PTS Update 33 - Feedback Thread for Account Wide Achievements

Dark_Lord_Kuro

I love this change as described in the patch note (even if i cant test as as ps player)

I guess you could add an opt out option for those who seem to only play to get new acheivement

With the map and zone guide it will be simple egnough to know where quest remain to be done on my alts( on that note: can we get more slots anytime soon?)

Tandor

Just to confirm that if Character A has earned an achievement first, it will show on your other characters' achievements list by the date on which Character A earned it, and if you hover over the achievement it will show Character A's name. If you now delete Character A, and load in e.g. Character B, it will still show the achievement Character A earned and the date on which it was earned, but when you hover over the achievement no name will be shown as that name no longer exists.

Meanwhile neither Character B nor any other of your characters has any reason to do the content that produced the achievement as (a) they already have it, and (b) it is confirmed that it will not result in a pop-up or other acknowledgement. This greatly reduces the re-playability of the game for those who regard gaining and recording individual achievements as an integral part of playing any or all of their characters through the game.

Jaraal

I worked my butt off to get Gray Host Emperor title for eight of my characters. My long term goal was to get it for all sixteen. But in one fell swoop, ZOS has killed my motivation to grind, by “gifting” me the achievements. I see myself only playing enough now to get my tier 3 rewards, and that’s it. And a lot of the hardcore AvAers I’ve spoken with feel the same way. The entire experience will be cheapened when 90% of the players are Former Emperors and Grand Overlords, most of them characters that didn’t actually earn the titles. And, for the record, I’ve never worn the Former Emperor title on any of my guys. It’s the principle of the thing that hurts. It’s like all that time and AP was wasted. It was like the awesome feeling of crossing the finish line after running a marathon, and being awarded a medal for your hard work. But now, all you have to do is drive up to the parking lot and ZOS is handing you your medal through the car window.

Ironically, do you think ZOS will give us account wide tier 3 achievements and rewards if we only do it on one character? I think you already know the answer to that.

heaven13

As I posted in the General Forum:

What I would really like to see is:

• Global Achievements: this adds all achievements across all characters, like the PC addon does. If this is all you care about, you never have to change the tab and see what any particular character is missing. Can make this where dyes are located, since they are already awarded to the account anyway.
• Character Achievements: pretty much the same as now so quest progress, dungeon/trial achievements, guild progress, etc is tracked per character for those that prefer such gameplay. This keeps things like justice, vampire/werewolf, etc unique to each character.
• Added Account Achievements: new achievements to promote playing multiple characters and/or to adjust the tedium of certain grindy achievements
  • Reach level 50 on each class
  • Defeat an emperor of each alliance (or grand overlord or something)
  • Stop the planemeld with each class
  • Move vet dungeon slayer achievements here
  • Possibly move monster trophies here since they are so, so grindy and have such horrible drop rates

I feel that this would be the best possible compromise to give to those who are tired of their main but feel locked in to that choice while not taking away from those who enjoy the effort and progress of each individual character as a separate entity. It would also promote playing with alts and perhaps encourage people to try a new class.

I will add that the current way of tracking as reported by @silvereyes here is just AWFUL. This would be one of those things that you could move to the Account Achievements section as I noted above. I'm not sure if I'll need to log in backwards with my characters or with my main first to mitigate the horrendous implementation of this half-baked idea but I know it's not going to matter either way. Might as well just start playing the meta each patch and screw the RPG aspect of this game.

I've unsubbed, I'm that unhappy with this.

Jim_Pipp

Another vote for "optional".

I really think this idea isn't fully thought through.

E.g.
One of my long-term projects is collecting the precursor target dummy from clockwork city on every character. A few characters haven't done it yet, but how will I know which ones if they all have the achievement? How will I know which pieces I've already found and installed when earning it? The character bound achievement tells you which pieces you still need. If this works how I think it will make some repeatable activities completely unplayable.

DarcyMardin

When I first heard about the change, I didn’t think I’d care one way or the other. But now that I see how it’s implemented, with individual characters’ progress and dates they completed this or that achievement being wiped out of existence, I am against the change. Some of us have been here since beta, slowly making new characters…and now the record of what we’ve achieved on each one is being deleted? This is seriously messed up!

