Quest Mode For Dungeons

Cadbury

VaranisArano wrote: »

Since ZOS insists on connecting the dungeons to the year long story, I think a story-mode is needed for dungeons. No rewards; just story.

I could get behind this. A storymode version of dungeons with some restrictions like:

-1 time only for completion
-No loot/Xp
-No skillpoint

Gylzyn

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

As others have said, if DLC dungeons are very specifically linked to the year long story by ZOS, there should be a way of experiencing the story of the dungeon in solo mode. And I say this as someone who plays dungeons regularly in vet mode with a group.

I am not especially bothered with rewards; I'd just like to experience the story in a logical order. Some nice non-gear rewards and achievements could be added.

Case in point: for various reasons, I didn't complete Black Drake Villa until after starting the story in Blackwood. There is a very direct link from BDV into the Blackwood story which would have been better experienced in order.

I actually think that this would improve the story writing significantly. For many dungeons the links between introductory quest, DLC dungeons, prologue, main story, DLC dungeons, prologue and quarter 4 have sometimes been tenuous. And because writers can't rely on players having experienced all of those components, the links are sometimes superficial plus we end up with a lot of repetitiveness. Some of the writing/dialogue for the dungeons (and Deadlands felt like this too for me) almost seemed detached from the flow of the story. Being able to add stronger story elements into dungeons which you only experience in story mode could improve the year long story telling immensely. And frankly I have felt that the story telling of the last two expansions has not been the best.

Woozywyvern

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

As others in this thread have stated, other MMO's have already implented solo modes for group content so clearly there is a demand for solo players to be able to experience this. If this is a trend, and more players are keen to do more content solo, shouldnt this be encoruaged? After all, the more players there are in the game, the more 'alive' the world feels in zones, the more opportunities there are for potential subs and crown sales which can only be a good thing for all types of player in game.

I think other MMO's have realised that change is essential in any 'continious' game, and that sticking to age old conventions just because that's the way it has always been, may not necessarily be best way to do things. Players change, the industry changes and beating the same 'it's an MMO, no Solo players' drum may be damaging to the game longer term. Particularly when the game is based on a solo game franchise. If anything, ZOS should be leading the way with solo play to encourage more Elder Scrolls gamers in.

Fennwitty

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

NeeScrolls wrote: »

...
Regardless, i did have yet another question/suggestion (that most people seem to ignore lol) to ask the now 234 'yes' votes in this thread:
How would you feel about an unlockable *purple glowy ghost* VIEWING mode (invincible like after dying) which would allow any player to go back through ANY prevoiusly completed dungeon...without any mobs or boss-fights....but with all quest NPC storylines, clickables, & sequences remaining intact to re-experience again as many times as you want?

No rewards, no xp, no mechanics. So all the @ZOS_ devs would have to do , from a coding standpoint, is essentially "neutor" each dungeon one by one to convert them into an empty single-player story showcase. (unlockable per character, once that character has gotten the 1st-time-story-mission Achievement done for each respective dungeon)

They could address a good 80-90% of this by simply making all dungeon quests repeatable, and just not giving a skill point more than once.

If I could take my characters back into a dungeon on normal mode and do the quest later, either myself or with one or two other players, that would serve the purpose of being able to get the story.

Many (Most?) dungeons simply don't have the quest npcs or events the second time around for a given character.

Deter1UK

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

Yes, Just replace the loot table with overland drops so there is no set farming or disable drops altogether if this is too complicated.

Nomadic_Atmoran

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

As long as the story mode doesn't give players access to sets and allows them to experience the story at their pace I dont see anything wrong with this idea.

NeeScrolls

No, I dont like this idea(please comment why)

Fennwitty wrote: »

They could address a good 80-90% of this by simply making all dungeon quests repeatable, and just not giving a skill point more than once.

If I could take my characters back into a dungeon on normal mode and do the quest later, either myself or with one or two other players, that would serve the purpose of being able to get the story..

Players can already do that now with the repeatable (albeit rotational) daily 'Undaunted' pledges system, no?

