Lets have an auction house please!!!

MLGProPlayer

Rave the Histborn wrote: »

Grimm13 wrote: »

redlink1979 wrote: »

Despite how many threads are created related to this the answer will always be a "No".

No we will not add Necromancers...

Adding a class is different from changing the fundamentals of your trading/guild systems. I heard WoW classic came out recently though so if you're looking for 20 yr old combat and trade systems I'd give it a look.

A central AH isn't a "20 year old trade system". It's used in every MMO on the market except ESO, including recent releases like GW2, FFXIV, and BDO, and will likely be a feature in every new MMO that comes out after them too. There is a reason why only one game uses a trader system, and it's not because the system rocks.

Elsonso

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

A central AH isn't a "20 year old trade system". It's used in every MMO on the market except ESO, including recent releases like GW2, FFXIV, and BDO, and will likely be a feature in every new MMO that comes out after them too. There is a reason why only one game uses a trader system, and it's not because the system rocks.

It is an old MMO trade system simply by the virtue of how long it has been around. These days, it is a version of 'phoning it in'.

In addition to it being genre specific, the guild trader system is probably more expensive to develop and maintain. Tie all this together with the idea that the system is not part of the game, it is meta to the game, and it ends up being just something they slap in. A central store is cheap and fills the void.

anitajoneb17_ESO

tahol10069 wrote: »

You are just projecting.

And what are YOU doing, if not projecting, and projecting ONLY ?

The only factual truth known after all those countless AH-threads is that there's a rough 50/50 split between pro- and anti-AH.
So no, it's NOT "the few rich" against "the many poor".
The "economy" arguments brought up by both sides roughly counter and contradict each other with no clear "winner".
The "other games" arguments brought up by both sides also cancel each other since noone seems to agree as to what "works" and "doesn't work" in other games.

The difference is mainly perception. The guild trader system is perceived as "fun and part of the game" by the anti-AH and as "inconvenient" by the pro-AH. Flipping is considered gaming by some, and swindling by others. Trading guilds are considered a socialization asset by some, and a barrier to entry by others.
These topics popping up on a regular basis don't prove that the current system is flawed, it only shows that players' opinions are still split about it.

I'd like people on both sides (I am personally on the anti-AH side) to acknowledge that their arguments are all subjective and STOP calling them FACTS, and also STOP calling the other side corrupt, predators or idiots.

Half of the players like or even love this system, the other half dislike or even hate it. That's a matter of taste and of how we like to play. That's all there's to it, really.

Grimm13

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

But I agree with you : taxes are probably a very small part of the entire gold sink, and a global AH would NOT draw as much gold out of the economy as the trader system does - albeit the counter-argument brought up above (that more items would be traded in a global AH, generating more taxes) is also valid to a certain extent.

You fail to account for the increase in listings due to access for all. This is a hard thing to predict but there would be one. It is the listing fee and not the tax that is the Gold Sink. Taxes is a transfer of wealth from player to a Guild.

anitajoneb17_ESO

Grimm13 wrote: »

You fail to account for the increase in listings due to access for all. This is a hard thing to predict but there would be one. It is the listing fee and not the tax that is the Gold Sink. Taxes is a transfer of wealth from player to a Guild.

Oh my... you got it all wrong.
The listing fee is reimbursed upon selling. It's no gold sink at all (unless the listing is cancelled).
Taxes are made of 2 parts : 3.5% that goes into the VOID upon selling (that is a straight gold sink) and 3.5% that goes to the guild (that's not a gold sink UNTIL it's reinvested into a bid).

gorgoloth

I like the guild trader system it mimics a real economy and you can 'find good deals' and stuff. It makes buying and selling a little fun. I do not want to find myself standing around an unnamed orc city in the badlands for years on end.

kathandira

Glurin wrote: »

jazsper77 wrote: »

So let’s get to the REAL REASON the same anti AH PLAYERS...