I don’t particularly care about titles, although I understand that a lot of folks work hard for their alts’ individual titles. But I do care about knowing which of my characters have done what and when.

I know from experience that once something goes on the PTS, it rarely gets changed or reverted, but this implementation looks ham-fisted. I’d go so far as to say it will be devastating to some players. Is there at least a way to make it optional? Or to add a tab that saves each alt’s personal progress?

ExoY

With all toons having now access to all titles unlocked, I think some sort of Title Management would be very helpfull.

It could be as simple as

• Having them sorted alphabetically
• Add a little search bar

I just scrolled through the title list four times looking for a specific title until i finally found it.

perfiction

This is such an overkill, wow. All you had to do was implement Kyoma's Global Achievements into base game (achievements tracked per character, option to display/link achievements of specific character without the need to relog, additional account-wide summary view).

Fully account wide achievements are killing the replayability of more difficult dungeon/trial content, as well as more time consuming overland content (rip the guy who got 18 master anglers). At least add completion info to the achievement tooltip and link (list of characters who unlocked the achievement with timestamps).

heaven13

A couple other thoughts:

• How are y'all going to meet your marketing quotas for chapter events? If all my characters already have the achievement for the POI for the chapter because ONE character did it, your numbers for people logging in and doing things are going to be much lower. I went to Blackwood on so many characters this previous event. Now I can one and done it. Will your numbers be adjusted to account for this or are you somehow expecting that you'll have that many extra players that the magic counter will still be impressive?
• I have a character who is a fully RP character. I use True Exploration, Slow Dialogues, and have turned off all quest markers. I utilize achievements to see if she has found all the POI, if she has talked to enough people to find all/most of the side quests, etc as a way of checking her progress. By giving her all the achievements of my main, she won't have any way of doing this.

This is ill-conceived, poorly implemented, and can be done better/has been done so much better by addon authors.

silvereyes

Wolfkeks wrote: »

While I love getting account wide achievements I'm seeing lots of peeps who are unhappy about it.

Would it be possible to make a tab for character and one tab for account achievements so peeps can track which character did a certain achievement? Or make a note on that achievement if it was done on that char or on the account?

DeathStalker wrote: »

Love the change but would be nice to try to include others by making it optional

Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »

I love this change as described in the patch note (even if i cant test as as ps player)

I guess you could add an opt out option for those who seem to only play to get new acheivement

I just wanted to say that I really appreciate it when I see players advocating for other players out of a sense of empathy for them. It isn't often that I come to the Internet - especially an online forum - and my faith in humanity increases. Thanks folks!

Dolgubon

This change is extremely disappointing to me. While I do use and like kyoma's global achievements, I also greatly enjoy having the character specific information. I like knowing that my tank got an achievement on x date, and my DPS got it on y date. To have all that information wiped out, and for that info to not be curated in the future sucks. And it also removes a lot (though not all) of the motivation to do prog groups on other toons. The best implementation would have been something like kyoma's global achievements, with a tab for character specific, and a tab for account wide achievements.

willymancer69

Seconded! Very wholesome and heartwarming to see the unified support

tmbrinks

I've been thinking over the last few hours, trying to process it all. I've settled on a single word.

Disrespected.

I feel like my time has been disrespected.
I feel like my loyalty (and money paid) has been disrespected.
I feel like any feedback I've given has been disrespected.

Disrespected.

I don't think I've seen such immediate and visceral feedback on a change in a long time. I just hope somebody is actually listening.

Jaraal

It’s interesting to note that the people against this change are giving detailed explanations as to why they feel it’s wrong. On the other hand, the folks in favor are mostly giving generalized praise as to why they like it. “I’m so happy about this change!” “It’s good for the game!” Well, let’s hear exactly what it is that makes this such a good thing for you.

peacenote

LtSnowballin wrote: »

Raevenglass wrote: »

I'd like to add my voice to making this optional.

Or if not, be a bit more mindful as to what titles should be shared. Do I want to do all the holiday events on every one of my characters for the titles? No. I would love that to be account-wide.

But should my character have Savior of X - if they haven't been to X or completed any of those quests? That doesn't make sense to me.

