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The "Balance" of Mag Sorcs

  • KBKB
    KBKB
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    We have been through the wringer with nerfs tbh. It's not like you can do much while spamming your albeit strong 8k ward in non CP. I don't play pets which seems to be the meta now, so I'm probably not the right person to defuse this nerf sorcs thread.

    Pet targeting is the closest thing to cancer in this game at the moment in my opinion I'll agree on that point. Frags, streak,ward and even sustained damage passives have all been nerfed. Stun options are limited to situational streak and a very telegraphed rune on the class side of things. Yes wards can be MADE stronger than before they still cop bleeds and crits tho so I struggle to call it a Ward buff as you need to build into it now at a trade off usually. We still don't hold a candle to jacked up stam NBs/wardens new Mag DKs. Please continue to cry though, and yes I have all of the above mentioned classes so not a sorc fanboi.
  • Strider__Roshin
    Strider__Roshin
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    Iskiab wrote: »
    Idinuse wrote: »
    Also, shields were changed, health and resistance is factored into them now, its not just about magicka. Though that being said, shields are stronger than ever now.

    With sets like Armor Master and i.e. Mighty Chudan's instead of any other offensive Monster Set or Sustain/DMG set yes. When building for max mag and SD, not so much. It's typical that when a class adapts by making sacrefices, the community whines. You people will not be staisfied untill the class has the lowest max mag, SD, sustain and survivability possible. But I guess the way Templars were whined to death a while back got you guys's dander up.

    You know sorc is the one class I don’t have, but now I think I should make one because after reading this they must be completely broken.

    Please go ahead and create one.

    The minute you fight a bunch of stam players who are not potatoes, your mag sorc will get shredded to bits.

    Yeah that's a lie.
  • PhoenixGrey
    PhoenixGrey
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    Daus wrote: »
    Iskiab wrote: »
    Idinuse wrote: »
    Also, shields were changed, health and resistance is factored into them now, its not just about magicka. Though that being said, shields are stronger than ever now.

    With sets like Armor Master and i.e. Mighty Chudan's instead of any other offensive Monster Set or Sustain/DMG set yes. When building for max mag and SD, not so much. It's typical that when a class adapts by making sacrefices, the community whines. You people will not be staisfied untill the class has the lowest max mag, SD, sustain and survivability possible. But I guess the way Templars were whined to death a while back got you guys's dander up.

    You know sorc is the one class I don’t have, but now I think I should make one because after reading this they must be completely broken.

    Please go ahead and create one.

    The minute you fight a bunch of stam players who are not potatoes, your mag sorc will get shredded to bits.

    Yeah that's a lie.

    Stamblade actually got buffed Daus ! looks like u still haven't realized that :D
  • master_vanargand
    master_vanargand
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    For example, there are 4 pet sorcerers team in deathmatch of BGs.

    1pet sorc x 4 = 8 target
    2pet sorc x 4 = 12 target
    3pet sorc x 4 = 16 target

    Can you aim sorc?
    Oh yeah, don't forget pets are so resistant to AOE and can not be kill pets by AOE.
  • pieratsos
    pieratsos
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    Iskiab wrote: »
    pieratsos wrote: »
    Lord-Otto wrote: »
    Daus wrote: »
    Aedaryl wrote: »
    Daus wrote: »
    I'm surprised they weren't nerf this update honestly.

    You didn't read the patch notes.

    Hardened ward took a 20% shield reduction

    Pets got their shield capped at 50% of their max HP

    Pets took 50% less healing

    Matriarch, scamp and cheesy pets monster set/5 pieces set deal 15% less damage when using deadric prey.

    Sorcerer got nerfed, people was just too much cared about NB and Necro to notice it.

    Almost everything you listed were bug fixes.

    Doesn't matter. Sorcs were made weaker this patch, intentions aside. Can't argue that.
    If it's enough, that's the debate.

    And for everyone else here, I wanna ask where that "L2P, adapt" attitude has gone that us sorcs have heard so often in the past. Not nice to be on the receiving end and then being thrown this crab into your face, is it?
    And stamina players can pipe down as a whole. Only exception stamsorc. You know you've been OP since Dark Brotherhood.