Also, my idea at bottom of my earlier post you quoted could also be applicable to TRIALS' stories too. ( talk about difficult lol try getting a group of 11 other rush-rush-rush gear-farming XP-runners to "slow down and smell the story/scenery" in a Trial someday. Good luck! - *Lucky for me, my cool guildmates will group with me and remain grouped just so i can spend time roaming & exploring within Trial zones after we finish )
.

Amottica

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

NeeScrolls wrote: »

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MudcrabAttack wrote: »

I still have no clue what the story is about in most of the dungeons. Starting a whole other character just to see the story isn't very appealing

Sorry but can't you just re-enter the dungeon from the outside manually (non queue'd ) the next day after reset and re-run the dungeon's story mission again...on the same toon? I do this all the time myself, to test my solo'ing skills (or lack thereof ) , so i'm pretty sure it can indeed be re-done without having to login a brand new separate toon.
.

I doubt anyone can solo every dungeon since there are mechanics in some that require more than one player to progress.

Even without that when Zenimax started continuing stories from the chapter through dungeons there should have been a solo version of those dungeons created. It is something other MMORPGs figured out years ago when they included their version of dungeons into the story for the zone.

NeeScrolls

No, I dont like this idea(please comment why)

Amottica wrote: »

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NeeScrolls wrote: »

MudcrabAttack wrote: »

I still have no clue what the story is about in most of the dungeons. Starting a whole other character just to see the story isn't very appealing

Sorry but can't you just re-enter the dungeon from the outside manually (non queue'd ) the next day after reset and re-run the dungeon's story mission again...on the same toon? I do this all the time myself, to test my solo'ing skills (or lack thereof ) , so i'm pretty sure it can indeed be re-done without having to login a brand new separate toon.
.

I doubt anyone can solo every dungeon since there are mechanics in some that require more than one player to progress

Correct--> https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/595210/which-dungeons-cant-be-solod ....but i never said i was solo completing "every" dungeon. I was just trying to remind people that they weren't supposedly "locked out" (or whatever the perception is) from re-entering dungeons again solo AND even repeating them slower with like-minded friends/guildmates as most story & dialog sequences remain intact after the instance phase resets each day.

spartaxoxo

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

I'm not locked out because I don't care about the quest being disjointed is a poor reason people who do care shouldn't feel locked out of content that literally locks them out.

tomofhyrule

Other, leave your idea below

NeeScrolls wrote: »

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Fennwitty wrote: »

They could address a good 80-90% of this by simply making all dungeon quests repeatable, and just not giving a skill point more than once.

If I could take my characters back into a dungeon on normal mode and do the quest later, either myself or with one or two other players, that would serve the purpose of being able to get the story..

Players can already do that now with the repeatable (albeit rotational) daily 'Undaunted' pledges system, no?

Not all of them. They've gotten better, but many of the basegame dungeons are very different if nobody needs the quest. For example, in EH1 the quest NPCs don't even spawn; VoM doesn't give any of the dialogue or the shriven souls to save off the quest; Volenfell has NPCs just missing from areas if nobody's on the quest; Direfrost has a special sub-boss that's only available on the quest and is not there otherwise...

I can't remember all of the differences since, y'know, I haven't seen the quests in ages.

Another big issue is that many NPCs will have their entire dialogue trees where you can ask them all of the background information, but that's all gone once you accept the quest. After that, they'll only repeat a line of 'I already gave you the quest' dialogue. If you've already done the quest, all you get from the NPC is the last line, so you don't get to explore those dialogue trees anymore. They're permanently closed for your character.

The pledges are different - that's just someone saying "go run this dungeon." A lot of people here are asking to walk in to a certain dungeon and take their time to read the lorebooks and listen to the dialogue without someone pulling all the trash and skipping everything for them to 'help' it go faster. Sure many dungeons can be done on normal (with exceptions of forced two-player mechanics like Direfrost and ICP), but not every new player pops out of Balfiera ready to solo nBDV. By the time new players are experienced enough to do so, there's a good chance they already got the skill point from these dungeons, so they can only see about half of the quest again.

NeeScrolls

No, I dont like this idea(please comment why)

spartaxoxo wrote: »

I'm not locked out because I don't care about the quest being disjointed is a poor reason people who do care shouldn't feel locked out of content that literally locks them out.