So let’s get to the REAL REASON the same pro AH PLAYERS want it. If you go back to every AH thread it’s the same players posting it’s wonderful and it’s selfish reasons they do this.

1. They don't want to join a guild or talk to people or interact with anyone in any way in this online, massively multiplayer game. Extremely antisocial. False

2. Flippers- players who want every item for sale in the entire game world available to them at all times so they can snatch up terribly under listed items and flip them before anyone else has a chance to do it first. They find this tedious and impractical with guild traders and would have a much easier time cornering the market with an AH. False

3. Conspiracy- the belief that all the guild traders are controlled by a secret group of about five guild masters who meet in a secret star chamber every week to dictate what price people are allowed to sell corn flower for. All those fees and raffles and auctions, they're just there to make this small handful of people rich. Not pay for guild traders every week. False

As I’ve just stated above and that’s just the easy stuff to list. A large part of the anti Guild Trader group would finally be able to do the shady things the guild trader system was specifically designed to prevent.

#Truth#Facts#Tinfoilhat

The above, in my case, are all false.

1: I am in several social guilds for Trials, Dungeons, Questing, and general game play

2: I have no interest in selling items. I work with my guild mates to provide and obtain things as needed. It is a pay it forward mentality. I help people out by crafting them gear, or helping them farm items. And in turn, when I need help, they help me without hesitation

3: While I don't believe there is a small group of people running the entire trading economy, there are some who have "sister Guilds" to take up more than one Trader Stalls to expand the amount of slots they can fill per week. Also, (on console) Major City traders are able to post items for increased prices since it is very inconvenient to travel around browsing prices because we don't have any add-ons to let us know what is for sale around Tamriel.

The 3rd point is my main reason for hating the current system. Upping prices is one thing, I can live with it. But having to spend an hour out of the two to three I have to play at night just to find something I need is really annoying. It is not an enjoyable experience staring at load screens and running from trader to trader.

starkerealm

kathandira wrote: »

3: While I don't believe there is a small group of people running the entire trading economy, there are some who have "sister Guilds" to take up more than one Trader Stalls to expand the amount of slots they can fill per week. Also, (on console) Major City traders are able to post items for increased prices since it is very inconvenient to travel around browsing prices because we don't have any add-ons to let us know what is for sale around Tamriel.

The 3rd point is my main reason for hating the current system. Upping prices is one thing, I can live with it. But having to spend an hour out of the two to three I have to play at night just to find something I need is really annoying. It is not an enjoyable experience staring at load screens and running from trader to trader.

This isn't only on consoles. On PC, there's a price spike in the major markets. Trade off is those stalls are always stacked with goodies, and there are a lot of hard to obtain items in a tight space. So, if you simply want something, you can get it right now, or you can go hunting for a better deal, while asking if the gold is worth the time.

The real problem here is the load times on consoles, which, yeah, that's an issue, no question.

kathandira

starkerealm wrote: »

kathandira wrote: »

3: While I don't believe there is a small group of people running the entire trading economy, there are some who have "sister Guilds" to take up more than one Trader Stalls to expand the amount of slots they can fill per week. Also, (on console) Major City traders are able to post items for increased prices since it is very inconvenient to travel around browsing prices because we don't have any add-ons to let us know what is for sale around Tamriel.

The 3rd point is my main reason for hating the current system. Upping prices is one thing, I can live with it. But having to spend an hour out of the two to three I have to play at night just to find something I need is really annoying. It is not an enjoyable experience staring at load screens and running from trader to trader.

This isn't only on consoles. On PC, there's a price spike in the major markets. Trade off is those stalls are always stacked with goodies, and there are a lot of hard to obtain items in a tight space. So, if you simply want something, you can get it right now, or you can go hunting for a better deal, while asking if the gold is worth the time.

The real problem here is the load times on consoles, which, yeah, that's an issue, no question.