If Character X gained Emperor in Cyrodill, should all their characters have that title? That doesn't make sense. My healer cleared vet Sunspire so my new tank should have that title too?

I'm not seeing where the benefit is in having account-wide achievements for most things, especially for those of us who like the questing and adventuring on different characters. I also like clearing end-game content on different characters and want the option of earning those titles for each character given how different game play is for each.

Could someone explain where the benefit is?

People aren't forced to do content (Especially HARD content) again to get a title for a toon they want it on. Especially for cases like my own, where I had to do my 3 GS's ALL on Magcro because no group would let me do any other role. Same goes for dungeon trifecta titles or anything else of the sort. There's ALOT of benefits for people, just need to look past yourself. ->

Which again, the opt-in option would be GREAT for some people that do want to do that, more power to you. Have it so the people who don't want to farm everything out on multiple characters aren't forced to in order to get a title they want for that toon, or etc.. It also allows them to add in the new collectibles, furnishings, etc... For completing and farming trifecta or just in general hard content which will bring back the "Replayability" or "Incentive" people are trying to argue with. And if someone doesn't want to be opted in then more power to them and allow them to refarm everything out for themselves.

I just want to point out here that since dyes and collectibles are available account-wide after one character earns them, it is extremely likely that titles could be changed to work the exact same way with very little coding effort.

We do not need account-wide achievements to get account-wide titles. If anything, the extremely strong feelings on both sides about titles are muddying the waters for the pro's and con's of account-wide only achievements.

The way I see it, account-wide titles happen to be in the same patch as account-wide achievements.

Pretend for a moment we got account-wide titles years ago. In that case, what, then, is the benefit to having ONLY account-wide achievements and losing data about what our individual characters have done?

I'm 100% in favor of an account-wide view/tab, btw. I'm just against losing the ability to also track character-specific info. The add-on available for PC that shows us both is, imo, a perfect example of how I would like to see it done in base game. I do not mind if titles become account-wide although I understand why some folks are so against it. I also wouldn't care if titles stayed as-is... either way is fine by me.

etchedpixels

So now I can't tell what dungeons and group events or questlines I need to go get the skill points from on a given character. This is really really screwed up and broken.

Account wide achievements are a great idea but implementing them by deleting all the existing ones and mashing stuff up so all the addons break and you can't actually see important things you need to know like dungeon progress per character is actually dumber than dark convergence.

Danel_Vadan

I love this. Good to not have to do annoying achievements on alts and be able to switch on the fly without worry.
I do think that completing endgame content should have more rewards, maybe similar to how vAS has an additional polymorph---which can be sold and incentivizes replays. Some things could be mounts (less flashy than trifecta mounts), outfits, exclusive trial motifs, mementos, and all other assorted stuff.

Zyva

I really hope things do not go live as they are. I hate it. My reaction upon logging onto pts and seeing all my alts now have the same progress as my main is awful.

I used achievements as a way to track their gameplay. What I'd accomplished on each class. What my tank vs healer vs dps have done. And I got many specific achievements across characters with different groups of friends; to see all that bundled together just... sucks. a lot.

I had one specific character that me and a friend were ONLY playing together, with the intention of getting every achievement in the game over again together. Now what? Were 1/3 the way through and it feels like its all for nothing. Those dates will all be lost even, losing the timeline.

Is it too much to ask zos to have a separate tab for account wide vs character based?? So we dont lose our character specific accomplishments???

tomofhyrule

I'll take whatever we get, but I definitely preferred character-based to this. At least for the bulk of the achievements.

The Housing and Champion achievements are essentially account-wide already. I'd love also to see Monster Trophies end up account wide. I'd also love an account overview so I could see the score over my entire account. In terms of Titles, I see them as any other cosmetic like skins/mounts, so I have no issue sharing them as well.

But it does feel like the characters are losing their personal histories with this change. I think something like the Global Achievement addon would be perfect, rather than just seeing all of my alts' data wiped completely. It does help to see what other characters still need to do in game. For some activities, it now requires us to keep our own external spreadsheets/journals to see what characters have done/still need to do.

