PTS Update 37 - Feedback Thread for Combat & Classes

Ratzkifal

Templars:

• No buffs to jabs? If this is the hill you are dying on, let it be known that this is the hill I am dying on. I have 3 templars and no desire to play them so long as their bread-and-butter skill does not feel rewarding to use with its shorter duration and reduced numbers. Revert the update 35 change.

Necromancer:

• You nerfed harmony to reduce the impact of "solo builds in PvP". The only solo build in PvP that made use of the harmony trait in this way was Necromancers. How am I going to play a magicka Necro in PvP now? Where are the buffs to compensate them? Harmony bombing was the only thing they had going for them if you weren't playing tank.
• At least a being a vampire Necromancer makes more sense now with Mist Form being a gapcloser, the thing that Necros didn't have natively access to. It will still suck that you are being shoehorned into play tanky instead of getting to be a bomber/glass canon, which would have been great to have a gap closer on.

Sorcerer:

• An actual good change to shields. It won't make me play a Sorc tank but now I feel like I could. That's nice.
• Edit: Apparently Mist Form is a free movement gapcloser now. That sucks for Sorc. Not to mention that everyone also has the projectile absorbing effect too. You seriously need to consider buffing Sorcs because they just lost one of their only unique strengths (the strength of getting to go in and out of combat on their own terms).

General:

• class-unique minor passives are still not hybridized, mundus stones are still not hybridized. that means even after the changes to glyphs of harming, you still favor one damage stat over the other, resulting in a thematic clash. Why does picking The Apprentice make me a better warrior than The Warrior, just because I am playing stamplar? Fix this.

TechMaybeHic

Wow. I'm a templar main from forever and the burst is dead to me because of scaling on POTL/PL maybe getting over reduced by battle spirit and not so much of a whisper about it? Have to admit; got my hopes up seeing backlash mentioned, only for it to be just a category.

And Necro; I went to that a bit as I got away from my templar; and it honestly feels about as bad if not for avid boneyard harmony combing blast bones, if you're lucky it all works as blast bones gets confused and synergies often require you to step out and go back in. It's just a mess of a class. Sure can't wait to see how disjointed this next one is

Ratzkifal

Give Bosmer racial passives back their bonus to stealth! Detection is useless in PvE and borderline useless in PvP while harming your own stealth capabilities in the process. If you don't understand why this is, please take a look at the "hidden" and "danger" indicators again and how that impacts the information aspect of stealth gameplay.
Proper stealth on the other hand, aside from being lore accurate, has exploration and flavor aspects to it, while also being tangibly beneficial in PvP - without being decisive in active combat, so there is no potential for harm here either. Bosmer are stealthy, they are not guards. If you do not plan on changing this, at least communicate on why you feel it's necessary to violate 25 years of lore stating that Bosmer are the (or tied with Khajiit as the) stealthiest race in Tamriel. Even your very own lore supports this.
Back then you said no two races can have the same passive but these days are long gone. Several races now share the exact same passive. Keep everything the same as it is - or buff the detection CP if you must - but switch detection for stealth!

Give us an answer or change it back!

acastanza_ESO

The longer I think about this, the madder I get.
Giving DK - the best class in the game - a huge buff with Major Breserk, while the major issues with Sorc get completely swept under the rug again. No offensive stat scaling on shields, no access to major buffs or debuffs, now everyone gets a free-movement gap closer with better targeting and secondary effects.

@ZOS_Gilliam @Gilliamtherogue @ZOS_GinaBruno, why is all of our feedback being continually ignored. We've shown you unambiguously how lacking Sorc is compared to DK, NB, or Warden, and it is ALL ignored. Instead we get a buff to shields that is SO SMALL it is completely meaningless. Why?

caesarvs

DeathStalker wrote: »

As someone at the bottom of the damage numbers, all I can say is... pretty disappointing. When are we at the bottom going to be remembered? When are we going to be able to feel strong and not struggle? Light attack weaving and animation canceling should not be mandatory to clear content except for things like the hardest dungeons and trials. My hands hurt so much and get so stiff trying to do all the movements needed to do damage. So disappointing. Forgotten. Unimportant. Maybe one day people like me can play and feel strong and powerful but it doesn't seem to be anytime soon.