Totally. That is the price of convenience. But i'd rather a system where I don't have to make that negotiation.

Grimm13

Rave the Histborn wrote: »

Grimm13 wrote: »

wenchmore420b14_ESO wrote: »

Ahhhh, the AH vs Trader discussion...... Again.
So let's review a few things....

1. Gold Sink- Can a AH take out 200 Million+ gold out of the system a week? To keep a viable economy there has to be a large gold sink as this.

You have to have a reason for gold to be spent such as item breakage, repairs and replacement. Change the repair kit drop rate to be more rare, thus more valuable. Change items to decrease in function at 75%, 50% and 25%, by like amounts instead of 100% until zero. Makes people more likely to repair often, increases the sink.

Breakage drives the economy by giving reasons to spend gold. Static ownership of an item until you leave the game does little to transfer wealth that is need for a vibrant economy. Before you throw a fit, trial and veteran gear need to be bis and exempt from breakage. Those folks put in a lot of work for that right.

wenchmore420b14_ESO wrote: »

3. The Elephant in the Room- WoW is made up of "Shards" or separate servers. ESO has a MegaServer, no shards.
SO, a AH in ESO would be, open up AH UI and have literally millions of items trying to load. Think lag is bad now?

ESO did a Megaserver as to NOT be like WoW and other MMO's. Same with traders. ZoS has from start tried to make ESO unique and not a copy paste of other games.

Tell this to CCP with Eve Onlive. A mega server that handles a AH, has repair needs,. Cornering a market is much harder than you make it out to be, so many more factors involved. It's more of a boogie man for the anti-AH crowd.

btw ESO is also a shard system as it creates different instances of zones and delves. In beta you could see how many were active, how many people was in yours and was able to change your instance. GM's actually told you how to do this when missions crashed or no respawn of bosses. It was about 50 per instance, which when grouping you could exceed that number. PVP is not instanced but they are also trying to run it with about 15 times the number of people that the system was designed to handle.

many things can be fixed in ESO but you have to be willing to compromise.

2. EVE online? You mean the game based on AH manipulation, guilds stealing and strong arm trader tactics? Cornering a market is very easy, it's not a boogie man.

It was stated that there is no game that is a mega server and has a Single Market system. That having such would cause tremendous lag.

I was pointing out that there is a game made this way and they do not have a problem with it causing lag. They also handle loads larger than what ESO does pretty well. It's not until players manipulate the system to bypass caps that issues start occurring.

Grimm13

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

tahol10069 wrote: »

You are just projecting.

And what are YOU doing, if not projecting, and projecting ONLY ?

The only factual truth known after all those countless AH-threads is that there's a rough 50/50 split between pro- and anti-AH.
So no, it's NOT "the few rich" against "the many poor".
The "economy" arguments brought up by both sides roughly counter and contradict each other with no clear "winner".
The "other games" arguments brought up by both sides also cancel each other since noone seems to agree as to what "works" and "doesn't work" in other games.

The difference is mainly perception. The guild trader system is perceived as "fun and part of the game" by the anti-AH and as "inconvenient" by the pro-AH. Flipping is considered gaming by some, and swindling by others. Trading guilds are considered a socialization asset by some, and a barrier to entry by others.
These topics popping up on a regular basis don't prove that the current system is flawed, it only shows that players' opinions are still split about it.

I'd like people on both sides (I am personally on the anti-AH side) to acknowledge that their arguments are all subjective and STOP calling them FACTS, and also STOP calling the other side corrupt, predators or idiots.

Half of the players like or even love this system, the other half dislike or even hate it. That's a matter of taste and of how we like to play. That's all there's to it, really.

Us here on the forums is such a small part of the ESO community. I keep saying they only way ZOS will get a closer view of the ESO Communities opinion is to do a survey on the login rewards screen quarterly. Get to know what the people that play the game think. This is not for just this subject but for anything TESO related.