    The reason people always tell sorcs to adapt is because sorcs are always either op or just under being op and sorcs still complain. The problem is that magsorc has a lot of casual players who just aren’t that good. So when they lose they think the class is fine because players can still beat them. When in reality they are losing because they just aren’t that good. Currently magsorcs are on a whole different level then the next best class.

    Yeah that goes both ways mate. Feel free to mention the casual sorcs who just arent that good but feel free to also mention the casuals who get their butts kicked and will always complain no matter what.

    Lets not forget that crittable shields that take resistances into account was a change asked mostly by non sorcs complaining about everything while people who actually play the class were telling them that they have no idea what they are talking about. And after ZOS did what they wanted with shields with the added hp cap on top, the same people are running around now complaining that shields are stronger than ever.

    So yeah, there is that. Im sure those people are perfectly capable to talk about the class and people who play sorc and actually warned ZOS how broken rune cage would be, how pets are impossible to balance, how frag non cc is horrible and making shields taking resistances into account is like opening pandoras box are mostly casuals who just want to be OP.

    Say what? That’s not how I remember things going down. I don’t know who asked for the changes, but I do remember magsorcs crying like crazy about it. Heck, I still see magsorcs claiming they were nerfed.

    Players do overreact with any change for sure. You see it in every class, I think the difference is so many sorcs continue to whine even when they’re buffed. They either don’t acknowledge or understand when they’ve been buffed, and continue to ask for nerfs to almost every other class.

    That's not how you remember things go down because u remember whatever suits ur agenda. Good sorcs have been telling from the beginning that when it comes to sorcs the issue is that you can stack shields and a better way to go about it would be to remove shieldstacking and compensate with some other form of defence.

    On the other hand u had non sorcs who don't know a single thing about the class running around shouting "hurrr durrr 40k shields, I can't crit them, my penetration is useless against them hurr durr".

    Sorcs say shields were nerfed because on paper they were actually nerfed. The uproar about shields that made the forums explode was because of cast time to shields, not the crittable resistant shields. When it comes to that sorcs actually warned everyone that its like opening pandoras box cause u are creating loopholes for sorcs to take advantage and make shields even stronger. Feel free to ask Daus what I told him back in the day when he proposed that. I'll even find the thread for you if u want.

    Same thing about pets frags and rune cage. Bottom line is that whether u like it or not, sorcs are the right people to talk about the class because they actually know the class. People who dont play the class are usually not in a good position to talk about it and that includes good players too.

    I can give u at least 2-3 examples of players who understand the game giving video examples in an attempt to proof something about sorcs but the video shows the exact opposite of what they are saying. And that happens not because they are clueless in the game but simply because they don't play the class to understand why the sorc did what he did in the video.

    And that applies to all classes not just sorcs.
  • Trancestor
    Trancestor
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    Gilvoth wrote: »
    all of this started because removal of shield breaker set.
    we need shield breaker set back and the problem also with their pets being constantly in the way.

    Old Shield breaker was ran only by a select few sweaty zerglings, other than that it was rare to come across someone using it, it was just annoying in those rare occasions so no that's not what started the problem, maybe for you it did because you were one of those zerglings.
  • PhoenixGrey
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    Iskiab wrote: »

    Say what? That’s not how I remember things going down. I don’t know who asked for the changes, but I do remember magsorcs crying like crazy about it. Heck, I still see magsorcs claiming they were nerfed.

    Players do overreact with any change for sure. You see it in every class, I think the difference is so many sorcs continue to whine even when they’re buffed. They either don’t acknowledge or understand when they’ve been buffed, and continue to ask for nerfs to almost every other class.

    Sure the solo sorc was buffed by a bit by the changes to pets.

    But you know the zergling sorc was buffed much more due to resists on shields leading to these potato threads.

    They just need to keep hardened ward up and dps'ing with a pocket healer providing all the healing and resists
    No longer they need to choose between keeping 3 shields up to stay alive or dps'ing.
    Sure those 3 shields were non crittable and huge but you had to choose between offence and defence !

