Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Minsc wrote: »

The issue with a stamina morph of Stone fist is that it will return partially its own cost via the Earthen heart passives so I don't think it's very likely they will do it

or they could put in an exception to that rule for that skill but like all things programming its probably super complicated and will result in DKs being able to fly.

Replace the dragon scale morph that gives you minor ward, with a reflect that allows you to also fly for the duration

I want the pre 1.5 inferno back this "new" version is pretty much useless.

Kova wrote: »

LorDrek wrote: »

actosh wrote: »

Awesome, we are the only Class without a usefull execute wich will force us to use either 2 hand, or find another way to burn *** down. U could have done stonefist as a finisher with 2 morphd (stam/Mag) that cant be reflected like meteor, but whatever.

Sad to see there are no real buffs to stam dk´s, so we still are a weaponline user with 1 or 2 classskills.....

Need to test more since this is the first reaction, and provide more detailed feedback then.

Have a nice day

True, sramina dk is now crap.

Not to argue over it, but did you two avoid pvp for the last three months? Stam DK kind of ruled with an iron fist. Also, ALL stamina classes besides stamblades are weapon based builds. There are classes decided by magicka builds and then there is the "stamina class" in which actual class just means what utilities you get with your 2hander/bow/dualwield(i.e. leap, streak, stealth, or...well templar has jabs..I guess...)

I haven't lost a single duel or 1v1 on my stamDK except against better stamDKs. I think the community places too much importance on execute skills and not enough on executing skills.

That being said, I'm sooo happy with the magicka and hybrid dk buffs. There are some great players who stuck with magicka dk and will probably be top shelf in this patch.

Slow clap

phillyproduct wrote: »

Kova wrote: »

LorDrek wrote: »

actosh wrote: »

Awesome, we are the only Class without a usefull execute wich will force us to use either 2 hand, or find another way to burn *** down. U could have done stonefist as a finisher with 2 morphd (stam/Mag) that cant be reflected like meteor, but whatever.

Sad to see there are no real buffs to stam dk´s, so we still are a weaponline user with 1 or 2 classskills.....

Need to test more since this is the first reaction, and provide more detailed feedback then.

Have a nice day

True, sramina dk is now crap.

Not to argue over it, but did you two avoid pvp for the last three months? Stam DK kind of ruled with an iron fist. Also, ALL stamina classes besides stamblades are weapon based builds. There are classes decided by magicka builds and then there is the "stamina class" in which actual class just means what utilities you get with your 2hander/bow/dualwield(i.e. leap, streak, stealth, or...well templar has jabs..I guess...)

I haven't lost a single duel or 1v1 on my stamDK except against better stamDKs. I think the community places too much importance on execute skills and not enough on executing skills.

That being said, I'm sooo happy with the magicka and hybrid dk buffs. There are some great players who stuck with magicka dk and will probably be top shelf in this patch.

Slow clap

I'm sorry we're forced to cycle through every class and non class ability and potions to make ourselves viable. Tell me if I am wrong in any of these points.

I will list every ability that made stamina DK what it is and tell me which one of these did not get hit...

for dps and even some tanks... stamina DK we're forced to use shuffle because as a class we lack mobility and that help keeps us from being snared while adding a nice 20 percent miss chance helping with survivability. We mitigated damage with dodging even with the stacking cost we made sure we could always break free/dodge with careful resource management. Thats part of the complaint with infinite resource, to the eyes of an trained player you would know they're just playing smarter than you.

Thankfully it cost stamina was probably met for stamina nightblade due to it being transparent and elusive and all. Sneaky builds. But we found a way cause thats just how us DKs are (not the reroller into DK but the ones who stick with it cause thats the class that suits them the most) refusing to be beat into the ground.

We used vigor, an alliance skill due to lack of class skill heal its intention was probably to help group pvp... we still lack a class skill heal limited only to mag DK none our heals come close to 25k burst heal in 8.5 seconds which translate into 3k heals each second(25k/8.5=3k but its a crit! ok 20k/8.5= 2.4 plus DoT ) FROM ONE skill not to mention INHALE on 6 targets. But I will stop on the Mag DK as im not trying to get them nerfed just got carried away.

So we used igneous shield found it to have synergy with all other heals and the most useful heal is rally that we're pretty much forced to use... and the 3k shield on 20k hp and traded some magicka for a heal increase. Now reduced by 5 percent.