Kagukan

In other MMO's I used the auction house on a regular basis. Both buying and selling. In this game I avoid it as much as possible. It just isn't a fun system. An auction system is a core feature in any MMO. It should be accessible to anyone, both buying and selling, without the need to join a guild. Besides performance issues, the guild trader system is the biggest failure in ESO.

Grimm13

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Grimm13 wrote: »

You fail to account for the increase in listings due to access for all. This is a hard thing to predict but there would be one. It is the listing fee and not the tax that is the Gold Sink. Taxes is a transfer of wealth from player to a Guild.

Oh my... you got it all wrong.
The listing fee is reimbursed upon selling. It's no gold sink at all (unless the listing is cancelled).
Taxes are made of 2 parts : 3.5% that goes into the VOID upon selling (that is a straight gold sink) and 3.5% that goes to the guild (that's not a gold sink UNTIL it's reinvested into a bid).

I have to concede you are correct and that I was mixed up at the time.

ZeroXFF

Glurin wrote: »

tahol10069 wrote: »

I don't even have a chat on, ever, and I'm on a trading guild.

Thus proving my point. Many, many times in these many, many threads, the AH whiners complain about being "forced" to join a guild, chief reason being they don't want to interact with anybody. In an MMO. Where the point of being an MMO is interacting with other people. The guild traders in ESO encourage (not force) people to join guilds, which in turn encourages (not force) people to be social, and the ESO community is better for it.

I'm not exactly the most social person either, but FFS you could at least say hello to people once in a while.

tahol10069 wrote: »

Oh oh oh. Like we wouldn't have the game full of flippers already! Go see any guide of how to make gold in ESO, flipping items is always promoted. Some people want to make it seem less ugly so they say it is "distributing items from less popular locations to popular locations". Self-deception is the strongest deception. You of course know this. Everyone and their mother in this game knows flippers earn millions because this totally unequal system allows it.

I'm really not too sure what you're on about here. "Flipping" is not a bad thing. The problem is an AH lets you put it in overdrive, which results in rampant inflation, while at the same time encourages frequent undercut wars that drive prices down to nothing on anything you don't have to do hard mode trials for. (That's a bad thing, in case you didn't catch it.) Not to mention makes it very, very easy for unscrupulous individuals to manipulate and control the market, particularly if they use bots to do their shopping for them.

Not sure where you're getting that BS about "distributing items from less popular locations to popular locations" being nothing more than spin. It's just "buy low, sell high" with a little demographics thrown in, and there is nothing inherently wrong with that. That's how business works.

At any rate, I think you completely missed the larger point of that post. I snipped the quote because I thought it was unnecessary to copy the entire post for people to see what I was doing, but apparently I should have just left the whole thing intact.

We do, just not with the noobs in trading guilds. I want to do vet trials in hm, and I love my trials guild, but the trading guilds are nothing but an imposition, and most of the people there who do not have the chat muted (for the same reason) are worse than an average dungeon finder PUG. Why the hell would I interact with them? There is literally nothing we can do together in the game that would be any fun at all. I can't think of a single time when a /zone PUG was worse than a trading guild PUG.

So don't tell me about playing with other people, I do it all the time, it's just that the people you apparently love hanging out with are spending too much time worrying about making money to ever improve at or enjoy any actual game content.

idk

.

Grimm13 wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

tahol10069 wrote: »

You are just projecting.

And what are YOU doing, if not projecting, and projecting ONLY ?

The only factual truth known after all those countless AH-threads is that there's a rough 50/50 split between pro- and anti-AH.
So no, it's NOT "the few rich" against "the many poor".
The "economy" arguments brought up by both sides roughly counter and contradict each other with no clear "winner".
The "other games" arguments brought up by both sides also cancel each other since noone seems to agree as to what "works" and "doesn't work" in other games.