    Now you need to get through 25k resists with a 28k health pool now after the shield goes down thanks to all the potatoes who complained on the forums and now you ask why sorcs complain after the buffs !
    No competent sorc ever asked for these thrash tier buffs.
  • bardx86
    bardx86
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    Sorc suck in high MMR BGs. Anyone thats says anything else doesn't understand the game. period! edit let me say non-pet sorcs.
    Edited by bardx86 on June 19, 2019 8:09AM
  • KurtAngle2
    KurtAngle2
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    bardx86 wrote: »
    Sorc suck in high MMR BGs. Anyone thats says anything else doesn't understand the game. period! edit let me say non-pet sorcs.

    Non-Pet Sorcs in High MMR... Do they even exist?
    Edited by KurtAngle2 on June 19, 2019 8:17AM
  • Strider__Roshin
    Strider__Roshin
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    Daus wrote: »
    Iskiab wrote: »
    Idinuse wrote: »
    Also, shields were changed, health and resistance is factored into them now, its not just about magicka. Though that being said, shields are stronger than ever now.

    With sets like Armor Master and i.e. Mighty Chudan's instead of any other offensive Monster Set or Sustain/DMG set yes. When building for max mag and SD, not so much. It's typical that when a class adapts by making sacrefices, the community whines. You people will not be staisfied untill the class has the lowest max mag, SD, sustain and survivability possible. But I guess the way Templars were whined to death a while back got you guys's dander up.

    You know sorc is the one class I don’t have, but now I think I should make one because after reading this they must be completely broken.

    Please go ahead and create one.

    The minute you fight a bunch of stam players who are not potatoes, your mag sorc will get shredded to bits.

    Yeah that's a lie.

    Stamblade actually got buffed Daus ! looks like u still haven't realized that :D

    Are you delirious? I never said anything about stamblades nor denied that they got buffed. I wonder what words you'll put in my mouth next.
  • Illuvatarr
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    Hit dodge once every 6 seconds. You don’t even need to cleanse curse. Just watch for when it is on you then dodge when it’s about to pop. Heal. Charge the sorc. Kill them.

    A lot of these posts seem to be coming from stam players who are uncomfortable with the fact their absolute dominance of pvp for the past few years is being challenged by a mag class.

    Adapt to the new reality.

    Edited by Illuvatarr on June 19, 2019 10:07AM
  • Illuvatarr
    Illuvatarr
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    mursie wrote: »

    Says the one who is corroborating with other potatoes respawning in this thread and calling me delusional lol !

    Even if mag sorc is as strong as you claim, I really dont understand what's the problem with having strong classes in the game.
    I am sure it's not fun even for a streamer to get repeatedly zerged down by premade zerglings in BG's or small scale stam groups in open world pvp.

    I believe in balance phoenix. equitable balance. it's why i play no-cp. it's why i do not use bash necro despite mostly playing stamcro the past few weeks. it's why i don't stack the deck with premades to stomp pugs..

    the magsorc is extremely overtuned at the moment. the only people that object to this statement are infact magsorcs such as yourself.

    maybe try participating in a no-cp pvp environment on something not extremely overtuned for a change. give yourself a little perspective. you need it, because right now you're completely delusional

    You are such a great player. Surprised at your posts. Dodge roll every six seconds based on when curse lands and you will disarm any mag sorc. Spec into well fitted traits on armor to make use of larger stam pool combined with roll dodge. The weakness of mag sorcs is stamina. Both in not having enough (this is in no cp mind you; cp mag sorc I am not experienced enough nor informed enough to comment as well as some other posters I am sure) and in the 100 percent damage mitigation available to stam toons vis a vis roll dodge. Dodge is so incredibly strong against mag sorc offense and burst. Cannot emphasize it enough.
  • Karivaa
    Karivaa
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    I’m having fun with my pets and it hasn’t been until recently thAt they were viable in PvP.
  • gepe87
    gepe87
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    Magsorc just want a burst heal. And that would be enough (few magsorcs like pets, but at current state it's crucial to have it or you only steal kills).

    It's true that Magblade suffered most from Healing Ward nerf but those weeks after Murkmire were a nightmare for Magsorc on PVP No CP.

