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https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/668861
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – November 18
• ESO Store and Account System for maintenance – November 19, 9:00AM EST (14:00 UTC) - 6:00PM EST (23:00 UTC)
• PlayStation®: EU megaserver for maintenance – November 19, 23:00 UTC (6:00PM EST) - November 20, 17:00 UTC (12:00PM EST)
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/668861
Rollback yes or no
-
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭ebuntsb14_ESO wrote: »I have seen only 1 major rollback in a MMO. Most other rollbacks generally was an hour or two or maybe to the beginning of the day . And those rollbacks was for tech. reasons.
The only real rollback, as the type being discussed happened in UO. A hacker hacked into the UO servers and caused every house in game to decay. Items in the house when it decays becomes free loot. Now imagine the entire landscape with nothing but gold, chests, furniture, weapons and other stuff laying all over the place. Even this was rolled back to an earlier save, before the hack.
I never heard of but maybe im wrong of a rollback of several days. Its not going to happen.
There was one in Galaxies, of a couple months, because of a backup failure, I think.0 -
Bluntski✭✭
I'm going by item quantity not type. Like if someone has 5 stacks of purple temper for instance. Finding the dupes for unstack-able items would be harder but not impossible. The item itself may not have a unique ID but the character its tied to does and if someone has X amount of a legendary item all made by themselves then it shouldn't be too hard. Obviously you cannot catch every perpetrator like this as some may have done very minimal duping. This is more in regards to those that heavily abused it. The database will also have timestamps for every item entry so if you saw something like "Joe Schmoe gained +50 of an item" in a single query entry then it is pretty obvious it was a dupe.
If the items are in a database, which they most definitely are, there is no reason you cannot run a script. There is an obvious threshold on the amount of items someone has that would make it look suspicious.you can not run a sql script to find dupes, they script can not determen if someone spend hours of harvesting or duped items n 10 seconds.
and yes agree hackers are not hackers because they are easy to find, they have multiple accounts and they dupe items have been moved elsewhere.
_
if you are pissed about loosing a few days of time playing imagine all the games you played and all the hours you lost playing, that's why they are games to enjoy playing, of curse you loose your time on them. imagine how pissed you be in a few months loosing months of time when you hit endgame and realize you cant compete lol..
bottom line , game should never have been released yet, issues need to be fixed asap and some kind of rollback has to happen. or its dead and you can quit and leave it to the dupers and hackers to noob kill like many other games that went down that road
Though each item does not have a unique ID. So.... How do you suggest they differentiate duped from legit?
Edited by Bluntski on April 18, 2014 4:22PM2 -
If the items are in a database, which they most definitely are, there is no reason you cannot run a script. There is an obvious threshold on the amount of items someone has that would make it look suspicious.you can not run a sql script to find dupes, they script can not determen if someone spend hours of harvesting or duped items n 10 seconds.
and yes agree hackers are not hackers because they are easy to find, they have multiple accounts and they dupe items have been moved elsewhere.
_
if you are pissed about loosing a few days of time playing imagine all the games you played and all the hours you lost playing, that's why they are games to enjoy playing, of curse you loose your time on them. imagine how pissed you be in a few months loosing months of time when you hit endgame and realize you cant compete lol..
bottom line , game should never have been released yet, issues need to be fixed asap and some kind of rollback has to happen. or its dead and you can quit and leave it to the dupers and hackers to noob kill like many other games that went down that road
Though each item does not have a unique ID. So.... How do you suggest they differentiate duped from legit?
Service request from the server of the creation of said item, perhaps? As in, where it originated from and where the player first received it to their inventory. I think there's an addon for ESOheads (I believe, though i may be wrong) that tracks where you receive items on the map, etc to fill up their database of items and books. I see no reason why the Staff cannot do the same, if not even more detailed, and in a more invasive manner.
1 -
LazerusKI✭✭✭if they do a rollback, they can shut down the servers completely^^
No one would accept a rollback after release.1 -
LarZen✭✭✭I don't care that people have exploited. Let em keep it or remove it from them. It don't effect me and I just don't care. That said the exploit need ofc to be removed.1 -
South_of_Heaven✭✭✭DoctorBear wrote: »
If the items are in a database, which they most definitely are, there is no reason you cannot run a script. There is an obvious threshold on the amount of items someone has that would make it look suspicious.you can not run a sql script to find dupes, they script can not determen if someone spend hours of harvesting or duped items n 10 seconds.
and yes agree hackers are not hackers because they are easy to find, they have multiple accounts and they dupe items have been moved elsewhere.