The difference is mainly perception. The guild trader system is perceived as "fun and part of the game" by the anti-AH and as "inconvenient" by the pro-AH. Flipping is considered gaming by some, and swindling by others. Trading guilds are considered a socialization asset by some, and a barrier to entry by others.
These topics popping up on a regular basis don't prove that the current system is flawed, it only shows that players' opinions are still split about it.

I'd like people on both sides (I am personally on the anti-AH side) to acknowledge that their arguments are all subjective and STOP calling them FACTS, and also STOP calling the other side corrupt, predators or idiots.

Half of the players like or even love this system, the other half dislike or even hate it. That's a matter of taste and of how we like to play. That's all there's to it, really.

Us here on the forums is such a small part of the ESO community. I keep saying they only way ZOS will get a closer view of the ESO Communities opinion is to do a survey on the login rewards screen quarterly. Get to know what the people that play the game think. This is not for just this subject but for anything TESO related.

True. However, some things Zos should not be so concerned about opinion. If they wanted this type of trading system (and they stated they did) and they feel it is working well based on in game measurements then there is no reason to even consider replacing the model.

anitajoneb17_ESO

ZeroXFF wrote: »

the people you apparently love hanging out with are spending too much time worrying about making money to ever improve at or enjoy any actual game content.

Trading IS "actual game content".

Rave the Histborn

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Rave the Histborn wrote: »

Grimm13 wrote: »

redlink1979 wrote: »

Despite how many threads are created related to this the answer will always be a "No".

No we will not add Necromancers...

Adding a class is different from changing the fundamentals of your trading/guild systems. I heard WoW classic came out recently though so if you're looking for 20 yr old combat and trade systems I'd give it a look.

A central AH isn't a "20 year old trade system". It's used in every MMO on the market except ESO, including recent releases like GW2, FFXIV, and BDO, and will likely be a feature in every new MMO that comes out after them too. There is a reason why only one game uses a trader system, and it's not because the system rocks.

Yeah, they use it because it's an "amazing" system and not because it's the easiest thing to code in and requires absolutely 0 creativity or imagination. God, it's almost like the game industry atm is ripe with stagnation and no ideas and they design games to come out as cheaply and quickly as possible. No no no. Can't be that, it's because WoW did it in 2004 and it's unusable, that's it.

ZeroXFF

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

ZeroXFF wrote: »

the people you apparently love hanging out with are spending too much time worrying about making money to ever improve at or enjoy any actual game content.

Trading IS "actual game content".

No, it's not. It is a means to save time for those who do want to play actual game content (and ESO's system is horrible at this primary function of a trading system).

EDIT: besides, regardless of your opinion on that topic it doesn't change the fact that there is absolutely no reason to interact with people in a trading guild if you ever do content harder than normal non-dlc dungeons, and the guy I was replying to is full of ***.

pelle412

You're all wasting energy on stuff that isn't going to change. Get with the program or don't use it.

idk

pelle412 wrote: »

You're all wasting energy on stuff that isn't going to change. Get with the program or don't use it.

And ironically this was said in the third post of this thread. Just no so directly. Zos wanted this type of trading system and even explained some of the reasons why. As such people can create a million threads on the subject that the last would be just as futile as the first. But they are permitted to express their opinions.

Toanis

lordrichter wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

A central AH isn't a "20 year old trade system". It's used in every MMO on the market except ESO, including recent releases like GW2, FFXIV, and BDO, and will likely be a feature in every new MMO that comes out after them too. There is a reason why only one game uses a trader system, and it's not because the system rocks.

It is an old MMO trade system simply by the virtue of how long it has been around. These days, it is a version of 'phoning it in'.

Well, NPC traders are older than global auction houses. They were a neat little thing in Ultima Online, resembling a quaint mom and pop shop where you could get a bargain by asking for it when the owner was in.

