PTS Update 40 - Bug Reports for Grand Master Crafting Stations

Silaf

Zeny listened to the comments.
In the new patchnotes 9.2.1

"Adjusted the achievement requirement to purchase a Grand Master Crafting Station from “Grand Master Crafter” to “Unsurpassed Crafter”

Billium813

During the Zeal of Zenithar event, are prices reduced at Writ Voucher vendors? I can't remember and I think they may not be. Also, during the Zeal of Zenithar event, do Writ Vouchers drop from event coffers, or do we get extra Writ Voucher rewards from completing sealed writs? Similar to how Undaunted Keys drop from Undaunted Celebration coffers, or how we get extra Tel Var +100% Tel Var Stone gains during Whitestrake's Mayhem.

Shadeous

Billium813 wrote: »

During the Zeal of Zenithar event, are prices reduced at Writ Voucher vendors? I can't remember and I think they may not be. Also, during the Zeal of Zenithar event, do Writ Vouchers drop from event coffers, or do we get extra Writ Voucher rewards from completing sealed writs? Similar to how Undaunted Keys drop from Undaunted Celebration coffers, or how we get extra Tel Var +100% Tel Var Stone gains during Whitestrake's Mayhem.

Writ voucher costs are not reduced during the zeal event.

Necrotech_Master

Billium813 wrote: »

During the Zeal of Zenithar event, are prices reduced at Writ Voucher vendors? I can't remember and I think they may not be. Also, during the Zeal of Zenithar event, do Writ Vouchers drop from event coffers, or do we get extra Writ Voucher rewards from completing sealed writs? Similar to how Undaunted Keys drop from Undaunted Celebration coffers, or how we get extra Tel Var +100% Tel Var Stone gains during Whitestrake's Mayhem.

vouchers do not drop from boxes, they are only obtained from master writs, we also do not get bonus vouchers either (we used to get a event box per master writ until it was nerfed for this years event to only be one per craft per master writ per day)

and not sure on the 10% discount, but its only 10% which means for these stations (even if it did apply) would only reduce the total cost by about 600 vouchers to buy all 4 stations

DoofusMax

Hotdog_23 wrote: »

No, the real issue for console is it is true that we can make many extra writs ahead of time and turn them too. I have done this many times before. The problem is, you need either write down what the writ is or take a picture of each and every writ you want to make. Then make a bunch ahead of time.

Having a memory only slightly longer than that of a goldfish, I keep a notepad right next to my mouse and that's how I did Master Writs before someone clued me in about WritWorthy. I still use the notepad, especially when compiling shopping lists for the motifs I need or the non-writ crafting I need to do. I definitely agree that how styles are indexed for purchase, lore library, and crafting station uses leaves much to be desired and I'd really like to see them indexed similarly across all use cases.

Sordidfairytale

DoofusMax wrote: »

... I definitely agree that how styles are indexed for purchase, lore library, and crafting station uses leaves much to be desired and I'd really like to see them indexed similarly across all use cases.

Agreed.

Votan has an addon that allows you to right click on the Style option when crafting and select from a drop down menu that is thankfully alphabetized.

Awesome Guildstore gives you the option to filter motifs (and recipes) by known and unknown.

Those are both things I wish that the base game had as options. I'm not against how the Lore Library is set up as it's easy to determine what chapters you have of a motif. Though it would be nice to have the base game allow you to sort the motifs by completion.

Entaro

Mendo wrote: »

Why is the blacksmith table 3x bigger than the others?





I kind of expected when you add the attunable tables, that I'd be able to buy another set of Master Crafter tables and put them in another home and have all the tables available, but this is on a per-Master Crafter table basis.

I feel the 1500 writ PER TABLE price is really steep, we've already paid 1000 writs per set, times 77. I could understand the price a bit better if the attunable tables we added were account-bound and could get additional Master Craft tables for other houses.

Have to agree with this. Hard to make a nice hub with 1 table being such an outlier chonker.

Blacknight841

Entaro wrote: »

Mendo wrote: »

Why is the blacksmith table 3x bigger than the others?





I kind of expected when you add the attunable tables, that I'd be able to buy another set of Master Crafter tables and put them in another home and have all the tables available, but this is on a per-Master Crafter table basis.

I feel the 1500 writ PER TABLE price is really steep, we've already paid 1000 writs per set, times 77. I could understand the price a bit better if the attunable tables we added were account-bound and could get additional Master Craft tables for other houses.

Have to agree with this. Hard to make a nice hub with 1 table being such an outlier chonker.