What?

Do you ever heard of oakensoul heavy attack builds? You can parse over 80k literally just pressing mouse button e using ultimate when ready.

The people at "bottom of damage numbers" never had a such favorable spot for doing good damage ever before

MEBengalsFan2001

Trinotops wrote: »

Honestly, pretty disappointing.

• Templars get no buffs and are still just beam bots.
• Necros had the one thing going for them taken away (bombing) and nothing was given in return such as a reliable stun, better spammable, class access to Major Brutality/Sorcery.
• Harmony change is boring and negatively affects more fringe synergies like Lady Thorn.
• Haven't tested it, but the Bloodthirsty trait was already in a good spot. The buff seems unnecessary.
• Sorcs get a measly buff to their shield, which is better than nothing I guess, but the class would've benefited way more from things like Major/Minor buffs or debuffs attached to their abilities, a reliable burst heal, better pets in PvP.
• Nightblades still have a ridiculously overloaded class kit.
• No change to the Vampire Undeath passive.

Actually if you read it Purifying Light got moved from melee to range and range damage is 90% of melee damage meaning Templar using purifying light got there damage nerfed.

Ratzkifal

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

The longer I think about this, the madder I get.
Giving DK - the best class in the game - a huge buff with Major Breserk, while the major issues with Sorc get completely swept under the rug again. No offensive stat scaling on shields, no access to major buffs or debuffs, now everyone gets a free-movement gap closer with better targeting and secondary effects.

@ZOS_Gilliam @Gilliamtherogue @ZOS_GinaBruno, why is all of our feedback being continually ignored. We've shown you unambiguously how lacking Sorc is compared to DK, NB, or Warden, and it is ALL ignored. Instead we get a buff to shields that is SO SMALL it is completely meaningless. Why?

I completely missed that Mist Form is now a free movement gapcloser. Wow, that does suck for Sorcs. I guess that makes the portal from the Arcanist less meaningful in the process too, which I already thought was bad news for Sorcs.

acastanza_ESO

Ratzkifal wrote: »

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

The longer I think about this, the madder I get.
Giving DK - the best class in the game - a huge buff with Major Breserk, while the major issues with Sorc get completely swept under the rug again. No offensive stat scaling on shields, no access to major buffs or debuffs, now everyone gets a free-movement gap closer with better targeting and secondary effects.

@ZOS_Gilliam @Gilliamtherogue @ZOS_GinaBruno, why is all of our feedback being continually ignored. We've shown you unambiguously how lacking Sorc is compared to DK, NB, or Warden, and it is ALL ignored. Instead we get a buff to shields that is SO SMALL it is completely meaningless. Why?

I completely missed that Mist Form is now a free movement gapcloser. Wow, that does suck for Sorcs. I guess that makes the portal from the Arcanist less meaningful in the process too, which I already thought was bad news for Sorcs.

When I say Streak, I'm really referring to the Ball of Lightning morph here. It is slightly slower than BoL (not as much slower as some people are trying to make it seem, but it is admittedly slightly), but in exchange you can position it anywhere in range rather than it being a fixed distance that is locked to the direction your character is facing like Streak is. Also, you get Major Evasion and Expedition on one of the morphs which is legitimately huge, and the other morph gets a big HOT on it. It's just straight up insulting how much better it is. The Streak morph literally only has the stun going for it, which with sets like RoA being the PVP meta, you actually don't want anyway.

Vevvev

Ratzkifal wrote: »

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

The longer I think about this, the madder I get.
Giving DK - the best class in the game - a huge buff with Major Breserk, while the major issues with Sorc get completely swept under the rug again. No offensive stat scaling on shields, no access to major buffs or debuffs, now everyone gets a free-movement gap closer with better targeting and secondary effects.