ESO's guild traders resemble a modern retail chain where customers always have the same "shopping experience", prices are normalized across all shops, and suppliers are unter constant pressure to meet a quota or be replaced.

starkerealm

Grimm13 wrote: »

Rave the Histborn wrote: »

Grimm13 wrote: »

wenchmore420b14_ESO wrote: »

Ahhhh, the AH vs Trader discussion...... Again.
So let's review a few things....

1. Gold Sink- Can a AH take out 200 Million+ gold out of the system a week? To keep a viable economy there has to be a large gold sink as this.

You have to have a reason for gold to be spent such as item breakage, repairs and replacement. Change the repair kit drop rate to be more rare, thus more valuable. Change items to decrease in function at 75%, 50% and 25%, by like amounts instead of 100% until zero. Makes people more likely to repair often, increases the sink.

Breakage drives the economy by giving reasons to spend gold. Static ownership of an item until you leave the game does little to transfer wealth that is need for a vibrant economy. Before you throw a fit, trial and veteran gear need to be bis and exempt from breakage. Those folks put in a lot of work for that right.

wenchmore420b14_ESO wrote: »

3. The Elephant in the Room- WoW is made up of "Shards" or separate servers. ESO has a MegaServer, no shards.
SO, a AH in ESO would be, open up AH UI and have literally millions of items trying to load. Think lag is bad now?

ESO did a Megaserver as to NOT be like WoW and other MMO's. Same with traders. ZoS has from start tried to make ESO unique and not a copy paste of other games.

Tell this to CCP with Eve Onlive. A mega server that handles a AH, has repair needs,. Cornering a market is much harder than you make it out to be, so many more factors involved. It's more of a boogie man for the anti-AH crowd.

btw ESO is also a shard system as it creates different instances of zones and delves. In beta you could see how many were active, how many people was in yours and was able to change your instance. GM's actually told you how to do this when missions crashed or no respawn of bosses. It was about 50 per instance, which when grouping you could exceed that number. PVP is not instanced but they are also trying to run it with about 15 times the number of people that the system was designed to handle.

many things can be fixed in ESO but you have to be willing to compromise.

2. EVE online? You mean the game based on AH manipulation, guilds stealing and strong arm trader tactics? Cornering a market is very easy, it's not a boogie man.

It was stated that there is no game that is a mega server and has a Single Market system. That having such would cause tremendous lag.

I was pointing out that there is a game made this way and they do not have a problem with it causing lag. They also handle loads larger than what ESO does pretty well. It's not until players manipulate the system to bypass caps that issues start occurring.

The entire reason EVE has a time dilation system is because the servers can't handle PvP on a large scale.

Rave the Histborn

Grimm13 wrote: »

Rave the Histborn wrote: »

Grimm13 wrote: »

wenchmore420b14_ESO wrote: »

Ahhhh, the AH vs Trader discussion...... Again.
So let's review a few things....

1. Gold Sink- Can a AH take out 200 Million+ gold out of the system a week? To keep a viable economy there has to be a large gold sink as this.

You have to have a reason for gold to be spent such as item breakage, repairs and replacement. Change the repair kit drop rate to be more rare, thus more valuable. Change items to decrease in function at 75%, 50% and 25%, by like amounts instead of 100% until zero. Makes people more likely to repair often, increases the sink.

Breakage drives the economy by giving reasons to spend gold. Static ownership of an item until you leave the game does little to transfer wealth that is need for a vibrant economy. Before you throw a fit, trial and veteran gear need to be bis and exempt from breakage. Those folks put in a lot of work for that right.

wenchmore420b14_ESO wrote: »

3. The Elephant in the Room- WoW is made up of "Shards" or separate servers. ESO has a MegaServer, no shards.
SO, a AH in ESO would be, open up AH UI and have literally millions of items trying to load. Think lag is bad now?

ESO did a Megaserver as to NOT be like WoW and other MMO's. Same with traders. ZoS has from start tried to make ESO unique and not a copy paste of other games.

