2021 NEEDS a new class.
proteinexe
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TL;DR - Classes bring people back to the game and there's no good reason not to introduce on to 2021.
Looking back on the 5 previous chapters, the most hype has always come from the class-based chapters. Morrowind was extremely hyped, but this was partially due to us being allowed to indulge on the nostalgia element of Morrowind, but the introduction of the Warden started a snowball effect where everyone in the community was dabbling in theory-crafting and talking about how they could fit a warden into their current gameplay. I for one returned DUE to Morrowind. I had been out of the loop since a year into the game (I think everyone can think back to the state of ESO at launch), and the concept of a new class drew me back into the game. When I came back to the game, I was surprised to find the guild which I was previously in thriving, and through speaking to them on discord, it was revealed that the majority of returning players were there to try out Warden. This is fundamentally why I'm making this post, to stress the point that classes are one of the core driving forces which make the game thrive, and have a tendency to bring back old players (which we're in dire need off).
The one thing that boggles my mind about the forum thread is when people neglect the concept of a new class due to balancing but then all in favour for the implementation of new weapons and skill lines.. pardon? Forget the positives of a new skill line v. a new class. The damage control and balancing if they screwed up a new skill line compared to a new class is incomparable. The skill lines that have recently been added are lets face it, lackluster in comparison to what we can expect from this update if a skill line is introduced rather than a class (no shade aimed at Psijic or Vampire). A standalone class, no matter how broken, can be fixed with tweaks, not having any impact on the rest of ESO except the class itself. Screwing up a new skill line and making it viable for every class means any tweaking can make the skill-line broken in favour of 'X' class but now useless to 'Y' class. The balancing of a potential new skill-line would mean ZoS would cater for 12 potential class-builds (the stam/mag for each class). If you're complaining about ZoS's ability to balance a single class, why would it be a good idea in the current stage of ESO to add a potentially broken skill line which affects every class? This isn't a rhetorical question, I'd genuinely like to know if I'm missing the point here.
My final point on this is I'm not trying to 'one or the other' this, I'd love for both a skill line AND a class to be added, but that would be a cluster-*** of broken builds to put it lightly.
I 100% agree. But to neglect the idea of a new class because of the current class hierarchy of 'broken' is in my opinion flawed. ZoS are currently balancing as we discuss. The buff/de-buff changes was a great idea. Some classes (biggest culprits; warden and necromancer), crutched on buffs and de-buffs in both PvP and PvE to obtain free damage or tankiness. Although the class kits make them strong, they've ultimately been hit fairly hard by this nerf. It's almost as if ZoS specifically targeted this nerf around classes which were over-performing : )
ZoS are always striving to make balances to the game, but it must be understood that a game as intricate and complex as ESO will mean any changes the devs make creates a butterfly effect, and with content creators solely looking for the BiS class/setup, there'll always be a build or class or skill which will be abused. To NOT add a class due to balancing would mean a class would never be added.. a bit of a drastic statement, and I understand some classes have ridiculous features (10% damage mitigation for Necros..), but believe it or not, ZoS aren't monkeys that slap a keyboard and eat salt for breakfast (or are they..?), they're employees of a multi-million pound business who probably have extensive experience in this field. I feel that we as the players can sometimes be in serious violation of the 'backseat driver' idiom.
This to me is a redundant statement. ALL the classes can do everything, this is how ZoS designs a class, to be a swiss army knife of Tamreil. All the classes have class kits to support tanking, healing and damage dealing, as well as a substantial ability to participate in PvP. What people really mean is all the current classes cover the THEME of any future classes. Nightblade being the rouge/assassin/hunter/darkmage, and so on (I shan't list them all, but you get the idea). But if you allow my interpretation, then we can 100% slot a new class in. Bard for instance is a theme which isn't even touched on currently, let alone a; monk, battlemage, engineer. For instance, a forum user created a whole new unique class called the 'engineer', and reading through, there are some great standalone skills which don't mingle with any other classes. Here's the link: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/544786/my-concept-eso-chapter-bronze-legion-includes-zone-map-new-class-item-sets-and-plot-points/p1
My personal favourite concept for a new class is the battlemage. A militant class with a strong influence on offensive support. I feel like there'll be a limit to the amount of classes which ESO can have without stepping on other classes toes, but we're nowhere near that limit currently, and I hope there'll always be brainstorm-ers looking to expand on the class list of ESO.