@ZOS_Gilliam @Gilliamtherogue @ZOS_GinaBruno, why is all of our feedback being continually ignored. We've shown you unambiguously how lacking Sorc is compared to DK, NB, or Warden, and it is ALL ignored. Instead we get a buff to shields that is SO SMALL it is completely meaningless. Why?

I completely missed that Mist Form is now a free movement gapcloser. Wow, that does suck for Sorcs. I guess that makes the portal from the Arcanist less meaningful in the process too, which I already thought was bad news for Sorcs.

Not exactly free movement as you can't steer it while in it, but it doesn't matter what direction you're facing as you choose the destination for it.

It also doesn't make you immune to melee and AoE damage during the traversal so it could potentially turn lethal if the incoming damage isn't a projectile. Also Elusive Mist's Major Evasion applies after the traversal so you'd need to cast it twice if planning to mist through let's say a choke point being filled with tons of AoE like Caltrops, Meatbag catapults, and the like.

virtus753

While I really appreciate the hybridization on jewelry, you've now left templars with absolutely zero group utility, downgraded from marginal.

Minor Breach is brought by every single physical damage skill, the melee taunt, and now frost wall. It used to be something templars were at least better at providing than others. I'm glad so many people now have access to it (no sarcasm), but there is zero acknowledgment that nothing has been done to replace this bit of class utility you completely diluted in adding it in so many contexts and to so many skills.

Minor Sorcery is now 100% irrelevant when you can get Minor Brutality from a DK for substantially more damage and far better support in terms of skills and sets. You have failed to acknowledge or address how Minor Sorcery and Minor Brutality are now in the vast majority of cases entirely interchangeable - same with Minor Prophecy and Savagery. Instead of bringing one of each of the four classes in a trial, optimized groups now bring the better of sorc or NB and the better of templar or DK (who are already dominant in the leaderboards and are now getting Major Berserk). Keeping the buffs spec-specific accomplishes nothing for class-specific power when the specs they buff are completely hybridized. Only in edge cases like running Warrior or Apprentice will Minor Sorcery make a difference now. That's not significant enough to consider templars' class buff worthy of the term group utility.

Other classes (like warden) can bring the minor regen buffs from Radiant Aura (which optimized templar dps are not running anyhow) and much more on top of that that templars can't. Don't get me wrong - I like the new Radiant Aura. It just isn't enough to make the class as a whole desirable over others in group PvE.

That is the question you have repeatedly failed to address: *why* bring a templar to group content, especially templar dps? It is now easy to argue it's selfish to play one because in the vast majority of cases you are actively hurting your group by bringing zero group utility and notably subpar damage. (That goes for PvP as well as PvE. The damage I do on my stamplar in PvP - same sets and nearly equivalent build - is incomparable to what I do on stamden, even though I've been playing stamplar for nearly six years and warden for maybe a month.) We should not be made to feel selfish for wanting to play a specific class, which is a core element of an RPG.

Every class needs to be valued for something. Every class needs to be able to bring something desirable. What has templar got left aside from a ridiculously OP magicka-only execute that cannot be blockcast and goes on a 1.8-second cooldown if you get interrupted during it? For all the complaints about the spammable being OP before, you've tried to balance the class by smacking the other end of the see-saw. That's not how balance works. Especially not when both morphs of said skill are magicka, meaning stamplar have comparatively limited ways of sustaining compared to magplars. (Same with Blazing Spear, the only class skill that can be used as a blockcastable spammable.)

But let me be clear: I don't want a stam morph of Spear or of Radiant Oppression. I don't want to take away from magplar. I want to feel that stamina templar has its own unique identity again rather than being a magplar in stam clothing. We had that once. Then you took away our infused jewelry and the other consequences of stamplar's unique class identity due to stacking weapon and spell damage better than any other class. In nerfing our stam class skills and buffing our class mag skills, especially the execute, you made the class feel like a magicka-based one even when played with stam glyphs. In addition to buffing the execute you also just now buffed Bloodthirsty, putting any hope of diversity there even further out of reach in most group play in PvE. You continue to ignore the original hybridized skill, Ritual of Retribution, in terms of the problematic scaling and how it explicitly violates your ground-based DoT rules. (You won't even acknowledge that it does so or how much that impinges on its practical use in content.) And you placed such a strain on our stam sustain that stamplars are forced to play hybrid (regardless of "how we want") if we want to be able to keep up any sort of rotation in PvE. In giving us a bit more sustain now with the changes to jewelry glyphs, you've taken away the last of our group utility. That's not a fair trade-off.