Tell this to CCP with Eve Onlive. A mega server that handles a AH, has repair needs,. Cornering a market is much harder than you make it out to be, so many more factors involved. It's more of a boogie man for the anti-AH crowd.

btw ESO is also a shard system as it creates different instances of zones and delves. In beta you could see how many were active, how many people was in yours and was able to change your instance. GM's actually told you how to do this when missions crashed or no respawn

ZeroXFF wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

ZeroXFF wrote: »

the people you apparently love hanging out with are spending too much time worrying about making money to ever improve at or enjoy any actual game content.

Trading IS "actual game content".

No, it's not. It is a means to save time for those who do want to play actual game content (and ESO's system is horrible at this primary function of a trading system).

EDIT: besides, regardless of your opinion on that topic it doesn't change the fact that there is absolutely no reason to interact with people in a trading guild if you ever do content harder than normal non-dlc dungeons, and the guy I was replying to is full of ***.

So it's not game content it's only a means for content to be distributed through. Ok buddy pal champ coach you keep on thinking that.

preevious

huhu .. a feeling of déjà-vu ..

wenchmore420b14_ESO

ZeroXFF wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

ZeroXFF wrote: »

the people you apparently love hanging out with are spending too much time worrying about making money to ever improve at or enjoy any actual game content.

Trading IS "actual game content".

No, it's not. It is a means to save time for those who do want to play actual game content (and ESO's system is horrible at this primary function of a trading system).

EDIT: besides, regardless of your opinion on that topic it doesn't change the fact that there is absolutely no reason to interact with people in a trading guild if you ever do content harder than normal non-dlc dungeons, and the guy I was replying to is full of ***.

Yes, it is.
Believe it or not, "The Trade Game" is the game many play. Just like RP'rs.
Before Guild Traders were added, people would spend hours in the capitol cities just buying and selling stuff.
Just because you don't see Trading as a aspect of the game, it is, and has been since launch.

As far as interaction, I am in a few PC/NA trade guilds. They have housing parties, auctions that are a fun time, hide and seek events, theory crafting meetings, and yes run delvs and such. Your experience of "Sociability" of trade guilds is not the norm.

WeerW3ir

Yeah no

Glurin

kathandira wrote: »

Glurin wrote: »

jazsper77 wrote: »

So let’s get to the REAL REASON the same anti AH PLAYERS...

So let’s get to the REAL REASON the same pro AH PLAYERS want it. If you go back to every AH thread it’s the same players posting it’s wonderful and it’s selfish reasons they do this.

1. They don't want to join a guild or talk to people or interact with anyone in any way in this online, massively multiplayer game. Extremely antisocial. False

2. Flippers- players who want every item for sale in the entire game world available to them at all times so they can snatch up terribly under listed items and flip them before anyone else has a chance to do it first. They find this tedious and impractical with guild traders and would have a much easier time cornering the market with an AH. False

3. Conspiracy- the belief that all the guild traders are controlled by a secret group of about five guild masters who meet in a secret star chamber every week to dictate what price people are allowed to sell corn flower for. All those fees and raffles and auctions, they're just there to make this small handful of people rich. Not pay for guild traders every week. False

As I’ve just stated above and that’s just the easy stuff to list. A large part of the anti Guild Trader group would finally be able to do the shady things the guild trader system was specifically designed to prevent.

#Truth#Facts#Tinfoilhat

The above, in my case, are all false.

That was actually kind of the point. These threads frequently have AH people posting junk about how anyone being against the AH is just a super rich guild master manipulating the system to screw all the poor people blah blah blah. But like the saying goes, turnabout is fair play. It's just as easy to dismiss pro AH people as conspiracy theorists and people who manipulated markets in other MMOs that want to do it here.

Sadly there is a lot of truth in what I posted though. Just a few posts below yours, another AH poster goes on another rant about not wanting to interact with people. At least outside of using them to complete trials anyway.

kathandira wrote: »

The 3rd point is my main reason for hating the current system. Upping prices is one thing, I can live with it. But having to spend an hour out of the two to three I have to play at night just to find something I need is really annoying. It is not an enjoyable experience staring at load screens and running from trader to trader.