But you're not "locked out" sparta , since EVERY dungeon quest can be experienced at your own pace the 1st time, if you so choose. No one, not even Zenimax, is forcing players to group with random rush-rush pugs for 1st time running a nice cool interesting lore-driven quest.

Whenever i run my dungeons for the 1st time, i always ask a friend or guildmate (or i make clear in chat that i plan on taking my time to read & explore for the STORY) . In my experience, 9+ years in-game, most of the time this choice i make to hold out for a more like-minded group has yielded positive results....especially in ESO, since our community has wayyyyy more nice helpful people than certain other MMO's ( imho ) .

tomofhyrule wrote: »

Another big issue is that many NPCs will have their entire dialogue trees where you can ask them all of the background information, but that's all gone once you accept the quest. After that, they'll only repeat a line of 'I already gave you the quest' dialogue. If you've already done the quest, all you get from the NPC is the last line, so you don't get to explore those dialogue trees anymore. They're permanently closed for your character..

That's a fair point and i hear you, but as i've stated in earlier posts: Firstly, how can a character's personal story (RP wise and code wise) be truly immersive if once you've "saved the world!" you get to do it (the exact same thing) all over again....and again...and again...and again?! Environments & reactions & effects & quest-decisions all have to matter, no?

Secondly, this is why i suggested a more realistic (development allocation wise) suggestion *purple glowy spectator mode* concept within my other post on page 6.

tomofhyrule

Other, leave your idea below

NeeScrolls wrote: »

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spartaxoxo wrote: »

I'm not locked out because I don't care about the quest being disjointed is a poor reason people who do care shouldn't feel locked out of content that literally locks them out.

But you're not "locked out" sparta , since EVERY dungeon quest can be experienced at your own pace the 1st time, if you so choose. No one, not even Zenimax, is forcing players to group with random rush-rush pugs for 1st time running a nice cool interesting lore-driven quest.

Whenever i run my dungeons for the 1st time, i always ask a friend or guildmate (or i make clear in chat that i plan on taking my time to read & explore for the STORY) . In my experience, 9+ years in-game, most of the time this choice i make to hold out for a more like-minded group has yielded positive results....especially in ESO, since our community has wayyyyy more nice helpful people than certain other MMO's ( imho ) .

I know when I started playing ESO, I didn't know that that would happen. I thought the only way to do a group dungeon was to do it in a group, and then I was at the mercy of the group I had. Doubly so for anyone coming from single-player TES games who are scared to talk, or any from other MMOs who are just expecting toxicity.

You can't know the community is super supportive if you've only just joined the community. And beyond that, 'it's a supportive community' is not a general rule. I was in a 4-man premade with a new character in a nDC run where one of the DPS just took off and pulled everything before I could even get there, screwing up my pulls and despawning the quest giver for the new healer. Sure, we could have kicked him, but it was an honest mistake and that doesn't reset the dungeon. I also had a time when a group of three wanted to show a new player the secrets in nBDV but we had to PUG a fourth, and it took a good fifteen minutes to find someone even despite us all having guilds.

NeeScrolls wrote: »

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tomofhyrule wrote: »

Another big issue is that many NPCs will have their entire dialogue trees where you can ask them all of the background information, but that's all gone once you accept the quest. After that, they'll only repeat a line of 'I already gave you the quest' dialogue. If you've already done the quest, all you get from the NPC is the last line, so you don't get to explore those dialogue trees anymore. They're permanently closed for your character..

That's a fair point and i hear you, but as i've stated in earlier posts: Firstly, how can a character's personal story (RP wise and code wise) be truly immersive if once you've "saved the world!" you get to do it (the exact same thing) all over again....and again...and again...and again?! Environments & reactions & effects & quest-decisions all have to matter, no?

Secondly, this is why i suggested a more realistic (development allocation wise) suggestion *purple glowy spectator mode* concept within my other post on page 6.