You have talked before about the "power fantasy" element and how crucial it is to RPGs. This is not it. [snip]

[edited for baiting]

DeathStalker

caesarvs wrote: »

DeathStalker wrote: »

As someone at the bottom of the damage numbers, all I can say is... pretty disappointing. When are we at the bottom going to be remembered? When are we going to be able to feel strong and not struggle? Light attack weaving and animation canceling should not be mandatory to clear content except for things like the hardest dungeons and trials. My hands hurt so much and get so stiff trying to do all the movements needed to do damage. So disappointing. Forgotten. Unimportant. Maybe one day people like me can play and feel strong and powerful but it doesn't seem to be anytime soon.

What?

Do you ever heard of oakensoul heavy attack builds? You can parse over 80k literally just pressing mouse button e using ultimate when ready.

The people at "bottom of damage numbers" never had a such favorable spot for doing good damage ever before

Those 80k builds are lies to those at the bottom. Every time you see one they are wearing end-game gear that those at the bottom can't get. take off all end-game gear, monster sets, and everything that a beginner or someone who can't run dungeons and trails doesn't have and the numbers you will see are way lower than 80k. WAY LOWER.

merpins

Warden, Sorc, Templar, NB player here. Here are my thoughts on the class balancing;

Warden:

The Cutting Dive morph change is nice. Too bad the animation on the skill still sucks, and the skill itself is probably the worst feeling skill to use just behind the Jabs rework. It's a good skill, don't get me wrong, but I would never use it. It's still baffling to me that this skill's animation didn't get touched despite it being universally disliked by Warden players, yet Jabs got an animation change despite no one asking for it and Templar mains calling for it to be changed back since before U35 even went live.

I play DPS so Crystalized Shield isn't a skill I have much insight on.

Sorc:

Ward and Execute buffs. These are fine, I like the idea of a bigger harder hitting Mages' Wrath. It needed a more substantial buff or some utility. U35 had new skill animations to skills people didn't want revamped in the first place, please rework some skills here that people aren't using, or buff the ones that are underperforming.

Templar:

Don't play it, won't play it. Templar is in its worst place it's been, and I'd be able to stomach it if OG Jabs was still a thing. But it's unplayable even if Jabs was fine, which it isn't.

Revert the Jabs change first.

NB:

Still hard to play. It requires too many skills for my square brain and stump hands to play properly. I can do higher DPS with 3 buttons on my Warden than I can with 12 buttons, all of which are important, on my NB. NB needs a bit of a rework IMO. Its kit is good, but it's just hard to play without loading the gameshark in my brain and blacking out during a boss only to wake up afterwards with carpal tunnel.

colossalvoids

DeathStalker wrote: »

caesarvs wrote: »

DeathStalker wrote: »

As someone at the bottom of the damage numbers, all I can say is... pretty disappointing. When are we at the bottom going to be remembered? When are we going to be able to feel strong and not struggle? Light attack weaving and animation canceling should not be mandatory to clear content except for things like the hardest dungeons and trials. My hands hurt so much and get so stiff trying to do all the movements needed to do damage. So disappointing. Forgotten. Unimportant. Maybe one day people like me can play and feel strong and powerful but it doesn't seem to be anytime soon.

What?

Do you ever heard of oakensoul heavy attack builds? You can parse over 80k literally just pressing mouse button e using ultimate when ready.

The people at "bottom of damage numbers" never had a such favorable spot for doing good damage ever before

Those 80k builds are lies to those at the bottom. Every time you see one they are wearing end-game gear that those at the bottom can't get. take off all end-game gear, monster sets, and everything that a beginner or someone who can't run dungeons and trails doesn't have and the numbers you will see are way lower than 80k. WAY LOWER.

