Why nerf Iceheart?

Sandman929

It's not like anything major was lost. At best Iceheart was occasionally OK, and could have used a buff. What kills me is that time was spent doing anything to this set besides buffing it. And then to write in a Dev comment about it's strength? Holy crap...what is going on over there?

AgaTheGreat

Who runs phoenix and brands of imperium in PVE??? I don't understand the reasoning of comparing a widely use MONSTER set to two dead 5-piece sets that no-one uses. They are two completely different categories.

Iceheart is used in many no death runs on consoles because you know what? We actually have bad fps, lag and no add-ons to tell us what to do, so sometimes rng can surprise us.

But yeah, nerf iceheart -.-

ccloyesb14_ESO

This is ridiculous. How was this set op? There goes my frost warden.

Fur_like_snow

RIP ice heart. You helped me thru vMA my first time. Now it’s your turn to rest returned to the sea where all life began. *salute*

xylena

If it's not "make sure the new sets are stronger than the old sets," what could this possibly be? Who does it benefit?

Tommy_The_Gun

Community:
- Please buff the new set, even Iceheart, the base game set is better.
ZOS:
- Nerfs Iceheart

I don't know about you, but I think that this is memeable... ^

Altyrann

It does beg the question what role the Mother Ciannait set could interestingly play. Instead of a moderate shield up frequently (assuming you use some cast time / channeled ability), it could be really interesting as a big chunky shield with a more specifically controllable proc condition to allow pre-emptive defence against incoming spikes. This would make it both useful and different, so Iceheart could continue as it is on live.

llBlack_Heartll

Mothers Cannait just becomes the Flawless VMA Monster Set for Magplarrs lol

Moloch1514

Wow, thanks for even more useless nerfs to force us to play DLC @ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_Gilliam. Couldn't be more obvious that you balance the game based on @Alcast videos.

Sandman929

Altyrann wrote: »

It does beg the question what role the Mother Ciannait set could interestingly play. Instead of a moderate shield up frequently (assuming you use some cast time / channeled ability), it could be really interesting as a big chunky shield with a more specifically controllable proc condition to allow pre-emptive defence against incoming spikes. This would make it both useful and different, so Iceheart could continue as it is on live.

They aren't going back on Iceheart, the spreadsheet already revealed it's been too strong for too long.

The_Lex

I honestly can't see how this dev team can be any lazier and more unimaginative.

Altyrann

Sandman929 wrote: »

Altyrann wrote: »

It does beg the question what role the Mother Ciannait set could interestingly play. Instead of a moderate shield up frequently (assuming you use some cast time / channeled ability), it could be really interesting as a big chunky shield with a more specifically controllable proc condition to allow pre-emptive defence against incoming spikes. This would make it both useful and different, so Iceheart could continue as it is on live.

They aren't going back on Iceheart, the spreadsheet already revealed it's been too strong for too long.

While there is clearly some Excel-lent (sorry) logic behind the change, we can always hope. Interesting that not one person has piped anywhere to support the change so far.

The_Lex

Altyrann wrote: »

Sandman929 wrote: »

Altyrann wrote: »

It does beg the question what role the Mother Ciannait set could interestingly play. Instead of a moderate shield up frequently (assuming you use some cast time / channeled ability), it could be really interesting as a big chunky shield with a more specifically controllable proc condition to allow pre-emptive defence against incoming spikes. This would make it both useful and different, so Iceheart could continue as it is on live.

They aren't going back on Iceheart, the spreadsheet already revealed it's been too strong for too long.

While there is clearly some Excel-lent (sorry) logic behind the change, we can always hope. Interesting that not one person has piped anywhere to support the change so far.

I was thinking the same thing, except now that you said it, a troll will crawl out from under the bridge.

Fur_like_snow

Imagine a dev team with such little confidence in its upcoming product they gotta ruin a set that players used to get thru vMA. A niche set for solo PvE content...

Kilcosu

now people won't run the new DLC dungeons for the new helm just out of spite for this unnecessary nerf.

GG ZOS

Altyrann

The_Lex wrote: »

Altyrann wrote: »

Sandman929 wrote: »

Altyrann wrote: »

It does beg the question what role the Mother Ciannait set could interestingly play. Instead of a moderate shield up frequently (assuming you use some cast time / channeled ability), it could be really interesting as a big chunky shield with a more specifically controllable proc condition to allow pre-emptive defence against incoming spikes. This would make it both useful and different, so Iceheart could continue as it is on live.

They aren't going back on Iceheart, the spreadsheet already revealed it's been too strong for too long.

While there is clearly some Excel-lent (sorry) logic behind the change, we can always hope. Interesting that not one person has piped anywhere to support the change so far.

I was thinking the same thing, except now that you said it, a troll will crawl out from under the bridge.

Sorry!

Brandathorbel

I wonder if the developer team reads this stuff and not get embarrassed.

WreckfulAbandon

Wow... remember everyone joking that they were gonna nerf Iceheart to make that new bad monster set seem good...

Just wow. The beatings will continue until morale improves I guess.

Tannus15

I love how many people said of the original set "this is bad compared to iceheart, please buff it but don't nerf iceheart!"
and ZoS was all "got it, buff the new set and nerf iceheart! We're listening!"

