Why nerf Iceheart?

Olupajmibanan

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Here are my rough ideas for new frost monster sets:

Chillrend: Designed for PvP (Note: I had a dungeon idea for a final boss monster to be a massive ice wraith called Chillrend, and it's death would be caused by a Glass Sword as a nod to the creation of the unique weapon seen in Oblivion and Skyrim.)


Hailthrash: Designed for PvE (Note: this means ALL Frost DoTs. including single target DoTs from Chilled, Icy Conjurer or Frost Reach.)

Hailstorm restriction is against this game standards that ZoS is so vehemently promoting. We had times when bosses could be affected by only one Burning effect. MagDKs rioted, obviously. We had times of bug when Bosses could be affected by only one Crushing Wall. Playerbase rioted, obviously.

The restriction should be "Enemies cannot be affected by more than 1 Hailstorm per player".

PS: Chilled does not cause any dot. It's direct damage single hit just as Diseased and Concussed

The Uninvited

Waiting for the first to say it's the fault of PVP players things get nerfed.

Alienoutlaw

The Uninvited wrote: »

Waiting for the first to say it's the fault of PVP players things get nerfed.

thats the thing NOBODY has asked for this and 99% of the ppl here are all singing from the same song sheet, that in itself should speak volumes to the Dev's

frozzzen101

It's honestly quite amazing that whoever designs those monster masks cannot design 4 useful ones per year without destroying what we had previously. Why does that person even deserve its paycheck? Vykosa got nerfed in the name of new itemization and now Iceheart. Just imagine that level of incompetency. That's our team right here.

robpr

Whole design of Mother Ciannait is flawed.
It gives max magicka and proc of cast time/channel skills. So clearly it is intended for magicka characters. The problem is, only 2 classes have channeled/casted non-ult abilities, that is Templar's Sweeps/beam and Sorcs hard casted frags and dark deal. Magicka nightblade can proc it only on casting soul harvest. Magicka DKs, Wardens and Necromancers have no way to proc it...without another DLC, giving them Channeled Acceleration or using Vamp Drain that is utterly useless in PvE unless you want to quick charge your ult on dummy.
On other hand, stamina specs have Rapid Strikes, Wrecking blow, Snipe, allowing all kind of specs to use it reliably on cd but then the max magicka and magicka restore bonus is useless.

Can it be pvp intended shield set? With battle spirit it's 2500 shield. It's around Harness Magicka levels but again, magicka chars aside of Templars and Sorcs dont have abilities that would proc the effect.

ESO_Nightingale

Olupajmibanan wrote: »

The restriction should be "Enemies cannot be affected by more than 1 Hailstorm per player".

PS: Chilled does not cause any dot. It's direct damage single hit just as Diseased and Concussed

1: yeah, that is what is supposed to happen. it doesn't often mention the "per player" part on sets and abilities from what i have seen.

2: i just tested it in game and you're right. that is really bizarre. i always remembered it having a very small damage over time effect, seems to only just apply minor maim now for the 4 seconds.

Pardus01

I freaking hate marketers. I never write in forum but this is a no go for me. Nerfing iceheart just to make new set viable is just unacceptable!!!

Dolar-sign eyed marketers love to ruin everything. Just like Boeing 737 max for instance!!! This is stupid.

logarifmik

Why they nerf it so hard? Damn. Sorry, Scales-of-Ice, but now I need to find you a different monster set. Undaunted! Undaunted!.. Ah, honey, don't cry.

haelene

Nobody asked for it, but Alcast (among others) was pretty vocal about how the new sets were *** in comparison to Iceheart. So ZOS did what ZOS does, and instead of fixing the new sets - they ruined the old ones.

The only real reason to do it this way is to try and force people to grind for the new stuff, and that means they not only play for longer (looks good to investors and makes the game artificially more active so more players stay), but they have to buy the new chapter.

It's a dirty practice, but it's completely in line with the ZOS's history. This is why I refuse to use any set the popular players (in particular Alcast) use. If he's noticed it, they have too, and it means it's going to get a substantial nerf. Basically, if Alcast mentions the set, it's time to find something new.

