
Many people don't want frags nerfed, especially a *** nerf like this. They just don't want rune prison, so feel frags is a compromise.
"Ignores the fact that that same exact rotation can be used on Live." Yes, the curse> execute>cage>frags can be. But it has other uses now, i.e. against a tanky target to keep beating on them for longer if they are low on stam, as opposed to it breaking straight away. Its also usable in groups. prison definitely a buff, if it was for DKs, then it is for sorcs.
Sorc itself ame out different but both buffed and nerfed. Better than some classes...
On reflect. DK reflect has been gutted, 2 duration limits, high cost, some projectiles ignore it, and status effects still go through. Reflective stance is one projectile only, so casting it isn't the most worth, maybe next patch though.
Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »xiZeroPointix wrote: »Guys i inderstand the skill..but the specifics are unclear. Is frags getting a damage buff due to loosing its cc and does the each of the aoe shards from blast able to stun multiple targets? Maybe reduce the cast time of blast a little would help.
Nah Frags remains as it is now except it loses the CC. Blast stays the same.
#BothMorphsInstantCastIsTheAnswer
Both morphs should NOT have instant cast. Where is snipes instant cast , hmmm? Why does sorc get to have instant cast high damage abilites and no one else? Templar loses damage for instant cast, uppercut has no instant cast, and snipe has no instant cast.
No one in the right mind would use snipe in direct engagements, there are other skills better suited, like PI. Do sorcs have the option to do so or do they depend on frags (bc they are instant sometimes), Hmmmmm?
Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »xiZeroPointix wrote: »Guys i inderstand the skill..but the specifics are unclear. Is frags getting a damage buff due to loosing its cc and does the each of the aoe shards from blast able to stun multiple targets? Maybe reduce the cast time of blast a little would help.
Nah Frags remains as it is now except it loses the CC. Blast stays the same.
#BothMorphsInstantCastIsTheAnswer
Both morphs should NOT have instant cast. Where is snipes instant cast , hmmm? Why does sorc get to have instant cast high damage abilites and no one else? Templar loses damage for instant cast, uppercut has no instant cast, and snipe has no instant cast.
No one in the right mind would use snipe in direct engagements, there are other skills better suited, like PI. Do sorcs have the option to do so or do they depend on frags (bc they are instant sometimes), Hmmmmm?
Poison injection doesnt have near the damage of snipe. Not even remotely. Sorcs do have other options, many more options in fact, we have snipe and pi, end of story.
Huge nerf to sorc, there's no two ways about it. Now you need to use streak or rune cage to set up the burst. One of which is difficult to time, the other means you lose a very very valuable skill slot. You're either dropping harness, boundless, conversion, or surge/entropy to run rune cage and losing either of them is gonna hurt your build
This thread is blowing my mind right now.
What "burst" are you using CF to set up?
Curse? Not blockable - don't need to CC the target to set that one up.
Meteor? I'm going to start blocking or misting when I see the telegraph, so I'll be blocking your CF too.
Dawnbreaker? If you're using CF to land your DB, then lol. You've got it backwards.
CF is your burst. If you haven't been using those other CCs to set up and land an unblocked CF then you've been playing Sorc like a pug.