Disagree with the price being too high. They usually release 6 attainable tables every year costing 6k vouches. However this year there will not be any new attainable tables with the Q4 dlc. So assuming that you don’t need to spend 3k on new tables, the difference in cost is only 3k. Basically this year there is an extra 3k vouchers needed as opposed to the last few years. The gold value of a voucher has been getting lower and lower every years this is because there are more vouchers produced than are needed. Having to spend an extra 3k in vouchers this year will go to offset some of the devaluation that regularly happens … even if it is temporary. There is absolutely no reason to have these tables all acquired on day 1 as it is only a matter of convenience. Once could have argued that it was ridiculous that we had to spend 26k vouchers to get all the sets available when they were introduced, however the players miraculously managed. Even adjusting the achievement required for the tables was unnecessary. Not everything is meant to be instant and easy to get… if this is the community trend, then why not let all the players get the difficult dungeon achievement mounts for just walking to the dungeon and discovering it.

lillybit

Blacknight841 wrote: »

Entaro wrote: »

Mendo wrote: »

Why is the blacksmith table 3x bigger than the others?





I kind of expected when you add the attunable tables, that I'd be able to buy another set of Master Crafter tables and put them in another home and have all the tables available, but this is on a per-Master Crafter table basis.

I feel the 1500 writ PER TABLE price is really steep, we've already paid 1000 writs per set, times 77. I could understand the price a bit better if the attunable tables we added were account-bound and could get additional Master Craft tables for other houses.

Have to agree with this. Hard to make a nice hub with 1 table being such an outlier chonker.

Disagree with the price being too high. They usually release 6 attainable tables every year costing 6k vouches. However this year there will not be any new attainable tables with the Q4 dlc. So assuming that you don’t need to spend 3k on new tables, the difference in cost is only 3k. Basically this year there is an extra 3k vouchers needed as opposed to the last few years. The gold value of a voucher has been getting lower and lower every years this is because there are more vouchers produced than are needed. Having to spend an extra 3k in vouchers this year will go to offset some of the devaluation that regularly happens … even if it is temporary. There is absolutely no reason to have these tables all acquired on day 1 as it is only a matter of convenience. Once could have argued that it was ridiculous that we had to spend 26k vouchers to get all the sets available when they were introduced, however the players miraculously managed. Even adjusting the achievement required for the tables was unnecessary. Not everything is meant to be instant and easy to get… if this is the community trend, then why not let all the players get the difficult dungeon achievement mounts for just walking to the dungeon and discovering it.

The gold value of vouchers doesn't matter as these are Bind on Pickup which is really the problem. They don't have to be easy, but this has made them impossible for guild hall owners who built their house with gold rather than vouchers

Kelinmiriel

Bug report #231002-001443:
Grand Master Crafting stations of the same type are not recognized as being different from each other, even if they have a different number of stations fed into them.

I had two GMC Blacksmithing stations side by side. One full, one empty. Picked up both, then did undo-undo, and they were placed back in opposite positions.

Not that this is likely to come up often, but still - it definitely shouldn't work that way.

Bind on pickup, we still haven't had any confirmation in either direction as to whether it's intentional, and if it is - why? Why would ZOS not allow guild members to contribute to their guild hall? (Or do they feel so strongly that this shouldn't be tradable as an empty consumable item, before it's been fed with bound attunables, that that's more important?)

Serenez

Has there been any update for the bind on pickup (BOP) ?

I agree with many posters here that this makes no sense, as it puts the onus on one person to do 6000 vouchers themselves. It would make more sense to bind it to account once the Grand Master Stations have an Attuned Station fed into it, to align it to work similar to the attunable stations. Unattuned can be purchased and donated/sold in Guild traders etc., but once attuned to a specific crafting set, it becomes bound to the account.

1. In some guilds it is not the GM that houses the Guild Hall
2. Some GMs that do house the Guild Hall, may not have the time to grind out all of the vouchers themselves, even if there are donations of master writs and supplies. Many have families and other obligations, and have Officers or Guild Members offering to assist by donating items from the Master Writ Vendor, OR by donating gold so that the GM OR member that houses the Guild Hall, can purchase the necessary supplies for the Guild Hall.
3. There is already an onus on the Guild Hall owner to supply by member request, items that are solely available for real money via the Crown store. (Mundus for example, although not required, it is requested by members to have a fully decked out Guild Hall).