Alienoutlaw

@ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_RichLambert

i think its safe to say the community has given its feedback and voiced our concerns. any chance you guys could respond?

vesselwiththepestle

Iceheart is worn even on Stamina DPS for example for flawless conquerer vma runs. I don't really care about Iceheart DPS. I just want the shield back - at it's full strength with the faster cooldown. We use it in progress runs when learning some difficult trials or for dlc dungeons, dlc hard modes, no death runs etc. Some might call it being carried by the set, I think that's what build diversity means. We lose dps, we gain survivability, especially on Stamina DPS not using Brawler. Other's are "carried" by dps. (I am always amazed by magicka dps in trial runs not even slotting the light armor shield.) This nerf to Iceheart won't hit the good players and groups, but the groups and players who are having trouble with content, who are learning it... I think it's a nerf on the wrong end of the game. So please... make this at least a set for those in need of that extra survivability. Nerf the damage into oblivion, but keep that shield strong.

I guess I'll give Chudan a try, but resistances just aren't the same and some classes get those easily anyway. Especially as Stamina DPS, where Vigor has that short duration for a while now, so you have to cast it more often which just means although the heal is more bursty (while it's still a hot), you lose more GCD you could have used for dps... Troll King could work, but it's 1st bonus is very bad - it's still great in no cp Cyro, though, especially if you want to take over ressources on your own on a stamina build with weak self heals. Other more Stamina focused defense monster sets have already been nerfed, like Pirate Skeleton. 8% Chance to get Major Protection every 20 Seconds - and get Major Defile at the same time, with a 100% visible telegraph? No, thank you. This would have to have at least a reliable procc condition so you could plan it.

However, there need to be some frost damage set. It's ZOS's fault that they haven't given us another frost dps monster set. Just like there is only one poison monster set which is crap. Please, consider adding or chaning an existing monster set to add some frost damage - probably even frost damage on RANGE, so you could pair it with sets like Winterborn, especially as Warden as Frosty-lover No. 1 is still a ranged focused class.

Sephyr

Alienoutlaw wrote: »

The Uninvited wrote: »

Waiting for the first to say it's the fault of PVP players things get nerfed.

thats the thing NOBODY has asked for this and 99% of the ppl here are all singing from the same song sheet, that in itself should speak volumes to the Dev's

All of this^

I've never seen one person complain about the set. The nerf is just straight out of nowhere, compared to other sets that underperformed on their very inception. This doesn't bring the other sets in line; it throws them all in the trash. Definitely feels like the end of an era.

bmnoble

So when they said they were going to re-balance/update old sets, did they just mean they are going to make them useless so so no one uses them, thus they never have to worry about balancing the sets again.

I don't recall anyone ever asking to nerf Ice heart, about the only time I ever used the set was in solo stuff like parts of Maelstrom arena.

I hope the changes don't go ahead as it is, people actually use this set from time to time, if these changes go ahead, it will end up being ignored completely.

As for the other defensive set, they are planning to introduce, it does not even look good enough for me to consider farming it, maybe instead of screwing over an old set they should work on improving the new monster set before it gets released.

colossalvoids

Surely all trifectas was carried by ice, no way that it was barrier they slotted only for mag regen, smh. Wrong end of the rope zos, yet again

virtus753

Altyrann wrote: »

Developer Comment:
Iceheart has long been a powerful defensive set that has become a staple for situations where you want to sacrifice damage for survivability, especially in instances such as Maelstrom Arena and no-death Trial runs. While we love the idea of this set helping in those contexts, the value of defensive and offensive potential this set provided was leagues beyond our standards when comparing it to other sets such as Brands of the Imperium or Phoenix.

If you "love" this idea, why are you effectively killing it?

How many players have dared Maelstrom or no-death runs because Iceheart made learning how to do it a realistic possibility rather than a pipe dream? Was that all just a carry because the gear wasn't down to your standards? That's the impression I'm getting from this explanation.

When you take the approach of lowering appropriately niche gear to meet arbitrary standards, rather than examining where those standards are in relation to how players learn to play your game and adjusting said standards accordingly, you're going to end up with even more people not only unable but frankly uninspired to pursue this idea you claim to love.