    We just adapt from that but as long we can have the same gameplay as before Murkmire, we would accept it.
    Gepe, Dunmer MagSorc Pact Grand Overlord | Gaepe, Bosmer MagSorc Dominion General

    If you see edits on my replies: typos. English isn't my main language
  • leepalmer95
    leepalmer95
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    Before I quit, back before critable shields and such.

    If a see a mag sorc: A bad one i'd slap instantly like any other bad players on any other class. A good one i'd make sure to pressure stam, apply dots and time my burst to kill them. If i got them to execute and didn't kill then i'd spam my execute to do mega dmg and rip their magicka and they couldn't heal without healing ward.


    Now:

    If i see a magicka sorc solo I don't bother. They all seem to have 26k-30k hp, plus shields and the ability to kite around stupid pets which you can't do anything about. The ability to give themselves an instant heal so i can't even pressure magicka if i get them close to dying. Literally pointless and impossible to kill 1v1 now unless they are super bad players and even then it'll take a while. Also i'm running around on tanky builds yet the pet is hitting me for 3k crits as well, wtf is that.
    PS4 EU DC

    Current CP : 756+

    I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.


    RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...
  • oxygen_thief
    oxygen_thief
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    gepe87 wrote: »
    It's true that Magblade suffered most from Healing Ward nerf but those weeks after Murkmire were a nightmare for Magsorc on PVP No CP.
    i didnt use HW at all because dark conversion was sufficient to heal, it was instant and not affected by defile. dodging was much better way to survive in 1vx than shields stacking but they nerfed this kind of builds by adding resistances to the wards.
  • RebornV3x
    RebornV3x
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    people like OP won't be satisfied until everything gets nerfed and were fighting unarmed and naked were every class is the exact same because balance and I bet OP would still moan about something....

    Xbox One - NA GT: RebornV3x
    I also play on PC from time to time but I just wanna be left alone on there so sorry.
  • Xvorg
    Xvorg
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    Well Kurt, use the ankle lock..

    xDDDDD

    Fireman Carry FTW

    To OP

    The other day I logged out very annoyed and frustrated... there was this NB spamming lethal arrow and cloaking anytime he wanted. I popped out my wings, but they did nothing. Blocking and popping out wings didn't work and somehow I ended up without stam soon (maybe a poison?). I wasn't able to land a single hit.

    I imagine that any NB or Sorc could hae just cloaked away/streaked away, but as a mDK the only thing I could do was to die a very frustrating death.

    And today I read about a guy complaining about sorcs and who mentions the "well deserved" nerf to wings...

    jackie-chan-meme-png.png

    Wings countered sorcs and snipe spammers... now deal with them
    Sarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly

    I was born with the wrong sign
    In the wrong house
    With the wrong ascendancy
    I took the wrong road
    That led to the wrong tendencies
    I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
    For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
    On the wrong day of the wrong week
    Used the wrong method with the wrong technique
  • Adernath
    Adernath
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    Guys... just stop bumping this unproductive thread, started by an undifferentiated general rant of someone who apparently does not understand the game and never seriously played sorc.
  • KurtAngle2
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    Adernath wrote: »
    Guys... just stop bumping this unproductive thread, started by an undifferentiated general rant of someone who apparently does not understand the game and never seriously played sorc.

    Hello mr.nobody. Been playing the game since 2014 and always PvPing at highest MMR with 4 different toons. Willing to share your name's account or you're afraid of playing against me? ;)
  • Aedaryl
    Aedaryl
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    Xvorg wrote: »
    Well Kurt, use the ankle lock..

    xDDDDD

    Fireman Carry FTW

    To OP

    The other day I logged out very annoyed and frustrated... there was this NB spamming lethal arrow and cloaking anytime he wanted. I popped out my wings, but they did nothing. Blocking and popping out wings didn't work and somehow I ended up without stam soon (maybe a poison?). I wasn't able to land a single hit.

    I imagine that any NB or Sorc could hae just cloaked away/streaked away, but as a mDK the only thing I could do was to die a very frustrating death.

    And today I read about a guy complaining about sorcs and who mentions the "well deserved" nerf to wings...

    jackie-chan-meme-png.png

    Wings countered sorcs and snipe spammers... now deal with them

    You are a Stamdk dying to a snipe build with wings giving 50% damage reduction + block making the damage reduced by around 90%.