Cause for concern.
My one cause for concern about this up and coming update is simply COVID. The current Markarth update was great! Really nice story and some good systems implemented, but the bugs were above what is usually expected. I put this down to COVID, as it's probably a lot harder to test the patch when everything is so up in the air. I worry for next year's chapter, and the amount of content that they can reliably put in the game. But ultimately, I'm sure this'll be cleared up in late December/early January with an official statement about the direction of ESO.
Edited by proteinexe on November 9, 2020 8:07PM
First off, I'd like to preface this by mentioning that I've been monitoring all the forum posts which mention next year's patch, seeing the opinions and sway of peoples hopes for next year's patch. The core topic which is always brought up (other than performance) is whether or not they'll add a new class to next years Chapter. I fundamentally believe that it is in ZoS's best interest TO make a new class, and here's why:
"They should add a new skill line, not a class"
Looking back on the 5 previous chapters, the most hype has always come from the class-based chapters. Morrowind was extremely hyped, but this was partially due to us being allowed to indulge on the nostalgia element of Morrowind, but the introduction of the Warden started a snowball effect where everyone in the community was dabbling in theory-crafting and talking about how they could fit a warden into their current gameplay. I for one returned DUE to Morrowind. I had been out of the loop since a year into the game (I think everyone can think back to the state of ESO at launch), and the concept of a new class drew me back into the game. When I came back to the game, I was surprised to find the guild which I was previously in thriving, and through speaking to them on discord, it was revealed that the majority of returning players were there to try out Warden. This is fundamentally why I'm making this post, to stress the point that classes are one of the core driving forces which make the game thrive, and have a tendency to bring back old players (which we're in dire need off).
The one thing that boggles my mind about the forum thread is when people neglect the concept of a new class due to balancing but then all in favour for the implementation of new weapons and skill lines.. pardon? Forget the positives of a new skill line v. a new class. The damage control and balancing if they screwed up a new skill line compared to a new class is incomparable. The skill lines that have recently been added are lets face it, lackluster in comparison to what we can expect from this update if a skill line is introduced rather than a class (no shade aimed at Psijic or Vampire). A standalone class, no matter how broken, can be fixed with tweaks, not having any impact on the rest of ESO except the class itself. Screwing up a new skill line and making it viable for every class means any tweaking can make the skill-line broken in favour of 'X' class but now useless to 'Y' class. The balancing of a potential new skill-line would mean ZoS would cater for 12 potential class-builds (the stam/mag for each class). If you're complaining about ZoS's ability to balance a single class, why would it be a good idea in the current stage of ESO to add a potentially broken skill line which affects every class? This isn't a rhetorical question, I'd genuinely like to know if I'm missing the point here.
My final point on this is I'm not trying to 'one or the other' this, I'd love for both a skill line AND a class to be added, but that would be a cluster-*** of broken builds to put it lightly.
"They need to balance other classes first"
I 100% agree. But to neglect the idea of a new class because of the current class hierarchy of 'broken' is in my opinion flawed. ZoS are currently balancing as we discuss. The buff/de-buff changes was a great idea. Some classes (biggest culprits; warden and necromancer), crutched on buffs and de-buffs in both PvP and PvE to obtain free damage or tankiness. Although the class kits make them strong, they've ultimately been hit fairly hard by this nerf. It's almost as if ZoS specifically targeted this nerf around classes which were over-performing : )
ZoS are always striving to make balances to the game, but it must be understood that a game as intricate and complex as ESO will mean any changes the devs make creates a butterfly effect, and with content creators solely looking for the BiS class/setup, there'll always be a build or class or skill which will be abused. To NOT add a class due to balancing would mean a class would never be added.. a bit of a drastic statement, and I understand some classes have ridiculous features (10% damage mitigation for Necros..), but believe it or not, ZoS aren't monkeys that slap a keyboard and eat salt for breakfast (or are they..?), they're employees of a multi-million pound business who probably have extensive experience in this field. I feel that we as the players can sometimes be in serious violation of the 'backseat driver' idiom.
