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Eye of flame has ruined pvp
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ku5h✭✭✭✭✭
✭I really don't get people who keep complaining about this ulti. It's really easy to counter and there are loads of methods posted here.
Sorry but L2P...
Only viable counter to more then one EotS is seeing it in time. If you get jumped on by more then one, there is no counter, you are dead.
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Flameheart✭✭✭✭✭Devouring Swarm has killed PvP
oops, sry my fault. That was so 2015...
Edited by Flameheart on June 1, 2017 11:34AMSometimes the prey turns and nips us... it's a small thing.
So let the snow flakes and unicorns dance alone until they melt or vanish from existence, we will finish up with those smart enough to stay in the glowing circle of love.
Selissi - CP 1k+ Redguard Stamina Nightblade (Ebonheart Pact)
Silmerel - CP 1k+ Breton Magicka Templar (Ebonheart Pact)
Sunja - CP 1k+ Dunmer Magicka Nightblade (Ebonheart Pact)
Suldreni - CP 1k+ Dunmer Magicka Dragonknight (Ebonheart Pact)
Sulhelka - CP 1k+ Altmer Magicka Sorcerer (Ebonheart Pact)
Sylundine - CP 1k+ Breton Magicka Warden (Ebonheart Pact)3 -
Sanct16✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭As long as most players in Cyro have the same movement patterns as the mobs in Skyreach, they will get farmed by organised groups. Nerfing destro ult won't change anything about that, you will just have different ultimates in your recap.- EU - Raid Leader of Banana Zerg Squad
AD | AR 50 | Sanct Fir'eheal | ex Mana DK @31.10.2015
EP | AR 50 | Sanctosaurus | Mana NB
AD | AR 44 | rekt ya | Mana NB
AD | AR 41 | Sanct Thunderstorm | Mana Sorc
EP | AR 36 | S'na'ct | Mana NB {NA}
AD | AR 29 | Captain Full Fist| Stam DK
AD | AR 29 | Sanct The Dark Phoenix| Stam Sorc
EP | AR 16 | Horny Sanct | Stam Warden
EP | AR 16 | Sánct Bánáná Sláyér | Mana DK
DC | AR 13 | ad worst faction eu | Stam Sorc
DC | AR 13 | Lagendary Sanct | Mana NB
>320.000.000 AP4 -
Banzai406✭✭Mephisto939 wrote: »There is absolutely nothing you can do when a group of flamers bomb you. It's gotten ridiculous.
Obviously your group is not built right a couple good healers can negate the bomb with there ult heal. It's always the same instead of having the right builds and group to counter a skilled PvP group ppl come here to rant. Same with sorcs shields cry you can't kill a sorcs instead of running shields breaker and speck your cp to take out shields. You all wanna know the real problem here ? Zos listens to threads like this.1 -
Banzai406✭✭When I see 4,5,6 guys running in with red circles I mist and move away, or hit an invis pot and move or whatever, its really not hard to get away from them. Situational awareness. Don't wait till the last minute.
Peeps really need to stop with the nerf bat calls on simple stuff that isn't broken.
Hate to pull this out, but it really is an L2P issue.
It's funny when these nubs stack up in the resource tower doorway and wonder why the got bombed lol1 -
STEVIL✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Carbonised wrote: »itscompton wrote: »ThePaleItalian wrote: »I find it funny when the weapon ultimates got revealed that the destro ulti got ripped apart for being useless, now people can't live without it.
If the Destro Ult, specifically EoTS, had been released the way it was originally designed on PTS it would have been useless in Cyrodiil for the most part since the DPS would have been about the same as BatSwarm but without any secondary effects like heals. What I remember from the comments on it during that PTS cycle is that most players were not happy because they wanted a strong single target ult for Destruction Staves. But of course the "fix" implemented by the Devs was not what people were asking for and so what we got was an AOE ult that is completely OP when used by coordinated groups.
Even after the latest changes it was still called a trash and useless ult, also what you are refering to what most players wanted is nothing but entirely subjective, not warrant a valid complain.
