Bolt Escape is overpowered

NordJitsu · May 2014

Soloeus wrote: »

THEN WHEN EVERYONE LEAVES THE GAME BECAUSE NOBODY FINDS THEIR CHARACTERS FUN ANYMORE YOU WILL BE HAPPY?

Nah. They'll simply move on and ruin the next game.

andreas.rudroffb16_ESO · May 2014

ErilAq wrote: »

Someone runs from me: class is OP nerf it.
Someone kills me: class is OP nerf it.
Someone outwits me: class is OP nerf it.
I kill someone: LOLOLOL L2P NEWB.

the force is strong in this one

Soloeus · May 2014

NordJitsu wrote: »

Soloeus wrote: »

THEN WHEN EVERYONE LEAVES THE GAME BECAUSE NOBODY FINDS THEIR CHARACTERS FUN ANYMORE YOU WILL BE HAPPY?

Nah. They'll simply move on and ruin the next game.

Exactly. These kind of players always want everyone else "weakened" down to their level. I am surprised they haven't asked for nerfs on "Skill" (not "skills" but talent at playing).

Die to a vamp? OP.

Die to a sorc? OP.

Die to a Dunmer? OP.

This is the logic that destroys a game; people build a character they enjoy, then they are forced out of that by having it reduced to nothing. Then they find a game which enables a playstyle they DO enjoy rather than blocking it.

Thechemicals · May 2014

Its a unique and fun skill for a class that needs it and makes sense to have.

The use of immovable or right/left click break-out can eliminate an aggressive stun bolter. One of the big weaknesses for the sorcerer that requires him to have a means to escape is not only the squishyness but that at this moment the dragonknight and Templar class have hard counters to their best spells (backlash and reflective scale) plus other skills that negate magic. These same classes Dk and templar also have the ability to spot heal through damage and continue engaging an enemy with Dragonblood+more and the templar resto tree naturallly. The sorcerer however,needs to look elsewhere for heals or stand in place to channel a recovery of health/magicka. His surge needs to be groomed to efficiency so alternative heals as well.

As most who run into Sorcerer's can see,all sorcerers are using either crystal shards or Mages fury, single target spells. As mentioned above,skill trees have very hard counter to sorcerers and even a gear set "storms" can reflect spells and give resistance against them. The sorcerer can be surprised with considerable damage that is his own reflection of spells being used against him.

For this reason, the class excels at mobility, as most wizard classes have been designed so, in all games. It is a cerebral and quick playing class that does require some forethought when engaging a target(s). It is also meant to be tricky and challenging to fight a sorcerer.

So to cover it all, bolt escape as an offensive tool can be hard countered with certain skills and regular breakout countering. Bolt escape as an escape skill is not an attack that requires a counter. It does feel bad that you couldnt catch the fleeing sorcerer but he is in fact fleeing you, and besides you have bigger fights ahead of you in Cyrodiil.

P.S also, this game isnt designed to be a 1v1 fight so try not to base your opinions on what is overpowered just on that experience.

Neferath · May 2014

@Thechemicals

Thank you for that one.

Nooblet · May 2014

Valn wrote: »

I just saw someone bolt escape through a pack of us and actually got away rofl. he used immovable and managed to get away from about 8 of us, we couldnt get on our horses because we were in combat.

no class should be able to escape any situation. but it seems bolt escape is the number 1 skill if you want to get away, no other class has a better escape ability and for this reason its unbalanced. anyone defending this has obviously never played pvp.

A DK can tank better than I can as a sorc.
A templar has more heal options.
A NB..... is far better at being bugged? Lol sorry.

Point is, things will never be equal.

You can have unique skills keeping things interesting and fun, or you can have 100% identical characters. Granted some tweeks can be made.. but to say one class can do something better than another is intended.

Biggest issue I had with daoc over the years(other than toa) was that eventually nothing was really unique. Every realm specific thing that made things interesting was added to the others.

Insignia91 · May 2014

Also all my heals are OP I shouldn't be able to stay alive while questing. NERF!!!

Syndy · May 2014

Nooblet wrote: »

Valn wrote: »

I just saw someone bolt escape through a pack of us and actually got away rofl. he used immovable and managed to get away from about 8 of us, we couldnt get on our horses because we were in combat.

no class should be able to escape any situation. but it seems bolt escape is the number 1 skill if you want to get away, no other class has a better escape ability and for this reason its unbalanced. anyone defending this has obviously never played pvp.