SirrLantzalot

(This is my first forum post, never had a forum account, so hopefully I don’t do anything wrong)

My thoughts on the account-wide achievement system:

I’m a day 1 player (Xbox) and my main character was created on day 2. That means that for nearly 7 years I have been working towards my ultimate goal of earning every achievement on my main. This change is effectively washing out 7 years of work towards that goal. I’m over 90% complete at this point, but I don’t want some achievements that I may not have on my main just granted because I got them on a fluke run on a different character. I want to earn each and every achievement on them.

Quite frankly, I know a lot of remarks are based on the validity of titles if they’re account-wide, but I don’t really care about that aspect. If people want to run titles on whatever characters, that’s fine, they can do that. I know that personally, I won’t run a title on a character that hasn’t actually completed the requirement anyways, I have control over that. What I don’t have control over are achievements that I don’t want unlocked on certain characters being automatically unlocked. My only option to avoid it at this point would be to never log in to another character until my main toon can be guaranteed to have any and all achievements unlocked already that any other character may have gotten unknowingly.

I know there are others like me whose goal is to max out the achievements on a single toon, granted idk if there are a lot of us, but I do know we exist. I also know there are people who like to earn or deny certain achievements of specific characters in order to build that character’s personality. For example, maybe they want one character to be devious so they’ll go for the Murderer achievement, or they want an innocent character so they will avoid all achievements that are rewarded for illegal actions in Tamriel. Also, some people like to feel the sense of accomplishment for earning something via achievement or just earning the achievement itself.

The way I see it, is that currently the achievement system doesn’t hurt anyone. People who want to earn them all on one character or specific characters can, and people who want achievements/titles on multiple toons can, just with a little more work (i.e. playing the game) but they are always able to earn them at some point going forward. The new system takes something away from people, such as myself, who want those achievements in specific ways, and we can never get that back, even after 7 years of working towards it (8 potentially for PC players).

All I ask is that something is done to not make all of this work and these aspects that make the game fun for people invalidated. Whether that is by making the entire system optional by if someone wants their achievements to sync or not. Another option is to allow there to be a filter to where you can sort achievements by character and see all the same details regarding what’s unlocked, what’s not unlocked, how many achievement points have been earned on a character by character basis. Essentially the same exact stuff you can see currently when you go to Journal>Achievements per character. And to be extra clear, I (and many others in this same camp) am not asking for the whole system to be scrapped. I’m not trying to prevent people who want account-wide achievements from having them. I’m just asking that it either be optional, or have the ability to continue to track individual characters’ achievement progress as can currently be done.

It’s constantly preached (even as recent as this global reveal back on Jan. 27th) how ESO is meant to be for the player to create their journey the way they want to play it, but removing the ability to track individual toons’ achievement progress is completely contradictory to that message. Please, for all of us achievement collectors and the like, understand how much this change affects and means to us.

peacenote

I don't have space for PTS but I can give feedback on some questions based on the nice folks that have posted screenshots and shared info in this thread. I"ll put the most important thing first.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Do you have any other general feedback?

@ZOS_GinaBruno ESO has been my hobby since 2014. I am heartbroken and devastated to think that all of my character-specific dates and memories will now be erased. I have never, ever been more disappointed and saddened by a change in ESO than I have been with this one. Please consider re-working this new functionality to mirror what we get with this mod by Kyoma. Also incorporate a toggle so anyone can see JUST the global or character-specific view if they so choose.

Somewhere along the line, someone in ZOS may have forgotten that a big part of what makes ESO special is its support and embrace of nostalgia. Why have there been ESO releases based around Skyrim, and Morrowind? Why do you feature artifact styles (which cannot be dyed!) in the Crown Store? Why do certain characters come back in new story content? It's because the folks at the helm understand that the whole ESO world and many of its players absolutely love that nostalgia.

Given all this, it seems especially tone deaf that you would release a feature which erases all character specific progress and dates. Character-specific achievements build upon the regular Elder Scrolls nostalgia and creates additional nostalgia to longtime players in your game. Seeing all the feedback in this thread, it makes me think there really wasn't awareness that players who like to relive their Skyrim days or will shell out real money to wield a weapon that existed in ES Arena, Daggerfall, and Morrowind also might be passionate about knowing exactly what days they achieved certain things.