Tommy_The_Gun

Sandman929 wrote: »

Altyrann wrote: »

It does beg the question what role the Mother Ciannait set could interestingly play. Instead of a moderate shield up frequently (assuming you use some cast time / channeled ability), it could be really interesting as a big chunky shield with a more specifically controllable proc condition to allow pre-emptive defence against incoming spikes. This would make it both useful and different, so Iceheart could continue as it is on live.

They aren't going back on Iceheart, the spreadsheet already revealed it's been too strong for too long.

Can't rally tell if it was strong or not, was not using it for a long time. But what is worrying me (and immediately lights up red light in my brain) is that ZOS is basically nerfing the old content just to re-sell it to us again
Nerfed sets & skills are being replaced with new ones. Not more powerful, just different enough so at the 1st glance you would not notice. Progression is being taken away.

At this point it can not be more obvious.

Tannus15

if i was going to nerf iceheart i'd take away the damage entirely, increase the proc % chance and change the 1pc bonus to mag regen or something like that

llBlack_Heartll

How many years has this game been out, not many complaintS about Ice Heart being OP, now all of a sudden it’s way OP, because of a new set.
But the new set is only for specific skills channel or cast time.

They literally get paid to think about set and how they work, yet 3 weeks into PTS it’s an issue.
Seriously, how did they not compare the sets before hand and think, maybe they don’t line up.

The_Lex

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Sandman929 wrote: »

Altyrann wrote: »

It does beg the question what role the Mother Ciannait set could interestingly play. Instead of a moderate shield up frequently (assuming you use some cast time / channeled ability), it could be really interesting as a big chunky shield with a more specifically controllable proc condition to allow pre-emptive defence against incoming spikes. This would make it both useful and different, so Iceheart could continue as it is on live.

They aren't going back on Iceheart, the spreadsheet already revealed it's been too strong for too long.

Can't rally tell if it was strong or not, was not using it for a long time. But what is worrying me (and immediately lights up red light in my brain) is that ZOS is basically nerfing the old content just to re-sell it to us again
Nerfed sets & skills are being replaced with new ones. Not more powerful, just different enough so at the 1st glance you would not notice. Progression is being taken away.

^^^

Vildebill

There's been some really stupid changes over the years, but this one is so stupid I actually got a little bit surprised. Why nerf a set that has been great for new players, for learning or for getting some extra defense? A set that obviously hasn't over performed in neither PvE nor PvP. Sometimes I wonder if ZOS plays their own game.

But then I get reminded of that new monster set in the new DLC, and suddenly all pieces falls into place. This is one of the biggest a-hole moves I've seen, and I've been here a looong time.

Beardimus

Altyrann wrote: »

From the patch notes:

Iceheart:
Reduced the damage shield this set provides to 6050 from 8600.
Reduced the damage per tick to 500 from 770.
Increased the cooldown to 12 seconds from 6.

Developer Comment:
Iceheart has long been a powerful defensive set that has become a staple for situations where you want to sacrifice damage for survivability, especially in instances such as Maelstrom Arena and no-death Trial runs. While we love the idea of this set helping in those contexts, the value of defensive and offensive potential this set provided was leagues beyond our standards when comparing it to other sets such as Brands of the Imperium or Phoenix.

Looks like a useful, popular, set has taken not one but three hits to bring it into line with sets nobody uses, or to help make the rather useless new monster set look slightly less useless. As per the Dev comment, we were already sacrificing damage for survivability, so it feels like a triple nerf is rather overkill.

I think the notes nail it.

It's a crutch for no death runs so makes them mean less.

Dagoth_Rac

If ZOS were chefs:

Diners: "The new lobster dish is awful. The shrimp dish that is half the price tastes much better!"

ZOS: "We have added rancid ostrich bile to the shrimp dish and lowered the price of the lobster dish by 2%."

Royaji

Brian "Spreadsheet" Wheeler stirkes again!

You can try hiding you sets and skills all you want, but nothing can withstand the power of boring and bland spreadsheet balancing!

The_Lex

This greedy, lazy, and unimaginative decision will hurt new players, players learning how to clear certain content, thematic theorycrafters, and RPers.

Is this subset of players the ones you want to alienate? @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_Gilliam

llBlack_Heartll

Beardimus wrote: »

Altyrann wrote: »

From the patch notes:

Iceheart:
Reduced the damage shield this set provides to 6050 from 8600.
Reduced the damage per tick to 500 from 770.
Increased the cooldown to 12 seconds from 6.

Developer Comment:
Iceheart has long been a powerful defensive set that has become a staple for situations where you want to sacrifice damage for survivability, especially in instances such as Maelstrom Arena and no-death Trial runs. While we love the idea of this set helping in those contexts, the value of defensive and offensive potential this set provided was leagues beyond our standards when comparing it to other sets such as Brands of the Imperium or Phoenix.

Looks like a useful, popular, set has taken not one but three hits to bring it into line with sets nobody uses, or to help make the rather useless new monster set look slightly less useless. As per the Dev comment, we were already sacrificing damage for survivability, so it feels like a triple nerf is rather overkill.

I think the notes nail it.

It's a crutch for no death runs so makes them mean less.

Yea, but now it’s just a crunch for no death runs for Magplar. Not solving the issue, just moving it.

NBrookus

Every time they pick an old, never used set that needed love and buff it to have a niche, we cheer. But there's always a sacrifice.

Remember when Trainee was nerfed for Shacklebreaker?
And Underwhelming Surge was nerfed for Auroran?

Well now the monster set that absolutely no one ever asked to be nerfed and caused no balance issues gets sacrificed to the need to sell new DLCs.