Combat Update in U21 - A New Approach

Sygil05

Think we'll get a follow-up within 2 months of the original post?

WreckfulAbandon

"Balance pass" is cryptic but if the past is any indicator then it means comprehensive nerfs. Wish they would just come out and say what they're planning.

katorga

antihero727 wrote: »

Racial balancing in ZOS’s vision is just another way to sell more crown store race change tokens.

This....

Savos_Saren

katorga wrote: »

antihero727 wrote: »

Racial balancing in ZOS’s vision is just another way to sell more crown store race change tokens.

This....

Honestly- ZOS could save face by offering one free race change token to each race that may have drastic changes.

Then, it would actually look like they have quality of their game in mind... rather than pushing for another cash grab.

Merlin13KAGL

Savos_Saren wrote: »

katorga wrote: »

antihero727 wrote: »

Racial balancing in ZOS’s vision is just another way to sell more crown store race change tokens.

This....

Honestly- ZOS could save face by offering one free race change token to each race that may have drastic changes.

Then, it would actually look like they have quality of their game in mind... rather than pushing for another cash grab.

You realize if they actually do the racial balance properly, there will be no need for anyone to race change, merely rearrange some passive points?

EDIT: And what would one free token do across 8/15 characters, other than *** off long-termers even further?

Aquatorch

[/quote]You realize if they actually do the racial balance properly, there will be no need for anyone to race change, merely rearrange some passive points?

EDIT: And what would one free token do across 8/15 characters, other than *** off long-termers even further?

[/quote]

You realize that ZoS doesn't balance on purpose right? If there was no need for race change or new character slots, then ZoS' money management team isn't doing their job right. If you nerf a class so hard that people pay to change or pay for a new character slot, then the company wins.

Merlin13KAGL

Aquatorch wrote: »

You realize that ZoS doesn't balance on purpose right? If there was no need for race change or new character slots, then ZoS' money management team isn't doing their job right. If you nerf a class so hard that people pay to change or pay for a new character slot, then the company wins.

Not once did I say I had any faith whatsoever they'd get it right.

You realize if they muck it up hard enough, people will just bail. People ceasing to play the game spend even less.

Trashing existing character viability won't increase race change sales, it will increase exodus from the game.

Maura_Neysa

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Aquatorch wrote: »

You realize that ZoS doesn't balance on purpose right? If there was no need for race change or new character slots, then ZoS' money management team isn't doing their job right. If you nerf a class so hard that people pay to change or pay for a new character slot, then the company wins.

Not once did I say I had any faith whatsoever they'd get it right.

You realize if they muck it up hard enough, people will just bail. People ceasing to play the game spend even less.

Trashing existing character viability won't increase race change sales, it will increase exodus from the game.

If they muck it up, I'm pretty sure that will be it. SOOOOO many people have bailed because of Murkmire's up already.
Still, I expect its a ZoS money grab and I have no faith in it coming out even.

ezio45

dazee wrote: »

Kinnahz wrote: »

Everyone get ready for nerfs to Redguard, Argonian and Dunmers. Start saving your crowns for race change tokens.

You mean redguard argonian and ALTMERS

altmer? its only good for sorc and even then its 50/50 with darkelf

ezio45

Savos_Saren wrote: »

katorga wrote: »

antihero727 wrote: »

Racial balancing in ZOS’s vision is just another way to sell more crown store race change tokens.

This....

Honestly- ZOS could save face by offering one free race change token to each race that may have drastic changes.

Then, it would actually look like they have quality of their game in mind... rather than pushing for another cash grab.

no they couldnt, i like my race

Quaffio

"The unique feeling and flavor each race provides should be retained and enhanced where possible, and remain faithful to established lore."

Okay, but if you start nerfing races who are strong in magic just to "balance" the game, you are killing the lore then. No race has more magic power than a High Elf. No race is as hardy and tough as a Nord. No race is a stong as an Orc. Etc.

But we all know ZOS is gonna nerf everything and pretty much remove all race abilities that separate the races into their own strengths and weaknesses. Just cause someone wants to play an Orc Sorc and be able to hang in damage with a High Elf, does not excuse ZOS to destroy a long standing feature in the elder scrolls games.