Have some people been asking for this? Yes. However it's important for ZOS to understand that many people in favor of this just want account-wide titles. Many others would be perfectly happy with the addition of a global view. Only the folks who believe it will solve end game toxicity and the folks who feel they MUST do EVERY SINGLE ACHIEVEMENT would be dissatisfied... and even then you're looking at a much smaller population of unhappy people than you are with this current implementation. There are other ways we can address end game toxicity... like better balancing classes so they all bring benefits to a raid and improving rewards for harder content, keeping them separate from achievements.

I have written several detailed posts on this topic and I won't repeat all of that here. I'll just link to them so you can find them easily. I hope you find them helpful. Please reconsider making some tweaks to what's on PTS.

Additional Info #1
Additional Info #2
Additional Info #3

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

This is the official feedback thread for account wide Achievements. Specific feedback that the team is looking for includes the following:

• Did you notice any achievements were missed or didn’t get captured the way you expected?
  

I would LIKE it to have an account wide tab that shows achieved date by the earliest date completed, and for character-specific views to remain intact and leave the character specific date.

If all data is collapsed, I would EXPECT it to use the date of the earliest date completed, rewriting achieved date as each character logs in to do this. For roll-up achievements that require other achievements to get the parent one, I'd expect the date to be the earliest date any of my characters did the roll-up. If the dates are spread across characters with no one character having the roll-up until the data is collapsed, I'd expect it to show the earliest date all four things were done across all my characters. So for example if my main achieved three things on 1/2/2015 and my alt achieved the fourth thing on 1/4/2017 and another alt achieved the fourth thing on 5/7/2019, the roll-up achievement for the global accomplishment should be 1/4/2017.

Neither is what seems to be happening.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

This is the official feedback thread for account wide Achievements. Specific feedback that the team is looking for includes the following:

Is it clear which achievements are still character-centered?

Not really. Having a mixed view like that is very confusing. It should be a separate view for account-wide and character-specific regardless of whether you adapt to feedback and give us both views for ALL achievements or keep the methodology you have on PTS.

TLDR: Ty for reading. Please give us both account-wide and character-specific achievements and let players decide whether they can see both or just one or the other.

Mauin

1. Did you notice any achievements were missed or didn’t get captured the way you expected?
No. Everything worked as expected once I had logged on with all of my characters.
2. Did you find your current Motif and Enchantment knowledge?
Yes.
3. Did you still have all your previously earned titles?
Yes.
4. Is it clear which achievements are still character-centered?
Yes.
5. Do you have any other general feedback?
Personally, I'm very much in favor of this change. I suffer from chronic illness and don't necessarily have the time, energy, or ability to repeat achievements I have already earned. To be frank, I also don't care for repeating trifecta achievements (or getting one, really), but if I did, I would do so to help a friend get it, not because I needed the achievement myself on different characters. I see no value in the achievements themselves beyond that little number it gives you on the achievement screen, and even then that number itself means nothing to me. It's not the achievement that matters, but the time spent getting there.

Additionally, this is a boost for the stories of my characters as they can now access the titles that the others have earned. Example: one character is a ruthless hunter of political dissidents, and had been using the Mageslayer title, even though I would have preferred using The Merciless on him (which my Stamden earned). Now, I can actually use the most appropriate title on him (and others like him).

On one final note, this change also relieves some of the tedious grind from the game. Frankly, the achievements for farming monster trophies have been one of the most obnoxious RNG battles ever since the trophies were changed to being bound to the character that gets them. It took me around 5 years to get the Mudcrab trophy item even with farming, and I am quite happy to have these achievements combined. I am now much closer to having them completed, and I won't be frustrated when the trophy drops on another character anymore. The same applies to dailies (Undaunted Pledges and the like), and the slayer achievements in dungeons, as I tend to use multiple characters (typically whatever role is needed a the time/what I feel like playing), thus removing the feeling that I *need* to use the same character for everything.

TiaFrye

Thank you for account wide titles with this. With how BGs are now it's the only way I would be able to have appropriate and immersive previously earned titles on some later made alts.