If someone is that beholden to RP, then why are they soloing it since the story is written as if there are four people there? I don't think any arguments are being made based on something like "I'm only allowed to play the story once and I'm going to uninstall as soon as I finish the game!" Trial and Arena quests are repeatable. As are all of the side quests in Craglorn. It makes just as much sense to have to undergo the Trials of Rahni'Za repeatedly as it does to do anything else repeatedly, after all - you did kill the boss. Besides, some prologue quests send you to delves you may have already cleared, does it make sense that the names boss is alive again?

And that's not assuming you're thrown back into the same dungeon again. "Somehow, Stormreeve Neidir returned" isn't exactly lore-appropriate after you already did Tempest once. Are you expecting people to drop out of a dungeon since "my character's already done it once, sorry."

A lot of this is more like "I first ran the dungeon 4 years ago and I forgot the story and I'd like to see it again." Or are you implying that in the real world, nobody consumes content more than once so there's no market to sell books, movies, or TV shows since as soon as you've seen it once you never need to see it again?

spartaxoxo

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

NeeScrolls wrote: »

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spartaxoxo wrote: »

I'm not locked out because I don't care about the quest being disjointed is a poor reason people who do care shouldn't feel locked out of content that literally locks them out.

But you're not "locked out" sparta , since EVERY dungeon quest can be experienced at your own pace the 1st time, if you so choose. No one, not even Zenimax, is forcing players to group with random rush-rush pugs for 1st time running a nice cool interesting lore-driven quest.

Whenever i run my dungeons for the 1st time, i always ask a friend or guildmate (or i make clear in chat that i plan on taking my time to read & explore for the STORY) . In my experience, 9+ years in-game, most of the time this choice i make to hold out for a more like-minded group has yielded positive results....especially in ESO, since our community has wayyyyy more nice helpful people than certain other MMO's ( imho ) .

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tomofhyrule wrote: »

Another big issue is that many NPCs will have their entire dialogue trees where you can ask them all of the background information, but that's all gone once you accept the quest. After that, they'll only repeat a line of 'I already gave you the quest' dialogue. If you've already done the quest, all you get from the NPC is the last line, so you don't get to explore those dialogue trees anymore. They're permanently closed for your character..

That's a fair point and i hear you, but as i've stated in earlier posts: Firstly, how can a character's personal story (RP wise and code wise) be truly immersive if once you've "saved the world!" you get to do it (the exact same thing) all over again....and again...and again...and again?! Environments & reactions & effects & quest-decisions all have to matter, no?

Secondly, this is why i suggested a more realistic (development allocation wise) suggestion *purple glowy spectator mode* concept within my other post on page 6.

Goal post move. First you argued that they could just repeat the quest after they already did it because the npcs were still doing most of their talking. My response was to that assertion not first time experiences.

Beyond that, I am not locked out period. I always solo it first time if it's possible
and know people irl if it's not. Many people are though and saying that they aren't because you have the friends or power level to make a meaningful choice when they don't, is just a lack of empathy masquerading as reason. I don't feel or experience that so your experiences are invalid.

Choice is not real if one is not realistic and for tons of players that is the case.

Many video gamedevelopers have realized that and realized their players are locked out of content. This is why this feature is increasingly becoming common for MMOs and is in many MMOs already.

If people were forced to actually argue why the story is enhanced by groups their arguments quickly fall apart.

Which is why they instead choose to make bad arguments that do NOT address why audio should only be able to heard in groups like "Everyone else has the same resources I do, or we can't have a common mmo feature because this an mmo, gaming can never progress forward because the way something is the way it always has to be" etc.

There are hardly any postive arguments about why people cannot listen to dialogue sans drops on their own.

Danikat

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

tomofhyrule wrote: »

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NeeScrolls wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

I'm not locked out because I don't care about the quest being disjointed is a poor reason people who do care shouldn't feel locked out of content that literally locks them out.

But you're not "locked out" sparta , since EVERY dungeon quest can be experienced at your own pace the 1st time, if you so choose. No one, not even Zenimax, is forcing players to group with random rush-rush pugs for 1st time running a nice cool interesting lore-driven quest.