_
if you are pissed about loosing a few days of time playing imagine all the games you played and all the hours you lost playing, that's why they are games to enjoy playing, of curse you loose your time on them. imagine how pissed you be in a few months loosing months of time when you hit endgame and realize you cant compete lol..
bottom line , game should never have been released yet, issues need to be fixed asap and some kind of rollback has to happen. or its dead and you can quit and leave it to the dupers and hackers to noob kill like many other games that went down that road
Though each item does not have a unique ID. So.... How do you suggest they differentiate duped from legit?
Service request from the server of the creation of said item, perhaps? As in, where it originated from and where the player first received it to their inventory. I think there's an addon for ESOheads (I believe, though i may be wrong) that tracks where you receive items on the map, etc to fill up their database of items and books. I see no reason why the Staff cannot do the same, if not even more detailed, and in a more invasive manner.
Do you know how many millions of items they would have to check? Do you know how many were traded and how many people would come here asking for their legally purchased items back, even if they could erase them? Do you know how many of these items have been consumed by crafting, REFINING, or used to level up and max out skills?
Wake up people. It is NOT going to happen. Anyone who says otherwise is either a duper or a dreamer.
Edited by South_of_Heaven on April 18, 2014 4:26PM1 -
Audigy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭You cant do a rollback without hurting innocent players. I am not even aware of what dupe or hack you guys talk about.
I am just level 12
2 -
LazerusKI✭✭✭
yeah...just without players. if there would be a rollback, our whole guild would quit, and i think we would not be the only ones.
Rollback for 99% of players because 1% exploited...great idea
Edited by LazerusKI on April 18, 2014 4:28PM1 -
Bluntski✭✭
I think you are severely underestimating what scripts can do.South_of_Heaven wrote: »DoctorBear wrote: »
If the items are in a database, which they most definitely are, there is no reason you cannot run a script. There is an obvious threshold on the amount of items someone has that would make it look suspicious.you can not run a sql script to find dupes, they script can not determen if someone spend hours of harvesting or duped items n 10 seconds.
and yes agree hackers are not hackers because they are easy to find, they have multiple accounts and they dupe items have been moved elsewhere.
_
if you are pissed about loosing a few days of time playing imagine all the games you played and all the hours you lost playing, that's why they are games to enjoy playing, of curse you loose your time on them. imagine how pissed you be in a few months loosing months of time when you hit endgame and realize you cant compete lol..
bottom line , game should never have been released yet, issues need to be fixed asap and some kind of rollback has to happen. or its dead and you can quit and leave it to the dupers and hackers to noob kill like many other games that went down that road
Though each item does not have a unique ID. So.... How do you suggest they differentiate duped from legit?
Service request from the server of the creation of said item, perhaps? As in, where it originated from and where the player first received it to their inventory. I think there's an addon for ESOheads (I believe, though i may be wrong) that tracks where you receive items on the map, etc to fill up their database of items and books. I see no reason why the Staff cannot do the same, if not even more detailed, and in a more invasive manner.
Do you know how many millions of items they would have to check? Do you know how many were traded and how many people would come here asking for their legally purchased items back, even if they could erase them? Do you know how many of these items have been consumed by crafting, REFINING, or used to level up and max out skills?
Wake up people. It is NOT going to happen. Anyone who says otherwise is either a duper or a dreamer.
0 -
Citraka✭I'm just not thrilled by thought of the same quests over again /yawn, waste of my life.
Someone earlier said all games were a waste of your life and a bunch of other such crap.
No, the time played was entertainment, re playing the same content to get back to where i already was, IS a waste of my time however because it wouldnt be FunEdited by Citraka on April 18, 2014 4:28PM2 -
South_of_Heaven wrote: »DoctorBear wrote: »
If the items are in a database, which they most definitely are, there is no reason you cannot run a script. There is an obvious threshold on the amount of items someone has that would make it look suspicious.you can not run a sql script to find dupes, they script can not determen if someone spend hours of harvesting or duped items n 10 seconds.
and yes agree hackers are not hackers because they are easy to find, they have multiple accounts and they dupe items have been moved elsewhere.
_
if you are pissed about loosing a few days of time playing imagine all the games you played and all the hours you lost playing, that's why they are games to enjoy playing, of curse you loose your time on them. imagine how pissed you be in a few months loosing months of time when you hit endgame and realize you cant compete lol..
bottom line , game should never have been released yet, issues need to be fixed asap and some kind of rollback has to happen. or its dead and you can quit and leave it to the dupers and hackers to noob kill like many other games that went down that road
Though each item does not have a unique ID. So.... How do you suggest they differentiate duped from legit?