"All the other classes cover any future classes"
This to me is a redundant statement. ALL the classes can do everything, this is how ZoS designs a class, to be a swiss army knife of Tamreil. All the classes have class kits to support tanking, healing and damage dealing, as well as a substantial ability to participate in PvP. What people really mean is all the current classes cover the THEME of any future classes. Nightblade being the rouge/assassin/hunter/darkmage, and so on (I shan't list them all, but you get the idea). But if you allow my interpretation, then we can 100% slot a new class in. Bard for instance is a theme which isn't even touched on currently, let alone a; monk, battlemage, engineer. For instance, a forum user created a whole new unique class called the 'engineer', and reading through, there are some great standalone skills which don't mingle with any other classes. Here's the link: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/544786/my-concept-eso-chapter-bronze-legion-includes-zone-map-new-class-item-sets-and-plot-points/p1
My personal favourite concept for a new class is the battlemage. A militant class with a strong influence on offensive support. I feel like there'll be a limit to the amount of classes which ESO can have without stepping on other classes toes, but we're nowhere near that limit currently, and I hope there'll always be brainstorm-ers looking to expand on the class list of ESO.
Cause for concern.
My one cause for concern about this up and coming update is simply COVID. The current Markarth update was great! Really nice story and some good systems implemented, but the bugs were above what is usually expected. I put this down to COVID, as it's probably a lot harder to test the patch when everything is so up in the air. I worry for next year's chapter, and the amount of content that they can reliably put in the game. But ultimately, I'm sure this'll be cleared up in late December/early January with an official statement about the direction of ESO.
Although I just wrote a fairly extensive forum thread on the the hopes of a new class being introduced to 2021 ESO, the jokes on me due to the fact that they've most likely already prepared and are in the final development stage for the chapter coming to 2021, class or not. BUT, I feel that the need for a new class needed to be stressed. I'd love to know the communities thoughts, and thank you for reading.
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Yellow_Monolith✭✭✭✭✭They should fix the game before they add anything else that will divert manpower. Adding more stuff that will be broken to the already broken stuff isn't the answer. Get to work on lag, class balance, broken quests and falling through the world and then consider adding something new.52 -
josiahva✭✭✭✭✭
✭Please no, after the terrible to play mess that Warden and Necro are....I hate to see what they come up with for a new class. I am tired of classes with half their skills on a delayed reaction...Warden and Necro have great toolboxes...but they are absolutely miserable to play compared to the original 4 classes.25 -
Recapitated✭✭✭✭Adding a new skill line means anticipating interactions with 6 different classes.
Adding a new class means anticipating interactions with all the pre-existing skill lines.
At first glance I don't think either is automatically more simple.17 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Me content is the driving force with keeping players interest. New classes are very much secondary.
Further, performance of the servers and stable management of combat in the game are significant drivers for keeping the first players that stick with the game throughout the year. ESo has lacked both.5 -
zergbase_ESO✭✭✭✭
I rather they fix all the brokenness... New class does not cover up how broken stuff is currently...
So thats a Naw I rather not have a new class from me.Edited by zergbase_ESO on November 9, 2020 8:22PM4 -
Stinkyremy✭✭✭✭✭idgaf about new classes. Idk warden or necro despite leveling 2 alts of each up. I just slotted the skills, didn't even rerad what they do.
I barely know NB templar or sorc tbh.0 -
JinMori✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I would be fine with both a new class or new skills, tertiary morphs etc.
My favorite would be a fourth skilline for every class.2 -
Jolsyf✭✭✭Necromancer was heavily suggested before Elsweyr because it was the only class in game that players didn't had access, now we have literally all types of magic avaible in every class: Restoration, undead, poison, fire, frost, nature, oblivion, shadow, light, shock, earth, disease and ofc magic and physical. Is there any remaining class that doesnt do something that we already have?
In my opinion something more interesting would be spellcraft like in Daggerfall (the game), so the players could make stuff like fire and lightning skills or anything really. However I get that probably won't happen out of the cheer complexity it would be.4 -
MasterSpatula✭✭✭✭✭
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"A probable impossibility is preferable to an improbable possibility." - Aristotle26 -
DTStormfox✭✭✭✭✭Not this again... there are like 100+ threads on this topic.Edited by DTStormfox on November 9, 2020 8:38PM8 -
proteinexe✭✭✭✭DTStormfox wrote: »Not this again... there are like 100+ threads on this topic.