Whenever i run my dungeons for the 1st time, i always ask a friend or guildmate (or i make clear in chat that i plan on taking my time to read & explore for the STORY) . In my experience, 9+ years in-game, most of the time this choice i make to hold out for a more like-minded group has yielded positive results....especially in ESO, since our community has wayyyyy more nice helpful people than certain other MMO's ( imho ) .

I know when I started playing ESO, I didn't know that that would happen. I thought the only way to do a group dungeon was to do it in a group, and then I was at the mercy of the group I had. Doubly so for anyone coming from single-player TES games who are scared to talk, or any from other MMOs who are just expecting toxicity.

You can't know the community is super supportive if you've only just joined the community. And beyond that, 'it's a supportive community' is not a general rule. I was in a 4-man premade with a new character in a nDC run where one of the DPS just took off and pulled everything before I could even get there, screwing up my pulls and despawning the quest giver for the new healer. Sure, we could have kicked him, but that doesn't reset the dungeon. I also had a time when a group of three wanted to show a new player the secrets in nBDV but we had to PUG a fourth, and it took a good fifteen minutes to find someone even despite us all having guilds.

When I was new I had a helpful guild group offer to take me through some dungeons and make sure I completed the quests. They told me to skip the dialogue because "it doesn't matter" and showed me several tricks to skip parts of the dungeon entirely, including completing the quest faster.

I'm sure they thought they were being genuinely helpful and I'd appreciate learning the fastest way to clear it, and I was very new to both the game and the guild and so reluctant to speak up and say I don't like the way they're doing it and would rather do it another way. I thought I'd just wait and do it differently next time.

It came as a nasty surprise to learn later on that unlike my previous MMOs this game's dungeon quests are not repeatable and my first/main character cannot ever do those quests properly.

I'd love to have known from the start exactly how the game works, and how to build a character that's able to solo dungeons at low levels so I could complete them myself as I was going through the zone stories but I didn't get to start out as a veteran player. I knew what I'd picked up during the beta tests but that was it (and even some of that had changed after launch).

NeeScrolls

No, I dont like this idea(please comment why)

tomofhyrule wrote: »

Or are you implying that in the real world, nobody consumes content more than once so there's no market to sell books, movies, or TV shows since as soon as you've seen it once you never need to see it again?

Okay, obviously i wasn't implying that. I think my posts are getting a bit mis-interpreted and skewed , which is probably partly my fault. Sometimes, as much as i enjoy forum discussions, the limitations of typed words and perceived "tone" is a drag.

I've made a few posts in this thread, including actual questions, ideas & suggestions (which, for some reason, are largely ignored and barely considered much less answered) . I stand by those posts and i've already voted so....i'm not sure if i can add much more tbh.

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Goal post move.

There are hardly any postive arguments about why people cannot listen to dialogue sans drops on their own.

With all due respect, i only "changed goal posts" (which btw is another empty internet buzz-phrase trope) because of simply RESPONDING to your post reply prompting me to offer new perspective. Otherwise known as: a debate.

Anyways, i enjoy reading your (and others ) posts in general but i feel like perhaps my perspectives & points here are so much in the minority that it might cause the thread to devolve into echo-chamber circular argument territory. And i certainly don't want that. Hopefully reasonable peeps will re-read my earlier posts with some level of objectivity (and context) and realize, as with the 'overland' thread, all of us here ultimately want the same thing: an ESO worthy of constant $ubscription.
.

spartaxoxo

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

NeeScrolls wrote: »

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tomofhyrule wrote: »

Or are you implying that in the real world, nobody consumes content more than once so there's no market to sell books, movies, or TV shows since as soon as you've seen it once you never need to see it again?

Okay, obviously i wasn't implying that. I think my posts are getting a bit mis-interpreted and skewed , which is probably partly my fault. Sometimes, as much as i enjoy forum discussions, the limitations of typed words and perceived "tone" is a drag.

I've made a few posts in this thread, including actual ideas & suggestions (which, for some reason, are largely ignored and barely replied to) . I stand by those posts and i've already voted so....i'm not sure if i can add much more to this thread tbh.

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spartaxoxo wrote: »

Goal post move.

There are hardly any postive arguments about why people cannot listen to dialogue sans drops on their own.