Not sure why you're comparing people who put an effort and optimised and ones who didn't then? You still can clear all the game have to offer with what, 10k DPS? Then comes vet so you'll go like what 30-40, but you still probably want to do vet HMS without the gear and any optimization still? Tools are there, recent patches are absolute best time for newer players and ones looking for accessibility options, but you still need some basic effort, they can't handle over you "deeps" if you're not taking it.

MudcrabAttack

DeathStalker wrote: »

caesarvs wrote: »

DeathStalker wrote: »

As someone at the bottom of the damage numbers, all I can say is... pretty disappointing. When are we at the bottom going to be remembered? When are we going to be able to feel strong and not struggle? Light attack weaving and animation canceling should not be mandatory to clear content except for things like the hardest dungeons and trials. My hands hurt so much and get so stiff trying to do all the movements needed to do damage. So disappointing. Forgotten. Unimportant. Maybe one day people like me can play and feel strong and powerful but it doesn't seem to be anytime soon.

What?

Do you ever heard of oakensoul heavy attack builds? You can parse over 80k literally just pressing mouse button e using ultimate when ready.

The people at "bottom of damage numbers" never had a such favorable spot for doing good damage ever before

Those 80k builds are lies to those at the bottom. Every time you see one they are wearing end-game gear that those at the bottom can't get. take off all end-game gear, monster sets, and everything that a beginner or someone who can't run dungeons and trails doesn't have and the numbers you will see are way lower than 80k. WAY LOWER.

Sergeants mail and Slimecraw come from wayrest sewers, stormmaster comes from tempest isle. That’s basically it to max out HA build, no fancy sets needed

acastanza_ESO

DeathStalker wrote: »

caesarvs wrote: »

DeathStalker wrote: »

As someone at the bottom of the damage numbers, all I can say is... pretty disappointing. When are we at the bottom going to be remembered? When are we going to be able to feel strong and not struggle? Light attack weaving and animation canceling should not be mandatory to clear content except for things like the hardest dungeons and trials. My hands hurt so much and get so stiff trying to do all the movements needed to do damage. So disappointing. Forgotten. Unimportant. Maybe one day people like me can play and feel strong and powerful but it doesn't seem to be anytime soon.

What?

Do you ever heard of oakensoul heavy attack builds? You can parse over 80k literally just pressing mouse button e using ultimate when ready.

The people at "bottom of damage numbers" never had a such favorable spot for doing good damage ever before

Those 80k builds are lies to those at the bottom. Every time you see one they are wearing end-game gear that those at the bottom can't get. take off all end-game gear, monster sets, and everything that a beginner or someone who can't run dungeons and trails doesn't have and the numbers you will see are way lower than 80k. WAY LOWER.

This is untrue. They are using two dungeon sets from easy to farm dungeons, and the oakensoul ring. They are extremely easy builds to put together.

Azyle1

I just wonder if Stam Warden will be good in PVE now with this cutting dive change.

DeathStalker

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

DeathStalker wrote: »

caesarvs wrote: »

DeathStalker wrote: »

As someone at the bottom of the damage numbers, all I can say is... pretty disappointing. When are we at the bottom going to be remembered? When are we going to be able to feel strong and not struggle? Light attack weaving and animation canceling should not be mandatory to clear content except for things like the hardest dungeons and trials. My hands hurt so much and get so stiff trying to do all the movements needed to do damage. So disappointing. Forgotten. Unimportant. Maybe one day people like me can play and feel strong and powerful but it doesn't seem to be anytime soon.

What?

Do you ever heard of oakensoul heavy attack builds? You can parse over 80k literally just pressing mouse button e using ultimate when ready.

The people at "bottom of damage numbers" never had a such favorable spot for doing good damage ever before

Those 80k builds are lies to those at the bottom. Every time you see one they are wearing end-game gear that those at the bottom can't get. take off all end-game gear, monster sets, and everything that a beginner or someone who can't run dungeons and trails doesn't have and the numbers you will see are way lower than 80k. WAY LOWER.

