Wood Elf/ Bosmer losing stealth passive, An open letter.

Alucardmike

OsManiaC wrote: »

maybe they make special bosmer DLC, where we can hunt and eat well --- you know - #justbosmerthings.

There are not many regions left...
Only a falinesti DLC could work, but it would be to much for the engine, I think...

Ratzkifal

OsManiaC wrote: »

maybe they make special bosmer DLC, where we can hunt and eat well --- you know - #justbosmerthings.

Hopefully. But from the looks of it, that won't come before Q2 2020, as Q1 is almost certainly going to be yet another dungeon DLC and the rest of the season of the dragon is already set in stone. We can only hope that in Pelletine the jungle allows for more sneakiness and that ZOS addresses our problems by then. The dragon guard will probably take the main focus of that DLC, so we'll probably not get that awesome new stealth system that's supposed to fix everything.

Ratzkifal

Alucardmike wrote: »

OsManiaC wrote: »

maybe they make special bosmer DLC, where we can hunt and eat well --- you know - #justbosmerthings.

There are not many regions left...
Only a falinesti DLC could work, but it would be to much for the engine, I think...

Not if Falinesti is outside of Tamriel and won't return during our visit there. Then it would just be like Artaeum and Clockwork City.

Koronach

I think I perfected this.





https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u1AFmN2hzLE

wedgebert

Wouldn't it be more perfect if instead of that epic fail video, you used the Elder Scrolls "Destruction 100" meme

Maybe tweaking it to say "Lore Destruction 100"

anadandy

Best I could do on one cup of coffee

Ratzkifal

Funny how the closest I've come to purchase Elsweyr over all this is the special deal Elder Scrolls Legends offers for ESO players. Now I am tempted to buy Elsweyr not because of ESO but because of another game, which actually hasn't been messing with TES lore at all so far.

ZOS should be glad they have others covering their backs for them. I still won't resub though until that's fixed. I recently sold like 40 furnishing plans, so my inventory management is going well even without ESO+.
Give Bosmer their stealth back and you can count on my money again!

BlueRaven

anadandy wrote: »

Best I could do on one cup of coffee

I like that Idea.

I started expanding on it a bit.



If anyone has some ideas on how to fill out the rest of the "stars" let me know. I will try to get back to it tomorrow.

Cundu_Ertur

Fast orcs (should be a low one it's kinda minor).

Archery combat bonuses for Imperials, Redguards, Dunmer, and Orcs -- but none for Bosmer.

Maybe:
The Nord alliance with the Dunmer, too. I remember being surprised the Nords have given up Solstheim after the Red Year since that was a relationship that had always been strained.

Dragons everywhere.

TelvanniWizard

BlueRaven wrote: »

anadandy wrote: »

Best I could do on one cup of coffee

I like that Idea.

I started expanding on it a bit.



If anyone has some ideas on how to fill out the rest of the "stars" let me know. I will try to get back to it tomorrow.

Is it a burning book? Awesome!

Cundu_Ertur

Oh, the first one at the bottom has to be 'no jungles in Cyrodiil.'

Taloros

Met a new player who had his character a bosmer, probably not knowing that he had picked a race with questionable passives. Made me a little sad.

Ratzkifal

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KuT5h7IzliA

Oh would you look at that. FudgeMuppet made a video on Bosmer. And what does he say at 5:07 ?

Bosmer are also known for being very quick, nimble and agile and more specifically, very stealthy and also natural born archers.

It gets even more juicy at 8:47 about the rite of theft. Sadly the forest coupling is not mentioned, but then again we haven't really seen it in any of the games (possibly because it's impossible to implement).

If you are wondering why this is relevant, well FudgeMuppet is a TES lore channel but focusing more on Skyrim and TESVI speculations. Although he uses ESO lore for some of his videos (sometimes even letting it shine through when it's not making much sense), it's pretty clear he doesn't play the game. So he's pretty much an outside view unaffected by the balance decisions taken by ZOS and ESO's patch history. If he can recognize that Woodelfs are stealthy and we can recognize that Woodelfs are stealthy, then why can't ZOS?

max_only

BlueRaven wrote: »

anadandy wrote: »

Best I could do on one cup of coffee

I like that Idea.

I started expanding on it a bit.



If anyone has some ideas on how to fill out the rest of the "stars" let me know. I will try to get back to it tomorrow.

Doing Yfrre’s work, bless you children.

anadandy

Ratzkifal wrote: »

https://youtube.com/watch?v=KuT5h7IzliA

Oh would you look at that. FudgeMuppet made a video on Bosmer. And what does he say at 5:07 ?

Bosmer are also known very quick, nimble and agile and more specifically, very stealthy and also natural born archers.

It gets even more juicy at 8:47 about the rite of theft. Sadly the forest coupling is not mentioned, but then again we haven't really seen it in any of the games (possibly because it's impossible to implement).

If you are wondering why this is relevant, well FudgeMuppet is a TES lore channel but focusing more on Skyrim and TESVI speculations. Although he uses ESO lore for some of his videos (sometimes even letting it shine through when it's not making much sense), it's pretty clear he doesn't play the game. So he's pretty much an outside view unaffected by the balance decisions taken by ZOS and ESO's patch history. If he can recognize that Woodelfs are stealthy and we can recognize that Woodelfs are stealthy, then why can't ZOS?

Edit: How do you make the thumbnail and video appear in here and not just the URL?

If it's from youtube just put [ youtube ] video id [ / youtube ] around it (get rid of spaces)

Ratzkifal

@anadandy

Thanks! I got it now

BlueRaven

@TelvanniWizard You noticed! I thought it was too subtle.

Sorry I could not get back to it yesterday. There was an emergency at work.

Here is the latest version.