With all due respect, i only "changed goal posts" (which btw is another empty internet buzz-phrase trope) because of simply RESPONDING to your post reply prompting me to offer new perspective. Otherwise known as: a debate. .

While that's true, sometimes when a goal post is moved it makes it sound like the person is responding to something they did not, which I feel is the case this time.

Like

"They are literally locked out"
"Except you're not because they can choose when to start the quest"

Makes it sound like my argument was that people are forced into starting the quest when they were first enter a dungeon, which is obvious nonsense.

Rather than the point I was actually making which was that people who have already completed the quest are locked out of doing it again. Something like "while that's true, but..." goes a long way in first acknowledging a point is made and then moving it along to the next one.

I realize now that was not your intention, so I apologize for being a bit snippy. But that sort of goal post move really grinds my gears as it's a personal pet peeve of mine when people respond me to as if I said something completely different to what I said in a way that feels deliberate rather than a result of my poor word choice, language barriers, etc. Ofc just because it feels that way doesn't mean it was always the case.

As to your other suggestions the reason they are ignored is they don't address the issue of people wanting to experience the dialogue without the social pressures that come with grouping. Not everyone, in fact most players, do not have access to people who want to actually take the time to listen to all the dialogue. And they also don't have the skill to just go it alone.

That is why the support is overwhelming. You can't assume that everyone can meet the same sorts of people, have the same level of skill, or even have the same level of mental wellness as yourself. For many people there is no meaningful choice in listening to or not listening to the dialogue because even guild mates willing to slow down for the quest expect them to not actually listen to it, but click through it real quick while they wait around so you don't get glitched out of it waiting for a cutscene. And even then ones who don't do that will often want to socialize with you while grouped, which is great for bonding but bad for reading or listening to dialogue and immersing yourself in a story.

It's great that you have people who don't do any of those things but it's very unfair and unempathetic to expect everyone to search out and befriend a very specific type of person in order to fix a game design issue that is easily solved and present in MMOs without causing any issues at all, because the issues it could cause are easily solved by disabling group loot.

LashanW

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

NeeScrolls wrote: »

I've made a few posts in this thread, including actual questions, ideas & suggestions (which, for some reason, are largely ignored and barely considered much less answered) . I stand by those posts and i've already voted so....i'm not sure if i can add much more tbh.

If your suggestions are often getting ignored, perhaps they are not good suggestions. Besides, you are not a ZoS dev asking the playerbase about a potential solution. So why should we try to accept your solution?

But I'll bite.

NeeScrolls wrote: »

Regardless, i did have yet another question/suggestion (that most people seem to ignore lol) to ask the now 234 'yes' votes in this thread:
How would you feel about an unlockable *purple glowy ghost* VIEWING mode (invincible like after dying) which would allow any player to go back through ANY prevoiusly completed dungeon...without any mobs or boss-fights....but with all quest NPC storylines, clickables, & sequences remaining intact to re-experience again as many times as you want?

No rewards, no xp, no mechanics. So all the @ZOS_ devs would have to do , from a coding standpoint, is essentially "neutor" each dungeon one by one to convert them into an empty single-player story showcase. (unlockable per character, once that character has gotten the 1st-time-story-mission Achievement done for each respective dungeon)

How can you even tell a story when some of the key characters are missing? Some of the bosses are super important to the dungeon story. For example entire story in Wayrest Sewers revolves around Pellingare siblings and their mentor Investigator Garron. And they are bosses, the lines they speak during boss fights are relevant to the story. Even the nature of mobs you find are important. Wayrest 1, you fight sewer creatures and mercs hired by Pellingare siblings. In Wayrest 2, the place is overrun by undead, walking skeletons and ghosts. And there's a reason for it.

There's also cases where you have to defeat a group of mobs to proceed the story (to free up some NPCs as you can see in Ruins of Mazzatun starting area.) How would they work with your suggestion? There are many dungeon stories that absolutely makes no sense if no enemies are present in the dungeon. They are not random enemies that are placed in the dungeon.

NeeScrolls

No, I dont like this idea(please comment why)

spartaxoxo wrote: »

As to your other suggestions the reason they are ignored is they don't address the issue of people wanting to experience the dialogue without the social pressures that come with grouping.