Please, please stop killing it.

Shaloknir

Sadness. I liked this set.

Flaminir

They always do this when they want to nerf something they know will be unpopular...

Huge nerf upfront...

Then next patch dial the nerf back slightly so we feel listened to.

Incoming: 7k shield & 9 second cooldown 'compromise'!

BalticBlues

Flaminir wrote: »

They always do this when they want to nerf something they know will be unpopular...
Huge nerf upfront... Then next patch dial the nerf back slightly so we feel listened to.

We all have a relationship with ESO - but ...
treating people in a manipulative manner like that -again and again- may result in a divorce.

Flaminir

Flaminir wrote: »

They always do this when they want to nerf something they know will be unpopular...

Huge nerf upfront...

Then next patch dial the nerf back slightly so we feel listened to.

Incoming: 7k shield & 9 second cooldown 'compromise'!

But zos if you're reading this that compromise will still not work... Take away the offensive side if you have a burning desire to nerf something that doesn't need a nerf... But please leave the defensive side intact.

That forces players to make a more defined choice between offense & defense, while still keeping the set viable for its main purpose.

kind_hero

I am so annoyed by this! Iceheart was one of the sets that worked well, you lost damage but gained this bubble which helped you to learn content and when you felt confident enough you could switch for a dps set.

Why can't the devs leave the old content in peace, focus on fixing bugs and creating NEW content?

I hate that every patch I have to sort my gear, dump old gear and re-learn abilities or combos. OK, I understand tweaks, but these changes make the set insignificant! You did a mistake here... trust the community!!!!

nwilliams2107b16_ESO

Oh dear, great change this ZoS, not! Was this really necessary?

Ashfen

As an Ice Warden solo player, i'm really sad.

Sevn

pod88kk wrote: »

Zos are hitting the people who are loyally sticking with the game and who probably spend the most money on it.

And there you have it. They are hoping by nerfing IH they will "entice" this group into buying their DLC to farm the uninspired replacement.

Such an obvious cash grab and a huge insult to players intelligence to mask it any other way. I hope it totally backfires on them. After they sell enough DLC'S they'll walk back some of the nerfs with a 7200 shield and a 8 1/2 second cooldown or something similar.

Sorry to read your playbook outloud to everyone ZOS but you're a one trick pony and this is your MO.

ESO_Nightingale

i feel like there is so much outrage here that they'll revert some of it back. But not all of it even though we are asking for a full reversion. my only hope is that they revert the damage or even buff it, and the uptime.

Flaminir

Developer Comment:

We have heard the community feedback that only Templar & Sorcerer's have access to commonly used cast time/channelled abilities to proc the new Mother Cianait set, so to address this we have added a 2 second cast time to blast bones, engulfing flames, assassin's will, & Shalks. We have increased the damage of these skills by 5% to compensate.

logarifmik

Flaminir wrote: »

Developer Comment:

We have heard the community feedback that only Templar & Sorcerer's have access to commonly used cast time/channelled abilities to proc the new Mother Cianait set, so to address this we have added a 2 second cast time to blast bones, engulfing flames, assassin's will, & Shalks. We have increased the damage of these skills by 5% to compensate.

Don't. Give. Them. Ideas.

Stevie6

yep just read about that new monster set with shield in the next DLC...won't try to farm that one...looks like the devs just need to delete both sets out of the game after the next nerf patch is released.

The_Lex

@ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_Gilliam @ZOS_GinaBruno

Congratulations! You’ve made a change that’s even more universally hated than your proposed cast times on sorc shields. On the bright side, you’ve managed to unify the community....solo players, RPers, end gamers....this is so beautiful to see. 😂

Kadoozy

Honestly, anyone saying to dial it back, I disagree. It needs to be a full reversion to what it currently is on live.

It is not overpowered in any way and is actually one of the most well balanced and fun sets. It is a standard that ZOS should aim for instead of their spreadsheet balancing.

Don't compromise on this people.

JanTanhide

Ok ZOS. Time to decon all my Iceheart pieces. It's now useless. Thanks again ZOS.