We used reflective scales to help our dps with 20k+ shields of a sorc,we couldnt keep the scales up for ever we are limited to maybe 3 cast on a 9k pool so it required careful management if you lost to a stamina DK even with all of the classes disadvantages thats because he played better than you... like it should be...... it took alot of know how to be able to reflect instant frags so how did a sorc fight us prox det>curse>streak>prox det>curse>steak ad nauseam. So 20k shields how else are we supposed to get through them without WB spam???

Thats if i was able to get close enough and around the daedric mines while being bursted... Daedric mines can now be placed where you want them. We had all of the disadvantages yet if we are good enough we can still beat the sorc... like it should be.

But if the playing field was equal they would crap their pants like they did with the reflect on meteors. Now they're afraid if Stamina DK get a buff or anything ...the already battle harden good players that helped make that class viable before will be really good. But in reality we're just so used to playing with disadvantages that it would amplify our skill ever more.

but they got a proxy det buff along side an unreflectable meteor... i guess the DoT from our 2 stamina class morphs is going to make up the difference on our already tight bar of viable abilities.

Some of us paid the price of green dragons blood for the 20 percent stamina regen cause we had to use pots for something else like to detect the ever disappearing nightblade.

Most of us had to focus on one weapon, and have a buff bar to make up for our weaknesses... while sorcs get 3 bars with overload with a 10k light attack, can stack solely DPS and have High DEFENSE, With HIGH mobility, AND HIGH RANGED damaged that hits as hard or even HARDER than WB do not even get me started on overload light attacks hitting harder than WB... from a range and instant cast.

Their arguement just WB>Take flight.... even though take flight is an ultimate and has to used at the right moment or risk wasted an ultimate LIKE meteor USED TO BE.

thankfully overload can still be reflected i can almost hear them "ultimates shouldn't be reflectable!" it was balanced... now magicka DK will have access to all weapon abilities and class abilities and still be viable.

What made us strong with the 2h is wrecking blow with out that we would be in the same boat as mag DK last patch... ransack cancel... with out those two skills to give us the burst dps what would we do? unstable flames>take flight?

Or abuse the fixed bug reverb bash>take flight?

What a lovely day to vote!
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/246023/do-you-think-battle-spirit-should-affect-health-percentage-based-skills

The changes look great, besides the fact we do not have an execute.

Bromburak wrote: »

With exception of Stonefist, I actually don't like the changes.
Or lets put it that way in comparison to my Stamina DK it just doesn't offer enough for my play style.

Healing:
We have some nice passives to increase heals, but I am missing a good self heal.
Ember has a great heal but is out of DKs control since it only heals after the dot effect ends.
Imo it's much better to stick with Vigor, with Magicka I am forced to play with a heal stick.

Burst single spell:
I am missing ranged direct damage spells, I am NOT expecting crystal frag like output but at least some skills going in a similar direction. Stonefist goes in the right direction but I would not play Magicka DK just because of one really useful skill.

Dots:
There are 2 issues with Dots, one is just a personal thing, I just don't like the way how dots are implemented in ESO,
I guess I am spoiled by Cabalist in DAOC. A well designed dot class, imo a role model in gaming.

The second thing and most important from PvP perspective, dots are a very uncertain source of damage,
because until they really hit hard they have been purged and outhealed already.
Generally there is nothing wrong with that, but since all cleanse, purge skills in ESO are ridiculous cheap to use it makes dots a questionable mechanic in ESO.

Of course I do see improvements for Magicka class, from my perspective it just doesn't feel finished and it's not fun to play in comparison to my Stamina DK.

I agree with the dots, they are not strong enough to out dps the heals which in this case they would need to be around 3k ticks or rather 1.5k for one dot .... to make it viable.

My general thoughts:

- Inner light will still be chosen over inferno due to the fact that spell critical and max magicka are more attractive than just a fireball that needs to be activated to do damage once every 5 seconds. I personally thought that Inferno will be the DK's execute, since all damage comes from Ardent Flame tree. You changed one Templar skill from a miss chance to an execute, i am sure inferno can be changed to an execute.

- Leap and both morphs still deal physical damage, giving only stamina builds a major advantage on this. You sai dback in Update 5 that ultimates will scale from either max magicka or max stamina, that may techically apply here, but with the CP system stamina builds will just deal more damage period.

- Corrosive armour still ignores physical resistance, once again leaning towards stamina builds only. It would only make sense to make it ignore physical and spell resistance to make it work well for magicka builds as well.