A DK can tank better than I can as a sorc.
A templar has more heal options.
A NB..... is far better at being bugged? Lol sorry.

Point is, things will never be equal.

You can have unique skills keeping things interesting and fun, or you can have 100% identical characters. Granted some tweeks can be made.. but to say one class can do something better than another is intended.

Biggest issue I had with daoc over the years(other than toa) was that eventually nothing was really unique. Every realm specific thing that made things interesting was added to the others.

Where did people say they wanted every class to be the same? The classes as they are now, even w/o bolt escape have enough to make them unique from each other.

Also You are right things will never be equal because right now there is a class that has an ability that makes it unkillable by the other 3. Until they fix that, things won't be equal.

I understand that my class will have a counter in another class(es), I know what those abilities are and I know if someone uses them against me I am going to have a rough time.

A sorc does not have these issues, ANY circumstance that looks like a rough time they can auto escape from without 3 other classes having a chance to stop him. Immovable + bolt Escape makes you unkillable.

Nooblet · May 2014

Odd I die all the time. And I kill other sorc all the time ( not even counting using bolt escape to catch them) we must all be bad.

Syndy · May 2014

Nooblet wrote: »

Odd I die all the time. And I kill other sorc all the time ( not even counting using bolt escape to catch them) we must all be bad.

I am going to go with, Yes.

Asava · May 2014

Nooblet wrote: »

Odd I die all the time. And I kill other sorc all the time ( not even counting using bolt escape to catch them) we must all be bad.

Obviously we are baddies Nooblet since they always have to turn the zerg on our 8-10 man to put us down. I guess we should start crying for enemy players in the same area nerf next then since fighting 3-1 odds isn't in our favor and we can't faceroll them all.

BugCollector · May 2014

As a Templar, I say Bolt Escape is fine. If you don't want the enemy Sorcerer to flee, just stun him, or get your horse to 100% speed.

Syndy · May 2014

Asava wrote: »

Nooblet wrote: »

Odd I die all the time. And I kill other sorc all the time ( not even counting using bolt escape to catch them) we must all be bad.

Obviously we are baddies Nooblet since they always have to turn the zerg on our 8-10 man to put us down. I guess we should start crying for enemy players in the same area nerf next then since fighting 3-1 odds isn't in our favor and we can't faceroll them all.

I am starting to wonder if you even read the posts in this thread. The point is every class has to deal with those 3v1 odds and stay and fight. Sorcs can run, and there is nothing the other classes can do about it.

BugCollector wrote: »

As a Templar, I say Bolt Escape is fine. If you don't want the enemy Sorcerer to flee, just stun him, or get your horse to 100% speed.

Again Please read the thread before posting. Both of your "solutions" are laughable.
1) Immovable, since sorcs have no other use of stamina.
2) The fastest horse has a max speed of 74%, and it's not like you can mount up in combat or anything.

Asava · May 2014

No, you choose to engage in a fight then are stuck with it when you want to turn tail. The other classes also have the ability to stay in a fight and live thru a KD/stun which a light sorc can not do. If I get caught in a fight with melee then I am dead a majority of the time. I've died quite a few times while bolting away. Everyone has the ability to hide, so choose your fights carefully. If a sorc is running then they aren't killing you. Now if you said that a sorc can cast elemental ring and wipe 30 people while everyone's attacking them but they won't die then I'd say that is way broken like dk/vamps were. But running away is not OP'd. What's next, nerf sprinting cuz you were out of stamina?

Syndy · May 2014

Asava wrote: »

No, you choose to engage in a fight then are stuck with it when you want to turn tail. The other classes also have the ability to stay in a fight and live thru a KD/stun which a light sorc can not do. If I get caught in a fight with melee then I am dead a majority of the time. I've died quite a few times while bolting away. Everyone has the ability to hide, so choose your fights carefully. If a sorc is running then they aren't killing you. Now if you said that a sorc can cast elemental ring and wipe 30 people while everyone's attacking them but they won't die then I'd say that is way broken like dk/vamps were. But running away is not OP'd. What's next, nerf sprinting cuz you were out of stamina?

Umm, no...