Maura_Neysa

Quaffio wrote: »

"The unique feeling and flavor each race provides should be retained and enhanced where possible, and remain faithful to established lore."

Okay, but if you start nerfing races who are strong in magic just to "balance" the game, you are killing the lore then. No race has more magic power than a High Elf. No race is as hardy and tough as a Nord. No race is a stong as an Orc. Etc.

But we all know ZOS is gonna nerf everything and pretty much remove all race abilities that separate the races into their own strengths and weaknesses. Just cause someone wants to play an Orc Sorc and be able to hang in damage with a High Elf, does not excuse ZOS to destroy a long standing feature in the elder scrolls games.

That why I am hoping for morphs. One that keeps races playing there BiS role, but one that is more "Balanced" Like chosing Dark Elf kind of is now.

Like Altmer - Spell Charge 9% Mag Regen, or 5% Mag + 4% Stam
Even more so than Altmer, Bosmer/Khajti - Stealthy 10% Bonus Damage from Steath, or 2% Reduce damage (all the time)
This way things are less pigeon holed. Bosmer and Khajti have a whole passive that is worthless unless you are a PvP StamBlade. That's just stupid

Plenty of room for this. Every "Reduced Damage" passive could be reduce/increase morph. Every 1Stat Max could be 2 Stat max at reduced. My only question would be what to do with current spit stat passives like Orc Brawny 6% Health+Stam

IronWooshu

Quaffio wrote: »

"The unique feeling and flavor each race provides should be retained and enhanced where possible, and remain faithful to established lore."

Okay, but if you start nerfing races who are strong in magic just to "balance" the game, you are killing the lore then. No race has more magic power than a High Elf. No race is as hardy and tough as a Nord. No race is a stong as an Orc. Etc.

But we all know ZOS is gonna nerf everything and pretty much remove all race abilities that separate the races into their own strengths and weaknesses. Just cause someone wants to play an Orc Sorc and be able to hang in damage with a High Elf, does not excuse ZOS to destroy a long standing feature in the elder scrolls games.

In no way has Bethesda in any Elder Scrolls game allowed certain races to hit higher DPS then others. If you chose a High Elf in Skyrim you start off with higher stats in magicka but in the end someone who made a Redguard could be the exact same.

ZOS_RobGarrett

Hello all, and Happy New Year!

Clearly many of you are chomping at the bit to learn more details about the U21 changes. As mentioned in the Class Rep Meeting Notes, our intent is to provide a more in-depth preview of the racial passive adjustments prior to publishing the patch notes for PTS 1. You can expect that preview in the next couple weeks. The rest of the changes will be detailed in the patch notes.

As for the long-term plan for Combat, that effort is still in progress and we don't have an ETA right now. As I mentioned before, this is a non-trivial effort and we still have updates to deliver in U21 and beyond.

Thanks for your patience. It's going to be an exciting year!

Neoauspex

ZOS_RobGarrett wrote: »

Hello all, and Happy New Year!

Clearly many of you are chomping at the bit to learn more details about the U21 changes. As mentioned in the Class Rep Meeting Notes, our intent is to provide a more in-depth preview of the racial passive adjustments prior to publishing the patch notes for PTS 1. You can expect that preview in the next couple weeks. The rest of the changes will be detailed in the patch notes.

As for the long-term plan for Combat, that effort is still in progress and we don't have an ETA right now. As I mentioned before, this is a non-trivial effort and we still have updates to deliver in U21 and beyond.

Thanks for your patience. It's going to be an exciting year!

I'll gladly trade a full year of balance changes and content updates for a performance pass on Cyrodiil.

Minno

Neoauspex wrote: »

ZOS_RobGarrett wrote: »

Hello all, and Happy New Year!

Clearly many of you are chomping at the bit to learn more details about the U21 changes. As mentioned in the Class Rep Meeting Notes, our intent is to provide a more in-depth preview of the racial passive adjustments prior to publishing the patch notes for PTS 1. You can expect that preview in the next couple weeks. The rest of the changes will be detailed in the patch notes.

As for the long-term plan for Combat, that effort is still in progress and we don't have an ETA right now. As I mentioned before, this is a non-trivial effort and we still have updates to deliver in U21 and beyond.