This is untrue. They are using two dungeon sets from easy to farm dungeons, and the oakensoul ring. They are extremely easy builds to put together.

I rest my case, not possible without dungeon sets

K9002

I'm watching a stream of the new dungeons and the cap on light attack damage seems too low. It looks like it should be in the 4000 to 4200 range. 3850 might have been better before blue CP stars got nerfed but now, not so much. Opportunities for improving LA damage also vary between classes:
DK improves fire staff attacks with World in Ruin (5%) and Engulfing Flames (6%).
Sorcerer improves lightning staff and any physical weapon LAs with Energized (5%).
Warden improves ice staff attacks with Piercing Cold (12%).

Other classes have more limited ways of improving their light attacks with any of the weapons, all of which are also accessible and stacking with the class passives. Fire staves also get a little ahead of other weapons thanks to Encratis' Behemoth. Please, consider helping other types of weapons too.

heaven13

I'm sure someone has already pointed it out but DKs and templars had similar reasoning for some changes in some vastly different approaches that feel incredibly unbalanced.

• Dragonknight: Chains of Devastation: This morph now grants Major Berserk for 10 seconds after casting, rather than Empower, as Molten Armaments already grants it in a much more effect way.
• Templar: Everlasting Sweep: Increased the duration of the pulsing Damage over Time to 10 seconds at base, up from 6 seconds.This morph no longer grants Empower, as Solar Flare and its morphs already grant this buff.

So DKs get an added named buff (and a major one) and templars get...4 more seconds of pulsing damage? Seems balanced.

acastanza_ESO

DeathStalker wrote: »

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

DeathStalker wrote: »

caesarvs wrote: »

DeathStalker wrote: »

As someone at the bottom of the damage numbers, all I can say is... pretty disappointing. When are we at the bottom going to be remembered? When are we going to be able to feel strong and not struggle? Light attack weaving and animation canceling should not be mandatory to clear content except for things like the hardest dungeons and trials. My hands hurt so much and get so stiff trying to do all the movements needed to do damage. So disappointing. Forgotten. Unimportant. Maybe one day people like me can play and feel strong and powerful but it doesn't seem to be anytime soon.

What?

Do you ever heard of oakensoul heavy attack builds? You can parse over 80k literally just pressing mouse button e using ultimate when ready.

The people at "bottom of damage numbers" never had a such favorable spot for doing good damage ever before

Those 80k builds are lies to those at the bottom. Every time you see one they are wearing end-game gear that those at the bottom can't get. take off all end-game gear, monster sets, and everything that a beginner or someone who can't run dungeons and trails doesn't have and the numbers you will see are way lower than 80k. WAY LOWER.

This is untrue. They are using two dungeon sets from easy to farm dungeons, and the oakensoul ring. They are extremely easy builds to put together.

I rest my case, not possible without dungeon sets

Sets from basegame dungeons. Not even DLC, and not even monster sets that need to be acquired on vet. These are extremely easy to acquire. The game simply can not cater to people unwilling to even run normal difficulty basegame dungeons. That isn't reasonable.

Lixen

Good job on block change (revert to what it was few years ago, but I take it) and in-combat dummy reset feature.

Harmony and mist for changes are mainly focused on pvp I believe since you've already gutted pve use of mist form. Harmony change basically makes this trait useless unless you make it very strong and OP for pve. New mist form = non-sorc ball of lightning, it's better than what it is now with pvp tank meta and tower trolls, but I suspect some classes may be able to pull off some broken combos with it, we'll see.

New sets are all bad and not useful in high end pve/pvp content except some nieche situation as they are now. I don't have problem with that, there are plenty of strong sets in the game and I don't think we need further power creep. It'd be nice to see some sets, especially rarely used trial ones to be updated: perfected version of gear for old trials (easy fix), all-time useless 5-piece bonuses of trial sets like nahvi, galenwe, stone-talker, and most crafted/overland/dungeon sets (you have the stats, pick couple of least used sets each quarter and tweak them a bit and let people play with them). You did a good job with DSR sets, they are all useful and strong, but not to a level that people use them in every encounter.