    Do you realise how ******** you need to be for that?

    Your personnal l2p issue doesn't reflect balance at competitive lvl.
  • PhoenixGrey
    PhoenixGrey
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    Daus wrote: »
    Daus wrote: »
    Iskiab wrote: »
    Idinuse wrote: »
    Also, shields were changed, health and resistance is factored into them now, its not just about magicka. Though that being said, shields are stronger than ever now.

    With sets like Armor Master and i.e. Mighty Chudan's instead of any other offensive Monster Set or Sustain/DMG set yes. When building for max mag and SD, not so much. It's typical that when a class adapts by making sacrefices, the community whines. You people will not be staisfied untill the class has the lowest max mag, SD, sustain and survivability possible. But I guess the way Templars were whined to death a while back got you guys's dander up.

    You know sorc is the one class I don’t have, but now I think I should make one because after reading this they must be completely broken.

    Please go ahead and create one.

    The minute you fight a bunch of stam players who are not potatoes, your mag sorc will get shredded to bits.

    Yeah that's a lie.

    Stamblade actually got buffed Daus ! looks like u still haven't realized that :D

    Are you delirious? I never said anything about stamblades nor denied that they got buffed. I wonder what words you'll put in my mouth next.

    How am I delirious? You really think a well played stamblade or stam dk would die to a mag sorc especially after the recent buffs ?
  • NinchiTV
    NinchiTV
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    Put some more cp into damage on shields? its all about pressure, you want
    Illuvatarr wrote: »
    Hit dodge once every 6 seconds. You don’t even need to cleanse curse. Just watch for when it is on you then dodge when it’s about to pop. Heal. Charge the sorc. Kill them.

    A lot of these posts seem to be coming from stam players who are uncomfortable with the fact their absolute dominance of pvp for the past few years is being challenged by a mag class.

    Adapt to the new reality.
    TRUE
    pd6U8LR.png
  • Strider__Roshin
    Strider__Roshin
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    Daus wrote: »
    Daus wrote: »
    Iskiab wrote: »
    Idinuse wrote: »
    Also, shields were changed, health and resistance is factored into them now, its not just about magicka. Though that being said, shields are stronger than ever now.

    With sets like Armor Master and i.e. Mighty Chudan's instead of any other offensive Monster Set or Sustain/DMG set yes. When building for max mag and SD, not so much. It's typical that when a class adapts by making sacrefices, the community whines. You people will not be staisfied untill the class has the lowest max mag, SD, sustain and survivability possible. But I guess the way Templars were whined to death a while back got you guys's dander up.

    You know sorc is the one class I don’t have, but now I think I should make one because after reading this they must be completely broken.

    Please go ahead and create one.

    The minute you fight a bunch of stam players who are not potatoes, your mag sorc will get shredded to bits.

    Yeah that's a lie.

    Stamblade actually got buffed Daus ! looks like u still haven't realized that :D

    Are you delirious? I never said anything about stamblades nor denied that they got buffed. I wonder what words you'll put in my mouth next.

    How am I delirious? You really think a well played stamblade or stam dk would die to a mag sorc especially after the recent buffs ?

    Because you're having a made up debate with me, that's why. You're retorting to a claim that I never made. So if you're not in a state of delirium then what's your excuse? Just felt like putting words in my mouth?
  • PhoenixGrey
    PhoenixGrey
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    Daus wrote: »
    Daus wrote: »
    Daus wrote: »
    Iskiab wrote: »
    Idinuse wrote: »
    Also, shields were changed, health and resistance is factored into them now, its not just about magicka. Though that being said, shields are stronger than ever now.

    With sets like Armor Master and i.e. Mighty Chudan's instead of any other offensive Monster Set or Sustain/DMG set yes. When building for max mag and SD, not so much. It's typical that when a class adapts by making sacrefices, the community whines. You people will not be staisfied untill the class has the lowest max mag, SD, sustain and survivability possible. But I guess the way Templars were whined to death a while back got you guys's dander up.