Thanks for your patience. It's going to be an exciting year!

I'll gladly trade a full year of balance changes and content updates for a performance pass on Cyrodiil.

I think they will have the muscle to do both, honestly. Assuming they use the rep feedback to make changes before PTS and then use PTS to catch bugs/make emergency changes.

Lord_Eomer

ZOS_RobGarrett wrote: »

Hello all, and Happy New Year!

Clearly many of you are chomping at the bit to learn more details about the U21 changes. As mentioned in the Class Rep Meeting Notes, our intent is to provide a more in-depth preview of the racial passive adjustments prior to publishing the patch notes for PTS 1. You can expect that preview in the next couple weeks. The rest of the changes will be detailed in the patch notes.

As for the long-term plan for Combat, that effort is still in progress and we don't have an ETA right now. As I mentioned before, this is a non-trivial effort and we still have updates to deliver in U21 and beyond.

Thanks for your patience. It's going to be an exciting year!

Unhappy to see Q1 update going to push in February,

Royaji

Lord_Dexter wrote: »

ZOS_RobGarrett wrote: »

Hello all, and Happy New Year!

Clearly many of you are chomping at the bit to learn more details about the U21 changes. As mentioned in the Class Rep Meeting Notes, our intent is to provide a more in-depth preview of the racial passive adjustments prior to publishing the patch notes for PTS 1. You can expect that preview in the next couple weeks. The rest of the changes will be detailed in the patch notes.

As for the long-term plan for Combat, that effort is still in progress and we don't have an ETA right now. As I mentioned before, this is a non-trivial effort and we still have updates to deliver in U21 and beyond.

Thanks for your patience. It's going to be an exciting year!

Unhappy to see Q1 update going to push in February,

All of the Q1 DLCs were released mid-February - early-March. What did you expect?

Lord_Eomer

Royaji wrote: »

Lord_Dexter wrote: »

ZOS_RobGarrett wrote: »

Hello all, and Happy New Year!

Clearly many of you are chomping at the bit to learn more details about the U21 changes. As mentioned in the Class Rep Meeting Notes, our intent is to provide a more in-depth preview of the racial passive adjustments prior to publishing the patch notes for PTS 1. You can expect that preview in the next couple weeks. The rest of the changes will be detailed in the patch notes.

As for the long-term plan for Combat, that effort is still in progress and we don't have an ETA right now. As I mentioned before, this is a non-trivial effort and we still have updates to deliver in U21 and beyond.

Thanks for your patience. It's going to be an exciting year!

Unhappy to see Q1 update going to push in February,

All of the Q1 DLCs were released mid-February - early-March. What did you expect?

Most Q1 DLC were released in PTS on January but seems like this one pushed into February and will put on Live by March.

Solariken

What da heck? PTS1 soonest arrival is a 3+ weeks?

Xvorg

Solariken wrote: »

What da heck? PTS1 soonest arrival is a 3+ weeks?

I suppose that is because they want to discuss the changes with class rep... in the meantime we can keep on playing nerfmire

JD2013

So is it not a good thing that the PTS won’t be for another 3+ weeks? More time for them to work on things.

Savos_Saren

ZOS_RobGarrett wrote: »

Hello all, and Happy New Year!

Clearly many of you are chomping at the bit to learn more details about the U21 changes. As mentioned in the Class Rep Meeting Notes, our intent is to provide a more in-depth preview of the racial passive adjustments prior to publishing the patch notes for PTS 1. You can expect that preview in the next couple weeks. The rest of the changes will be detailed in the patch notes.

As for the long-term plan for Combat, that effort is still in progress and we don't have an ETA right now. As I mentioned before, this is a non-trivial effort and we still have updates to deliver in U21 and beyond.

Thanks for your patience. It's going to be an exciting year!

@ZOS_RobGarrett

Since we've got a couple more weeks before we see the PTS- can you at least give us an idea of how ZOS is planning to adjust racials?

IE: "In the passives you can choose 10% Stamina or 10% Health at level 20." or "Khajiit can get 8% extra weapon crit or 8% extra spell crit."