Yep i hear you but i was actually talking about THIS specific non-grouping suggestion i made at the bottom of my post from page 6 (which i think you might've missed? ) ...Sorry for quoting myself here lol:

NeeScrolls wrote: »

Regardless, i did have yet another question/suggestion (that most people seem to ignore lol) to ask the now 234 'yes' votes in this thread:
How would you feel about an unlockable *purple glowy ghost* VIEWING mode (invincible like after dying) which would allow any player to go back through ANY prevoiusly completed dungeon...without any mobs or boss-fights....but with all quest NPC storylines, clickables, & sequences remaining intact to re-experience again as many times as you want?

No rewards, no xp, no mechanics. So all the @ZOS_ devs would have to do , from a coding standpoint, is essentially "neutor" each dungeon one by one to convert them into an empty single-player story showcase. (unlockable per character, once that character has gotten the 1st-time-story-mission Achievement done for each respective dungeon)

....Yeah so that ^ would alleviate any "group pressures" or whatever. And, as i meant to imply earlier, could be far more realistic from a development coding aspect. I admit, i am slightly biased in my thinking since i've worked as QA & code bug-fixer on another MMO before. In discussions like these threads, my experience can be both an asset and a curse.

spartaxoxo

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

NeeScrolls wrote: »

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spartaxoxo wrote: »

As to your other suggestions the reason they are ignored is they don't address the issue of people wanting to experience the dialogue without the social pressures that come with grouping.

Yep i hear you but i was actually talking about THIS specific non-grouping suggestion i made at the bottom of my post from page 6 (which i think you might've missed? ) ...Sorry for quoting myself here lol:

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NeeScrolls wrote: »

Regardless, i did have yet another question/suggestion (that most people seem to ignore lol) to ask the now 234 'yes' votes in this thread:
How would you feel about an unlockable *purple glowy ghost* VIEWING mode (invincible like after dying) which would allow any player to go back through ANY prevoiusly completed dungeon...without any mobs or boss-fights....but with all quest NPC storylines, clickables, & sequences remaining intact to re-experience again as many times as you want?

No rewards, no xp, no mechanics. So all the @ZOS_ devs would have to do , from a coding standpoint, is essentially "neutor" each dungeon one by one to convert them into an empty single-player story showcase. (unlockable per character, once that character has gotten the 1st-time-story-mission Achievement done for each respective dungeon)

....Yeah so that ^ would alleviate any "group pressures" or whatever. And, as i meant to imply earlier, could be far more realistic from a development coding aspect. I admit, i am slightly biased in my thinking since i've worked as QA & code bug-fixer on another MMO before. In discussions like these threads, my experience can be both an asset and a curse.

A version with no mobs would not be worth doing, as the mobs are part of the story.

I know this would be an investment but the most popular part of the game is the story. So it would have high usage. It would also drive sales as there are people who don't buy dungeons just because they aren't interested in the group rewards and can't experience the story. It would also stop causing the dungeon finder to stop being an experience people argue over all the time. Because everyone in there would be there for the group rewards.

There's a massive quality of life boost to this game that comes with this suggestion which is why so many MMOs have added this content.

It's not unrealistic to want a change that many other MMOs have made because of the massive boost to player experience imo, especially when dungeons are sold separately in this game and people enjoying dungeons more is good for business. The majority of players in this game are here for the story, they've said that plenty of times.

AzuraFan

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

Lord of the Rings Online rejigged all of its STORY content so that players could do it solo. I'm not sure why ZOS can't do the same.

At the very least, it would be nice if ZOS would stop putting part of the year long story into dungeon DLCs. No more story in dungeons. If they'd done this in the first place, nobody would even be requesting this.

spartaxoxo

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

AzuraFan wrote: »

Lord of the Rings Online rejigged all of its STORY content so that players could do it solo. I'm not sure why ZOS can't do the same.

At the very least, it would be nice if ZOS would stop putting part of the year long story into dungeon DLCs. No more story in dungeons. If they'd done this in the first place, nobody would even be requesting this.

Yeah nobody is clamoring to see the story of Fungal Grotto. That one is too simplistic. It's the dungeons with fairly long and interesting stories that people want to learn.