    You know sorc is the one class I don’t have, but now I think I should make one because after reading this they must be completely broken.

    Please go ahead and create one.

    The minute you fight a bunch of stam players who are not potatoes, your mag sorc will get shredded to bits.

    Yeah that's a lie.

    Stamblade actually got buffed Daus ! looks like u still haven't realized that :D

    Are you delirious? I never said anything about stamblades nor denied that they got buffed. I wonder what words you'll put in my mouth next.

    How am I delirious? You really think a well played stamblade or stam dk would die to a mag sorc especially after the recent buffs ?

    Because you're having a made up debate with me, that's why. You're retorting to a claim that I never made. So if you're not in a state of delirium then what's your excuse? Just felt like putting words in my mouth?

    You claimed that I lied about competent stam players not able to kill a mag sorc.

    If you are not aware there were multiple specs buffed last patch which can shred a mag sorc and one of them is apparently the one you play, you should probably be more self aware before passing judgements.
    Edited by PhoenixGrey on June 19, 2019 10:42PM
  • Strider__Roshin
    Strider__Roshin
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    Daus wrote: »
    Daus wrote: »
    Daus wrote: »
    Iskiab wrote: »
    Idinuse wrote: »
    Also, shields were changed, health and resistance is factored into them now, its not just about magicka. Though that being said, shields are stronger than ever now.

    With sets like Armor Master and i.e. Mighty Chudan's instead of any other offensive Monster Set or Sustain/DMG set yes. When building for max mag and SD, not so much. It's typical that when a class adapts by making sacrefices, the community whines. You people will not be staisfied untill the class has the lowest max mag, SD, sustain and survivability possible. But I guess the way Templars were whined to death a while back got you guys's dander up.

    You know sorc is the one class I don’t have, but now I think I should make one because after reading this they must be completely broken.

    Please go ahead and create one.

    The minute you fight a bunch of stam players who are not potatoes, your mag sorc will get shredded to bits.

    Yeah that's a lie.

    Stamblade actually got buffed Daus ! looks like u still haven't realized that :D

    Are you delirious? I never said anything about stamblades nor denied that they got buffed. I wonder what words you'll put in my mouth next.

    How am I delirious? You really think a well played stamblade or stam dk would die to a mag sorc especially after the recent buffs ?

    Because you're having a made up debate with me, that's why. You're retorting to a claim that I never made. So if you're not in a state of delirium then what's your excuse? Just felt like putting words in my mouth?

    You claimed that I lied about competent stam players not able to kill a mag sorc.

    If you are not aware there were multiple specs buffed last patch which can shred a mag sorc and one of them is apparently the one you play, you should probably be more self aware before passing judgements.

    Acting like magsorcs will shred into bits the moment they run into a non-potato stam character is asinine. Magsorcs are still top dog in PvP (not considering the stupid necro bash nonsense), but yes stamblades actually have a decent fighting chance this update; greatly narrowing the gap.

    Nonsense like what you said deserves to be called out, and if you truly believe what you said then you're not a competent magsorc. But I think you're just trying to downplay your class out of fear that a Dev might read what's being said, and will actually do something about it.
    Edited by Strider__Roshin on June 19, 2019 11:23PM
  • PhoenixGrey
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    Iskiab wrote: »

    Say what? That’s not how I remember things going down. I don’t know who asked for the changes, but I do remember magsorcs crying like crazy about it. Heck, I still see magsorcs claiming they were nerfed.

    Players do overreact with any change for sure. You see it in every class, I think the difference is so many sorcs continue to whine even when they’re buffed. They either don’t acknowledge or understand when they’ve been buffed, and continue to ask for nerfs to almost every other class.

    Sure the solo sorc was buffed by a bit by the changes to pets.

    But you know the zergling sorc was buffed much more due to resists on shields leading to these potato threads.

    They just need to keep hardened ward up and dps'ing with a pocket healer providing all the healing and resists
    No longer they need to choose between keeping 3 shields up to stay alive or dps'ing.
    Sure those 3 shields were non crittable and huge but you had to choose between offence and defence !