If someone attempts to gank you (sorc), and they do not kill you instantly, you can get away. See Immovable, and Learn to Break out of K/Ds...

If Templar gets ganked, he has to fight.

If DK gets ganked, he has to fight.

If NB gets ganked, he can try to run, but can fail because there are CC counters to his escape. Magelight, Root.

That is what I and many others are stating.

There needs to be a Counter for Bolt Escape or it needs to be adjusted to not be a Get out of Jail Free Spam ability.

Whats the point of PvPing as another class if I could play one class and always choose which fights I wanted to fight in and which I didn't? Never find yourself helpless in a bad situation with no escape that all the other classes have to deal with...

Balael · May 2014

Bolt escape is absolutely fine, the constant nerf whine in MMO's is really getting old. It's like a disease that all the bads from wow have been spreading around since 2004.

JessieColt · May 2014

If you get knocked off your horse, feed your horse to improve its stamina, just like the tooltip says to.

Syndy · May 2014

bradleyreesb16_ESO wrote: »

Bolt escape is absolutely fine, the constant nerf whine in MMO's is really getting old. It's like a disease that all the bads from wow have been spreading around since 2004.

Thank you for your invaluable feedback and contribution to the thread.

dbennett707cub18_ESO · May 2014

I honestly would like to see it tweaked a little at first, frustrating to see a dude with roots around his feet still warping around the battlefield. As a Sorc, I even feel this ability is a bit much, PvP is very low risk for me and unless something goes horribly wrong, I never feel like wandering into almost any situation is that dangerous, and I don't think that's right. But before outright nerfing of the skill, id like to see it counter-able by some others first. Like perharps snares reducing the jump distance and roots stopping the jump all together.

Zarec · May 2014

dbennett707cub18_ESO wrote: »

I honestly would like to see it tweaked a little at first, frustrating to see a dude with roots around his feet still warping around the battlefield. As a Sorc, I even feel this ability is a bit much, PvP is very low risk for me and unless something goes horribly wrong, I never feel like wandering into almost any situation is that dangerous, and I don't think that's right. But before outright nerfing of the skill, id like to see it counter-able by some others first. Like perharps snares reducing the jump distance and roots stopping the jump all together.

I don't agree with it being used while rooted but I also think that is the only real change needed for it.

cucmw5ub17_ESO · May 2014

If Blink had no cooldown in WoW, there'd be a nearly universal outrage from all classes that weren't a Mage.

Knock the game if you want, but it kinda has been doing pvp balancing for 10 years as opposed to this game =p

Kn1ghtmare · May 2014

Make a CD between bolts, or make a longer one if CD is already present, problem solved.

Neferath · May 2014

I still dont get why it is such a huge problem for you all if somebody has the chance to get away from a fight. Honestly i mean he "is getting away from the fight". He isnt dealing any damage and isnt stunning or rooting you (at least i failed to notice any affect of the 2 sec stun wich actually should be dealt to nearby enemies with bolt escape).

All what happens is that you arent able to gank that poor guy who is trying to escape, so what? There are dozens of other players out there you actually are able to gank and kill. Go on for them and get over it.

Besides that, i see many sorc dying while trying to bolt escape and well yes lets be honest, it happens to me too. Especially if i eat crystal shards while trying to use my bolt escape.

But well on the other hand hence playing a melee sorc ... i mainly use bolt to charge into a fight rather than to escape from one.

[Aunt Edith says]

Oh i almost forgot to reply to f0rgiv3n27b14_ESO and his wonderfull comments here ...

If Templar gets ganked, he has to fight.

If DK gets ganked, he has to fight.

If NB gets ganked, he can try to run, but can fail because there are CC counters to his escape. Magelight, Root.
That is what I and many others are stating.

There needs to be a Counter for Bolt Escape or it needs to be adjusted to not be a Get out of Jail Free Spam ability.

Whats the point of PvPing as another class if I could play one class and always choose which fights I wanted to fight in and which I didn't? Never find yourself helpless in a bad situation with no escape that all the other classes have to deal with...

Well you should also mention that all of them are melee classes wich actually are able to handle them selves while beeing in a melee fight.

Playing a melee sorc myself i can assure you that there is no way to compete with these classes during pvp if you arent able to get into and out of the fight as you desire or are able to get the lucky strike on distracted or less skilled players.