Yes, pts forums vs eots was the largest blunder we've ever seen, they've never been so wrong. Well maybe they will now, after massive whine regarding sustain nerf, we'll see about that
I see this urban legen repeated time and time over, usually with someone like you gloating with glee that "omg, the forum ragers were so wrong, how delightful".
I was on the PTS, I participated in the destro ult discussion, and here is the real facts (not the fake news you and others present whenever we discuss destro ult):
1) Most of the outrage regarding destro ult was regarding the FIRST iteration of the ultimate, one that ticked much, much slower and thus dealth much less damage per second (DPS) than the one we had now. Essentialy, Wrobel & co. acknowledged that this version of the ult was underperforming, and thus reduced the time it ticked by half, while ticking for much more damage - thus increasing the DPS of the skill. So all the "forum rage" you describe wasn't directed at the current version, it was directed at the first version, which was indeed much less viable in PvP.
2) Most of the outrage regarding destro ult wasn't directed against Eye of the Storm morph. Many people acknowledged that it had potential in PvP (after it got buffed to the second version, that is, the first version of Eye was still a poor man's bats). The outrage was actually directed at the other morph, the non-moving one. And counting number by number, that morph of destro ult STILL does LESS overall damage than several other popular ults, such as DK Banner and Shooting Star. Hence those ults are STILL better in most PvE environments, especially since they come with lots of secondary effects that Destro ult does not have. Arguably destro ult in most PvE scenarios is therefore outperformed by other ults.
3) We have since had (much needed) buffs to destro staff that also became buffs to destro ult, for instance the lightning staff increase of all AOE damage. That was NOT present at the time destro ult was tested on PTS.
This you need to take into consideration before rubbing your sweaty hands together in glee over all the stupid PTS people who were so wrong about destro ult. Fact is, the Rage morph is still mediocre at best in a PvE environment, and the Eye morph's only saving grace is its large area and the fact that it follows the player.
If anything, the area for the Eye morph only could be reduced a bit further (it has already been reduced once), or the Eye morph could have a more slow damage build up (keeping overall total damage, but decreasing the speed in which it is delivered), something of a middle ground between the 1st PTS version of Eye and the 2nd one we have now.
This alone would do much to silence the destro ult PvP whiners.
The other morph, Rage, should be left as is, all the main concerns from the PTS still apply to that one.
#ALTSPIN
none of what you say changes anything about the claims.
yes, most of the outrage was directed at the first version, cuz you know it was around longer and was there when the PTS first started... so it got the initial "let down" and the initial "blow up" in addition to the benefit of time.
In addition when the half time dbl dmg hit there was a quite strong outrage over how stupid it was this did not change the problem which was damage done etc... there was no happy happy joy joy when the half and double change hit.
Also, while yes the opinions were divided as to which was worse, the pvp or the pve versions, there was not any sort of happy joy over the pvp version as it was still looked at as more damage from other ults against the high cost.
Finally, the real rage over the ulti in its current form after release when it started being seen in play was before the staff increases, not after, which you did not specifically say but definitely led down the path towards. if you look back when the staff changes themselves went in (well after the ulti released) you will see the double outrage over how this buffed the destro ultis.
So, not seeing the #Fake News you are... well, not the same fake news at least. More like now seeing revisionist history.Proudly skooma free while talks-when-drunk is in mandatory public housing.
YFMV Your Fun May Vary.
First Law of Nerf-o-Dynamics
"The good way I used to get good kills *with good skill* was good but the way others kill me now is bad."1 -
wazzz56✭✭✭✭✭Sheezabeast wrote: »The direct counter would be to use Negate
A skill that everyone has access to (even some stamina builds run it on their back bar) can be countered by a class specific ultimate
Balance
barrier.........GM Tig Ole Critties ps5 NA small scale PvP guild
"After a hard week of farming, or a long night of being nagged by your wife, there is nothing better than going out for a bit of a fish."1 -
Qbiken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »Avran_Sylt wrote: »To all those talking about not running into the big read circle: Streak. I roll-dodge, they streak to me. roll-dodge doesn't negate ground targeted AoE. I can't root them since they've got an immovability pot on them. I try and cloak to vanish and evade them but the AoE knocks me outta stealth.