    Now you need to get through 25k resists with a 28k health pool now after the shield goes down thanks to all the potatoes who complained on the forums and now you ask why sorcs complain after the buffs !
    No competent sorc ever asked for these thrash tier buffs.

    @Daus : I am not trying to downplay anything. I have already highlighted what the real problem is if you read the above.

    My issue is with the potatoes who pass comments trying to get aspects of the class nerfed that are not actually a problem.
  • Lord-Otto
    Lord-Otto
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    Bottom line: don't ask for sorc nerfs, you will still be disappointed afterwards.
    What happened to that mentality that we should refrain from nerfs and rather buff underperforming classes? Are we skipping this for sorcs?
  • darkblue5
    darkblue5
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    Lord-Otto wrote: »
    Bottom line: don't ask for sorc nerfs, you will still be disappointed afterwards.
    What happened to that mentality that we should refrain from nerfs and rather buff underperforming classes? Are we skipping this for sorcs?

    I, for example, have literally never held that view. It is true that on the forum a lot of people seem to hold that view. There is certainly a die hard group that opposes nerfs on principle but no nerfs means an even quicker power creep. Lots of people hate power creep and hate nerfs. Some people just love power creep. I know that a couple of those people genuinely and personally hold me in contempt for being so pro nerf :D.

    I hate power creep much more than I love nerfs. I love nerfs because they solve the thing that needs to be solved. "Buffs to other" often have unintended bad consequences and contribute to power creep.

    For example I was and am happy with the changes that have made magblade be less trash tier and more just ok. I also am low key concerned that in the long term the magblade buffs will cause problems. The fact that the buffs were also effectively nerfs to snares and paired with a nerf to damage help IMO... but probably the Grim Focus mitigation will need to be nerfed. At least for Relentless Focus morph.
  • darkblue5
    darkblue5
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    Petsorc isn't as OP as 2014-2015 flavor of the patch classes but they are pretty overtuned. Any good player should be able to swap to a magsorc pet build and do as well or better than their old main in open world. They may not find it fun. They may not find that it meshes with their playstyle.

    Yes there are counters open world to meta petsorcs. They don't work if the magsorc isn't bad/thirsty enough to fight where their opponent is advantaged. (LOS spaces like buildings, places with slopes and large LOS trees/rocks, aka places where Streak is at its weakest, pets' DOTs can be avoided with LOS, and the sorc is forced to not LOS with them.)

    If you're an open world sorc and you're dying a lot to solo players on other classes avoiding your burst and then attacking after and putting you on the defensive... and then killing you.... then you're probably not using magsorc's mobility in open flat spaces enough. You're chasing too thirsty into tight spaces, or maybe playing in too many areas where Streak turns into a free-fall that acts like a 0 stamina/magicka CC for your opponent.

    If your opponent is a heavy stamblade dueling spec? You don't have to fight them using your open world build with no LOS or stamina draining poisons. You don't have to let them wail on you after you fired your pretty telegraphed combo. Let them think what they want to think about you being cowardly if they won't fight you on your terms. Chances are that they are thirsty to kill another newbie who followed the meta to petsorc expecting to be a god made flesh. Punish them for their thirst in an open field where you decide if you want to go LOS around the nearest rock or just LOS in your atronach. Punish their expensive gap closers with stuns that aren't followed by predictable combos but instead by pressure. If they're winning run away and see if you can burst them with their defenses down as they chase too thirsty.

    I understand that in open world the meta pet build is for sure the strongest open world spec available this patch. Shouldn't imply that it is also for sure the strongest dueling spec, and also the strongest groups spec, and invincible as emperor as you wipe zergs with one Streak. Petsorc is far from the most broken spec for its time. There have been specs that were much more degenerate in their context than current pet sorc. Maybe not more annoying but certainly more degenerate. Despite not being more broken for its time when compared with the most broken builds in ESO history it is still the best open world spec by a pretty strong margin. It could certainly survive a nerf.

    TLDR: Not the most broken build in the history of ESO but pretty overtuned. If you're dying a lot on magsorc open world you're either going for too difficult fights and the "dying honorably", or just not using the class to its fullest potential skill wise.

    Stay not thirsty my friends, because actually wanting to PvP is what gets you killed more often than not.
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