But regardless...

Whats the point of PvPing as a sorc if every other class is able to force you into a melee fight? Never find yourself able to stay at distance and fire your spells, never beeing able to actually get some distance in order to have the time to "cast" your spells?
[/Aunt Edith has spoken]

NordJitsu · May 2014

Neferath wrote: »

I still dont get why it is such a huge problem for you all if somebody has the chance to get away from a fight. Honestly i mean he "is getting away from the fight". He isnt dealing any damage and isnt stunning or rooting you (at least i failed to notice any affect of the 2 sec stun wich actually should be dealt to nearby enemies with bolt escape).

All what happens is that you arent able to gank that poor guy who is trying to escape, so what? There are dozens of other players out there you actually are able to gank and kill. Go on for them and get over it.

Besides that, i see many sorc dying while trying to bolt escape and well yes lets be honest, it happens to me too. Especially if i eat crystal shards while trying to use my bolt escape.

But well on the other hand hence playing a melee sorc ... i mainly use bolt to charge into a fight rather than to escape from one.

Please change name from "Bolt Escape" to "Bolt Stay in Same Place and Let Me Kill You."

That might be a bit long though.

DarkFark · May 2014

I like pie

Kiwi · May 2014

just think
by this time next week the percentage of whining crybabies will have dropped dramatically
best patch yet

the real fix for this whole drama is to make sure you need a shield to use immovable because currently and obviously you dont

Amaylia · May 2014

DarkFark wrote: »

I like pie

I like trains.

Honestly, I read through all of the pages, and it sounds like "Immovable" is the problem. Not Bolt Escape. Why is someone who is "Immovable" able to move?

NordJitsu · May 2014

Amaylia wrote: »

DarkFark wrote: »

I like pie

I like trains.

Honestly, I read through all of the pages, and it sounds like "Immovable" is the problem. Not Bolt Escape. Why is someone who is "Immovable" able to move?

Immovable OP!

Plz Nerf Bolt Escape.

NordJitsu · May 2014

Thechemicals wrote: »

Its a unique and fun skill for a class that needs it and makes sense to have.

The use of immovable or right/left click break-out can eliminate an aggressive stun bolter. One of the big weaknesses for the sorcerer that requires him to have a means to escape is not only the squishyness but that at this moment the dragonknight and Templar class have hard counters to their best spells (backlash and reflective scale) plus other skills that negate magic. These same classes Dk and templar also have the ability to spot heal through damage and continue engaging an enemy with Dragonblood+more and the templar resto tree naturallly. The sorcerer however,needs to look elsewhere for heals or stand in place to channel a recovery of health/magicka. His surge needs to be groomed to efficiency so alternative heals as well.

As most who run into Sorcerer's can see,all sorcerers are using either crystal shards or Mages fury, single target spells. As mentioned above,skill trees have very hard counter to sorcerers and even a gear set "storms" can reflect spells and give resistance against them. The sorcerer can be surprised with considerable damage that is his own reflection of spells being used against him.

For this reason, the class excels at mobility, as most wizard classes have been designed so, in all games. It is a cerebral and quick playing class that does require some forethought when engaging a target(s). It is also meant to be tricky and challenging to fight a sorcerer.

So to cover it all, bolt escape as an offensive tool can be hard countered with certain skills and regular breakout countering. Bolt escape as an escape skill is not an attack that requires a counter. It does feel bad that you couldnt catch the fleeing sorcerer but he is in fact fleeing you, and besides you have bigger fights ahead of you in Cyrodiil.

P.S also, this game isnt designed to be a 1v1 fight so try not to base your opinions on what is overpowered just on that experience.

Get out of here with your logic bro!

You're not welcome.

Either start calling someone names because they ran away from you in a fight or gtfo da thread.

Amaylia · May 2014

NordJitsu wrote: »

Amaylia wrote: »

DarkFark wrote: »

I like pie

I like trains.

Honestly, I read through all of the pages, and it sounds like "Immovable" is the problem. Not Bolt Escape. Why is someone who is "Immovable" able to move?

Immovable OP!

Plz Nerf Bolt Escape.

lol!

Am I wrong in thinking this? So far in all descriptions of a sorc being able to escape everything, it is Immovable + Bolt Escape, not just Bolt Escape. So why is Bolt Escape the target?