I'd assume the same would be an issue for a magNB using Lotus Fan to keep up.
If you could stun them,root them, knock them back, yeah, there's conuterplay. but if you can't move them in any manner, and they can dash to your location, you gotta hope you're tanky or can heal through it.
Also, I haven't tested it, but if you bar a lightning staff on one bar, fire on another, use the fire destro ulti, then swap to the lightning staff, is the ulti damage still increased on top of the 8% AoE damage increase from the lightning staff?
Immovable potions don't stop roots.
Nightblades have the best ultimate to counter a destro ult. Just slot it and hold onto it just in case. This ultimate is called Bolstering Darkness. It gives 60% damage reduction to you and 30% to everyone. It has a great heal for teammates and 70% snare to enemies. From reading on here (not you in particular) everyone want to run their build without changing anything and just nerf this ultimate so they can when a easy change can help so much.
It's strong. It's expensive. I get it but damn. Any nightblade not running Bolstering Darkness hads no right to complain about destro ultimates.
You think bolstering will counter eots.... smh. 30% mitigation wont save your allies, 60% might but its still not enough in group vs group situations.
The correct ultimate a nightblade could use is Soul Siphon. A 15k burst heal with a 30k HoT and 4 second Major Vitality. This ultimate will save you and your allies.
However you cant ignore the fact Eye of the Storm is blatantly overpowered and abused by the player base because its too strong. This is like when proxi was overbuffed all over again. Anyone defending it does not know what good game balance is.
Anyone not agreeing with you have no clue about what they´re talking about???
Got to love that logic.....
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Sinolai✭✭✭✭✭The issue is battlegrounds really. Sure in Cyrodiil it's a pain but there are more ways around. In battlegrounds your all squished into this area so something with that field of effect and ratio or just way to much. And it isn't just Eye of the flame, the other morph is becoming problematic too.
so far I havent seen a single eye of flame in bg. The cost is so high it has no place in there. Even if someone used it he would not be popping it very often.0 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭When the skill was first released, it was a glorious time when this would be a common occurrence:
and
But Charles Darwin was right. Those who didn't whine and quit have adapted and have gotten much better at not being a nub and dying to this ultimate. It has become noticeably harder to kill people and groups with the destro ult who know what they are doing.
If it's one bomber, you have quite a few options available to you. The first step is always the same, move *away* from any teammate because the bomber's Viscous Death set is what is going to kill you more often than the actual destro ulti. Once you moved away, usually the best strategy is to burn down the bomber, because they are squishy, 100% focused on offense, and not chasing after you because bombers will target the nubs who didn't follow step one and move away.
If it's one person who isn't a bomb build and just happens to use the destro ult (example: tanky templar), their destro won't do enough damage to kill you unless you're pretty much already dead.
If it's the "pain train" overlapping destro bomb group, you need to have a modicum of situational awareness and not chase the "fleeing" stack on crown group through that choke point because they are going to turn around and drop a negate + roots which will make you dead without you being able to do much about it. That death is on you for being dumb; it's not the game's or Wrobel's fault. In an open field scenario where no choke point exists, it is easy as pie to simply move out of the way which is all that needs to be done because as one poster colorfully noted, stack on crown bomb groups are akin to dogs on a leash.
Make Rush of Agony "Monsters only." People should not be consecutively crowd controlled in a PvP setting. Period.0 -
GreenSoup2HoT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »Avran_Sylt wrote: »To all those talking about not running into the big read circle: Streak. I roll-dodge, they streak to me. roll-dodge doesn't negate ground targeted AoE. I can't root them since they've got an immovability pot on them. I try and cloak to vanish and evade them but the AoE knocks me outta stealth.