Changes from previous version;

• Added suggestions from @Cundu_Ertur
• Changed font sizes slightly for better readability.
• Added Lore Destruction description on the bottom.

I went through it (quickly) to check for spelling etc, let me know if I missed anything. I am open to any changes, but I am trying to keep it in the style of the source material so nothing too long.

MartiniDaniels

^
"Redguards aren't best swordsmen"

I mean through all games we heard that Redguards have exceptional melee martial skill, notably higher then other races, but now they are clearly behind Orcs and Dunmers which is strange imo.

JobooAGS

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

^
"Redguards aren't best swordsmen"

I mean through all games we heard that Redguards have exceptional melee martial skill, notably higher then other races, but now they are clearly behind Orcs and Dunmers which is strange imo.

Redguards are best with weapons in general, with a huge emphesis on swords

MartiniDaniels

JobooAGS wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

^
"Redguards aren't best swordsmen"

I mean through all games we heard that Redguards have exceptional melee martial skill, notably higher then other races, but now they are clearly behind Orcs and Dunmers which is strange imo.

Redguards are best with weapons in general, with a huge emphesis on swords

Yes, best with melee bladed weapons like swords, scimitars, axes. But not with bows and magic staves.

JobooAGS

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

JobooAGS wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

^
"Redguards aren't best swordsmen"

I mean through all games we heard that Redguards have exceptional melee martial skill, notably higher then other races, but now they are clearly behind Orcs and Dunmers which is strange imo.

Redguards are best with weapons in general, with a huge emphesis on swords

Yes, best with melee bladed weapons like swords, scimitars, axes. But not with bows and magic staves.

https://elderscrolls.fandom.com/wiki/Redguard_(Arena)
https://elderscrolls.fandom.com/wiki/Redguard_(Daggerfall)
https://elderscrolls.fandom.com/wiki/Redguard_(Morrowind)
https://elderscrolls.fandom.com/wiki/Redguard_(Oblivion)
https://elderscrolls.fandom.com/wiki/Redguard_(Skyrim)

All of these state at the very least more proficient with weapons if not the best at them and did not exclude bows/staves. They also suggest an emphasis on swords/blades. Not to mention the lack of poison resistance in which the main article states
https://elderscrolls.fandom.com/wiki/Redguard


Edit: If combat were a grading scale, Redguards would score straight As at all weapons with a big A+ on swords. I can agree that they will score lower with magic due to their weariness of magic in general. Bosmers would easily get top grades with an A+ at bows, Altmer with staves and so on.

BlueRaven

And Redguards have curved swords.

Curved. Swords.

(Carry on, I really don’t have anything to add to the conversation other than a meme. 🙂)

Koronach

TelvanniWizard wrote: »

BlueRaven wrote: »

anadandy wrote: »

Best I could do on one cup of coffee

I like that Idea.

I started expanding on it a bit.



If anyone has some ideas on how to fill out the rest of the "stars" let me know. I will try to get back to it tomorrow.

Is it a burning book? Awesome!

Never thought I would ever agree with a Telvanni, but I agree that is awesome ^.=.^

Jaraal

BlueRaven wrote: »

If anyone has some ideas on how to fill out the rest of the "stars" let me know. I will try to get back to it tomorrow.

Awesome work!

Pehaps "Sai Sahan faked his own death 3/3"

thegreatme

Oh are we coming up with lore trees to compliment Bos' completely lore-friendly changes? How about vegan vampires? They're not allowed in Valenwood obviously, but then again who's going to stop them since we're not stealthy enough to catch them in the act anyway

Cundu_Ertur

Looks good, Raven.

Jordan.nick11b14_ESO

Signed. Wood elves (which I loathe) should def. keep their stealth passive. Please don't turn this game into a version of FF14...they have a well earned reputation for nerfing jobs and homogenizing everything. Please keep the races different...

wedgebert

Jordan.nick11b14_ESO wrote: »

Signed. Wood elves (which I loathe) should def. keep their stealth passive. Please don't turn this game into a version of FF14...they have a well earned reputation for nerfing jobs and homogenizing everything. Please keep the races different...

Unfortunately keeping races "different" is part of what got us into this mess. Rather than let Bosmer and Khajiit both be stealthy, in the name of "making races different" they decided that Bosmer should lose stealth and instead become super bland races with no actual flavor outside of "they think they're cats that can gracefully land after a fall" and "think they're Jackie Chan from Drunker Master except without any actual improved martial skills"

Cundu_Ertur

wedgebert wrote: »

Jordan.nick11b14_ESO wrote: »

Signed. Wood elves (which I loathe) should def. keep their stealth passive. Please don't turn this game into a version of FF14...they have a well earned reputation for nerfing jobs and homogenizing everything. Please keep the races different...

Unfortunately keeping races "different" is part of what got us into this mess. Rather than let Bosmer and Khajiit both be stealthy, in the name of "making races different" they decided that Bosmer should lose stealth and instead become super bland races with no actual flavor outside of "they think they're cats that can gracefully land after a fall" and "think they're Jackie Chan from Drunker Master except without any actual improved martial skills"

I think part of the problem, too, is that sneaking was regarded as a bit of fluffy RP garbage that is completely unimportant in the grand scheme of things, instead of being regarded (as it should be) as the single most important resource for the Thief archetype playstyle.

edit to add: I think the current batch of devs also failed to appreciate how important the Thief archetype is to the Bosmer, and I suspect they thought that only the Khajiit were ever the thieves; and that of the original Bosmer passives half of them were shared with other races because the original dev team didn't know what they were doing. I bet the devs thought they were doing Bosmer a favor. In some ways they did, but removing all vestiges of stealth gameplay from Bosmer was NOT appropriate and, in my opinion, negates most of the benefitial changes that were made.

OsManiaC

wish someone reached them at E3. 77 pages and no effect