Where's the finishing of hybridization? I'm carrying 2 sets of gold jewels with different enchants different types of food and potions to make my setups work in different groups. Please prioritize this half-finished work. It'll help your server performance too...

Where's the leaderboard fix update? According to your own site's comment on this issue [snip] it's a visual bug [snip]

[edited for baiting]

schoober

Mist form looks awesome. Thanks ZOS, after all those nerfs vampires got.

React

Wrecking blow has a severe targeting issue. Dizzying swing does NOT have this issue, ONLY the wrecking blow morph has this issue.

The bug: With the wrecking blow morph of uppercut, if you character model turns slightly away from the target you are channeling the ability on, it instantly cancels the channel. This is extremely problematic in PVP, where players are frequently moving around and the server struggles to establish precise locations. This bug is not present on the dizzying swing morph, only on the wrecking blow morph. This doesn't occur if your camera moves away, but only if your character model turns away, as seen in the clip below.

It is so great to finally see this ability getting a much needed buff, and I am excited to once again have the option of playing an uppercut build in PVP - but PLEASE fix this targeting issue so that the skill is useable.

https://streamable.com/z3o92z

godchucknzilla

ForumBully wrote: »

Not to diminish the weaknesses of Necros in PvP, but I'm so sick of Harmony that I'd rather have that last crutch kicked out from under the class so that, just maybe, they'll finally see there's a problem with the class design.
Harmony is literally the only thing keeping them relevant, and it's played out and boring.

This guy says it all, you can't removed the only unique necro playstyle to see how absolutely lacking the necro is.

With how Tanky everyone is due to CP, Mythics, and Battlespirit, synergy damage will be too low without harmony to have any impact at all.

[snip] The #1 thing Alliance War needs is an adjustment to cross healing in full groups who are lagging the server and grieifing the rest of the population. The tank meta is no joke, and if whoever came up with the change to hamony, actually played pvp extensively they would see harmony isn't that strong after getting hit by a 20k Assasin Will, 15k Incap, and 10k Impale.

[edited for baiting]

acastanza_ESO

Lixen wrote: »

Where's the finishing of hybridization? I'm carrying 2 sets of gold jewels with different enchants different types of food and potions to make my setups work in different groups. Please prioritize this half-finished work. It'll help your server performance too...

You must've missed it! They actually addressed Weapon/Spell damage glyph hybridization in this patch notes! You will no longer need two different enchants, unless you want to get a little bit of extra sustain for your off-resource. It's a great change!

XomRhoK

• Overall i like the idea of elusive gameplay with Mist form, often go in and out of Mist form create really good vampiric atmosphere and gameplay.
• At this point, Mist form skills are bugged, character just don't streak to the pointed direction with any settings of ground targeting, he only streaks if Mist form used second time in a raw or if any other skill were used right before using Mist form. Seems not all players affected by this bug.
  And another bug, where character try to streak to Invalid location and regain all magicka, but still receive all buffs. Potentially can be abused.
• Animation of casting Mist form need to be changed, in my opinion. It must be instant witout any scream and movement from the character, because now it looks more like a jump forward with scream, not a elusive movement.
• Elusive mist skill seems ok at the moment in terms how it looks and feel.
• Blood mist, in the other hand, looks and feel bad, in my opinion. Animation of ground effect is bad, it's just a red puddle, looks very cheap and not atmospheric, with mist on top of that puddle it looks acceptable, but without mist, just under the character model it looks bad. DOT last for long 20 seconds, it take away this cool feeling of constant transforming in and out of Mist form. Better make it similar to bat swarm streak that NPC vampires have with cool animation and instant AoE damage, or if you want to keep DOT damage make it last for 4-10 seconds, just to keep reasons to use this skill more often.
  At the begining of the video you can see NPC vampire streak.

caesarvs

DeathStalker wrote: »

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

DeathStalker wrote: »

caesarvs wrote: »

DeathStalker wrote: »

As someone at the bottom of the damage numbers, all I can say is... pretty disappointing. When are we at the bottom going to be remembered? When are we going to be able to feel strong and not struggle? Light attack weaving and animation canceling should not be mandatory to clear content except for things like the hardest dungeons and trials. My hands hurt so much and get so stiff trying to do all the movements needed to do damage. So disappointing. Forgotten. Unimportant. Maybe one day people like me can play and feel strong and powerful but it doesn't seem to be anytime soon.