Service request from the server of the creation of said item, perhaps? As in, where it originated from and where the player first received it to their inventory. I think there's an addon for ESOheads (I believe, though i may be wrong) that tracks where you receive items on the map, etc to fill up their database of items and books. I see no reason why the Staff cannot do the same, if not even more detailed, and in a more invasive manner.
Do you know how many millions of items they would have to check? Do you know how many were traded and how many people would come here asking for their legally purchased items back, even if they could erase them? Do you know how many of these items have been consumed by crafting, REFINING, or used to level up and max out skills?
Wake up people. It is NOT going to happen. Anyone who says otherwise is either a duper or a dreamer.
So long as the original exploiters are banned, this is just a side-bonus. I'd hoped you know my viewpoint on this if you've been keeping up with the thread. That being said, like i have said before, these kinds of matters where items were sold or traded to innocent players who were effected by the exploit could be handled on a case by case basis. Would it take a while? Yes. But for those in situations where it's a simple case (for example, who still have the item and need only be compensated for the gold traded and nothing more) it would be fixed quite easily. And that is in fact, a lot of people, i would hazard to guess. Neither of us however know the answer to any of those questions you've raised, only the Staff may, and so i would appreciate it if you do not act as if we are the defining direct factor of what Staff decides to do. This is for discussion's sake, regardless of what we want, Staff will make their own decision.0 -
Mufasa✭✭✭
I think you are severely underestimating what scripts can do.South_of_Heaven wrote: »DoctorBear wrote: »
If the items are in a database, which they most definitely are, there is no reason you cannot run a script. There is an obvious threshold on the amount of items someone has that would make it look suspicious.you can not run a sql script to find dupes, they script can not determen if someone spend hours of harvesting or duped items n 10 seconds.
and yes agree hackers are not hackers because they are easy to find, they have multiple accounts and they dupe items have been moved elsewhere.
_
if you are pissed about loosing a few days of time playing imagine all the games you played and all the hours you lost playing, that's why they are games to enjoy playing, of curse you loose your time on them. imagine how pissed you be in a few months loosing months of time when you hit endgame and realize you cant compete lol..
bottom line , game should never have been released yet, issues need to be fixed asap and some kind of rollback has to happen. or its dead and you can quit and leave it to the dupers and hackers to noob kill like many other games that went down that road
Though each item does not have a unique ID. So.... How do you suggest they differentiate duped from legit?
Service request from the server of the creation of said item, perhaps? As in, where it originated from and where the player first received it to their inventory. I think there's an addon for ESOheads (I believe, though i may be wrong) that tracks where you receive items on the map, etc to fill up their database of items and books. I see no reason why the Staff cannot do the same, if not even more detailed, and in a more invasive manner.
Do you know how many millions of items they would have to check? Do you know how many were traded and how many people would come here asking for their legally purchased items back, even if they could erase them? Do you know how many of these items have been consumed by crafting, REFINING, or used to level up and max out skills?
Wake up people. It is NOT going to happen. Anyone who says otherwise is either a duper or a dreamer.
Explain how it would work for anything bought with laundered gold. Items crafted and improved, etc....0 -
South_of_Heaven✭✭✭
I think you are severely underestimating what scripts can do.South_of_Heaven wrote: »DoctorBear wrote: »
If the items are in a database, which they most definitely are, there is no reason you cannot run a script. There is an obvious threshold on the amount of items someone has that would make it look suspicious.you can not run a sql script to find dupes, they script can not determen if someone spend hours of harvesting or duped items n 10 seconds.
and yes agree hackers are not hackers because they are easy to find, they have multiple accounts and they dupe items have been moved elsewhere.
_
if you are pissed about loosing a few days of time playing imagine all the games you played and all the hours you lost playing, that's why they are games to enjoy playing, of curse you loose your time on them. imagine how pissed you be in a few months loosing months of time when you hit endgame and realize you cant compete lol..
bottom line , game should never have been released yet, issues need to be fixed asap and some kind of rollback has to happen. or its dead and you can quit and leave it to the dupers and hackers to noob kill like many other games that went down that road
Though each item does not have a unique ID. So.... How do you suggest they differentiate duped from legit?
Service request from the server of the creation of said item, perhaps? As in, where it originated from and where the player first received it to their inventory. I think there's an addon for ESOheads (I believe, though i may be wrong) that tracks where you receive items on the map, etc to fill up their database of items and books. I see no reason why the Staff cannot do the same, if not even more detailed, and in a more invasive manner.
Do you know how many millions of items they would have to check? Do you know how many were traded and how many people would come here asking for their legally purchased items back, even if they could erase them? Do you know how many of these items have been consumed by crafting, REFINING, or used to level up and max out skills?