I'd assume the same would be an issue for a magNB using Lotus Fan to keep up.
If you could stun them,root them, knock them back, yeah, there's conuterplay. but if you can't move them in any manner, and they can dash to your location, you gotta hope you're tanky or can heal through it.
Also, I haven't tested it, but if you bar a lightning staff on one bar, fire on another, use the fire destro ulti, then swap to the lightning staff, is the ulti damage still increased on top of the 8% AoE damage increase from the lightning staff?
Immovable potions don't stop roots.
Nightblades have the best ultimate to counter a destro ult. Just slot it and hold onto it just in case. This ultimate is called Bolstering Darkness. It gives 60% damage reduction to you and 30% to everyone. It has a great heal for teammates and 70% snare to enemies. From reading on here (not you in particular) everyone want to run their build without changing anything and just nerf this ultimate so they can when a easy change can help so much.
It's strong. It's expensive. I get it but damn. Any nightblade not running Bolstering Darkness hads no right to complain about destro ultimates.
You think bolstering will counter eots.... smh. 30% mitigation wont save your allies, 60% might but its still not enough in group vs group situations.
The correct ultimate a nightblade could use is Soul Siphon. A 15k burst heal with a 30k HoT and 4 second Major Vitality. This ultimate will save you and your allies.
However you cant ignore the fact Eye of the Storm is blatantly overpowered and abused by the player base because its too strong. This is like when proxi was overbuffed all over again. Anyone defending it does not know what good game balance is.
Anyone not agreeing with you have no clue about what they´re talking about???
Got to love that logic.....
Who said people have to agree with me? I said if anyone thinks this ultimate is balanced dont know what balance is. Two different things.PS4 NA DC2 -
Docmandu✭✭✭✭✭
✭As long as most players in Cyro have the same movement patterns as the mobs in Skyreach, they will get farmed by organised groups. Nerfing destro ult won't change anything about that, you will just have different ultimates in your recap.
Don't know which one is more skill-less... the pug / zerg surfer that gets caught by gap close+CC+ 20 man organized AoE, or the 20-man organized group that AoE bombs pugs.
I would say the latter, since that can be done while watching netflix...
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brtomkin✭✭✭While I don't agree that this ultimate has a catastrophic effect on PVP, I do think that this ultimate is overperforming when compared to other ultimate abilities. It doesn't need an overhaul... simply a tweak. My suggestion would be to do ONE of the following:
1. Increase cost to 325
-or-
2. Shorten duration to 5 seconds
-or-
3. Decrease radius to 7m
PS5 NA: Pickmans__Model, CP 2600+0 -
kuro-dono✭✭✭✭also. you need to be able to negate the ultimate when negated. atm, negate does nothing to to it. it can be used preemptive but not after the ultimate has been activated.
gab closing with it should not work either.Edited by kuro-dono on June 1, 2017 3:23PM0 -
Olupajmibanan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I could laugh at destro ult bombers with Remembrance before. But, now with this stupid, nerf templar focused update, the damage reduction for allies has been taken away of this ultimate. Really stupid, now we can just kneel before the almighty destro ult.0 -
Warraxx✭✭✭✭✭ALERT! someone died in Cyrodiil...
Right?
And there was nothing, and I mean NOTHING anyone could have possibly done. There was literally no conceivable way the poster or his starchy allies could have:
- Cast major expedition
- Thrown down AOE heals
- Cast stone giant on the guy with the ulti and walked away
- Cast a damage shield
- Used talons, encase, caltrops or fossilize on the caster and moved
- Killed the guy in center of the red circle
- Roll dodged
+Quick Cloak0 -
apostate9✭✭✭✭✭Avran_Sylt wrote: »Avran_Sylt wrote: »To all those talking about not running into the big read circle: Streak. I roll-dodge, they streak to me. roll-dodge doesn't negate ground targeted AoE. I can't root them since they've got an immovability pot on them. I try and cloak to vanish and evade them but the AoE knocks me outta stealth.
I'd assume the same would be an issue for a magNB using Lotus Fan to keep up.