- Whip got no buffs, either morph, the main magicka DK burst dps and only burst skill we have. It needs a buff no matter which way you look at it.

- Molten Weapons group buff renders spell power potions and any class gaining major sorcery or major brutality virtually useless. A tank in the dungeon can keep it up 100% of the time, keep restoring 5% of their stamina and giving minor brutality to the whole group. So as a magicka DK, what potion should i use? Major proficey can not be used to due inner light being slotted (the critical chance) and with the Tank using it (or myself) major sorcery is also not needed from potions, so basically only a restore magicka posion can be used. Maybe make molten weapons when activated to act like an execute, meaning for x seconds deal more damage with all flame based skills to low health targets up to 300% (all executes do this, do not be shocked to see the numbers) if you choose not to change inferno.


- Chocking talons still deals physical damage, so when i off tank in dungeons im loosing out here, the 15% debuff is nice indeed, but with burning talons dealing flame damage and scaling of elemental expert it makes sense to favor this over chocking which deals physical and will scale off mighty.

- Shifting standard is cheaper, but standard of might got no changes, still a 30% healing debuff, 20% more damage and 20% less damage taken while in the banner with a very expensive 250 ulti cost. Bring it back to 50% healing debuff and 30% more damage with 30% less damage taken and maybe a 200 ulti cost (the way it used to be), sounds a bit much, but if DKs still do not get an execute class skill, we need some sort of ulti that just hits harder than any ulti out there, especially for pvp when one dodge roll will save them and we are stuck sitting in our own banner. You gave templars rune to continue its effect for 8 seconds when they leave their rune, maybe apply something similar to standard of might maybe.

- Eruption now deals more initial damage when cast, which is nice, but still really really miss having the dodge chance with no mobility skills. Major evation while in the ash cloud is still something i would really like to see return. Almost every stamina build in pvp will use shuffle/evation, and stamian builds have really cheap cost and super high regen (3K+) and still able to get over 3.3K weapon damage.

This is what i can think of at the moment.

If DK is meant to tickle someone to death, then add the "reduce enemy's healing taken" to Whip. This effect could then be removed from standard and maybe make standard of might a bit cheaper than 250 ult.

As a magicka DK atm, I couldn't care less about making molten whip into a stamina morph. Maybe then it would be useful to someone.
Why though would you want stam fiery grip? S+S and 2h have wonderful gapclosers.

Why are DK's so hosed by elevation? I also play Templar, and temp has no elevation issue -- toppling charge can go up or down. NB's don't have elevation issue on ambush or lotus fan -- mine goes up and down just fine. The DK chains are useless when everyone is not on a perfectly flat surface, making them useless to slot. If they want to protect keep walls (dumb choice by ZOS, in my view, but whatever), make the walls immune and nothing else. Give us a WORKING gap closer.

RoamingRiverElk wrote: »

Dragon Leap is still the only ultimate in the game that cannot be activated while rooted. -.-

I would not change the damage type of Ferocious Leap to flame damage from physical damage, because that would hurt stamina DKs which are already getting nerfed due to igneous being nerfed, and the introduction of the physical resistance CP star. The other morph of Dragon Leap... is not really worth using imo. Mostly I see it being used either by someone who really likes to fly far (mostly just for how awesome that is... fluff reasons, that is). In PvP, that morph is chosen to be able to leap into keeps at certain few places that still are possible. But aside from those couple of very specific reasons, I really think that morph is vastly inferior to getting a 50% damage shield based on your health.

I use Ferocious Leap both on my stam and magicka dk. The only difference though, is that on my stam dk it's much more likely that I can use it exactly when I want, because on magicka dk I can't always afford to dodge roll to get out of the root when I would need that the most - and that it deals less damage on a magicka dk. (Using purge for getting rid of the root just isn't as efficient because it takes more time in a situation where it really would be crucial to be able to leap to get resources back and to get that damage shield) Stam DKs do need the physical damage from the ultimate though for being able to finish enemies off with that + execute.

Take flight is the better morph ^^

I still think dk passives are lacking a bit, we need some type of wpn/spell dmg in there or some regen like every other class seems to have.

Seriously elder dragon and scaled armour is so useless. Hp regen? 2500 spell resist?

Change the hp regen to mag/stam regen. Give it a flat amount like 10% or something. Also for scaled give us both physical + spell resist and boost it up to 4k or something.