Wake up people. It is NOT going to happen. Anyone who says otherwise is either a duper or a dreamer.
God, tell me you actually know programming and didn't just said this before I jump off a building :P1 -
Nordak✭✭I'm just not thrilled by thought of the same quests over again /yawn, waste of my life.
Someone earlier said all games were a waste of your life and a bunch of other such crap.
No, the time played was entertainment, re playing the same content to get back to where i already was, IS a waste of my time however because it wouldnt be Fun
Then just run a different faction. If this isn't fixed *CORRECTLY* then the majority of us who didn't cheat *WILL* leave. Rollback is the only proper fix.1 -
Bluntski✭✭
I am ONLY talking about duping.
I think you are severely underestimating what scripts can do.South_of_Heaven wrote: »DoctorBear wrote: »
If the items are in a database, which they most definitely are, there is no reason you cannot run a script. There is an obvious threshold on the amount of items someone has that would make it look suspicious.you can not run a sql script to find dupes, they script can not determen if someone spend hours of harvesting or duped items n 10 seconds.
and yes agree hackers are not hackers because they are easy to find, they have multiple accounts and they dupe items have been moved elsewhere.
_
if you are pissed about loosing a few days of time playing imagine all the games you played and all the hours you lost playing, that's why they are games to enjoy playing, of curse you loose your time on them. imagine how pissed you be in a few months loosing months of time when you hit endgame and realize you cant compete lol..
bottom line , game should never have been released yet, issues need to be fixed asap and some kind of rollback has to happen. or its dead and you can quit and leave it to the dupers and hackers to noob kill like many other games that went down that road
Though each item does not have a unique ID. So.... How do you suggest they differentiate duped from legit?
Service request from the server of the creation of said item, perhaps? As in, where it originated from and where the player first received it to their inventory. I think there's an addon for ESOheads (I believe, though i may be wrong) that tracks where you receive items on the map, etc to fill up their database of items and books. I see no reason why the Staff cannot do the same, if not even more detailed, and in a more invasive manner.
Do you know how many millions of items they would have to check? Do you know how many were traded and how many people would come here asking for their legally purchased items back, even if they could erase them? Do you know how many of these items have been consumed by crafting, REFINING, or used to level up and max out skills?
Wake up people. It is NOT going to happen. Anyone who says otherwise is either a duper or a dreamer.
Explain how it would work for anything bought with laundered gold. Items crafted and improved, etc....
0 -
Edited by marcweiss81nrb19_ESO on April 18, 2014 4:33PM0
-
Dominulf✭✭✭Duping is the most damaging thing in a game. Devs can restore glitched items, return hacked accounts,nerf farm spots, but duping is like nuclear fallout that can never be repaired on a macro level.
I know people that have 800 Dreugh Wax. Do you know what that means? Every piece of armor from now until they quit the game will be Legendary Tier for free.
Coming from Diablo 2 and Mortal Online I can tell you one thing, NO one will take the game seriously if this isn't addressed.
This is BAD.The Elder Scrolls Online - Where the best spells are AoEs and the strongest weapon is a Shield!
"I used to be the most beloved roleplaying series of a generation... but then I took $14.99/mo to the knee."1 -
Otherwise this game is toast.
The game has only been out for a couple weeks. I don't see how anybody can oppose a rollback for the sake of this game's integrity.
Spanking godly vets and other cheats would go over well in this community. From what I've been reading. About this launch.1 -
Soloeus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Anyone unhappy about this proposal is a duper. Anyone who isn't a Duper who has ever played an MMO should demand a rollback +30 days free gametime for all accounts.
Honest players are already suffering, having to compete with the exploiters onward. It will do little harm to them to have a full rollback, and less harm than allowing this game state to progress.Edited by Soloeus on April 18, 2014 4:35PM
Within; Without.1 -
AstroCat✭✭✭The "word" is out now:
http://kotaku.com/major-duping-bug-hits-the-elder-scrolls-online-1564641897
I look forward to ZOE's response.Edited by AstroCat on April 18, 2014 4:35PM2 -
Squishy✭✭✭
Then report them?
I know people that have 800 Dreugh Wax. Do you know what that means? Every piece of armor from now until they quit the game will be Legendary Tier for free.
This is BAD.