What?

Do you ever heard of oakensoul heavy attack builds? You can parse over 80k literally just pressing mouse button e using ultimate when ready.

The people at "bottom of damage numbers" never had a such favorable spot for doing good damage ever before

Those 80k builds are lies to those at the bottom. Every time you see one they are wearing end-game gear that those at the bottom can't get. take off all end-game gear, monster sets, and everything that a beginner or someone who can't run dungeons and trails doesn't have and the numbers you will see are way lower than 80k. WAY LOWER.

This is untrue. They are using two dungeon sets from easy to farm dungeons, and the oakensoul ring. They are extremely easy builds to put together.

I rest my case, not possible without dungeon sets

Lol, if you don't want to put minimal (and I mean MINIMAL) effort on clearing normal base game dungeons, which can be achieved only using skills, no light or heavy attack needed, it tells more about your lack of willingness than the game itself.

Lixen

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

Lixen wrote: »

Where's the finishing of hybridization? I'm carrying 2 sets of gold jewels with different enchants different types of food and potions to make my setups work in different groups. Please prioritize this half-finished work. It'll help your server performance too...

You must've missed it! They actually addressed Weapon/Spell damage glyph hybridization in this patch notes! You will no longer need two different enchants, unless you want to get a little bit of extra sustain for your off-resource. It's a great change!

Thanks, yea, I jumped to the next section and missed that one sentence of vague promise, at least it's mentioned and as long as things are moving it's good.

Edit: I missed the details too, now only if they fix potions and do something about minor buffs it'll be awesome.

Yamenstein

Can a dev please explain the harmony/boneyard nerfs in relation to necro pvp? Is there plans to buff necros or fix up several skills in their skill lines?

Yamenstein

XomRhoK wrote: »

• Overall i like the idea of elusive gameplay with Mist form, often go in and out of Mist form create really good vampiric atmosphere and gameplay.
• At this point, Mist form skills are bugged, character just don't streak to the pointed direction with any settings of ground targeting, he only streaks if Mist form used second time in a raw or if any other skill were used right before using Mist form. Seems not all players affected by this bug.
  And another bug, where character try to streak to Invalid location and regain all magicka, but still receive all buffs. Potentially can be abused.
• Animation of casting Mist form need to be changed, in my opinion. It must be instant witout any scream and movement from the character, because now it looks more like a jump forward with scream, not a elusive movement.
• Elusive mist skill seems ok at the moment in terms how it looks and feel.
• Blood mist, in the other hand, looks and feel bad, in my opinion. Animation of ground effect is bad, it's just a red puddle, looks very cheap and not atmospheric, with mist on top of that puddle it looks acceptable, but without mist, just under the character model it looks bad. DOT last for long 20 seconds, it take away this cool feeling of constant transforming in and out of Mist form. Better make it similar to bat swarm streak that NPC vampires have with cool animation and instant AoE damage, or if you want to keep DOT damage make it last for 4-10 seconds, just to keep reasons to use this skill more often.
  At the begining of the video you can see NPC vampire streak.

As long as the ability stays as it currently is, I honestly doubt they are going to change animations/sounds. The vampire spammable sounds like I'm slapping someone and they made that change ages ago.

ZoS devs have great ideas (at times) but then when they go and implement them it ends up being a miss, and rarely a hit.

Their best ideas and money spent will be on new classes - because it forces players to start from the beginning. Which in turns mean more time spent in game to spend on crown stores - or just generally to skip content that the player has already completed. Like skyshards or skill lines.