If you could stun them,root them, knock them back, yeah, there's conuterplay. but if you can't move them in any manner, and they can dash to your location, you gotta hope you're tanky or can heal through it.
Also, I haven't tested it, but if you bar a lightning staff on one bar, fire on another, use the fire destro ulti, then swap to the lightning staff, is the ulti damage still increased on top of the 8% AoE damage increase from the lightning staff?
Immovable potions don't stop roots.
Nightblades have the best ultimate to counter a destro ult. Just slot it and hold onto it just in case. This ultimate is called Bolstering Darkness. It gives 60% damage reduction to you and 30% to everyone. It has a great heal for teammates and 70% snare to enemies. From reading on here (not you in particular) everyone want to run their build without changing anything and just nerf this ultimate so they can when a easy change can help so much.
It's strong. It's expensive. I get it but damn. Any nightblade not running Bolstering Darkness hads no right to complain about destro ultimates.
Are you sure immovable pots don't stop roots? It says in the tooltip that it makes you immune to knockback and disabling effects. Roots do disable movement, so I'd think they fall under that category. Though I can't say I've readily tested it.
He is correct. Root/Snare is not a disabling effect, in this context. You can root the caster even if s/he has an immovable pot. Note that roots NOW have an immunity timer of their own, but this is not impacted by immovable.1 -
InvitationNotFound✭✭✭✭✭
✭also. you need to be able to negate the ultimate when negated. atm, negate does nothing to to it. it can be used preemptive but not after the ultimate has been activated.
gab closing with it should not work either.
hey foxey
If you want to go that way it should negate other ultis as well (e.g. templar heal ulti, which keeps on working when activated before the negate hits, etc.). Otherwise I wouldn't see a reason why negate should negate only a few ultis and not all. but i doubt that negating running ultis would be a good idea anyway.We want firing off Dark Exchange in the middle of combat to feel awesome... - The Wrobler
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Hammy01✭✭✭✭✭I'm still confused on how a bus got into this thread and what is has to do with pvp? Not to mention, what type of bus is it... a yellow bus, Greyhound bus, or maybe a small bus that should actually be called a van?0 -
Mephisto939✭✭✭✭To reiterate, the problem isn't with single players running the ult. The problem is with coordinated EOTS groups. Half a dozen players cap a resource, hide in tower and then AP farm the people recapturing it by kicking off 3-4 eots simultaneously. It's cheesey as hell. Somehow I doubt this is what the devs had in mind.Why did the Dunmer cross the road?
Apparently to get stuck in an eternal load screen!0 -
Trashkan✭✭✭Lol it's all I got against 2h macro who hits you 5 times before you can blink. C'mon fix the **** that needs to be fixed like the realism of a 2h swinging faster than any other weapon in the game before you start in on this.
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Bouldercleave✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I really don't get people who keep complaining about this ulti. It's really easy to counter and there are loads of methods posted here.
Sorry but L2P...
Well they have to complain about SOMETHING. May as well be this. Next week it'll be something else.
Edited by Bouldercleave on June 2, 2017 3:06PM0 -
Bramir✭✭✭✭I've dodge rolled out of more eyes than I can count. Keep your head up and roll as soon as the zerg ball gets near you. If you are trying to meet it head-on, therein lies your problem.
Dodge roll out of the way...drop your own eye (or even better...a negate) on them and laugh at their inability to be effective against a spread out enemy despite their supposed 'organization'.0 -
RedJoker✭✭✭I used to qq about Eye of Flame the first few times I died to it, but in retrospect it really was a l2p issue for me. There are viable counters, and now I rarely die. At one time I wanted ZOS to nerf or remove the ultimate, but not anymore. Although I don't use it myself, Eye of Flame is part of a legit playstyle, and keeps the game interesting.0 -
Flameheart wrote: »Devouring Swarm has killed PvP
oops, sry my fault. That was so 2015...
Hey u leave my Bat Nukes out of this. I still bat nuke fools......0