Some Guilds may be in a good position to take on all this work and have no issues with the BOP, however my opinion is that it does put an unfair onus on the Guild Hall owner, to not only sacrifice real money to purchase the Crown store items, but adds a further onus on ONE PERSON's time.

itsfatbass

RagnarSw wrote: »

Also, requesting the stations become collectibles so that we can place them in multiple houses. I kind of figured they were going to be expensive (I expected 1,250 though) and BoP, but if they're BoP they really need to be a collectible.

100% agreed. The BoP thing makes perfect sense, there are achievement requirements to purchase them and they should absolutely remain BoP, but they should ALSO be a collectible.

code65536

itsfatbass wrote: »

RagnarSw wrote: »

Also, requesting the stations become collectibles so that we can place them in multiple houses. I kind of figured they were going to be expensive (I expected 1,250 though) and BoP, but if they're BoP they really need to be a collectible.

100% agreed. The BoP thing makes perfect sense, there are achievement requirements to purchase them and they should absolutely remain BoP, but they should ALSO be a collectible.

No, the "it requires an achievement" bit is nonsensical. Everything in Faustina's inventory requires an achievement to purchase. There are things there that even require the "Unsurpassed Crafter" achievement, same as the GMCS. And NONE of it is bound.

On the Live server, the precedent is clear as day: Every item that you can buy with writ vouchers is tradeable (with the exception of the storage chests since they are collectibles and not items). I repeat, EVERY ITEM.

Until these GMCS.

This is, frankly, a bad decision. Keep the price high: that's fine. Go back to requiring the Grand Master Crafter achievement: that was fine, too. Crafting in ESO has traditionally been a mercantile activity. People should be able to sell the things that they earn through their crafting work. That crafting work earned people the privilege to purchase GMCS with vouchers, and they should be able to sell those GMCS, since that's the whole spirit of trade and crafting!

Leave that BoP nonsense to dungeons and trials.

Edit: I do see a need for the stations to be bound since the attuned stations that are fed into it are bound. But the solution here is to bind the GMCS to your account when you feed a station to it. Not when you purchase it.

Granamere

I also would like to say please do not make these BOP. If they were account wide and there needed to be a trigger to unlock it for that account I could kind of see it but since they are not account wide like storage chests pretty please do not make them BOP.

If there is a good reason for this could you please post here what it is? I can understand when it is security related not to give us the details but if it is a design choice please educate us why it was thought this was the best way.

Thank you.

Kelinmiriel

I will share my personal belief on why the stations are bound on pickup. I wouldn't have, if there had been ANY official comments at all on why this decision had been made. But we've had no response at all. So here it is.

I believe that they had some coding issues with getting the stations securely bound AFTER attunables were fed into them, and decided that the easiest and most secure way to deal with it was to make them bind-on-pickup in the first place.

The reason I believe this might be a possibility, from my point of view as a retired programmer, is because I had picked up two grand master crafting stations - one empty, and one filled - then did "undo" twice. The housing editor put them back in the opposite positions.

If the code had them clearly identified, that shouldn't have happened.

Still - if my idea is correct, there would have been very simple methods of solving it other than making the stations bind on pickup. For example, putting it in a runebox. That's a common method of making an item tradable initially, with contents that are bound by the end user as soon as it's opened.

If that's really the problem - it's not too late; this would be a very simple change that could be done last-minute, and would make a lot of people happier. (Especially if it was announced quickly, so we would know about it and could stop scrambling for the next two weeks!)

If not - please tell us WHY!! The community can be understanding, if there's just a good reason. (Although it's hard for me to imagine a good enough reason for you to have put us through this.)

If I see no change and no explanation - I'll just continue to believe it's lazy coding.

remosito

- price is fine imo
- bop is a NOGO (a huge % of those are gonna sit in GHs where bop is a pain)

DoofusMax

Having real issues with the bind-on-pickup end of things. While I'm not thrilled with the price, that will be as it will be. But I'd really like to be able to do more than contribute sympathy and commiseration to the guildhall (which already has all the attunables). As it stands, I can't send the station and I can't send the vouchers to pay for the station. All that's left is "here's a stack of writs with enough voucher rewards to purchase, and here are the mats you'll need to do those... do you already know motifs x, y, and z or do you need those, too?"

GBee172

Interacting with a grand master crafting station crashes the game for me every time on PS4. Thankfully, a guildmate still has all the tables in their primary residence so I can go there.

Araneae6537

GBee172 wrote: »

Interacting with a grand master crafting station crashes the game for me every time on PS4. Thankfully, a guildmate still has all the tables in their primary residence so I can go there.

Wouldn’t it have made more sense to start a new thread for this in the Bug Reports section rather than necroing the PTS thread?