"In 2014, a possible bot was sent to coldharbour by a military GM for a crime she didn't commit. This argonian promptly escaped from a maximum security stockade to the Ebonheart underground. Today, still wanted by the developers she survive as soldiers of fortune. If you have a bot problem, if no one else can bite you, and if you can find her....maybe you can hire The SQUISHY."1 -
Bluntski✭✭
Nope! I am a sysadmin and can write sql scripts (among others), scripting isn't programming. But this isn't about me. Zeni's enigneers should easily be able to identify most of the duping that happened barring underlying issues that we may not know about.South_of_Heaven wrote: »
I think you are severely underestimating what scripts can do.South_of_Heaven wrote: »DoctorBear wrote: »
If the items are in a database, which they most definitely are, there is no reason you cannot run a script. There is an obvious threshold on the amount of items someone has that would make it look suspicious.you can not run a sql script to find dupes, they script can not determen if someone spend hours of harvesting or duped items n 10 seconds.
and yes agree hackers are not hackers because they are easy to find, they have multiple accounts and they dupe items have been moved elsewhere.
_
if you are pissed about loosing a few days of time playing imagine all the games you played and all the hours you lost playing, that's why they are games to enjoy playing, of curse you loose your time on them. imagine how pissed you be in a few months loosing months of time when you hit endgame and realize you cant compete lol..
bottom line , game should never have been released yet, issues need to be fixed asap and some kind of rollback has to happen. or its dead and you can quit and leave it to the dupers and hackers to noob kill like many other games that went down that road
Though each item does not have a unique ID. So.... How do you suggest they differentiate duped from legit?
Service request from the server of the creation of said item, perhaps? As in, where it originated from and where the player first received it to their inventory. I think there's an addon for ESOheads (I believe, though i may be wrong) that tracks where you receive items on the map, etc to fill up their database of items and books. I see no reason why the Staff cannot do the same, if not even more detailed, and in a more invasive manner.
Do you know how many millions of items they would have to check? Do you know how many were traded and how many people would come here asking for their legally purchased items back, even if they could erase them? Do you know how many of these items have been consumed by crafting, REFINING, or used to level up and max out skills?
Wake up people. It is NOT going to happen. Anyone who says otherwise is either a duper or a dreamer.
God, tell me you actually know programming and didn't just said this before I jump off a building :P
0 -
South_of_Heaven✭✭✭DoctorBear wrote: »South_of_Heaven wrote: »DoctorBear wrote: »
If the items are in a database, which they most definitely are, there is no reason you cannot run a script. There is an obvious threshold on the amount of items someone has that would make it look suspicious.you can not run a sql script to find dupes, they script can not determen if someone spend hours of harvesting or duped items n 10 seconds.
and yes agree hackers are not hackers because they are easy to find, they have multiple accounts and they dupe items have been moved elsewhere.
_
if you are pissed about loosing a few days of time playing imagine all the games you played and all the hours you lost playing, that's why they are games to enjoy playing, of curse you loose your time on them. imagine how pissed you be in a few months loosing months of time when you hit endgame and realize you cant compete lol..
bottom line , game should never have been released yet, issues need to be fixed asap and some kind of rollback has to happen. or its dead and you can quit and leave it to the dupers and hackers to noob kill like many other games that went down that road
Though each item does not have a unique ID. So.... How do you suggest they differentiate duped from legit?
Service request from the server of the creation of said item, perhaps? As in, where it originated from and where the player first received it to their inventory. I think there's an addon for ESOheads (I believe, though i may be wrong) that tracks where you receive items on the map, etc to fill up their database of items and books. I see no reason why the Staff cannot do the same, if not even more detailed, and in a more invasive manner.
Do you know how many millions of items they would have to check? Do you know how many were traded and how many people would come here asking for their legally purchased items back, even if they could erase them? Do you know how many of these items have been consumed by crafting, REFINING, or used to level up and max out skills?
Wake up people. It is NOT going to happen. Anyone who says otherwise is either a duper or a dreamer.
So long as the original exploiters are banned, this is just a side-bonus. I'd hoped you know my viewpoint on this if you've been keeping up with the thread. That being said, like i have said before, these kinds of matters where items were sold or traded to innocent players who were effected by the exploit could be handled on a case by case basis. Would it take a while? Yes. But for those in situations where it's a simple case (for example, who still have the item and need only be compensated for the gold traded and nothing more) it would be fixed quite easily. And that is in fact, a lot of people, i would hazard to guess. Neither of us however know the answer to any of those questions you've raised, only the Staff may, and so i would appreciate it if you do not act as if we are the defining direct factor of what Staff decides to do. This is for discussion's sake, regardless of what we want, Staff will make their own decision.
We are not but don't underestimate the power of the customers.
As for the exploiters getting banned, it may happen, but imagine if a group of 100 people had an account for duping, did their dirty work with the account and that was it. Anyway, time for a break.1