Let the vocal people have their optionality if it's what they are asking but a lot more of us asked for this change for a long time. A few addons and no one will ever remember they need tracking or pop-ups in a few months because modders will find a way to make it. Or maybe it will be an official addition. On release or in the next update.

Just don't take back hope from people who are very exited for this change only because they have no need to bombard the forums.

static_recharge

Did you notice any achievements were missed or didn’t get captured the way you expected?
Nothing that I noticed.

Did you find your current Motif and Enchantment knowledge?
Did not look yet.

Did you still have all your previously earned titles?
Did not look yet.

Is it clear which achievements are still character-centered?
No? Other than the list in the patch notes I don't see how this is highlighted in game.

Do you have any other general feedback?
Yes. Why is this pair of achievements highlighted in blue with points around it? What is the significance?

silvereyes

etchedpixels wrote: »

So now I can't tell what dungeons and group events or questlines I need to go get the skill points from on a given character.

While I preferred accessing all this information from the achievements screen, it is still possible to track most or all of that information in various places.

For dungeons, trials and arenas, you can use the icons on the map to see if the quest has been completed. I have tested this on PTS, and it still works.

Edit: However, on a second character, all information about whether dungeons, trials and arenas are completed on vet mode seems to be lost, as well as any challenges like speed runs, no-deaths, hard modes and trifectas.

Dungeon icon without completed quest


Dungeon icon with completed quest


For public dungeon and delve quests, you can use the same indicator icons on the map.

Edit: delve quests were never, and still are not, tracked by map icons. I don't know why I originally wrote that, but it is false.

For public dungeon group events, those are still tracked at the individual character level, so you can still use the Achievements for those. Character-level achievements are the one's with blue titles, with the little blue person's head icon to the left of the title.

For story quests and skyshards, there is the Zone Guide.


I hope this helps a bit.

silvereyes

static_recharge wrote: »

Do you have any other general feedback?
Yes. Why is this pair of achievements highlighted in blue with points around it? What is the significance?

Those achievements are tracked by character, although the titles are account-wide, still. For example, this brand new character I made on PTS does not have the achievments:


Even though many of my other characters do, unlocking the Stormproof title for my level 3 character

Sheezabeast

Unfortunately I do not have room on my comp to download the PTS right now. Could someone check something out for me?

I love looking back on my oldest characters and seeing when they hit benchmarks, like Slaughterfished achievement, or Level 10, seeing back in 2014 or 2015 when they got it. Will these achievements and dates be gone completely once they merge?

Will this be like the mail being deleted that we had from Post-Beta being deleted and being told to just screenshot it before it is gone forever? Do I need to take screenshots of all my achievements with my old dates for memories sake? Will they be gone forever?

Hamboot

There is something in this game called immersion, sense of progression, RP identity (in an mmo*RP*g), this change completely ruin that feeling, the feeling of progress and change and adventure on your own char, how would you explain having a char just created yesterday running around with GO rank? I don't want to see all titles in title section, I only want to see titles that I earned on my current toon, how would you explain a title like Champion of The Aldmeri Dominion on a char that has never ever completed that achievement (hello solo questing?? a thing a big chunk of your player base do on a regular basis including me???) the simple fact of seeing it in the list of titles and not being able to earn it again freakin sucks and remove any sense of immersion, RP identity (in an mmo*RP*g) and sense of progression that each char is supposed to have, please reconsider this change or at the very least, make it a toggle in the settings giving people *the choice* to have or not account wide achievements. I'm not an RPer but I still very much care about the RP identity of my chars, does ZOS even care at all about the Elder Scroll Online Role Play Community? How about them?

silvereyes

Sheezabeast wrote: »

Unfortunately I do not have room on my comp to download the PTS right now. Could someone check something out for me?

I love looking back on my oldest characters and seeing when they hit benchmarks, like Slaughterfished achievement, or Level 10, seeing back in 2014 or 2015 when they got it. Will these achievements and dates be gone completely once they merge?

There is still a date, but from what I can tell, it takes the earliest date of any character that earned the achievement. The character-level specificity is completely gone. Only the oldest remains.

newtinmpls

Raevenglass wrote: »

Could someone explain where the benefit is?

Not without being really really sarcastic.