Sygil05

ZOS_RobGarrett wrote: »

Hello all, and Happy New Year!

Clearly many of you are chomping at the bit to learn more details about the U21 changes. As mentioned in the Class Rep Meeting Notes, our intent is to provide a more in-depth preview of the racial passive adjustments prior to publishing the patch notes for PTS 1. You can expect that preview in the next couple weeks. The rest of the changes will be detailed in the patch notes.

As for the long-term plan for Combat, that effort is still in progress and we don't have an ETA right now. As I mentioned before, this is a non-trivial effort and we still have updates to deliver in U21 and beyond.

Thanks for your patience. It's going to be an exciting year!

Thanks for the update, but we're getting close to two months since the original post (and several days into 2019) and we're still being told there isn't a long-term plan for combat in this game, which seems to contradict the intent behind the original post in this thread.

Using "this is a non-trivial effort and we still have updates to deliver in U21 and beyond." as an excuse on why this isn't done is pretty flimsy, considering the first post in this thread also mentioned that the next update is scaled back to provide developers time to work on this.

How would this indicate that ZOS is taking "a new approach"? Releasing a transcript of a hurried Class Rep meeting and charging headfirst towards changing up racial passives (seemingly without a long-term plan?) sounds like "the old approach" to me.

Minno

JD2013 wrote: »

So is it not a good thing that the PTS won’t be for another 3+ weeks? More time for them to work on things.

That's my understanding. Pts early meant no time to make feedback changes. At least we can speculate that they well be making class rep changes first then pts bugs be second.

MaxwellC

@ZOS_RobGarrett
Anyone complaining about Major evasion somehow still being too strong is in a serious L2P dilemma that they haven't come to terms with.

Roll dodge feels unchanged only if conditions meet that requirement i.e the game is not lagging which in PvP is almost 99.1% of the time.
Still no Dragon Knight changes for the stamina side nor is there any news of classes in general having more stamina choices within their own class, just goes to show priorities here are a bit skewed again.

Lord_Eomer

Xvorg wrote: »

Solariken wrote: »

What da heck? PTS1 soonest arrival is a 3+ weeks?

I suppose that is because they want to discuss the changes with class rep... in the meantime we can keep on playing nerfmire

Moat of changes they have finalized already, 1-2 weeks are not enough to discuss changes and then implement.

Even PTS cycle sees minor adjustments only.

ezio45

ZOS_RobGarrett wrote: »

Hello all, and Happy New Year!

Clearly many of you are chomping at the bit to learn more details about the U21 changes. As mentioned in the Class Rep Meeting Notes, our intent is to provide a more in-depth preview of the racial passive adjustments prior to publishing the patch notes for PTS 1. You can expect that preview in the next couple weeks. The rest of the changes will be detailed in the patch notes.

As for the long-term plan for Combat, that effort is still in progress and we don't have an ETA right now. As I mentioned before, this is a non-trivial effort and we still have updates to deliver in U21 and beyond.

Thanks for your patience. It's going to be an exciting year!

unnerf shields
up sorc sustain
dont touch highelf
decrease damage in heavy
kill mag tanking give ice an actual use so magden can be happy

bam combat changes done, send it

ll_Rev

MaxwellC wrote: »

@ZOS_RobGarrett
Anyone complaining about Major evasion somehow still being too strong is in a serious L2P dilemma that they haven't come to terms with.

Roll dodge feels unchanged only if conditions meet that requirement i.e the game is not lagging which in PvP is almost 99.1% of the time.
Still no Dragon Knight changes for the stamina side nor is there any news of classes in general having more stamina choices within their own class, just goes to show priorities here are a bit skewed again.

its not a l2p issue evasion affects some classes more than others.

MaxwellC

@ll_Rev
That's obvious but again last time I checked classes were implemented in this game to differentiate one from another, if something hinders a class more than another (as long as it's not a massive impact) then I call that sound game-play.

It's like how major mending benefits templars more so than other classes due to their innate ability to heal or how major defile benefits nightblades more since their tool-set is geared towards sustained/high damage.

Just because one particular class or two is having a disadvantage to reduction of AoE damage in-comparison to all other classes, doesn't mean it's broken so again it's a clear L2P issue.