I know, I've been reading them all and this is my thoughts3 -
Solariken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭New classes are just a lame way for devs to recycle content.
What the game needs more is a new system to complement existing combat and classes. I'm looking at you, spell crafting...8 -
josiahva✭✭✭✭✭
✭Necromancer was heavily suggested before Elsweyr because it was the only class in game that players didn't had access, now we have literally all types of magic avaible in every class: Restoration, undead, poison, fire, frost, nature, oblivion, shadow, light, shock, earth, disease and ofc magic and physical. Is there any remaining class that doesnt do something that we already have?
In my opinion something more interesting would be spellcraft like in Daggerfall (the game), so the players could make stuff like fire and lightning skills or anything really. However I get that probably won't happen out of the cheer complexity it would be.
Actually yes....Frostcaster...Warden is NOT an ice mage any more than Templar is a fire mage, the ice damage skills warden has are few and far between...which is fine...but until there is an actual ice mage class, a lot of sets will remain underutilized....I honestly wouldn't mind a new class if it was implemented better than the last 2....no one cares about flashy animations...they care about a skill going off when they press a button, not 2 seconds later(except PvP burst builds)
But you are correct, I would much rather see skillcrafting than any new class.2 -
CrimsonGTX✭✭✭I'm always a fan of new classes, but they need to fix the game and have a solid combat direction first.Sorc & Warden Main - PC NA(CP 1k+) & Xbox NA (CP 1k+)5 -
AdamBourke✭✭✭✭✭2021 needs to _remove_ classes.
Elder scrolls is supposed to be about playing however you want. Well I want liquid lightning AND magic healing flowers.
Also crystal fragments, but that's living in the past. Let's look to a bright future where one can summon both the undead AND the daedra.
More seriously, I do think they should remove classes as they are now. Maybe you choose a class at launch, and it determines your starting skill lines, and other skill lines you get from playing the game (maybe they have a 20% debut if not in your class).
For me, classes are the worst part of ESO. (Not including monetisation...)PS4 - EU
Please put the Eyevea/EarthForge wayshrines back on the map?7 -
Vayln_Ninetails✭✭✭✭✭No, the game DOES NOT need a new class you're absolutely wrong.
A new class does nothing for existing players since the game doesn't have a class changing system.
What people WANT and what the game NEEDS are new weapons and a 4th skill line per class.
Adding in a new class would kill off a lot of vet players because that'd be the *only* new thing at all next year.
New classes do bring people to the game, @proteinexe, but you forget that this game already is mostly catered towards new players. Vets/experienced players (which keep bringing in money through subs and purchases on the crown store) should have an equal if not more respect in this aspect.
I don't think you understand how much just getting a new class next year would absolutely destroy experienced players who already have classes they like playing and don't want to level a new one/find a new main.14 -
Jeremy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'd prefer new skill lines to classes myself. A lot of players don't enjoy starting over.Edited by Jeremy on November 9, 2020 11:49PM15 -
Vayln_Ninetails✭✭✭✭✭proteinexe wrote: »
New content only for new players to explore.
You're literally right if you're discounting a solid majority of the player base.
Adding in new weapons or skill lines would be so much more of a benefit that saying we need a new class over that is very short-sighted. As new players can get excited about those things too, if not more than a new class.7 -
Luke_Flamesword✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Let them finish with new standards, rebuilding CP, etc and then we can talk about new classes
Some classes still need some love (DKs, chlip) and giving new p2w class is just another reason to ignore old classes problems.
Also more exciting is not new class, but some combat changes to make hybrids viable - that would be so great.PC | EU | DC |Stam Dk Breton5 -
cheesefome✭✭✭What we need is the lag fixed and less bugs.
Less content, more performance patches.3 -
Red_Feather✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I am sorry but I hate redoing everything on a new character and elswyr to me was the least interesting expansion because it didn't add any new skills.2 -
GrimTheReaper45✭✭✭✭✭No thank you, am good on classes for the foreseeable period of time. Please ask again in several centuries.10