As for this, those hard to find items are why I'm leaning somewhat in favor of a function similar to TTC for consoles. But it would have to have many of the same limitations that TTC has or it would undermine what the guild traders do to keep the economy healthy.

Cortimi

You don't understand how much the trader bids combat inflation. Billions of gold a month would start piling on the server. Prices on everything would skyrocket as the currency becomes massively devalued, and controlled by a few wealthy elite.

I seriously don't understand why simple economics isn't taught in schools any more.

What is ACTUALLY needed, and what you ACTUALLY want, is a central location to search for, and price check items across the server. The real inconvenience isn't that you can't BUY everything in one spot, it's that you can't FIND everything in one spot. So,

What needs to happen is a central LISTING npc, who can search alllllllll the traders at once and tell you exactly who has it for how much and where to go to pick up what you want.

That means traders are still extremely important (more so, since remote locations will get a massive value-added boost), and people have a single place to FIND what they want.

wolfie1.0.

jazsper77 wrote: »

So let’s get to the REAL REASON the same anti AH PLAYERS don’t want it. If you go back to every AH thread it’s the same players posting it’s terrible and it’s selfish reasons they do this.

1. GM’s and Officers of Guilds who think that they are or their GUILD(s) is something special in ESO and they would lose that and become just another player. EGO Trip.

2. Flippers- players who go around to every Trader during the week buying terribly under listed items in flipping them in their Capital City Traders or Zone chat. They would lose a vast majority of this with an AH.

3. Freebies- So many GMs and Officers of mainly larger Guilds get everything from Free Skin,weapon,armor,Achievement carries from members who are trying to suck up to the leaders. Also any mats or Attunable Stations that wink wink are for the Guild Hall. Lol like if you leave the Guild you get them back.

As I’ve just stated above and that’s just the easy stuff to list. A large part of the pro Guild Trader group would lose their precious freebies and social status.

You can still have Guilds in ESO !
1. Trials
2. Housing
3. Fishing
4. Vampire
5. Werewolf
6. Role play
7. Questing

Oh and each Guild has a Built in Store WOW ! Who would have thunk it.
#Truth#Facts#

Yo know I dont like your assumptions.
And that is what they are. I am not a GM. I recognize that my guilds are not the end all be all of perfection. I also have never asked for a carry or freebies. In fact I give stuff away. I mean I could just as easily say that people that WANT a global store/auction house are just too lazy to go farm there own stuff. But I cant because I know that it's not true.

I'm anti global store/auction house not because its necessarily bad. But because it would require gutting everything and starting over to prevent exploitation and abuse. We are talking about a major overhaul of the economy and how it works. It's a lot of moving parts and honestly we would be trading one system with flaws for another one with just as many if not more flaws.

Edit: fyi flipping still happens with a GAH or global store. Your elitist trade guilds wont go away they will just create groups of people who go in and start manipulating the market or attempting to do so. Instead of competing with each other or the cold trade wars that happen they will work together and start eating up the market. It will be easier for them because they no longer have any weekly bids to worry about.

Wolfpaw

1. Searched for DC pvp guild in guild finder
2. Join dc "pvp" guild-donation, no weekly fee.
3. One week later, letter in mail telling me I need to "donate".
4. Annoying guild chat of how the leaders of the guild do this & that for us guild members...blahblahblah...
5. Ask why no mention of a weekly fee in guild finder, & get the explanation how my "donation" enters me in some stupid raffle w/hundreds of other players making multiple "donations" for tickets.
6. Want no part of this system, leave guild.

Some of these guild leaders/officers sure think they're special, & doing some great service.

Sell in chat & keep what I earn, or sell crowns for gold....easy to make gold in this game. Current trade system is a joke.