OldStygian

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

To respond to the 'just ask a friend' argument - that's not as simple and easy for some of us. If I can't complete the DLC I miss part of the story which really is a shame.

There's already normal and veteran. If I had a magic wand I'd add a solo difficulty that's on par with something like the base game group dungeons and a story difficulty that's on par with delves and scale the loot accordingly.

radiostar

Other, leave your idea below

They could put an "Honor" or "Tribute" NPC near the entrances who would tell the dungeon's quest and book stories from a clicklist. Any player could talk to the NPC at any time. It wouldn't need to interfere with the current way dungeons are queued and run. Visit them before you use the Group Finder.

peacenote

No, I dont like this idea(please comment why)

AzuraFan wrote: »

At the very least, it would be nice if ZOS would stop putting part of the year long story into dungeon DLCs. No more story in dungeons. If they'd done this in the first place, nobody would even be requesting this.

I really think that this is such an important point. I like the stories and I love group content and as a result I get the stories out of order because I run dungeons right away and I take my time with quests.

A story mode would only fix half the problem... if ZOS is going to do something about this they should address the root cause. Dungeons and trials should have a point but be self contained and not a big step in the broad story arc.

Otherwise I honestly think things are fine as-is. We need to think bigger than this grouping / not grouping debate. ESO's philosophy has always been to encourage people to try all aspects of the game. It's why leads for mythics (combat gear!!!) can be found while fishing and in lockboxes. It's why style motifs drop in Battlegrounds. It's why a wide variety of achievements give dyes, collectibles, furniture, etc. The game has various carrots all over the place to encourage the crossing of lines. Want to avoid certain content? Well, then... you miss out a little on certain rewards/experiences.

And it has been like this from the beginning. Lore books are everywhere... in dungeons and in Cyro. Want to read all the lore? You have to explore the entire world.

In my opinion this is a good thing and taking a step to accommodate a portion of the player base so the carrot to try dungeons or trials is removed is a slippery slope. I don't really care what other MMOs have done. ESO says "come try everything!" and in this case the carrot is the story.

Smile2342

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

I'd love an "easy" mode for dungeons. Except for public dungeons I haven't done a single one since I started playing the game. I hate PUGs (that was the worse in WOW). Besides I'd hate to inconvenience and waste other peoples precious time by puttering around in a dungeon listening to the story.

Jusey1

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

DarcyMardin wrote: »

There are many dungeon quests I’ve never completed. Which means I’m missing not only the story, but also the valuable skill points. If I can solo the dungeon or duo it with my husband, I can get those skill points. But there are many DLC dungeons where this is still impossible for me.

I've been able to solo every DLC dungeon (that doesn't have anti-solo mechanic) and honestly, I kinda want to offer help to people who still need to get their quests done and get it done properly. Cause I fully understand how painful it is to do quests in a group with people rushing. So many quests can be broken by rushers...

Tornaad

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

spartaxoxo wrote: »

show previous quotes

AzuraFan wrote: »

Lord of the Rings Online rejigged all of its STORY content so that players could do it solo. I'm not sure why ZOS can't do the same.

At the very least, it would be nice if ZOS would stop putting part of the year long story into dungeon DLCs. No more story in dungeons. If they'd done this in the first place, nobody would even be requesting this.

Yeah nobody is clamoring to see the story of Fungal Grotto. That one is too simplistic. It's the dungeons with fairly long and interesting stories that people want to learn.

I want to see all of the stories.

Drammanoth

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

Most vanilla dungeons can be soloed, true, if you play eg. a Magplar, MagDK with meta gear, and have some skil.

But with people queuing as fake tanks, good luck finding a real tank, hence the story mode is in order. After playing my MagSorc for more than a year? I managed to become a decent DPS.

The conclusion? Not everyone has all the time in the world to gather all the equipment neede from DLCs, hundreds of transmutes and play a Magplar, MagDK with meta gear.

daim

Yes, I like this idea and want to get into the story

I would be happy just if the group mechanics were removed from normal modes.
But sure, why not to have an overland mode as well, with same trash loot.